The Next Best Thing - Spiritomb [Voting]

Discussion in 'BW RU' started by Silvershadow234, Mar 30, 2013.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. Silvershadow234

    Silvershadow234 :]]]]]
    is a Pre-Contributor
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2012
    Messages:
    695
    Credit to fatty for the OP. Banner by skylight.

    The Next Best Thing

    [​IMG]
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    What is this?:

    I for one, along with many others I'm sure, feel as though there is some untapped power within the RU environment. There is substantial evidence for this idea in the form of one commonality for most tiers, RU included: there always seems to be one or more new-fangled, hyped up sets that weren't originally main-stay or seen as "viable" by the community, but somehow has taken the metagame by storm. This can be seen in DPP OU (with Special Lucario transitioning to SD Lucario, Heatran eventually running items other than Choice Scarf, and the influx of ChestoRest Kingdra) in ADV (with the vaunted TyraniBoah now becoming almost an urban myth in comparison to Special and DD Tyranitar, and the increasing popularity of SupeRachi) and in BW OU (with the advent of SubSalac Terrakion, SubDisable Gengar, and ChestoRest Volcarona). Yes, some of these sets may have been found early on with respect to the creation of the tier or fairly recently, the point is, though, that there seems to be an endless supply of effective and potent sets out there yet to be discovered, especially factoring in metagame swings and the possible tier shifts. The purpose of this project will be to systematically subject each and every RU pokemon to a collective body of research in an attempt to uncover these "hidden gems", so to speak, and hopefully spark some creativity throughout the RU community.

    The Process:

    Each week, I will choose a different RU Pokemon, sometimes chosen by random, sometimes chosen by curiousity, of which participants will try to personally create a new set for that is not already on-site or in the process of being put on-site. Participants will be given 5 days to create their set, with discussion about the particular sets being promoted throughout, and on the 6th and 7th day of the week, a vote will be held to choose which user's set represented the most creative and simultaneously competivitely viable set to utilize in the current RU metagame. Once the votes are tallied and a winner is crowned, the set will be archived in the OP and the process will start all over again for the next pokemon specimen.

    What are we looking for?:

    Specifically, I want to stress the importance of the balance between creativity and viability when picking a set to post for the Pokemon in question. There's a very fine line between a "creative" set and a "gimmick", and this project is not meant to produce gimmicks, rather emphasize the ability to think outside the box when using a specific Pokemon in order to maximize it's potential. Having said that, I would also like to deviate from simple one move / item changes. For example, using Lum Berry over Life Orb on an SD Absol does nothing to show any untapped potential Absol has because we already have a basic understanding of what SD Absol is and does, it's just now better at dealing with status and has less power. The same goes for using Return over Pursuit on CB Escavalier, it doesn't yield productive discussion or results for the project. I am looking for sets that test what we think we know about checks or counters, so-called standards, and what it means to be viable. Maybe a particular option for a Pokemon looks inferior at first glance for that particular pokemon, but dig deeper and try and find what it might mean in the big picture, for the entire team.

    Some things to consider:
    • What is thought to "counter" this pokemon?
    • Is there anyway to bypass this pokemon's so-called "counters?
    • What moves are seldom used on this pokemon, but have the most upside?
    • What niches can this pokemon potentially fill in the current metagame?
    • What opposing pokemon does this pokemon do well against?
    • How can this pokemon benefit its teammates?
    Hall of Fame:

    Show Hide


    This week's pokemon will be:
    [​IMG]
    Spiritomb

    So what sets can spiritomb run to beat its normal checks / counters? What sets have you found that are great but not already on site? If you do know a cool set for spiritomb, then get posting!
  2. Molk

    Molk idk
    is a Tutoris a Smogon IRC AOPis a Forum Moderatoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Community Contributor Alumnus
    RU Leader

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2011
    Messages:
    2,984
    [​IMG]
    Rotom-Mow @ Chesto Berry
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 48 HP / 252 SAtk / 208 Spd
    Modest Nature
    - Volt Switch
    - Leaf Storm
    - Thunderbolt / Hidden Power Fire
    - Rest

    I think Chestorest Rotom-C is a pretty good option in this metagame. While other Rotom-c sets such as Choice Scarf are great scouts and are excellent at grabbing momentum/revenge killing/checking certain threats, they often struggle with being worn down over time due to their lack of recovery and repeated Stealth Rock damage, this is where Chestorest comes in. When Rotom-c is worn out from repeated attacks and Stealth Rock damage mid to late game, it can use Rest to fully restore its hp and remove any status the opponent might've inflicted on it earlier, greatly increasing its longetivity. Thanks to the lack of Life Orb recoil or Leftovers recovery, Chestorest Rotom-c is also incredibly good at bluffing a choice set, making it an exceptional lure for bulky Ground-types such as Rhydon who may want to switch in on Rotom-c expecting it to be choiced, only to be murdered by a surprise Leaf Storm the next turn. The EVs i chose on this set allow Rotom-C to outrun neutral natured base 80's and below, most notably Kabutops, but more speed or bulk can be run if you think you need it.
  3. GOthee

    GOthee

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2013
    Messages:
    56
    [​IMG]
    Rotom-Mow @ Leftovers
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Modest Nature
    - Will-O-Wisp/Thunder Wave
    - Volt Switch
    - Substitute
    - Leaf Storm

    In my opinion this is Rotom C best set. Comparing it to his choice sets they can get outclased by other special attackers, but this set is a mix of offense moves and support moves. Lefties help with Rotom survival and make sit a much harder poke to wear down. I like this more over the chesto ret set because late game even when you have him low and then rest, A high hp Rotom w without a choice wont do much for the team late game, and if you played him well he should be healthy thanks to avoiding status with substitute and lefties recovery. This set might not be good at bluffing a set, but it can produce a lot of switches , making it an exceptional lure for bulky Ground-types such as Rhydon who may want to switch in on Rotom-c expecting it to be choiced, only to be murdered by a surprise Leaf Storm the next turn. The EVs i chose on this set allow Rotom-C to outrun neutral natured base 80's and below, most notably Kabutops, but more speed or bulk can be run if you think you need it.
  4. PTJon7

    PTJon7

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2012
    Messages:
    552
    This is is pretty much the only boosting set Rotom-C could run:

    Rotom-Mow @ Life Orb/Leftovers
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Modest Nature
    - Leaf Storm
    - Thunderbolt
    - Charge Beam
    - Substitute

    Obviously Charge Beam is the point of this set, and a 70% percent change to boost SAtk is nothing to laugh at either. Thanks to its interesting typing & ability getting a Substitute up often isn't very hard, and when behind a Sub the boosting then commences. I wonder if a more defensive spread like 252 HP / 4 SAtk / 252 Spe would aid it at all however.
  5. Silvershadow234

    Silvershadow234 :]]]]]
    is a Pre-Contributor
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2012
    Messages:
    695
    K I'm going to start voting in a few hours, so if you have a cool set for rotom-c then post it soon pls
  6. complete legitimacy

    complete legitimacy one for the future
    is a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2011
    Messages:
    1,037
    [PIMG]500[/PIMG]
    Rotom-C @ Expert Belt
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 20 HP / 252 SAtk / 236 Spd
    Modest Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
    - Volt Switch
    - Leaf Storm
    - Thunderbolt
    - Hidden Power [Fire]

    All right, Expert Belt Rotom-C has pretty much been the new standard Rotom-C in higher level play, and rightfully so. Scarf Rotom-C has always been a waste of Rotom's potential in my opinion, as it's pretty bulky, sits at a nice Speed tier anyway, and has great coverage with its STABs and HP Fire. Because Rotom-C has always been commonly seen as a Choice Scarf user in the past, this means that it tends to lure out resists to one of its STAB moves, namely Volt Switch or Thunderbolt. Lanturn, Rhydon, Ferroseed, and others are all lured out to take a Volt Switch, but they get smacked by Leaf Storm or HP Fire after "predicting" the Electric-type move. Anyway, this set has been used for a while, but it's kinda become a little more prepared for now, so it's lost its effectiveness a bit. Of course, this means that you can now bluff Expert Belt with Choice Scarf. However, against your average everyday ladder player this set still has a ton of surprise value and eliminates Electric resists very easily, allowing Rotom to just spam Volt Switch later. I'd personally use Modest because nothing around base 80 Speed uses positive natures commonly, but Timid is also good so you can be sure that you outspeed Kabutops among other things.

    While it would seem that this set could be outclassed by the ChestoRest set that Molk posted, the extra damage output gained from Expert Belt can actually be really important.

    Calcs (open)

    252+ SpA Expert Belt Rotom-C Leaf Storm vs. 248 HP / 116+ SpD Slowking: 391-463 (99.49 - 117.81%) -- 93.75% chance to OHKO
    252+ SpA Rotom-C Leaf Storm vs. 248 HP / 116+ SpD Slowking: 326-386 (82.95 - 98.21%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    252+ SpA Expert Belt Rotom-C Leaf Storm vs. 40 HP / 216+ SpD Lanturn: 461-542 (114.96 - 135.16%) -- guaranteed OHKO
    252+ SpA Rotom-C Leaf Storm vs. 40 HP / 216+ SpD Lanturn: 384-452 (95.76 - 112.71%) -- 75% chance to OHKO

    252+ SpA Expert Belt Rotom-C Hidden Power Fire vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Eviolite Ferroseed: 264-312 (90.41 - 106.84%) -- 43.75% chance to OHKO
    252+ SpA Rotom-C Hidden Power Fire vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Eviolite Ferroseed: 220-260 (75.34 - 89.04%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    252+ SpA Expert Belt Rotom-C Hidden Power Fire vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Tangrowth: 300-355 (74.25 - 87.87%) -- 6.25% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
    252+ SpA Rotom-C Hidden Power Fire vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Tangrowth: 250-296 (61.88 - 73.26%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock

    252+ SpA Expert Belt Rotom-C Hidden Power Fire vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Escavalier: 331-394 (96.5 - 114.86%) -- 81.25% chance to OHKO
    252+ SpA Rotom-C Hidden Power Fire vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Escavalier: 276-328 (80.46 - 95.62%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    252+ SpA Expert Belt Rotom-C Volt Switch vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Sigilyph: 312-370 (109.09 - 129.37%) -- guaranteed OHKO
    252+ SpA Rotom-C Volt Switch vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Sigilyph: 260-308 (90.9 - 107.69%) -- 43.75% chance to OHKO
  7. Silvershadow234

    Silvershadow234 :]]]]]
    is a Pre-Contributor
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2012
    Messages:
    695
  8. Molk

    Molk idk
    is a Tutoris a Smogon IRC AOPis a Forum Moderatoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Community Contributor Alumnus
    RU Leader

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2011
    Messages:
    2,984
    Complete Legitimacy's Expert Belt set looks pretty interesting, i need to try it out sometime!
  9. cbt

    cbt
    is a Pokemon Researcher
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2012
    Messages:
    1,290
  10. Slory

    Slory

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2011
    Messages:
    85
    Complete Legitimacy's Expert Belt
  11. Mylo Xyloto

    Mylo Xyloto

    Joined:
    May 12, 2012
    Messages:
    788
    Complete Legitimacy's Expert Belt
  12. The Immortal

    The Immortal <skylight> i havent had sex this year
    is a Battle Server Administratoris a Programmeris a Forum Moderatoris a Tiering Contributor
    Moderator

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2010
    Messages:
    754
    Complete Legitimacy's Expert Belt Set
  13. scorpdestroyer

    scorpdestroyer is a pious radio
    is a Contributor to Smogon
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2012
    Messages:
    1,312
    Molk's ChestoRest

    C-c-c-combo breaker

    But seriously I feel ChestoRest give it a whole lot more survivability and potential for a renewed sweep. It doesn't mind status unlike other Rotom-Cs.
  14. col49

    col49 you know I used to try
    is a Contributor to Smogon
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2011
    Messages:
    1,026
    Molk

    EBelt is definitely a solid set, but prefer ChestoRest's survivability, especially when switching into Scalds.
  15. FortressDoor

    FortressDoor

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2012
    Messages:
    54
    Complete Legitimacy's Expert Belt
  16. Celever

    Celever

    Joined:
    Sep 25, 2012
    Messages:
    2,433
    Molk's ChestoRest, because I don't like the others.
  17. PTJon7

    PTJon7

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2012
    Messages:
    552
    C L's Expert Belt set seems like it could be really effective, definitely worth checking out.
  18. Blizzard

    Blizzard

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2012
    Messages:
    89
    Complete Legitimacy
  19. Nozzle

    Nozzle

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2012
    Messages:
    775
  20. Silvershadow234

    Silvershadow234 :]]]]]
    is a Pre-Contributor
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2012
    Messages:
    695
    Molk's set: 3
    GOthee's set: 0
    PTjon7's set: 0
    Complete Legitimacy's set: 8


    C_l wins with 8 votes!

    This week's pokemon will be...
    [​IMG]
    Sceptile
  21. Hot N Cold

    Hot N Cold PLUTO
    is a Pre-Contributor

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2011
    Messages:
    1,028
    [​IMG]

    Sceptile @ Flying Gem
    Trait: Unburden
    EVs: 204 Atk / 224 SAtk / 80 Spd
    Naive Nature (+Spd, -SDef)
    - Acrobatics
    - Rock Slide
    - Hidden Power [Fire]
    - Leaf Storm

    Mixed Sceptile Unburden, this set help work like a soft wallbreaker luring a punch of mons such Roselia, Cryogonal, Moltres or Escavalier with the right support of hazards, Stealth Rock at least. The Evs spread allows to outrun Offensive Cryogonal. Also, on late game when the damage is done can work like a cleaner because Unburden + great coverage on both sides.
  22. Molk

    Molk idk
    is a Tutoris a Smogon IRC AOPis a Forum Moderatoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Community Contributor Alumnus
    RU Leader

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2011
    Messages:
    2,984
    [​IMG]
    Sceptile @ Petaya Berry
    Trait: Unburden
    EVs: 4 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Substitute
    - Giga Drain
    - Hidden Power [Rock] / Hidden Power [Fire]
    - Focus Blast

    This set may seem similar to the onsite Special Attacker set at first glance, but it plays a bit differently. While Life Orb Sceptile has the ability to hit hard right away while trading away some longetivity because of LO (although Giga Drain compensates for this a bit). Subpetaya Sceptile trades away this initial power (although it can still score kills when it needs to) for the ability to outrun potential revenge killers late game while also being able to hit even harder than Life Orb Sceptile without the recoil once it gets the Petaya boost. Once things like Amoonguss, Roselia, Escavalier, and CB Entei are eliminated from the match, Subpetaya Sceptile can switch in, sub down to Pinch Berry range, activate Unburden to prevent potential revenge killers from beating it, and sweep. Giga Drain helps regain the hp that Sceptile lost from subbing down to petaya range over the course of its sweep, making it slightly less vulnerable to priority. Personally i'd probably still use Life Orb Sceptile most of the time, but using a Petaya berry is an interesting alternative.
  23. Kenny

    Kenny don't expect me

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2012
    Messages:
    460
    [​IMG]
    Sceptile @ White Herb
    Trait: Unburden
    EVs: 4 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Modest Nature
    - Giga Drain / Substitute
    - Leaf Storm
    - Hidden Power [Rock]
    - Focus Blast

    White Herb allows for a Leaf Storm to be fired off without the crippling -2 Sp.Atk, and also gives it a tremendous speed boost. Modest is the choice of nature because it will outspeed everything that it needs to outspeed, even the dangerous Scarf Accelgor (lol.) You could use either Giga Drain or Substitute, although I prefer the recovery aspect of Giga Drain and find it generally more useful. You could also run Dragon Pulse if you really hate Druddigon, although it does nothing else besides hit Druddigon. Despite this the convenience of White Herb, I generally find myself using plain ol' Life Orb Sceptile, but that doesn't stop this from being the next best thing!
  24. Silvershadow234

    Silvershadow234 :]]]]]
    is a Pre-Contributor
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2012
    Messages:
    695
  25. Molk

    Molk idk
    is a Tutoris a Smogon IRC AOPis a Forum Moderatoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Community Contributor Alumnus
    RU Leader

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2011
    Messages:
    2,984
    Hotncold's Mixed unburden Sceptile. Ive seen that set in action quite a bit and its incredibly effective, especially when paired with Spikes, excellent late game cleaner with a bit of surprise value to boot!
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 0)