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The Lost Art of Ubers Multi-Weather

Discussion in 'BW Ubers' started by Theorymon, Mar 16, 2013.

  1. Theorymon

    Theorymon AHHHH REAL GOOMBAS!
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    The Lost Art of Ubers Multi-Weather

    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]


    A common assumption among many players today is that using multiple weather starters on a team doesn't really work out. This makes perfect sense if you play OU this gen, because after all, stuff like Ninetales aren't used for anything but their kick ass ability. But believe it or not, this was not always a commonly held belief! If you look at ye olde Generation 4 stats from August 2010, you may notice something that seems pretty shocking!

    In Kyogre's teammate stats... Groudon is the 4th most common teammate! And even more shocking, Kyogre is Groudon's most common teammate! This may seem like a bizzare combo, but multiweather was actually fairly common last gen. It was a strategy that, instead of playing to a particular weathers strengths, was much more about using clever switching to screw with other weather teams, and to use the constant weather changing as a way to gain momentum in your favor. As a bonus, this strategy also benefited from the fact that Groudon, Kyogre, and Tyranitar were pretty awesome Pokemon!

    Of course, that was last gen. If you look at the most recent Uber stats for this gen, Multiweather seems to have lost a lot of its luster, as according to the Metagame Analysis, Multiweather was only seen around 7% of the time in February.

    While it may be a new (okay its almost 3 years old now give me a break) gen, I really wonder just how harsh BW and B2W2 really were to Multi-Weather... Sure, Team Preview is sorta a butt, but from my experience from the last few months of 2012, I'm not so sure that Muli-Weather truly deserves to be a lost art!

    So here's the deal: below here are the two most prominent examples of Multi-Weather duos. You'll notice that I skimp over a LOT of key details, and even leave some more obscure but viable duos out! But I did that on purpose, because I want to encourage some discussion and thinking here.

    This thread doesn't have a grand goal or purpose, we are just going to discuss stuff like how gen 5 changed this strategy, new variants you might think of, Pokemon who work well with this strategy, the best set combinations for the duos, and other stuff you want to mention. So just read the purposely vague descriptions of the two prominent duos, and say what is on your mind about Multi-Weather!


    Duo 1:

    [​IMG] + [​IMG]

    Unlike the lameness of Politoed + Ninetales, Kyogre and Groudon actually help each other out! Beyond the usual "use clever switches and weather changing to bring the momentum in your favor" tactic, Groudon takes those nasty Electric-type attacks aimed at Kyogre, while Kyogre laughs at feeble Ice and Fire-type attacks. Just be careful, they both share a grass weakness! Additionally, Groudon can fill in as your Stealth Rocker, and both Pokemon can support the other with a handy Thunder Wave. While Groudon's claim to fame is that strong Earthquake, you can put a fire move on it to help a bit against Ferrothorn. Also, there is one particular teammate that can work nicely with these two: good old dual weather Palkia! With both Fire Blast and STAB Surf, Palkia can often benefit from either weather! Just watch out though, if you use Thunder over Outrage, Ho-Oh is gonna be a pain in the sun.

    Duo 2​

    [​IMG] + [​IMG]

    Like Kyogre + Groudon, Tyranitar and Kyogre actually have some nice synergy with each other! With the awesomeness of Sandy Rocks, Specially Defensive Tyranitar takes most Thunders like a static shock from a rug. In return, Kyogre can take on annoying Water moves, and if you got balls, you can predict a Groudon switch in and make the sunny dinosaur think twice about staying in! You can also use Choice Band Tyranitar with Pursuit, as you can do stuff like deal a nice amount of damage to locked in Scarf Palkia, and even trap Latias, who often don't cary Grass Knot! You can try to trap Latios, but be careful, that thing carries Grass Knot quite a bit more often than Latias. Additionally, Kyogre can use the power of Thunder Wave to REALLY make Latias and Latios pray for mercy vs Tyranitar!

    Duo 3​

    [​IMG] + [​IMG]

    Hippo + Kyogre make for a really awesome defensive combo. Similarly to lousy's post above, running a specially defensive Kyogre alongside a physically defensive Hippo allows for two great tanks. The benefit of Hippo > Groudon is it's reliable recovery and sandstream. Although sun can hinder mons, sandstream forces mons like Arceus to have a harder time switching in due to potential SR and Spikes + the 6% of health it will lose. Ferro and Skarm both make for excellent partners to this combo due to their ability to work well in both weathers and lay their hazard of choice. Forretress can also work but I generally feel like you'll be getting more benefit from the former two due to their weaknesses. Poppy's team is a really good example of a Kyogre + Hippo core in case you wanted to check it out but are unsure where to start. by Faint
  2. Haruno

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    Thanks to new dreamworld abilities introduced this gen and a few select mons that are weather specific (excadrill, ferrothorn to be more exact) running multi weather isn't anywhere near as viable now as it was 4th gen.

    Ferrothorn, rain dish tenta are the two most common rain specific mons that were introduced this gen and are relatively common.

    Sun received regenerator ho oh.

    Sand received excadrill.

    In addition to that arceus is now a common and major threat to most teams unlike 4th gen because you can ev him properly which you couldn't do last gen.
  3. blitzlefan

    blitzlefan I remember it all too well...
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    Actually, if you look at the Dream World abilities from another angle, you see that a lot of them being dependent on weather can be beneficial. Having two forms of weather means you can screw with mono-weather teams no matter what they have. If you can win the weather war, then after their weather dependent mons are more easily dispatched, you can switch back to the weather that benefits you the most. For example, Kingdra in Rain is a big threat to Dragon-types, but in Sun, it's not nearly as big a threat and can be taken out more easily. Dual-weather teams are more versatile in this regard, being able to deal with twice as many team archetypes at the cost of losing "focus" (ugh... I'll think of a better word. the one I want is eluding me.)

    Say, if the opponent was a rain stall team with Ferrothorn and Tentacruel. If you switch to sun and take them out, you can use mons like Kyogre and Palkia much more easily. Kyogre can't usually deal with Tentacruel and Ferrothorn, but Tentacruel will usually lose to Groudon (if Groudon doesn't get burned by Scald) and Ferrothorn can be beaten with Fire Punch.
  4. lousy918

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    personally I use dual weather, the kyogre + groudon duo is really good.
    kyogre can take special hits really well, since I use a SDef spread, allowing to beat any special attacker that doesn't hit it SE, isn't kyurem-w or at +4. meanwhile groudon beats zekrom (I used an offensive spread to beat subhc variants as they 2hko at +1), roast ferrothorn and forry. ita drought is what's going for it, though without drought it'll still be good, but drought makes ferrothorn less annoying. in fact it's so annoying I kinda wish kyogre can get drought via dream world so I don't have to keep sending groudon in

    I also used the 2nd core before, didn't work too well for me though
  5. Hugendugen

    Hugendugen Noam Chompsky.
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    Dual-weather may be less used, but by no means do I think it's less useful. In fact the rise of specially defensive Kyogre makes it an even more viable pairing with Groudon, to handle Kyu-W/Resh, other Kyogre, Darkrai and the like. Latias's also helps this combination compared to BW1 by covering the shared Grass weakness as well as reinforcing the Water and Electric resists.

    As for the Kyogre + Tyranitar combo, one addition in BW that sets it apart from its DPP counterpart is Toxic Heal Gliscor. Not only does it resist Fighting and is immune to Electric and Ground-type moves, it takes advantage of a number of situations that the other two create. Gliscor's main function is to switch in on slower defensive Pokemon or ones locked into a move that it resists and use the free turn to sub up and wreak havoc with residual damage. Kyogre lets Gliscor take advantage of switch-ins like Ferrothorn or Zekrom, while Tyranitar brings in Excadrill, Terrakion and Skarmory as well as Sandstorm to increase the residial damage. Possibly its most useful trait however is how well it deals with Groudon, the third main weather inducer, by Taunting to prevent Stealth Rocks, and taking it down with Toxic + Substitute. Landorus-T can also perform a similar, albeit more offensive, role as well as setting up rocks and pivoting with U-turn.
  6. Faint

    Faint Valar morghulis
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    Since Theorymon already mentioned the very effective Tyranitar + Kyogre duo, I'll mention Hippowdon + Kyogre.

    Hippo + Kyogre make for a really awesome defensive combo. Similarly to lousy's post above, running a specially defensive Kyogre alongside a physically defensive Hippo allows for two great tanks. The benefit of Hippo > Groudon is it's reliable recovery and sandstream. Although sun can hinder mons, sandstream forces mons like Arceus to have a harder time switching in due to potential SR and Spikes + the 6% of health it will lose.

    Ferro and Skarm both make for excellent partners to this combo due to their ability to work well in both weathers and lay their hazard of choice. Forretress can also work but I generally feel like you'll be getting more benefit from the former two due to their weaknesses.

    Poppy's team is a really good example of a Kyogre + Hippo core in case you wanted to check it out but are unsure where to start. :)
  7. gookie

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    hugen is right in saying specially defensive kyogre pairs well with stealth rock groudon, but often time the pairing is not for taking advantages of either weather, but their attributes in being able to set stealth rock, tank, retaliate, and absorb status ( in the case of kyogre ). there is of course an added advantage in that sand teams probably won't stand a chance.

    kyogre + tyranitar sounds cool in theory (to trap lati twins or scarf palk), but provide very little defensive synergy. it /can/ work, but i think groudon + kyogre is a much more viable pair in terms of the strength of the team(s) you can build from it as a framework.
  8. Brave Bird spam

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    I really like multiweather in ubers because the weather inducers are really good on their own even without screwing with opposing dedicated single weather teams. Kyogre+ groudon is the core I've had most success with. Calm Mind+ roar kyogre sweeps really easily and groudon eliminates ferrothorn(which for some reason switches in fairly often) with fire punch. It's also funny how some people try(and fail) to eliminate both weather induces just so they can attempt a sweep with excadrill.
  9. Tobes

    Tobes Woo-hoo, woo-hoo, woo-hoo-hoo!
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    I particularly like the offensive core of Tyranitar/Excadrill/Kyogre/Kabutops. Excadrill and Kabutops have excellent offensive synergy since they're both countered by the same things, which are relatively easy to wear down by sacrificing one or the other. Between them it's also difficult to be swept by a fast offensive threat other than Rayquaza. Tyranitar also has some nice synergies with Kyogre, being able to remove Lati@s and maybe roast a Ferrothorn with Fire Blast if you can pull it off. It helps that you can run Stealth Rock on Tyranitar, because the issue with this core is how much it has to cover with its last two slots. You need switch-ins to Kyogre and Dragon-types. Ferrothorn is an obvious choice, but it can't handle a Choice Specs Kyogre by itself. Another Water-type resist is probably needed, but you also need something else that can handle Dragon-types (especially Rayqauza). Options I've considered in the last slot would be Grass Arceus, Ghost Arceus, Steel Arceus, Giratina, Giratina-O, and specially defensive Latias. It's a fun kind of team, but it felt too vulnerable to common threats to be really effective.
  10. trickroom

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    Tobes's combination is great, but it is sadly weak to things like Lustrous Orb Palkia. Sure, Excadrill can outrun it in sand, but that requires you to get in Tyranitar first which can be tricky. Kyogre gets Thundered, Kabutops can't OHKO Palkia, and Excadrill will be drowned. Of course, you can play around that with smart prediction.

    Bad news about Tyranitar + Kyogre is you don't like Shaymin-S, a threat who can take down Tyranitar/Excadrill/Kyogre/Kabutops if you mispredict. Scarf Shaymin-S also outruns Kabutops and Excadrill in the appropriate weather unless you are Jolly. It can just spam Seed Flare and kill someone. I think Steel Arceus or at least Roar Giratina is needed to check Shaymin-S.

    Offensive Groudon can also spam Earthquake and kill everyone including Kyogre who is 2HKOed by Earthquake. Giratina-O will make a great addition to the dual weather core. Something you won't enjoy facing is Kingdra, because it outruns Kabutops and isn't afraid of Aqua Jet. Great thing is Kingdra is weak initially if it is not running a Special set, Waterfall 2HKOes Tyranitar though and Kyogre is 2HKOed by Outrage.

    Oh, I almost forgot, Choice Band Zekrom will tear through Tyranitar + Kyogre with a simple Bolt Strike spam, as even Tyranitar is easily OHKOed after just SR alone. Tyranitar absorbs Thunders well but Bolt Strike will rip it to pieces, so Excadrill is an obvious partner, and Tobes mentioned it anyway.

    Groudon + Kyogre is a great combination offensively too. Groudon never likes facing Lugia because Stone Edge misses and you are unlikely to outrun Lugia unless you are the Rock Polish variant. Specs Kyogre can assist Groudon in smashing Lugia, defensive Arceus, and some Giratina. If Giratina goes physical, Kyogre can 2HKO it with Water Spout or Ice Beam, if it does choose to go Specially Defensive, Groudon can easily smashed it with +2 Earthquake, as long as you use Life Orb and have entry hazards support.

    If you like the more Defensive playstyle, Groudon is always helpful to check things like SD Arceus, Dragon Dance Rayquaza with the support variant. Why? Because Kyogre stuck on Ice Beam or Surf are setup on by both of those sweepers, Groudon can help phaze them out out, not a good solution but prevents them from sweeping.

    Groudon/Kyogre/Palkia does not enjoy facing Grass Arceus lol, but it's rare and it actually defeats all three of them, unless you get in Palkia in the right weather, sun for Fire Blast. I just feel that Tyranitar + Kyogre isn't that great offensively because Tyranitar is a slow ass and you never get to sweep with it. Dragon Dance sucks, Pursuit clears up Latias but you are also letting your opponent a free switch in next turn. Something like Terrakion can come in grab a boost and kill everyone, including Kabutops and Excadrill if it uses Rock Polish.
  11. Furai

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    I used the Kyogre + Tyranitar duo in my week 8 battle of SPL vs Faint, and it worked quite alright. Since Tyranitar is capable of trapping and removing Kyogre's checks and counters, namely Latias, non-Lustrous Orb Palkia, and Ferrothorn, this makes the duo a really solid Bulky Offense-ish path to go. trickroom is definitely right about Shaymin-S being a threat, but he beats pretty much any of those. Just pair your core with something like Dialga or Latias and you're good. Zekrom is a threat as well, but that's what I used Ground Arceus for, which also enjoys Tyranitar's removal capabilities of Lati@s. Specially Defensive Kyogre is one hell of a boss and fits on every Dual-Weather core. I'll add the Hippo + Kyogre core Faint wrote about into the OP.


    To finish I'd like to ask you guys if one of you ever used 3 weather. I know it seems extremely redundant, and it just might be, but I'm really curious to read your experience and opinions about it!
  12. Darknesscrusher

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    Hmm... I never really face multiple weathers, and when I do, they get squashed easily (just like most things on the ladder, though.). One weakness I see would be Scarf Ogre, as it can come in and kill most of, if not all, the weather setters. Scarf Ogre kills everything but specs ogre, wich makes it a present threath to teams like this.

    calcs (open)

    252+ SpA Kyogre Water Spout vs. 252 HP / 180+ SpD Tyranitar: 458-540 (113.36 - 133.66%) -- guaranteed OHKO

    252+ SpA Kyogre Water Spout vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Groudon: 654-770 (161.88 - 190.59%) -- guaranteed OHKO
  13. jackm

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    3 weather seems pointless unless the team actually appreciates the presence of all three inducers; that is to say, a TyraKyDon team would actually necessitate, for instance, a Specially bulky Pursuiter, a superpowerful nuke, and a bulky Stealth Rocker. If you would be better off replacing any of the inducers, you probably should.
  14. Darknesscrusher

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    Whereas this is true for OU, or any other tier, this is not always true in ubers. My team, for example, has Kyogre while I don't have any abuser. Scarf Ogre is jsut an immense force, that should be treated with care.
  15. trickroom

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    Darkness's calculations are wrong, they never factor in the appropriate weather.
    If it is in sand, Tyranitar actually has a chance of living Water Spout from Scarf Kyogre and Support Groudon will also survive in the sun.

    252+ SpA Kyogre Water Spout vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Groudon in sun: 324-384 (80.19 - 95.04%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    252+ SpA Kyogre Water Spout vs. 252 HP / 180+ SpD Tyranitar in sand: 306-362 (75.74 - 89.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
  16. jackm

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    You misunderstood my statement. I meant "if you have a motive for replacing any of the inducers because something else does its job better, you shouldn't let the fact that it's an abuser hold you back from doing so."
  17. Darknesscrusher

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    Ah, yeah, in that regard, you are right. Although still, having an abuser can be very useful, to counter other weather teams, for example. You did make a good point though.

    TR, you are right, but seeing that the scarfed Whale prefers to switch into something or revenge.
  18. Haruno

    Haruno

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    Assuming of course your opponent isn't running the same weather as your weather "counter."
  19. syrim

    syrim 1x1x1x1x1x1x1x1x1x1

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    The simple fact is that in general it's easier to build up moment through a single objective if you run one weather. For instance, only very situationaly is it better to use sand stream over sand force on a hippowdon paired with sp def kyogre.

    If I'm running a true stall core, things like Jirachi and Deo-d would be excellent fits, but they function much better in rain than they do sand. There can be some benefits, but usually if you build correctly you won't need them, and the single weather theme can let you do that. Like checking ho-oh poorly with a SS hippo, or having a really crappy answer to swift swim teams with SS hippo.

    A lot of the time the only real reason i can see using Groudon and kyogre together is when you desperately need to preserve your arceus form. But with the rise of Lando-t I would rather use a bulkier arceus form and Lando-t to fill many of the holes don does while still keeping a unified theme.

    That's the key point in my opinion, the ability to not only create a team that takes full advantage of your weather in whatever capacity it is meant to, while still having space to check opposing weathers. You can't use many of the metagames biggest threats in a reliable capacity if you don't plan ahead with your weather (palkia, Ho-Oh). The logic of "I have sun and rain, whatever check they bring will be weak to palkia/latios in one of these weathers" isn't good at all in the long run. It forces you to throw your setters around, and allows the opponent to end your momentum with one switch to the wrong type of weather setter. Many times it also forces you to run sub-par move sets (like a latios trying to use rain/sun to beat most of its usual checks).
  20. Adam Lambert

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    I really think Abomasnow should be mentioned in this thread. It is a great check to Kyogre, resisting all but one common moves Kyogre holds, Ice Beam, while also threatening this oversized orca back with Giga Drain, Grass Knot or even Leech Seed. Hail is also a very good weather to have in Ubers, because most teams are hindered from Hail, and cannot use this weather to their own benefit. Abomasnow is a great teammate for Kyogre and Groudon, as he resists what they are weak to, and he can also counter/check their counters/checks.

    I used a team back in Gen4 Ubers that used Abomasnow, Groudon and Kyogre, and I am proud to say this team was very successful. One thing I will say about using Hail in Ubers to make sure that when you send out your Arceus/Giratina-o, if you decide to use these mons, you should be sure not to send them out during Hail, Giratina-o especially, as they do not have leftovers to ignore Hail.

    The common misconception that Ferrothorn does not work on Sun teams upsets me greatly. People do not realzie that sun needs a working counter/check to Kyogre in order to be successful, and Ferrothorn does just that/ Ferrothorn also has another nifty utility in checking EKiller Arceus, if they lack Brick Break.
  21. Hack He Must

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    Well, I don't think that is entirely true. The reason sun teams don't usually use Ferrothorn is not because they don't know that they need a check to Kyogre, as a matter of fact, that is usually a big priority. The thing is that sun teams usually elect to use Palkia or Latias as their Kyogre switch ins rather than Ferrothorn, because they can sponge attacks from the specs set better. It's hard because the spots on an sun team are really strapped to something like: Groudon+Spinner(Magic Bouncer)+Ho-oh+Kyogre check+Scarfer+Arceus forme. IMO, it was always hard to fit Ferrothorn on offensive sun teams because it doesn't hold much momentum like Palkia and Latias, and defensive ones (okay, maybe just sun teams with Forretress) still wants a more solid check to specs-Kyogre. Also, since Groudon is prevalent on sun team, Ferrothorn's ability to check it is somewhat not necessary.

    For multi-weather, I believe it is viable for the reasons Hugen and others pointed out. Since Groudon is the ultimate support mon and Kyogre can never be bad, there is not that much hassle using both on the same team unless you add really weather specialized mons of course.
  22. Haruno

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    Assuming rocks isn't up and it comes in on scald AND kyogre isn't running 100 > speed ev's then yes it can threaten kyogre but more than likely that isn't the case. Hail isn't a good weather to have in ubers because most teams most likely including yours will not be able to benefit from it. Unlike sand you do not get any sweepers because of hail and unlike rain you don't cut bulky steels weakness to fire in half. Abomnasnow fails to counter/check groudon and kyogre's most used counter which is the lati twins.

    252Atk Abomasnow (+Atk) Ice Shard vs 0HP/0Def Leftovers Levitate Latios (+Def): 41% - 49% (126 - 150 HP). Guaranteed 3HKO.

    Even after sr damage lati@s can safely take the hit and ohko abomnasnow. If abomna being a counter/check for kyogre/groudon's checks/counters means that it just heavily dents the latis there are better options that can do the same thing without getting killed in the process.

    Completely irrelevant since gen IV =/= gen V. There are new/different threats/counters out there that simply did not exist in gen IV.

    No one ever said that ferrothorn didn't work on a sun team however Ho-oh does a much better job at checking/countering special attackers that threaten such teams than ferrothorn does since ho oh can both take hits and dish out damage when paired up with forretress another common groudon partner.

    How exactly does ferrothorn threaten/check ekiller in any way? Unlike forry it can't toxic and pain split to outlast arceus. All it can really do is use leech seed and try to stall while in the meanwhile ekiller will either switch to their own ferrothorn check/counter or proceed to get more boosts which will guarantee their win. This is assuming they're not running brick break by the way since if they are ferrothorn fails at even being a soft check to ekiller.
  23. Brave Bird spam

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    I think ferrothorn does work on sun teams, but in sun forretress is generally a better choice. Forretress is really the only spinner (in my opinion) that can function at its full capacity in sun so the vast majority of sun teams are better off with forretress. Using ferrothorn forces you to use a magic bouncer (or a much more niche spinner)because of ferrothorn and forretress's bad synergy. Also sun teams need all the extra teamslots they can get and forretress supplies a hazard layer and spinner in one slot but using ferrothorn forces you to use two. Imo as a general rule ferrothorn>forretress outside of rapid spin and tspikes but on sun forretress is better cause of spinning.

    On to triple weather. I haven't used triple weather that much so I apologize if I don't know what I'm talking about. I think the best core is tyranitar/ kyogre/ groudon. I still don't think it's that good though because I often find myself dedicating too many other teamslots to cover the huge grass and fighting and dragon(I don't trust tyranitar to soak up every specs DM) weaknesses. Also I don't really like tyranitar's performance in general, specially defensive is too weak to hurt anything outside of with SR, and band suffers even more from lack of longevity. I generally stick to using it on dedicated sand teams to power up excadrill but I guess it has its uses on other teams, I just can't get it to work :(

    On the topic of hail: I don't think hail is particularly good, I have used it and I find that I suffer from hail just as much as the opponent because there are so few viable hail-immune pokemon, and the existing one usually just aggravate type weaknesses. With a hail team you basically need a spinner and almost always kyurem-w as well because it's generally the best choice of the small pool of good hail abusers. Hail is just too hard to abuse and support in my opinion.
  24. puregenius

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    Ok so I got very curious when Furai mentioned triple weather, as I thought I had tested every single viable playstyle/pokemon in ubers (bar semistall, semistall can suck me off). Naturally, the core would be Kyogre, Groudon and Tryanitar. Politoed and Ninetails are complete crap, while using Hippowdon would result in type stacking, which isn't something to do unless absolutely necessary. Hail is very difficult to maintain even by itself so that was out of the question. The very first thing I noticed was ttar's trapping ability. Then I realised something even better: ttar can trap most of groudon and kyogre's checks. The three actually have good offensive synergy together. Latias, who is notorious for blocking even specs water spouts and being immune to eq and ohkoing groudon, is easy to kill with pursuit or crunch, especially if it is a gk-less variant. Latios is similar, but deals more damage. Palkia, another check can easily be trapped on a fire blast thunder, or even spacial rend. Even opposing kyogres, that come to revenge kill kyogre with thunder can be trapped. Psychics that wall groudon are all easily handled by ttar as well. Lugia, cresselia and claydol (the latter are uncommon, but still something is better than nothing) can all be forced into difficult situations with pursuit and crunch. Gira can still be a pain even with dark stabs because he can burn, so I was considering fast ttar, but it just loses too much bulk. Gira is just something to be dealt with by team mates.

    After much deliberation, I have concluded that the most effective offensive core is band ttar, scarf kyogre and offensive sr groudon. Since ttar can trap and kill so many of kyogre's checks, scarf kyogre is the most effective set to clean or revenge kill. Band is needed on ttar for power. After water spout, palkia is koed by by band pursuit (I'm on my phone so no calcs). Offensive sr groudon is the beat fit because after setting up rocks, necessary for most teams, he can throw around powerful earthquakes.

    Obviously when team building, you also have to cover the huge grass weakness, specifically grasseus and skymin. Scarf Kyurem-w and gene can revenge kill both. If skymin is scarfed, ttar can trap and 2hko with pursuit so it isn't a problem. Kyurem-w also can kill or force out gira, which is essential. Ferrothorn can be used for his x4 grass resist, but grasseus can just cm and stomp you. He is still good to check scarf ogre and spike, which is also needed. Latias is good as a general tank or sweeper and resists both grass and water. I'd also run a dragon resist, because I wouldn't trust ttar to take physical dragons or specs meteors from something like kyurem w. Steelceus is a good fit and functions pretty well in most of the weathers. Spdef gira works pretty well with this core as he can take grass and water hits quite easily. He also blocks spins, acts as a secondary ek arceus check and is immune to fighting for ttar. Ghostceus doesn't resist water or grass, but is still immune to fighting, spin blocks and most importantly kills gira that can block the core. He also beats gene. Skarmory stops ek arceus and spike, but you don't really need a hard wall for it because groudon is already a good secondary check and running stuff like genesect and ghostceus would keep you pretty safe. The final thing I would keep in mind while team building is something to stop ho oh, as ttar and groudon can be burnt by sacred fire, while kyogre taks heavy damage from brave bird. You could always run a cleric like Chansey (why doesn't latias get heal bell :/) who can heal status and can tank water and grass hits, which are predominantly special, as well particularly powerful meteors. Chansey, latias and jirachi all get special mention as they can pass wish to heal ttar so he can trap more opponents.

    But yeh triple weather is legit. You could even go more offensive with rp or dd groudon

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