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Sunscreen Offensive Sun Team

Discussion in 'BW OU Teams' started by Ghetsis, Nov 22, 2012.

  1. Ghetsis


    Aug 5, 2012
    Greetings Smogon! I made this team a week or so and it has been working out very well even though the team lacks essential sun "protection" it works very well against other weather as well. Please leave a suggestion and I hope you enjoy. I will also provide a battle video number if you want to see the team in action against a sand team!

    The Team

    Team building
    Ninetales is to obviously summon endless rays of sunshine. Besides that, it really isn't that good.
    Now I needed sun abusuers. Heatran came to mind! I always used it out of sun and he was destructive! Imagine how much a 50% boosted, STAB Fire Blast would do! Next a fast sweeper and Venusuar was my first choice. I used it on all my previous sun teams and I have to say it works better than Sawsbuck.
    Breloom is a Pokemon that should be on every sun team. Its main purpose it take out opposing weather inducers. By OHKO both Politoed and Tyranitar the weather war isn't that big of a deal.
    Chansey and Blissey started to be a problem. The ones with Thunder Wave cripples all my attackers. Espeon seemed to be the perfect counter. But if I lose Espeon Stealth Rock would be big trouble so I needed a spinner and I went with Donphan.

    In Depth:
    Ninetales @ Leftovers | Drought
    Modest | 136 HP / 252 Sp.A / 120 Spd
    - Sunny Day
    - Solar Beam
    - Fire Blast
    - Protect

    I went with the Sunny Day set over the other ones because this set works good against sandstorm teams. But since sand is somewhat unpredictable , I find myself using this against rain. Solar Beam is to hit Politoed or Tyranitar when they switch into a Sunny Day, but really it does nothing so I rarely use it. Protect is a dangerous move. It can help me stall a burn or something. But, it allows dangerous threats to set-up or sub, which can cost me the match.

    Heatran @ Air Balloon | Flash Fire
    Timid | 252 Sp.A / 4 Sp.D / 252 Spd
    - Fire Blast
    - Earth Power
    - Solar Beam
    - Hidden Power Ice (Ivs: 31/30/30/31/31/31)

    Yes it's HEATRAN ON A BALLOON! I love this thing. I used it a lot without sun and it is utter destruction so mixed with sun...I can't even say it. The ground weakness is a shame, but if played right a troublesome Gliscor or Landorus can be taken out with HP Ice. I originally had HP Grass and Dragon Pulse, but HP Grass wasn't powerful enough and Dragon Pulse didn't hit Dragonite and Salamence hard enough. Fire Blast under sun is just pure power. Earth Power is perfect when it comes to predicting incoming fire-types but it doesn't work with Tyranitar effectively which kinda sucks.

    Venusuar @ Life Orb | Chlorophyll
    Rash | 4 Atk / 252 Sp.A / 252 Spd
    - Growth
    - Giga Drain
    - Hidden Power Fire
    - Earthquake

    "Put Sleep Powder on it you idiot" said the last guy I beat because of Earthquake. I used to have Sleep Powder on it but the miss meant that I lost the game. Earthquake can't OHKO some fire-types without any boost, but if I have a +2 from Growth nothing stands in our way. Earthquake also surprises Tyranitar. Being a physical move it deals a nice chunk of damage to Tyranitar. I usually take advantage of a switching Politoed that came into a Sunny Day to bring him in, unless my opponent has Tornadus-T.

    Breloom @ Life Orb | Technician
    Adamant | 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    - Low Sweep
    - Mach Punch
    - Bullet Seed
    - Spore

    3 words...WEATHER WAR PWNAGE. Breloom is the best Politoed and Tyranitar check. Bullet Seed OHKOs any Politoed. If they do switch out anything coming in will take some nice damage. With Tyranitar I go for Low Sweep, if they stay in they die...if they switch...whatever comes in loses speed. Against weather-less teams I use him recklessly basically to take out Terrakion or weaken troublesome Pokemon with Mach Punch. Spore isn't really that much useful I mean sometimes it is, but Swords Dance looks like it might work better, but some matches Spore was the reason I won.

    Espeon @ Light Clay | Magic Bounce
    Timid | 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spd
    - Reflect
    - Light Screen
    - Psyshock
    - Hidden Power Fire

    This thing saved me a lot. Magic Bounce is awesome and that's what Espeon does best...well besides setting my screens. Not only that but it inspired me to call my team Sunscreen. Creative huh? No...okay. Anyway not much to explain, but I love it when Ferrothorn or Forretress decide to stay in to take me out with Gyro Ball and then I destroy them with HP Fire.

    Donphan @ Leftovers | Sturdy
    Nature | 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spd
    - Rapid Spin
    - Stealth Rock
    - Earthquake
    - Roar

    I KNOW NO ICE SHARD!!! I heard a lot people telling me to put Ice Shard on it and I got so angry I replaced Roar with it...and it failed me. With no attack EVs Ice Shard doesn't do a lot. The Offensive Rapid Spinner isn't bulky and I need bulk. Also carrying Ice Shard left me weak to sweepers that need sub. Roar is perfect. Weaken opposing Pokemon by shuffling them and racking SR damage.

    I love the team. It does lack ground immunity but it is pretty good and works out. I had a lot of sun teams but this worked out the awesomest. This team does have a horrible weakness especially to Landorus Incarnate with sub. So please don't underestimate the team...but feel free to underestimate me because I think this team is too good for some idiot like me to be using it. So help me make the team even better. Also watch the team in action and give me some tips about my battling style as well. I hope you enjoyed reading, please leave any suggestions, and have a nice day, night, morning, or evening. Battle Video: 14-81671-86040
  2. ganj4lF

    ganj4lF Nobody is safe from the power of science!
    is a Team Rater Alumnus

    Jun 11, 2011
    your team looks solid as-is to me, I'm going to suggest some little changes that can improve it a bit but it should work just fine even without them.

    First of all, I suggest using a Jolly nature on Breloom. Reaching 262 Speed is important since it means you can hit Tornadus-T on the switch with Low Sweep, and 2HKO it either casting Low Sweep again, or with Bullet Seed (provided SR are on the field). This also allows to outspeed all non-Timid Heatrans, Politoeds, and even 252+ Scizor, if someone is mad enough to use it.

    Second, you should really consider a Naive nature on Venusaur. Rash means you can be revenged by the likes of Scarf Keldeo or Scarf Terrakion in Sun, after a couple of rounds of LO recoil (or some residual damage, like SR and 1 layer of Spikes, or a Scald burn, or whatever else). Now, while outspeeding Scarf Lati@s is not much relevant here (you can't touch them at all with your moveset), outspeeding Scarf Terrakion / Keldeo is indeed relevant and allows you to avoid unwanted risks for your sweep. Naive Venusaur still has plenty of power at +2, and doesn't miss any significant KO if I can recall everything right. Using a spread of 72 HP /4 Atk / 252 SpA / 180 Spe Naive allows you to outspeed all those said threats (and even Choice Scarf Lati@s: it would be foolish to give away this opportunity to retain 4 more EVs, since it can come useful in case of a weakened Lati trying to stop your sweep), and gives a good boost to your survivability and a LO numver of HP, and even a slight buff to your Earthquake.

    Thirdly, and lastly, running Solarbeam on Heatran without Sunny Day on it is not a good idea, really. Politoed (that Heatran will lure in to no end) will make you charging it for two turns, and the player can then just switch to its Dragonite / Salamence / Latios / Tornadus-T / Genesect to take the beam without risking anything, and probably busting your balloon in the process. If you're having so big problems with things like Gastrodon, I'd suggest switching to Hidden Power Grass (and use Dragon Pulse to hit Dragons), however the best option is to just use another move, like Toxic, Will-O-Wisp, or Roar. They both have their function, the first two can cripple common switch-ins (Dragons, Fighting types, and Politoed) while being quite unexpected from an offensive variant of Heatran, while the last can give you a better way to check Bulky Volcarona, that could be quite threatening after having set up some Quiver Dances (if Volcarona Quiver Dances on the switch, it can achieve another one before the Fire Blast, and with 2 of them under its belt, it takes only 38.27 - 45.28% in Sun, so it can fish for a miss with Roost / Morning Sun and proceed to boost more and go to town on your team). The choice is up to you, use the move that cripples the most threatening thing for your team.

    Hope my rate helped somewhat. Good luck for your team!
  3. Reymedy

    Reymedy Colt Python 357 Magnum.
    is an official Team Rateris a Forum Moderatoris a Tiering Contributoris a Tutor Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnus

    Oct 17, 2012
    Hi !

    This gonna be quick for my part since Ganjalf said a lot of wise things already.

    You need something for Dragonite, if he got EQ he kills Heatran (having Balloon and HP Ice is really far from being enough) and NOBODY on your team can touch him. He can also play with you if he's a ParaShuffler, since HP ice is really far from threatening him.

    I don't see why you use Donphan AND Espeon. I mean, their roles are pretty similar.
    I was about to tell you to use Terrakion@Focus Sash. But you are so weak to Earthquake that I prefer tell you to use Landorus-T.

    The set is up to you, try to put SR on him though. I'm more thinking about a Bulky set to replace Donphan as a defensive pivot.
    He gives you the immunity you need, he's not weak to Fire or Grass. And shut down Physical threats that could kill Espeon Ninetales Venusaur Heatran.

    I really think you should give it a try. Good luck.
  4. malomyotismon


    Sep 12, 2008
    If you want to keep duel screen espeon, for dragons who potentially sweep this team, I would recommend mamoswine over donphan and give heatran Sr over solar beam for the reason ganj said and to save you the rouble of finding the sprites i'll post the set.

    Mamoswine@life orb
    Thick Fat
    252 attack 6hp 252 speed
    stone edge
    icicle crush
    ice shard

    http://sprites.pokecheck.org/b/473.gif back sprite.
  5. dragonuser

    dragonuser The only thing I look up to is the sky
    is a Tutor Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a defending World Cup of Pokemon champion

    Jun 7, 2011
    Hey there,

    This team is pretty cool, but there are ways it can be improved. To start, like Gan4lf said running SolarBeam on Heatran without Sunny Day is a large liability, and I would advise against it. I would heavily recommend Toxic over Solarbeam. Latias is a very large threat for your team, and Toxic gives you a solid way to hit it. Toxic also hits bulky Water-Types and effectively neuters them. You also have a pretty large weakness to Dragon-Type and Rock Polish Landorus. I realize that you are slightly disappointed with the damage output of Ice Shard, but it would really help your team a lot. It gives you a better way to revenge Dragon-Types, and it can do a lot to RP Landorus. I would definetly recommend using Ice Shard over Roar, and run a 252 HP / 84 Atk / 168 Def / 4 Spd spread. This spread will help a little bit with its damage output, while still maintaining some bulk. Also like other users have said having both Espeon and Donphan is a bit redundant. For this reason I would suggest running Zapdos > Espeon. Zapdos is a very good RP Landorus check (helping incase it manages to get +2), and gives your team a bit more overall bulk. It is also a very good Rain team check, taking pressure off of your Venusaur, preserving it for its sweep. Anyways, hope I helped gl.

    set (open)

    Zapdos @ Leftovers
    Trait: Pressure
    EVs: 248 HP / 76 Def / 184 SDef
    Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
    - Thunderbolt
    - Heat Wave
    - Hidden Power [Ice]
    - Roost

  6. Ghetsis


    Aug 5, 2012
    @ganj4lF Thank you for your suggestions! I love the new EV spread on Venusaur. But OHKO-ing Latios with +6 Giga Drain is a bet. The Toxic on Heatran didn't real prove useful yet but the again I rarely used Solar Beam in the first place. Thank you so much. Oh, and thank you on the Jolly suggestion on Breloom.

    True but considering I am pretty careless with both having 2 Pokemon with somewhat similar roles kinda gives me more than one chance to dodge entry hazards, but really Espeons main goal is to bounce back status not entry hazards. I will try malomyotismon's suggestion and use Mamoswine since my only defense against Dragonite is fooling it into believing my Donphan carries Ice Shard. Thank you for your suggestions!

    Actually Zapdos doesn't seem really necessary because I kinda deal with rain teams with Breloom or Venusaur easily, and I have a strategy for Tornadus-T which puts my opponent in a tough spot. The real problem are Fighting/Ground/Rock-types. These types are weak to Breloom and Venusaur (excluding Fighting) but their bulk kinda covers their weaknesses.
  7. undisputed

    is a Tutor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnusis a Past WCoP Champion

    Aug 16, 2009

    You've got the basics of a Sun team going right now, and that is a great start. I'm worried that you won't win the weather war though. For that reason, I'm mostly going to focus on helping you outlast Rain and Sand.

    First, we need to change up your Heatran set a little. Use Sunny Day / Solar Beam / Magma Storm / Earth Power. It's pretty much the same set, but with Magma Storm, you now have the ability to trap Politoed and Tyranitar on the switch. After they come in, assuming they aren't Scarfed, you use Sunny Day and proceed to kill them with Super Effective Solar Beams.

    Second, I'd recommend you use Volcarona over Espeon. In my opinion, Espeon isn't that good. It's basically Tyranitar bait anyway. Screens are most beneficial to teams with 5 sweepers all ready to go. If the other team has Tyranitar or Politoed, you're going to waste a lot of Screens time just trying to keep your preferable hazards on the field. I think this a massive waste for you. Volcarona will give you a great Sun Sweeper, so when you do win the weather war, you can bring the pain. It serves as a passable check to Lati@s, which is a huge threat for your team right now. In addition to that, Volcarona can take advantage of Venusaur's Earthquakes. Most Heatran will think they can hard counter Venusaur, but then you'll EQ them and continue your sweep. Once Venusaur goes down to, say Scizor's Bullet Punch, then you bring in Volcarona and sweep again. Use Quiver Dance, Fiery Dance, Bug Buzz, and Giga Drain for your moves. Giga Drain is huge because it allows you to beat Terrakion.

    After that, I like Dragonuser's suggestion for Zapdos. However, I think you should replace Breloom. Breloom doesn't serve a consequential role on your team in my eyes. Now that you have two sweepers, I think you should focus on a supporting crew to make sure they sweep. Zapdos is one of the premier Landorus counters, and since Landorus is Sun's #1 threat, I highly recommend it.

    Finally, use Head Smash on Donphan. It's a pretty cool niche move. You can use it to beat Spin Block Gengars. You can also switch into stuff like Dragonite and counter it.

    Good luck!
  8. Ghetsis


    Aug 5, 2012
    @undisputed Wow i like you suggestions very much. I will try them out. But what should Head Smash replace?
  9. GaryTheGengar

    GaryTheGengar I wanna get me a little oblivion, baby
    is a Tiering Contributor Alumnus

    Nov 13, 2011
    Hey man, got your request to rate this team. Looks pretty solid, but there are for sure some things you can do to improve it.

    Espeon lures in tyranitar, which can easily be trapped by dugtrio. Because of that reason, I'd suggest using dugtrio over your donphan. You don't need spin, as you only have one sr weak poke, that won't be needed after you've already won the weather war. I'd advise using sr / eq / stone edge / reversal @ focus sash on dugtrio. If you really want to win the weather war, you could change heatran's set to the one undisputed suggested. This lures in politoeds, and can eliminate them easily, winning you the weather war against two common weather archtypes. With the weather war so easily won, I'd recommend using a sun sweeper, such as trick room victini or volcorona over your breloom, as those pokes can really dominate when the weather is on their side.

    Good luck!

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