SM OU The return of the vicious Scizor

[Obedience]

Introduction: Hello Ladies and Gentlemen, welcome to another of my special "Rate My Team"s! Of course, you may ask your selves, "Why is this Rate My Team so special ?". That is because I always try to use Pokemon that aren't really used the OU format, to counter the boredom created due to lack of variety. (Moreover, Scizor holds a special place in my heart, since the first competitively useful set I created, was for it). Either way, into the team.

*IMPORTANT- PLEASE READ * : It is an offensive team, that lacks the setter for any type of entry hazards. However idiotic this may seem, the team has worked out surprisingly well, winning against opponents with a score of 6-0 or 5-0 most of the times, with the lowest number of Pokemon left on the team being 3. The team's concept is to hit with strong, momentum-gaining moves the opposing team, continuously wreaking up damage, until an easy sweep can be achieved.


The team :

Team-building processes: I started with Scizor, since I wanted it to be the core of this team. Seeing his weaknesses, I decided to add Hetran, since Flash Fire offers an immunity to all fire type moves. However, that created a BIG Ground weakness, not to mention the fighting and water type ones. So, I needed to flying type to make the team a little more stable. Once I added Thundurus, I saw a rock and water weakness form. The water type weakness was covered by Fini, since I also needed a defog user. To cover the rock type weakness I thought of Zygarde, because I could use a set up mon as well. Seeing how solid the team was in terms of coverage, I decided to add Ash-Greninja ; I was able to get rid of all the ground types and Metagrosses, that stopped Thundurus from roaming around the opposing team...And Presto! The team was ready!

Scizor A.K.A. Expulsus

Expulsus (Scizor) (M) @ Choice Band
Ability: Technician
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Bullet Punch
- U-turn
- Superpower
- Pursuit

Since I wanted to use something different, I turned into past gens stars. And there it was, the mon that felt just right. It good against Pheromosa, even eating up a High Jump Kick, offers a STAB steel type move with priority to help against tough situations against fairies, AND has access to U-turn. I had tried to use it once again, but I realised that a fast offensive set is rather frail against the current mega. So I went with the option of bulky offense. Of course, I had to think about using its mega form, but the damage calculator Gods were in my favor and Scizor with Choice Band deals more damage than a mega set.

Overall, this thing is a total beast. Bullet punch has a 50% chance to OHKO Kyurem-Black, OHKOs Pheromosa and Choice Band Bulu. Superpower for pesky Pokemon such as Heatrans and weakened Chanseys / Magnezones that feel like switching in ( OHKOs Grassium Z/ Bulky Heatrans, deals 88.7 - 104.6% to Chanseys, OHKOs Specs and Scarf Magnezone - not Lure). Pursuit is used to deal damage/beat opponents trying to switch. U-turn is a powerful STAB move that allows the trainer to gain momentum while dealing serious damage. It also makes Scizor the first member of



Thundurus-Therian

Fulminis (Thundurus-Therian) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Volt Absorb
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Thunderbolt
- Volt Switch
- Focus Blast
- Hidden Power [Ice]

Thundurus is a BIG offensive presence in the team. Hidden power Ice OHKOs every Lando variant except for, the defensive variant on which it has a 25% chance to OHKO at full HP. Thundebolt does massive damage coming from a base 145 Sp. Attack, and Focus Blast deals really nice damage to any incoming Steel type. Volt Switch is the second momentum- gaining move used to give the user the advantage over almost any situation. Once the opponents' electric immunities are gone, Thundurus just dances around their team, depriving their every Pokemon of a serious amount of HP, while offering switch ins to assault vest users.




Greninja-Ash

Greninja-Ash @ Choice Specs
Ability: Battle Bond
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Water Shuriken
- Hydro Pump
- Dark Pulse
- U-turn

Greninja is around to offer a second priority, and deal with the ground types that disturb Thundurus form tearing the opposing team apart.The usual Specs set is enough to do the work. Hydro Pump obliterates all the ground types, Water Shuriken is its boosted priority. Dark pulse puts mega metagrosses down, and deals serious damage to most pokemon, other than Fini or AV Alolan-Muk/Magearna. U-turn is the last move used to switch out, and provides openings to threats to the opponents' Pokemon. Due to this teams other 2 switching moves, gaining Ash-form is really easy.



Heatran

Heatran (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Lava Plume
- Earth Power
- Toxic
- Protect

Heatran is a basic Sp. Defense set. It uses its excellent typing to resist a wide variety if the moves the opponent wants to throw at it. Lava plume is used for coverage and the burn ratio it offers. Toxic is used to gradually weaken any Pokemon that the opponent wants to bring in. Defensive Landos, Rotoms, Charizards, Greninjas, they all start to slowly lose HP until they are finished off by either a momentum move, or the poison damage. Protect is used to stop Pheromosas from getting a free High Jump Kick, and scouting the opponent's moves. Earth Power is used for basic coverage reason, against other heatrans, toxapexes, marowaks and risky Terrakions.



Tapu Fini

Tapu Fini @ Leftovers
Ability: Misty Surge
EVs: 248 HP / 192 Def / 16 SpD / 52 Spe
Calm Nature
- Taunt
- Nature's Madness
- Moonblast
- Defog

Tapu Fini is the defensive wall of the team. Natures Madness wears down opponents, Moonblast damages heavily the opposing dragon types, for which this team lacks coverage. Taunt shuts down status moves, preventing entry hazards, and status/ recovering moves. Defog gets rid of entry hazards, that can otherwise hinder the basic concept of the team. This however, does not prevent it from working his however, does not prevent it from working

Zygarde

Zygarde @ Leftovers
Ability: Aura Break
EVs: 104 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 148 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Thousand Arrows
- Substitute
- Rock Slide
- Dragon Dance

Zygarde serves as the set up pokemon of the team. Leftovers ensure longivity, and restore its health after the sub. Dragon Dance seals the deal for a GG , if the opponent is overall weakened. I chose Rock Slide over Stone Edge, because the team had problem against Volcarona, while this sets can take a +1 Z-Fire Blast and get rid of it with a move more accurate than Stone Edge. Thousand arrows is easily one of the best moves there are, and recieves a nice STAB , while offering coverage.



I am waiting for your suggestions ! Moreover, I would like any ideas on the scizor set . ^^

 

[Obedience]

I would really like to rate this team, however, it lacks whats called a *teambuilding process* showing why you added certain pokemon to the team, what roles they play. Once you add that, I'll be willing to check this out anytime!

Done boiiiii!

 

[Obedience]

Thanks for the Teambuilding procces! You have no idea how much that helps.

---->

To cover your ground weakness, you might as well go with the most reliable ground type check, that is, Physically defensive Landorus Therian with HP ice. Landorus Therian also forms a VoltTurn core with Scizor, scizor dealing with the bulky grass types and Lando threatening fire types.

+ Rock Slide > Protect

Scizor's massive weakness to fire types requires the most resilient fire check around. Rock slide OHKOes Volcarona and Mega charizard Y and the rare talonflame massively improving your matchup against them. Thanks to your aforementioned spread, it survives a +1 Hp ground from volc and a focus blast from Zard and still Koes them in return.

------>

(Scarf)

Now with Landorus Therian playing the role of a bulky ground type and Heatran checking Mega Zard Y and Volcarona for you, I recommend you replace Zygarde with Choice Scarf Garchomp. Your team covers nearly every single fire type for scizor, all of them except for Thunder punch Zard X so Garchomp can come in on a +1 zard X , outspeed and OHKO it. Outrage is extremely spammable late game and this gives your team a revenge killer besides Scizor, something I've come to see your team lacks.

---> EV Spread Change

I recommend you use a spread of 248 Hp/ 252 def/ 8 speed and a Bold Nature to give you the best possible matchup against pokemon its supposed to check such as Latios, Garchomp, and Mega Charizard X. 8 speed Evs allow you to still outspeed bulky heatran and bulky Marowak Aloan and defog against them, while the special defense investment you have does't really do much for Tapu fini. Its the spread I always use on my Tapu finies, so You should really try it out.

And that's all! Nice team you got there btw.

First of all, thank you for taking your time to tell what I had to do in order for you to rate the team. However, I do have some questions. You must be calculating the damage dealt by heatran's rock slide using another spread, because from what I see, rock slide has only a chance to OHKO, an this is while using careful nature and 31 IVS on attack. Adding the rest 4 EVs to attack, I have a 50% chance to OHKO, which, while being rather high, can cost me my heatran or the game. Talking about Volcarona only, since Zard Y has more Def bulk. I also get the feeling, that if I switch Thundurus for Def Lando, I will have no direct way of threatening water/flying types. Also, if I remove Zygarde for Scarfchomp, will that not leave me weaker against stall plays? Moreover, isn't thousand arrows better than EQ ? Fini's speed investment is there to help it outspeed def landos. However, I do notice that for some reason I messed up the fini set spread, it will be corrected to the smogon based Defensive set

 

[Obedience]

Thanks! I will to the changes and see how it works out ^^

 

[Obedience]

I WILL :3. Thank you for explaining the reason behind your choices, it really helps ^^

 

[Obedience]

Obedience I made an importable of the team with all my changes implement, including EV changes, pokemon swaps, and moveset editing. Enjoy!

Team With My Changes

Expulsus (Scizor) (M) @ Choice Band
Ability: Technician
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Bullet Punch
- U-turn
- Superpower
- Pursuit

Landorus-Therian @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 HP / 216 Def / 24 SpD / 16 Spe
Impish Nature
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock
- Hidden Power [Ice]
- U-turn

Greninja-Ash @ Choice Specs
Ability: Battle Bond
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Water Shuriken
- Hydro Pump
- Dark Pulse
- U-turn

Heatran (F) @ Leftovers
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Lava Plume
- Earth Power
- Toxic
- Rock Slide

Tapu Fini @ Leftovers
Ability: Misty Surge
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 Spe
Bold Nature
- Taunt
- Nature's Madness
- Moonblast
- Defog

Garchomp @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Outrage
- Rock Slide
- Fire Blast

<3. Thank you. I recreated the team just before you post the edited sets, and it was almost exactly the same as yours. However, I face some problems with it. Firstly, I do not get the 4 attack EVs on heatran, while having a nature that lowers the stat. Secondly, I do think there is a point in having fire blast on Garchomp, when Scizor's Superpower 2 Hit KOs it with ease, not to mention Heatran being around. Another thing is that Fini seems to tear this team apart with ease : Garchomp(moonblast) , Scizor(natures madness) , Lando (natures madness + moonblast/scald/surf), Greninja(moonblast) all get worn down by fini quickly, leaving me with 2 mons to resist hits from it, moreover, by replacing Thundurus with Lando, there is no way to threaten it. [Or Skarmory/ Celesteela( EQ variant)]. :/ I DO NOT mean to discourage you, or attack you/your opinion, I love the suggestions that you have made, I am just pointing out its weak points so we can work as a team to make it SUPER MEGA ULTRA POWERFUL . That means, for everyone too bored to read through the entire thread that THE TEAM HAS NOT CHANGED.

 

[Obedience]

My friend, don't worry about Tapu fini wrecking through your team. I made a RMT that was also weak to tapu fini so do you know what I did?

Greninja-Ash @ Grassium Z
Ability: Battle Bond
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Water Shuriken
- Dark Pulse
- Hydro Pump
- Grass Knot

Use this set on Ash Greninja instead, I used it and its very effective at luring in bulky waters like Tapu fini and OHKOing them with bloom doom.

252 SpA Greninja-Ash Bloom Doom (160 BP) vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Tapu Fini: 314-370 (91.5 - 107.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
So you can just use this set instead, and adhere to all the other changes I recommended. Good luck with your team!

I must say that I like how twisted the idea is. The fini set you used to calculate the damage is your set , isn't it XD .( It lacks the sp def investment as well as the calm nature, be careful my brother, it can cost you the game) if we assume that the average player does not use smogon's set, we need stealth rocks up and Ash-Forme to ensure that Fini is knocked out, and does not obliterate our butts :P . Also, we lose long term damage out put.

 

[DracoNinja]

Virizain

gren will likely not be in its ash gren forme because it would not have picked up a kill with fini around if ur opponent is competent so this is the appropriate calc:

252 SpA Greninja Bloom Doom (160 BP) vs. 248 HP / 16+ SpD Tapu Fini: 214-252 (62.3 - 73.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

z gk is significantly weaker and needs a ton more chip damage than what u have proposed, also since u mention that u have used these sets can u also post replays of them working where other gren/fini sets would not have worked as well in that situation instead of having the trump mentality and saying "ive used these sets and they do definitely work" lol, it rly aint convincing at all

--

hey nice team, I see that the team utilises some standard defensive cores with good defensive synergy with each other such as heatran+fini and msciz+fat water, so hopefully my rate will help optimise the team a lil more

Firstly, I think the biggest issue with the team rn is its inability to deal with opposing fatter builds (most notably stall, it literally can't touch it). opposing wallbreakers such as Mega Metagross and Mega Mawile can also shred through your team through their sheer power alone. To fix this, I would strongly recommend to change CB Scizor to SD Roost Mega Scizor. The increase in bulk when mega evolving helps to tank the afore-mentioned pokemon's hits, as well as other prominent attackers in the tier such as Landorus-T, Magearna and Mega Alakazam. Mega Scizor still provides a strong win condition through SD+Bullet Punch, while also faring well midgame by being able to pivot out with U-turn to another team member to further pressure the opponent.

Secondly, to cope with your weakness against fat teams, I would recommend grassnium z magma storm sr heatran+cb zygarde. sr is needed not just to pressure sr weak mons (such as zard y/x/volc) but to also pressure fatter builds in general because the chip damage does weaken them in the long run. cb zygarde in conjuction with sr allows you to 2hko every mon on the standard msab/dugtrio/chansey/clefable/skarm/toxapex team by coming in on a passive pokemon that can't do much such as toxapex or chansey. grassium z heatran allows you to trap and ko bulky waters such as opposing tapu fini, allowing your wallbreakers in specs ash greninja and cb zygarde to have an easier time manhandling the opposing team. I would also recommend wisp as the last slot on heatran as opposed to earth power because earth power only hits opposing heatran and toxapex, both mons are handled by zygarde. wisp allows you to cripple mega mawile and prevent a potential sweep, as well as powering up heatran's own fire moves by bouncing the wisp off mega sableye's magic bounce, allowing you to 2hko it with magma storm. it is also useful in weakening other heatran switch ins such as keldeo/zygarde/garchomp etc.

I would change thundurus-t to defensive zapdos cuz zapdos does fit better on the team, and even though you would not have a scarfer I do feel you match up against offense better because of your strong defensive core+you do have 3 priority users in the form of ash gren/zygarde/mscizor but it opens up a weakness to tapu koko so maybe someone else can build up on it.

hope I helped, good luck on your team!

sets

Heatran @ Grassium Z
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 25 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Stealth Rock
- Will-O-Wisp
- Magma Storm
- Solar Beam

Scizor-Mega @ Scizorite
Ability: Light Metal
EVs: 248 HP / 100 Atk / 144 SpD / 16 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Bullet Punch
- U-turn
- Swords Dance
- Roost

Zygarde @ Choice Band
Ability: Aura Break
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Thousand Arrows
- Extreme Speed
- Outrage
- Toxic

 

[Leo]

You should use the analysis' spread for Tapu Fini to take on Ash Greninja and special Pheromosa better (which is what Tapu Fini is supposed to take) Tapu Fini isn't supposed to take Earthquakes from Chomp (40 min with max Def) and you still beat Zard-X with that spread. You also need enogh speed for Landorus to prevent rocks and avoid taking 30 from an uninvested Earthquake for no reason

e: I also disagree with that Greninja set completely. The whole point of using Ash Gren is getting it to its Ash form asap and break your opponents team with Specs attacks. With that not only do you need 40% chip on Fini in order to break it, but your Ash Gren is also weaker than Specs Gren before transformation

 

[Obedience]

Virizain

gren will likely not be in its ash gren forme because it would not have picked up a kill with fini around if ur opponent is competent so this is the appropriate calc:

252 SpA Greninja Bloom Doom (160 BP) vs. 248 HP / 16+ SpD Tapu Fini: 214-252 (62.3 - 73.4%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery

z gk is significantly weaker and needs a ton more chip damage than what u have proposed, also since u mention that u have used these sets can u also post replays of them working where other gren/fini sets would not have worked as well in that situation instead of having the trump mentality and saying "ive used these sets and they do definitely work" lol, it rly aint convincing at all

--

hey nice team, I see that the team utilises some standard defensive cores with good defensive synergy with each other such as heatran+fini and msciz+fat water, so hopefully my rate will help optimise the team a lil more

Firstly, I think the biggest issue with the team rn is its inability to deal with opposing fatter builds (most notably stall, it literally can't touch it). opposing wallbreakers such as Mega Metagross and Mega Mawile can also shred through your team through their sheer power alone. To fix this, I would strongly recommend to change CB Scizor to SD Roost Mega Scizor. The increase in bulk when mega evolving helps to tank the afore-mentioned pokemon's hits, as well as other prominent attackers in the tier such as Landorus-T, Magearna and Mega Alakazam. Mega Scizor still provides a strong win condition through SD+Bullet Punch, while also faring well midgame by being able to pivot out with U-turn to another team member to further pressure the opponent.

Secondly, to cope with your weakness against fat teams, I would recommend grassnium z magma storm sr heatran+cb zygarde. sr is needed not just to pressure sr weak mons (such as zard y/x/volc) but to also pressure fatter builds in general because the chip damage does weaken them in the long run. cb zygarde in conjuction with sr allows you to 2hko every mon on the standard msab/dugtrio/chansey/clefable/skarm/toxapex team by coming in on a passive pokemon that can't do much such as toxapex or chansey. grassium z heatran allows you to trap and ko bulky waters such as opposing tapu fini, allowing your wallbreakers in specs ash greninja and cb zygarde to have an easier time manhandling the opposing team. I would also recommend wisp as the last slot on heatran as opposed to earth power because earth power only hits opposing heatran and toxapex, both mons are handled by zygarde. wisp allows you to cripple mega mawile and prevent a potential sweep, as well as powering up heatran's own fire moves by bouncing the wisp off mega sableye's magic bounce, allowing you to 2hko it with magma storm. it is also useful in weakening other heatran switch ins such as keldeo/zygarde/garchomp etc.

I would change thundurus-t to defensive zapdos cuz zapdos does fit better on the team, and even though you would not have a scarfer I do feel you match up against offense better because of your strong defensive core+you do have 3 priority users in the form of ash gren/zygarde/mscizor but it opens up a weakness to tapu koko so maybe someone else can build up on it.

hope I helped, good luck on your team!

sets

Heatran @ Grassium Z
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 25 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Stealth Rock
- Will-O-Wisp
- Magma Storm
- Solar Beam

Scizor-Mega @ Scizorite
Ability: Light Metal
EVs: 248 HP / 100 Atk / 144 SpD / 16 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Bullet Punch
- U-turn
- Swords Dance
- Roost

Zygarde @ Choice Band
Ability: Aura Break
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Thousand Arrows
- Extreme Speed
- Outrage
- Toxic

Thank you for taking your time to rate my team! Here are my notes on the changes you suggested :

1. There is no Sp def wall
2. Mega Scizor is significantly weaker to Choice Band Scizor, and setting up is difficult when there are opponents that can threaten you( Example : Tapu Lele with HP fire, I have to switch out, get the Misty T up, then attack, granted that the opponent stays in
3. Zygarde Band DOES good damage, but lacks the speed to use it to its full extend :/

Any ideas ?

 

[Obedience]

Virizain was lower ladder guy, (1250), please do not be hard on him [ Not saying this is bad , I am at 1500+ ]

 

[DracoNinja]

Thank you for taking your time to rate my team! Here are my notes on the changes you suggested :

1. There is no Sp def wall
2. Mega Scizor is significantly weaker to Choice Band Scizor, and setting up is difficult when there are opponents that can threaten you( Example : Tapu Lele with HP fire, I have to switch out, get the Misty T up, then attack, granted that the opponent stays in
3. Zygarde Band DOES good damage, but lacks the speed to use it to its full extend :/

Any ideas ?

u don't need walls at all u can pretty much pivot around most special attackers with the combination of mscizor/heatran/zygarde/fini. yea mscizor is weaker than cb scizor until it does set up sd and it gets so many opportunities to do so, from the top of my head mmetagross/defensive landt/magearna/tangrowth etc. ur lele check can be heatran too? either way it cant rly switch in on anything bar fini for free. cb zygarde is used as a breaker and u have the necessary pivots in mscizor/thundt to bring it in safely, and also provides as a solid switch in to a lot of mons such as zard y/pex etc.

 

[Obedience]

hmmm I see... Thanks ! I was using Def Zapdos, so my pivoting was weak. Now I should be able to move more freely throughout the game ! I will try the team out in the up coming days and inform you ! ^^

 

[Obedience]

The ladder was reset three times and all three times before my ladder ranking was higher then yours. Simply assuming im a low ladder guy is very arrogant imo.

True, but no proof was provided to prove otherwise, and in combination with the bad advises, the at least currently low ladder and GXE, it was only natural that such a conclusion would be drawn. I am sorry if you were offended, the comment was meant to protect you from any harsh comments of people reading this thread. You may very well have your own, beyond the average one strategy- and it might be working out for you, not saying the opposite- but most people, including me, seem to have difficulty following/accepting it.

 

[Obedience]

Yo, Draconinja, I am trying out the team. It works out really well, with the only problem still being my Sp. Def. . Tapu Koko can work its way around the team with a general ease, and that leaves the team weakened :/. Same goes with Magnezone. However, M-Scizor's bulk IS nice to have( still feeling kinda bad about the damage, but SD feels good!)