1. Welcome to Smogon! Check out the Smogon Starters Hangout for everything you need to know about starting out in the community. Don't forget to introduce yourself in the Introduction and Hangout Thread, too!
  2. Welcome to Smogon Forums! Please take a minute to read the rules.

Speed and Attack furr dayss!

Discussion in 'BW OU Teams' started by iiEvOL, Dec 24, 2012.

  1. iiEvOL

    iiEvOL

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2012
    Messages:
    12
    [​IMG]

    Hey everybody, this is my first take at a RMT and which I've tried my best to base around speed and attack. I started off with Reckless Mienshao because I rarely ever see people run it over regenerator. Here it is: (Sorry for the lack of images, I'm not really sure how to get the little mini-images that people have on their RMT's but if someone can let me know, it'd be greatly appreciated thanks)

    Zuko (Cobalion) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 152 Spd / 104 HP / 252 Def
    Impish Nature
    - Thunder Wave
    - Close Combat
    - Stealth Rock
    - Iron Head

    Cobalion is one of the faster defensive walls and it's my stealth rocker. The main goal of this team is to slow down anything faster than Mienshao, Jolteon and Scizor and hit them hard with specs/band STAB moves. I just think that Cobalion does a great job putting up rocks and t-waving threats.

    Azula (Blissey) (F) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Natural Cure
    EVs: 4 Def / 252 HP / 252 SDef
    Calm Nature
    - Protect
    - Seismic Toss
    - Thunder Wave
    - Softboiled

    Blissey... lol pretty self-explanatory. Take hits fade threats away and paralyze them lol. I really don't want to run toxic because I really want to gear this team towards paralysis. I think there could be some changes to this set and I'll keep on trying until I find something that really pleases me.

    Toph (Jolteon) @ Choice Specs
    Trait: Volt Absorb
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 252 Spd / 4 HP
    Modest Nature
    - Volt Switch
    - Thunderbolt
    - Shadow Ball
    - Signal Beam

    Once again, not too many things can outspeed Jolteon so I don't really need the need to put scarf. I just went with specs for the extra power and T-Wave is essantially always available to stop anything that outspeeds it. Basic set for u-turn + volt switch combo and thunderbolt for stab specs :P

    Katara (Latias) (F) @ Choice Specs
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 252 Spd / 252 SAtk / 4 HP
    Timid Nature
    - Draco Meteor
    - Trick
    - Hidden Power [Fire]
    - Recover

    Latias just has absolutely great synergy with Cobalion because of the steel+dragon combo lol. That's besides the point. People don't really expect a specs Latias. Draco Meteor destroys anything that's not prepared and Hidden Power Fire is for steel types. Trick is incase I need to put away something wanting to setup or wall (Blissey.. Skarmory) and recover is for after tricking. It's helped me out before. So let me know what you think :P Always open for suggestions lol

    Aang (Scizor) @ Choice Band
    Trait: Technician
    EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4 HP
    Adamant Nature
    - Bullet Punch
    - Bug Bite
    - Superpower
    - U-turn

    Nothing beyond average, Bullet Punch EVERYTHING. Sort of my revenge killer/late game sweeper with Mienshao. Rarely ever using anything besides bullet punch. Sometimes U-turn when I see a prediction and obviously superpower for the steal types lol. Bug Bite is... I suppose just an extra STAB :P

    Sokka (Mienshao) @ Choice Band
    Trait: Reckless
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Adamant Nature
    - Hi Jump Kick
    - U-turn
    - Stone Edge
    - Dual Chop

    Hero of my team. Serves as my late game sweeper. I don't find the need to put a scarf because I usually have the opponents team paralyzed so Mienshao can just toss up Reckless Hi Jump Kick's. If I ever lead off with Mienshao I just use u-turn to scout with Jolteon's Volt Switch/Scizor's U-Turn. Stone Edge is just for coverage and dual chop is for the dragons. I might replace Stone Edge or Dual Chop considering I only need one.

    Please rate comment and criticize!!! lol thank you and rest assured because as soon as I figure out how to put images and stuff on I will change it immediately.

    Importable
    Code:
    Sokka (Mienshao) @ Choice Band
    Trait: Reckless
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Adamant Nature
    - Hi Jump Kick
    - U-turn
    - Stone Edge
    - Dual Chop
    
    Zuko (Cobalion) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 152 Spd / 104 HP / 252 Def
    Impish Nature
    - Thunder Wave
    - Close Combat
    - Stealth Rock
    - Iron Head
    
    Azula (Blissey) (F) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Natural Cure
    EVs: 4 Def / 252 HP / 252 SDef
    Calm Nature
    - Protect
    - Seismic Toss
    - Thunder Wave
    - Softboiled
    
    Toph (Jolteon) @ Choice Specs
    Trait: Volt Absorb
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 252 Spd / 4 HP
    Modest Nature
    - Volt Switch
    - Thunderbolt
    - Shadow Ball
    - Signal Beam
    
    Katara (Latias) (F) @ Choice Specs
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 252 Spd / 252 SAtk / 4 HP
    Timid Nature
    - Draco Meteor
    - Trick
    - Hidden Power [Fire]
    - Recover
    
    Aang (Scizor) @ Choice Band
    Trait: Technician
    EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4 HP
    Adamant Nature
    - Bullet Punch
    - Bug Bite
    - Superpower
    - U-turn
    
  2. TheStriker

    TheStriker

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2012
    Messages:
    117
    Hi, nice nicknames by the avatar characters. I wished they used the same characters for a different season but they made that stupid other series with a different main character that isn't as exciting as the original.

    Okay. Let me see here. The main problem here is that you have 4 choice users. None with a scarf so Cloyster, Gyarados, Volcarona, Sawsbuck, Venusaur, Dragonite, Landorus, Whiscash, Salamence, well anything with a speed boosting stat move means the end of this team. In the fast paced metagame you will need a pokemon that can keep up the momentum. Jolteon is particularly bad with a pair of Choice Specs because electric-type moves are bad to get locked into especially with Dugtrio, Gliscor, and Thundurus-T all over the place. I reccommend switching it to Life Orb. You still have decent power but you can switch moves.

    Next I would change your Mienshao's Choice Band to a Expert Belt. Expert belt is much better because Sokka (Lol) has good coverage. Why are you running Dual Chop on Mienshao? It can break Subs but only hits Dragon types super effectively and all the dragons are hit super-effectively because of their secondary typing. Change that to Swords Dance. You can start a sweep with that if you want. Also switch your Mienshao's nature to Jolly Nature. Like I said, in the fast-paced metagame, you'll need it.

    Latias ain't that good with Choice Specs and your team is weak to that big list I provided. Latios has a higher SpA and can run a Choice Scarf to out speed most threats like +2 Cloyster. The set is in my RMT if you want to get a good description. If you want you can copy and paste that one and take out all the unnecessary info. Here is the set.

    [​IMG]
    Latios @ Choice Scarf
    Timid Nature
    252 SpA / 4 SDef / 252 Spe
    Levitate
    - Trick
    - Psyshock
    - Surf
    - Draco Meteor

    Cobalion is a little too underated in the current OU metagame. I don't want to switch too much but if you want me to do another rate, just VM Me again!

    Good team. Hope these suggestions will help having a better momentum.
  3. iiEvOL

    iiEvOL

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2012
    Messages:
    12
    Thanks for the rate. Yeah I kind of noticed the 4 choiced problem so I changed the Expert Belt on Mienshao and life orb Jolteon. It works pretty good especially with the Latios set that you gave me. I just changed Shadow Ball to HP Ice for ground types on Jolteon incase of things like Dugtrio etc.

    Thanks for the rate/set, very well appreciated. Haha, glad you took notice of the nicknames :P
  4. Gary2346

    Gary2346 A filthy casual
    is a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Aug 5, 2011
    Messages:
    1,406
    Hey man! I like the use of Mienshao. He is very underrated in OU, and I myself have made a pretty damn awesome team featuring Mienshao, and he works great! First off your team has a huge crippling flaw, and that's you have WAAYYY too many Choiced Pokemon. Choice items are awesome, however being locked into a move almost all the time is a huge let down, and can cause sweepers to come in and set up on Pokemon locked into moves they can resist. Here are some suggestions:

    First off your Cobalion has a strange EV spread. The best Defensive Cobalion spread that I know of other then just going all out 252/252, is this spread right here, 252 HP / 208 Def / 48 Spe. The 48 Speed EVs are to outrun anything that base 70 speed positive nature, like Breloom and Politoad. This is essential, because even Breloom fails to OHKO Cobalion with Low Sweep or Mach Punch, but Cobalion can deal huge damage to Breloom with Close Combat. Something else I recommend changing on Cobalion is switching out Iron Head for Hidden Power Ice. Steel isn't the most useful offensive typing, but Ice is. Hidden Power Ice is a clean 2HKO to Gliscor, and almost a OHKO to Landorus, and severely denting Dragons. The reason HP Ice is so useful is because Cobalion can come into an Outraging Dragon such as Salamence or Dragonite, and can not only wall them, but take them out with HP Ice. Also, since you already have Blissey for paralysis, you should replace T-Wave with either Iron Head or Volt Switch.

    Secondly, I agree with TheStriker in changing Jolteon's item to Life Orb. Jolteon is an amazing scouter, and will often find himself attacking then Volt Switching out to maximize damage. With Specs however, you can't do that. Also, I would switch out Signal Beam for Hidden Power Ice. You already have Scizor checking Psychic types, so Jolteon is best of using HP Ice to hit Landorus, Gliscor, and Garchomp who normally completely wall Jolteon's entire move set. Besides, Shadow Ball pretty much hits anything that Signal Beam does except Dark and Grass types, which Grass is hit by HP Ice.

    I also yet again agree with TheStriker on either giving Latias a Choice Scarf or trying out Scarf Latios. An offensive team like yours MUST have a Choice Scarfer, and Latios/Latias work out perfectly. If you opt for Latias, you could use Healing Wish over Trick in order to completely heal a crippled Pokemon of yours, which is really useful late game. However, if you'd like more power then go with TheStriker's set.

    Scizor is pretty much fine as is. However, I'd replace Bug Bite with Pursuit in order to completely trap Psychic types, and it's a standard on a CB set. Also, CB Scizor does not need any investment in speed due to priority and terrible speed already. Try a more bulkier EV spread of 252 Atk / 8 SDef / 248 HP. Since Scizor is slow, he needs the extra bulk to survive.

    Last but not least, Mienshao. I can understand why you like Reckless, but the fact that Mienshao can only abuse one move is kind of a bummer. Other then the Scarf set, the best set Mienshao can run in OU is a Life Orb hit and run set. First off, you NEEEEDDDD Regenerator on Mienshao. Mienshao is so frail that he needs all of the extra HP he can get, and Regenerator is the only reason to even use Mienshao over Terrakion. Life Orb set looks just like your CB set, except with HP Ice over Dual Chop and a Hasty Nature. An alternative to this is Aerial Ace and a Jolly Nature. By the way, Expert Belt on Mienshao isn't the best because Mienshao's coverage isn't a lot like Genesect's per say, so Life Orb should be used for all around more reliable power.

    Hope this helped. Good luck! Props for Mienshao!
  5. iiEvOL

    iiEvOL

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2012
    Messages:
    12
    Hi Gary. I took both your and Striker's post and I really liked some of the tips and rating you guys offered. I really like the Reckless on Mienshao because I rarely ever end up using it as a U-Turn and Regenerator abuser. I just like bringing it in late game when most things a paralyzed and life orb reckless Hi Jump Kicking everything. I got rid of expert belt and placed life orb keeping reckless. As for the Choiced Item problem, that was the first thing I changed lol :P

    I also changed the Cobalion EV Spread and I love the 48 speed investment for Breloom considering how annoying it is. I tried the HP Ice and it kind of works so I suppose I'll get rid of Iron Head. What I was thinking was the TWave + Iron Head, but obviously it's no Jirachi! So I got rid of both Twave + Iron Head and Changed it for Volt Switch and HP Ice.

    I made some minor changes to Jolteon such as changing the Signal Beam for HP Ice and keeping shadow ball w/ Life Orb along with TheStriker's Latios Set. The Scizor EV Spread was much appreciated because the speed was useless considering I use BP Almost all the time.

    Thanks for the rate!
  6. Nova

    Nova Palisades
    is a Tiering Contributoris a Site Staff Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2011
    Messages:
    1,519
    Hi iiEvOL

    Welcome to Smogon! First off, I like to say I love your use of underrated sets such as Paraflinch Coballion and Reckless Mienshao. The element of surprise these sets provide can really throw your opponent off guard and turn the tide of a battle. Now looking at your team, a major threat to it are Dragon Dance users such as Dragonite, Haxorus, and Salamence. After setting up a Dragon Dance boost, these threats are able to outspeed your entire team and rampage through with its combination of Outrage and coverage moves. Coballion is currently your best bet to take on these Dragons but can only typically take on Dragonite if Coballion has not taken much prior damage. He is unable to deal with Haxorus and Salamence due the first packing a very powerful Earthquake and the second packing Fire Blast. Thunder Wave can slow them down but they often carry Lum Berrys to protect them against status while setting up. To handle these threats, I recommend replacing Choice Specs Latias with a Choice Scarf Latios with a moveset of Draco Meteor / Surf / Hidden Power [Fire] / Trick. Scarf Latios is one of the best revenge killers in the metagame, being able to outspeed all the aforementioned threats even after they have DD'ed and finish them off with a powerful STAB Draco Meteor. Surf allows you to hit Heatran and works as a generally safe move to spam. HP Fire handles Scizor and Ferrothorn and Scarf Latios carries Trick so you don't lose the ability to cripple walls such as Blissey by tricking them a Choice item.

    Now for some moveset changes. On Scizor, I suggest replacing Bug Bite with Pursuit. This allows Scizor to come in on a Latias or Latios locked into a Dragon-type move or a Celebi lacking HP Fire and trap them with Pursuit as they try to switch out expecting a U-turn. Bug Bite is an extremely powerful attack but Scizor is just too slow in general to make much use of it and often would just be in a better position to just fire off a Bullet Punch. Lastly, I recommend replacing Dual Chop on Mienshao with Hidden Power [Ice]. Hidden Power [Ice] allows you to easily take out Landorus-T and Gliscor who are very common physical walls and are likely most teams' initial switchin into Mienshao. If you make this change, it would be beneficial to use an EV spread of 252 Atk / 4 SAtk / 252 Spd with a Naive nature on Mienshao. Naive is a speed boosting nature and is recommended to take advantage of Mienshao's speed tier, the power boost from Adamant is not necessary with Mienshao's already high Attack, Reckless ability, and Choice Band.

    Hope I helped and good luck with your team!


    Set:
    Show Hide
    Latios (M) @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    -Draco Meteor
    -Surf
    -Hidden Power [Fire]
    -Trick


    tl;dr
    Show Hide
    Choice Specs Latias ----> Choice Scarf Latios
    Bug Bite on Scizor ----> Pursuit
    Dual Chop on Mienshao ----> Hidden Power [Ice]
    Mienshao's EV Spread ----> 252 Atk / 4 SAtk / 252 Spd with Naive Nature
  7. iiEvOL

    iiEvOL

    Joined:
    Dec 24, 2012
    Messages:
    12
    Novaray thanks for the Rate. I choose to take Scarf Latios and he covers many of my problems. I also put pursuit in place of bug bite and the Mienshao HP ice was weird but I suppose it makes sense. I really want made this team to abuse Mienshao's reckless banded hi jump kick so I'm gonna put HP Ice in case I ever want to predict, however here's the set I'm running right now.

    Still on the verge of whether to run Psyshock or HP Fire.

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 0)