1. New to the forums? Check out our Mentorship Program!
    Our mentors will answer your questions and help you become a part of the community!
  2. Welcome to Smogon Forums! Please take a minute to read the rules.

Team Hammer-time

Discussion in 'BW OU Teams' started by Silvershadow234, Jun 2, 2012.

  1. Silvershadow234

    Silvershadow234 :]]]]]
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2012
    Messages:
    737
    Hi guys this is my first RMT and it features Terrakion, arguably the most broken Pokemon in the current metegame. It has been my most successful team by far, and has reached 1200, but I think could go further. I would really like some help though. My main problems have been against some hyper offense teams, as well as rain teams when Rotom-W and Celebi go down. It is quite solid in my opinion, but does need some polishing.

    Heatran
    Nature: Timid
    EV's: 4hp, 252sp.att, 252spe
    Item: Air Balloon
    Ability: Flash Fire
    [​IMG]
    Flamethrower
    Earth Power
    HP Ice
    Stealth Rock

    Heatran is my sun counter. He has great coverage, and with an Air Balloon laughs in the face of Dugtrio and the like. I originally had the specially defensive set, which was still great, but this one packs a bigger punch, and much better coverage. He can still reliably set up SR, and still easily switch in on Scizor and standard Tar. HP Ice takes care of Gliscor who try to set up, while Earth Power takes out the fire types on sun teams, as well as Infernape and opposing Heatran.

    Celebi
    Nature: Modest
    EV's: 188, 252sp.att, 68spe
    Item: Leftovers
    Ability: Natural Cure
    [​IMG]
    Nasty Plot
    HP Fire
    Giga Drain
    Psychic

    Nasty Plot Celebi is one of the best sets I've ever used. It is just so underrated. Not even Blissey can beat it(I've done it before). Nasty Plot just sends his sp.att skyrocketing, while Giga Drain can heal back his health. HP Fire decimates Scizor, who always tries to U-turn away and gets killed, as well Ferrothorn and Forretress. Psychic is absolutely necessary in dealing with Conkeldurr, which is one of Celebi's main reasons for being on the team. Celebi really helps against rain teams-taking out pretty much all of the standard members apart from Dragonite or Tornadus. The speed ev's outspeed all Scizor's apart from Scarfed sets, which I've never encountered

    Rotom-W
    Nature: Timid
    EV's: 4hp, 252sp.att, 252spe
    Item: Choice Scarf
    Ability: Levitate
    [​IMG]
    Volt Switch
    Hydro Pump
    Thunderbolt
    HP Ice

    Rotom-W is my first revenge killer. When combined with Celebi, I can usually beat rain team, and is great at taking out DD Gyarados and Tornadus, as well as Starmie and Politoed. Hydro Pump is his most powerful move, and does heavy damage to Tyranitar and Heatran. HP Ice hits the Dragons hard, while Thunderbolt allows me to seriously damage Rain teams without needing to switch, as well as having the ability to 1HKO Gyarados. He was originally a bulky variant, but I was having trouble with speedier Pokemon, and Rotom-W now works much better as a revenge killer.

    Skarmory
    Nature: Impish
    EV's: 252hp, 224def, 32spe
    Item: Leftovers/Shed Shell
    Ability: Sturdy
    [​IMG]
    Brave Bird
    Whirlwind
    Spikes
    Roost

    Originally, I had a big weakness to powerful dragons like Haxorus, Landorus, Gyarados and Scizor. Thankfully, there is a Pokemon that checks all of these-Skarmory, the best physical wall in the game. The set is pretty standard, but Spikes is the most important move. Against the likes of rain teams, it is difficult to get Heatran in to set up Rocks. After a kill, Skarmory can then switch in and set up at least one layer, which goes a long way in stopping the likes of Heatran, Politoed and Gastrodon. Brave Bird provides a STAB move to take out Breloom, Heracross and Swords Dance Virizion. Roost gives me healing power, while Whirlwind provides me phazing power which I lost when Heatran was changed to a more offensive version.

    Tyranitar
    Nature: Jolly
    EV's: 4hp, 252att, 252spe
    Item: Choice Scarf
    Ability: Sand Stream
    [​IMG]
    Stone Edge
    Crunch
    Pursuit
    Superpower

    Tyranitar is my replacement for Landorus, who was here previously. He is Terrakion's partner in crime-softening up his counters so he can sweep. The main reason for Tar though is to counter weather teams-in particular, sun. He stops the fearsome weather sweepers cold, which could be devestating to the rest of the team. Terrakion really benefits from the special defense boost too. He doesn't normally lead, but does against Baton Pass teams since he destroys Espeon, who I despise.

    Terrakion
    Nature: Jolly
    EV's: 4hp, 252att, 252spe
    Item: Rock Gem
    Ability: Justified
    [​IMG]
    Substitute
    Swords Dance
    Stone Edge
    Close Combat

    Terrakion is who the team was built around, and with good reason. He is an absolute monster. The SubSwords Dance set looked really good, so I decided to try that, and I was not disappointed. He can do huge damage even without a Swords Dance boost, and when he does, he kills everything. I was using Life Orb, but Rock Gem allows him to OHKO Gliscor at +2, which was very handy. Out of all the others, he does by far the most damage.

    So, that's the team. Hope you enjoyed!
  2. Silvershadow234

    Silvershadow234 :]]]]]
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2012
    Messages:
    737
    I could really do with some comments and criticism. If there's anything wrong with the team, please tell me.
  3. NatGeo

    NatGeo sun's coming up
    is a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Sep 4, 2010
    Messages:
    2,428
    Hey, pretty interesting team. Pretty standard but again this works off of a good template, but unfortunately that tends to bring some weaknesses along with it. Some random Pokemon that mainly could go into the category of sand offense can mess this team up a bit. Landorus, especially the Choice Scarf variant, really hands this team a lot of trouble, as between Earthquake, Stone Edge, and U-turn (the latter two being boosted by Sand Force), there's a very real possibility that Landorus could 2KO your entire team. The Acrobat set on Gliscor is also annoying for this set as well - It KO'es everything on this team with either a boosted Acrobat or Earthquake, and thanks to Sand Veil, you're chances of taking it out with Rotom-W aren't exactly optimal; it's a shaky check at best for this team. Physical Dragon-types also seem like a nuisance for this team, since between DD Dragonite with Earthquake, MixMence, and basically any variant of the two Pokemon with Fire Blast / Fire Punch / Earthquake, you're hard pressed to wall them without them taking a massive chunk out of at least 1 team member. Additionally, sun teams still give this team a bit of trouble, since Heatran is still beaten by a host of sun sweepers, such as Venusaur with Earthquake, the previously mentioned DD Dragonite, and Volcorona with HP Ground. Tyranitar doesn't make a perfect fit to revenge kill all of these either, as many Pokemon on Drought teams carry Sunny Day to ignore sandstorm. Some sun teams with Dugtrio can just flat out KO you on the revenge kill too, meaning they win the weather war and have their way with you.

    This seems like a lot, but a lot of it can be fixed with some simple tweaks. Skarmory is a good idea to try out over Scizor. While you might miss Scizor at first because of its offensive presence and revenge killing capabilities, most (if not all) of what it checks is covered by your other team members (e.g. Latios meets ScarfTar, Rotom-W says hi to Landorus). With Skamory, Gliscor and Landorus are soundly walled, as well as just about every physical Dragon-type. You can even Roost off damage from Fire Punch and Whirlwind the opponent out if it comes down to that. As a plus, Skarmory, Heatran, and Celebi also happen to form an anti-weather core of sorts, allowing you to keep up with each type of weather with each respective Pokemon. Skarmory provides additional hazards aside from Heatran's Stealth Rock in the form of Spikes; this can help weaken down opponents due to the switches many of your Pokemon cause, especially Terrakion. Speaking of which, Spikes is great for helping Terrakion and Celebi sweep, since a layer of Spikes along with Stealth Rock goes a long way in taking out pesky opponents. Now, another fix: try an offensive spread on Heatran with Air Balloon. This will help a bit versus sun, since you can hit almost every major team member on sun for huge damage, and straight up knock out Volcorona in two hits when it tries to set up on you. You still retain the ability to lay down Stealth Rock, which is a plus. Another thing: Air Balloon Heatran is also a great check to Dragon-types, since with Hidden Power Ice and Air Balloon you can wall all common physical Dragon-types for one turn, giving you the opportunity to smack them with HP Ice; this also applies to Landorus in a sense, but you should watch out for Stone Edge. Lastly, some subjective changes that could work; Thunderbolt over Trick on Rotom-W makes sure SubDD Gyarados doesn't sweep you outright, while Earthquake over Pursuit on Tyranitar is a possibility if you want further assurance against things like Darmanitan locked into Flare Blitz and Venusaur. That's all I got.

    Sets (open)

    Skarmory @ Shed Shell / Leftovers
    Impish Nature | Sturdy
    252 HP / 232 Def / 24 Spe
    Roost / Spikes / Whirlwind / Brave Bird

    Heatran @ Air Balloon
    Timid Nature | Flash Fire
    4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    Fire Blast / HP Ice / Earth Power / Stealth Rock


    Gl!
  4. Silvershadow234

    Silvershadow234 :]]]]]
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2012
    Messages:
    737
    Thanks NatGeo, really useful tips. I'll be sure to try all of them out.
  5. Omicron

    Omicron
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2010
    Messages:
    3,042
    Hey there, it looks like you have a pretty standard Sandstorm / VoltTurn team. Here's a few suggestions that may help you out. First of all, you really don't have a solid answer to Landorus; it is easily capable of dealing immense damage to your team, and Rotom-W seems to be your only option, and it easily gets worn down by repeated U-turns. Everything else on the team succumbs to a powerful Sand Force-boosted Earthquake, with the exception of Celebi, which is also promptly destroyed by U-turn. To solve this problem, I'm going to second NatGeo's recommendation of Air Balloon Offensive Heatran with Stealth Rock. This also gives you a pseudo-check to Dugtrio, as it cannot hope to hurt Heatran if it has it's balloon intact. This will also make it easier to deal with sun teams, which commonly carry Dugtrio. I'm not going to elaborate on the other threats to your team too much, as NatGeo already covered most of it, but I have a few more suggestions.

    Nasty Plot Celebi is a really great set in the current metagame, and it comes down to whether or not you want to be able to hit Scizor with Hidden Power Fire, or Heatran with Earth Power. Your team doesn't seem to have too many issues with Heatran, so Hidden Power Fire is probably the better choice. One thing to note, however, an Offensive variant of Scizor with Swords Dance can easily run through your team, and with your current EV spread, Celebi is outsped by Jolly Scizor. For this reason, I'm going to suggest that you increase the Speed EVs to 64, which allows Celebi to outspeed all variants of Scizor bar the Choice Scarf variant. You might also want to try Will-O-Wisp on Rotom-W over Trick, as Trick really doesn't see much use, especially as Rotom-W is much more useful with its Choice Scarf equipped. Will-O-Wisp is a very useful move that is incredibly underrated on Rotom-W. Although you are Choice Scarfed, a fast Will-O-Wisp can really work to your advantage; however, this is even more of an optional change.

    One last thing, I'm going to disagree with NatGeo about Tyranitar; you really need Pursuit in order to trap things such as Latios. I know it already outspeeds it with a Scarf, but Latios can simply switch out if you don't carry Pursuit. Granted, you can play mind-games, but a -2 Specs Latios is most likely going to switch out. Keep Pursuit on Tyranitar.

    GL with the team!
  6. Silvershadow234

    Silvershadow234 :]]]]]
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2012
    Messages:
    737
    Thanks for the suggestions! Offensive Heatran has been working really well-took out a sun team all on it's own. I'm not that sure about Skarmory though-Scizor was really useful for keeping up the momentum and U-Turning. AcroBat Gliscor wouldn't be that much of a threat, due to HP Ice on Heatran-which will KO, no doubt, and if that fails, Rotom-W has HP Ice too.
  7. Silvershadow234

    Silvershadow234 :]]]]]
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2012
    Messages:
    737
    I've updated the team with the changes you suggested-mainly Skarmory over Scizor, Thunderbolt over Trick on Rotom-W and a more offensive spread on Heatran. Keep posting, the team's coming along nicely now!
  8. Davaro

    Davaro

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2012
    Messages:
    4
    I think you should have a rapid spinner....
    Meanwhile that you chose Heatran and Celebi in the same team is good because they support each other.
  9. Silvershadow234

    Silvershadow234 :]]]]]
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2012
    Messages:
    737
    A spinner would be good, but who to choose? They are all pretty vital to the team, and if I swap Rotom-W for Starmie I would lack speed and the ability to switch in on Tornadus, since I don't like switching Tyranitar in in case of a Focus Blast, as well as Volt Switch. Donphan only works on sun teams, while Forretress is outclassed by Skarmory in walling Landorus and Haxorus thanks to reliable recovery. Also, the ability to phaze is important against Baton Pass teams, as well as stat uppers like Dragonite, who may use Forretress as set-up bait.

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 0)