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The Top 10 Titans of the 5th Gen OU Metagame

Discussion in 'BW OU' started by Sork, Mar 3, 2013.

  1. Sork

    Sork

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    As 6th gen swiftly approaches, I think it’s time that we take a look back on the entire 5th gen OU Metagame. With the transition from 4th gen to 5th gen, we acquired such powerhouses as Excadrill, Thundurus, new abilities that pushed pokemon over the top, Permanent Weather, Terrakion, Landorus, Volcarona, and more. With the arrival of Black and White 2, we obtained a powerful threat in the form of Kyurem-Black, along with the blistering speed and power of Tornadus-T, Thundurus-T, and Landorus-T, along with being blessed with the raw power of Sheer Force Landorus. These Pokemon have all had a great impact over the course of 5th gen OU. But, it is now time to decide, who are the Top 10 Titans of 5th Gen OU?

    This is where you guys come in. This thread will work similarly to the OU Viability Ranking Thread, where throughout the week, you guys will nominate Pokemon to be voted on to be placed as candidates for the Top 10 Titans of 5th Gen OU. The voting for the actual top 10 list will be done in September (one month away from 6th gen) by you all, so that by the time 6th gen does roll around, we have an accurate depiction of which Pokemon were the ones that had a very significant impact on the OU Metagame. Every Sunday, you will look through the candidates mentioned, and then you will vote on the one that has the most compelling argument on why it should be in the Top 10. The voting will last until Sunday, 11:59 PM GMT-7, which after that, I will try my best to announce officially the winner and then edit the OP with the potential candidates. Then, you all will continue to nominate candidates for the week.

    Now, what do I want in a post? Well, what I would like to see in a post nominating a Pokemon is:

    What kind of effect did this Pokemon have during its time in the 5th Gen OU Metagame?
    What were its main roles when it was/is used?
    What caused it to have such a significant impact? (Think Movesets, abilities, base stats, etc)
    How would you deal with this Pokemon when you are team building/battling it? (checks, counters, etc)

    These are the kinds of posts that show that you aren’t just saying, “Pokemon X should be in the top 10 because it looks cool.” Those kinds of posts should not even be thought about being made.

    Now, for the big question, what kinds of Pokemon can we nominate? Well, really, you can nominate any that were in OU but were banned, any in OU but were moved down, or you can suggest any Pokemon that’s in OU right now. I’m hoping that by the time that September rolls around, we’ll have a significant list to vote for the top 10.

    Now, the voting for the top 10 will NOT be a standard 1. Best Pokemon 2. Second best, etc. The Top 10 will be the ones that have had the most significant impact on their time used in the Metagame. This means even in Black and White 1, so you can suggest Deoxys-A to be a candidate. However, this would be advised against since it was only OU for a very short time in Black and White 1, and therefore its impact was not very notable.

    So, with Week 1 now over, it's time to keep a list of who is in the running to become a titan. Your potential candidates are:

    Tyranitar
    Politoed
    Terrakion
    Ferrothorn
    Deoxys-Speed


    Now, for the rest of the voting, you will be voting on 1 pokemon to be put in the top 10.

    I feel that this topic would be a great idea for us at the moment with 6th gen coming towards us fast and with 5th gen finally winding down on being almost done with the changes in it. So, now it is up to you all. Who do you think impacted the OU metagame the most? Who do you believe is a Titan?
  2. SlimMan

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    I'll make an actual post and discuss on this probably like tomorrow (or 2-ish hours), because I have only a minute now. But I do have time to say this:

    Moody is going on this list, period. It got banned from Ubers and we had to make an entirely new Clause for it, lol.
  3. Deck Knight

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    Gonna get the most obvious one out of the way:

    [​IMG]

    If you want to talk about impact, this is the single Pokemon that inspired basically every other ban of any OU Pokemon. It started with the Drizzle + Swift Swim ban, and it caused the suspect testing and banning of a huge number of Pokemon.

    Some might say this is just Drizzle, but I'd disagree. As a Pokemon Politoed had sufficient bulk to be able to keep Rain up continually, and with 100 Base SpA it wasn't a slouch with Rain-boosted Hydro Pumps. It also had a decent support movepool with Toxic, Encore, and Perish Song.

    You can't imagine 5th Gen OU without Politoed, so I'm nominating it first.
  4. RabidChipmunk

    RabidChipmunk

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    Seconding Politoed, because obviously.

    In addition...

    [​IMG]

    Gen V is the generation of Fighting-types, and leading the pack is Terrakion. Possessing a nearly unresisted STAB combination, wicked base Attack, good bulk for such an offensive Pokemon and a Speed stat that effectively borked OU's speed tiers (base 100 just doesn't cut it anymore, thanks in part to Terrakion), Terrakion is one of the most defining 'mons of the generation.

    Terrakion has nearly limitless options for sets. Scarf him and use him as a fantastic revenge killer. Band him and destroy everything. Use Double Dance or SubSalac to make him a fantastic sweeper. Put him on whatever team you want, because he'll never disappoint you.
  5. Jukain

    Jukain fuck macle
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    [​IMG]
    This thing was godlike when it was around, having 550 Speed and 405 Attack alongside Swords Dance, Rapid Spin, Earthquake, and Rock Slide. I don't have much time now, but this thing was (and hopefully will be!) one of the most influential Pokemon during its extended stay in OU.
  6. Lavos Spawn

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    [​IMG]

    hello there

    deoxys-s had a huge impact on the metagame for the good while that it was around. it's the fastest pokemon in the game, and has a deep enough movepool to allow it great versatility and a plethora of options, all of which are good in one way or another. deo-s was the premier hyper offense lead in the days of bw1, since it was practically guaranteed to get two layers time and time again. with rocks, spikes, taunt, and magic coat at its disposal, it was unstoppable in terms of raw hazard-setting ability. then there's the life orb revenge killer set, another story entirely. with options including but not limited to psycho boost, ice beam, superpower, thunderbolt, hidden power fire, and extremespeed, deo-s made for a fearsome answer to any setup sweeper, as well as an excellent late-game cleaner. other sets include a sashed offensive role and a dual screens suicide lead. truly, deo-s had quite the impact on the bw1 metagame.
  7. Lord of Bays

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    Seconding what Deck Knight said. The Toed is the definitive BW Pokémon. We've spent two years nerfing the permanent rain it brings and, excusing builds designed to counter rain, it's still the best team archetype.
  8. ihatesmogan

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    I nominate Blaziken, the first starter to be banned. Making a jump from UU to ubers, it was almost impossible to prepare for. It could protect on the first turn, SD on the second and it was basically gg. The only "counter" it had was jellicent, but even jelli is 2HKOed by shadow claw. When it was running around, the usage of jelli shot up. Of course, the fact that high jump kick got buffed did nothing to stop the massacare. I also agree that politoed is up there. Remember when every team was politoed and 5 swift swimmers? The existance of one pokemon resulted in many other bans such as the ban for ss and drizzle, and arguably torn-t and thunderus. Even with those two gone, people are still complaining about it. Of course, it's ability isn't the only thing going for it. Most teams would be hard pressed to find a counter to specs hydro pump in the rain.
  9. Halcyon.

    Halcyon. Come on, she's not burned; she's just gone.
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    Yeah, Politoed is definitely the most influential Pokémon in all of BW when it comes to support Pokémon. I think Excadrill was definitely the most influential offensive Pokémon during its time in OU. I mean, I remember playing on PO, turning off the ladder, and forfeiting any time I saw an Excadrill on my opponent's team (yeah I know, I was a much, much worse player back then) because it was just so ridiculous to face if you didn't have Gliscor, Bronzong, or Skarmory, and even those weren't effective after he got a Swords Dance or two up. Besides Excadrill, I think Genesect was definitely the most influential offensive Pokémon. Actually, it might even have been more influential than Excadrill was, because he could be used on just about every team and playstyle (the 50% Suspect Test usage stats from the Kyurem-B test pretty much prove that).

    Then there are lesser Pokémon that, while not as centralizing, have consistently been more than effective at what they do since the beginning of BW. Things like Ferrothorn and Landorus, for example, have been fantastic from the beginning, and will continue to be fantastic for a long time. Keldeo is much newer to the game, but also has proven to be a major threat. All of these guys could be considered.
  10. ChrisTehAwesome

    ChrisTehAwesome

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    I'd like to submit Venusaur as one of the top 10 titans. While Venusaur may not be a broken pokemon or one that defined the metagame for a while before being pushed to ubers, I think it deserves a slot. Without venusaur, I think Ninetales would see a lot less usage. It has been a constant fact that if your team does not have an answer for venusaur then it is not a great team. Venusaur's ability brought with it a whole new meaning to the speed race, and dugtrio's ability to take out venusaur's biggest counters brought it up from NU all the way to OU.

    Even though Rain is currently the most dominant weather, it stands to reason that if it weren't for rain, Venusaur would probably be banned. Venusaur cannot be underrated because everyone knows how powerful it is. Not the highest used pokemon by any means, but I think it definitely helped shape the BW OU meta.

    On the defensive end, Ferrothorn definitely raised the bar in what a defensive mon can do.
    [​IMG]
    With access to spikes leech seed protect stealth rocks and even offensive moves like power whip and gyro ball, ferrothorn forced teams everywhere to start using HP Fire. Ferrothorn is the kind of mixed wall Forretress wishes it could be, and it's moves, stats, and ability have combined to make it the highest used pure defensive pokemon for almost the entire 5th generation.
  11. Trinitrotoluene

    Trinitrotoluene how to pronounce my username: \ˌtrī-ˌnī-trō-ˈtäl-yə-ˌwēn\
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    Without a doubt, Politoed definitely belongs in either #1 or #2, with the other slot being occupied by Moody. Now, ladies and gents, feast your eyes on what I think is another Pokemon worthy of being in the top 10 for influence across OU:

    [​IMG]

    Oh gosh, where do I begin? Many dragons have existed and will continue to exist in OU (unless the OU Tiering Council decides on a whim to just ban all dragons for shits and giggles), and while many of them were close to becoming Uber (Dragonite, Latios, I'm looking at you two), Garchomp was the only one that actually went over the edge and back into its previous tier of residence. The only reason it even came back to OU is because of a change in the definition of the Evasion Clause, as quoted in Garchomp's OU analysis. Its typing is incredible, and prior to BW2 and after the Blaziken ban, its SubSD set was the golden standard that every physical sweeper had to match up against. Sand Veil made it even more aggravating to deal with back then, and vestiges of its power could be found in the (arguably) inferior SubSD Gliscor, which aimed to emulate SubSD Garchomp. Even now, in the current BW2 OU meta, Garchomp still has a lot going for it. Its incredible bulk and amazing typing for a sweeper gives it multiple set-up opportunities against many different types of teams, and BandChomp is one of OU's most ferocious wall-breakers. Thanks to the BW2 move tutors and Rough Skin, it can actually act as a powerful supporter and pivot.

    I'll edit this post later with more info.
  12. SlimMan

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    Okay, now I have an opportunity for a slightly more legit post. Politoed was the most obvious choice here, and I am glad that Deck brought it up. But there is one thing I want to address.

    So far, OU has had 10 Suspect Rounds, yielding 12 metagames (add the current one and the deo-s meta). If we're picking the Top 10 Titans, I'm more inclined to end up picking the Pokemon who ended up sufficiently warping the metagame around themselves to get banned. Now obviously, we're not just going to pick the Pokemon who got banned every Suspect Round, but it's also clear that Excadrill, Blaziken, and co. lend themselves for consideration more easily than other threats.

    So the big, over-arcing question this raises for me is: Should we take only take into account how LARGE a Pokemon's impact on the metagame was, or should we also factor in how LONG it was?

    Example: Skymin was the first (and only iirc) Pokemon in Smogon's history to be universally voted to Ubers. A 100% vote. It was (and still is) unheard of here. I would call that having a pretty huge impact. But then, Skymin was only in OU for what, 2 months? So what do we put more weight on when we consider nominations? I feel like more definable criteria would be very helpful for us as we begin this process.

    Anyway, back to Politoed. It's unquestionable that Drizzle (ie Politoed) has to be on this list. Do you guys think that the inclusion of Drizzle should exclude us from including the Ludicolo/Kingdra/Kabutops trio? I mean, these three Pokemon utterly defined OU in Round 2, and led to the modern-day precedent for complex-banning arguments. Obviously a huge impact on the metagame. But I wonder if they should deserve their own spot, or be lumped in with Politoed. Something to think about.
  13. GatoDelFuego

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    On the two in the OP:

    Wow, what can you say about genesect? It is the single most defining aspect of pokemon ever. When BW2 came it, it was his game. Everything was about genesect, every other pokemon rose and fell based on what it could do against it. Heatran was higher. Dragons were lower. Dugtrio was OU because of genesect. Having one of the best stat spreads, best movepools, best abilities, and best typings in the game let genesect slide into any role on any team like a glove. The number one way to counter him was Stealth Rock. On a non-stealth rock weak pokemon. Genesect will never change as the most defining pokemon ever (at least of what I've played)

    Tornadus-T, in my opinion, is a lot less deserving of a top spot, maybe not even in the top ten. It was broken as hell, sure, but it didn't really define pokemon as much as Terrakion, Politoed, Landorus, Genesect, Ferrothorn, Volcarona did. Everything that you can say about Tornadus-T really comes from politoed's support; it's nothing without its rain. Rain is certainly dominating, tornadus-t not so much.


    I'm going to put Dragonite, Volcarona, and Ferrothorn out there.
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    Now, what do all three of these have in common? Stealth Rock. While it may have been important in 4th gen, 5th gen stealth rock was even more of a requirement. If you didn't have stealth rock up from the beginning, Dragonite and Volcarona could pretty much sometimes sweep you whole. Multiscale is such an amazing ability, giving you the great chance to set up free dragon dances and hopefully sweep. Dragonite also can stay bulky and fire off powerful thunders and hurricanes from the rain. Whenever dragonite enters the match, it's all about him.

    Ditto for volcarona. Whenever it's sent out, you have to focus on killing it and it alone. The most dangerous boosting move in the game really doesn't need any more explanation; quiver dance puts volcarona on an outrageous level. It may have fallen in usage in BW2, similar to dragonite, but they both exuded huge dominance on the BW1 metagame.

    Ferrothorn seems like an odd choice in such an offensive metagame. However, its ability to tank hits from some of the biggest powerhouses and set up hazards of its choice is incredible. It's a staple on all defensive teams with some of the best resistances and so much potential. Thunder Wave and Power Whip/Gyro Ball also let it hold its own against offensive threats that want to come in and beat it. Ferrothorn is also usually the best dragon counter you can find out there, unless they're packing fire moves.
  14. shrang

    shrang Reaction to Ubers ladder
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    One Pokemon that hasn't been mentioned yet but was massive in BW1: Rotom-W. It was pretty much the Pokemon that made VoltTurn go from a decent strategy to something that was almost overpowered due to its resistances, excellent STABs, good power and defenses. Not only did it defend against rain teams, it also took full advantage of it, and was a big part of making Grass-types (Celebi, Breloom and Virizion) popular. VoltTurn sort of died down in BW2, but Rotom-W was still very instrumental against defending against rain, especially when Tornadus-T was around.
  15. Spirit

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    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    Blaziken

    The epitome of cataclysmic force, while around briefly in BW1, Blaziken was undoubtedly the most difficult sweeper to stop. Thanks to its coveted high base power attacks, access to swords, and the ability that turned Blaziken's sweeping ability into an unrivaled domino effect, speed boost; Blaziken was banished into the forbidden zone of Ubers. While around, Blaziken forced its opponent to carry a counter, otherwise they will inevitably be swept. Like Manaphy for rain, and Excadrill for sand, Blaziken was the nucleaur weapon used by sun teams to augment the fire power of its respective weather. Not released during its reign of terror, Baton Pass(an eggmove) allowed Blaziken to do more than just sweep, but allow its teammates to finish the job when it was too worn out, or in a sticky situation. In DW OU, were the Malevolent overlord Darkrai reigned supreme, along with the flaming specter, Chandelure, Blaziken's sweeping and supporting characteristics stood out the most making it the only pokemon in DW to be officially banned.
  16. Hemp Man

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    Anybody a fan of Ninetails? Sure he sucks, but Drought is a big deal. Insanely over powered Fire Blasts, Chrophyll sweepers, etc.
  17. GatoDelFuego

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    No love for our number 1?

    [​IMG]

    Scizor deserves top spots on usage alone. If I recall Scizor didn't even step down from number 1 in stats, except for possibly during the genesect era. I really don't know about this, but I'm not sure if Scizor is all that dominating. He's all in all pretty standard, though absolutely amazing. The problem is, if you're prepared for terrakion, you're prepared for Scizor. If you're prepared for Garchomp, you're pretty much prepared for Scizor. All it takes is one physical wall to shut this guy down. Still, all of his abilities are top-notch. Leading the VoltTurn charge all through BW1 is an incredible feat...didn't people suggest banning VoltTurn at one point? Even still with VoltTurn offense dying down, he still manages to be the king of OU. He really does fit well into every team, but he never seems to be something to watch out for.

    [​IMG]

    If I talked about everything this pokemon could do I'd be here all night. Jirachi has the most versatility of any of the top 10 most used. Offensive, defensive, support, you name it, jirachi does it. The steel type was always excellent, and Jirachi proves it. Its ability to take on almost every OU dragon, especially in the rain, makes it a huge defensive threat. While its scarf set is much less popular since 4th gen, Calm Mind Jirachi and its variants can destroy unprepared teams. It's not always the first threat you think of, similar to scizor, but it has some of the highest potential of anything in OU.
  18. blitzlefan

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    Personally, I gotta go with Ferrothorn on this one. Even in the beginning of BW1, Ferrothorn always had decently high usage, and has a plethora of utility moves to keep it functioning no matter what. Leech Seed, Thunder Wave, Toxic, SPIKES!!!, etc. always give it a niche on teams, along with its good defensive typing and resistance to Water-type moves. Furthermore, it basically kept the OU metagame from becoming more and more offensive by giving defensive teams a humongous defensive stalwart. Even in Ubers, every time I see a Ferrothorn, I have to play a LOT more carefully with my Dragons.
  19. Kidogo

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    I'm surprised that these guys haven't gotten up here yet but first of all I'd like to nominate:
    [​IMG]
    This guy is p much responsible for making the meta not *completely* overrun with rain. In addition, he's a fantastic SR user and special wall, and can check the latis as well as a ton of offensive threats. His offensive sets have been getting more notice lately, with his CB band being a premier wallbreaker in OU and his CS set being perfect for teams that need to remove spinblockers such as gengar. Ttar has been the premier sand setter throughout BW, and his sand has made garchomp, gliscor, excadrill, landy, and the rest of the sand abusers the monsters they are. He also forms an incredible combo with mons like keldeo that need specific checks removed, since he is the premier pursuiter in OU.

    Speaking of pursuiters, my second nomination is the only other popular pursuiter in OU, and none other than the king of the usage stats:
    [​IMG]
    Scizor is simply one of the most useful, easy-to-fit-on-a-team mons in OU. It can serve as a great pivot, revenge-killer, and trapper with it's stadard CB set; it can focus instead on trapping those threats that trouble your team with the utility trapper set; it can decimate teams at a moment's notice with its offensive LO set; and it can slowly boost up and sweep though teams with the bulky SD set. Furthermore, scizor functions well in the two dominant weathers, being immune to SS and having its fire weakness halved in the rain. Scizor's high usage also means that every competitive OU team MUST have a means of dealing with him or they risk being swept. Definitely a contender for a top 10 most influential spot.

    Eh ninja'd by gato in regards to scizor
  20. New World Order

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    [​IMG]

    Tyranitar has to be the most "underrated influential Pokemon" of 5th gen, if that exists. Without Tyranitar, Excadrill is nothing. You thought Fighting types were dominant stand-alone threats? Well pair them with Tyranitar and you'll find them even more powerful. The thing might no longer be the gold standard for power it was 2 generations ago, but it the single biggest reason numerous Psychic, Ghost, and Flying types don't come in and completely shut down Fighting-types. You thought Rain and Sun were overpowered? Imagine how ridiculous they'd be without this thing to keep them in check, I'd go as far as saying Tyranitar the only thing allowing Politoed to avoid the banhammer. Tyranitar never had the metagame revolve around him like a Genesect or Terrakion have, but it seemingly affects every aspect of BW OU. If I were to pick a top 10 most influential Pokemon of 5th Gen, Tyranitar would be in the top 7 alongside Politoed, Terrakion, Ferrothorn, Dragonite, Heatran, and Genesect (in no particular order). I feel that these 7 Pokemon are a clear cut above the rest in terms of how much they cultivated the metagame. Take any one of these away and the metagame progresses in a drastically different direction.

    EDIT:
    [​IMG]

    Surprised nobody has brought up this guy yet. Heatran absolutely belongs in the top 10. First of all, the guy could fit in literally every team except maybe a rain team. Sun will always be second fiddle to Rain (and up until Excadrill's ban was inferior to Sand as well), and while this has a lot to do with Rain having more versatility, Heatran's presence cannot be understated. This guy single handedly keeps 90% of Ninetales' merry band of sweepers at bay. Whereas with Rain, you need at least 2, often 3 Pokemon who could handle the burden of taking out Rain's biggest threats. Heatran is the definition of a crutch Pokemon, just leaning on it alone gave players a fighting chance against an entire playstyle, and often very minor support from a Latias or Terration would give you all you need to play against Sun teams of any sort. The fact that it and Tyranitar allowed ****ing Dugtrio to become OU speaks volumes. Another aspect of Heatran that kind of goes under the radar is it's interaction with Steels and Dragons. Not only could it serve as a pseudo-check to pretty much every OU dragon, it also dominates Ferrothorn and co like nobody's business. When you think Steel killers, you immediately think MAGNEZONE FTW! But the fact is Magnezone is a liability against any team without one of Skarmory, Ferrothorn, or Forretress (Jirachi can sometimes bs it's way through Magnezone or escape through U-turn). Heatran, even against Rain teams, can pull it's weight by getting up Stealth Rock or taking out Ferrothorn.

    Besides the 7 I listed, the following Pokemon can all make a case for top 10: Deoxys-S, Thundurus, Excadrill (I'd argue it's a byproduct of Tyranitar though), Tornadus-T (clearly a byproduct of Politoed IMO), Scizor, Ninetales, Rotom-W, Gliscor, Skarmory, Volcarona, Landorus, and Reuniclus (it had it's time in the sun/trick room/stallbreakding or whatever). If I were to pick 3, I'd probably go with Ninetales, Scizor, and Rotom-W.
  21. SlimMan

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    Someone's never played GSC. :P

    Alright, kidding aside, I seriously think you over-exaggerate Genesect's place in his meta (yes, it was HIS meta). It really was not all about Genesect. Pokemon which could not damage Genesect whatsoever remained high. Scizor never left the top 5. Jirachi never left the top 15. Tyranitar and Latios held strong in the top 10 and 20, yet they were just asking Genesect to come in on their STAB moves and U-Turn them to death. Dragonite and Garchomp were easy pickings for Scarf Genesect to revenge, but they never left the top 5 and 15 respectively. All of these Pokemon demonstrated consistently high use in the Genesect era because they are good Pokemon, and worth using even with Genesect around. Am I saying that Genesect didn't significantly affect the usage stats? Of course not. But "every other Pokemon" most CERTAINLY did not rise or fall based on how they performed vs Genesect.

    Another thing, Dugtrio was not OU because of Genesect. Dugtrio rose to OU in June last year, 2 months before Genesect was even released. This was because right before BW2 came out, VoltTurn teams were ripping all through the metagame, and Dugtrio worked well on those types of teams. Dugtrio was OU before Gene's release. It is OU after Gene's ban. Just because they paired well does mean that Dugtrio was useless without Genesect.

    Genesect was on like every other team right before its ban, but that is a reflection on its usefulness and omnipresence. In terms of outright dominance, it's no greater than any other Suspect we've banned in BW2. It was the face of the metagame, but I would not say that it was the metagame. I don't know if you remember (or were there) for the first 5 Rounds of Suspect voting, but those times were the definition of Pokemon being the metagame. Round 1, Skymin, Darkrai, Deo, and Moody WERE the metagame. Swift Swim defined Round 2, as did Excadrill Round 5. Actually, with the exception of Swift Swim, I don't think any of those Pokemon were as common and universal as Genesect was. But they were surely better examples of Pokemon who morphed OU into their playground and made it all about them.

    You call Genesect the "single most defining aspect* of Pokemon ever". I wouldn't even call it the most defining Pokemon of Gen V, let alone ever.

    *Aspect implies to me that you count all innovations added to Pokemon over the years. I'm probably just nitpicking a word choice (sorry if that's the case), but please see: Abilities, EVs, Natures, etc.
  22. Frog

    Frog

    Joined:
    Mar 2, 2012
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    94
    Well.
    My main concern is that some pokemon are indirectly responsible for others- in that case who gets the influence award? What about synergizing well with weather starters? If weather starters take influence for abusers these are my top 10.
    Politoed- see above posts
    Tyranitar- see above posts
    Terrakion- Best physical attacker in BW OU, maybe ever
    Genesect- Defined metagame for a long time.
    Rotom-W- On almost every sand team, BW, torn-t metagame
    Dragonite- multi scale Nuffield said
    Ferrothorn- a true stop to starmie and a steel type with no ground weakness and good mixed defenses, decent attack, leech seed, spikes, undebatable
    Latios- has always been the poster special dragon, very common
    Deoxys-S- Owned the metagame for a few months
    Scizor- consistently most used for a reason

    These are the indispensable pokemon of gen 5. Garchomp and venusaur are just wrong. Volcarona makes me laugh. If we are counting excadrill as it's own it replaces Latios. No other weather sweeper deserves a spot. Ninetales and heatran might want to be squeezed in though.
  23. GatoDelFuego

    GatoDelFuego Damn son, where'd ya find this?
    is a Smogon Media Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon
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    Slim, I'd have to disagree. When I say "rose or fall", of course it didn't turn the entire game on its head, but genesect impacted every pokemon in the game. Sure, there were still things up there that weren't good against genesect, but you've got six pokemon on a team. Dugtrio was really a mistake of mine, but its usage definitely soared after people started pairing it with gensect. I'm not really sure how good of a representation the stats are of genesect's presence, because of course it was introduced in the turmoil of BW2. The first month it was out, genesect was lower than its final position, but it started climbing. Other things started dropping, simply because of the reason they weren't genesect. Chances are if something could do a job genesect might very well have been able to do it better. It combined the versatility of jirachi with the typing and power of scizor. While swift swim, skymin, and moody were explosions of popularity that instantly took over the metagame, genesect exuded dominance more slowly. I'm sure if time had been given the stats would have changed as everything shaped around genesect; it just was banned before I think we truly saw what his meta would have become.

    And no, I've never played GSC, though I know Snorlax is definitely the most dominating pokemon, I should think about what I'm writing before I post something that fast. I started in DPP, so imo genesect is the most dominating out of anything I've played so far. I just put too much fanboy opinion in my post.

    Aspect of pokemon really was a word choice thing, but, taking out mechanics changes (like the special split, EVs, natures, critical hits), I believe genesect to be as dominating as any ability or entry hazard.
  24. SlimMan

    SlimMan

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    Oh, I'll grant you that Genesect took a while to get the ball rolling. I actually discounted August 2012 when I talked about usage stats, because no one really knew what the thing was capable of for at least a month, haha. And sure, GeneTrio did become an extremely common (and obnoxiously hard to beat) core. GeneTrio singlehandedly created sets like Shed Shell Heatran, sets which fell completely off the face of the earth after Genesect got banned. And before I leave the topic of usage stats, I'd like to admit that Genesect is the only Pokemon to knock Scizor off the #1 pedestal this entire Gen, iirc (not gonna go back and check it though).

    Genesect, to his credit, also made pretty much every battle extremely formulaic, to the point where they all play out the same. Unlike with other Suspects (*coughTornadus-Tcough*), you couldn't really play around Genesect because of U-Turn. Tornadus-T's U-Turn did like no damage unless your name was Alakazam, but Genesect's U-Turn seriously hurt, especially with a Download boost half the time (which also led to Pokemon investing significant EVs just to avoid giving it the wrong boost). Genesect's U-Turn spamming made it about as close to uncounterable as anything else has been IMO.

    But when it's all said and done, I think most of Genesect's dominance had a different source than other Pokemon. Swift Swim's dominance came from the fact that it was ridiculously overpowered, and after Ferrothorn got worn down you lost. As a result of that power, it became extremely popular. Genesect became extremely popular because of its "versatility of Jirachi and power of Scizor", and exuded dominance as a result of its omnipresence. Okay, maybe that's not very clear. Let me know if I need to clarify this point better.

    I also started in DP, relatively early on in the Gen, but in Gen 4 nonetheless. I've only played GSC retroactively. I don't play GSC seriously really, but it is my favorite tier/Gen ever! <3

    Alright, sorry for nitpicking then. Honestly, I think we're gonna have to agree to disagree here. I mean, I think Genesect was insanely good, but I would personally put it near the bottom of this list tbh.
  25. HabibsHotDogs

    HabibsHotDogs

    Joined:
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    260
    Now Politoed is by far the biggest influence in OU and its not even really a contest. But I would like to bring to everybody's attention the ONLY pokemon that almost singlehandedly (in tandem with Excadrill) forced some of OU's top threats (such as Terrakion, Haxorus and Hydreigon) to the very bottom of OU during its reign, and in some cases, even causing otherwise stable OU threats to drop to UU or BL (Terrakion & Hydreigon).

    [​IMG]

    Rains number one abuser could fire off incredibly high powered moves of 95 SpAtk with over 500 speed! In an exclusive tier where no viable scarfed pokemon could get the jump on it, Kingdra was a real menace in OU.

    When you consider its sole weakness being to a type that:

    -Has no priority
    -Has users weak to one of Kingdra's STABS
    -Is RARELY used for "coverage"
    -Has no user that could match Kingdra speed barring other Kingdra

    You could see why "checking" Kingdra was something only defensive pokemon could do.

    And with only Ferrothorn and Empoleon resisting both of its 140 and 180 BP STABs it was incredibly difficult finding a pokemon to switch into it.

    Even Blissey feared Kingdra as it could viably run a physically offensive set with little oppurtunity cost, threatening to 2hko Skarmory in rain at +1 with waterfall after just a little residual damage!

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