The Counter Game

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Ok guys here is a silly game we can play to help us think of strategic playing in DP. I give a pokemon with EVs, moves, item, trait etc and you have to give an 100% counter to it. A counter has to be able to switch in to any of the pokemons moves and basically either make the original pokemon switch out, or kill it before it kills you. Here is an example:

Edit:
You guys apparently don't understand this game, and, because it's so obviously complex, I'm going to do a quick run-down for you.

You cannot have "filler" in a moveslot. You need to actually give a move. You cannot just name a Pokemon and then assume a moveset so you can come back later and be like "lol I outsmarted you because I actually had this set so I win!!!" If I catch anyone else doing that, you will be infracted.

The point of the game is not just to counter the previous Pokemon, but for the next person to come up with a counter to that Pokemon. If you have "filler" in a moveslot, the person can't possibly know what that move is, meaning they can't come up with a perfect counter. Seriously, did you guys even read the first post?

A few ground rules that I think we can all agree on are that if two people post at the same time, we just ignore whichever post comes through second. If a person posts a Pokemon as a counter but it isn't actually a counter to all the moves ("I see your CB EQ Gyarados and counter you with my Thunderbolt Raikou!"), then you give a reason for why that Pokemon obviously isn't a counter, and then give a real counter to the Pokemon they failed to counter.

Some rules that I think should be added are (and what follows is just my thoughts, I won't infract / insult you for disagreeing): 1) Don't assume Spikes, 2) Don't assume Stealth Rock, 3) Don't assume Sand Stream (unless the counter or countered Pokemon is Tyranitar / Hippowdon), 4) Explosion and Selfdestruct are not methods of countering, 5) "lol switch" is not a way to avoid being countered.

In my eyes, for the purposes of this game, a "counter" is a Pokemon that can switch into a Pokemon, and, assuming neither Pokemon switches, that counter Pokemon will end up with at least 1 HP, and the other Pokemon will be fainted.


Gallade (F) @ Choice Band
Trait: Steadfast
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Close Combat
- Psycho Cut
- Night Slash
- Stone Edge

Then the next poster should quote this pokemon and post a counter. For example

Spiritomb (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 108 Atk / 148 Def
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Shadow Sneak
- Pain Split
- Will-o-wisp
- Protect

Immune to Gallade's two most powerful, stab attacks. Has a stab super effective move that strikes first to gallades weakest defensive stat, its physical defense. Has will-o-wisp to halve gallades attack and can pain split or protec to recover. This is an example of a perfect counter. The next person would then have to counter this spiritomb. Get it?

Ok let's begin, the first pokemon will be a mixed electivire
Electivire (M) @ Life Orb
Trait: Motor Drive
EVs: 100 Atk / 156 Spd / 252 SAtk
Mild Nature (+SAtk, -Def)
- Cross Chop
- Ice Punch
- Thunderbolt
- Hidden Power [Grass]


Rules:
-No whining
-No moveslots like this tbolt/thunder/discharge/tpunch/return, decide on ONE move
 
give a moveset loser, ok to counter shedinja i say...

staraptor @ cb
-close combat
-brave bird
-return
-pursuit, now your shedinja is dead! good move asshat
 
Well, I was about to do that...anyway,

Tyranitar with Leftovers
Quiet Nature
Sandstream ability
evs: 252 HP / 68 Spd / 188 SpAtk
Substitute
Focus Punch
Dark Pulse
Ice Beam

I don't think an explanation is necessary...
 
what if i had focus sash (for staraptor)

also i dont believe sandstorm hits you on the first turn tar is in, so can't i just switch again with focus sash?

and if i survive, then that means you didn't counter me so i win?
 
Darn, I'm too slow...anyway, if it had a focus sash, we'll just use my counter. Anyway, for Staraptor,

Skarmory@ Leftovers (opening up something obvious, but who cares...)
Impish, max def and Hp, 6 in whatever
Drill Peck
Roost
Stealth Rock
Whirlwind
 

Lee

@ Thick Club
is a Top Team Rater Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnus
Yeah, Shedinja could switch, but it's still been countered, surely.

Standard Heracross can counter that Tyranitar nicely. Takes Dark Pulse and Focus Punch NVE and isn't threatened too much by Ice Beam. Can OHKO with CC or Megahorn. Lets say it's a Choice Scarfer too.
 
whats the whole point of listing things if we can just switch out? not to mention cb x-sissor does a shitload to tyranitar, so i wouldn't say thats all too dandy, now is it?

also did you know that with stealth rocks on the floor that shedinja after intimidate and swords dance, so +1, return will ohko staraptor, and with focus sash, won't die?

also skarm can't actually switch out as no shed skin so magnezone, but then again thats a whole different kind of counter!
 
Wow, looks like two counter games at once; we can't post fast enough...
Anyway, Aero, Ttar vs Shedinja by itself, even if Sheddy switches, it needs a Sunny Day/Rain Dancer to support it, which counts as a Ttar counter...so although Sheddy could run, without help, it cannot hide. And next time, please put a moveset for Shedinja, I merely thought it would be the scout/status Shedinja...with your innovative CB Sheddy, Ttar wouldn't be such a counter, but I could not be aware of that instance, correct?

Anyway, to clear these things up, let's just say that Aero's Magnezone is the current poke to counter. (meh, I knew this would happen, but whatever.)
 
It wasn't a great topic to begin with, but you didn't have to ruin it completely MoP.

To be moderately on topic:

Dugtrio@CB
EVs: Guess
Nature: Jolly (+Spd, -SpAtk)
-EQ
-Aerial Ace
-Stone Edge
-Sucker Punch
 
well wait, we cna't get to tar yet cause, although it survives, a cb x-scissor will do roughly 75% to the max hp tar, and if you take that much, can you really be called a counter? can we get a clear definition of what a 'counter' is here?

also the hera is scarf and the duggie is cb, isn't hera still faster and will most likely ko it?
 

Lee

@ Thick Club
is a Top Team Rater Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnus
I've always viewed a counter as something that can switch in without causing too much of a risk to itself, whilst being able to threaten or wall the opponent.

Tyranitar surely can't be viewed as a Shedinja counter as two of it's standard moves (Will-o-Wisp and X-Scissor) wreak havoc with him.

A good counter to Shedinja I guess, would be Yanmega as he doesn't care about WoW, has a decent defence value and can kill with Air Slash.
 

Stallion

Tree Young
is a Tiering Contributoris a Battle Simulator Moderator Alumnusis a Three-Time Past WCoP Champion
It wasn't a great topic to begin with, but you didn't have to ruin it completely MoP.

To be moderately on topic:

Dugtrio@CB
EVs: Guess
Nature: Jolly (+Spd, -SpAtk)
-EQ
-Aerial Ace
-Stone Edge
-Sucker Punch
You cant really switch into Dugtrio, so lets just say my previous poke had Beautiful Skin.

Suicune @ Lefites
Bold
252 HP/252 Def/4 Sp. Atk.

Calm Mind
Surf
Ice Beam
HP Electric

HP Elec just for smartasses who wanna switch in Poliwrath or Vaporeon :P
 
if you read the first post...A counter has to be able to switch in to any of the pokemons moves and basically either make the original pokemon switch out, or kill it before it kills you.

if you really need a counter to that shedinja (that you didnt even post a moveset for, idiot) to get to sleep at night hows this:

hippowdon @leftovers max hp max defense impish
earthquake
stealth rock
protect
slack off
 
can't i just send in a cb azelf with explosion? where does explosion fare in this kind of game? (suicune)

although if you were to do hippowdon and protect against shedinja to where it can't willowisp and dies to sandstorm, then you're also banking on protect to fail 50% next time if you ese azelf and expect explosion? but then you wouldn't know its so
 
*Sighs* sorry MoP, but you're right on one count: we can't get to Ttar. But that's because we've moved on. Let's just continue this before a mod decides to close this thread. About Ttar; I repeated, I was under the impression of a Scout Sheddy, not CB Sheddy. But to continue...

How can anyone seriously counter Dugtrio, since it cancels switches, and it sure isn't going to come into a flyer. In revenge, (best counter, I guess...)

Charizard@ Salac
Adamant, max speed, attack
Sub
Belly Drum
Fire Punch
Earthquake

I have an idea: how bout we all wait ~ 2-3 minutes before we start countering and stomping around, since we're all too ready with our keyboards, causeing too many counters and too many stepping on other ppl's toes...I think this belongs more on a gamefaqs board...
 

Lee

@ Thick Club
is a Top Team Rater Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnus
Dusknoir, Aeroblacktyl?

Anyway, lets get back on topic, lol. Hippowdon can't really take a Will-o-Wisp though! Give it a Lum Berry and we're in business.

Charizard@ Salac
Adamant, max speed, attack
Sub
Belly Drum
Fire Punch
Earthquake
Swampert@ Leftovers
Relaxed 252 HP 252 Def (not standard, but just for the sake of countering...)

Roar
Earthquake
Waterfall
Stealth Rock
 
are we seeing that every other poke aforementioned before is in that battle, of was this a straight 1 on 1 counter? Of course Zard won't work with that Hippo, and Ttar... But you try to "counter" that Duggy...Charizard is a decent Duggy "counter" IRL, I guess, but be my guest to find a true Duggy counter aero...

Sorry, but I think I'll have to disqualify myself for whining, but that's the TC's choice, and anyway, gl with your game.
 

Lee

@ Thick Club
is a Top Team Rater Alumnusis a Community Leader Alumnus
I don't think Charizard can be considered a Dugtrio counter because the chance of Dugtrio using EQ on the switch to Zard is zero.

The opponent can only switch to Charizard if the previous Poke had Levitate or Flying type, so why would Dugtrio use EQ on the switch?

If anything, he'd use Stone Edge to hit the flying/levitator that was previously in battle. Bye Bye Charizard.
 
Hmm, caught by my own words...I always was a crappy debater. Why would Dugtrio come in on anything that is levitating or a flying type? I guess in certain special cases, but that's pretty rare. Ah well, Charizard's a good revenger, which could be the closest thing to a CB Dugtrio counter, but if we want to discuss Duggy, and Wobbuffet counters to boot, barring improper use (sending Dugtrio into a flyer, or Wobbuffet into said Bellyzard)...
 
Sneak isn't SE to Gallade...anyway



Carnivine @ Ganlon Berry
252 atk 252 spatk
-energy ball
-crunch
-hidden power(water)
-natural gift

energy ball ftw
First of all, Shadow Sneak is a ghost move, so you're pretty much wrong.

For Carnivine:

Salamence @ Yache Berry (or the berry that reduces ice moves)
enough speed for 265, max attack, rest in HP
-dragon dance
-dragon claw
-fire fang
-earthquake
 
Shadow Sneak is SE on Gallade.

Anyways to counter Salamence:
Cresselia@Leftovers
enough for 404 HP, 350 in Def and SDef, rest in SAtk
-Rest
-Sleep Talk
-Ice Beam
-Charge Beam
 
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