1. Welcome to Smogon! Check out the Smogon Starters Hangout for everything you need to know about starting out in the community. Don't forget to introduce yourself in the Introduction and Hangout Thread, too!
  2. Welcome to Smogon Forums! Please take a minute to read the rules.

Team APHID: A Parasite Hidden In Dust (Peaked #5)

Discussion in 'BW OU Teams' started by toshimelonhead, Nov 2, 2012.

  1. toshimelonhead

    toshimelonhead Raising Whitney's Miltank

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2009
    Messages:
    1,152
    At a glance:
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    Introduction:

    After hearing rumblings of Genesect dominating the DW OU tier, I couldn’t wait to use it in Standard OU. Along with looking awesome, it screams versatility and can run five or six sets very well. Since I had released a Rain RMT and a Sun RMT, I figured this next team would be Sand based. The end result has given me my best team so far. It peaked in the top 5 on the Pokemon Online Server with 1639 points. Don't remember any specific Showdown peaks, but it does well there, too. I then used this team to get Suspect requirements for the Garchomp vote. This team was also nominated for the #pokemon tournament. Since the #pokemon tournament is now over, I have decided to retire this team. Enjoy!

    Team Building Process:

    The first step was talking to Xtrashine, the savior of Team US Central. When I asked him what the best Genesect set was, he responded,
    DUH... (open)

    [22:04] <xtra> duh
    [22:04] <xtra> the best
    [22:04] <xtra> 252 spatt 252 speed
    [22:04] <xtra> uturn tbolt flamethrow icebeam
    [22:04] <xtra> naive
    [22:04] <xtra> and,, FOCUS SASH
    [22:04] <xtra> ahh my fave mon 2 us
    01[22:04] <toshimelonhead> o.O that sounds awesome
    [22:05] <xtra> yup
    [22:05] <xtra> dat bluff
    01[22:06] <toshimelonhead> so basically u-turn like crazy?
    [22:07] <xtra> naw
    [22:07] <xtra> just hit normally
    [22:07] <xtra> if u see a scizor
    [22:07] <xtra> fthrow it
    [22:07] <xtra> or dnite
    [22:07] <xtra> ice beam it
    [22:07] <xtra> they then switch into something like lucario
    [22:07] <xtra> and u fthrow that


    Never one to doubt Xtra, I started building.

    The next step was looking at teams in the RMT Archive and looking for common characteristics of a good team. I found four traits that were almost universal:

    1.) Weather
    2.) Ground immunity
    3.) Stealth Rock
    4.) Bulky steel

    I wanted to build a Sand RMT since I already produced Sun and Rain teams, so I added Hippowdon for its defensive prowess. Hippowdon could also set up Stealth Rock. Jirachi could wall special attacks as a bulky Steel and heal Genesect with Wish. Rotom-W provided a Ground-type immunity. Starmie’s Rapid Spin support helped keep Genesect’s Sash intact, and Terrakion provided a Stall breaker without being G-weak.

    [​IMG]

    Genesect @ Focus Sash
    Trait: Download
    EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Hasty Nature (+Spd, -Def)
    - U-turn
    - Flamethrower
    - Thunderbolt
    - Ice Beam

    Genesect runs the metagame right now. Its versatility and elusiveness make it impossible to counter by any one pokemon alone. Gene gets excellent coverage with a standard moveset of U-Turn, Flamethrower, Thunderbolt, and Ice Beam that makes it hard to justify other moves. U-Turn helps Genesect get out of trouble as stated earlier. Boltbeam coverage is classic, and Flamethrower takes care of Ferrothorn, which can be a problem for this team since Genesect doesn’t like paralysis and there are four pokemon weak to Grass-type moves. Xtra’s call for a Focus Sash was an excellent suggestion. I have a hard time putting a choice item on a Genesect. Genesect’s beauty is that since it has so few counters, any checks thinking that I’m locked onto a move suddenly become much less threatening when I switch to a Super effective move. Sash Genesect also checks RP Landorus and Choice Scarf Salamence, while Scarf sets do not. Focus Sash is nice over Expert Belt or Life Orb because it allows Genesect to recover from any surprise attacks and score a game changing OHKO.

    It is important to note that Focus Sash does not disappear once Genesect loses HP, but rather when Genesect uses the Sash. Jirachi, for instance, can heal Genesect with Wish back to HP and Sash intact if Genesect has taken some damage beforehand. Status is a bigger problem for Genesect because burn negates the Sash and paralysis renders Genesect useless.

    I did not have the chance to ladder during Round 7, but Genesect is a worthy suspect test and I am not sure at this point if I would ban it from OU given the chance. I would rather see Thundurus and Excadrill in the metagame first and then decide on Genesect.


    [​IMG]

    Starmie @ Leftovers
    Trait: Natural Cure
    EVs: 252 HP / 32 Def / 224 Spd
    IVs: 0 Atk
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Scald
    - Psyshock
    - Rapid Spin
    - Recover​

    Starmie is vital to the team because it clears hazards for Genesect and provides a check to Heatran and Terrakion. When it comes to viable OU Rapid Spin users, Starmie tops a very exclusive list. Even if Excadrill were OU, I would rather have Starmie spinning since Starmie can take status and fully recover, which is nice against stall teams. Natural Cure also serves as a nice way to check what status moves the blobs have so I can act accordingly. The EV spread is standard here, I need Starmie to survive for the long term and outspeed the Gengars and Terrakions of the world. The moveset provides STAB coverage, with Scald providing a way to cripple any rain threats that might switch in. Psychic might go over Psyshock since pink blob usage is declining and most fighters struggle with special attacks.


    [​IMG]

    Hippowdon (F) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Sand Stream
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef
    Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
    - Earthquake
    - Whirlwind
    - Stealth Rock
    - Slack Off​

    The classic Tank. I chose Hippowdon over Tyranitar because Hippowdon provides a physical presence that Tyranitar cannot match. Having the ability to handle Terrakion, the occasional Dragon spam, and Scizor is very nice. Hippowdon gains Whirlwind with the release of BW2, making it easier to stop Baton Pass teams. Stealth Rock is on Hippowdon over Jirachi since Jirachi has a better move pool, and Earthquake provides STAB. Sand Stream helps everyone on the team except for Starmie and Rotom-W, which both have recovery methods. The EV spread has max defense over the suggested spread since Hippowdon cannot touch RP Landorus, and Earth Power 2HKOs it anyway. The only Special Attacker Hippowdon check is the SubCM Rain Jirachi that everyone loves.


    [​IMG]

    Terrakion @ Choice Band
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Quick Attack
    - X-Scissor
    - Close Combat
    - Stone Edge


    Terrakion is a monster in this metagame. It can provide offensive pressure and check Genesect at the same time, something no other pokemon can boast. Taking out Volcarona is nice, too. I chose a Choice Band set over a Sub set because I wanted a chance to revenge kill with Quick Attack. Choice Band is nice over Choice Scarf to 2HKO Skarmory. While Terrakion’s moves come with drawbacks--Stone Miss comes to mind—the squad appreciates Terrakion’s ability to ram through teams with no setup necessary. In fact, there are no setup sweepers on this team, which probably speaks to the power of Genesect as a revenge killer.


    [​IMG]

    Jirachi @ Leftovers
    Trait: Serene Grace
    EVs: 252 HP / 224 SDef / 32 Spd
    Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
    - Iron Head
    - Body Slam
    - Wish
    - U-turn


    Jirachi provides a Steel resistance that helps me against dragons and special attackers. It is the default switch in even for things like Celebi since I don’t want Genesect taking any attacks. Even though I did not ladder with this team during the Kyurem-B suspect testing, I would not be concerned since Choice Band Adamant Outrage is a 3HKO even factoring Stealth Rock damage. The move set is nothing surprising given my proclivity for parahax, and Wish as discussed before heals Genesect and Terrakion. U-Turn helps Jirachi get out against DragMag teams, which can give this team fits if played properly. The EVs are leftover from BW1, but I have toyed with the idea of outspeeding Jolly Breloom, even though it would severely compromise Jirachi’s walling duties. The other problem with higher speed is that a slower U-Turn helps Genesect come in untouched, which is essential with this team.


    [​IMG]

    Rotom-W @ Chesto Berry
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 36 HP / 252 SAtk / 220 Spd
    Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
    - Thunderbolt
    - Hidden Power Grass
    - Hydro Pump
    - Rest


    Rotom-W rounds out the team. There have been some changes since releasing this team to the #pokemon tournament, and I think they are for the better. The first is the EV spread; I wanted to outspeed Adamant Mamoswine and Jolly Breloom just in case Breloom is in the KO range for Hydro Pump or Thunderbolt. The second is the move set. Thunderbolt is on here for Jellicent and Jellicent alone. Volt Switch can 2HKO some versions by itself, but Specially Defensive Jellicents could wall this entire team before switching to Thunderbolt. Hidden Power Grass is insurance for Gastrodon and Seismitoed. ChestoRest allows Rotom-W to take a Scald burn from a Politoed or a Tentacruel and heal back up when necessary. It also allows me to bluff a Choice item for a little bit (not having Volt Switch hurts in that respect).


    Closing Thoughts​

    While I don’t think this team needs many changes, I have been toying with the idea of replacing Rotom-W with a Lati@s set to deal with Special Attacker Landorus. The problem lies in picking the right moveset; most likely a Life Orb Draco / Surf / HP Fire / Recover set. I have not made the switch permanent, however, since it leaves me more G-weak.

    Thank you for reading this. I know that many of you had the chance to test this team in the #pokemon tournament, so there might be some feedback out there to improve this team. As always, I love it when my teams earn a Luvdisc so do not be afraid to give one.


    Also, yes I do borrow pictures without permission. Thanks Deviantart, TotalPokemon, Bulbagarden, Generation Pokemon, NoCookie, and PokemonElite for not being annoying and changing the pics on me.

    Final glance:

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    Importable (open)
    Genesect @ Focus Sash
    Trait: Download
    EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Hasty Nature (+Spd, -Def)
    - U-turn
    - Flamethrower
    - Thunderbolt
    - Ice Beam


    Starmie @ Leftovers
    Trait: Natural Cure
    EVs: 252 HP / 32 Def / 224 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Scald
    - Psyshock
    - Rapid Spin
    - Recover


    Hippowdon (F) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Sand Stream
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SDef
    Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
    - Earthquake
    - Whirlwind
    - Stealth Rock
    - Slack Off


    Terrakion @ Choice Band
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spd
    Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
    - Quick Attack
    - X-Scissor
    - Close Combat
    - Stone Edge


    Jirachi @ Leftovers
    Trait: Serene Grace
    EVs: 252 HP / 224 SDef / 32 Spd
    Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
    - Iron Head
    - Body Slam
    - Wish
    - U-turn


    Rotom-W @ Chesto Berry
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 36 HP / 252 SAtk / 220 Spd
    Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
    - Thunderbolt
    - Hidden Power [Grass]
    - Hydro Pump
    - Rest


    Threat list (open)


    1.) Play styles

    Baton Pass - Baton Pass teams have very few goals in mind - they want to either pass to Espeon with many boosts, or pass to a 4 attack Sweeper at Air Balloon or Focus Sash. To defeat these teams, keep these questions in mind:

    • Can I break the chain successfully and/or somewhat easily? Hippowdon with Whirlwind
    • Am I not helpless to Espeon with only defensive boosts? Special Defense Jirachi says hi
    • Can I hit hard enough to quickly kill these teams after the chain is broken? Terrakion, Genesect
    • How could I potentially beat Focus Sash Smeargle before it gets out of hand? Lead Genesect, U-Turn Hippowdon.
    Stall - Stall teams can be weather or non-weather, but they all focus on the same central goal of laying down hazards and proving solid defense while the foe struggles to bring in Pokemon that can break them.

    Being able to beat stall teams require a much different kind of thinking than trying to defeat archetypes of weather. Be sure to answer these questions:

    • Can I control the hazards of the game, either by setting up my own or by having a successful spin strategy? Starmie + Hippowdon
    • Is my team fine in the long-run by entry hazards and status? Yeah, team can fully heal itself if it wants to (Jirachi can wish Genesect back to almost full health.)
    • Can I attack from both sides of the attacking spectrum successfully? Genesect says hi.
    • Can I lure in defensive threats that wall a large portion of my team and get rid of them (or even make them useless?)
    The biggest wall problem was Jellicent but I put Thunderbolt on Rotom-W over Volt Switch to make sure it can’t recover off damage.
    Standard OU Offensive Threats
    Genesect: Terrakion is the best offensive check because Genesect needs Flash Cannon for a super effective move. If I see a Genesect lead, I switch to Rotom-W
    Tornadus-T:
    • Choice Specs / Life Orb Jirachi is main switch into Tornadus-T. Rotom-W is the backup.
    Thundurus-T:
    • Choice Scarf / Choice Specs No solid switch ins but plenty of checks. Terrakion probably is first option especially if Sand is up.
    • Life Orb / Expert Belt: Genesect checks both of these.
    Tyranitar:
    • Choice Band – Crunch is a max 3HKO on Hippowdon.
    • Choice Scarf – Hippowdon says hi.
    • Dragon Dance – Hippowdon roars away boosts.
    Rotom-W:

    Not a great answer here but best bet is to switch in Rotom-W to figure out the set. If it’s scarf, Rotom-W is fine, but ideally I want Terrakion or Genesect in there.
    Scizor:
    • Choice Band – Hippowdon takes 38% max from Superpower
    • Swords Dance – Hippowdon can roar any boosts (Genesect has a win condition)
    Dragonite: Hippowdon can take CB versions decently. Genesect cleans up DD Nite with Sash intact.
    Politoed:
    • Choice Specs / Scarf – Rotom-W takes a maximum 50 percent from Specs Hydro Pump
    • 3 Attacks – less threatening than Choice Specs
    Heatran:
    • Standard: Rotom-W / Starmie’s job (Starmie first).
    Jirachi:
    • Substitute + Calm Mind / Wish + Calm Mind – Hippowdon takes care of SubCM.
    • Expert Belt – Rotom-W resists most Expert Belt attacks. Genesect in a pinch, too.
    • Choice Scarf – Rotom-W can take the scarf.
    Latios:
    • Life Orb / Expert Belt – Jirachi says hi.
    • Choice Scarf / Specs – Jirachi says hi.
    • Calm Mind – Jirachi says hi.
    Reuniclus:
    • Calm Mind – Jirachi says hi.
    • Offensive Trick Room – Jirachi says hi.
    Haxorus: Genesect is my Haxorus check since Genesect gets a Special Attack boost with Download and can survive any attacks with Focus Sash.

    Ninetales:
    • Nasty Plot - Tricky. Lead with Hippowdon against sun teams, but Rotom-W is back up otherwise.
    Conkeldurr:
    • Bulk Up – Hippowdon roars any bulk up boosts.
    • Flame Orb + 3 Attacks – can’t touch Hippowdon even with Ice Punch.
    Celebi:
    • I use Jirachi for Celebi, either for U-Turn or Body Slam + Iron Head. Genesect might check but not my first switch in. Terrakion has X-Scissor just in case.
    Terrakion:
    • Double Dance – Hippowdon as long as something breaks Balloon (Starmie can break)
    • Choice Scarf / Choice Band – CC is not even a 2HKO.
    • Substitute + Swords Dance – Hippowdon works here, too.
    Keldeo:
    • Calm Mind – Defensive Starmie is my first switch in.
    • Choice Specs – Rotom-W does well here. Switch to Starmie if it uses Secret Sword.
    • Sub + Calm Mind – Starmie loves these if they don’t have HP Ghost.
    Gyarados:
    • Offensive / Bulky Dragon Dance – Rotom-W
    • Choice Band / Choice Scarf – Rotom-W
    Gengar:
    • Substitute + Disable / Pain Split – Jirachi
    Starmie:
    • Choice Specs – Only worry about Starmie is that Psyshock is a 2HKO on Rotom-W.
    Landorus:
    • Special Attacker can die in hell. Rotom-W is my best check and can survive a Focus Blast but not always enough.
    Infernape:
    • Mixed Attacker - Wear down throughout the game with hazards / weather / LO damage. Not a huge concern.
    Volcarona:
    • Offensive Quiver Dance –Terrakion is reserved for Volcarona.
    Magnezone: Hippowdon says hi. I have to play conservatively with Jirachi if I see one, though.

    Espeon:
    • Calm Mind – Jirachi says hi.
    Salamence:
    • Like Dragonite, Hippowdon is first switch in. Generally save Genesect/Jirachi just to stop Outrage sweeping lategame.
    Hydreigon:
    • All versions are huge problems but Genesect and Terrakion can check.
    Breloom: Tricky. Rotom-W and Starmie are checks to Breloom (ok Rotom-W not really but Hydro Pump does a shitton), but I need something to take the spore. HP Ice is a OHKO after factoring rocks / sandstorm damage. Note that Rotom-W cannot take a +2 Mach Punch. Genesect works as well if Sash is intact.

    Latias:
    • Jirachi says hi.
    Toxicroak:
    • Swords Dance – Hippowdon says hi.
    • Bulk Up – Hippowdon says hello.
    Lucario:
    • Swords Dance – Hippowdon says hi.
    • Nasty Plot – Genesect checks
    Virizion:
    • Calm Mind - Jirachi
    • Swords Dance - Jirachi
    • Dual Screens - Jirachi
    Scrafty:
    • Dragon Dance – Hippowdon says hi.
    • Bulk Up – Hippowdon says hello.
    Venusaur:

    Jirachi is the main switch in. While it seems odd, HP Fire/Earthquake doesn’t OHKO and Jirachi’s usefulness is limited against Sun teams otherwise.

    Metagross:
    • Stealth Rock – Rotom-W / Starmie take care of Metagross (Rotom-W first switch).
    • Choice Scarf / Choice Band – Rotom-W only loses to CB Hammer Arm if WoW misses.
    • Agility – Rotom-W doesn’t care.
    Mienshao:
    • All-Out Attacker – shut down by Hippowdon
    • Choice Scarf / Choice Band – shut down by Hippowdon, too.
    Cloyster:
    • Shell Smash – Jirachi with Iron Head / Rotom-W.
    • Utility – Rotom-W takes care of these too.
    Mamoswine:
    • Physical Attacker – Rotom-W works best here and can switch on anything except for CB Stone Edge (Starmie is backup). Also outspeeds adamant versions.
    • Focus Sash + Endeavor – if Leading, Rotom-W is out first turn and uses Will-o-Wisp
    Darmanitan:
    • Choice Scarf / Choice Band -
    Abomasnow:
    • Choice Scarf – Jirachi says hi.
    • SubSeed – Lots of U-Turning between Genesect and Jirachi.
    • Mixed Attacker – Jirachi and Genesect say hi.
    Alakazam:
    • Substitute + 3 Attacks – Jirachi says hi.
    • Offensive Calm Mind – Jirachi says hi.
    • Focus Sash - Jirachi says hi.
    Azelf: Jirachi / Genesect
    Azumarill:
    • Choice Band – Superpower is a 2HKO but Rotom-W outspeeds and TBolt is OHKO after hazards
    Deoxys-D:
    • Fast Spiker – If I see an HO team I always lead with Starmie. Scald on Turn 1, and then spin away any hazards. If they switch in Gengar, Starmie outspeeds and Psyshock OHKOs.
    Dugtrio:
    • Focus Sash – Rotom-W
    • Choice Band – Rotom-W
    Empoleon:
    • Agility – Rotom-W
    • Choice Specs – Rotom-W
    Gorebyss:
    • SmashPass – Rotom-W works but Hippowdon normally leads and I would risk using roar to prevent a clean smashpass.
    • Shell Smash Sweeper – Rotom-W
    Kingdra:

    Jirachi is normally the best option here. Not seen much though.
    Kyurem:
    • Choice – Jirachi says hi.
    • Substitute + 3 Attacks – Jirachi is fine at full health and can prevent subs, Terrakion revenges.
    Victini:
    • Physical Attacker – Hippowdon / Rotom-W are my best bets.
    Stoutland:
    • Choice Band – Hippowdon / Jirachi completely walls
    Sharpedo:
    • Speed Boost – While Crunch is a 2HKO, Sharpedo usually Protect on Turn 1 to give Rotom-W a free switch in.
    Rotom-C:
    • Choice Scarf / Choice Specs - Rachi is best option.
    • Support - Tricky.

    Standard OU Defensive Threats

    Tyranitar:
    • Specially Defensive – Hippowdon says hi.
    Ferrothorn:
    • Standard - Tricky. Genesect can switch in after I check for Thunder Wave, but that is oftentimes hard to do. This is the real problem of not having Volt Switch on Rotom-W.
    Politoed:
    • Defensive – Starmie
    Gliscor:
    • Swords Dance – Rotom-W
    • Substitute + Protect - Genesect
    • AcroBat – Starmie / Rotom-W / Genesect
    • Defensive – Genesect OHKOs with Ice Beam.
    Heatran:
    • Specially Defensive – Starmie is best case scenario here.
    Jirachi:
    • Specially Defensive – Hippowdon / Starmie
    Skarmory:
    • Spiker - Starmie takes a maximum 43 percent from Brave Bird and removes all hazards with Rapid Spin.
    Forretress:
    • Spiker – Starmie can burn it with Scald and recover any damage from Volt Switch.
    Gyarados:
    • RestTalk – Rotom-W / Starmie take care of this.
    Jellicent:
    • Utility Counter – Rotom-W has Thunderbolt just for Jellicent.
    Tentacruel:
    • Toxic Spikes – Starmie can Rapid Spin Toxic Spikes and KO back with Psyshock.
    Gastrodon:
    • Tank – Rotom-W says hi.
    Blissey:
    • Support – Switch in Starmie first to see what status move it has. Then switch in Genesect / Terrakion / Hippowdon and act accordingly.
    Vaporeon:
    • Wish Support – Rotom-W 2hkos, (Hippowdon or Tyranitar) change weather.
    Bronzong:
    • Tank - Starmie walls Bronzong. Gyro Ball is a 4HKO.
    Mew:
    • Stallbreaker -
    Slowbro:
    • Tank – Rotom-W can ware down with Thunderbolt.
    Cresselia:
    • Support -
    • Dual Screens -
    Deoxys-D:
    • Bulky Spiker - Starmie can take all attacks, burn Deoxys-D, and remove hazards with Rapid Spin.
    Empoleon:
    • Specially Defensive – Rotom-W handles Empoleon.
    Hippowdon:
    • Physical Tank – Starmie is first switch in to check for Toxic. Rotom-W takes care with Hydro Pump.
    Xatu:
    • Standard – Rotom-W
  2. TGMD

    TGMD +Biosci: you both gave me crabs
    is a Tutoris a Battle Server Moderatoris a Team Rater Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnus
    Won OST Predictions

    Joined:
    Nov 27, 2011
    Messages:
    998
    Hey toshi, nice team!

    When looking through your team, I noticed a rather large weakness to sun sweepers, such as Victreebel and Venusaur. Under the sun, Victreebel has a chance of OHKOing your entire team after Stealth Rock damage (the only thing it dosen't have a chance of OHKOing without Stealth Rock is Genesect with Sash intact) with just Giga Drain and Weather Ball. Venusaur lacks Weather Ball, so it can't OHKO Jirachi, but sun teams almost always have Dugtrio, and although Dugtrio's Earthquake isn't an OHKO, it will bring Jirachi into Hidden Power [Fire]'s KO range. Your only chance of beating them without losing 2 pokemon every time they come out is with lucky predictions (eg. Jirachi baits Hidden Power [Fire], switch out to Hippowdon, go back to Jirachi on the Giga Drain), which is hardly a reliable strategy. To help remedy this situation I suggest running a Life Orb Latias over your current Rotom-W. Latias can take any hit from Victreebel / Venusaur and then OHKO them with Psyshock. Latias also helps alot against Sheer Force Landorus, Keldeo, Breloom, sun in general etc, and although it makes you weaker to the likes of Mamoswine and genesect, they're both checked by other members of your team and overall just aren't as threatening as Victreebel, Venusaur SF Landorus etc.

    Anyway, I hope this rate helped and GL with the team! Luvdisc'd :)

    Life Orb Latias (open)

    [​IMG]
    Latias @ Life Orb
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 72 HP / 184 SAtk / 252 Spe
    Timid Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Draco Meteor
    - Surf
    - Psyshock / Hidden Power [Fire]
    - Recover
    Psyshock is slashed first mainly for Specially Defensive Jellicent. HP EVs give you Life Orb recoil number and good bulk, without comprimising any crucial KOs
  3. toshimelonhead

    toshimelonhead Raising Whitney's Miltank

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2009
    Messages:
    1,152
    Thanks TGMD for the rate! Looks like someone read my mind. Definitely will try.
  4. Electrolyte

    Electrolyte Where's the soul in soldier on?
    is an official Team Rateris a Contributor to Smogonis a Smogon Media Contributoris a Battle Server Moderator

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2012
    Messages:
    2,060
    Hi,

    Solid team! The only problem I see is Sun, since Grass hits most of your pokemon pretty hard. Volcorona is a huge problem, especially versions with Giga Drain, as all they need is one boost in the face of a locked Terrakion to be able to OHKO a majority of your team. Because Terrakion is banded and Genesect won't be able to hit hard with a +1 defense boost under Volc's belt, your team will just be Drained to death. The weakness of Volc translates to a weakness of Sun as well- since Fire/Grass hits all of your team hard. Venasaur is tricky to handle without Hippowdon and even with Hippowdon too because you can't change the weather without risking the loss of it. Taking your slight weakness of Landorus into account as well, I think the best pokemon to use to try to handle it all would be to make Rotom-W Specially Defensive.

    Rotom-W @ Chesto Berry
    Calm, 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD
    Thunder Wave / Rest / Hydro Pump / Volt Switch

    SpDef Rotom covers it all. It throws itself into mayhem to Thunder Wave threats to your team- living even +1 Giga Drains from Modest LO Venusaurs. After it Thunder Waves, hopefully it's still alive so it can Volt Switch to a partner- preferrably Genesect/Hippowdon- and you can proceed to revenge kill. Rotom also tanks Landorus's attacks- immune to EP and using it's massive SpDef to take a Focus Blast and OHKO back with Hydro Pump. Rest is for Recovery, as Rotom will be taking quite a beating for you, but if you think Jirachi's Wish passes are enough than you could opt for TBolt or even HP Grass if it suits your fancy. SpDef Rotom is also a lot better at handling Tornadus-T, which Jirachi may struggle to do at lower health.

    Good luck! Awesome team!
  5. chimpact

    chimpact fire nation
    is an official Team Rateris a Smogon Social Media Contributoris a Tiering Contributor

    Joined:
    Oct 22, 2006
    Messages:
    1,883
    Latias definitely seems like a great answer to sun teams over rotom, and it gives you a much better answer to Breloom. Breloom just has to go for low sweep and everything on your team is 2hko'd or close to it. Swords dance variants are a little easier to handle for you but its still dangerous.

    one nitpick I have is to give Terrakion 4 Spdef EVs instead of attack so genesect gets an attack boost outside of sand. Additionally you can also give Genesect an EV spread of 8 atk / 248 spa / 252 spe so if you get an attack boost you'll get an extra point in attack with that spread.
  6. toshimelonhead

    toshimelonhead Raising Whitney's Miltank

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2009
    Messages:
    1,152
    Good call on the Terrakion EVs. Fixed.
  7. Sork

    Sork

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2012
    Messages:
    72
    Wow, somebody else who uses Focus Sash Genesect, I thought I was alone on that. Props to Xtra on finding a hidden gem with that. However, since I also use Sash genesect, I would actually go with an EV spread of 64 ATK, 192 Sp Atk, and 252 Speed. This makes your u-turn significantly higher damaging, and even with the loss in Sp Atk, it really doesn't make that big of a difference when you have the +1 in sp atk boost. As for Team Member suggestions, I would definitely advise the Latias change. However, your team seems to be able to deal with heatran nicely already, so, instead of the Draco/Surf/HP Fire/Recover set, I would actually forgo using a set with, banananana, Healing Wish. Healing wish is a great move, especially when paired with focus sash genesect. If you ever get pursuit trapped by T-tar or Scizor, you can healing wish out to Genesect, restore it back to full hp, and still have your sash intact. This also helps with whenever Genesect gets statused, because, as you mentioned, you had no way to take care of that. An EV Spread of 40 HP, 224 Sp Atk, and 244 Speed is what I would go with. This allows you to outspeed max speed Terrakion and Keldeo with Psyshock (Provided you have the life orb), and to be able to OHKO them with Psyshock even without Rocks on the field. Also, an added benefit of Healing Wish, since you already have a spinner, you can keep rocks off of your team and not have to worry about Entry hazards making Genesect's sash useless. Although, with this set, you do lose out on recovery. So, you could also go with a spread of Draco/Healing Wish/Roost/Psyshock, which you could change the ev's to 240 speed, 220 Sp Atk, and 44 Hp, giving you a little more survivability. Hope I helped out!
  8. Ada

    Ada
    is a Tiering Contributor

    Joined:
    Feb 10, 2011
    Messages:
    183
    I noticed a lot of suspect testers ran Giga Drain over Thunderbolt (myself included), which provides similar coverage - you do miss out on Gyarados - but with the added advantage of hitting Terrakion harder. I think it would be especially nice on Focus Sash Genesect to be able to recover off of Water-types and get back to full health. Just a small suggestion :)
  9. toshimelonhead

    toshimelonhead Raising Whitney's Miltank

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2009
    Messages:
    1,152
    That is an interesting idea. Here is the result from Honko at +0:

    Terrakion (OU Choice Band) Giga Drain 52.46 - 61.72%
    Rotom-W (OU Bulky Attacker) Giga Drain 54.27 - 64.68%
    Gastrodon (OU Tank) Giga Drain 59.15 - 70.42%

    Here is the result at +1:

    Terrakion (OU Stealth Rock) Giga Drain 78.01 - 92.26%
    Rotom-W (OU Bulky Attacker) Giga Drain 81.78 - 96.65%
    Gastrodon (OU Tank) Giga Drain 89.2 - 105.16%

    With sand up, Giga Drain doesn't even 3HKO. While a nice idea, I don't think it is worth changing it over Thunderbolt. I appreciate the suggestion, though :).
  10. toshimelonhead

    toshimelonhead Raising Whitney's Miltank

    Joined:
    Nov 24, 2009
    Messages:
    1,152
    Thanks for the rate! Sorry for the slow response, but I was testing out Healing Wish Latias using Draco / Surf / Psyshock / HWish with a modification of that EV spread. Pleased with the results so far (9-1 on Showdown...hard to tell if that is statistically significant but it certainly works well with the team.)
  11. tehy

    tehy

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2010
    Messages:
    1,655
    PICK ME!!!!!!

    Gotta be honest, i'm not really a big fan of sashnesect. Until the scarf bluff is seen through, they probably won't be trying to straight OHKO you with much that you can deal with well anyhow. The only exception is via breaking the bluff and counter-koing them, but E-belt does that too. The whole point is that it also checks d-nite and stuff, but it's a check broken by ANY prior damage...

    Fact is, your team is rather stally, or at the very least balanced. You're going to be coming in a good bit, and you even lack a spinner. Wish from jirachi is all well and good, but rachi is forced out by earth and fire moves, which means genesect can only switch in on the former. And then he might not recover 100%.

    Also, what? In fact, there are no setup sweepers on this team, which probably speaks to the power of Genesect as a revenge killer.

    I guess you mean terrakion? But weird, cause you really mean lategame sweeper. And not really a big fan of that starmie, but it's effective, i just like my starmies with ice beam.

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 0)