Team Style

Discussion in 'Past Gen Teams' started by WillSO, Dec 23, 2010.

  1. WillSO

    WillSO

    Joined:
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    Messages:
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    __________________________________________________
    Introduction
    __________________________________________________

    Let me start off my RMT by telling you a little about my competitive Pokemon battling history. I started playing competitive Pokemon during the summer of 2010 - around the time Salamence was floating around in most peoples' teams and we all had to play around it. Obviously, it was difficult to start Pokemon in an era were prediction was very key to beating Salamence, but I think that he difficulty involved aided me in becoming a better Pokemon player, and certainly helped me develop my style of play which I use in the current day metagame. Around the time Salamence got banned, I switched and started playing a lot of UU. In UU, FWG cores are dominant and bulky offence is generally the favoured way to play. Over the few months I played of UU, I further developed my style of play and began to take interest in the OU metagame again. This is where I am today.

    This is my latest team, and my favourite one to this date. I present to you today, Team Style.
    __________________________________________________
    Teambuilding
    __________________________________________________

    that teambuilding (open)

    Because I wanted to play the same way I play in UU, I had to pick a bulky FWG core that could all take some hits, and do some decent damage to hit back with. Originally, I started with Heatran, Suicune and Celebi.
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    Next, I wanted a Pokemon that could fix up any weaknesses. I knew Rotom provided a ground and fighting immunity, and so synergises well with Heatran, and it could also provide me with a way of crippling walls with Trick. Choosing the form was easy for me. At this point Tyranitar was a major threat (Pursuiting Celebi and Rotom) so Rotom-W could at least threaten with Hydro Pump. I also knew Rotom-W was a good check to bulky waters, which can always cause issues.

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    Okay, core settled. The only things I still didn't like were my Ghost and Dark weaknesses. I knew at this point, I was fairly free with my choices (because I wasn't weak to anything in particular other than Ghost/Dark). I decided that a dedicated revenge killer (should Rotom have to trick something) would always be useful and so what immediately sprung to mind were Jirachi and Flygon. At this point, I lacked a way of dealing with Dragon's reliable, and although Jirachi can Ice Punch, I prefer Flygon and his Outrage, as it is more powerful, and can kill Kingdra's (which Ice Punch cannot).

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    Right, let's assess the team type weaknesses. I'm still fairly stable. I only have a double weakness to three types, Ghost, Dark and Ice. Nothing was desperately needed to provide a check to something, so I could go ahead and choose myself another Pokemon that is reliable and gets the job done, pretty much regardless of typing. I went here for a lead, a solid lead that could get Stealth Rock down and do damage to the opponents team in the early game. I also know that the lead I have in mind can come back throughout the game and cause havoc.

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    And let's just arrange the images in a nice order for you: Lead, Core, Glue, Revenge Killer.

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    After testing the team, I found that the Celebi set I was using wasn't putting enough offensive pressure on the opponent, and at this point I switched set. After another episode of testing, I decided Celebi wasn't doing enough for the team, and so I removed it in favour of Breloom. Breloom was handy as he has a very threatening combination of moves with Spore, Substitute and Focus Punch.

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    Breloom didn't seem to fit into the team as well as I'd liked him to, so I switched him for Celebi's base 100 counterpart - Shaymin. Shaymin scares anything with Seed Flare and isn't held back by Celebi's 4x weakness to U-Turn or trapping.

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    This is where I settled upon the team members, the only changes after this being move set changes.


    __________________________________________________
    The Team In Depth
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    The Lead:
    [​IMG]
    Metagross @ Lum Berry
    Ability: Clear Body
    EVs: 252 HP/252 Atk/4 Spd
    Adamant nature (+Atk,-SpAtk)
    - Bullet Punch
    - Explosion
    - Meteor Mash
    - Stealth Rock

    Why this Pokemon?
    Any lead for any team used for competitive battling should have a purpose of setting up momentum or giving a player an advantage during the match. My Metagross does this for me nearly every time. As a general rule, setting up Stealth Rock is a priority, and seeing as Metagross has so many resistances, getting down my entry hazards is nearly guaranteed. On top of this, Metagross has an extremely threatening base attack stat and can sometimes scare the opponent into switching fearing an early 5-6 disadvantage. Metagross does so much for this team, providing a great start to the game, and can even be saved for the late game to help provide resistances and a threatening physical sweeper. He is perfect for his role.

    Why this set?
    This is pretty much the standard lead Metagross set. I use Stealth Rock for entry hazards, guarantees my team a lot of KO’s late game and no Pokemon is immune to it, nor can it be absorbed, and it only takes one turn to set up. Overall, it’s just the most efficient entry hazard (and the only one Metagross can use). I choose Meteor Mash over Earthquake for the chance for an attack raise, which makes Metagross a lot more threatening. I often lead with this move for the +1 boost which it offers. Bullet Punch for the obligatory STAB priority to nullify Focus Sash leads and hit faster Pokemon for damage. Explosion is awesome coming from Metagross’ huge attack stat, pretty much guaranteeing a kill. It can also be saved till late game to explode on any potentially problem-causing Pokemon. The EV’s listed maximise Metagross’ natural bulk and monstrous attack. The 4 speed EV’s are to speed tie with other lead Metagross if it ever matters. He has an Adamant nature to further boost his attack. Lum Berry allows me to deal with status inducing leads with ease (Roserade >_>) and also lets me combat the annoying Machamp far easier as Lum Berry cures confusion.

    The Core:
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    The core of my team is made up by these four Pokemon. I chose a FWG core because it provides a useful amount of resists and they largely cover each other’s weaknesses. I added a Ghost into the core to complete the synergy and provide a useful Fighting and Ground immunity. I like to play a bulky offence team, and so by choosing these four Pokemon which all have some natural bulk regardless of investments I am allowed to make unpredictable switches and let not the obvious switch take a hit. This often allows me a free turn and gives me the initiative to threaten the opponent. A useful feature of the core (which I picked up from an RMT a long while back) is that none of them are weak to Stealth Rock, which allows me to make constant switching without too much penalty of entry hazard damage.

    [​IMG]
    Heatran (M) @ Leftovers
    Ability: Flash Fire
    EVs: 252 Spd/252 SpAtk/4 SpDef
    Timid nature (+Spd,-Atk)
    - Earth Power
    - Fire Blast
    - Substitute
    - Toxic

    Why this Pokemon?
    Heatran is pretty much a staple on all of my OU teams that utilize a FWG core because of the relatively frailty of Fire types; they are weak to common Ground and Water attacks, on top of being weak to Stealth Rock – this really hinders their usefulness. This is somewhat cancelled out by Heatran providing a number of resistances, including Rock, and immunities to Poison moves and Fire moves. Flash Fire is an amazing ability, absorbing Fire attacks giving him a free switch in whilst boosting his already threatening Fire attacks. There’s not really much else to say about Heatran, the pros definitely out way the cons when considering him for a team like my own.

    Why this set?
    SubTran is definitely my favourite set to use with Heatran. The nature of Heatran forces many switches, which give Heatran the opportunity to use Substitute, and Heatran behind a substitute is very threatening, forcing more switches, allowing for entry hazard damage and Toxic abuse from Heatran. Fire and Ground is pretty good coverage and from Heatran’s special attack stat, it’ll put a dent into almost anything. The idea is pretty simple, come in on something Heatran is either immune to or resists, force the opponent out, Substitute on the switch and from then you’re guaranteed either a free hit, or a free Toxic if it’s appropriate. The EV’s are simple, maximise speed and special attack to hit as hard as possible as fast as possible. The 4 EV’s in special defence are negligible. He has a Timid nature because that way I’m more likely to out speed opposing Heatrans should the need arise. I have chosen Leftovers over the also-popular Shuca Berry so that I can use Substitute more effectively throughout the game.

    [​IMG]
    Suicune @ Leftovers
    Ability: Pressure
    EVs: 252 HP/252 Def/4 SpDef
    Bold nature (+Def,-Atk)
    - Calm Mind
    - Rest
    - Sleep Talk
    - Surf

    Why this Pokemon?
    I chose Suicune for a few reasons. He has great base defensive stats, a stall-ish ability in Pressure, a good special attack stat and a move with the means of boosting it. Water is a good type, having good coverage with its STAB alone. I did have a few options available to me throughout the tier: Empoleon, Gyarados, Kingdra, Swampert, Tentacruel and Vaporeon but I feel that Suicune has the best combination of offensive and defence qualities whilst maintaining good synergy throughout the team – switching to Empoleon would make me ground weak, Gyarados is weak to Stealth Rock, Kingdra makes me dragon weak, Swampert doesn’t resist water, Tentacruel is again weak to ground and cannot take physical hits very well. Vaporeon was the last option and I’d actually consider him solely for Wish support. Nonetheless, Suicune does his job very well.

    Why this set?
    In case you hadn’t spotted it yet, this Suicune set is the infamous CroCune which is such an effective Suicune set. Everything here works so well together – maximum defence and HP investment allows him to take nearly any hit on the physical side of the spectrum, whilst Calm Mind allows him to boost his special defence and special attack equally. Surf provides a very reliable move; it is one hundred per cent accurate and has a pretty good damage output. Water is only resisted by other water-types, grass and dragon, all of which can be played around by switching around my team. The combination of Rest and Sleep Talk allows him to stay healthy whilst boosting or attacking during his sleep. Bold nature maximises his defence, and Leftovers ensure that he recovers health even when not resting.


    [​IMG]
    Shaymin @ Leftovers
    Ability: Natural Cure
    EVs: 252 HP/188 Spd/68 SpAtk
    Timid nature (+Spd,-Atk)
    - Hidden Power [Fire]
    - Leech Seed
    - Protect
    - Seed Flare

    Why this Pokemon?
    Why Shaymin? Well, because I needed a bulky grass type and Celebi didn’t quite cut it! Celebi is four times weak to U-turn and also is susceptible to trapping, which I really don’t like. Shaymin however, has the same base stats and isn’t as vulnerable as Celebi is. Another benefit of using Shaymin over any other grass type is Seed Flare, which is incredible, in my opinion one of the best moves in the game.

    Why this set?
    This set I actually got from an RMT I read a while back, someone had suggested it in the replies. This is a brilliant set to use though. Seed Flare is obviously a no brainer on any Shaymin set, giving the possibility of a sharp special defence drop on the opponent. This is especially useful against Blissey, and essentially makes Seed Flare increase in power. Protect plus Leech Seed and Leftovers ensure that Shaymin sticks around for a while, and HP Fire let’s me trump other enemy grass types and also Scizor (and any other steel type) which I count as a high priority threat. 252 HP EV’s give him maximum bulk on both sides of defence, the 188 speed EV’s (and Timid nature) allow him to out speed max speed and plus nature base 90s, max speed base 95s and some Infernape sets that run the 192 speed EV’s (without a +speed nature). The special attack EV’s give his attacks more damage, which makes Shaymin more threatening.

    [​IMG]
    Rotom-w @ Leftovers
    Ability: Levitate
    EVs: 252 HP/136 Def/120 SpDef
    Calm nature (+SpDef,-Atk)
    - Hydro Pump
    - Shadow Ball
    - Thunderbolt
    - Will-O-Wisp

    Why this Pokemon?
    Rotom-W completes my core by covering Heatran’s ground and fighting weakness perfectly. He also serves as an excellent spin blocker, hitting common spinners Starmie, Tentacruel and Donphan super effectively. The Washer form is really the only option for me, Hydro Pump threatens a lot of Pokemon that like to come in on Rotom – such as Tyranitar. Ghost/Electric is also a good typing; only being weak to Dark and Ghost attacks.

    Why this set?
    It was suggested to me that I switch my old Scarf Rotom-W for something. I'd previously considered a defensive Rotom, but I took my chance to actually make this change. The moveset is fairly standard, Will-o-Wisp to cripple physical sweepers and also get burn damage, Hydro Pump, Thunderbolt and Shadow Ball are Rotom's strongest options for attacking with, and they provide excellent coverage. The EV's give a fairly good balance of defence (304/284/308) and Leftovers helps with Rotom's survivability and bulk. The nature is also there to balance defences, not help with attack.

    The Ace Card:
    [​IMG]
    Flygon (M) @ Choice Scarf
    Ability: Levitate
    EVs: 252 Atk/252 Spd/4 SpDef
    Jolly nature (+Spd,-SpAtk)
    - Earthquake
    - Outrage
    - ThunderPunch
    - U-turn

    Why this Pokemon?
    Originally, I chose Flygon over Jirachi because in my opinion Outrage is far more useful than anything that the Jirachi offers as a revenge killer – having already got a Trick user on my team. Flygon brags the omnipresent Levitate ability rendering him immune to ground attacks, giving him a free switch in on any ground attacks directed at Heatran (from say, an opposing Heatran?) and then proceed to either kill something or U-Turn for damage.

    Why this set?
    This is my favourite set for Flygon, Earthquake and Outrage are obvious STAB high powered attacks to sweep with. Outraging on enemy dragons causing trouble causes epic lulz and ragequitting, which I am a big fan of too. A lot of you might be wondering about the third slot, but ThunderPunch lets me kill a +1 Gyarados who I consider another huge priority. Stone Edge can KO, but I think that ThunderPunch is more reliable and it also gives me a way of hurting bulky waters. U-turn is obvious on any scarf set, free damage or a switch to something appropriate should the opponent be scared into switching. 252 into attack and speed are again obvious, maximising attack and speed so that I can hit hard and fast. I chose Jolly over Adamant because winning a speed tie with other Flygon is more important than that little extra damage.

    __________________________________________________
    Final Thoughts
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    So this is my team – Team Style.
    Overall, I’m very happy with it but I’ve come to you Smogonites to help me improve on my team and spot any threats that my team is weak to.

    A weakness that I have already identified and which worries me a lot is the lack of a phazer, if you could help me introduce one into the team, that'd be great.

    Here is the resistances chart from Marriland, in case you were interested.
    them synergies (open)
    [​IMG]

    I hope you’ve enjoyed reading my first RMT, and I look forward to the feedback I may receive.
    __________________________________________________
    Changes & Former Members
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    them changes (open)

    - Metagross hold item changes from Occa Berry to Lum Berry
    - Rotom-W set changed.





    __________________________________________________
    Credits
    __________________________________________________

    them credits (open)

    Sprites from Pokemon Elite: http://www.pokemonelite2000.com/
    RMT Layout from Chanseys: http://www.smogon.com/forums/showthread.php?t=83506
    And elements from LonelyNess: http://www.smogon.com/forums/showthread.php?t=48348
    Shaymin set from Faladran: http://www.smogon.com/forums/showthread.php?t=81672
    Serioussss, and 15fareed from the Pokemonexperte Server on Pokelab for playing lots of games with me and allowing me to test my team over and over again.
    Loves for all of you <3


    __________________________________________________
  2. Faladran

    Faladran twitch.tv/faladran
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    Looks to be a really solid team. I really think Lum Berry would be better for Metagross though, as sleep leads like Smeargle and Roserade are troublesome. It especially helps against the latter, since you can beat it with Meteor Mash + Bullet Punch, while preventing Toxic Spikes from being laid down (this team doesn't exactly appreciate T-Spikes).

    Scarf Rotom-w + Scarf Flygon is a tad redundant. Flygon covers basically any threat that Rotom does, with maybe the exception of Gengar. I think it would help to change one of them to a different set. Since you seem to prefer keeping Flygon Scarfed, I would suggest trying out a Specs Rotom over your current set, as it hits much harder and opponents tend to be far less prepared for it. If you prefer to keep Scarf Rotom, you could try out a mixed set with Draco Meteor / Earthquake / Fire Blast / Roost on Flygon, which would help out further against stall teams and give you a powerful and unexpected attacker.

    Good luck!

    EDIT: muffinhead, Shaymin doesn't have Rest. It's a Leech Seed + Protect set, one that I recommend extremely often. Toxic Spikes are more dangerous to this team than it would seem. Think about it: Toxic Spikes are commonly used on stall teams. Shaymin is pretty much crippled by T-Spikes, and it happens to be this team's best bet against stall. Crocune helps somewhat, but any good stall player will have worn it down by the end of the match and it isn't immediately threatening.
  3. WillSO

    WillSO

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    Actually Toxic Spikes is interesting for this team, no one is really susceptible to it.
    Metagross and Heatran are Steel, Rotom and Flygon are Levitaters, Suicune has Rest and Shaymin can somewhat counteract the negative effect of Poison with Leech Seed and Leftovers.

    I think I'll switch my Rotom-W for a bulkier set though, perhaps a max HP max SpA Trick Specs set.
  4. muffinhead

    muffinhead b202 wifi vgc
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    This team looks really solid ._. Toxic Spikes don't threaten it at all, they only shorten Shaymin's attacking time before it has to use Rest by a little bit. I recommend using HP Ice on Shaymin, your team has a lot of Scizor / Forretress switch-ins. Generally, Toxic Spikes or Spikes is a good idea for any defensive team that forces a lot of switches, but I don't know where you could fit them on. You might want to change Fire Blast on Heatran to Flamethrower or Lava Plume, for more PP and accuracy, and a higher chance to burn with Lava Plume.
    Good luck with this team, I'm jealous, I can't build defensive cores for the life of me.
  5. y4f

    y4f

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    That's a very solid and well put-together GEN4 Team, most definitely one of the better ones I've seen. The small font makes it look good, but kind of hard for the reader - maybe italicize it instead? First off, your SubToxTran. I ran a variant of that earlier in GEN4, and while it was very effective, it only worked because the main thing my team had trouble with was bulky waters. However, in your case, your team has problems with dedicated special walls (think Bliss / Chans / Clef). Considering you have 1 physical attacker that's choiced and 1 other physical attacker, and only 1 trick user (also keep in mind chans/clef can still wall you even when choiced by spamming s-toss / switching then spamming recovery, etc), it seems to me that you should run a more offensive non-sub variant of tran. Something like this:

    [box]Heatran @ Leftovers / Passho Berry / Choice Scarf
    Trait: Flash Fire
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 252 Spd / 4 Def
    Hasty nature (+Spd, -Def)
    - Fire Blast
    - Earth Power
    - Hidden Power Grass / Electric
    - Explosion[/box]

    Also, for your LeadGross, run Lum instead of Occa. This isn't GEN5, Ninetales isn't running around. Also, Infernape leads aren't nearly as possible as Machamp, and Lum helps you take the DPunch. Your logic for running Occa is very solid, however, consider that Shaymin, when it switches in to absorb status, doesn't fare well against the standard status-inducing leads and will be forced to switch out, thus rendering it cured of its sleep and eliminating sleep clause. A competent player will then predict the -obvious- switch and Sleep Powder / Spore / Dynamicpunch whatever comes in next. I feel like LumGross is just the way to go, since you don't even pack EQ to deal with Fire-types, so Occa isn't getting as much use and seems like it's just unnecessarily crippling your Metagross, while on the other hand Lum variants have a guaranteed 2KO against a shit ton of leads. Also, unstabbed Fire Blasts from stuff like Azelf won't generally KO (keep that in mind).

    edit: fuu faladran beat me to it :(

    Bye!

    For Rotom, since you already have a formidable revenge killer, try running Choice Specs. Firstly, Specs gives Rotom the power to absolutely wreck switchins with the gigantic neutral coverage Hydro Pump + Thunderbolt + Shadow Ball provides. Second, it's often better to trick Choice Specs onto something than Choice Scarf, since you can unknowingly provide checks to your own sweepers by boosting an opponent's poke via Choice Scarf if they predict accurately. Also, I have personally had a lot of success with TrickSpecs Rotom, and smacking TTar switchins with specs Hydro Pump. And by the way, keep your Speed EVs and don't put them in HP or at least not all of them - I've found the extra speed on Rotom to be quite helpful.
  6. Aerrow

    Aerrow hunter
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    Pretty solid team. Immediately, I see a problem with your lead's set; occa berry seems to be quite redundant in the current metagame as it only helps Metagross deal with opposing Heatran (and the rare attacking lead Dragonite), so changing the item to a lum berry would be beneficial. A lum berry will allow Metagross to deal with sleep-inducing leads (like Roserade) while also helping with the ever-present Machamp as with a lum berry, Metagross can avoid confusion that dynamicpunch causes, and defeat Machamp through two consecutive meteor mashes.

    Also, as Faladran has mentioned, two choice scarf users on one team seems to be unnecessary, especially Rotom and Flygon as they work in a very similar manner, taking out similar threats. Although utilizing a choice specs version of Rotom-W would indeed give your team a better chance at maintaining its core and eventually sweeping through the opposing ranks, I think trying out the defensive variant of Rotom-W would also be something to think about as with said defensive variant, your team will have a better time dealing with swords dance Infernape (as it is crippled through Rotom's Will-O-Wisp, and Rotom can live a swords dance boosted Fire Punch (66.1% - 78%), although if Infernape carries flare blitz, you'll need to play conservatively to defeat it), which although is rare, it can really weaken your team's defensive core if it gets the chance to set up a swords dance. Even Flygon will be taking up to 69.1% from a swords dance boosted mach punch, so your revenge killer may not be able to help if residual damage has claimed about 60% of Flygon's health. Good luck.
  7. WillSO

    WillSO

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    Actually Machamp has always been an issue for this team, using a Lum Berry on my Metagross does nearly completely nullify the problem.
    I can't believe I'd totally ignored that possibility.

    Rotom did need the switch, a more defensive variant fits the core much better.

    Thank you very much for the rates so far, they've been positive and useful.
  8. Iminyourcloset

    Iminyourcloset Too fabulous to not be Leader. Srsly- &Closet rite nao plz
    is a Battle Server Moderator

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    this seems pretty solid, I wouldn't run both meoter mash AND bullet punch... I now im dangerously new, but whatev, right? I would put an elemantal punch on it, just for unexpected advantage. Also, im imagining my speedy magmortar can possibly take out a whole lot from your team ( if it wasnt used by me...) no offense, but I would either get an elemental punch, or Eq. Sorry, it's solid, but trying to put my thoughts out... :)
  9. 15fareed

    15fareed

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    This looks like a pretty solid team. Considering what the above people have said, there really isnt that much else. One thing worth mentioning though, is that you're probably better off running earthquake over meteor mash, since earthquake has superior coverage, and not to mention meteor mash's shaky accuracy. The attack increase chance from meteor mash might seem hard to resist, but as a suicide lead metagross will not be in the battlefield for too long, and B-pucnh will still do a fairly decent chunk of damage to pokemon weak to it.

    Although you did mention that you would like your lead to come back mid-game and cause havoc, so in that situation, meteor mash will probably be preferable as far as sweeping goes, as the STAB does make a difference. So go for meteor mash in that case.

    Hope this helps and Good Luck :)
  10. Boondocker

    Boondocker

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    Gengar and opposing shaymin can mess you up badly. Maybe a togekiss over rotom? You dont really need a spin blocker and flygon can always revenge gyrados. Shaymin can also hit it and suicune can bluff hp electric.

    I would run rest on shaymin to deal with sub roost zapdos. If not use a rest talk rotom.
  11. WillSO

    WillSO

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    I've been considering running an semi-offensive phazing Zapdos set over Rotom, thoughts?
  12. Kyogre

    Kyogre

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    I think this would be a good idea because of your weak against SubShaymin with Hidden Power Ice. You may have more problems with Machamp and Lucario as Lucario is afraid of your Rotom-W althought it's not faster and switchin in Dynampic Punches is much more difficult but with Zapdos and Suicune both abusing pressure you will be able to handle it.
  13. tomtom5858

    tomtom5858

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    Hello, my friend from across the sea, I came to pick apart your team. I failed. This seems like a fairly effective team, but MixVire via Gyarados destroys your team.

    First of all, Gyarados comes in, and grabs a couple of KOs by DDancing and attacking, then when your Flygon comes in, Electrivire grabs a Motor Drive boost from the TPunch. after that, it's pretty much good game, as it can take out most of your team with TPunch, Flamethrower, and Cross Chop.

    I don't know how to remedy this, as like Iminyourcloset, I'm very new, but still...


    That's just my two cents, good luck!
  14. WillSO

    WillSO

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    You're right, an Electivire predicting correctly will tear through my team.

    The only saving grace however is that even when Vire is at +1 Speed, Scarf Flygon STILL outspeeds and can KO with EQ.
  15. y4f

    y4f

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    I would argue that Electivire will in no way whatsoever tear through this team. Your Suciune and your Rotom are bulky enough to easily take a hit from it and either cripple back with Will-o-Wisp or KO back. Also, Vire won't generally OHKO Gross without a crit, and you can Explode. Needs to rely on 80 accuracy to hit Tran. and Flygon can easily revenge.
  16. WillSO

    WillSO

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    He scores a super effective hit on most of my team, providing that the team has been worn down by the opponent and Vire is used as a late game sweeper, he's definitely threatening.
  17. San_Pellegrino

    San_Pellegrino the eternal dreamer
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    Again, we have to look at the situation. Flygon can easily revenge kill, and rotom-w takes a mere 27.6% max from evire's flamethrower (A 3HKO for a rotom after SR damage). With a bit of predicting, it poses a small threat to your team.

    Also, in regards to your previous post about the zapdos, replacing rotom loses you a very important fighting and normal type resist. As the moment rotom appears to me as the glue of the team, with burn capability and ample defensives. In my opinion, Rotom needs and takes a big benefit from having pain split in hydro pump's moveslot. Yes, it loses a water attack, but with the likes of suicune and shaymin in your team, it's redundant.
  18. y4f

    y4f

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    Also consider running ResTalk Rotom with WoW and Thunderbolt / Shadow Ball, it can really annoy teams, especially seeing as how it completely locks down some of the most powerful offensive sweepers and cripples switchins. Having it around and as a status absorber that's not afraid of switching in to Toxic would be nice for your team. Having 3 Status Absorbers might be perceived as overkill, but I feel like having your antispinner and your main counter to Scizor + Flygon around as long as possible with full recovery capabilities is good.
  19. Sir Koopaman

    Sir Koopaman

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    Messages:
    89
    This is a very solid and well made team! Execellent job. Only thing is that I'd replace Toxic for HP Grass in case your Shaymin gets KOed.
  20. WillSO

    WillSO

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2010
    Messages:
    100
    Thanks for all the rates. I've not played too much with the bulky Rotom set listed above, so I'm very open to suggestions of what to try.

    @y4f, I'd actually like to apoligise for pretty much totally misregarding your argument.
    I'm far too lazy to run damage calcs and although I probably shouldn't, I do tend estimate how much damage things do purely on assumption.

    Can anyone suggest a Rotom EV spread? I found a relatively mixed spread on the EV analysis spread and decided it was probably a good start.
  21. DarthChocoboz

    DarthChocoboz

    Joined:
    Nov 26, 2010
    Messages:
    816
    Have you tried Offensive bulky suicune? Calmind Hydro pump + rest roar hidden power electric ice beam with lefties or life orb?
  22. Lamppost

    Lamppost I put the milk in first
    is a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2010
    Messages:
    1,092
    let me just start by saying f/w/g owns.

    in 4th gen i used f/w/g + rotom and peaked 22nd on the beta ou leaderboards.

    i really only have one major suggestion:
    on rotom change hydro pump for substitute.
    like you said if you want to cover trans weakness' your more than often going to be in a situation to set up a sub which a lot of times means a free will-o-wisp

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