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BW RU Storm (Peaked at #3)

Discussion in 'RMT Archive' started by complete legitimacy, Jul 3, 2012.

  1. complete legitimacy

    complete legitimacy Honko's Happy Funtime With Men
    is a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon

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    Credit to Keiran for the banner!

    A Team by complete legitimacy

    Proof (open)
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    So yeah, I'm complete legitimacy. I have various abbreviations of my name on IRC, but the most common is c_l since I use an underscore on there. I've been playing RU since late December, and it's been my favorite metagame since. I only started playing competitive Pokemon in late July of last year, and I've gotten better as time progressed. RU is a metagame where a lot more things are viable than in the upper tiers, and there's a ton of diversity. The metagame has been balanced for months, although I think a certain vine monster has started to upset that balance. This stage of the metagame has been really fun, since while the ladder was hopelessly inactive most of the time, I still had some great battles against good players. I peaked at #3 with this team, which perfected a strategy that I like to call it FireTrap (name courtesy of DittoCrow). It's pretty similar to DragMag, but the RU version. It comes from the fact that a lot of the best special walls in RU are extremely prone to Pursuit such as Slowking, Cryogonal, and Munchlax. This is especially effective at the top of the ladder, since Slowking and Cryogonal are the main special walls used. But the cool thing is, I had been using this strategy for months without realizing it.

    When this stage first started, I had to experiment a bit to see what worked in the new metagame and what didn't. Of course, I didn't make this team until mid-May, but when I did I could see after only a few battles how effective it was. I originally based the team around Magmortar, which at the time was the most anti-metagame Pokemon in RU. Its ability Vital Spirit made it one of the few complete counters to Tangrowth, and its access to Thunderbolt allowed it to 2HKO the impending Slowking switch-in that was dominant in the metagame. If you look closer at the title, you'll see that this team is aptly named Storm because of Magmortar and its access to Thunderbolt. I chose teammates that would be able to facilitate a Magmortar sweep easily. Choice Band Spiritomb is probably the best Pursuit user in the metagame from my experiences, and the FireTrap combo was born. Of course, Magmortar is pretty slow compared to most offensive Pokemon, and that's where I brought in an effective paralysis support core of Ferroseed and Slowking. I've used Ferroseed over Tangrowth for months because of its access to Spikes, and entry hazards are vital to this team's success. Cryogonal was the next addition for its access to Rapid Spin, especially since Cryogonal is the best spinner in RU. Finally, I needed something for Stealth Rock that would patch up the team's holes. I was doing an analysis for Rhydon at the time, and it was perfect for my team's needs.

    I've never been entirely sure of what exactly my favored playstyle is, but I think I've found it with this team. Again, I'm not sure what exactly it classifies as, but I think it would either be semistall or bulky offense. I like having a strong defensive core to check most threats in the metagame, but at the same time I can't play full stall. I like having some offense as a way to break opposing stall, and Magmortar is one of the best candidates for the job. I typically get my hazards up as soon as possible, and against offense I take hits and paralyze while against defense I get Magmortar in and let it do its job. What I like most about this team is its flexibility, since it can easily stall for one or two hundred turns, but also it can end a battle fairly quickly. Ladder play was a piece of cake, and I ended up getting five alts in this month's 1200 stats, with of course my highest alt being at #3 earlier in the month. Now that that's out of the way, without further ado, here is Storm!

    Team-Building Process (open)
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    I started with Magmortar.

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    I had had great experiences with Choice Band Spiritomb before, and I added to it to the team here, because I had actually used it with Moltres before, and its ability to trap Slowking left Moltres free to sweep too. Spiritomb is also one of the best spinblockers in the metagame, in the top three with Cofagrigus and Rotom.

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    Ferroseed was my next choice for a teammate. It provided great resistances, paralysis support, and Spikes, and I've used Ferroseed before on other successful teams, so I know how good it is. It was a good check to the priority users around its Speed tier that Magmortar doesn't like, such as Feraligatr, Kabutops, and Absol.

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    Slowking forms a good defensive core with Ferroseed. It gave me another check to Fighting-types should Spiritomb be out of commission and is just really sturdy in general.

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    Rapid Spin was a necessity on my team at this point, and Cryogonal fit well. Magmortar is extremely prone to hazards, and in general I just like having a spinner on my team so Spikes and Toxic Spikes don’t get in my way.

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    Rhydon filled all the holes of team perfectly both synergy-wise and also in dealing with threats. It gave me a Flying resist and also checked things like Scolipede, Electivire, and Drapion. Stealth Rock was also a necessity, and Rhydon is a great user of it.


    Team at a Glance

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    A Closer Look

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    Magmortar (F) @ Expert Belt
    Trait: Vital Spirit
    EVs: 44 HP / 32 Def / 252 SAtk / 180 Spd
    Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
    - Fire Blast
    - Thunderbolt
    - Focus Blast
    - Hidden Power [Grass]

    Magmortar is the star of the team, and it was one of the most anti-metagame Pokemon there was at the time I created this team. Now, the metagame has actually started to shift around Magmortar, which is actually pretty cool. I hyped this thing up on #rarelyused for weeks, and people finally tried it out for themselves as the month went on. Magmortar is pretty much the best wallbreaker in the tier at this point in time, and the only real way to stop it is using Munchlax or a bunch of other niche counters like Grumpig, Flareon, and Camerupt. This is a set that I created, and I’ve given it to multiple other users and they’ve all had similar success with it. Expert Belt is an often-overlooked item, appearing gimmicky compared to Life Orb, and it’s forever branded to Electivire back from its time in DPP OU. However, it is put to great use here, since Magmortar also has exceptional super effective coverage. Magmortar is anti-metagame mainly because of Vital Spirit and Thunderbolt, since it can singlehandedly demolish the TanKing core without taking too much damage in the process. Focus Blast is really helpful for things like Clefable and Munchlax, and it’s also Magmortar’s best option against opposing Fire-types, bar Moltres. HP Grass is mainly for 2HKOing Lanturn after Stealth Rock, and is also helpful against certain Ground-types such as Rhydon, Quagsire, Sandslash, and Golurk. This is an original EV spread too, and I didn’t stop modifying it until the last night of the stage. Modest 180 Speed outspeeds Cryogonal and everything below, most notably Omastar and Crawdaunt. When Expert Belt gives Magmortar’s attacks a boost, Modest Expert Belt is actually slightly stronger than Timid Life Orb variants, which in my opinion are inferior to this set. Magmortar sits at a really cool Speed tier just above base 80s, but most things at or below base 80 Speed has priority to hit Magmortar with; Absol, Feraligatr, and Kabutops are what I’m talking about. Medicham can be outsped with more Speed too, but most of them are Scarfed and I’d rather not take the risk of being OHKOed by Hi Jump Kick regardless. The remaining EVs are to increase Magmortar’s bulk in a key place, and they specifically allow Magmortar to always survive no investment Tangrowth’s Earthquake after Stealth Rock, truly making it a perfect switch-in. Magmortar is what I like as an offensive Pokemon, since it still has good special bulk and can check a few troublesome threats such as Moltres and Lilligant. Anyways, Magmortar isn’t so anti-metagame anymore, but you should still be prepared for it since it’s really good.

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    Spiritomb (F) @ Choice Band
    Trait: Pressure
    EVs: 172 HP / 252 Atk / 84 Spd
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Shadow Sneak
    - Sucker Punch
    - Pursuit
    - Return

    Choice Band Spiritomb is one of my favorite Pokemon to use out of any metagame. It is just so good at what it does, and it can trap Ghosts and Psychics almost guaranteed, sometimes getting multiple kills per game. It forms the second part of my FireTrap core, and a lot of the things it can beat are roadblocks for the team such as Slowking, Rotom, and other things. RU is a tier dominated by Ghost-types such as Cofagrigus, Spiritomb, and Rotom, so Pursuit support is a godsend in this metagame. Spiritomb is arguably the best Pursuit trapper in the metagame, since it’s a Ghost-type and has Sucker Punch too. Spiritomb is a great spinblocker too, since it can trap and kill Cryogonal too, the best spinner in the metagame. No other good Ghost-type can boast that (I said good so Dusknoir doesn’t count). Sandslash has to hit three Earthquakes to kill Spiritomb, and Kabutops takes a lot from Sucker Punch if it chooses to go for Stone Edge. Spiritomb is a perfect counter to almost every Fighting-type in the metagame, since Medicham, Hitmonchan, Hitmonlee, Hariyama, and Primeape can’t touch it. Usually their STAB moves are pretty predictable, but Spiritomb can easily find itself stretched thin between Pursuit trapping and countering Fighting-types. Recently, I’ve tended to not switch it in as aggressively as I have in the past, and it generally ensures that Spiritomb stays around longer. The set itself is almost standard, with the exception of Return. The deadly combo of Sucker Punch and Pursuit is pretty easy to win most of the time, and if I don’t get it right once, then I definitely will the second time. Shadow Sneak is what I use against Rotom, Jynx, Haunter, and other frail Pokemon, since they can all punish the use of Sucker Punch with Substitute, or Lovely Kiss in Jynx’s case. Double priority is a great insurance against frail offensive Pokemon such as Manectric, Accelgor, and Scpetile, since Spiritomb can take them all out with Sucker Punch before it dies to a strong STAB move. Most Choice Band Spiritomb use Trick, and I originally did as well. However, my team is incredibly weak to Crawdaunt, and I needed some way to break its Substitutes before it could set up. It found other uses as well by being more powerful than Shadow Sneak, and locking yourself into Sucker Punch unless absolutely necessary isn’t a good idea. With Return, Spiritomb can also check Taunt + SD Drapion since it isn’t OHKOed by Crunch and can deal a good deal of damage with Pursuit. The EVs outspeed Dusknoir before it can use Will-o-Wisp, but Dusknoir isn’t that common or good so it doesn’t come in handy that often. I see people using this set with Will-O-Wisp over Trick and with BlackGlasses, and I just shake my head because Pursuit can’t OHKO Slowking or Cryogonal on the switch.

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    Ferroseed (F) @ Eviolite
    Trait: Iron Barbs
    EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SDef
    Relaxed Nature (+Def, -Spd)
    - Spikes
    - Leech Seed
    - Thunder Wave
    - Gyro Ball

    Ferroseed is a Pokemon that I’ve used on pretty much every successful team I’ve ever made for this metagame. Every time, it hasn’t disappointed. This is the only Ferroseed set worth using, and even with Protect you lose a valuable moveslot that makes Ferroseed setup fodder. Well, you could drop Spikes, but at that point you should be using Tangrowth. As for me, I’ve always preferred Ferroseed because I really like Spikes in RU, since a lot of the most threatening attackers take full damage from entry hazards. Ferroseed isn’t liked by a lot of the top players, but I’ve always been able to use it successfully. In my opinion, the key to using Ferroseed is to keep using Thunder Wave. Most players think that Ferroseed is a free switch-in for pretty much anything, but Thunder Wave deters things like Moltres, Magmortar, and Entei from doing much. Ferroseed can switch in easily on Water-types, and also many Normal-types as well. Against offensive teams, I’m spamming Thunder Wave since if I’m switching in Ferroseed it usually means I wall whatever my opponent has in. Against defensive teams, I’m either laying down Spikes or using Leech Seed to get a healthy recovery method going. Things like Steelix and Sandslash that can actually hit Ferroseed with Earthquake are usually Leech Seeded, whereas Choice-locked Electric-type attacks are getting Spikes set up on them. Gyro Ball is completely necessary so that Ferroseed isn’t destroyed by Taunt and Gyro Ball actually finds a fair bit of use against Aerodactyl and Whimsicott, which are both hard countered by Ferroseed. Sap Sipper users such as Bouffalant and Sawsbuck are hit hard by Gyro Ball, breaking both of their Substitutes. It’s always funny to me when people try to bring in Golurk on Ferroseed, since the only way that Ferroseed will be significantly damaged is by Focus Punch, but Gyro Ball breaks Golurk’s Substitutes so Golurk can’t get the Focus Punch off. A physically defensive spread is completely necessary for Ferroseed, and allows it to counter Feraligatr and Kabutops, among other things. I’ve never even considered a specially defensive spread, since the only notable special attack that Ferroseed needs to survive is +2 Omastar’s Ice Beam, but Ferroseed only loses about two-thirds of its health when using a physically defensive spread. I would consider more attack to break Crawdaunt’s Substitutes. But I’m sure it’s way too much investment than for what it’s worth. The only other thing that’s slightly annoyed me is how Aerodactyl can live a Gyro Ball with only 2%, and I always get a low damage roll on it. All the same, Ferroseed is an excellent defensive pivot that is one of the better Spikers in the metagame.

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    Slowking (F) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Regenerator
    EVs: 248 HP / 144 Def / 116 SDef
    Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
    - Scald
    - Thunder Wave
    - Psyshock
    - Slack Off

    This is a pretty standard defensive set, and Slowking is just so good at what it does. It uses its resistances and bulk to check/counter most Fire- and Fighting-types easily. I’ve used it a lot in this metagame, and it forms an effective defensive core with Ferroseed, and there’s few things that they can’t handle. Slowking first rose into prominence when Moltres burst out onto the scene as a major threat, and Slowking was its best common counter since it had Regenerator and Slack Off. I’ve used Slowking on a lot of teams, and it always gets the job done. The defensive set is definitely the best, since once you know that it’s a Specs set, it’s really quite easy to switch into. However, the defensive set packs an element of surprise, since you don’t always know what its second attacking move is; Fire Blast is bad for Ferroseed, while Psyshock is bad for Cryogonal. I originally went with Psychic to deal with Qwilfish and Poliwrath better, but I soon found that Psyshock was the better option. It’s mainly for Cryogonal, but it also works better against Hitmonchan, Hitmonlee, and Gallade. It lets it serve as a secondary check to Bulk Up Gallade, which can be problematic if it gets too many boosts and Spiritomb is down. It’s completely superior to Psychic, since it still hurts Qwilfish and Poliwrath. Scald is Slowking’s primary STAB move though, since the burn chance is really nice. Being able to catch a Drapion or Spiritomb on the switch is really cool, and it makes Slowking a lot harder to take down. I’ve use Surf in the past to deal with Moltres and SubCM Entei better, but I really prefer Scald. One of the cool things about hitting both physically and specially with the same Special Attack stat is that if a 40% Cofagrigus switches in and takes 18% from Psyshock, I can easily go for the KO with Scakd since Cofagrigus’s Defense is higher than its Special Defense. Like with Ferroseed, if I expect something slightly problematic switching in, every day I’m using Thunder Wave. It really is the key to this team’s success, and since there are few viable clerics in RU (Lanturn, Clefable, Uxie) it cripples them for the rest of the match. Slack Off has been traditionally deemed a necessity for Slowking, but most matches I don’t even use it. Of course, I could replace it with Fire Blast, but I think there are more times that I need Slack Off than I would need Fire Blast. It’s really only helpful for Tangrowth and Ferroseed, but they usually aren’t too threatening. The EV spread is pretty standard, since it has enough Defense EVs to avoid the 2HKO from Choice Band Entei, and the rest are placed in Special Defense. Slowking has high usage for a reason, since it’s a wonderful pivot.

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    Cryogonal @ Leftovers
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SDef
    Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
    - Rapid Spin
    - Haze
    - Recover
    - Ice Beam

    Cryogonal is the best spinner in RU, and it only moved into RU this month. It can beat pretty much every spinblocker in the tier, since it hard counters Cofagrigus and Rotom, can beat Calm Mind Spiritomb, and also beats Golurk. The only good spinblocker that it can’t beat all of the time is Choice Band Spiritomb, since Dusknoir is bad. But even then, SilentVerse has been using a spread that let Cryogonal beat even Spiritomb, since it only needs a certain amount of Defense EVs to always survive either a Sucker Punch or Pursuit on the switch. Cryogonal is great against spike-stacking teams, since they typically only carry Cofagrigus or Rotom as their spinblockers, and Cryogonal is immune to Spikes and Toxic Spikes. It is also a good special wall, since it has reliable recovery, a good defensive typing for a special wall, and of course that high Special Defense. It has great utility in countering some of the threats that Slowking can’t handle, such as Sceptile, Manectric, Rotom, and Rotom-C. It’s one of the best counters in the metagame to Trick Room + Nasty Plot Cofagrigus, and it’s the main reason why I chose Haze over Toxic. Ice Beam is surprisingly powerful, dealing a good chunk of damage to most things that don’t resist it. It’s one of my go-to options for Sigilyph, although it immediately wins if it has Psyshock. However, only Life Orb variants carry Psyshock, and those are easily dealt with by Spiritomb. Cryogonal is weak to Stealth Rock, which isn’t really desirable as a spinner, since Cryogonal is easily forced out because of its awful Defense stat. This is most definitely the standard set for Cryogonal though, since it combines its utility as a spinner and a special wall into one. A pretty simple max/max spread lets it take on special attackers as best as possible, while not being susceptible to setup sweepers because of Haze. Haze is one of the best things Cryogonal has going for it, and it makes it different from things like Slowking and Lanturn. Say, did Shadow Ball just cause a Special Defense drop? No big deal, just stay in and use Haze, and then the Ghost-type is beaten down. Cryogonal is finally getting the usage it deserves, since it’s been the best spinner in RU for quite some time.

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    Rhydon (F) @ Eviolite
    Trait: Lightningrod
    EVs: 60 HP / 252 Atk / 16 Def / 56 SDef / 124 Spd
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Stealth Rock
    - Earthquake
    - Rock Blast
    - Megahorn

    And now, the mighty Rhydon comes into play, one of the most underrated Pokemon in RU. Rhydon is the glue of the team, since it offers many helpful resistances, insurance against many threats, and some nice offensive presence to go along with Stealth Rock. I face a lot of teams that are weak to it, since people tend to lack Ground resists on their team because there aren’t any prominent RU threats with STAB Earthquake. Rhydon was thrown onto the team mainly because of the above reasons, but it turned out to be anti-metagame as well. It’s a great lead, since it can beat most other hazard leads with Rock Blast, and can even set up Stealth Rock of its own. All those Aerodactyls, Scolipedes, Accelgors, and Crustles got nothing on Rhydon. It is literally the best feeling in the world to OHKO Crustle since it needs five hits and a crit to actually happen. Anyways, Rhydon is my primary way of beating special walls such as Miltank, Clefable, and Munchlax that Magmortar can’t switch into very easily. It tanks Earthquakes like it’s its job and deals heavy damage in return. Honestly, I think that Rhydon is one of the most underrated Pokemon in RU, since it has few hard counters due to its bulk, power, and coverage. It’s one of the best Drapion counter in the tier, since only a +2 Aqua Tail really hurts it enough, and even then Drapion needs a Life Orb to guarantee the OHKO. Megahorn is one of Rhydon’s greatest assets in my opinion, since it can deal over 80% to unsuspecting Slowkings and also allows it to be a low-health Tangrowth. It hits lead Mesprit for an OHKO most of the time, while Rhydon easily lives an Ice Beam. It’s also good for hitting things like Crawdaunt and Sceptile on the switch, since they can both be pretty threatening if played correctly. Now, Rhydon’s spread looks incredibly complicated, and I’m not gonna tell you that it’s actually quite simple because it’s not. Max Attack is obvious, while 124 Speed outruns the rare support Omastar that Double01 uses. The HP and Special Defense allow Rhydon to take on Life Orb Rotom, since its Shadow Ball doesn’t even 2HKO, while the rest is placed in Defense since it increases physical bulk more than placing it in HP would. Rhydon is a great Pokemon that plays numerous roles for a team, and it really shines with the support this team gives it.

    Threatlist (open)
    Absol- Can be problematic if I let it set up. It can set up on Slowking, or Spiritomb locked into anything but Return, and proceed to wreak havoc from there. I usually try to lure the Superpower on Ferroseed, so that either Rhydon or Spiritomb can take a hit after its Attack has dropped. It usually tries to set up on Ferroseed though, so I can Leech Seed stall it until it dies by wearing it down with repeated switches.

    Accelgor- Cryogonal is a hard counter, although it’s forced to switch out if Accelgor gets the Special Defense drop. In the lead matchup Rhydon comes out on top since they always expect me to switch, but I don’t. Spiritomb is a good check too, since it can come in on Focus Blast, live a Bug Buzz, and 2HKO with Shadow Sneak. Magmortar also beats variants that lack HP Rock.

    Aerodactyl- Ferroseed is a hard counter, since it takes a +1 Earthquake with ease and has a chance to OHKO Aerodactyl with Gyro Ball. Rhydon always wins the lead matchup, since earthquake doesn’t even 2HKO while Rock Blast needs only 3 hits to OHKO Aerodactyl. Rhydon can even live a CB Aqua Tail. Slowking is a pretty good check too, although it’s 2HKOed by Life Orb or Choice Band Stone Edge.

    Aggron- Rhydon takes all of its attacks like a boss and OHKOes with Earthquake. However, SubPunch versions with Magnet Rise are a problem, since I have to either predict the Magnet Rise and switch to Magmortar, or switch to Slowking since it can take the Head Smash too. Ferroseed only fears Fire Punch, but all Aggron does is spam Head Smash anyways. Magmortar outspeeds and OHKOes with Fire Blast, and also deals heavy damage with Thunderbolt if I can’t afford a miss.

    Alomomola- Ferroseed can switch in and Leech Seed it to oblivion, and can use Thunder Wave for maximum effect. Magmortar also KOes it with the combination of Fire Blast and Thunderbolt.

    Altaria- I’ve only seen special variants of these, and either Slowking or Cryogonal can deal with them just fine. Cryogonal can OHKO with Ice Beam (although it’s a 2HKO at -2) while Slowking can paralyze it so Rhydon can come in to save the day. Speaking of Rhydon, it can survive a Draco Meteor and retaliate.

    Archeops- Rhydon hard counters this guy. It usually wastes its Flying Gem way too early, and Rhydon takes it easily. Not even Earthquake 2HKOes. Ferroseed only fears the Flying-Gem boosted Acrobatics, but otherwise it’s a good check that can either paralyze Archeops or hit it with Gyro Ball. Slowking also takes an Acrobatics, and brings Archeops into Defeatist range with Scald.

    Bouffalant- The most common set is the Sub + 3 Attacks set, and Ferroseed takes that on easily, since earthquake or Megahorn doesn’t do nearly enough and Gyro Ball breaks its Subs. Rhydon is also a good check that can break through its Substitutes with Rock Blast, and can hit with Earthquake too. Otherwise, Magmortar has Focus Blast but it never seems to hit.

    Braviary- Rhydon is a good check that only fears Superpower. However, if Braviary uses Superpower I can then easily trap it with Spiritomb. Ferroseed is good for getting paralysis on it, and Slowking can do the same.

    Camerupt- Slowking is a hard counter and OHKOes with Scald. Rhydon can switch in pretty easily too, since it outspeeds and OHKOes with Earthquake, and isn’t OHKOed by Earth Power.

    Clefable- Ones with Toxic are a giant problem. Rhydon can’t 2HKO without Rock Blast getting lucky, and Magmortar has to rely on hitting two Focus Blasts in a row while being possibly Toxic stalled. If it lacks Toxic, Cryogonal can PP stall it, although that’s a last resort.

    Cofagrigus- Not a problem at all. I would say it’s a classic case of over-preparing for it, but both Cryogonal and Magmortar are hard counters, and everything else on the team has some way of dealing with it. Cryogonal is generally the most reliable option though, since it can Haze away its boosts into oblivion, although Magmortar is useful for those that carry Will-O-Wisp and/or Rest, since it can 2HKO with Fire Blast while Cryogonal can’t 3HKO.

    Crawdaunt- The biggest threat to the team. I can’t let this thing set up. If I lead with Rhydon and my opponent leads with Crawdaunt, it’s gg right then and there. I lead with Magmortar to prevent it from setting up off the bat, and if I have Slowking or Ferroseed I’m using Thunder Wave all day long. Spiritomb is the closest thing I have to a check against it, since it can take a +1 Waterfall just barely, and Return breaks it Substitutes. After that, I may be able to stall it out with Ferroseed if it tries to set up Substitutes on me.

    Crustle- Not threatening in the slightest, since Rhydon can usually 2HKO it with Rock Blast to prevent it from setting up too many hazards. Cryogonal is pretty reliable against these types of teams too. Offensive versions are also stopped by Rhydon, while Ferroseed paralyzes it easily for Magmortar to do work.

    Cryogonal- Spiritomb is a trusty spinblocker that can force Cryogonal into the prediction game, or I can just use Return and deal like 75%. Ferroseed can OHKO with Gyro Ball, Slowking wins if it lacks Toxic since it has Psyshock, and Magmortar even beats offensive versions with HP Ground since it only does 60%. Rhydon can also take an Ice Beam and OHKO with Rock Blast.

    Drapion- Rhydon beats all variants except for offensive Swords Dance variants with Aqua Tail, and if that’s the case, then Ferroseed is a hard counter that can paralyze it. Magmortar is a good check to specially defensive variants, while Cryogonal can spin away their Toxic Spikes since Crunch does paltry damage. Choice Band versions try to trap Slowking, but can’t since it’s too weak.

    Drifblim- The Acrobatics set is the only one I’ve seen, and Ferroseed is one of the best initial switch-ins to paralyze it. Slowking can do the same, with Magmortar and Cryogonal being able to kill it. Rhydon is a good check as long as it avoids Will-O-Wisp, since it can break even Drifblim’s Substitute with Rock Blast.

    Druddigon- Ferroseed can take even a Superpower, and on the next turn I switch to Spiritomb and use Pursuit for heavy damage. If it’s locked into Outrage, Cryogonal revenge kills nicely, while Rhydon can take a Superpower at full health and retaliate.

    Dusknoir- Ferroseed can use Leech Seed on it while taking the burn, and then Slowking can stall it out. Nobody uses SubPunch anymore, but Spiritomb is a hard counter to it as long as it avoids Will-O-Wisp. Magmortar is a good check as long as it avoids Earthquake, and Rhydon doesn’t like taking Will-O-Wisp either but otherwise it’s fine.

    Emboar- Slowking is my primary switch-in to it, since even Wild Charge can be easily recovered off. If it stays in for the 2HKO, I’ll switch to Rhydon and OHKO it. If it doesn’t use Wild Charge, Slowking beats it. If it tires to get the upper hand on Rhydon and use Superpower, Spiritomb can come in and Pursuit it.

    Electivire- Is threatening in theory, but not so much in practice. It tries to come in on Slowking with full health, but can’t OHKO so I just try to go for the burn. Rhydon is a good check since Electivire has to hit two Earthquakes or Cross Chops in a row to beat it, while Spiritomb can take even a Wild Charge and force it into the prediction game, or deal heavy damage with Return.

    Entei- Slowking is my primary switch-in to it since Rhydon fears HP Grass, and doesn’t risk anything by switching in, since even a crit Stone Edge won’t kill it, and Slowking doesn’t stay in long enough for Toxic to run its course. Rhydon takes its hits the best though, and once I’ve scouted out that it lacks HP Grass or Will-O-Wisp I’m free to switch in Rhydon. Otherwise, I can wear it down with recoil before it gets to be too much of a problem.

    Feraligatr- Ferroseed is a hard counter, but most people stay in against and try to win, which they can’t bar crits. Slowking can also take a +2 Return and hit it with Psyshock for some residual damage, or use Thunder Wave to ensure that Spiritomb can hit first with Sucker Punch. Rhydon can actually survive a Waterfall if Ferliagatr lacks Leftovers, but it needs to be at full health to do so.

    Ferroseed- Magmortar is my first switch-in since it generally tries to get up Stealth Rock as soon as possible, although some people are smart and use Thunder Wave. Rhydon can actually switch in and beat Ferroseed should it lack Protect, since Earthquake deals more damage than Leech Seed can recover. Otherwise, I engage Ferroseed in an epic stall war with the other Ferroseed.

    Flareon- Once again, Flareon should be threatening in theory, but isn’t in practice. Rhydon is my best switch-in to it, and OHKOes with Earthquake while only fearing a Lava Plume burn. Slowking also beats it, since I’m bound to get parahax and both Scald and Psyshock do 40%.

    Gallade- Spiritomb is a hard counter to all sets, since Shadow Sneak does a lot to any set. Slowking and Rhydon can take on Bulk Up Gallade before it gets too many boosts in, and Cryogonal can Haze away its boosts as long as it doesn’t OHKO with Shadow Sneak. Swords Dance versions are checked by Magmortar.

    Galvantula- Cryogonal is a hard counter to it, and the only chance Galvantula has is with Stealth Rock. Ferroseed can survive a Bug Buzz and paralyze it for Magmortar to come in and KO it with Fire Blast, and Spiritomb can KO it with Sucker Punch after Stealth Rock. Rhydon beats any Galvantula that lacks Energy Ball for some reason.

    Golurk- Can’t set up on anything, and tends to try on Ferroseed but Gyro Ball breaks its Subs. Spiritomb is probably my best answer to it, but literally everything on the team checks it so it’s not a threat.

    Gurdurr- Although incredibly obscure, Gurdurr is one of the largest threats to my team. My best bet is to hit for 40% with Rhydon before it starts to Bulk Up, and wear it down with Spiritomb so it can’t heal itself. Then, I’ll put the last 40% down on it with Magmortar, hopefully killing it off before it can regain all of its health back.

    Hariyama- Slowking is a hard counter, since it’s slower than Hariyama and can avoid the double-damage Payback. Spiritomb is a good check too. I’ve been seeing some RestTalk Hariyamas lately with Whirlwind and Force Palm, and in that case Rhydon and Ferroseed check it.

    Haunter- Cryogonal is a good check to everything but SubDisable. Slowking can take a Shadow Ball, and has two different attacks to break its Substitute. Rhydon can break its Substitutes, and easily takes an HP Ground. Spiritomb can OHKO with either Shadow Sneak or Pursuit too.

    Hitmonchan- Spiritomb is my first switch-in to it since I typically have Stealth Rock up early and Hitmonchan wants to spin them away. Both Return and Shadow Sneak are the moves of choice, and Spiritomb always comes out on top. If I see Leftovers, I assume that it’s carrying Foresight, so in that case I switch to Slowking, which is a good check to all sets. Rhydon actually beats most Hitmonchan, since Drain Punch doesn’t 2HKO most of the time and Rhydon does 80% with Earthquake.

    Hitmonlee- Spiritomb and Slowking are both hard counters. Spiritomb is typically my first switch-in since it blocks Fake Out and hopefully Hi Jump Kick, but Slowking works too since it can paralyze or KO with Psyshock. Ferroseed can take a Close Combat but not a Hi Jump Kick and live to hit with Gyro Ball or paralyze. I believe Rhydon can also take a Close Combat and retaliate with Earthquake.

    Jynx- Magmortar counters the SubNP or SubCM, as well as chcecking every other set. Spiritomb can KO with Shadow Sneak or Pursuit if something has already been put to sleep. Cryogonal can Haze away its boosts, although it greatly fears Psyshock. Rhydon can break its Substitutes with Rock Blast, and Ferroseed OHKOes with Gyro Ball. Of course, Slowking breaks its Substitutes with Psyshock and takes little from any of Jynx’s attacks.

    Kabutops- Ferroseed hard counters it, paralyzing it and Leech Seeding it to its death. Magmortar can take an Aqua Jet at full health, and Spiritomb has Sucker Punch should it be paralyzed. If it lacks Aqua Jet, Spiritomb can beat it, but if it lacks Aqua Jet, it can’t OHKO Rhydon at +0. Defensive variants are pushovers and literally anything can deal with it, but Ferroseed is still my switch-in to it.

    Klinklang- Believe it or not, Rhydon counters it, since even +1 Gear Grind can’t OHKO while Rhydon OHKOes with Earthquake (unless you’re ShakeItUp and use dual screens). Slowking is a good check in general, and Leftovers versions can’t beat it. Life Orb versions are easily dealt with by Ferroseed though.

    Lanturn- I switch in Ferroseed to it, and Leech Seed to slowly drain its health. It’s Rapid Spin fodder for Cryogonal, and Cryogonal eventually wins since Lanturn lacks recovery (except for RestTalk which no one uses but should). Slowking also wins because of Psyshock since Lanturn is weak.

    Lilligant- I typically don’t have problems with this, and when I do it’s because of me playing Ferroseed poorly. Lilligant suffers from severe coverage issues, and it can’t beat the team with either Hidden Power it usually runs. HP Fire is countered by Magmortar, and HP Rock is checked by both Ferroseed and Cryogonal. It can only put one of them to sleep, so the one that it doesn’t put to sleep is the one that can paralyze it or beat it outright.

    Linoone- Ferroseed and Spiritomb both hard counter it. It can only set up on Slowking, and it has to have Seed Bomb to pose a threat. Ferroseed can paralyze it so that Rhydon or Spiritomb can finish the job, while if lacks Seed Bomb Rhydon beats it easily, and Spiritomb gets to play the prediction game with it.

    Magmortar- Should be threatening in theory, but really isn’t. I switch to Slowking, and if it predicts that and uses Thunderbolt, that’s cool. If it doesn’t, that’s cool too. If it hits the first Thunderbolt, then I switch to Spiritomb and force it into the prediction game, which I tend to be more aggressive than usual with. Hazards and Life orb wear it down greatly so it’s not that big of a threat, and my own Magmortar can also wear it down.

    Magneton- Cryogonal is my first switch-in to it, and it eventually wins since Magneton doesn’t even have Leftovers recovery. If it’s a SubCharge set, then I switch to Rhydon and deal with it. Magmortar can also check it.

    Mandibuzz- Suffers from massive four-moveslot syndrome, and it needs five moves to beat the team. Rhydon is a hard counter to it, and can either hit it with Rock Blast, or if I predict the Roost it can also use Megahorn. Magmortar 2HKOes it with Thunderbolt, and it needs to keep Roosting to win, although I think Thunderbolt has more PP. Before that though, I’ll either get a crit or a paralysis so I can beat it.

    Manectric- Cryogonal only fears Choice Specs or Life Orb, which are the two less common sets. Choice Scarf sets are easily dealt with by Cryogonal. Slowking beats Choice Scarf sets too, since Volt Switch doesn’t do enough. Since Manectric is usually Choice–locked, I can predict around it with Ferroseed, Slowking, and Rhydon and beat it. Magmortar is a good check that can take a Life Orb Thunderbolt and OHKO if need be, and Spiritomb OHKOes with Sucker Punch after Stealth Rock.

    Medicham- Spiritomb is my go-to switch-in, and if it’s locked into an ineffective move I can just Pursuit it. Otherwise, Shadow Sneak gets the job done. Slowking is a pretty good check as well if it’s not Choice Band, and Rhydon can take a Choice Scarf Hi Jump Kick and hit back with Earthquake.

    Mesprit- Lead sets are the most common, and are promptly beaten by Rhydon with Megahorn. Offensive sets are somewhat trickier but still not threatening, since Spiritomb is a hard counter to all offensive sets and Magmortar checks them as well.

    Miltank- This thing is only somewhat of a threat because you don’t know what ability it’s carrying until it’s too late. If it lacks Sap Sipper I’m free to Leech Seed it with Ferroseed, and if it lacks Scrappy it can’t touch Ferroseed. However, Magmortar is really my only way of bringing it down since Rhydon can’t 2HKO it with Earthquake, and if Focus Blast misses or Body Slam paralyzes, it’s going to be a long game.

    Misdreavus- Cryogonal beats it no questions asked. Ferroseed can Leech Seed it, while Magmortar is a good check that can absorb the Will-O-Wisp. Slowking can attempt to stall it out too.

    Moltres- Slowking is a hard counter and lasts the whole match. Magmortar is also a good check to Moltres, since Life Orb Air Slash only does 55% while Thunderbolt OHKOes. Interestingly enough, if Moltres doesn’t run Fire Blast then Cryogonal can survive a hit. Spiritomb has priority to get the last 30% off, and Rhydon beats SubToxic versions easily.

    Munchlax- Can’t touch Spiritomb in any way, shape, or form. Rhydon also hits it pretty hard, and Ferroseed can use Leech Seed so both Rhydon and Magmortar 2HKO. Is extremely reliant ont RestTalk for survival, so it’s pretty easy to wear down.

    Omastar- Ferroseed, Slowking, and Cryogonal all check it, and they can paralyze it or Haze away its boosts before slowly wearing it down. Magmortar beats it before it’s set up with HP Grass. Rhydon outspeeds and 2HKOes support variants, while Ferroseed sets up alongside it with Leech Seed running in the background. Its hazards are easily spun away by Cryogonal.

    Poliwrath- Slowking is my switch-in to Poliwrath, although it doesn’t always stay in for long because of Circle Throw. Ferroseed can take a Circle Throw easily, and allows me to get Leech Seed on it. If Rhydon comes out, Poliwrath always goes for Scald so I can keep Slowking in for longer. Once it’s down to about 70% and Magmortar comes out, it can Thunderbolt for the kill. SubPunch versions are easily dealt with by Slowking.

    Primeape- Spiritomb or Slowking deals with Primeape fine. Paralyzing it helps, but Spiritomb can kill it outright. Both Ferroseed and Rhydon can live a Choice Scarf Close Combat, which is the only set you’ll see, and hit back with either Gyro Ball or Earthquake.

    Quagsire- Ferroseed switches in on to avoid Toxic, and can Leech Seed it. Slowking doesn’t like Toxic, but can try for a Scald burn. Otherwise, Magmortar can hit it with HP Grass, and can live a Scald or Earthquake after a burn.

    Qwilfish- Slowking is my only 100% safe switch-in, but that’s okay since people seem to be misusing Qwilfish lately. It always stays in and gets as many layers of Spikes down as possible, but these are easily spun away by Cryogonal. Magmortar outspeeds and OHKOes with Thunderbolt, and Rhydon deals heavy damage even after Intimidate, while Qwilfish can’t OHKO with Waterfall.

    Regirock- Ferroseed can use Leech Seed on it, and Rhydon also hard counters it, although it can only 2HKO with Earthquake I think. Magmortar has Focus Blast to hit it with, and Slowking has Scald.

    Rhydon- Ferroseed is my only safe switch-in, but I can predict around it pretty easily between Ferroseed, Cryogonal, and Slowking racking up Leech Seed damage before Cryogonal goes in for the kill with Ice Beam once Rhydon has 60% left. Magmortar OHKOes with HP Grass, while Rhydon can 2HKO with Earthquake. Chances are, my Rhydon will be faster so I can win the Rhydon vs. Rhydon. Slowking is also a good check that can live Megahorn and OHKO with Scald.

    Roselia- Magmortar is the best switch-in to it on the very small chance that it carries Sleep Powder, and OHKOes with Fire Blast. Cryogonal is also a solid switch-in that can spin away its hazards and hit back with Ice Beam. Slowking beats it one-on-one with Psyshock, too.

    Rotom- Cryogonal is a hard counter, although SubSplit sets can be a pain. Rhydon also counters it, and can break Rotom’s Substitutes with Rock Blast. Spiritomb can switch in and put Rotom into a trap and kill situation, and is the best option if I think it’s going to use Trick. Magmortar is a good check that can take a hit and OHKO, while Slowking can also live a Life Orb Thunderbolt and hit back with Scald.

    Rotom-C- Cryogonal counters it, and even if it gets Tricked a Choice Scarf it’s okay since Choice Scarf Cryogonal is boss. Ferroseed is another good check, since it only fears HP Fire and Trick, but takes literally nothing from Rotom-C’s other two attacks. Magmortar can take a Thunderbolt and OHKO, and while it doesn’t like being Choice-locked it’s easily the best Pokemon on the team for a Choice Scarf.

    Samurott- Ferroseed is a hard counter that wears down Samurott a lot over time. I don’t think it can OHKO Slowking with Megahorn, and even if it goes for the Megahorn it will be forced to take Iron Barbs + Life Orb damage. Both Ferroseed and Slowking can paralyze it for Spiritomb or Magmortar to dispose of it.

    Sandslash- People who use Sandslash typically lead with it, and I get that first 33% off with Earthquake while they set up Stealth Rock. I then switch into Cryogonal to avoid the Earthquake (although sometimes it gets hit with a Toxic, but not Stone Edge since nobody predicts that) and use Ice Beam for the KO. I’d rather have a dead Sandslash than rocks up anyday. If it comes in in the middle of the match to try to use Rapid Spin, Spiritomb prevents it from spinblocking until I force it out with Cryogonal again.

    Sawsbuck- Ferroseed counters it. I can Thunder Wave it for Magmortar or Cryogonal to do the dirty work, or Ferroseed can just take it out with Gyro Ball. As a side note, Rhydon can live a Horn Leech and OHKO with Megahorn.

    Sceptile- Cryogonal is a good check, since my opponent has to predict my switch-in and hit two Focus Blasts in order to beat Cryogonal. Just in case, I switch to Spiritomb to avoid the attack and Sucker Punch for the kill, or Pursuit if they’re Choice-locked. Physical variants are pretty troubling, but after the Acrobatics is taken comfortably by Rhydon, Ferroseed can take the second one and paralyze Sceptile.

    Scolipede- Rhydon is a hard counter that wins either in the lead matchup or in the middle of the game with Rock Blast. Ferroseed is a good check that can paralyze, while Spiritomb can survive a Life Orb Megahorn. Swords Dance versions can try to force a switch on Slowking, but I can use Psyshock for a lot of damage.

    Scyther- Rhydon is my go-to switch in, and hopefully can set up Stealth Rock to limit its switch-ins. Only Brick Break hurts, but since Scyther is usually Choiced, Spiritomb can just trap it with Pursuit. Ferroseed is another goo check that can paralyze Scyther for either Magmortar or Cryogonal to clean up.

    Sigilyph- Life Orb variants are dealt with by Spiritomb, which only takes 66% from an Air Slash and can OHKO with Sucker Punch. Cryogonal is a good check to those that lack Psyshock, since it can Haze away its boosts. Cosmic Power variants are a little complicated, but actually kinda fun to play around. First, I let Cryogonal get burned. On the next turn, I switch to Ferroseed or Slowking as they use Cosmic Power. Then, Sigilyph shifts its burn onto Slowking or Ferroseed while I use Thunder Wave, and the Flame Orb can’t reactivate. Then, I can easily beat it with Cryogonal or Spiritomb.

    Slowking- My own Slowking is the best switch-in, and it helps to scout out its moveset first. Those that lack Fire Blast are set up on by Ferroseed, while Specs Slowking is remarkably easy to play around. I can trap it with Spiritomb, and Rhydon can deal over 80% to all Slowking variants with Megahorn. Magmortar can 2HKO all variants of Slowking with Thunderbolt after Stealth Rock, and Specs Slowking will fall to the combination of Fire Blast and Thunderbolt. Cryogonal can also stall out those that lack Psyshock and Toxic.

    Smeargle- Whenever I see this in Team Preview, I always lead with Magmortar and go for the reliable 2HKO with Thunderbolt. If something has been put to sleep already and Smeargle’s Focus Sash isn’t broken, then Rhydon can Rock Blast it for the KO.

    Spiritomb- Is threatening since it can trap both Cryogonal and Slowking, leaving special attacker an easy sweep. I try to burn on the switch with Slowking, and Ice Beam with Cryogonal. Calm Mind versions are easily dealt with by Cryogonal, and Ferroseed can use Leech Seed to aid in this. Versions with Will-O-Wisp are Leech Seeded by Ferroseed, and then I lure the Will-O-Wisp to Magmortar so it can use Fire Blast.

    Steelix- On its first switch-in, it tries to set up Stealth Rock as soon as possible. If its Sturdy is broken, I switch in Magmortar and OHKO with Fire Blast. If not, then I switch to Ferroseed and attempt to Leech Seed it. Slowking can 2HKO with Scald, and Rhydon can 2HKO with only a little prior damage.

    Tangrowth- I have multiple ways of dealing with Tangrowth, but they didn’t work sometimes because Tangrowth was broken. Anyways, Magmortar can switch in on literally anything and KO with Fire Blast. Cryogonal is a good check, and only needs to avoid Power Whip and Sleep Powder. Rhydon can hit it on the switch with Megahorn, but it only 2HKOes offensive Tangrowth. Sometimes, I can either burn or paralyze it, so I have to hope for the best after that.

    Typhlosion- Slowking switches into it all day long. Magmortar is a good check as long as it avoids HP Rock, and Rhydon can switch into Typhlosion’s STAB moves and KO with Earthquake. Since it’s usually Choiced, it can’t sweep my team while being locked into one move.

    Uxie- In the lead matchup, I typically go for the 2HKO with Megahorn with Rhydon. If it’s dual screens however, I let it set up both screens, and use Stealth Rock on the inevitable Memento. The only semi-threat to the team is the SubCM, and that is dealt with by Spiritomb, and Rhydon and Magmortar can also deal damage to it.

    Whimsicott- What doesn’t beat this thing, in the entire metagame? Ferroseed is what I switch into it though since I don’t like it SubSeeding me until I die from laughing too hard, and Gyro Ball break its Subs. In any other case, everything on the team can break its Substitutes consistently and not allow it to get a Leech Seed off bar Slowking and maybe Spiritomb.


    Importable

    Code:
    Magmortar (F) @ Expert Belt
    Trait: Vital Spirit
    EVs: 44 HP / 32 Def / 252 SAtk / 180 Spd
    Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
    - Fire Blast
    - Thunderbolt
    - Focus Blast
    - Hidden Power [Grass]
    
    Spiritomb (F) @ Choice Band
    Trait: Pressure
    EVs: 172 HP / 252 Atk / 84 Spd
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Shadow Sneak
    - Sucker Punch
    - Pursuit
    - Return
    
    Ferroseed (F) @ Eviolite
    Trait: Iron Barbs
    EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SDef
    Relaxed Nature (+Def, -Spd)
    - Spikes
    - Leech Seed
    - Thunder Wave
    - Gyro Ball
    
    Slowking (F) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Regenerator
    EVs: 248 HP / 144 Def / 116 SDef
    Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
    - Scald
    - Thunder Wave
    - Psyshock
    - Slack Off
    
    Cryogonal @ Leftovers
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SDef
    Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
    - Rapid Spin
    - Haze
    - Recover
    - Ice Beam
    
    Rhydon (F) @ Eviolite
    Trait: Lightningrod
    EVs: 60 HP / 252 Atk / 16 Def / 56 SDef / 124 Spd
    Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
    - Stealth Rock
    - Earthquake
    - Rock Blast
    - Megahorn
    This team has been one of the greatest teams I’ve ever created, and I think it truly exemplifies the state of the metagame at this time. All of the Pokemon synergize wonderfully both typewise and in dealing with threats, and I think that’s one of the reasons why RU is my favorite metagame. It takes skill to win, but there’s a lot of diversity so that a lot of strategies are viable. I’ve enjoyed this stage of RU more than most, since it was fun to play in such a balanced metagame with the exception of Tangrowth. If you don’t play RU, I hope that you try it sometime, since it’s a really fun metagame that unfortunately suffers from playerbase issues. I know that this team has had an enormous effect on the metagame, and it’s pretty cool that I actually had metagame trends countered before they even appeared (hi SV and DC :P). Now that’s what I call taking the metagame by Storm.​
    Level 51 likes this.
  2. TheMexican

    TheMexican

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2010
    Messages:
    223
    Gratz on your peak, I've battled this team many times and its pretty solid. I'll give a proper rate later.
  3. Bigblue

    Bigblue

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2011
    Messages:
    140
    [​IMG]

    I know that Nidoqueen was not out at the time of your laddering (Congratz BTW) but the Life orb variant destroys this team. The only way to defeat it is to get cryogonal or slowking in safely by predictions and proceed to kill it off with an ice beam or psychic but you would have to change all your evs to kill it after stealth rocks. Or send in Spiritomb and hope that a sucker punch will kill it which it wont, and then EarthPower or Sludge Wave will 2HKO it.
    Show Hide
    252 Atk Choice Band Spiritomb (+Atk) Sucker Punch vs 0 HP/0 Def Nidoqueen: 59.81% - 70.4% (2 hits to KO)


    The Evs required to kill Nidoqueen off after stealth rocks are 200 spec attack in Cryogonal and 24 speed evs if Nido is modest, 124 if Nido is timid. Slowking requires 216 spec attack evs to kill Nido with psychic after Stealth rocks, but it will not take a thunderbolt nicely without those EVS in HP or Sdef anymore. This is if both have leftovers on them. Thunderbolt and Flamethrower/Fire Blast will still 2HKO both of these two(Slowking after stealth rocks).
    Show Hide
    252 SpAtk Life Orb Sheer Force Nidoqueen (+SpAtk) Thunderbolt vs 248 HP/116 SpDef Slowking (+SpDef) : 51.4% - 60.56% (2-3 hits to KO)

    252 SpAtk Life Orb Sheer Force Nidoqueen Thunderbolt vs 248 HP/116 SpDef Slowking (+SpDef) : 46.82% - 55.47% (2-3 hits to KO)

    252 SpAtk Life Orb Sheer Force Nidoqueen (+SpAtk) Fire Blast vs 248 HP/252 SpDef Cryogonal (+SpDef) : 57.73% - 68.22% (2 hits to KO)

    252 SpAtk Life Orb Sheer Force Nidoqueen Fire Blast vs 248 HP/252 SpDef Cryogonal (+SpDef) : 52.48% - 61.81% (2-3 hits to KO)

    252 SpAtk Life Orb Sheer Force Nidoqueen (+SpAtk) Flamethrower vs 248 HP/252 SpDef Cryogonal (+SpDef) : 45.48% - 53.64% (2-3 hits to KO)

    252 SpAtk Life Orb Sheer Force Nidoqueen Flamethrower vs 248 HP/252 SpDef Cryogonal (+SpDef) : 41.4% - 48.98% (3 hits to KO)


    Amazing team on the other hand but you will have to tweek so EVS to stop nidoqueen whether it is more speed in Magmortar or more Spec Attack in Slowking.
  4. Endorfins

    Endorfins Your Worst Nightmare
    is a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Nov 6, 2011
    Messages:
    546
    You've already acknowledged this, but Crawdaunt is a huge threat to your team. It can set up on Spiritomb, Ferroseed and Slowking, especially the common Substitute DD Crawdaunt variants.
    An easy way to fix this is to replace one of Ferroseeds moves with either Bullet Seed or Seed Bomb.
    Luvdisc'd
  5. alexwolf

    alexwolf King of Conquerors
    is a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Jul 3, 2009
    Messages:
    6,483
    Very nice team complete legitimacy! This is the style of play that i like too, a proper defensive core to fall back and a few hard hitters to fasten up the pace a bit when you need to. This way you can play both offensively and defensively, which is great!

    I see a great SD Gallade weakness. Especially to Bulky SD Gallade with Leaf Blade. If it carries Lum berry it can set-up on against 3 pokes in your team (Ferroseed, Gallade and Cryogonal) and then proceed to wreck havoc. At +2 it 2hkoes everything in the team except from Spiritomb, which is 2hkoed 50% of the time after SR + Spikes. Did i also mentioned that Spiritomb cannot OHKO a healthy Gallade with Shadow Sneak? Yeah that too. So long story short, if Spiritomb is a bit weakened and/or Spikes are up you lose one poke every time Gallade comes in on Slowking, Ferroseed and Cryogonal, which is your whole defensive core. The only mon that can threaten it after it gets an SD, except Spiritomb, is Magmortar, but even he cannot ohko if Gallade is at full life (56.88 - 67.27% is the amount that Fire Blast does). So your only answer is to weaken it with Spiritomb and then revenge kill with Magmortar.

    I cannot suggest anything, since Gallade has hardly any counters, but leaving those 3 pokes in as less as possible and T-Wave spamming (which you already do) with Slowking and Ferroseed are your best allies.
  6. complete legitimacy

    complete legitimacy Honko's Happy Funtime With Men
    is a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2011
    Messages:
    1,126
    Thanks for the rates and Luvdiscs, guys!

    Thanks! Our battles were always haxy one way or another :(

    This team is retired now, so I won't be using it in the BW2 metagame. However, if I were then I actually wouldn't be too worried about Nidoqueen. If it comes in on Ferroseed or Cryogonal, I can switch to Slowking and take the Fire Blast followed by Thunderbolt and hit back with Scald. If that doesn't kill it I can switch to Spiritomb and Sucker Punch for the kill. If it comes in on Rhydon, I can switch to Cryogonal to take either the Earth Power or the Ice Beam, fire off an Ice Beam, and switch to Spiritomb and Sucker Punch for the KO. I guess it's one of those things like Electivire that's pretty threatening in theory, but not so much in practice. There's a difference between OHKOing everything and 2HKOing everything, and you'd be surprised how few players (even good ones) don't predict when they're not locked into a move. Thanks for the rate though!

    Yeah, if Crawdaunt gets a DD and I haven't paralyzed it yet, then it's pretty much gg unless I can get a bunch of Gyro Ball crits or something. I'm not sure I can easily replace Gyro Ball though. I don't want to be setup fodder for Bouffalant, and Ferroseed is one of my primary ways of dealing with Taunt Aerodactyl. Plus, Gyro Ball hits a lot harder against most threats while ensuring that Cryogonal can't come in and spin all my hazards away. I appreciate the rate though.

    Actually, most of the team can deal significant damage to Gallade before it has a chance to set up. Spiritomb is my best counter to it, so I'll usually try to keep it at full health. Also, if I know that Gallade is carrying Lum Berry, both Ferroseed and Slowking can actually hit it hard before it sets up with Gyro Ball or Psyshock. If I hit them as they SD, if it's on Ferroseed I can pivot into Spiritomb and OHKO it with Shadow Sneak. If it comes in on Slowking or Rhydon, I hit them as they SD, switch to Ferroseed to take the Leaf Blade and rack up Iron Barbs damage, and go to Spiritomb on the Drain Punch. If all else fails, I can outspeed it with Cryogonal and use Haze to make it even easier pickings for Spiritomb or hit it with Magmortar once it's lost enough health. Of course, if it predicts it can be a problem, but you can say that for anything really. However, it is a great set and it surprised me the first time I played it. Thanks for the rate!
  7. Friar

    Friar

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2008
    Messages:
    615
    This is a really great team, I really like the innovative spread on Magmortar and the use of Rhydon.

    It seems to me like your Gurdurr, Miltank, Toxic Clefable problems are effectively stopped by using the standard CB Spiritomb set with Trick over Return. You lose very little coverage, and can make Gurdurr very weak defensively and also easy to wall and Clefable and Miltank unable to do much of anything. It would also help towards the end of games, dealing with any last pokemon situation easily by Tricking the band off and going to a resistor. The main reason it seems you're using Return is for Crawdaunt, but if you go with Endorfins' suggestion and drop T-Wave for Seed Bomb you should be pretty well protected. It also helps against BU Gallade who seems like it could be an issue for your team, especially if it carries Night Slash, although Substitute or Taunt would still be a problem.

    I'd be interested to watch your team play against Leftovers Klingklang with Shift Gear / Sub / Gear Grind / Return, because Rhydon can be worn down without recovery, and it sets up on Ferroseed, Spiritomb, and Cyrogonal. I might not be giving Slowking enough credit I guess. You could think about Steelix over Rhydon, but that would probably make the team too reliant on Slowking for Fire types.

    Great team!
  8. complete legitimacy

    complete legitimacy Honko's Happy Funtime With Men
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    Thanks for the rate! I've used Trick in the past on Spiritomb, but I've never looked back with Return. Return is a great move that eases prediction, and like you acknowledged, it's the closest thing I have to a check to Crawdaunt. Also, Bulk Up Gallade isn't a problem, since even Rhydon can take it on before it gets too many boosts, as well as Slowking. I have it pretty well checked.

    I actually can't replace any of Ferroseed's moves since they're all essential. The only move I would even consider dropping Seed Bomb for is Gyro Ball, and even then Gyro Ball has a lot more use. I can't drop Thunder Wave because paralysis support is essential for this team to work, since both Magmortar and Rhydon aren't what you'd call fast.

    Lastly, Leftovers Klinklang isn't a problem either, since +1 Return doesn't 2HKO Slowking, and Scald deals good damage while possibly burning it. If it still breaks through Slowking, I can actually beat it with Ferroseed once its health has dropped significantly.
  9. Explorer

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    You have a very nice balance in your team; Rhydon is a major threat in RU, and the best way is to murder it with Surf or Leaf Storm, or to burn it, since Eviolite gives it no recovery.

    For Slowking, I would suggest getting rid of Slack Off since you already have Regenerator. Instead, use Fire Blast or Ice Beam, depending on which coverage you prefer to have more of.

    If Crawdaunts try to switch into Slowking and use to set up, you could also use Hidden Power Grass or Fighting (Bug and Electric coverages are both poor).
  10. complete legitimacy

    complete legitimacy Honko's Happy Funtime With Men
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    Sorry, but I can't get rid of Slack Off. It's really necessary when I lose momentum and Slowking has to take a hard hit. Specifically, it's pretty helpful against weaker Volt Switch users such as Lanturn and Scarf Manectric, since I can just take the hit and use Slack Off to Recover off the damage. It's also useful against Pursuit users, since it's a good move to avoid both Sucker Punch and Pursuit from Spiritomb, and it also lets you not get trapped by Drapion. Admittedly, my team has a bit of a problem with Pursuit users that come in on Cryogonal or Slowking, and dropping Slack Off would only increase that weakness, especially since Drapion and Spiritomb are far more common than Crawdaunt. I appreciate the rate though!

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