Talonflame

DragonWhale

It's not a misplay, it's RNG manipulation
is a Top Social Media Contributor Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Dedicated Tournament Host Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
upload_2015-3-25_16-40-27.png

[OVERVIEW]

Despite being a "starter bird" of the Kalos region, Talonflame is a popular competitive choice for having the strongest priority in the game in the form of Gale Wings and Brave Bird. Combine that with the highest Speed stat of all generation VI Pokemon, and you have a Pokemon capable of sweeping through weakened teams late-game. Although its other stats are very mediocre, Talonflame makes up for this with access to a lot of useful moves and great compatibility with numerous items.

One of Talonflame's greatest strengths is that it places a lot of restrictions on the opponent's options in Team Preview. A Flying-type check becomes mandatory, and Talonflame-weak Pokemon such as Blaziken and Lopunny are unable to move as freely because Talonflame is a great check to them. However, it's important to note that many people bring Stealth Rock support with Talonflame-weak sweepers, so don't expect an easy match just because the opponent's win condition is a Blaziken. Talonflame also does a lot of damage to itself thanks to recoil from its most common attacks and common Rocky Helmet users.


[SET]
name: Choice Band
move 1: Brave Bird
move 2: Flare Blitz
move 3: U-turn
move 4: Tailwind / Will-O-Wisp / Sleep Talk
item: Choice Band
ability: Gale Wings
nature: Adamant
evs: 44 HP / 244 Atk / 220 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========

Brave Bird takes full advantage of Gale Wings to hit the opponent with a STAB 120 Base Power priority move. It's also the best answer the game has for Blaziken. Flare Blitz is Talonflame's other STAB option if locking into Brave Bird is not optimal, and it hits Steel-types such as Ferrothorn and Scizor very hard. U-turn allows Talonflame to scout opponents and keep momentum in your favor.

The last slot is mainly filler, as you'll rarely use anything aside from the first three moves, but in certain situations, using Will-O-Wisp or Tailwind to support the next teammate is sometimes the best option. Sleep Talk is also a viable option that allows Talonflame to switch into an incoming Spore from Breloom.

Set Details
========

This set is designed to maximize Talonflame's offensive capabilities. Despite only having a measly base 81 Attack, great Attack investment with Choice Band gives it a lot of firepower and makes it easier to spam Brave Bird. Adamant is often preferred over Jolly because the boost in Attack is more important than Speed when Talonflame fires off priority moves anyway. 220 EVs in Speed let Talonflame outspeed maximum speed Liepard to beat Assist Spore. They also let Talonflame beat priority users such as Mega Kangaskhan and a lot of Talonflame variants that put more investment into HP. 44 HP EVs give Talonflame 159 HP to optimize passive damage and give it a slight boost in bulk. The rest of the EVs are put into Attack.

It's possible to sacrifice some Speed EVs for HP to increase longevity and handle recoil better, but keep in mind this can allow opposing Pokemon to outspeed Talonflame with priority. Key Pokemon to look out for are opposing Talonflames and Mega Kangaskhan (if you opt for less than 172 EVs in Speed). It will also limit Pokemon you will be able to use U-turn against.

Usage Tips
========

Ideally, this Talonflame's role is to sweep the opponent once all of their Pokemon are within KO range from Brave Bird. Until then, it can be used as a scout or pivot with U-turn, or heavily dent Pokemon that switch into Brave Bird or Flare Blitz. However, it's frail and takes a lot of recoil, so don't expect it to pull through teams it cannot take out alone. Choice Band Talonflame's matchups are usually either very good or very bad, so keep your opponent's team in mind when locking yourself into a move. Avoid bad matchups as much as possible, and make good use of U-turn predicting your opponent to switch out Talonflame-weak Pokemon and keep momentum on your side. Flare Blitz also 2HKOes non-Sitrus Berry Zapdos, which is commonly used to stop Talonflame, so if the opponent is afraid of Brave Bird and has Zapdos in their team, Flare Blitz is usually a pretty good option.

Another thing to keep in mind is that the opponent will know Talonflame is holding a Choice Band from the damage output and will plan accordingly. If you think it's in your favor to keep your Talonflame set ambiguous in a match, don't use U-turn. It rarely is the case, as many people will assume you're using a Choice Band anyway, but occasionally it makes it hard for opponents to bring in certain Pokemon when they don't know you're locked into Flare Blitz. It's also important to look out for Rocky Helmet users, as combined with move recoil it will hurt you a lot.

While not as common as in 6v6, Stealth Rock does have a decent presence in Battle Spot Singles, especially on Blaziken teams. There are also a few Pokemon that spam Roar or Whirlwind after setting up Stealth Rock, such as Hippowdon and Swampert, so don't bring Talonflame when facing a team with Hippowdon or a non-rain team Swampert. Entry hazard management is useful, but the difficulty is not really worth it. Defog users and Rapid Spin users are very limited in number, and using a turn to remove entry hazards is usually not the best option.

Team Options
========

Talonflame's ideal use is to sweep weakened teams late-game. Due to this simplicity, Talonflame works with Pokemon that deal severe damage to Pokemon that stops these sweeps. Garchomp resists a lot of Talonflame's weaknesses and clears the path very effectively with super effective Earthquakes against the three types that resist Flying, though it does struggle against Zapdos, Thundurus, Rotom-W, and Skarmory. Talonflame can also finish off teams weakened by offensive Pokemon such as Greninja, Mega Kangaskhan, and Mega Gengar.


[SET]
name: Bulky Rocky Helmet
move 1: Brave Bird
move 2: Will-O-Wisp
move 3: Roost
move 4: Taunt
item: Rocky Helmet
ability: Gale Wings
nature: Jolly
evs: 172 HP / 244 Def / 92 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========

Brave Bird is Talonflame's main STAB move, because you can't go wrong with a 120 Base Power STAB priority move. Will-O-Wisp completely stops physical attackers, and combined with priority Roost, a lot of opponents such as Mega Salamence and Mega Mawile will not be able to get past Talonflame. Taunt allows Talonflame to handle support Pokemon and slowly scrape off HP with burn damage while preventing bulky Pokemon from recovering HP.

Set Details
========

92 Speed EVs and Jolly nature allow Talonflame to outspeed Adamant Mega Salamence. Putting 252 EVs into Defense will give Talonflame 174 HP and will therefore go down after two switches with Stealth Rock up, so 8 EVs are shifted to HP. As a little bonus, 175 HP is optimal for handling passive damage. Rocky Helmet is for taking on opposing physical attackers. Even without any Attack investment, Brave Bird has the same damage output as a maximum Attack Scizor's Bullet Punch.

Usage Tips
========

Against tankier, stall Pokemon, Taunt allows Talonflame to get past a lot of them with relative ease. On top of that, priority Roost lets Talonflame stall out foes with burn damage. In essence, physical attackers that are unable to 2HKO Talonflame while burned will not be able to beat it. If used effectively enough, all of the opponent's Pokemon will eventually enter Brave Bird range. There is also the element of surprise in your favor, as most opponents will assume Talonflame to be a Choice Band set. This set is also very good against Pokemon that rely on Sucker Punch, such as Bisharp, Mega Mawile, and Mega Kangaskhan, as it allows Talonflame to get a free burn and cripple them.

That said, keep in mind Will-O-Wisp can miss and there are physical Pokemon that are capable of 2HKOing while burned, notably Rock-types, Rock Slide Mega Kangaskhan, and Belly Drum Azumarill. However, Rock-types deal half damage when Roosting, so don't forget to check the amount of damage the opponent does to Talonflame to avoid unnecessary accidents. This set doesn't fare too well against special attackers, so don't force yourself to stay in against them. This set is also setup fodder for Mega Sableye. Stealth Rock isn't as scary on this set if you can create opportunities to Roost back up.

Team Options
========

Garchomp is a great teammate that can switch into hits that Talonflame prefers not to take and effectively scrape off a lot of HP from the opponent. Tyranitar is also a nice teammate to have for special attackers, though keep in mind the sandstorm can sometimes affect the longevity of Talonflame. Talonflame also helps Tyranitar greatly by scaring away Fighting types and weakening physical attackers. Other specially defensive Pokemon such as Porygon2 and Cresselia make great teammates as well, especially if you plan on stalling out foes with burn damage.


[SET]
name: Flexible Attacker
move 1: Brave Bird
move 2: Flare Blitz
move 3: Swords Dance / U-turn
move 4: Will-O-Wisp / Roost / Tailwind / Taunt
item: Life Orb / Sharp Beak
ability: Gale Wings
nature: Adamant
evs: 44 HP / 252 Atk / 212 Spe

[SET COMMENTS]
Moves
========

Brave Bird is Talonflame's best move, hitting hard with STAB 120 Base Power. Flare Blitz takes advantage of Talonflame's other STAB type, allowing it to hit opposing Steel-types or other Pokemon that would otherwise survive a Brave Bird. Swords Dance allows Talonflame to sweep through a lot of teams, especially when everything is in range of a +2 Brave Bird. Roost is another option in this slot if you want to switch Talonflame a lot during a battle, giving it more opportunities to switch into Stealth Rock, as well as mitigate the tremendous amounts of recoil done by the attacking moves, Rocky Helmet, and Life Orb. Will-O-Wisp is a handy support option that Talonflame can use against incoming switch-ins, crippling them if they're physical attackers. U-turn allows Talonflame to switch out while damaging the opponent, potentially breaking Focus Sashes or giving you the upper hand when the opponent decides to switch. Tailwind can come in handy if you want to sacrifice Talonflame to allow your next Pokemon to come in with double Speed, which can be very helpful for Pokemon that are in a mediocre Speed tier, such as Mega Heracross and Sylveon. Taunt is also a useful option to prevent the opponent from setting up entry hazards or boosts. Although it does require a fair amount of prediction, it is very effective against Pokemon such as Skarmory and Cresselia.

Set Details
========

44 HP EVs gives Talonflame 159 HP, which is a Life Orb number and optimizes passive damage. Attack is maximized to increase damage output. 212 Speed EVs let Talonflame outspeed base 105 Speed Pokemon, allowing Talonflame to Flare Blitz Manectric before it Mega Evolves, which will OHKO after a Swords Dance if Talonflame is holding a Life Orb. An Adamant nature is preferred over Jolly as it gives a 10% boost to Attack, while Talonflame doesn't necessarily need the 10% boost in Speed thanks to Gale Wings. However, a Jolly nature with 228 Speed EVs will allow Talonflame to outspeed Water Shiriken Greninja that may potentially stop its sweep as well as outspeed and OHKO Thundurus with Flare Blitz after a Swords Dance boost.

Life Orb provides Talonflame with the powerful boost it can get without locking itself to a move, allowing Talonflame to choose moves flexibly based on the opponent in front of it. Sharp Beak is also an option for this slot if you don't want to deal with Life Orb recoil on top of the recoil from the two main attacking moves, but keep in mind it will not boost Flare Blitz and Brave Bird will be slightly less powerful.

Usage Tips
========

This Talonflame is best used when the path is clear for a sweep. One key difference between this set and the Choice Band set is that Talonflame won't be locked into a move, allowing it to switch between Brave Bird and Flare Blitz, Taunt opposing support Pokemon, recover HP with Roost, burn opposing Pokemon with Will-O-Wisp, or set up a Swords Dance. Due to this flexibility, this set is capable of going up against both offensive and defensive Pokemon and provide support for the other two members in your team. Even if the opponent has a Zapdos in their team, if you set up a Swords Dance on the switch Flare Blitz can OHKO with Life Orb.

However, due to Talonflame's lackluster defensive stats, it's usually unable to fully utilize its entire moveset before going down. Therefore, whenever Talonflame is sent out, keep in mind what is needed the most in the current situation in the battle and choose its moves accordingly.

Team Options
========

This Talonflame is very flexible, so it is able to fit into almost any team. It enjoys Garchomp, Aegislash, and Mega Lucario as a partner because they can switch into incoming Rock-type moves and dish out a lot of damage. Breloom is also a good partner, as Tailwind can double its Speed to allow it to Spore faster opponents, as well as Spore slow Rock-types and defensive Pokemon. Putting Pokemon to sleep also gives Talonflame a great opportunity to set up Swords Dance. Mega Gengar is a great partner to remove Pokemon such as Mega Slowbro and Cresselia, which prevent Talonflame from sweeping. If you're using Perish Trap Gengar with Wobbuffet, Wobbuffet can also give Talonflame an opportunity to set up Swords Dance by Encoring the opponent into a status or Ground-type move.


[STRATEGY COMMENTS]
Other Options
=============

Natural Gift allows Talonflame to deal significant damage to its usual counters as long as it's holding the appropriate Berry. At +2, Natural Gift OHKOes Rotom-W and Heatran with the Liechi and Salac Berries, respectively. However, it's a one-time trick, and Talonflame will not be holding any items afterwards to boost its offensive capability. You can use it in conjunction with Acrobatics if you want to take advantage of the item removal and don't like Brave Bird recoil, but keep in mind that it won't deal a lot of damage without a Swords Dance boost. Overheat is also a cool option that can be used with Life Orb to catch physical walls off guard, most notably Mega Aggron, Mega Steelix, and Avalugg, although all three of these Pokemon are hardly seen in Battle Spot Singles. Protect is useful to prevent extra damage from Fake Out from Pokemon such as Mega Medicham, Mega Lopunny, Mega Kangaskhan, and Mienshao, though you lose a valuable moveslot.


Checks and Counters
===================

**Stealth Rock**: The 4x Rock weakness severely limits Talonflame's mobility throughout the match. Combine it with any defensive Pokemon and you can effectively put Talonflame into a checkmate.

**Rock-types**: If a Choice Band Talonflame doesn't use U-turn upon Rock-types switching in, they can easily take a Brave Bird or Flare Blitz and proceed to set up Stealth Rock while scaring Talonflame away. Burns won't save the Rocky Helmet set from STAB Stone Edges from Pokemon like Tyranitar and Rhyperior.

**Defensive Pokemon**: Mega Slowbro, Cresselia, Porygon2, Hippowdon, Heatran, and bulky Gyarados will tank multiple Choice Band-boosted Brave Birds and either hit back hard or recover health. Against the Rocky Helmet set, Gyarados, Hippowdon, and Cresselia will have difficulty getting through, so watch out. Porygon2 and Mega Slowbro can get through with Discharge/Thunderbolt and Scald, respectively. Heatran wins if it gets off a Toxic before getting Taunted, but get ready for a long battle if it fails to do so.

**Electric-types**: Mega Manectric, Rotom-W, Rotom-H, and Zapdos can take multiple Choice Band-boosted Brave Birds and hit back extremely hard. Thundurus cannot tank two Choice Band-boosted Brave Birds, but it can check Talonflame effectively and even paralyze Talonflame with priority Thunder Wave. All of them except Rotom-A cannot take Flare Blitz too well, so don't send them in carelessly. All of them are special attackers, so burns aren't a problem.

**Bulky Offensive Pokemon**: Garchomp, Landorus-T, Mega Salamence, and Mega Kangaskhan can check Choice Band Talonflame and OHKO with any powerful attack. Against the Rocky Helmet set, Garchomp and Landorus-T can break through with Stone Edge, hold a Lum Berry, hold a Choice Scarf to beat Talonflame before getting burned, or set up Swords Dance. Mega Kangaskhan can beat Talonflame with Fake Out + burned Rock Slide or Facade, and Mega Salamence can set up Dragon Dance on the turn of Will-O-Wisp and muscle through with Double-Edge.

**Mega Sableye**: The Rocky Helmet set will not be able to beat Mega Sableye thanks to Magic Bounce preventing Taunt, and Mega Sableye will freely start setting up Calm Mind. Choice Band Talonflame can 2HKO Mega Sableye, so the only hope it has is to Recover stall until Talonflame faints from recoil damage.

**Aegislash**: Aegislash checks Talonflame thanks to King's Shield and Talonflame's main offensive options making contact. Special Aegislash don't mind getting burned either and can beat Talonflame with Shadow Ball.

**Recoil**: Recoil is an issue for Talonflame, as its main offensive options deal a third of the damage dealt on the opponent to itself. Combine that with Rocky Helmet, Iron Barbs, and Rough Skin, and Talonflame often knock themselves out.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Ares

Fool me...can't get fooled again
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus
Overview:
In the overview I would specifically say what roles Talonflame fills in battle spot. I'm sort of getting the vibe that it is a strong revenge killer with priority, but specifically coming out and saying that at the start of saying its great for checking Blaziken / other fighting types would be good. I would list a couple of more cons aside from Stealth Rock weakness and mediocre stats. You can also say that recoil and rocky helmet damage means that Talonflames survivability is limited.

CB:
I know that CB is the most common set, but I've always liked the fact that having an item like Sharp Beak means that I can switch up moves as well as run CB on another member of my team. I think that slashing Sharp Beak after Choice Band should be an option that QC considers, or at the very least mention it in set details. If you do mention it in Set Details after saying what sharp beak does also mention that using roost over uturn / 4th moveslot is ideal.

Moves:
Mention specific Pokemon that each move hits, example Brave Bird is good for stopping bunny and blaziken.

UT:
Your Usage Tips are good, to expand on them I would add in a line about when to predict with a Choice Band (like predict zapados / flying resist) and use Flare Blitz or when to use U-turn (like if you see X,Y,Z mons). I would also add in a line saying be wary of Rocky Helmet users as you pretty much neuter yourself with recoil damage.

TO:
Your team options need a lot more than just Garchomp, and some offensive Pokemon. Does it fit on any specific teams or does it compliment slower teams with priority? Add in like 2-3 more lines of suggested Pokemon to use Talonflame with.

Rocky Helmet:

Moves:
Mention what Will-O-Wisp hits.

UT:
Your usage tips are really good, just mention specific Pokemon that Talonflame stops.

Nice analysis! A lot of this was just adding on some minor things as well as a preference of my own. Your Usage Tips and C&C was really well done, which is usually where most people struggle.
 

DragonWhale

It's not a misplay, it's RNG manipulation
is a Top Social Media Contributor Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Dedicated Tournament Host Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
Thanks for the feedback! I was talking with Theorymon about the Choice Band set as well, and contemplating changing the name to 'offensive', and slashing in Life Orb and Sky Plate/Sharp Beak as an item as well. Or I might give it its own section since the flexibility allows for more support moves. I'll think about it. I'll add in more concrete examples later as well when I get some free time.
 

cant say

twitch.tv/jakecantsay
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Top Social Media Contributor Alumnusis a Senior Staff Member Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
Adding to what Mont said about Sharp Beak / Sky Plate, Life Orb is also really popular on sets that don't want to be locked into a move. Sure this means that Talonflame will be taking heaps of recoil, but that's what Roost is for, right?

Other than that, this is pretty good. Talonflame is pretty straight forward!

QC approved 1/3
 

Theorymon

Have a wonderful day, wahoo!
is a Site Content Manageris a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Smogon Discord Contributoris a Pokemon Researcheris a Top Contributoris a Top Smogon Media Contributoris a Social Media Contributor Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnusis a CAP Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
Moderator
Don't have too much to nitpick, Talonflame is a very simple mon, and other stuff has been covered by above posters!

Overview

I think another selling point to Talonflame is that compared to other revenge killers, its a bit versatile in a way. Not so much in amount of sets and attacks, but more about the differences between CB / LO and Bulky Talonflame. Very few revenge killers can have both a fast revenge killing set AND a bulky, semi defensive variant.

On Life Orb / Sky Plate

After thinking about the last time we talked about this on IRC, I'm leaning towards making this a seperate set despite it running similar stuff to Choice Band. The main difference in playstyle is that I feel like this Talonflame is much more effective at using its support move options than Choice Band, plus not being locked into Brave Bird can be a life saver vs teams that have Steel-types.

I'm thinking he set should be:


Free Attacker (tentative name)
########
name: Free Attacker
move 1: Brave Bird
move 2: Flare Blitz
move 3: U-Turn
move 4: Will-o-Wisp/Tailwind/Swords Dance
ability: Gale Wings
item: Life Orb / Sky Plate
evs: 44 HP / 244 Atk / 220 Spe (not sure about the evs, maybe there's better HP for LO recoil stuff?)
nature: Adamant

Will-O-Wisp is still nice against stuff like Garchomp and Mega Kangaskhan switch-ins, and Tailwind is good offensive support ofc. Swords Dance is the weird one though. Like we talked about on IRC, Swords Dance Talonflame tends to either be devastating or ineffective depending on the team match up. I think that alone justifies a slash in, since worst case, if you know you aren't gonna be able to Swords Dance, then you still can Brave Bird stuff. Also, maybe give a small mention of being able to use Jolly with 228 Speed EVs and Swords Dance to avoid Greninja Water Shrunken shenigans, and it allowing Talonflame to outspeed and smash Thundurus with boosted Flare Blitz.

Of course, note that with Life Orb, Talonflame tends to get worn down REALLY fast with all the recoil it has to face. However, with Life Orb, Flare Blitz still has decent power. Sharp Beak means a rather weak Flare Blitz, but in exchange Talonflame lasts longer (especially useful if you're using Swords Dance).

I think we talked about Overheat: you can put that in other options or set comments if you want. It's cool for avoiding recoil against stuff like ferrothorn and avoding Kings Shield vs weakened Aegislash, but otherwise its really weak...

Otherwise... only other thing I can think of to nitpick on this analysis is to split some of the Pokemon in the "Other Pokemon" section of checks/counters into their own sections. For example, Aegislash probably deserves it for giving CB problems when its locked into Brave Bird, and the bulky set not liking it much either. Maybe a seperate Rocky Helmet section since Talonflame suffers from a lot of recoil in general.
 
Last edited:

Ares

Fool me...can't get fooled again
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus
Roost should be the main slash over uturn imo, as it allows you to come in and check things multiple times or live a weak hit.
 

Theorymon

Have a wonderful day, wahoo!
is a Site Content Manageris a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Smogon Discord Contributoris a Pokemon Researcheris a Top Contributoris a Top Smogon Media Contributoris a Social Media Contributor Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnusis a CAP Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
Moderator
Roost should be the main slash over uturn imo, as it allows you to come in and check things multiple times or live a weak hit.
Do you mean for the unchoiced set? Oh yeah, I TOTALLY forgot about Roost rofl. It can also be nice since it nets you an offensive Talonflame that can sorta have a back up plan against Stealth Rock, unlike CB which is totally screwed.

That being said I'd also mention that Roost can be used in the 4th slot too if you don't care about Talonflame's support options much. U-turn is still pretty valuable early game. I don't really have an opinion on whether the third slot should have Roost or slashed first though, I think both are fine. Maybe Roost might make a bit more sense because its another selling point over Choice Band Talonflame.
 
Hey there! On the first slot, I believe Tailwind should be slashed in the first slot. Will-O-Wisp is nice, but let's be real; you're only going to use the first three slots and save the fourth slot as a last-ditch situation. Tailwind is better in this regard as a sort-of "panic button" because of its priority. In the situation you're facing a Choice Scarf Pokemon, or you've just sacked Talonflame against something for a teammate, I feel that Tailwind has been better. It gives a Pokemon a second chance, and if the teammate is weakened, then Will-O-Wisp still will not save them. Will-O-Wisp is great, but I feel Tailwind slightly edges it out in the role of last-ditch effors by Talonflame.
 

Jibaku

Who let marco in here????
is a Top Team Rater Alumnusis a Senior Staff Member Alumnusis a Smogon Discord Contributor Alumnusis a CAP Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Top Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnusis a Two-Time Past SPL Champion
QC 2/3

Swords Dance + LO + Flare Blitz can OHKO Zapdos.

Swords Dance + Natural Gift + Liechi Berry can OHKO Rotom-W and make Rock types think twice before switching in. Likewise, Salac Berry can threaten Heatran and Tyranitar. Gimmick set at best, but can really catch people off guard.
 

Theorymon

Have a wonderful day, wahoo!
is a Site Content Manageris a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Smogon Discord Contributoris a Pokemon Researcheris a Top Contributoris a Top Smogon Media Contributoris a Social Media Contributor Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnusis a CAP Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
Moderator
DragonWhale: Just tell me when you implement the suggestions, and then I'll give this a final QC check so it can be grammar checked! =)
 

Ares

Fool me...can't get fooled again
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus
I think no item acrobatics is good enough for oo, it lets you run another item for other members of your team as well as giving you a priority move that is only 10bp less with no recoil. Can be useful in certain situations when you don't want to die from recoil.
 

DragonWhale

It's not a misplay, it's RNG manipulation
is a Top Social Media Contributor Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Dedicated Tournament Host Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
Acrobatics is sometimes used in conjunction with the Natural Gift set, albeit rare, since that 10BP influences certain kills (which I can't really remember off the top of my head). It's why Talonflames still ran Brave Bird in the 'no items' special season.

But yeah, I'll work on implementing the changes you guys suggested after finishing my Salamence analysis, so hold off on that last QC until then. Apologies to those waiting for QCs btw, but it's been a busy week >.<
 

Ares

Fool me...can't get fooled again
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus
Oh, just realized, put quick guard in oo. Its cool to have if you're last mon talonflame against last mon kanga or another relevant Fake Out mon. You can quick guard and block the KO from Fake Out and then KO the weakened kanga with prio bb.
 

Ares

Fool me...can't get fooled again
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus
If the sole purpose is to block Fake Out, wouldn't Protect be the better option? o.o
True, lol. I was meshing my metas together, Quick Guard is p good in triples which is where I was getting the idea from. So I guess you could stick protect in oo if you want to.

Edit @ below: I was gonna say that but it seemed way to niche a reason to put it in oo xD
 
Last edited:

Theorymon

Have a wonderful day, wahoo!
is a Site Content Manageris a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Smogon Discord Contributoris a Pokemon Researcheris a Top Contributoris a Top Smogon Media Contributoris a Social Media Contributor Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnusis a CAP Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
Moderator
Heh actually, Quick Guard does have one thing over Protect: Quick Guard can be used in succession. So lets say you face a last mon CB Talonflame, and you haven't used Quick Guard. Since Quick Guard and Brave Bird have the same PP... you could actually stall an opposing Talonflame to death 0_0

Now I mean that's quite possibility even more niche than Protect, but I've always chuckled at the idea of this situation lol.
 

Theorymon

Have a wonderful day, wahoo!
is a Site Content Manageris a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Smogon Discord Contributoris a Pokemon Researcheris a Top Contributoris a Top Smogon Media Contributoris a Social Media Contributor Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnusis a CAP Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
Moderator
Ok I can only really think of a few things to add to the flexiable attacker.

1. While you mention Jolly in other options, I'd give it a short mention here. The idea is that you use a Jolly nature on Swords Dance Talonflame so you can outspeed Thundurus and Greninja. Flare Blitz will OHKO Thundurus afer a boost, while the extra speed means that Greninja won't stop your sweep with Water Shuriken.

2. This may sound a bit strange, but maybe give a mention to Wobbuffet as a teammate. I gave Swords Dance Talonflame a shot while messing around with a Wobbuffet + Mega Gengar team (I'm still tinkering with that team heh), and Encoring stuff like Earthquake and set up moves gave Talonflame the perfect chance to set! And of course, Mega Gengar itself is pretty useful too, trapping some very annoying defensvie Pokemon like Slowbro.

3. I'd split up the "other Pokemon" section a bit in counters. For example, I'd give "recoil" its own mention since Rocky Helmet and Rough Skin are big problems for Talonflame.

Otherwise... you covered what needed to be covered for Talonflame, a simple but deadly bird. I'll give you a QC Approved 3/3 since I trust you'll add the stuff when you get the chance :P
 

GatoDelFuego

The Antimonymph of the Internet
is a Site Content Manager Alumnusis a Social Media Contributor Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnusis a Smogon Discord Contributor Alumnusis a Top Contributor Alumnusis a Top Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus
DragonWhale

REMOVE CHANGE COMMENTS

Overview
########

Despite being a "starter bird" of the Kalos region, Talonflame is a popular competitive choice for having the strongest priority in the game in the form of Gale Wings + Brave Bird. Combine that with the fastest Speed stat of all generation VI 6 Pokemon and you have a Pokemon capable of sweeping through weakened teams late-game. Although its other stats are very mediocre, it Talonflame makes up for this it with access to a lot of useful moves and great compatibility with numerous items.

One of Talonflame's All your apostrophes are like this; curled. If you write in MS word, all apostrophes are curled. Smogon needs straight apostrophes. Redew has a guide you can check out on how to change them all, so I won't mark the rest of them greatest strengths is that it places a lot of restrictions on the opponent’s options in team preview. A Bird spam check becomes mandatory, and Talonflame-weak Pokemon like such as Blaziken and Lopunny are unable to move as freely, (RC) since because Talonflame is a great check to them. However, it’s important to note that many people bring Stealth Rock support with Talonflame-weak sweepers, so don’t expect an easy match just because the opponent’s win condition is a Blaziken. Talonflame also does a lot of damage to itself thanks to recoil in its most common attacks and the common Rocky Helmet users.



Choice Band
########
name: Choice Band
move 1: Brave Bird
move 2: Flare Blitz
move 3: U-turn
move 4: Tailwind / Will-O-Wisp / Sleep Talk
ability: Gale Wings
item: Choice Band
evs: 44 HP / 244 Atk / 220 Spe
nature: Adamant

Moves
========

Brave Bird is the main move of this set, which takes full advantage of Gale Wings to fire off hit the opponent with a STAB 120 Base Power priority moves at the opponent. It's also the best answer the game has for Blaziken. Flare Blitz is Talonflame’s other STAB option if locking into Brave Bird is not optimal, and it hits Steel-types like such as Ferrothorn and Scizor very hard. U-turn allows Talonflame to scout out opponents and keep momentum in your favor.

The last slot is mainly filler, since as you’ll rarely use anything aside from the first three moves, but in certain situations, using Will-O-Wisp or Tailwind to support the next teammate is sometimes the best option. Sleep Talk is also a viable option that allows Talonflame to switch into an incoming Spore from Breloom.

Set Details
========

This set is designed to maximize Talonflame’s offensive capabilities. Despite only having a measly base 81 base Attack stat, great Attack investment with Choice Band gives it a lot of firepower and makes it easier to spam Brave Bird. Adamant is often preferred over Jolly because the boost in Attack is more important than Speed when Talonflame fires off priority moves anyway. 220 EVs in Speed let Talonflame outspeeds max Speed Liepard to beat Assist Spore. It They also let Talonflame beats priority users such as from Mega Kangaskhan and outspeeds a lot of Talonflame variants that put more investment into HP. Adamant nature is preferred over Jolly because the boost in damage is more important than speed when Talonflame usually fires off priority anyway. 44 HP EVs gives Talonflame 159 HP to optimize passive damage (16n-1) and give it a slight boost in bulk. The rest of the EVs are put into Attack.

It’s possible to sacrifice some Speed EVs for HP to increase longevity and handle recoil better, but keep in mind it this can allow opposing Pokemon to outspeed you Talonflame with priority. Key Pokemon to look out for are opposing Talonflames and Mega Kangaskhan (if you run use less than 172 EVs in speed). It will also limit Pokemon you will be able to use U-turn against.

Usage Tips
========

Ideally, this Talonflame’s role is to sweep the opponent once all of their Pokemon are within KO range from a Brave Bird. Until then, it can be used as a scout and/or pivot with U-turn, or heavily dent Pokemon that switch into Brave Bird or Flare Blitz a banded 120BP move. However, it’s frail and takes a lot of recoil, so don’t expect it to pull through teams it cannot take out alone. Banded Choice Band Talonflame’s matchups are usually either very good or very bad, so keep your opponent’s team in mind when locking yourself into a move. Avoid bad matchups as much as possible, and make good use of U-turn predicting your opponent to switch out Talonflame-weak Pokemon and keep momentum on your side. Flare Blitz also 2HKOes non-Sitrus Berry Zapdos, which is commonly used to stop Talonflame, so if the opponent is afraid of Brave Bird and has Zapdos in their team, Flare Blitz is usually a pretty good option.

Another thing to keep in mind is that the opponent WILL know you’re banded from looking at your damage output and will plan accordingly. If you think it’s in your favor to keep your Talonflame set ambiguous in a match, don’t use U-turn. It rarely is the case, as many people will assume you’re using a Choice Band banded anyway, but occasionally it makes it hard for opponents to bring in certain Pokemon when they don’t know you’re locked into Flare Blitz. It's also important to look out for Rocky Helmet users, as combined with move recoil it will hurt you a lot.

While not as common as in 6v6, Stealth Rocks does have a decent presence in Battle Spot Singles, especially on Blaziken teams. There are also a few Pokemon that spam Roar/Whirlwind after setting up rocks like Stealth Rock such as Hippowdon and Swampert, so don’t bring Talonflame when facing a team with Hippowdon or a non-rain team Swampert. Entry hazard management is useful, but its the difficulty is not really worth it. Defog users and Rapid Spin users Either 'spinners' or 'Rapid Spin users', but not both are very limited in number, and using a turn for them to remove entry hazards is usually not the best option.

Team Options
========

As mentioned above, Talonflame’s ideal use is to sweep weakened teams late-game. Due to this simplicity, Talonflame works with Pokemon that deal severe damage to Pokemon that stops these sweeps. Garchomp resists a lot of Talonflame’s weaknesses and clears the path very effectively with super effective Earthquakes against the three types that resist Flying, though it does struggle against Zapdos, Thundurus, Rotom-W, (AC) and Skarmory. Talonflame can also finish off teams weakened by offensive Pokemon like such as Greninja, Mega Kangaskhan, or Mega Gengar.


Bulky Rocky Helmet
########
name: Bulky Rocky Helmet
move 1: Brave Bird
move 2: Will-O-Wisp
move 3: Roost
move 4: Taunt
ability: Gale Wings
item: Rocky Helmet
evs: HP 172 / 244 Def / 92 Spe
nature: Jolly

Moves
========

Brave Bird is Talonflame's main STAB move, obvious, because you can’t go wrong with a 120 Base Power STAB priority move. Will-O-Wisp completely stops physical attackers, and combined with priority Roost a lot of opponents such as Mega Salamence and Mega Mawile will not be able to get past Talonflame. Taunt allows Talonflame to handle support Pokemon and slowly scrape off HP with the burn damage while preventing them bulky Pokemon from recovering HP.

Set Details
========

92 Speed EVs and Jolly nature is allow Talonflame to outspeed Adamant Mega Salamence. Putting 252 EVs into Defense will give Talonflame 174 HP and will therefore go down after two switches with Stealth Rock up to two Stealth Rocks, so 8 EVs are shifted to HP. As a little bonus, 175 HP is optimal for handling passive damage (16n-1). Rocky Helmet is the centerpiece of this set, since this Talonflame is designed to for taking on opposing physical attackers. Even without any Attack investment, Brave Bird has the same damage output as a max Attack Scizor's Bullet Punch.

Usage Tips
========

In a metagame with a lot of prominent physical attackers, Rocky Helmet Talonflame has a lot of opportunities to shine. Even Against tankier, stall Pokemon, Taunt allows Talonflame to get past a lot of them with relative ease. On top of that, priority Roost lets it Talonflame stall out burn damage. In essence, physical attackers that are unable to 2HKO Talonflame while burned will not be able to beat it. If used effectively enough, all of the opponent’s Pokemon will eventually enter Brave Bird range. There is also the element of surprise in your favor, since as most opponents will assume you Talonflame to be a Choice Banded set. It's This set is also very good against Pokemon that rely on Sucker Punch, like such as Bisharp, Mega Mawile, and Mega Kangaskhan, as it allows Talonflame to get a free burn and cripple them.

That said, keep in mind Will-O-Wisp can miss and there are physical Pokemon that are capable of 2HKOing while burned, notably Rock-types, Rock Slide Mega Kangaskhan, and Belly Drum Azumarill. However, Rock-types deal half damage when Roosting, so don’t forget to check the amount of damage the opponent does to you to avoid unnecessary accidents. It This set doesn’t fare too well against special attackers either, so don’t force yourself to stay in against them. It's This set is also setup fodder for Mega Sableye. Stealth Rocks aren’t isn't as scary on this set if you can create opportunities to Roost back up.

Team Options
========

Once again, Garchomp is a great teammate that can switch into hits that Talonflame prefers not to take and effectively scrape off a lot of HP from the opponent. Tyranitar is also a nice teammate to have against special attackers, though keep in mind the sandstorm can sometimes affect the longevity of Talonflame. Talonflame also helps Tyranitar greatly by scaring away Fighting-types and weakening physical attackers. Other specially defensive Pokemon like such as Porygon2 and Cresselia make great teammates as well, especially if you plan on stalling out burn damage.

Flexible Attacker
########
name:Flexible Attacker
move 1:Brave Bird
move 2:Flare Blitz
move 3:Swords Dance / U-turn
move 4:Will-O-Wisp / Roost / Tailwind / Taunt
ability: Gale Wings
item: Life Orb/Sharp Beak
evs: 44 HP / 252 Atk / 212 Spe
nature: Adamant

Moves
========

Brave Bird is Talonflame's best move, allowing it to dish out priority STAB hitting hard with 120 Base Power damage. Flare Blitz takes advantage of Talonflame's other STAB type, allowing it to hit opposing Steel-types or other Pokemon that would otherwise survive a Brave Bird. Swords Dance allows Talonflame to sweep through a lot of teams Pokemon, especially when everything is in range of a +2 Brave Bird. Roost is another option in this slot if you want to switch Talonflame a lot during a battle, giving it more opportunities to switch into Stealth Rocks, as well as mitigate the tremendous amounts of recoil done by the attacking moves, Rocky Helmet, and Life Orb. Will-O-Wisp is a handy support option that Talonflame can use against incoming switch-ins, crippling them if they're physical attackers. U-turn allows Talonflame to switch out while damaging the opponent, potentially breaking Focus Sashes or giving you the upper hand when the opponent decides to switch. Tailwind can come in handy if you want to sacrifice Talonflame to allow your next Pokemon to come in with double Speed, which can be very helpful for Pokemon that are in a mediocreS peed tier, like Mega Heracross and Sylveon. Taunt is also an useful option to prevent the opponent from setting up entry hazards or boosts. Although it does require a fair amount of prediction, it is very effective against Pokemon like such as Skarmory and Cresselia.

Set Details
========

44 HP EVs gives Talonflame 159 HP, which is a Life Orb number (10n-1) and optimizes passive damage (16n-1). Attack is maximized to increase damage output. 212 Speed EVs let Talonflame outspeed base 105 Speed Pokemon, allowing Talonflame to Flare Blitz Manectric before it Mega Evolves, which will OHKO after a Swords Dance if Talonflame is holding a Life Orb. An Adamant nature is preferred over Jolly as it gives a 10% boost to Attack, while Talonflame doesn't necessarily need the 10% boost in Speed thanks to Gale Wings. However, a Jolly nature with 228 Speed EVs will allow you Talonflame to outspeed Water Shiriken Greninjas that may might potentially stop your its sweep as well as outspeed and OHKO Thundurus with Flare Blitz after a Swords Dance boost.

Life Orb is the most powerful boost Talonflame can get without locking itself to a move, allowing Talonflame to choose moves flexibly based on the opponent in front of it. Sharp Beak/Sky Plate is also an option for this slot if you don't want to deal with Life Orb recoil on top of the recoil from the two main attacking moves, but keep in mind it will not boost Flare Blitz and Brave Bird will be slightly less powerful.

Usage Tips
========

This Talonflame is similar to the Choice Band set in that it's best used when the path is clear for a sweep. One key difference between this set and the Choice Band set is that you Talonflame won't be locked into a move, allowing you it to switch between Brave Bird and Flare Blitz, Taunt opposing support Pokemon, recover HP with Roost, burn opposing Pokemon with Will-O-Wisp, or set up a Swords Dance. Due to this flexibility, this set is capable of going up against both offensive and defensive Pokemon and provide support for the other two members in your team. Even if the opponent has a Zapdos in their team, if you set up a Swords Dance on the switch Flare Blitz can OHKO with Life Orb.

However, due to Talonflame's lackluster defensive stats, it's usually unable to fully utilize its entire moveset before going down. Therefore, whenever Talonflame is sent out, keep in mind what is needed the most in the current situation in the battle and choose your moves accordingly.

Team Options
========

This Talonflame is very flexible so it is able to fit into almost any team. It enjoys Garchomp, Aegislash, and Mega Lucario as a partner because it can switch into incoming Rock-type moves and dish out a lot of damage. Breloom is also a good partner, as Tailwind can double its Speed to allow it to Spore faster opponents, as well as Spore slow Rock-types and defensive Pokemon. Sleeping Pokemon also gives Talonflame a great opportunity to set up Swords Dance. Mega Gengar is a great partner to have to remove Pokemon like such as Mega Slowbro and Cresselia which that prevent Talonflame from sweeping. If you're using Perish Trap Gengar with Wobbuffet, Wobbuffet can also potentially give Talonflame an opportunity to set up Swords Dance by Encoring the opponent into a status or Ground-type move.

Other Options
########

Natural Gift allows Talonflame to deal significant damage to its usual counters, (RC) as long as it's holding the appropriate Berry. At +2, it Natural Gift OHKOes Rotom-W and Heatran with the Liechi and Salac berries respectively. with However, it's only a one-time trick, and Talonflame will not be holding any items afterwards to boost its offensive capability. You can use it in conjunction with Acrobatics if you want to take advantage of the item removal and don't like Brave Bird recoil, but keep in mind that it won't deal a lot of damage without a Swords Dance boost. Overheat is also a cool option that can be used with Life Orb to catch physical walls off-guard, most notably Mega Aggron, Mega Steelix, and Avalugg, although all three of these Pokemon are hardly seen on in Battle Spot Singles. Protect is useful to prevent extra damage from Fake Out from Pokemon like such as Mega Medicham, Mega Lopunny, Mega Kangaskhan, or Mienshao, though you lose a valuable moveslot.

Checks & Counters
########

**Stealth Rocks**: The 4x Rock weakness severely limits Talonflame’s mobility throughout the match. Combine it with any of the defensive Pokemon below and you can effectively put Talonflame into a checkmate.

**Rock-types**: If a Choice Banded Talonflame doesn’t U-turn upon Rock-types switching in, they can easily take a Brave Bird or Flare Blitz and proceed to set up Stealth Rocks while scaring Talonflame away. Burns won't save the Rocky Helmet set from STAB Stone Edges from Pokemon like Tyranitar and Rhyperior.

**Defensive Pokemon**: Mega Slowbro, Cresselia, Porygon2, Hippowdon, Heatran, and bulky Gyarados will tank multiple Choice Band-boosted Brave Birds and either hit back hard or recover health. Against the Rocky Helmet set, Gyarados, Hippowdon, and Cresselia will have difficulty getting through, so watch out. Porygon2 and Mega Slowbro can get through with Discharge/Thunderbolt and Scald respectively. Heatran wins if it gets off a Toxic before getting Taunted, but get ready for a long battle if it fails to do so.

**Electric-types**: Mega Manectric, Rotom-W/-H, and Zapdos can take multiple Choice Band-boosted Brave Birds and hit back extremely hard. Thundurus cannot tank two Choice Band-boosted Brave Birds, but it can check Talonflame effectively and even paralyze it Talonflame with priority Thunder Wave. All of them except the Rotom-A cannot take Banded Flare Blitz too well, so don't send them in carelessly. All of them are special attackers, (AC) so burns aren't a problem.

**Bulky Offensive Pokemon**: Garchomp, Landorus-T, Mega Salamence, (AC) and Mega Kangaskhan can check Choice Banded Talonflame and OHKO with any powerful attack. Against the Rocky Helmet set, Garchomp and Landorus-T can break through with Stone Edge, hold a Lum Berry, hold a Choice Scarf to beat it Talonflame before getting burned, or set up Swords Dance. Mega Kangaskhan can beat it Talonflame with Fake Out + burned Rock Slide or Facade, and Mega Salamence can set up Dragon Dance on the turn of Will-O-Wisp and muscle through with Double-Edge.

**Mega Sableye**: The Rocky Helmet set will not be able to beat Mega Sableye thanks to Magic Bounce preventing Taunt, and Mega Sableye will freely start setting up Calm Mind. Choice Banded Talonflame can 2HKO Mega Sableye, so the only hope it has against it is to Recover stall until Talonflame faints from recoil damage.

**Aegislash**: Aegislash checks Talonflame thanks to King's Shield and Talonflame's main offensive options making contact. Special Aegislash don't mind getting burned either and can beat Talonflame with Shadow Ball.

**Recoil**: Recoil is an issue for Talonflame as its main offensive options deal a third of the damage dealt on the opponent to itself. Combine that with Rocky Helmet, Iron Barbs, and Rough Skin, and Talonflames often knock themselves out.

1/2
 
Last edited:

Lumari

empty spaces
is a Site Content Manageris a Top Social Media Contributoris a Member of Senior Staffis a Community Contributoris a Top Contributoris a Top Smogon Media Contributoris an Administrator Alumnus
TFP Leader
remove
add (Capitalize)

(comments); (AC=add comma; RC=remove comma; SC=semicolon)
Overview
########

Despite being a "starter bird" of the Kalos region, Talonflame is a popular competitive choice for having the strongest priority in the game in the form of Gale Wings + Brave Bird. Combine that with the fastest highest (a numerical value can't be fast) Speed stat of all generation IV VI Pokemon, (AC) and you have a Pokemon capable of sweeping through weakened teams late-game. Although its other stats are very mediocre, Talonflame makes up for this with access to a lot of useful moves and great compatibility with numerous items.

One of Talonflame's greatest strengths is that it places a lot of restrictions on the opponent's options in Team Preview. A bird spam Flying-type ('bird spam' is too colloquial) check becomes mandatory, and Talonflame-weak Pokemon such as Blaziken and Lopunny are unable to move as freely because Talonflame is a great check to them. However, it's important to note that many people bring Stealth Rock support with Talonflame-weak sweepers, so don't expect an easy match just because the opponent's win condition is a Blaziken. Talonflame also does a lot of damage to itself thanks to recoil in from its most common attacks and common Rocky Helmet users.


Choice Band
########
name: Choice Band
move 1: Brave Bird
move 2: Flare Blitz
move 3: U-turn
move 4: Tailwind / Will-O-Wisp / Sleep Talk
ability: Gale Wings
item: Choice Band
evs: 44 HP / 244 Atk / 220 Spe
nature: Adamant

Moves
========

Brave Bird takes full advantage of Gale Wings hit the opponent with a STAB 120 Base Power priority move. It's also the best answer the game has for Blaziken. Flare Blitz is Talonflame's other STAB option if locking into Brave Bird is not optimal, and it hits Steel-types such as Ferrothorn and Scizor very hard. U-turn allows Talonflame to scout opponents and keep momentum in your favor.

The last slot is mainly filler, as you'll rarely use anything aside from the first three moves, but in certain situations, using Will-O-Wisp or Tailwind to support the next teammate is sometimes the best option. Sleep Talk is also a viable option that allows Talonflame to switch into an incoming Spore from Breloom.

Set Details
========

This set is designed to maximize Talonflame's offensive capabilities. Despite only having a measly base 81 Attack, great Attack investment with Choice Band gives it a lot of firepower and makes it easier to spam Brave Bird. Adamant is often preferred over Jolly because the boost in Attack is more important than Speed when Talonflame fires off priority moves anyway. 220 EVs in Speed let Talonflame outspeed max-speed maximum Speed Liepard to beat Assist Spore. They also let Talonflame beat priority users such as Mega Kangaskhan and a lot of Talonflame variants that put more investment into HP. 44 HP EVs give Talonflame 159 HP to optimize passive damage (16n-1) (interesting but a bit out of place here) and give it a slight boost in bulk. The rest of the EVs are put into Attack.

It's possible to sacrifice some Speed EVs for HP to increase longevity and handle recoil better, but keep in mind this can allow opposing Pokemon to outspeed Talonflame with priority. Key Pokemon to look out for are opposing Talonflames and Mega Kangaskhan (if you use opt for ('you' don't use those EVs, Talonflame does, but that would also sound a bit awkward so this is better imo) less than 172 EVs in Speed). It will also limit Pokemon you will be able to use U-turn against.

Usage Tips
========

Ideally, this Talonflame's role is to sweep the opponent once all of their Pokemon are within KO range from Brave Bird. Until then, it can be used as a scout and/or pivot with U-turn, or heavily dent Pokemon that switch into Brave Bird or Flare Blitz. However, it's frail and takes a lot of recoil, so don't expect it to pull through teams it cannot take out alone. Choice Band Talonflame's matchups are usually either very good or very bad, so keep your opponent's team in mind when locking yourself into a move. Avoid bad matchups as much as possible, and make good use of U-turn predicting your opponent to switch out Talonflame-weak Pokemon and keep momentum on your side. Flare Blitz also 2HKOes non-Sitrus Berry Zapdos, which is commonly used to stop Talonflame, so if the opponent is afraid of Brave Bird and has Zapdos in their team, Flare Blitz is usually a pretty good option.

Another thing to keep in mind is that the opponent will know Talonflame is holding a Choice Band from the damage output and will plan accordingly. If you think it's in your favor to keep your Talonflame set ambiguous in a match, don't use U-turn. It rarely is the case, as many people will assume you're using a Choice Band anyway, but occasionally it makes it hard for opponents to bring in certain Pokemon when they don't know you're locked into Flare Blitz. It's also important to look out for Rocky Helmet users, as combined with move recoil it will hurt you a lot.

While not as common as in 6v6, Stealth Rock does have a decent presence in Battle Spot Singles, especially on Blaziken teams. There are also a few Pokemon that spam Roar/ or Whirlwind after setting up Stealth Rock, (AC) such as Hippowdon and Swampert, so don't bring Talonflame when facing a team with Hippowdon or a non-rain team Swampert. Entry hazard management is useful, but the difficulty is not really worth it. Defog users and Rapid Spin users are very limited in number, and using a turn to remove entry hazards is usually not the best option.

Team Options
========

Talonflame's ideal use is to sweep weakened teams late-game. Due to this simplicity, Talonflame works with Pokemon that deal severe damage to Pokemon that stops these sweeps. Garchomp resists a lot of Talonflame's weaknesses and clears the path very effectively with super effective Earthquakes against the three types that resist Flying, though it does struggle against Zapdos, Thundurus, Rotom-W, and Skarmory. Talonflame can also finish off teams weakened by offensive Pokemon such as Greninja, Mega Kangaskhan, or and Mega Gengar.


Bulky Rocky Helmet
########
name: Bulky Rocky Helmet
move 1: Brave Bird
move 2: Will-O-Wisp
move 3: Roost
move 4: Taunt
ability: Gale Wings
item: Rocky Helmet
evs: HP 172 HP / 244 Def / 92 Spe
nature: Jolly

Moves
========

Brave Bird is Talonflame's main STAB move, because you can't go wrong with a 120 Base Power STAB priority move. Will-O-Wisp completely stops physical attackers, and combined with priority Roost, (AC) a lot of opponents such as Mega Salamence and Mega Mawile will not be able to get past Talonflame. Taunt allows Talonflame to handle support Pokemon and slowly scrape off HP with burn damage while preventing bulky Pokemon from recovering HP.

Set Details
========

92 Speed EVs and Jolly nature allow Talonflame to outspeed Adamant Mega Salamence. Putting 252 EVs into Defense will give Talonflame 174 HP and will therefore go down after two switches with Stealth Rock up, so 8 EVs are shifted to HP. As a little bonus, 175 HP is optimal for handling passive damage (16n-1). Rocky Helmet is for taking on opposing physical attackers. Even without any Attack investment, Brave Bird has the same damage output as a maximum Attack Scizor's Bullet Punch.

Usage Tips
========

Against tankier, stall Pokemon, Taunt allows Talonflame to get past a lot of them with relative ease. On top of that, priority Roost lets Talonflame stall out foes with burn damage. In essence, physical attackers that are unable to 2HKO Talonflame while burned will not be able to beat it. If used effectively enough, all of the opponent's Pokemon will eventually enter Brave Bird range. There is also the element of surprise in your favor, as most opponents will assume Talonflame to be a Choice Band set. This set is also very good against Pokemon that rely on Sucker Punch, such as Bisharp, Mega Mawile, and Mega Kangaskhan, as it allows Talonflame to get a free burn and cripple them.

That said, keep in mind Will-O-Wisp can miss and there are physical Pokemon that are capable of 2HKOing while burned, notably Rock-types, Rock Slide Mega Kangaskhan, and Belly Drum Azumarill. However, Rock-types deal half damage when Roosting, so don't forget to check the amount of damage the opponent does to you Talonflame to avoid unnecessary accidents. This set doesn't fare too well against special attackers, so don't force yourself to stay in against them. This set is also setup fodder for Mega Sableye. Stealth Rock isn't as scary on this set if you can create opportunities to Roost back up.

Team Options
========

Garchomp is a great teammate that can switch into hits that Talonflame prefers not to take and effectively scrape off a lot of HP from the opponent. Tyranitar is also a nice teammate to have for special attackers, though keep in mind the sandstorm can sometimes affect the longevity of Talonflame. Talonflame also helps Tyranitar greatly by scaring away Fighting types and weakening physical attackers. Other specially defensive Pokemon such as Porygon2 and Cresselia make great teammates as well, especially if you plan on stalling out foes with burn damage.


Flexible Attacker
########
name:Flexible Attacker
move 1:Brave Bird
move 2:Flare Blitz
move 3:Swords Dance / U-turn
move 4:Will-O-Wisp / Roost / Tailwind / Taunt
ability: Gale Wings
item: Life Orb / Sharp Beak
evs: 44 HP / 252 Atk / 212 Spe
nature: Adamant

Moves
========

Brave Bird is Talonflame's best move, hitting hard with STAB 120 Base Power. Flare Blitz takes advantage of Talonflame's other STAB type, allowing it to hit opposing Steel-types or other Pokemon that would otherwise survive a Brave Bird. Swords Dance allows Talonflame to sweep through a lot of teams, especially when everything is in range of a +2 Brave Bird. Roost is another option in this slot if you want to switch Talonflame a lot during a battle, giving it more opportunities to switch into Stealth Rock, as well as mitigate the tremendous amounts of recoil done by the attacking moves, Rocky Helmet, and Life Orb. Will-O-Wisp is a handy support option that Talonflame can use against incoming switch-ins, crippling them if they're physical attackers. U-turn allows Talonflame to switch out while damaging the opponent, potentially breaking Focus Sashes or giving you the upper hand when the opponent decides to switch. Tailwind can come in handy if you want to sacrifice Talonflame to allow your next Pokemon to come in with double Speed, which can be very helpful for Pokemon that are in a mediocre Speed tier, like such as Mega Heracross and Sylveon. Taunt is also an a useful option to prevent the opponent from setting up entry hazards or boosts. Although it does require a fair amount of prediction, it is very effective against Pokemon such as Skarmory and Cresselia.

Set Details
========

44 HP EVs gives Talonflame 159 HP, which is a Life Orb number (10n-1) and optimizes passive damage (16n-1). Attack is maximized to increase damage output. 212 Speed EVs let Talonflame outspeed base 105 Speed Pokemon, allowing Talonflame to Flare Blitz Manectric before it Mega Evolves, which will OHKO after a Swords Dance if Talonflame is holding a Life Orb. An Adamant nature is preferred over Jolly as it gives a 10% boost to Attack, while Talonflame doesn't necessarily need the 10% boost in Speed thanks to Gale Wings. However, a Jolly nature with 228 Speed EVs will allow Talonflame to outspeed Water Shiriken Greninja that may potentially stop its sweep as well as outspeed and OHKO Thundurus with Flare Blitz after a Swords Dance boost.

Life Orb is the most provides Talonflame with the powerful boost Talonflame it can get without locking itself to a move, allowing Talonflame to choose moves flexibly based on the opponent in front of it. Sharp Beak/Sky Plate (same thing, no point in mentioning both) is also an option for this slot if you don't want to deal with Life Orb recoil on top of the recoil from the two main attacking moves, but keep in mind it will not boost Flare Blitz and Brave Bird will be slightly less powerful.

Usage Tips
========

This Talonflame is best used when the path is clear for a sweep. One key difference between this set and the Choice Band set is that Talonflame won't be locked into a move, allowing it to switch between Brave Bird and Flare Blitz, Taunt opposing support Pokemon, recover HP with Roost, burn opposing Pokemon with Will-O-Wisp, or set up a Swords Dance. Due to this flexibility, this set is capable of going up against both offensive and defensive Pokemon and provide support for the other two members in your team. Even if the opponent has a Zapdos in their team, if you set up a Swords Dance on the switch Flare Blitz can OHKO with Life Orb.

However, due to Talonflame's lackluster defensive stats, it's usually unable to fully utilize its entire moveset before going down. Therefore, whenever Talonflame is sent out, keep in mind what is needed the most in the current situation in the battle and choose your its moves accordingly.

Team Options
========

This Talonflame is very flexible, (AC) so it is able to fit into almost any team. It enjoys Garchomp, Aegislash, and Mega Lucario as a partner because it they can switch into incoming Rock-type moves and dish out a lot of damage. Breloom is also a good partner, as Tailwind can double its Speed to allow it to Spore faster opponents, as well as Spore slow Rock-types and defensive Pokemon. Sleeping Putting Pokemon to sleep also gives Talonflame a great opportunity to set up Swords Dance. Mega Gengar is a great partner to have to remove Pokemon such as Mega Slowbro and Cresselia, (AC) that which prevent Talonflame from sweeping. If you're using Perish Trap Gengar with Wobbuffet, Wobbuffet can also potentially give Talonflame an opportunity to set up Swords Dance by Encoring the opponent into a status or Ground-type move.


Other Options
########

Natural Gift allows Talonflame to deal significant damage to its usual counters as long as it's holding the appropriate Berry. At +2, Natural Gift OHKOes Rotom-W and Heatran with the Liechi and Salac Berries, (AC) respectively. However, it's a one-time trick, and Talonflame will not be holding any items afterwards to boost its offensive capability. You can use it in conjunction with Acrobatics if you want to take advantage of the item removal and don't like Brave Bird recoil, but keep in mind that it won't deal a lot of damage without a Swords Dance boost. Overheat is also a cool option that can be used with Life Orb to catch physical walls off guard, most notably Mega Aggron, Mega Steelix, and Avalugg, although all three of these Pokemon are hardly seen in Battle Spot Singles. Protect is useful to prevent extra damage from Fake Out from Pokemon such as Mega Medicham, Mega Lopunny, Mega Kangaskhan, or and Mienshao, though you lose a valuable moveslot.


Checks & Counters
########

**Stealth Rock**: The 4x Rock weakness severely limits Talonflame's mobility throughout the match. Combine it with any defensive Pokemon and you can effectively put Talonflame into a checkmate.

**Rock-types**: If a Choice Band Talonflame doesn't use U-turn upon Rock-types switching in, they can easily take a Brave Bird or Flare Blitz and proceed to set up Stealth Rock while scaring Talonflame away. Burns won't save the Rocky Helmet set from STAB Stone Edges from Pokemon like Tyranitar and Rhyperior.

**Defensive Pokemon**: Mega Slowbro, Cresselia, Porygon2, Hippowdon, Heatran, and bulky Gyarados will tank multiple Choice Band-boosted Brave Birds and either hit back hard or recover health. Against the Rocky Helmet set, Gyarados, Hippowdon, and Cresselia will have difficulty getting through, so watch out. Porygon2 and Mega Slowbro can get through with Discharge/Thunderbolt and Scald, (AC) respectively. Heatran wins if it gets off a Toxic before getting Taunted, but get ready for a long battle if it fails to do so.

**Electric-types**: Mega Manectric, Rotom-W/-H, Rotom-H, and Zapdos can take multiple Choice Band-boosted Brave Birds and hit back extremely hard. Thundurus cannot tank two Choice Band-boosted Brave Birds, but it can check Talonflame effectively and even paralyze Talonflame with priority Thunder Wave. All of them except Rotom-A cannot take Flare Blitz too well, so don't send them in carelessly. All of them are special attackers, so burns aren't a problem.

**Bulky Offensive Pokemon**: Garchomp, Landorus-T, Mega Salamence, and Mega Kangaskhan can check Choice Band Talonflame and OHKO with any powerful attack. Against the Rocky Helmet set, Garchomp and Landorus-T can break through with Stone Edge, hold a Lum Berry, hold a Choice Scarf to beat Talonflame before getting burned, or set up Swords Dance. Mega Kangaskhan can beat Talonflame with Fake Out + burned Rock Slide or Facade, and Mega Salamence can set up Dragon Dance on the turn of Will-O-Wisp and muscle through with Double-Edge.

**Mega Sableye**: The Rocky Helmet set will not be able to beat Mega Sableye thanks to Magic Bounce preventing Taunt, and Mega Sableye will freely start setting up Calm Mind. Choice Band Talonflame can 2HKO Mega Sableye, so the only hope it has is to Recover stall until Talonflame faints from recoil damage.

**Aegislash**: Aegislash checks Talonflame thanks to King's Shield and Talonflame's main offensive options making contact. Special Aegislash don't mind getting burned either and can beat Talonflame with Shadow Ball.

**Recoil**: Recoil is an issue for Talonflame, (AC) as its main offensive options deal a third of the damage dealt on the opponent to itself. Combine that with Rocky Helmet, Iron Barbs, and Rough Skin, and Talonflames Talonflame often knock themselves out.



GP 2/2
 
Last edited:

DragonWhale

It's not a misplay, it's RNG manipulation
is a Top Social Media Contributor Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Dedicated Tournament Host Alumnusis a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnus
Thanks. I'll finish this when I get up in the morning.

wow, I wrote the roman numeral for 4 instead of 6. I'm dumb.
 

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 1, Guests: 0)

Top