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The Sun Worshipers

Discussion in 'BW OU Teams' started by Veofiend, Jul 31, 2012.

  1. Veofiend

    Veofiend

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2012
    Messages:
    10
    The Beginning

    I got to admit right now.. I've fallen in love with Sun teams. If you've seen my other posts, then you can easily tell about my love for Sunny Day teams. However, right now I've come across my most lethal sunny day team yet. I've had a lot of success with this team from Pokemon Showdown (though it crashes a lot :/ )and I would like to see if I can get some real good criticisms and advice for this team.

    Building The Sun Worshipers

    I've tried other sun abusers but mostly from what you've seen so far I've always gone with
    [​IMG] because...this moth is a complete monster..with the right support. I liked Volcarona, but I decided to try something else that could abuse the sun and then I came across what became one of my favorite Pokemon..

    [​IMG] Everyone, meet Chandelure. The only ghost/fire type up to 5th generation and one of the most powerful fire type Pokemon in existence, at least in my view. With that crazy 145 base special attack, decent defenses, and passable speed, I knew I could use Chandelure to great success. With Chandelure as my core, I went forward to making a team.

    [​IMG][​IMG] As we all know, what's a sun team without someone that could summon the sun permanently? We all know Ninetails...it was horrible back then, but with Drought for an ability, Ninetails serves a very good purpose for the team providing endless sun to ravage the team with fire-type attacks.

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG] I had a dilemma. With Tyranitar and Politoed, and to a lesser extent, Abomosnow and their abilities to change the weather, I have to figure out a way to get rid of them. Ninetails could handle any Abomosnow bar Choice Scarf with some rock or ground move, but Ninetails would always lose to Politoed and definitely Tyranitar. I needed something that could take both of them out. Then I came across Lilligant, like an answer to my prayers. It had enough speed to outpace them even without the sun (once again, bar choice scarf users) and demolish them with Leaf Storm. I also noticed I could use Lilligant as a cleric with Heal Bell and put stuff to sleep with Sleep Powder. So I took Lilligant for a test drive, and it performed beautifully. It might be rated RU, but she is perfectly capable of performing fine in the dangerous grounds of OU.


    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG] If you look at the previous team, you know one Pokemon that immediately can wall this team so far and it's one of the banes of most Sunny Day teams. [​IMG] Yep, Heatran. It's not that the defensive threats bother me. I could wall the defensive types without Earth Power with Chandelure, but the choice scarf sets are a different story. I needed something that could handle Heatran and provide my team with a rock resistance because I was lacking in one. I remembered using Flygon a long time ago before it got put down to the lower leagues when big brothers, [​IMG]and[​IMG] received nice upgrades when the 5th generation came around. Flygon could Earthquake Heatran, provided a rock resistance, and could scout with U-Turn. Even though it would take some proper prediction to deal with Heatran, I decided to go with Flygon.

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG] Wow, I feel like a big hypocrite saying all those things about Heatran when in turn, I decided to use one myself lol. A specially defensive Heatran rocks! Heatran could take a lot of specially defensive hits and retaliate with a ton of support moves. Heatran..is an outstanding wall and the immunity to fire is awesome!
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    Last thing to cover, I needed a rapid spinner. It was a must. Sunny Day teams are ravaged by all entry hazards so in my opinion, a rapid spinner is almost mandatory. [​IMG]Donphan...wasn't pulling its weight for me. Ice Shard did a pitiful amount to dragons without prior damage and either got burned or just wiped out too easily before it could do any damage itself. From the limited amount of rapid spinners out there, I just stuck with the most reliable and offensive, Starmie. So there you have it, the team!

    Chandelure
    [​IMG]@Leftovers
    Ability: Flash Fire
    EVs: 6 HP/ 252 SpA/ 252 Spd
    Nature: Timid
    - Substitute
    - Fire Blast
    - Shadow Ball
    - Hidden Power [Fighting]

    Chandelure is the core of my team and he's effective at forcing switches so that's why I chose to run a substitute set for him. No use putting EVs in Attack, HP, or reduce it's decent defenses, and it would be handy to outrun certain Pokemon and Chandelure is offensive enough as it is, so I decided to run a Timid nature. Fire Blast is STAB does immense damage in the sun. Shadow Ball is for STAB and Hidden Power Fighting can catch Tyranitar and Hydreigon off guard if they decide to switch in.

    Ninetails
    [​IMG]@Leftovers
    Ability: Drought
    EVs: 52 HP / 84 SAtk / 152 SDef / 220 Spd
    Nature: Calm
    - Flamethrower
    - Hidden Power [Fighting]
    - Will-O-Wisp
    - Sunny Day

    I don't know what was going through my head with this complex EV spread but surprisingly, it works. Enough special defense to survive water attacks, enough speed to outspeed Politoed, Tyranitar, Breloom, and Abomosnow, enough special attack to deal a decent amount of damage, and the rest went into HP. Flamethrower is STAB and Hidden Power Fighting deals with opposing Rock types. I might change Hidden Power Fighting to Roar because this Ninetails doesn't do much damage to start off with and Roar could help build up Stealth Rock damage. I'll have to see...

    Lilligant
    [​IMG]@Life Orb
    Ability: Chlorophyll
    EVs: 40 HP / 252 SAtk / 216 Spd
    Nature: Modest
    - Heal Bell
    - Leaf Storm
    - Hidden Power [Ice]
    - Sleep Powder

    Lilligant serves as my cleric and way of dealing with Politoed, Tyranitar, and fellow dragons. Sleep Powder serves as a way of crippling would-be counters. I'm surprised Lilligant is so far down in RU because it can cripple Gliscor, dragons, and bulky water types like Swampert and Slowbro. Oh well, I'm sure she will rise above the ranks soon.

    Flygon
    [​IMG]@Life Orb
    Ability: Levitate
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    Nature: Jolly
    IVs: 30 SAtk / 30 SDef
    - Outrage
    - Earthquake
    - U-turn
    - Fire Punch

    I just recently added Flygon to my team and it's doing a good job so far. Earthquake does a good amount of damage, U-Turn scouts, Fire Punch deals a hefty amount of damage and even KO's Ferrothorns and Forretresses. Outrage is there for another STAB move.

    Heatran
    [​IMG]@Leftovers
    Ability: Flash Fire
    EVs: 48 HP / 208 Def / 252 SDef
    Nature: Calm
    - Lava Plume
    - Stealth Rock
    - Roar
    - Toxic

    I decided to do a different set from Smogon and invest more into Heatran's defense. So far I've had success with this set. Lava Plume is for STAB and the burn chance is awesome. Stealth Rock is self explanatory, Roar racks up damage from Stealth Rock and keeps Heatran from being Set Up fodder. Toxic is for residual damage.

    Starmie
    [​IMG]@Life Orb
    Ability: Natural Cure
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Nature: Timid
    - Psyshock
    - Rapid Spin
    - Ice Beam
    - Hidden Power [Fire]

    Starmie is my rapid spinner and can actually sweep a team by itself once the counters are out of the way. Rapid Spin is for getting rid of entry hazards and Natural Cure means no status for Starmie once it switches out. Hidden Power Fire gets rid of Scizor and the steel twins, [​IMG] and [​IMG]. Lots of people don't expect Starmie to carry a psychic type move so Psyshock lets me deal with Terrakion, Conkeldurr, and Virizion. Ice Beam is for the dragons.


    Conclusion

    I'll happily listen to all your suggestions and take them into thought when I go back to Pokemon Showdown. Greatly appreciate it.

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
  2. LilOuOn

    LilOuOn

    Joined:
    May 25, 2012
    Messages:
    647
    Hello Veofiedn, nice team you have there...

    You must consider Tornadus-T as a major threat to your team because he can easily OHKO most of your pokes since them are frail (except heatran).

    Tornadus-T is now the BIG BOSS of the metagame, causing problems to all teams except those team that have 6 jirachis. But, since this is not possible, you can try having at least one Jirachi.

    Also, your lack of scarfers doesnt allow you to revenge kill, try scarf Flygon. The sets right here:

    Show Hide


    [​IMG]

    Flygon @choice scarf
    Ability: Levitate
    EVs: 4 sdef / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    Nature: Jolly
    - Outrage
    - Earthquake
    - U-turn
    - Fire Punch


    Show Hide


    [​IMG]

    Jirachi @Leftovers
    Ability: Serene Grace
    EVs: 252 HP / 224 Sdef / 32 Spd
    Nature: Jolly
    - Iron Head
    - Thunder Wave
    - U-turn
    - Wish


    Hope I helped you
  3. Nova

    Nova
    is a member of the Site Staffis an official Team Rateris a Smogon IRC AOPis a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
    Mentor

    Joined:
    Nov 13, 2011
    Messages:
    1,468
    Hi Veofiend

    Welcome to Smogon and solid sun team you have, nice to see you using Lilligant and Flygon in OU. However, I do have some suggestions for your team. Looking at your team, it is threatened by Choice Specs Tornadus-T, one of the biggest threats in the new Black and White 2 metagame. If your opponent is able to set up rain, Tornadus-T outspeeds your entire and 2HKOs if not OHKOs every member save Heatran who is hit hard by Focus Blast. Another threat to your team is Offensive Dragon Dancers, namely Haxorus and Salamence. After a DD boost, these offensive powerhouses can rip through your team with a combination of Outrage and Earthquake. Although Lilligant has the ability to outspend them, this requires you to have Sun up which is challenging in a rain dominated metagame. For these threats, I suggest replacing Flygon with a Choice Scarf Thundurus-T with a move set of Thunderbolt / Volt Switch / Focus Blast / Hidden Power Ice. Scarf Thundurus-T outspeeds Tornadus-T and dispatches it easily with Thunderbolt while also being faster than +1 Haxorus and Salamence. He also is able to speed tie with the common Scarf Landorus as well as opposing Scarfed Thundurus-T and eliminate them with HP Ice. With his Volt Absorb ability, Thundurus-T still has the electric immunity that Flygon has, allowing him to switch into Thunders/Thunderbolts without worry. Volt Switch provides you with the switch advantages that Flygon currently create but hits much harder with Thundurus-T's massive base 145 special attack and STAB. Focus Blast is used in the last slot to provide coverage against Ferrothorn, Heatran, and Tyranitar.

    Now for some smaller changes. On Ninetales, I would replace Hidden Power Fighting with Solarbeam. Solarbeam gives you a powerful hit on bulky water types and combos well with Sunny Day. For example, you can use Sunny Day on a predicted Politoed to remove rain and then eliminate him with Solarbeam, winning you the crucial weather war. Making the change from Flygon to Thundurus-T does make you more prone to opposing Heatran. For this reason, I suggest replacing Toxic on Heatran with Earth Power. Toxic is nice to cripple opposing walls, however you are already using Will-o-Wisp on Ninetales and Sleep Powder on Lilligant which does the job nicely. Earth Power gives you a 4x Super Effective hit on opposing Heatran as well as dealing more damage to Tyranitar and Terrakion on the switch. Lastly, I would change Heatran's EV spread to 36 HP / 208 Def / 252 SDef / 12 Spd with a Calm nature to outspeed the onsite Specially Defensive Heatran set and be able to fire off an Earth Power first.

    Hope I helped and good luck with your team!


    Set:
    Show Hide
    Thundurus-T @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Volt Absorb
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    -Thunderbolt
    -Volt Switch
    -Focus Blast
    -Hidden Power [Ice]



    tl;dr
    Show Hide
    Flygon ----> Choice Scarf Thundurus-T
    Hidden Power Fighting on Ninetales ----> Solarbeam
    Toxic on Heatran ----> Earth Power
    Heatran's EV Spread ----> 36 HP / 208 Def / 252 SDef / 12 Spd
  4. Veofiend

    Veofiend

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2012
    Messages:
    10
    Thanks for the suggestions. Greatly appreciated!
  5. august

    august get a grip mothafucka
    is a Smogon IRC AOPis a Tiering Contributoris a Tutor Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnuswon the 5th Official Smogon Tournamentis a World Cup of Pokemon defending champion

    Joined:
    Nov 25, 2007
    Messages:
    3,022
    Please lengthen your descriptions a bit, or I will have to lock this

    :toast:

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