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The Iron Fleet (peaked #10, 1864 points)

Discussion in 'BW Other Teams' started by vigi, Oct 30, 2012.

  1. vigi

    vigi

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2012
    Messages:
    35
    The Iron Fleet
    "We Do Not Sow"
    [​IMG]

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    Hey, vigi here again with my second RMT. After spending the second half of BW1 making unsuccesful team after unsuccesful team, I finally made a team that I'm proud of for BW2.

    I've reached #10 at 1864 under the alt Crow's Eye, and I believe I could have peaked higher if I had more time to ladder. I'm having a hard time improving this team from it's current point, and I've slowly lost my rank, so I'd like to share the team with you and hear your opinions.

    Team Building Process (open)

    The team began with the beast of UU, Rhyperior. Rhyperior is absolutely incredible in he current UU metagame due to his versatility and sheer strengh on both offense and defense. I chose CB Rhyperior as the base to the team for his ability to break physical walls, which UU has a lack of anyway, and for the prediction involved with using this tank.

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    CB Rhyperior's biggest issue is how difficult it is to switch him in. Originally, I wanted to use Sub BP Mienshao in order to give Rhyperior as much momentum as possible when switching in. After experimenting with the set, I decided that Scarf Mienshao would be superior due to his ability to capitalize on the holes Rhyperior punches through teams, while also being able to provide Rhyperior with a safe U-Turn into battle.

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    With 2 heavy-hitters on the team, my goal was to find a sweeper capable of cleaning up. Look no further than Sharpedo, the best physical late-game sweeper in UU bar none (you heard that right, Heracross). With near-perfect 3-move coverage, Speed Boost and terrific offensive synergy with Mienshao and Rhyperior, Sharpedo is usually the one to finish games for me.

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    At this point the team was very weak to Heracross (this was before Mienshao had the CS), and I was in need of some entry hazards. Enter Gligar, arguably the best Heracross counter and Stealth Rock user in UU. Does his job exactly as expected, which is exactly what you want from your wall.

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    Generally, you shouldn't have a special/physical imbalance unless you're using a hyper-offensive team. With 3 physical attackers and 1 physical wall on the team already, I needed a tank that can take and dish damage from the special side. Rotom-C, while being an unorthodox choice, provides me with exactly what I needed: a check to most UU Water types and another pokemon capable of creating momentum out of nothing, utilizing his relatively slow Volt-Switches to give me free switch-ins.

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    Here I first ran into trouble.
    I had no clue what to put in this slot. I knew, more or less, what's missing on the team: a specially offensive pokemon capable of checking Chandelure and relieving Rotom-C of some pressure.
    I chose an offensive Empoleon, which, apart from fitting the criteria, did nothing.

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    Being fed up with Empoleon, I was stuck again. Luckily, a Meloetta SubCM set came up on the forums and I tried it out.
    Needless to say, it performed much better than I expected. Meloetta's plethora of sets make it entirely unpredictable, thus giving me many opportunities to set up a sub and a CM or two. Although I miss the ability to check non-Specs Chandelure and the extra Water resistance that Empoleon provided, Meloetta's special bulk more than makes up for it, allowing me to set up subs on the Scalds and non-STAB HPs that plague this tier

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    Silence (Rhyperior) @ Choice Band
    Trait: Solid Rock
    EVs: 252 Atk / 164 Spd / 92 HP
    Adamant Nature
    - Earthquake
    - Rock Blast
    - Megahorn
    - Ice Punch


    As any reasonable UU player will tell you, you just don't mess with Rhyperior. You just don't. With the ability to 2HKO every single UU pokemon, all that's left to the user is to click the correct move! I'm kidding, of course: using CB Rhyperior has been quite the challenge: first, you need to switch it in, which is niegh on impossible due to his atrocious defensive typing. After bringing him in the match, you've got to predict your opponent: a wrong move, and you're down a pokemon. If you've managed to bring in Rhyperior safely and read your opponents, you can reap the fruits. Just as everything else about this guy, these so-called fruits are incredibly huge: watching with glee as even the bulkiest walls in UU shatter from the power of this mountain: 252/252/Impish Gligar? 80-94% with Ice Punch. 252/252/Impish Bronzong? 43-51% with Megahorn. The list goes on. In addition, Rhyperior provides a safe switch in to Darmanitan, Crobat and most versions of Zapdos. Max attack for max slaughter, 164 Speed Evs let me outspeed 0 Speed base 60s such as Empoleon, Porygon2 and Swampert, and the rest is dumped into HP to take neutral and 2x effective hits better. Forgot to mention: Solid fucking Rock.

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    Fingerdancer (Mienshao) @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Regenerator
    EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4 SDef
    Jolly Nature
    - Aerial Ace
    - U-turn
    - Hi Jump Kick
    - Stone Edge


    Mienshao has great offensive synergy with Rhyperior, drawing out slow, bulky walls for him to pound and in return abusing the pressure Rhyperior applies to said walls to clean up their ruined remains. Stone Edge catches most of Mienshao's switch-ins off guard, Hi Jump Kick is it's only viable move for neutral damage (I guess Rhyperior has made me a spoiled battler, since HJK is fantastically strong), Aerial Ace is for when opposing Heracross think they can just waltz their horns to victory.
    U-turn, along with regenerator, is the key to Mienshao's success: it supports the entire team with momentum and allows Mienshao to keep knocking up the opponent while taking minimal damage himself, opening up a sweep for either himself or Sharpedo. Mienshao acts as somewhat of a fail-safe to UUs biggest threats and also acts as a Toxic absorber when Gligar is down.


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    Black Wind (Sharpedo) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Speed Boost
    EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4 SDef
    Adamant Nature
    - Protect
    - Earthquake
    - Crunch
    - Waterfall



    If Rhyperior is the ace in my hand, Sharpedo is the ace up my sleeve. This torpedo-shark is slowly becoming one of my favorite pokemon in the tier, one of the 2 pokemon able to sweep entire teams with 0 support (the other being RD Kingdra). Sharpedo is usually shown twice per battle: once to lure out his checks and double switch, and twice to do his dirty work. Not much else to say about this bugger other than mentioning that the battle is not over so long as Sharpedo is alive and scowling.

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    Sparrowhawk (Gligar) @ Eviolite
    Trait: Immunity
    EVs: 252 HP / 244 Def / 12 Spd
    Impish Nature
    - Roost
    - Stealth Rock
    - Earthquake
    - Taunt

    Gligar does all you'd expect from a physical wall: stop physical threats, set up hazards and in Gligar's case Taunt. Gligar and Rhyperior can stall out LO Zapdos together, depending on the HP (this is shaky). Stealth Rocks are extremely important for granting those 1HKOs that Mienshao and Sharpedo desperately need, some 2HKOs for Rhyperior. In addition, they multiply Rotom-C's offensive capabilities (explained in it's section). 12 Speed EVs are used to get the jump on other Gligars. This is definitely a weak link in the team and I would like suggestions on what to change. (Crobat has been considered, but I prefer not to use him because my team is already too similar to kokoloko's "Strobe"...).

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    Maiden's Bane (Rotom-Mow) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 80 Spd / 176 HP
    Modest Nature
    - Volt Switch
    - Thunder Wave
    - Leaf Storm
    - Pain Split


    Rotom-C is the backbone of the team: it's typing, moveset and stats are all dedicated to support. It's support can come in different ways: spamming Leaf Storm to soften up the enemy, Volt switching for momentum, paralyzing threats for Rhyperior to have his way with later and switching in on every single Water type (except Specs Kingdra) in the tier. I usually try to keep Rotom-C as healthy as possible for as long as possible because it is my safest way to beat Waters which block Sharpedo's sweep. Stealth Rock are indescribably important to have on the enemy side for Rotom-C, as they allow it to spam Leaf Storm without fear of a Flying/Fire/Bug type sponging it up like nothing.Max SpA for, again, reducing the opponents HP as much as possible, 80 Speed EVs let me outspeed 4 Speed Arcanine/Xatu and all the rest is HP. A better spread is probably possible, but I'm not too good at assigning defensive EVs.

    [​IMG]

    Sea Song (Meloetta) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Serene Grace
    EVs: 40 HP / 252 SAtk / 216 Spd
    Modest Nature
    - Psychic
    - Thunderbolt
    - Substitute
    - Calm Mind


    Meloetta is the newest addition to UU, and a superb one: her versatility is rivaled only by Mew. Most Meloetta's I've seen are either mixed or fully physical, which is quite a shame because they miss out on Meloetta's combo of huge Special bulk and intimidating SpAtk. Calm Mind is the perfect move to abuse this: it lets Meloetta beat most special sweepers 1 on 1, and set up on walls lacking a physical move or Seismic Toss.Additionally, Meloetta is the perfect counter to another new star in UU, Cofagrigus, and checking the oldest star, Roserade. Her typing is a double-edged sword: on one hand, she can counter Cofagrigus, Mismagius and NP Mew(!), but on the other hand she is threatened by many Physical attackers such as Heracross, Krookodile and Sharpedo. This weakness is mitigated by Substitute: Sharpedo and Heracross are KOed after breaking the sub, and Krookodile can be scouted for what move he uses. Although Meloetta is my only special sweeper, she is the first pokemon I sac if the opponent lacks a Mew or Cofagrigus since she is more or less a luxury. Max SpA obviously, 216 Speed outspeeds neutral, max Speed base 85s such as Heracross, Nidoking and Suicune, rest is HP. Another (relatively) weak link.​

    Weakness:

    This team, being an offensive one, doesn't boast hard counters to as many prominent threats in the UU as I would have liked. Many pokemon, such as non-Choice Chandelure and LO Roserade require me to sac a member of my team in order to defeat them, but I'm okay with that. The biggest threat to this team is, far and away, Sableye. If Rotom-C has taken some damage, I have very few ways of dealing with him, since Meloetta gets Taunted and Recovered on and my 4 physical attackers get burned. If I feel that Rhyperior isn't needed, I will switch him in on Sableye (you heard that right, CB Rhyperior beats max HP/Def Sableye 1 on 1).


    Conclusions:
    I would like to mention how much I feel I've improved by laddering with this team. I am still learning the ins-and-outs of teambuilding and battling, and this team has sharpened my prediction by quite a bit. In a way, it's similar to my previous team: it's based on a wallbreaker that requires heavy prediction and support to use efficiently. Furthermore, I've had heaps of fun playing with it, and hope you will as well. Also, for those of you wondering, the team name and member nicknames are "A Song Of Ice And Fire" (AKA "A Game of Thrones") references.

    Importable (please keep the nicks) (open)

    Silence (Rhyperior) @ Choice Band
    Trait: Solid Rock
    EVs: 252 Atk / 164 Spd / 92 HP
    Adamant Nature
    - Earthquake
    - Rock Blast
    - Megahorn
    - Ice Punch

    Fingerdancer (Mienshao) @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Regenerator
    EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4 SDef
    Jolly Nature
    - Aerial Ace
    - U-turn
    - Hi Jump Kick
    - Stone Edge

    Black Wind (Sharpedo) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Speed Boost
    EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4 SDef
    Adamant Nature
    - Protect
    - Earthquake
    - Crunch
    - Waterfall

    Sparrowhawk (Gligar) @ Eviolite
    Trait: Immunity
    EVs: 252 HP / 244 Def / 12 Spd
    Impish Nature
    - Roost
    - Stealth Rock
    - Earthquake
    - Taunt

    Maiden's Bane (Rotom-Mow) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 124 Spd / 132 HP
    Modest Nature
    - Volt Switch
    - Thunder Wave
    - Leaf Storm
    - Pain Split

    Sea Song (Meloetta) @ Leftovers
    Trait: Serene Grace
    EVs: 40 HP / 252 SAtk / 216 Spd
    Modest Nature
    - Psychic
    - Thunderbolt
    - Substitute
    - Calm Mind

  2. DestinyUnknown

    DestinyUnknown in other words...
    is a Team Rater Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2011
    Messages:
    1,450
    Hey vigi,

    This team is overall very solid and it uses some original sets, which is pretty cool, but as you have outlined, it has some weaknesses that need to be ironed out. The first problem, that you have already noticed, are some special threats like Roserade, Chandelure and Raikou/Zapdos too, as Rhyperior can't reliably stop them with an offensive spread. I also feel that Meloetta isn't doing much for your team and ''it's just there'', so I would recommend using Choice Band Snorlax instead, as it lets you handle Chandelure and Roserade a bit better while still being a good offensive pokemon. Set:

    Snorlax@Leftovers | Thick Fat
    Adamant Nature | 252 Atk / 252 SpD / 4 Spe
    Return / Earthquake / Crunch / Pursuit


    Using Return or Body Slam is up to your preference, and I guess you could also use Leftovers on Snorlax but yeah, that's up to you!

    The other problem this team has is dealing with Sableye. There isn't much that can be done to solve this without changing the team a lot, but you could try using Shaymin (or Roserade, but it isn't as bulky and can't check Kingdra) instead of Rotom-C. Shaymin has the advantage of having Natural Cure, and being able to run an offensive set / spread while retaining the necessary bulk to switch into Kingdra and other water type pokemon well, and it also has a recovery move on Synthesis or Rest.

    Shaymin@Life Orb | Natural Cure
    Timid Nature | 252 SpA / 4 SDef / 252 Spe
    Seed Flare / Earth Power / Psychic / Rest | Synthesis


    Hope I helped!
  3. vigi

    vigi

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2012
    Messages:
    35
    Hey DU, thanks for the rate! Always love getting advice from top players.

    I've tried both your suggestions, together and alone. Snorlax is good, I'm using a Leftovers set with Body Slam and it works really well, especially considering it does what Meloetta had done but better.

    About Shaymin: It's a good alternative to Rotom-C, but I feel it changes the way the team plays out too much. Natural Cure is awesome, but I Volt-Switch makes the other 5 pokes better, which is irreplaceable. Hopefully it makes sense.
  4. Psylink

    Psylink

    Joined:
    Sep 9, 2012
    Messages:
    256
    Wow! Nice team you've got there! The synergy is fantastic! I, like Destiny Unown, think Meloetta should be replaced with an Agilty Porygon-Z set. You REALLY don't have a reliable lead, but sending out Porygon-Z first would help the odds. Agility would help immensly and you could be able to attempt an early-game sweep. That makes the team's job easier late game.

    But other than that, good team! Here's the Porygon-Z set:
    Porygon-Z @ Life Orb/Leftovers
    Trait: Download
    - Agility -Tri Attack
    - T-Bolt - Ice Beam/Dark Pulse
    EVs: 252 SpA, 252 Spe 4 HP
  5. vigi

    vigi

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2012
    Messages:
    35
    Hi Psylink, thanks!
    I don't believe in predefined leads in Gen V, since Team Preview makes them irrelevant
    (Although Mienshao could be considered my "lead").

    About P-Z: I was actually thinking of trying a "double-dance" (Agility/Nasty Plot/Tri Attack/???) type set to serve a similar role as Sharpedo.

    Again, thanks for the rate!
  6. Fantom0

    Fantom0

    Joined:
    Dec 28, 2010
    Messages:
    379
    Hey vigi, nice team and a strong position on the ladder you have there!

    You mentioned Gligar was a weak link on your team. I can see 2 solutions to this, which are either U-Turn or Toxic over Stealth Rock. Toxic will help you get some damage on pokes, whereas U-Turn could work as another way of getting Rhyperior in safely.
    Without SR on Gligar, I recommend SR on Rhyperior. It may seem odd having SR on a Choice pokemon, but since Rhyperior forces so many switches, it may be worth a try.

    That's all I can offer. Hope I helped!

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