Sandslash is really, really bad. It should not go any higher than C-Rank, and I'd argue even E-Rank for it and here's why:I nominate Sandslash for A-tier.
It's a really solid spinner that has been getting a lot of use now that people realize how good it is.
Versatile, being able to run either a defensive or offensive set and getting it's spinning job done. And even on a defensive set, if it runs SD, it can still pretty easily 2HKO most anti-spinner, without much issue.
It's defensive set walls a lot of common Physical pokemon, such as Aero, Druddigon, Absol, Drapion, Evire, Aggron, and Durant, and threaten to kill almost all of them with a Stone Edge or Earthquake, or widdle down with Toxic.
It's offensive set is usually still bulky, and I believe the more preferred of the two sets. With Mixed EVs in HP, ATK, and DEF, it can wall things almost just as well. Coming in a physical wall and SDing with a Lum berry, it can take a burn or a sleep and still deal good damage to whatever was trying to status him.
Overall he's a very good pokemon for RU, and I'd even go as far to say as the second best spinner behind Kabutops, but even then there's reasons to pick Slash over him on teams.
You're looking at Articuno's bad set. It's C-Rank not for its shitty defensive set, but rather its offensive set. Two solid STAB moves in Ice Beam and Hurricane, along with reliable recovery in Roost, make it a solid offensive threat in RU. Articuno can put some real hurt on the opposition with Ice Beam and Hurricane off of a decent 95 Special Attack. It can hit rather hard and can put some holes in teams. Articuno has flaws in massive SR weakness and rival in Moltres, but thanks to its solid power and bulk to stand out, it's a pretty solid C-Rank, and a High C-Rank too.Sandslash in A is wrong. Sandslash is pretty bad in this metagame.
Anyways I would like to propose Articuno be placed into the D Rank. Articuno simply has nothing going for it. Slowking either roasts it with fire blast, tricks it specs, or thunder waves it. While articuno... uses ice beam. How does it do against other top pokemon? Uxie sets up stealth rock for it to switch in on. Escavalier rocks it with an iron head. Durant actually sets up on defensive articuno. Moltres roasts is with fire blast and sceptile nails it with HP rock, if some prior damage is taken. As an ice type it is totally outclassed by everything, like freaking regice. The horrible typing, 4X rock weakness, unimpressive SpA do not warrant it any usage. Any steel type switching in for free and any fire type beating it just don't make it good at all.
This is from the OP. You may want to fix this.Top tier Pokemon such as Sceptile and Nidoqueen go into S
Fixed, thanks!This is from the OP. You may want to fix this.
Offensive Articuno in't really that great. Here is a quote from the C&C section.You're looking at Articuno's bad set. It's C-Rank not for its shitty defensive set, but rather its offensive set. Two solid STAB moves in Ice Beam and Hurricane, along with reliable recovery in Roost, make it a solid offensive threat in RU. Articuno can put some real hurt on the opposition with Ice Beam and Hurricane off of a decent 95 Special Attack. It can hit rather hard and can put some holes in teams. Articuno has flaws in massive SR weakness and rival in Moltres, but thanks to its solid power and bulk to stand out, it's a pretty solid C-Rank, and a High C-Rank too.
You know that and it is still weak to Stealth Rock majorly, which Hail teams already struggle with somewhat. That and the fact that it is dependent on Hail to do great amounts of damage. D-Rank seems reasonable.- The power isn't there, at least Moltres has the ability to get past Slowking sometimes, and can easily get past stuff like Druddigon anyway even without a super effective hit. Most Lanturn have Tbolt and most Slowking should be carrying Fire Blast anyway.
- The Speed is actually a huge deal. Being able to actually outspeed Lilligant when it counts (cuz of the IV Speed drop) is a major selling point of Moltres.
- The typing is a huge deal. Not being able to take hits from stuff like Klinklang, Fighting-types, and the extra damage from Grass-type attacks makes a difference in the long-run.
- Finally, the difference in power is actually extremely significant. Base 90 to Base 125 is a HUGE leap, leaving even the chip damage from Moltres to be far more significant than that from Articuno.
I'm lazy so I'm going to quote my post from 2 weeks ago regarding this.Dusknoir needs to be dropped into E-Rank. The fact that it shows up in Team Preview is an immediate sign of a bad player and it does not do its job very well at all. Not to mention there's absolutely zero reason to use Noir over any Ghost-type available.
Nothing has changed ever since then. As someone else pointed out, Dusknoir, even if it loses, can often bring Kabutops down to enough damage to die from recoil on the next turn. The "small marigin" bit referred to it being bulkier than Misdrevus even with the eviolite attatched - Spiritomb and (especially) Rotom are quite a bit behind.Dusknoir is the most physically bulky Ghost in RU, even if by a small marigin. Its probably the only one that stands a chance against both Kabutops and Cryogonal, as most are specified to blocking one of them. Even if it usually loses to Kabutops, its not like any of the other Ghosts can actually defeat it. For example, Golurk gets OHKOed by both (its not a spinblocker as much as a tank but w/e). It has a good (not great) bulk, Fire Punch, and Will-O-Wisp makes it a good check to Fighting-types and Escavalier. Unlike the others it can actually hurt Escavalier (I guess Golurk can too). Its also a lot bulkier than Spiritomb, and Spiritomb having no weaknesses is pretty irrelavent because it has only one resistance anyway. Its probably the only Ghost to do both, and although its not great at either, it has that going for it. Along with the fact Dusknoir is locked into D as it is, it doesn't deserve to be with Munchlax - while it slowly dies it can do a few disruptive things to the opponent.
Natu, Ninjask and Glalie are pretty awful Pokemon. Maybe Glalie its better, but still its pretty bad and has a very small niche.Removing Natu, Ninjask and Glalie from the Ranking.
Linoone and Vanilluxe down to D Rank
On Natu, Ninjask, and Glalie, i believe that all 3 of them are viable enough in RU to stay in D rank, of course their niches arent huge, but thats why i placed them in D rank instead of any of the above ranks. As Dcae mentioned, Ninjask can be very dangerous when played well, being able to pass Speed- and Attack- Boosts to much more threatening Pokemon such as Aggron and Gallade, allowing them to tear through teams and often their standard checks with ease. I think this is enough to justify leaving it in D rank despite its 4x Stealth Rock weakness and fraility. Glalie has a decent niche in offensive Hail Teams as a Spikes Setter, while its typing leaves much to be desired, 80/80/80 bulk is decent enough, especially because it can abuse Ice Body just like other recognized hail threats such as Glaceon and Walrein. Unlike other spikes setters that might fit on hail such as Qwilfish, Glalie can abuse Blizzard just like the hail abusers its support, allowing it to wear down various Blizzard resistances such as Lanturn, making it much easier for something like Scarf Glaceon or Subsplit Rotom-F to clean up, especially with the Spikes that glalie is capable of setting. I'd say Natu's niche is arguably the smallest of the three proposed Pokemon, but i still think its enough for it to stay D rank. Magic Bounce is just sooo useful, and while Natu's pretty frail, it still has reliable recovery and access to Eviolite to boost its bulk to acceptable levels, making blocking entry hazards for the whole match a definite possibility. Natu also has access to other useful support moves such as Reflect, Light Screen, Toxic, and U-turn, making sure that its not total dead weight outside of bouncing hazards and status over the course of the match. Lastly, Natu's the only RU legal Pokemon that prevents Smeargle from accomplishing anything over the course of the match simply by switching in, bouncing every move it commonly uses back at it and using a well timed U-turn to get a teammate in for free, giving an immediate advantage. All in all, i think all 3 of these Pokemon totally deserve to stay in D rank, but if enough people disagree i'll remove them from the list.updates said:Added Basculin to low C rank
Added Vanilluxe to low C rank
Moved Linoone to D rank
Moved Golem to D rank
Moved Hitmonchan to C rank
Moved Druddigon to top S rank
Added Victreebel to mid C rank
Moved Regirock to top C rank
Moved Articuno to D rank
Moved Scolipede to Mid B Rank
Sorry, I just think this was missed given the 0 comments given on it.I know that cbt is going to shout at me on irc for this, but would quagsire going up to low, possibly mid B be unreasonable?
Quagsire has such good defensive typing for RU it's not funny, and the defense and HP stats it possesses are just amazing. It takes out a LOT of physical threats in RU, minus, like, gallade. Couple it with a special wall and you have a great core right there. The amount of physical attackers in RU really help quagsire, since if you manage to dispatch the 2 special attackers on your opponent's team (and gallade if he has it) then quagsire can just stand there with his derpy face walling the opponents.
Marowak definitely has a notable niche. On my Trick Room team it averages maybe two kills a battle and often severely dents a third Pokemon. However, all of Marowak's sets require solid support in order to be effective. I'm always hesitant to send out Marowak when I know it's going to be slower because it's threatened by a lot of things. I feel like Marowak is a fine example of high-risk, high-reward that can be a monster in the right situations which deserves a place near the higher end of the C tier.C Rank: Reserved for Pokemon that have notable niches in the RU metagame, but have just as notable flaws that prevent them from being effective. Pokemon in the C tier often require significant support to be effective in RU. C rank Pokemon tend to face a lot of competition with the more commonly used Pokemon.
Have you also considered running its spdef variant with heal bell? I can see its use as a specially defensive cleric. With Lava plume for burn (and STAB move i guess), heal bell to heal of all status conditions and Wish+Protect for recovery and to pass wishes to give its teammates safer switch ins. I have seen this set working perfectly fine. It may be outclassed by other clerics but i still think its an option worth trying out.I'm looking to test out all the Untestedmons as RU used to be my favorite tier and im trying it out again. The first Pokemon i tested was Flareon and let me just say, D-rank for days.
I didn't have the highest hope for Flareon going in, its never had much to go off. I tested its recommended bulky set as well as a Choice Band set and LO mixed set. All i found is that Flareon cannot take any unstabbed EQs. It already has issues dealing with most of The S/A rank Pokemon more then throwing a Toxic at them, but the few things it can touch won't stay in, being Exca, Accelgor, Cryogonal, Sigilyph and the Rotoms. Even then, it cant switch in on these mons more then once besides Cryognal if rocks are up.
The CB set was rubbish as expected, Entei did everything I ever could better, and the LO mixed set was pretty well the same story. Defensively, its a decent Pokemon i'll admit. But it just cant seem to do more then any other defensive Pokemon can do back to it. But having to use both Wish and Protect to heal makes its moveset miss opportunities. Running just Flamethrower/Toxic makes you setup bait for Substituting waters, Lava Plume/Roar lets SLowking, the number 1 RU mon switch into you with no fear at all, and Toxic/Roar doesnt work great together and means a Taunt will make you take more SR damage.
I almost want to call it E-rank its so unable to do things. However, with proper team support it can patch a weakness to the Pokemon i mentioned earlier to a decent extent. But it requires a LOT of babying.
Its smogon analysis set is sp. def. Heal Bell doesnt help out any of the problems I've found with Flareon itself. Its not a bad option per se, but you are 100% walled by any other fire type, or any of the Magic Guard RU Pokemon who cant be burned. Heal Bell is nice for team support yes, but it may be the only thing Flareon can do once its in before it dies or has been set-up fodder.Have you also considered running its spdef variant with heal bell? I can see its use as a specially defensive cleric. With Lava plume for burn (and STAB move i guess), heal bell to heal of all status conditions and Wish+Protect for recovery and to pass wishes to give its teammates safer switch ins. I have seen this set working perfectly fine. It may be outclassed by other clerics but i still think its an option worth trying out.
You're wrong: doesn't matter if there are Pokemon Flareon can't touch, such as Slowking, Lanturn or Clefable, because this isn't his job. Flareon, thanks to the combination of great special bulk, Flash Fire and great supports moves like Wish or Heal Bell, has an unique niche, making it great answer to Fire and Grass-types and supporting mon for stall teams. The aim of Flareon is stop mons like Rotom-C or Typhlosion and supporting the team with wish, not sweeping teams. Because of this is irrelevant if its hard walled by something. Flareon has 2 real problems: SR is one of those, with SR Flareon has much more difficult of checking some threats like Sceptile, Rotom-C or Magmortar, secondly is Moltres. In BW1 Flareon was able to take Moltres very well, but the introducion in BW2 the Hurricane Moltres, make it unreliable answer to Moltres. Flareon isn't bad Pokemon by any means, but isn't not that great it was in BW1 meta :<Its smogon analysis set is sp. def. Heal Bell doesnt help out any of the problems I've found with Flareon itself. Its not a bad option per se, but you are 100% walled by any other fire type, or any of the Magic Guard RU Pokemon who cant be burned. Heal Bell is nice for team support yes, but it may be the only thing Flareon can do once its in before it dies or has been set-up fodder.
Not sure how i'm "wrong" bringing my experience to a dicsussion thread lol. Additionaly, the set provided does nothing special to "stop" Typhlosion that other Pokemon can't do, Sceptile can destroy it with EQ and i mentioned it is a decent counter to the popular RU Rotoms. How decent Flareon was in BW1 is also not relevant. I've found that while it CAN support a team, it doesnt do it better than most Pokemon and it needs much more team support then it gives in return. Its really not that good.You're wrong: doesn't matter if there are Pokemon Flareon can't touch, such as Slowking, Lanturn or Clefable, because this isn't his job. Flareon, thanks to the combination of great special bulk, Flash Fire and great supports moves like Wish or Heal Bell, has an unique niche, making it great answer to Fire and Grass-types and supporting mon for stall teams. The aim of Flareon is stop mons like Rotom-C or Typhlosion and supporting the team with wish, not sweeping teams. Because of this is irrelevant if its hard walled by something. Flareon has 2 real problems: SR is one of those, with SR Flareon has much more difficult of checking some threats like Sceptile, Rotom-C or Magmortar, secondly is Moltres. In BW1 Flareon was able to take Moltres very well, but the introducion in BW2 the Hurricane Moltres, make it unreliable answer to Moltres. Flareon isn't bad Pokemon by any means, but isn't not that great it was in BW1 meta :<