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The New LC Usage-Based Threat List [PLEASE CONTRIBUTE]

Discussion in 'BW LC' started by Woodchuck, Jan 6, 2013.

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  1. Rowan

    Rowan not a professor
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    [​IMG]
    Murkrow
    Base Stats: 60 HP / 85 Atk / 42 Def / 85 SpA / 42 SpD / 91Spe
    Abilities: Insomnia, Super Luck, Prankster

    Role(s): Physical Sweeper, Mixed Sweeper, Wall Breaker, Late Game Cleaner

    Murkrow is an extremely popular Pokemon in Little Cup due to its ability to sweep, wall-break and beat many Pokemon such as the plethora of Fighting types, Grass types and many more. It reaches the coveted 19 speed tier and is very dangerous with a base stat of 85 in both offenses. With its great coverage it OHKOs or 2HKOs many Pokemon with a Life Orb mixed set containing Brave Bird, Sucker Punch, Heatwave and Hidden Power Grass. Occasionally it may run Drill Peck over Brave Bird or Dark Pulse over Hidden Power Grass to give it a STAB move without a drawback. Despite this set's power, it also faints very quickly due to Life Orb recoil, Brave Bird recoil and passive damage from weather and Stealth Rock. A Scarf set can also be used with the same moves as the Life Orb set. This allows it to out speed and check other boosted pokemon such as +1 Scraggy and Scarf Snover. These two sets utilise insomnia meaning it can switch into grass types like Shroomish and Foongus without worrying about Spore. Because Mixed Murkrow doesn't last long, many players opt for a more bulky SubRoost set with Substitute, Roost, Brave Bird and Sucker Punch. Prankster allows Murkrow to set up priority substitutes as well as being able to heal quickly whilst removing a weakness to Rock, Electric and Ice type moves. With an eviolite and a bit of EV investment in the defenses, this set has good longevity but it is easier to beat with many Rock and Steel type Pokemon. Finally, a parafusion set with Thunder Wave, Confuse Ray, Roost and Brave Bird or Drill Peck can prove to be a very annoying set to face, but it's generally not recommended due to its reliance on luck.
  2. FireMage

    FireMage Burnt out
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    I have Shellder written up on my other computer. I'll recheck it as it needs a few tweaks then I'll get it posted.

    (I'm re-reserving Shellder)

    Edited shellders onto my reservation post. it might need a few things added, but I'll roll with it for now.
  3. Rowan

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    Reserving Snover as Good Luck said he's not planning on doing it anymore
  4. Icicle Fissh

    Icicle Fissh

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    Sorry it's not in order, I wanted to start with something quite simple if this okay :)


    [​IMG]

    Clamperl
    Base Stats: 30 HP / 64 Atk / 85 Def / 74 SpA / 55 SpD / 32 Spe
    Abilities: Shell Armour, Rattled

    Role(s): Set-up Sweeper

    Clamperl was born to do one thing and one thing only: Shell Smash. When holding DeepSeaTooth, its signature item, its Special Attack is doubled. This means that, after a Shell Smash, Clamperl reaches a nauseating 68 Special Attack. Its speed is also doubled after using Shell Smash, so that it outspeeds almost the whole unboosted tier. Clamperl also gets Rattled from the Dream World, meaning it can nab a sneaky boost as it switches in on a stray U-turn, or other Bug, Ghost or Dark move, meaning it doesn't even have to attempt to Shell Smash to pull of a sweep. To top it all off, Clamperl gets fantastic coverage between a STAB Surf, Ice Beam and Hidden Power Grass, meaning only Ferroseed is safe from the wrath of this adorable mollusk. (Though do watch out for the very rare Hidden Power Fire.)
    Clamperl can also utilize the ubiquitous Eviolite. This makes setting up very easy thanks to its great 85 base Defense, and it also allows it to take some weaker attacks after setting up, despite its lowered defenses.
    Clamperl does not have many other options. DeepSeaScale, its other signature item, doubles its Special Defense. Alas, defensive Clamperl is outclassed, as it lacks reliable recovery, so expect not to run into too many of those.

    Walling Clamperl is almost out of the question (only Ferroseed comes close), so how does one go about beating it? DeepSeaTooth Clamperl's biggest weakness is priority, and luckily, priority is something Little Cup is well affiliated with. There are a plethora of strong priority users, like Croagunk, who can come in, then use Fake Out followed by Vacuum Wave or Sucker Punch to severely dent -1 Clamperl. Eviolite Clamperl worries less about priority, as it has enough bulk to take most priority attacks in the tier and retaliate, however, Eviolite Clamperl can sometimes be lacking in power, so some bulkier Eviolite holders can take a hit and retaliate, ending Clamperl's reign of terror.



    Not sure if it is any good or anything, (it actually looks a bit long for such a simple poke, now that I look at it) but I thought I would try my hand at this. :)
  5. Electrolyte

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    Calling Riolu

    [​IMG]
    Riolu
    Base Stats: 40 HP / 70 Atk / 40 Def / 35 SpA / 40 SpD / 60 Spe
    Abilities: Steadfast, Inner Focus, Prankster

    Role(s): Revenge killer, Late Game Cleaner

    Known in the upper tiers for its devious priority phazing through Prankster, Copycat, and Roar, Riolu works quite differently in LC despite it having almost the exact same set as in the other tiers. In Little Cup, Riolu uses Prankster and Copycat along with its above average base 70 Attack to turn the moves of itself and its opponent into powerful priority moves that can be used to effectively revenge kill or clean up late game. Because Copycat makes the user perform the move last used in the battle, and Riolu's Prankster gives its copycat priority, Riolu has the ability to snatch whatever move was used last and use it again, with priority. This allows for many clever tricks and plays that no other pokemon in the whole game can perform. For example, Misdreavus, who is a common switch in to Roar Riolu, can not defeat offensive Riolu because Riolu can Crunch as Misdreavus switches in and then Copycat that Crunch next turn for the 2HKO before the Misdreavus can react. If a weakened Murkrow kills a teammate with Brave Bird, Riolu can be brought in to Copycat that Brave Bird and revenge kill the Murkrow. With Protect, the mindgames get even more extreme. Riolu can bait a Drain Punch from +3 Scraggy, Copycat it, and KO back, preventing any sweeps despite being easily outsped and OHKO'd. Protect can also force your opponent to go last, so Riolu can copy whatever your opponent uses. Because Riolu has decent bulk with an eviolite, it can also often switch in to or tank neutral or resisted hits, and KO back. A great example of this is Riolu's unique ability to defeat Sand Rush Drilbur using this Copycat technique. Another awesome thing about Riolu is that it can clean up weakened teams because it can use its own Drain Punch as 'priority', effectively finishing off opponents, no matter how fast they are.

    Apart from using Copycat offensively, Riolu can also use Copycat to copy its opponent's support moves and use them to support its own team. If it switches in on a hazard laying Ferroseed, it can copycat the Spikes and lay down some layers on the opponent. Vice versa, if a spinner comes in and tries to spin away hazards, Riolu can copycat the rapid spin and spin for its own team as well. It can tank a Toxic and spread it, or it can take a Feather Dance and return it back. Because Riolu can copy almost anything the opponent uses, it can also be the ultimate support pokemon for its team.




    (it's long, but Copycat takes a bit to explain, so I hope it's still ok.)
  6. Good_Luck!

    Good_Luck!

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    A quick note: most Mienfoo don't run Mach Punch (I don't even think it gets the move). Maybe Croagunk with Fake Out + Vacuum Wave/Sucker Punch is a better choice.
  7. Icicle Fissh

    Icicle Fissh

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    You are correct, brain fart moment there, haha. Thanks for pointing that one out, fixed now.
  8. Axisotaku

    Axisotaku

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    I can probably do Frillish since I use him in my team

    [​IMG]
    Frillish
    Base Stats: 55 HP / 40 Atk / 50 Def / 65 SpA / 85 SpD / 40 Spe
    Abilities: Water Absorb, Cursed Body, Damp

    Role(s): Special Wall, Special Attacker, Spin Blocker, Support

    With his excellent typing, good bulk and reliable recovery, Frillish is able to wear down many threats in the current Metagame. With Eviolite, he can live things like Chinchou's Volt switch, Staryu's Thunderbolt and Misdreavus Shadowball. He can freely switch in on Mienfoo even if he might lose Eviolite from Knock Off. He can weaken BU Timbur since he cant recover from drain punch, payback can hurt but with some luck cursed body can kick in leaving him unable to do anything. Some might say he is outclassed by Misdreavus as a spin blocker, but with the added water typing, he can fit better than him on some teams that could need the fire, water and ice resistances. With good predictions, you can cripple many things that will make the life of your team much easier such as putting toxic on Chinchou,Porygon and Lileep that would want to switch in on it. He can also burn something with Scald or Will-O-Wisp. Even with his low speed stat he can also surprise the opponent with a choice scarf or life orb given his fair special attack.

    He does however still have his fair share of counters. Scraggy and Dratini first come to mind as they can shed skin the burn and setup on him. Ferroseed resist everything he has and doesn't mind the burn. Croagunk can also switch in freely on Frillish if he has Toxic. Chinchou's Thunderbolt can 2hko and most grass types such as Foongus, Shroomish and Paras can come in to spore. There is also Snover's giga drain to watch out for even if frillish can live it and hit back hard with Shadowball.
  9. Good_Luck!

    Good_Luck!

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    [​IMG]

    Diglett

    Base Stats: 10 HP / 55 Atk / 25 Def / 35 SpA / 45 SpD / 95 Spe

    Abilities: Sand Veil / Arena Trap / Sand Force

    Role: Revenge Killer.

    Two words come to mind when looking at Diglett: Fast and Frail. Diglett is one of only three Pokemon able to hit the 20 Speed tier and the only one of them used consistently. This means that Diglett is able to outspeed every unboosted Pokemon not holding a Scarf. It's the combination of speed and its ability, Arena Trap, that makes Diglett the ultimate Revenge Killer in Little Cup. Arena Trap prevents any grounded Pokemon from switching out and with its usable Attack stat and STAB Earthquake to hit those grounded Pokemon, Diglett is capable of dispatching an enemy or two before going down. Even Flying-types and Levitate Pokemon have to be careful around Diglett as it achieves perfect coverage with Rock Slide and either Shadow Claw or Pursuit. Sucker Punch is also an option if, for some reason, you need to kill an scarfed opponent like Snover. The most common sets usually run Life Orb to secure KOs on the opponent but it can also run a Focus Sash to alleviate its pathethic bulk and survive at least one hit. Even at low health, Diglett is capable of supporting its teammates with Stealth Rock or let a boosting partner come in easily after Diglett uses Memento. Substitute is also a good option as it acts as a defense against status or one strong attack. In the end, however, Diglett is one of the frailest attackers in the tier so don't expect it to live more than two hits.
  10. TPM

    TPM

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    [​IMG]
    Larvesta

    Base Stats: 55 HP/ 85 Atk / 55 Def / 50 SpAtk / 55 SpDef / 60 Spe
    Abilities: Flame Body / Swarm
    Roles: Bulky Attacker, Pivot, Scout

    Despite its massive Stealth Rock weakness, Larvesta can really pull its wait on a team. It can easily check any Fighting type that lack Rock-type attacks, and deter most physical attackers with the threat of a burn from its incredibly useful ability Flame Body. On top of that many players run Will-o-Wisp to ensure a burn on physical threats. While 55 across the board may not seem like ideal defensive stats, with Eviolite and the semi-reliable recovery move Morning Sun Larvesta becomes a rather bulky bug. Larvesta is not all about being on the defensive though; Larvesta’s true power lies in its huge attack stat; reaching 19 with a positive nature and max EVs. From that stat it can fire off incredibly powerful STAB Flare Blitzs that will seriously dent anything that does not resist it. Additionally, it gets STAB on U-Turn, which can turn it into a deadly scout. Some players even opt to use Choice Scarf Larvesta for the aforementioned scouting ability, as well as to revenge kill things with that powerful Flare Blitz. Wild Charge often rounds off Larvesta’s attacking moves, allowing him to hit Water types that resist his main STAB. One must be careful when using Larvesta though; Stealth Rocks and the recoil from his attacks can cause him to quickly tear himself down. Still, if you can afford a Rapid Spinner on your team (Staryu makes a great partner to the firebug) Larvesta is a great defensive and offensive threat.

    Quick write-up. Hope it doesn't look too bad.
  11. blarajan

    blarajan i was born under the same star as shakeitup
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    Just so you know, while we haven't reviewed the submissions yet for quality corrections, we appreciate the contributions and will give them the reviews they deserve soon.
  12. Good_Luck!

    Good_Luck!

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    [​IMG]

    Tentacool

    Base stats: 40 HP / 40 Atk / 35 Def / 50 SpA / 100 SpD / 70 Spd

    Abilities: Clear Body/Liquid Ooze/Rain Dish (DW)

    Roles: Rapid Spin user, Support

    Tentacool is one of the most useful pokemon in LC tier. Its access to support moves like Knock Off, Toxic, Toxic Spikes, and Haze along with its excellent Special Defense makes it one of the few usable Rapid Spin users and the only one who performs a defensive role. Its typing is very good as it grants it a resistance to common Fighting- and Water-type attacks as well as a useful resistance to U-turn making it a hard wall to Mienfoo, Larvesta and other physical attackers. Tentacool can also use Scald to burn those physical threats and further boost its defensive capabilities. With so many draining attacks like Drain Punch and Giga Drain in LC, Tentacool's unique ability Liquid Ooze gives it a formidable niche at stopping those threats who rely on the healing from those moves to keep a sweep going. It is also the only Water-type who can comfortably switch into Snover and prevent it from spamming both of its STAB moves while also threatening it with a Super Effective STAB Sludge Bomb. All in all, Tentacool is a formidable threat even with Ground-type moves being so common.

    ...

    Idk, it seems a little oversold...

    Edit: Added, thank you MeteorMiss.
  13. MeteorMiss

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    Make sure you add that it counters snover.
  14. Valafar123

    Valafar123

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    Most fire attackers seem to pack electric moves so I'm not really sold on Tentacool.

    It's still a very nicely balanced pokemon with a lot of utility and can do a lot of work with its massive supporting move pool.

    I also learned that Liquid Ooze works on Leech Seed too, so that's an added bonus.
  15. Rowan

    Rowan not a professor
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    [​IMG]
    Base stats: 60 HP / 62 Atk / 50 Def / 62 SpA / 60 SpD / 40 Spd

    Abilities: Snow Warning/Soundproof (DW)

    Roles: Revenge Killer, Hail Setter

    Snover is one of the most used Pokemon in a Little Cup for a very good reason — its ability, Snow Warning, which summons permanent Hail meaning Sand teams are a lot easier to handle. With a Choice Scarf, Snover outspeeds Drilbur and Sandshrew when Hail is up and can OHKO them both, putting a stop to the "Double Rush" strategy. The Choice Scarf set is the set you will see the majority of the time. Despite Snover not having a fantastic Special Attack stat, having access to a 120 power move in Blizzard that is 100% accurate in Hail means it can still deal a lot of damage. Giga Drain will always be used as well making it a good check to Water-types. Ice Shard is a useful priority which bypasses Sucker Punch from the likes of Murkrow. Snover's final move will mostly be a Hidden Power. Hidden Power Fire is often used to hit Magnemite, Pawniard and other Steel-types on the switch-in and Hidden Power Rock is often used to hit Fire-types like Larvesta and Houndour on the switch. Hidden Power Ground is another option which hits both Fire-types and Steel-types but leaves it vulnerable to Bronzor and Larvesta. Snover will occasionally run an Eviolite instead of a Choice Scarf. This allows it to bluff a Choice Scarf often netting it a surprise kill on an unsuspecting Water-type thinking Snover is locked into Blizzard. However it is out-sped by Drilbur even during Hail so it is less-effective at beating Sand teams in general.
  16. Charmander

    Charmander mfw i have a mane and am actually the sun
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    The biggest one, Larvesta, usually doesn't carry Wild Charge. Houndour doesn't either lol. Ponyta's Wild Charge isn't even that strong unless it's LO or something. That isn't really the point though; being able to Rapid Spin, check Snover really well, set up Tspikes, and get rid of Eviolite through Knock Off is an amazing niche. If Tentacool got recovery it would probably be top tier, but it's still good nonetheless. I don't know why you wouldn't be "sold on it".
  17. Valafar123

    Valafar123

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    It just seemed a little underwhelming when I was on the other side of it.

    That's not to say I don't think it's very good. It's just not something I would consider without a metagame shift to a more special spectrum.
  18. Rowan

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    reserving magnemite
  19. Goddess Briyella

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    Scraggy 2HKOs Eviolite Mienfoo and Timburr with Zen Headbutt after a DD, factoring in opposing Drain Punch recovery. Also it 2HKOs Eviolite Riolu and deserves a special mention in this role due to making Copycat useless in copying Zen Headbutt as it does nothing to Scraggy. Scraggy can take on every Pokemon in LC after a DD except Eviolite Roariolu, for obvious reasons. The only thing in LC that is a complete stop to Scraggy is Brave Bird from Scarf Murkrow or another Scarfed Flying type such as Doduo. But after two Dragon Dances, Scraggy outspeeds all Scarfers. After a DD Scraggy can actually take down Sash Abra (Drain Punch can be used to 2HKO and recover a ton of health despite the resistance) and OHKO Misdreavus and Gastly with Crunch. Lileep and Bronzor are setup bait for Scraggy and the game is often won when he comes in on them. I hope my additional info is helpful. ^_^
  20. dcae

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    I'd like to reserve Dwebble seeing as no one has done it yet. Well here it is:


    Base Stats: 50 HP / 65 Atk / 85 Def / 35 SpA / 35 SpD / 55 Spe​

    Abilities: Sturdy/Shell Armor/Weak Armor(DW)​

    Roles: Spike Lead, Shell Smasher​

    Dwebble is a fun little pokemon that has great utility in LC. Dwebble is a top 20 used pokemon in LC right now, and for good reason. Dwebble has an excellent lead movepool, with access to Spikes and Stealth Rocks, and has decent speed to pull it off. Helping him as a great lead is Sturdy, which allows him to practically guarantee a layer of hazards up. Another boon is that Dwebble has Rock Blast, which paired with its decent attack stat, allows it to break lots of other Sturdy users or Substitute users.This sheer utility provided by Dwebble allows him to be a great option for lead. However, Dwebble is not merely limited to a supporting role: it has access to one of the most broken setup moves in the game: Shell Smash. This grants Dwebble a niche as a Smasher, along with others, like Clamperl, Tirtouga, etc. What makes Dwebble stand out among these others is its much higher speed, which makes it much harder to revenge kill. It is only outclassed in this role by Tirtouga, but Dwebble's higher speed and the fact that it could be considered a lead set allow it to be a great Shell Smasher. The surprise factor of a Shell Smash set often nets a free Shell Smash, and thus with the great offensive STABs it can proceed to wreak havoc. It can give great coverage in its two sets, able to run Earthquake to get the infamous EdgeQuake coverage. Overall, Dwebble is a dangerous threat and pokemon in the LC metagame, and definitely one that you should try out or be wary of!​
  21. Rowan

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    http://www.smogon.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4537511&postcount=6
  22. Organization Member XIV

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  23. Electrolyte

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    [​IMG]
    Shroomish

    Base stats: 60 HP / 40 Atk / 60 Def / 40 SpDef / 35 Spe

    Abilities: Effect Spore / Poison Heal / Quick Feet (DW)

    Roles: Physical Wall, Support, Tank

    What makes Shroomish stand out from amongst the other Grass types in the tier are its magnificent mono-grass typing, its balanced defenses, and awesome support movepool. This makes it one of the best Sand walls in the whole LC metagame, as it resists Ground, can shut down opposing sweepers, and is quite bulky when equipped with an Eviolite. Spore is one of the biggest assets to Shroomish- as it is an awesome, 100% accurate sleep move that few other pokemon besides itself recieve. This lets Shroomish shut down virtually any opponent it can outspeed or sponge a hit from- not only supporting its team but also making it tough to take down. Its cool ability in Poison Heal just makes it all the more effective- not only making it immune to Toxic, the only status move most Sand walls carry, but also making it heal from Toxic, making it last even longer. With a balanced defensive spread of 60 / 60 / 60, Shroomish can easily wall Drilbur, Sandshrew, and Hippopotas, and even shut down / outstall Lileep with Toxic. If any team needs a good answer to Sand, Shroomish is one of the best there is.

    Shroomish's best set is definitely its bulky Eviolite set- which walls Sand teams to no end and even has utility against weatherless / hail teams too. It has a moderately quick Spore / Toxic, letting it shut down offensive / defensive pokemon respectively, and with its decent base 40 SpA it can whittle opponents down with Giga Drain too (especially Drilbur / Hippo / Sandshrew / Water types.) With smart play, it can also help its team absorb Toxic, and then continue acting as a status sponge. Its great Grass typing let it defeat Ground, Water, and Electric types fairly easily. Another rarer set is the SubSeed set. While it may not have as much bulk as the Eviolite set, it has a lot more utility. It is a very reliable status sponge because it always carries Toxic Orb to help let it grab healing using Poison Heal, and with a mix of Substitute / Protect it can easily defeat opponents by stalling with Leech Seed. This set takes a longer time to deal damage, and is not as reliable as acting as a tank, however, it can still deal a lot of gradual damage, and once it gets started it is increasingly hard to stop.
  24. ABfloww

    ABfloww

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    Reserving Porygon.
  25. Rowan

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    I did Magnemite. Reserving Foongus

    [​IMG]
    Magnemite

    Base stats: 25 HP / 35 Atk / 70 Def / 95 SpA / 55 SpD / 45 Spd

    Abilities: Magnet Pull/Sturdy/Analytic (DW)

    Roles: Steel Trapper, Special Attacker, Revenge Killer

    Magnemite has quite a few positive traits which make it a good choice for many Little Cup teams. First off is its fantastic base 95 Special Attack which means it can reach 20 Special Attack with a positive nature. Next is its ability, Magnet Pull, allowing it to trap and remove Steel-types allowing a team mate to sweep easier. Its typing also makes it a great counter to Murkrow that lack Heat Wave and other Flying types. Finally, Magnemite works well on sand teams as it can beat Lileep, Snover and Bronzor, three of the most threatening Pokemon to Drilbur.

    Magnemite has two common sets which you might see; a bulky Eviolite set and a Choice Scarf set. The first is excellent at trapping Steel-types as it uses Magnet Rise which allows it to avoid Earthquake from Bronzor and kill it with Hidden Power Fire. This also can be used as a Ground-types like Drilbur or Hippopotas switch in, allowing Magnemite to beat many of its counters. The set will also use Volt Switch and Flash Cannon, the former is a powerful STAB that gains momentum, whilst the latter is a solid move to use against Lileep, Snover and it deals decent damage to Ground-types. The Choice Scarf set, whilst similar on paper, plays rather differently. Most of the time it will spam Volt Switch which is an incredibly effective strategy against teams that lack Ground-types or Chinchou. It will also carry Thunderbolt as an Electric STAB that is slightly more powerful that it can clean late-game with. Flash Cannon is a secondary STAB to hit Ground-types with, and Hidden Power Fire will be used to beat Ferroseed. The Choice Scarf set is very effective as it outspeeds and OHKOs Mixed Murkrow making it a better check to Murkrow than the Eviolite set.
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