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The Wrath Of (Kangas)Khan (Mixed Tier Team)

Discussion in 'BW OU Teams' started by Hopkinc1, Jul 24, 2013.

  1. Hopkinc1

    Hopkinc1

    Joined:
    May 14, 2013
    Messages:
    104
    Hello there Smogon! It has been quite a while since I have been here posting a RMT. I've been on a bit of a Haitus because of vacation, work, and many other factors; however, I'm back! Today, I got an OU/Mixed Tier team for you all! I love this team, and it has been doing very well on Wi-Fi; however I haven't really brought this team to Showdown because Showdown (in my opinion) is a more competative environment while battling over Wi-Fi is just for fun, and that's what I made this team for. So, without adieu, I give you all:​
    THE WRATH OF (Kangas)KHAN
    [​IMG]Introduction: Why Kangaskhan and Why Mixed Tier?[​IMG]
    No, this isn't a Star Trek themed team, but the first minute and 15 seconds of the video fits the build perfectly. This team was based around a remnant from Gen1 and Gen2 OU, and one of the most underrated pokemon in the game: Kangaskhan. Why Kangaskhan you ask? How could he be viable in OU? Well, I'll get to why he is viable down below when we talk about the team, but why I used him is a more simple answer. I love Kangaskhan. The Kangaroo has always been one of my favorite pokemon, and I have used her at any chance I could. And I can tell you this: not once has Kangaskhan failed me, in battle or in game.​
    Now, why do I play Mixed Tier? Well to me, mixed tier is a lot more fun than standard OU for one reason: in mixed tier, people will bring aything. Yeah, technically in OU, you can bring any Pokemon that you want; however, 99% of teams I battle bring at least one or more of these:​
    [​IMG] Scizor [​IMG]
    [​IMG] Salamence [​IMG]
    [​IMG] Some Kind of Weather [​IMG]
    [​IMG] Ferrothorn/Forretress [​IMG]
    [​IMG] Keldeo [​IMG]
    [​IMG] Terrakion [​IMG]
    To me, that is boring, using the same 51 Pokemon over and over again! Yes, they are powerful, and yes they do get the job done, but after a while it gets dull. I love using Mixed Tier because we also get Pokemon from other tiers, such as RU, NU, even PU fighting pokemon from OU, while they kick ass and take names! People like The Etika World Network are huge influences to me because of the way that they play, using underappreciated pokemon and even some OU pokemon in new and innovative ways. THAT my friends, is why I love Mixed Tier. Anyway, onto the First Looks at the Team:​
    [​IMG]First Look at the Team:[​IMG]
    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    [​IMG]Team Building Process:[​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    For this build I wanted to challenge myself: Build an OU /Mixed Tier Team based around The Kangaroo, Kangaskhan. For this, I needed Kangaskhan, as most Pokemon on this team are based around supporting it.​
    [​IMG][​IMG]
    I needed a good Entry Hazard Setter and a spinblocker to Support Kangaskhan, and these were the two I chose for the team. Nidqueen has both Stealth Rocks and Toxic Spikes, but if the other team has a poison type Pokemon, I opt not to use Toxic Spikes. Spiritomb is my Spin Blocker and provides Curse Support to force Switches into Hazards.​
    [​IMG][​IMG]
    I wanted an effective Defensive core, and This core is pretty unbeatable. Quagsire takes at most Neutral Damage from everything except grass, and Celebi happens to resist Grass. This is a standard Quagsire set, but Celebi's set...well You'll see.​
    [​IMG]
    Finally, I needed a special attacker in case a physical wall/dragon came around to Decimate Kangaskhan It is a standard Flame Charge Heatran, but this is a very effective set. He comes in on an obvious fire move, then on the switch he Flame Charges, and then is poised to sweep everything barring Blissey.​
    [​IMG]The Team:[​IMG]
    (Note: All Changes made are in red)
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    [​IMG][​IMG]/[​IMG][​IMG]
    Trait: Poison Point​
    EVs: 252 Def / 252 HP / 4 Atk​
    Impish Nature​
    [​IMG]Toxic Spikes
    [​IMG]Stealth Rock
    [​IMG]Super Fang
    [​IMG]Roar
    [​IMG]The first thing you might notice about this set for Nidoqueen is the lack of Sheer Force. "Why are you lacking Sheer Force?" you might ask, "It is clearly the better choice." Well, not in this case. See, If I were using a coverage move, such as Thunderbolt, Ice Beam, Flamethrower, etc. then yes. I would be using Sheer Force, because come on, having the equivalent of a Life orb without recoil? Who wouldn't want that? But look at the move set. We got Super Fang in there instead. Why Super Fang you might ask? The answer is simple. Nidoqueen goes in, sets up hazards, and then weakens Pokemon I know Kangaskhan can't kill on his own. This includes Ferrothorn, Forretress, and any extremely Physically Bulky Pokemon. This also means that Nidoqueen doesn't care about getting burned because the damage he puts out is pretty consistent. This set up for Nidoqueen isn't meant to kill, it is purely support, and on this team This Nidoqueen set up does the job well.​
    ___________________________________________________________________​
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    Trait: Scrappy​
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spd​
    Jolly Nature​
    [​IMG]Return
    [​IMG]Drain Punch
    [​IMG]Earthquake
    [​IMG]Sucker Punch
    [​IMG]This is a very strange site, even in Mixed Tier. A Kangaskhan? Why would anyone use a Kangaskhan? What could possibly come out of using this guy? Well, there is a bit of a surprise factor with him. See, Kangaskhans low use, even in NU, has actually given me a slight advantage. Because of his little to no use in OU (which is what most people play), not many people know about his gem of an ability: Scrappy. I want to argue that Scrappy is the BEST ability in the game because of how it allows you to hit Ghost type Pokemon with Normal types and Fighting Types, and in Mixed Tier, you will see a lot of ghost types. I have had countless people switch Spiritomb or Sableye into this thing only to get demolished by a drain punch, and then have them cry about losing their troll/wall. He also has a great move in Earthquake, with it dealing damage to those Rock and Steel Types that want to switch in on its STAB. Sucker Punch is just to get some damage on a Pokemon before (if) he goes down. I am telling you all, THIS is the most underrated Pokemon in the current Metagame.​

    ___________________________________________________________________​
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    [​IMG][​IMG]/[​IMG][​IMG]
    Trait: Natural Cure​
    EVs: 220 SDef / 252 HP / 36 Spd​
    Calm Nature​
    [​IMG]Giga Drain
    [​IMG]Recover
    [​IMG]Thunder Wave
    [​IMG]Heal Bell
    [​IMG]So originally, here, I had a Sub/Seeding Celebi, and I love that thing. However, I was told it was unviable, and as much as I disagree with that, the more I played with it, the more i figured out that it wasn't the right fit for my team. So, I decided to go with another set that I don't see too often: The Cleric Set. This set is one of my favorite that I used to use all the time. Giga Drain and Recover along with Leftovers gives Celebi a high amount of Recovery, while Thunder Wave slows down threats enough for Kangaskhan to deal with them. Finally, Heal bell gets rid of the status on any of my pokemon, including Burns that may happen on my Kangaskhan, as well as on any other Pokemon. Natural Cure also Allows him to switch into any status moves that I know are coming up (other than Will-O-Wisp, the better choice there is Heatran.)
    ___________________________________________________________________​
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    [​IMG][​IMG]/[​IMG][​IMG]
    Trait: Flash Fire​
    EVs: 128 HP / 180 SAtk / 200 Spd​
    IV's: 30 Atk / 30 Def​
    Modest Nature​
    [​IMG]Fire Blast
    [​IMG]Earth Power
    [​IMG]Hidden Power Ice
    [​IMG]Flame Charge
    [​IMG] Yeah, I admit. It is a little hypocritical of me to complain about people always using the same Pokemon on their teams and then have the most used OU Pokemon in DPP on my team. But Heatran in this case has a role on the team that is crucial: The Special Attacker. He can rip through any physical wall that is giving Kangaskhan problems, and when Combined with Celebi and Quagsire, I have a resist on my team for every type of Pokemon in the current metagame (when Fairy type comes out we will see if that changes). The idea is bring him on a Fire Type Move (A Will-O-Wisp from Sableye, something like that) to get the Flash Fire Boost, then on the switch use your Flame Charge to up your speed, then sweep the opponents team. 30 IV's in speed would make HP Ice as well, but you need your speed more than you do your Atk and Def, and lets be honest...One Defense EV isn't gonna save you when this guy gets EQ'd.​
    ___________________________________________________________________​
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    [​IMG][​IMG]/[​IMG][​IMG]
    Trait: Pressure​
    EVs: 252 HP / 192 Atk / 56 SDef / 8 Spd​
    Adamant Nature​
    [​IMG]Foul Play
    [​IMG]Curse
    [​IMG]Pain Split
    [​IMG]Sucker Punch
    [​IMG]Ah Spiritomb, my reliable spinblocker. He doesn't need to worry about Psychic attacks or Normal Fighting usually (thanks to no one using Foresight or Pokemon with Scrappy), and He can really deal some damage as well. I feel like Infiltrator would be a better ability for Spiritomb (at least this set) to deal with Dual Screeners, but I'm not entirely sure. As for the move set, it is fairly Standard, except for the use of Curse. This puts pressure on Pokemon to switch out, and on the switch he can Pain Split to get his Health back. Foul Play is for those pokemon with high attack stats that switch in, and sucker punch is for damage when I know I'm going to get attacked by something.​
    ___________________________________________________________________​
    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    [​IMG][​IMG]/[​IMG][​IMG]
    Trait: Unaware​
    EVs: 252 Def / 252 HP / 4 Atk​
    Impish Nature​
    [​IMG]Waterfall
    [​IMG]Toxic
    [​IMG]Recover
    [​IMG]Stockpile
    [​IMG]Quagsire is that Pokemon that says "Give me your best fucking shot." Then he takes it like a man (unless it's a grass move of course), then can do one of several things. He can either: (a) Recover the Damage, (b) toxic you, (c) hit you with a Waterfall. On a forced switch, he can either stockpile and get his defenses up, or he can recover off the damage. And thanks to his ability, Unaware, your Swords Dance that you used before, it isn't going to do diddlysquat. Quagsire is one Monster of a physical wall, and one that shouldn't be taken lightly. It is a standard Smogon set, but that is the set that works the best with this team; I tried a curse set, but it lacked the defensive ability this one had.​
    ___________________________________________________________________
    [​IMG]Closing Thoughts:[​IMG]
    I hope that you all enjoyed this Mixed Tier team! Please feel free to give me any feedback that you would like to give me, I will take almost any request. Keep this in mind though: It is mixed tier. That means do NOT give me advice saying to switch all my pokemon to a purely OU and UU team. Give me some RU Pokemon you think will work better, or even some NU Pokemon! Also keep in mind that this team is build around Kangaskhan, so I will NOT be switching him out; however, any set changes on him you think would be helpful, i will happily try out. Thank you everyone and Enjoy!​
    scotti likes this.
  2. Lampent

    Lampent

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2013
    Messages:
    28
    Hello there. I really like the originality here, which is something I value very highly. However, there's a fine line between originality and unviability, and I need you to understand that. Originality is the usage of a set/pokemon that has a specific niche/surprise factor. Though you talk about that a lot, I would like to give you some suggestions. However, this is only my opinion, and I am in no way bashing your team.

    Starting off, your Celebi set is just unviable. Though it certainly has "surprise factor", it really isn't enough. For example, a scarf Rotom-W with HP Fire is the example of originality: it uses surprise to KO a common threat. However, on Celebi's case after one use of Leech Seed the surprise is gone, and because Leech Seed works gradually there is really no reason to commit to it. Replace Thick Root with Leftovers, and change Substitute with Recover.

    Next, on Quagsire, change Earthquake with Stockpile. Quagsire is an excellent boosting tank similar to Sigilyph, and Stockpile makes Quagsire nearly impossible to break through bar a HP Grass or a critical hit. Waterfall hits everything equally, while Earthquake has immunities. Water absorb pokemon is taken out with Scald.

    On Nido, I reccomend a standard Sheer Force set. Because if its super wide coverage, it often can do more damage than Super Fang, making it obsolete. A moveset of Stealth Rock / Ice Beam / Thunderbolt / Earth Power.

    Finally, though it may seem a bit harsh, take Khan out. It is just too outclassed to be viable in OU. There's a lot more Steels than Ghosts in OU, and anything like Ferrothorn can paralyze you, taking Drain Punch with ease, and wearing you out with Leech Seed, Iron Barbs, Rocky Helmet, Life Orb... You'll be dead in 3 turns. To replace it, I would suggest Life Orb Keldeo. It's dual STABs can easily clean up late game.

    Finishing off, originality for the sake of originality often doesn't work. If it holds a specific niche that your team needs... go for it! However, you should have good reasons why it doesn't get outclassed.

    Anyway, hope I helped! Good luck!
  3. Hopkinc1

    Hopkinc1

    Joined:
    May 14, 2013
    Messages:
    104
    Hey man! Thanks for your suggestions man! All of them are very true in many ways, so give me a minute to respond to them :)

    Celebi: Okay, I see what you mean, and I'll try a more standard set with a slight twist. Granted, this set for my Celebi hasn't been doing badly; i usually bring it in after all the grass/steel types are dead, but I do see how this set is kind of unviable in most situations. I'll work on the set and make it a bit more...i don't wanna stay standard, but I'll definitely work on the set a bit. If you got any other suggestions on this let me know :)

    Quagsire: Very good point, I never thought about that. Looking at my team again, I got 3 pokemon with Earth Moves, so I think I'm actually good with that anyway. I'll make this change :)

    Nidoqueen: I'll definitely try it, but keep in mind that she is support for Kangaskhan, and wasn't really built to kill Pokemon outright, which is why I have toxic stalling with poison point on here, toxic spikes, etc. I'll give it a try though! One thing also: If I do end up making this a full on attacking set, would you agree that it would be a good idea to switch this set to Nidoking(which I use all the frickin' time, love Nidoking :P)? I know thats mostly a question whether I want more bulk or not but what do you think?

    Kangaskhan: I just can't do it man...I love Kangaskhan too much. And keep this in mind also: Yeah, sometimes I fight teams that are mostly OU and UU, but I mostly fight Mixed Tier teams. Because I'm mostly doing Mixed Tier, there are a lot of RU and NU Pokemon in that game, and THAT is where Kangaskhan really shines. Plus, Keldeo is Special (which I already have with Heatran) and Kangaskhan is Physical so the two different Pokemon (other than using secret sword) aren't really interchangeable.... Trust me, I do see what you are saying and it may seem dumb that I'm knocking this suggestion down, but again, I'm mostly fighting Mixed Tier teams, not OU, so in this case Kangaskhan is viable. Thats part of the reason I haven't really brought this team to showdown and just keeping it on WiFi :)

    I'll also edit this to make it a bit more clear that I'm playing against other mixed tier teams, I do talk about OU a lot and I can see how it seems like I'm just playing a lot of fully OU teams, but that isn't the case :)
  4. Hopkinc1

    Hopkinc1

    Joined:
    May 14, 2013
    Messages:
    104
    Bumping this anyone else got any suggestions?
  5. Goddess Briyella

    Goddess Briyella Nido Goddess: Sheer Force & 2 Life Orbs
    is a Tutoris a member of the Site Staffis a Forum Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Smogon Media Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Battle Server Moderator
    Moderator

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    Hi Hopkinc1!

    This is a cool team you have here around Kangaskhan. I absolutely love the originality presented here, but I'll have to agree with Lampent in that this team lacks viability. A Rain team with Tornadus will storm through this team. A Sun team with a Fighting type will do the same, and so will a Sand team with Celebi or Breloom. Heatran is the only thing on the team that's keeping a long list of other things from steamrolling through this entire team, and really, against six Pokemon, its Balloon will be popped by something and it will be destroyed with Earthquake or a Rain boosted Water attack. Terrakion alone mows through this team if it has X-scissor, and the same can be said about Keldeo if it's running HP Bug for Celebi. It's almost impossible to try and offer suggestions to help the team improve when there isn't very much to build on. :(

    Nidoqueen definitely wants the standard Sheer Force set if you're going to use it, but even then, it's outclassed in OU by faster mons with lots of coverage like Starmie.

    With that being said, I definitely respect the originality, but I recommend building another team from scratch if you're going to play OU. And if this isn't an OU team, perhaps you posted this RMT in the wrong thread. I don't mean to seem harsh but there really isn't enough to work with here without changing the entire team. :(

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