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Sun team with unoriginal name (actually, it has no name)

Discussion in 'BW OU Teams' started by RBG, Jan 24, 2013.

  1. RBG

    RBG But I keep cruising, can't stop, won't stop grooving.
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    Messages:
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    [pimg]38[/pimg]@ Leftovers
    Trait: Drought
    EVs: 252 SDef / 252 HP / 4 SAtk
    Calm Nature
    - Sunny Day
    - Flamethrower
    - Pain Split
    - Will-O-Wisp

    Since I wanted to use a sun team, I naturally had to start building it with Ninetales. The Sunny Day variation seemed to be the most useful, since it makes weather wars some what easier, and Pain Split allows it to heal itself outside of rest. I decided to also make it the bulky version since being the worst of the weather starters, it needs as much bulk as possible to stay alive, and it also allows it to throw out a few Will-O-Wisps.

    [pimg]3[/pimg]@ Life Orb
    Trait: Chlorophyll
    EVs: 252 Spd / 252 SAtk / 4 HP
    Rash Nature
    - Growth
    - Giga Drain
    - Earthquake
    - Hidden Power [Fire]

    Every sun team benefits from Venusaur. Originally, I ran a purely special version (Sludge Bomb), but Heatran start to annoy me enough that I added Earthquake to try to go mixed and hit things on both sides of the spectrum. I thought about dropping Growth and putting back on Sludge Bomb, but the power boost from Growth is just too impressive to make me actually go through with it.

    [pimg]616[/pimg] @ Life Orb
    Trait: Chlorophyll
    EVs: 252 Spd / 252 Atk / 4 SDef
    Jolly Nature
    - Horn Leech
    - Jump Kick
    - Nature Power
    - Return

    The second half of the Chlorophyll duo. Sawsbuck is a personal favorite of mine. It gets great coverage between it's 4 moves. There honestly isn't much I can think of to say here, as I haven't actually changed anything about it while using this team, but I wouldn't be against replacing it to improve the team.

    [pimg]667[/pimg] (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Flame Body
    EVs: 252 Spd / 252 SAtk / 4 HP
    Timid Nature
    - Quiver Dance
    - Fiery Dance
    - Bug Buzz
    - Hidden Power [Ground]

    Volcarona, the fearsome fire moth. I went for the offensive variation. I've been torn between Hidden Power and Giga Drain, but Heatran (again!) was annoying enough to deal with after getting a Quiver Dance that I decided to just replace it, since I can power through most waters with Bug Buzz, but I do miss the healing from Giga Drain. D:

    [pimg]675[/pimg](M) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Sheer Force
    EVs: 252 Spd / 252 SAtk / 4 HP
    Modest Nature
    - Rock Polish
    - Earth Power
    - Focus Blast
    - Psychic

    I originally had Mamoswine here, but I heard about the special Sheer Force Landorus and I had to take some time to try it, and it has done a lot more than Mamoswine ever did. This thing was won battles on it's own. I'm still torn on whether I need Psychic/HP Ice/Sludge Wave for that last move, so I'm open to suggestions.

    [pimg]450[/pimg] (M) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Rough Skin
    EVs: 252 Spd / 252 Atk / 4 SAtk
    Naive Nature
    - Outrage
    - Earthquake
    - Stealth Rock
    - Fire Blast

    Garchomp is the last and newest member of my team, replacing Calm Mind Latios. I wanted a Stealth Rock user because I had noticed that so many of my battles would have been easier if I had Stealth Rock on the field. Wanting to keep a Dragon Type, Garchomp was the first thing that came to mind. I've found the set to be effective, although I am open to criticism.

    -----

    I apologize for the short write ups. I usually build my teams by just throwing together sets I want to use and then replacing and fixing things, so there isn't so much strategy in my team. Because of this I am open to any and all suggestions on how to fix this team. Some problems I've noticed have been 4 Pokemon weak to Ice and no Steel types, but I'm sure most suggestions will fix these, so I'll leave this to the Team Raters to suggest things to change. ^_^

    Code:
    Ninetales @ Leftovers
    Trait: Drought
    EVs: 252 SDef / 252 HP / 4 SAtk
    Calm Nature
    - Sunny Day
    - Flamethrower
    - Pain Split
    - Will-O-Wisp
    
    Landorus (M) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Sheer Force
    EVs: 252 Spd / 252 SAtk / 4 HP
    Modest Nature
    - Rock Polish
    - Earth Power
    - Focus Blast
    - Psychic
    
    Venusaur @ Life Orb
    Trait: Chlorophyll
    EVs: 252 Spd / 252 SAtk / 4 HP
    Rash Nature
    - Growth
    - Giga Drain
    - Earthquake
    - Hidden Power [Fire]
    
    Volcarona (M) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Flame Body
    EVs: 252 Spd / 252 SAtk / 4 HP
    Timid Nature
    - Quiver Dance
    - Fiery Dance
    - Bug Buzz
    - Hidden Power [Ground]
    
    Garchomp (M) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Rough Skin
    EVs: 252 Spd / 252 Atk / 4 SAtk
    Naive Nature
    - Fire Blast
    - Outrage
    - Earthquake
    - Stealth Rock
    
    Sawsbuck @ Life Orb
    Trait: Chlorophyll
    EVs: 252 Spd / 252 Atk / 4 SDef
    Jolly Nature
    - Horn Leech
    - Jump Kick
    - Nature Power
    - Return
    
    
  2. Jirachee

    Jirachee Kaleidoscope
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    Hello!

    The main problem I see with this team is that you can't really do a lot against most Dragon types. Latios, Dragonite, Latias, Salamence, Kyurem-B, etc. all the powerful offensive Dragon types can get a free hit pretty much every time they switch in. A lot of your Pokemon are switch in fodder for these Dragon types, which makes it even worse: your Venusaur lets things like Dragonite switch in every time as they can't really touch it, and it can get a Dragon Dance then proceed to annihilate your team with Outrage. I know that Sun is all about offense and keeping the momentum, so you can't really waste your time having a switch in to everything in the metagame. However, the part where it's a problem for your team is that you can't even revenge kill those Dragons. Nothing on your team carries a powerful enough attack to OHKO them, except Garchomp, which will be slower most of the time anyway. I recommend using a Choice Scarf Jirachi instead of Landorus. Landorus doesn't seem to add much for your team, as it doesn't need an extra sweeper, since you have already 2 Chlorophyllers. Furthermore, if you need an offensive Ground type for whatever reason, you already have Garchomp. Jirachi on the other hand, does a lot for your team. First of all, it offers you a (not so solid, but fine for an offensive team) Dragon resist, which is able to outspeed and revenge kill some of the Dragons like Dragonite. It will also be able to deal with Latios and Latias as they are weak to U-turn, allowing Jirachi to take advantage of them switching out giving free set up fodder to something like Volcarona. This will allow you to keep the momentum and fix your weakness to Dragon types.

    I'd also advise running Hidden Power Ice and a Naive nature instead of Hidden Power Fire and a Rash nature on Venusaur. With Earthquake, Venusaur doesn't need Hidden Power Fire to hit opposing Steel types, except for Ferrothorn and Scizor, which really shouldn't be a problem for a Sun team. Hidden Power Ice allows Venusaur to hit your biggest enemy, which are Dragon types. With a Naive nature, Venusaur is able to outspeed Choice Scarf Latios and OHKO it with +2 Hidden Power Ice, which will help Venusaur a lot (as well as the rest of your team.) With that, you should run a spread of 80 Atk / 252 SpA / 176 Spe, which ensures you outspeed Choice Scarf Latios and gives you extra Attack to hit harder with Earthquake.

    You don't really have a way to prevent opposing Stealth Rockers to set up on your team, as things like Lead Terrakion don't care about Ninetales, which is what you should be leading with against Lead Terrakion teams. This will hurt Volcarona's sweeping capabilities a lot, as then Volcarona will start the game at 50% HP. It's very difficult for Volcarona to set up then, let alone sweep. I suggest changing its set a bit. Running a different version with Morning Sun would be perfect for your team. That way, you get a late game sweeper that doesn't mind that much about Stealth Rock as it is capable of healing itself, as well as gaining something that will take advantage of Venusaur's ability to remove most Heatran with Earthquake and then sweep the opponent's team after a couple of Quiver Dances. In my experience, this set will work much better than the three attacks set if you run Earthquake Venusaur. I'll include it in the hide tag below.

    I suggest using Roar instead of Pain Split on Ninetales. While Pain Split is certainly nice to heal Ninetales as it is your weather starter, the move you'll usually be using against other weathers is Will-O-Wisp as it heavily cripples Hippowdon, Tyranitar and Politoed. Ninetales shouldn't stay in for long anyway. Roar, on the other hand, allows Ninetales to be not set up fodder for a lot of things if you're able to predict correctly, such as SubSD Terrakion, or Lum DD Dragonite.

    I don't think that having both Ground and Fighting coverage adds a lot to Sawsbuck. If anything, it just uses an additional move slot without reason. I think that you should be using Swords Dance instead of either Nature Power or Jump Kick. Both are pretty similar moves, except that Jump Kick hits Air Balloon Heatran, while Earthquake has perfect accuracy. Swords Dance makes Sawsbuck a menace that's difficult to deal with if you're able to nab a boost on a forced switch, and can soften checks to some of your other sweepers.

    That's pretty much it, here are the sets you should use:
    Jirachi (open)

    [​IMG]
    Jirachi @ Choice Scarf
    Serene Grace
    Jolly
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
    ~Iron Head
    ~Ice Punch
    ~Fire Punch
    ~U-turn

    [​IMG]
    Venusaur @ Life Orb
    Chlorophyll
    Naive
    EVs: 80 Atk / 252 SpA / 176 Spe
    ~Giga Drain
    ~Earthquake
    ~Hidden Power Ice
    ~Growth

    [​IMG]
    Volcarona @ Leftovers
    Flame Body
    Timid
    EVs: 240 HP / 216 Def / 52 Spe
    ~Fiery Dance
    ~Bug Buzz
    ~Quiver Dance
    ~Morning Sun


    Good luck!
  3. PDC

    PDC D I R T
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    Hey, cool team!

    This is a rather cool and creative sun team and I like it a lot. Sawbuck is one of the coolest Pokemon of all time, and I love seeing it on sun as it is much better than most people expect. The use of Lead SR Chomp is also pretty neat too, something I definitely like.

    The main problem with this team, like Jirachi said, is that you struggle to beat dragon types. Latios can come in, fire a Draco Meteor, and then switch out if it is threatened. You basically have to sac something every time something like Kyurem-B or Latios comes in due to your lack of any way of beating them or even heavily damaging them. Now I am not going to suggest the same things that Jirachi did, but I do agree on changing up Venusaur's set to accommodate your need for a faster Pokemon that can outrun most dragons even after boosts and then defeat them with Hidden Power Ice. My first suggestion is on Ninetails. Most of Ninetails threats are not special in the first place, which is why I suggest using a different EV Spread on it instead of the regular SDef spread everybody seems to like to use. 248 HP / 136 Def / 120 Spe Timid is by far the better spread. With this you can survive the feared Mach Punch from Breloom if needed, take Pursuits or stray Crunches better, or in general be more bulky. The specially defensive set only helps with Scalds, and otherwise is not very useful at all. On Sawsbuck you should also definitely be using Swords Dance with an Adamant nature. Jolly is honestly not needed as you already hit the speed of 598, which is more than fast enough. Swords Dance also allows Sawbuck to abuse it's power and actually sweep just like Venusaur. I suggest replacing Nature Power as Jump Kick basically covers the same things, and doesn't leave you completely vulnerable to Air Balloon Heatran.

    Finally I am siding with Jirachi's decision of running Scarf Jirachi over Landorus, as it is definitely the best option.
  4. BKC

    BKC
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    jirachi and pdc basically covered things, but i just wanted to point out that offensive venusaur should always have a +spe nature, as it allows it to outrun the fastest scarfers in the metagame [keldeo, terrakion, lati twins]. nice team gl
  5. Neliel

    Neliel Sacred Sword

    Joined:
    Oct 9, 2012
    Messages:
    565
    hey!

    I pretty much agree with all the changes jirachi and Pdc already said, but i think you can do also an another change. While its true that this team is really offensive, stealth rock alone is a problem. It will let you lose the weather war the most of the time, even with pain plit Ninetales, because its not reliable as a recovery move, and sr will also make you volcarona less effective. To prevent this, i dont think any spinner suits this team, but a different lead to prevent stealth rock should work fine here. Im talking about Sash terrakion, with stealth rock, close combat, stone edge and taunt. I think you can replace it for Garchomp because it does the same job, just better. With his fast taunt you can prevent anything from setting up, like Deo-d or bulky walls like ferrothorn, heatran ect. Its true that they can setup them later, but at that point you can take advantage of that free turn to kill a pokemon/setup a growth and win.

    Lastly, as i said, if you still want to use a recovery move on Ninetales, dont use Pain split. The fact that people often uses chesto berry Rotom-w its self explanatory of how pain split unrielable as a recovery move. Honestly i think that a chesto berry Ninetales is better, because not only it lets you cure some toxic (lets say you switch it into bulky politoed and they toxic you) but also you are sure to get some Hp back, without having to care about how many hp your opponent has. I dont think that with a so offensive team you ever needed to click pain split more than once, so rest shouldnt change anything.

    Now that i look at ninetales, i think you can do some little fix to your evs. Ninetales doesnt need speed, but i think that some evs just to outspeed Adamant breloom should be fine. With chesto rest you can also absorb the spore and ko it back with ftrower. 16 evs in speed are enough to do this trick, but you can also put 40 evs to catch some other things like jirachi, gliscor, celebi, Max speed ttar and other stuff in with the same speed. You should also put 248 evs in Hp on ninetales so that you can switch into sr 5 times instead of 4.
    Thats it, hope it helped!

    Show Hide
    [​IMG]-->[​IMG]Terrakion @ Focus Sash
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Close Combat
    - Stone Edge
    - Stealth Rock
    - Taunt

    [​IMG]Ninetales (F) @ Chesto Berry
    Trait: Drought
    EVs: 248 HP / 220 SDef / 40 Spd
    Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
    - Rest
    - Will-O-Wisp
    - Sunny Day
    - Flamethrower



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