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The Next Best Thing...

Discussion in 'BW UU' started by fatty, Jan 15, 2013.

  1. BLINGAS ♥

    BLINGAS ♥

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    [​IMG]
    Zapdos @ Leftovers Trait: Pressure
    EVs: 252 HP / 224 SDef / 32 Spd
    Calm Nature (+SDef, -Atk)
    - Substitute
    - Baton Pass
    - Thunderbolt
    - Roost / Hidden Power Grass



    I've been using this a lot recently. It can really put in some work and be a nice support mon to many teams. Even without any investment, zapdos still has its massive special attack, which helps it dish out hits before passing out. Roost gives Zappy more longevity, while hidden power grass can be used to hit Rhyperior and the likes. Many things like having it a sub passed to it, such as nidoqueen, DD Kingdra, or just any hard hitting attacker in general.


    This is probably my favorite zapdos set to use and i have to admit it is quite effective :)
  2. fatty

    fatty
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    that's a wrap. voting time! may the best zapdos win.
  3. Godsend

    Godsend

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    Cim's Zapdos wins.
  4. Ezio

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    Pokemazter's Metal Sound Zapdos is definitely the best choice. It's incredibly potent at racking up entry hazards damage because it's strong as fuck.
  5. Cesterp

    Cesterp

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    Voting Pokemazter's Metal Sound set because I'm a big fan of fun unexpected stuff. It actually really has me wanting to go make a team centered around one, and I can't help but think that it can be the destroyer of teams.
    I can't help but think, though... why not attack twice instead of Metal Sound => Attack?

    Semi-related... Got smashed by a Mirror Coat Swampert earlier today, congratulated the guy for being amazing and carried on with my life.
  6. Ezio

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    For two reasons: Metal Sound eases prediction and cripples the foe until it switches. Say the opponent has a Rhyperior and a weakened Snorlax. You could use Hidden Power Grass twice to kill the Rhyperior or Thunderbolt twice to kill the Snorlax but you do not know for sure which Pokemon is coming in. You could predict but using Metal Sound is much safer as long as you can force the current foe out.
  7. scorpdestroyer

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    Tiffanyy's set because it's the most solid one IMO, you don't have to worry about getting walled because you can just pass to someone else and I don't see a situation where it won't work.

    I don't like Metal Sound's accuracy


    I've changed my vote, see below
  8. PTJon7

    PTJon7

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    Voting on Cim's set. Zapdos would reach extremely powerful levels under the rain with Thunder and a boosted HP Water. I'm gonna definitely test the set out soon.
  9. Cassen

    Cassen

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    Pokemazter's Metal Sound Zapdos gets my vote!I think a wrote a few paragraphs about his set already but basically the ability to get past Umbreon, Snorlax, and Porygon2 with Metal Sound is extremely helpful, as well as allowing Zapdos' other special-attacking partners to have an easier time against weakened special walls.
  10. scorpdestroyer

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    Changing my vote. Voting for cim's Rain Dance set because its an amazing tool for rain teams, especially with boosts to its moves and its ability to Volt Switch to other rain sweepers
  11. Ace Emerald

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    Pokemazters Metal Sound set. The Rain sets are pretty cool (I did help a little with one), but there's nothing like breaking through would be Special Walls, racking up hazard damage, and allowing one of the myriad of good Special Attacks in the tier to have a field day. While being a good special sweeper anyways.
  12. cim

    cim happiness is such hard work
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    Not voting just yet, but I thought I'd elaborate. Treat Metal Sound less like Nasty Plot and more like Yawn. It's for all intents and purposes a psuedo hazing move. When you Metal Sound a Snorlax as it comes in and takes Spikes damage, you basically screw it completely over. If it stays in it's taking a huge Thunderbolt, if it leaves it will have taken double hazard damage while accomplishing nothing. When you consider which of Zapdos's checks have instant recovery (ans: very few / none of them), this is particularly attractive.

    The ease of prediction is a small part of it but it's really all about the hazard damage vs massive direct damage momentum grab.
  13. Reaver12

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    Pokemazters Metal Sound set. Tried it out for a bit with Froslass laying spikes and it worked pretty damn well. Raikou really appreciated Snorlax taking all that hazard damage.
  14. TPO3

    TPO3 Never practice; Always perform.

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    Pokemazter's Metal Sound set. I like that concept the most. I don't like the first Rain Dance set very much, because I feel like Zapdos should be using either Rain Dance or SubPass, not trying to end up somewhere in the middle with both. I'd almost rather use Volt Switch. The 2nd Rain Dance set seems cool, HP Water to hit both Rhyperior and Nidoqueen, in addition to a strong hit on Flygon seems cool, but it just gets walled by Grass-types if you use Rain Dance at the wrong time, and you have to sacrifice longevity (aka Roost) just to be able to hit them. I think pokemazter's set has the greatest coherence, and it's very well thought out.
  15. fatty

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    i'm voting for Pokemazter's Metal Sound set. i've always been fond of ms zappy due it's impeccable ability to force switch-ins and giving it a psuedo way of boosting it's special attack. it also has the bulk to abuse metal sound, making it a menace for special walls to face. pair it with a good spikestacking core and it can make your opponent pull their hair out.

    and with that Pokemazter wins with 7 votes! MS Zapdos will be archived, and in continuation, the next pokemon to go under the scope will be Virizion!
  16. PTJon7

    PTJon7

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    [​IMG]
    Virizion @ Leftovers
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 SDef / 4 Def
    Calm Nature
    - Giga Drain
    - Toxic
    - Roar/Taunt
    - Synthesis

    I figure Virizion would work pretty well as a special wall, considering its very good special bulk. I think this set would work best for stalling purposes, thanks to Toxic and Synthesis. Roar or Taunt for general utility purposes as well.
  17. FruitSeller

    FruitSeller

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    I figure a dual screens set could work pretty well, as her defensive options are a bit limited, and imo running an offensive set other than cm or sd is hard because of low offensive stats (all out offensive or mixed just doesn't have enough damage).

    [​IMG]
    Virizion @ Light Clay
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 192 Spd / 252 HP / 64 Def
    Jolly Nature
    - Reflect
    - Light Screen
    - Taunt
    - Sacred Sword/Giga Drain

    With dual screens, this set can catch it's normal switch-ins off-guard and potentially get free screens. Either way, it's speed with these EVs gets to 330, which is above any +100s (by two points... I have to speed creep :3), and the rest is put into the defenses. Defense is chosen over special defense because it wants to be able to set up both screens if possible, which means it needs to take hits from both sides of the spectrum. A fast taunt prevents opposing Pokemon from setting up while Virizion is getting up screens or opposing members from preventing setup with taunt, which is a major problems for a good amount of screeners (i.e. cresselia, uxie). The STAB move of choice would vary with your team, but I would prever sacred sword in most cases I think because a dual screens team generally has set-up sweepers, and it is sometimes difficult to fit a fighting type there. However, giga drain can be useful so that scald burns don't destroy your ability to use attacking moves as well as gaining the ability to actually kill water types 1v1 more effectively.

    This set should be paired with raikou (or zapdos) so that crobat switch-ins can be taken advantage of and so that taunt won't ruin all the set-up sweepers that would be paired with Virizion's screens.

    Sadly, I won't be testing this (I'm busy trying out my Dark Horse team :P), but from my theorymoning it seems like the best alternative to on-site sets.
  18. Cesterp

    Cesterp

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    I'm a huge fan of Virizion and all that it does, and have enjoyed utilizing it on a Dark Horse team. Personally, I'm a fan of the Swords Dance set because it tends to destroy defensive teams and can hold its own against an offensive team once the scarfers are dead. With that said, it's the #1 set on the site for Virizion, so I can't really go about submitting it. In-depth analysis of Virizion's movepool-
    Non-Competitive/Outclassed Moves (open)

    Take Down, Snore, Round, Rock Smash, Quick Guard, Magical Leaf, Flash, Leer, Hyper Beam, Giga Impact, False Swipe, Double Team, Double Kick, Cut, Seed Bomb, Facade, Retaliate, Superpower (CC is a better option 99% of the time)

    Physical Attacking Moves (open)

    Close Combat/Sacred Sword
    Leaf Blade
    Stone Edge
    Zen Headbutt
    X-Scissor
    Aerial Ace/Bounce
    Return/Frustration
    Quick Attack

    Special Attacking Moves (open)

    Giga Drain/Energy Ball
    Focus Blast
    Hidden Power
    Solarbeam (if running sun)

    Walling/Stalling/Self Support Moves (open)

    Substitute
    Protect
    Synthesis
    Block
    Rest
    Sleep Talk
    Roar
    Taunt
    Toxic

    Team Support Moves (open)

    Light Screen
    Reflect
    Sunny Day
    Safeguard

    Set-Up Moves (open)

    Swords Dance
    Calm Mind
    Work Up


    So... Virizion's attack movepool is significantly better on the physical side. Except Giga Drain- if you're going to be a mono attacker, you'll probably want Giga Drain for extra recovery. That said, Virizion is not the most powerful of attackers without setting up, but it's very specially defensive and that's where I'm inclined to make a set. Take use of what you're given, I suppose...

    Virizion @ Leftovers
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 12 Spd / 252 SDef / 244 HP
    Calm Nature
    - Block
    - Toxic
    - Protect
    - Synthesis

    Second set I'm submitting with the move Block. It's a lot like U-Turn when you think about it, because you're guaranteed that your opponent will be still in with that mon the following turn. The basic idea of this set, if you couldn't already tell, is Toxic stalling something to death. It's a great way to get rid of something built for stall that can't hit you hard enough back. To be more specific, anything that hits you for less than 62.5% health with its most powerful move will die. If they don't have instant recovery, it's 7 turns until they die if they start at full health, so they can only attack you 4 times (~23% chance of a crit), and if they have instant recovery, it's 14 turns max until death, so they can only hit you 7 times (~36% chance of a crit). Not to mention if they're special attackers, it's quite possible the crit may not even result in death.

    Of course, you're countered by poison types, steel types, Immunity, Magic Guard, anything with Heal Bell/Taunt/Rest, and anything that can do more than 62.5% damage to you consistently. Notable things that generally die include Claydol, Kingdra, Milotic, Rhyperior, Slowbro lacking SpAtk investment, Zapdos, Blastoise, Krookodile, and non-NP Cofagrigus. Things like Suicune, Snorlax, and a few others depend heavily on the set being run and generally won't die. A lot of things that are choice-locked on a move that can generally 2HKO/3HKO you without worrying about what you're about to do will also die, but I can't really think of too many scenarios that would happen where the choice-locked mon is just death fodder anyway.

    Beyond that, Virizion is pretty much death fodder or a way to gain momentum via Block.

    Suggested teammates would probably be things with Substitute or set-up moves. It can create a few free turns for your team over the course of a battle and might be the key to victory for a teammate.

    Yeah, this set isn't the best. I'm just throwing it out for the heck of it, and the movepool analysis is helpful.
  19. fatty

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    Thanks cesterp, nice work as always! I kept this open extra long because it seemed as though virizion was one of the harder pokemon to come up with effective sets for. Nonetheless, the 3 sets posted look solid enough so I will be opening up voting now.

    One suggestion though in ptjons's spd set, maybe slash leaf blade over giga drain because dealing with special boosters like raikou reliably would be one of the main selling points of spd virizion, especially with it having semi reliable recovery in synthesis. Lum berry could also work in conjunction with leaf blade to make dealing with cm cune a bit easier
  20. PTJon7

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    Thats an interesting though Fatty, it didn't occur to me. But would a Secret Sword be more powerful against a physical Suicune?

    I'm voting for Cesterp's set cuz it seems interesting.
  21. TPO3

    TPO3 Never practice; Always perform.

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    I'm going to vote for PTJon7's Specially Defensive set. I think with Virizion's massive base Special Defense, in addition to resisting Water and Electric-type attacks makes it a great candidate to take on some prominent Special threats in Raikou, Non-Heat Wave Zapdos (If those still exist...), and pretty much any bulky Water-type. I would also suggest Leaf Blade over Giga Drain, since it will definitely hit Raikou harder. I'm unsure of what it would do against Suicune, but I would assume Leaf Blade hits harder after Suicune gets a Calm Mind boost in.
  22. FruitSeller

    FruitSeller

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    Voting for PTJon7's Specially Defensive set, since it provides a strong switch in to the common water types in the tier, as well as Raikou (main reason I like it is for Raikou).

    One thing to note about that set, is using a fighting-type move might be good to differentiate from a specially defensive shaymin some more. Makes it have some more utility, i.e. hit snorlax, since it is for UU, and snorlax is so dominant.
  23. scorpdestroyer

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    FruitSeller's dual screens set gets my vote, as a dual screener that finds many opportunities to set up screens due to its unpredictability as well as ability to come in on stuff like Suicine.
  24. BloontoniumGayGhast

    BloontoniumGayGhast

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    Taunt is the killer of the set...

    But very unique...
  25. cbt

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