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Gen 6 thought exercise
- Thread starter dice
- Start date
well I've already built one lol, seems to be p solid
most teams these days don't have a reliable kyu-w switchin, basically I took a few defensive mons to wear down and status stuff and slapped on sd groundceus to clean and take care of the bulky steels that occasionally switch into kyu
I won't go into depth here but you can always message me
most teams these days don't have a reliable kyu-w switchin, basically I took a few defensive mons to wear down and status stuff and slapped on sd groundceus to clean and take care of the bulky steels that occasionally switch into kyu
I won't go into depth here but you can always message me
I'd use TWave support Groudon to check Steel and Fairy types while paralyzing stuff like bulky Arceus. Anti-hazard measures are an absolute necessity so I'd consider pairing a Choice Specs set with both Mega Diancie (Ho-Oh check / temporary hazard repellant) and a Defog Arceus (Lati@s in not necessary with Groudon / Kyurem-W, just make sure the Arceus can check Groudon). Life Orb Kyurem sets can deal with Ho-Oh, opening up the possibility to use Mega Sableye or perhaps even a sole Defog user.
Building with this mons seems really restrictive, leading to predictable builds. It's certainly viable because the Dragon and Ice checks in this tier lack reliable recovery, but Kyurem itself often gets worn down too quickly before it can wallbreak that much. Need I mention that wretched defensive typing...I sincerely prefer Ice Arceus to this.
Building with this mons seems really restrictive, leading to predictable builds. It's certainly viable because the Dragon and Ice checks in this tier lack reliable recovery, but Kyurem itself often gets worn down too quickly before it can wallbreak that much. Need I mention that wretched defensive typing...I sincerely prefer Ice Arceus to this.
mags
Banned deucer.
I don't like using defog with it or magic bounce. Defensive inclined teams that would use mega sableye or support arcs to defog need 5 other mons to fill in defensive roles imo. I mean having a mon that has offensive pressure on defensive teams will usually be ho-oh and is kinda similar to kyurem-white. They both kinda nuke shit , both are weak to rocks, and both are kinda slow. But ho-oh has defensive niches and kyurem doesn't. I just haven't made a kyurem team that was good enough for me not to delete but when I tried i liked more offensive teams. Trying to keep rocks off will just give the other team more chances to break holes in the team which will be even easier with kyurem pulling 0 weight defensively. Maybe hyper offense with rapid spin?? idk its kinda dumb but tbh i feel like on hyper offense u can run like lead exca that can spin and help with keys or try deo s but it can always be replaced with a better mon. That way the team stays offensive instead of balance/stall fuck man this mon sucks :(
absolute best wallbreaker in the tier
...eh, not quite. It can struggle versus standard stall because Blissey just diddles on it for eternity, and against hyper offense it's usually just gonna either A) take a hit, kill something, and die or B) die. What it is good at doing though is smashing balance teams - their sturdiest Ice resist is usually bulky Arceus-Water which can be taken down by Draco Meteor, it obviously has coverage moves to take down Steels, and nothing else really wants to take Ice Beam especially considering fast Ho-Oh seems to be growing in popularity over bulky Ho-Oh.
Since you asked for thought processes I'll actually try making a team with it. So a good starting point for building with this mon seems to be pairing it with offensive stuff that can take advantage of weakened Ice resists. Fast Specs/LO is probably best here to take full advantage of Kyurem-W's power. I personally prefer LO for flexibility + Roost access, but either is fine.
One thing that actually sprung to mind as a partner is OTR Bronzong. It loves having fat Waters and Steels (Waterceus, POgre, Keys, Zonger, Aegis, Zor, etc) out of the way and it covers a ton of enemy threats (Lati@s, Mega Diancie, Xerneas, Salamence, Arceus-Ground, Groudon w/o Plume) at the same time, which helps make up for Kyurem-W being lame defensively. They are all good against the team archetypes the other is bad against, which is helpful for obvious reasons.
So we're starting with this:
LO Kyurem-W / OTR Bronzong
First, let's get the obvious teammate out of the way:
LO Kyurem-W / OTR Bronzong / Primal Groudon (set undecided, but will probably be the rocker)
After that it's pretty much covering the basics: hazard control and checks to PDon, Ho-Oh, CM Arc, EKiller, and Darkrai. I also want something else to help with the stall matchup because Blissey stalls look rather mean at the moment. We can help with hazard control, Ho-Oh, and the Dark resist by choosing Mega Diancie. Typewise it has great synergy with our main offensive core and is a formidable offensive threat itself, and it likes having Kyurem-W to wear down bulky Steels and Waters that are often its main checks.
LO Kyurem-W / OTR Bronzong / Primal Groudon (SR) / Mega Diancie
We can handle CM Arceus and Darkrai with CB Ho-Oh, which also doubles as a great stallbreaker in conjunction with the rest of the team. We're going to need strong anti-hazard support already with Kyurem-W on the team, so it's not big deal to include Ho-Oh.
LO Kyurem-W / OTR Bronzong / Primal Groudon (SR) / Mega Diancie / CB Ho-Oh
Our last slot absolutely has to be a Defogger, and it needs to be able to help against Primal Groudon, Ho-Oh, and EKiller. Looks like it's gonna be some kind of Arceus. This is actually a little annoying to work out though, as no Arceus variant covers all three of them as well as I would like. Wisp Dragon Arceus does come pretty close though. It's not the best EKiller check by any means and without Toxic it has some trouble dealing with Groudon, but I have Bronzong to act as backup against Fire-less PDon and Ghost-less EKiller, as well as Mega Diancie and my own Primal Groudon to help check Ho-Oh, so it can at least do what I need it to do.
LO Kyurem-W / OTR Bronzong / Primal Groudon (SR) / Mega Diancie / CB Ho-Oh / Wisp Arceus-Dragon (shoutouts Hack)
And that's what I ended up with. It feels alright, and Kyurem-W baits things that stuff like Rayquaza/Palkia don't so it seems like it has good offensive synergy here. That said, the shakiness versus EKiller is still annoying. Having Wisp non-Ghost Arceus as the only check isn't the best thing in the world, but the Arceus slot really needs the Fire resist for PDon/Ho-Oh so it pretty much has to be this. Stone Edge Giratina-O might work over Dragceus but it can still be overwhelmed easily and not having an Arceus forme in ORAS is meh.
Using the Mega on Gengar or Sableye could also lead you into an interesting new direction, but Diancie has good synergy offensively with Kyu and I'm a fan of Diancie in general so...
Overall, building with Kyurem-W is very tricky as it has very little defensive synergy, not resisting much and requiring extensive anti-hazard support to make the most out of it. It also doesn't accomplish much against hyper offense due to said bad defensive typing and lack of boosting options. I tried though!
(also hyw that team is too weak to geoxern)
...eh, not quite. It can struggle versus standard stall because Blissey just diddles on it for eternity, and against hyper offense it's usually just gonna either A) take a hit, kill something, and die or B) die. What it is good at doing though is smashing balance teams - their sturdiest Ice resist is usually bulky Arceus-Water which can be taken down by Draco Meteor, it obviously has coverage moves to take down Steels, and nothing else really wants to take Ice Beam especially considering fast Ho-Oh seems to be growing in popularity over bulky Ho-Oh.
Since you asked for thought processes I'll actually try making a team with it. So a good starting point for building with this mon seems to be pairing it with offensive stuff that can take advantage of weakened Ice resists. Fast Specs/LO is probably best here to take full advantage of Kyurem-W's power. I personally prefer LO for flexibility + Roost access, but either is fine.
One thing that actually sprung to mind as a partner is OTR Bronzong. It loves having fat Waters and Steels (Waterceus, POgre, Keys, Zonger, Aegis, Zor, etc) out of the way and it covers a ton of enemy threats (Lati@s, Mega Diancie, Xerneas, Salamence, Arceus-Ground, Groudon w/o Plume) at the same time, which helps make up for Kyurem-W being lame defensively. They are all good against the team archetypes the other is bad against, which is helpful for obvious reasons.
So we're starting with this:
LO Kyurem-W / OTR Bronzong
First, let's get the obvious teammate out of the way:
LO Kyurem-W / OTR Bronzong / Primal Groudon (set undecided, but will probably be the rocker)
After that it's pretty much covering the basics: hazard control and checks to PDon, Ho-Oh, CM Arc, EKiller, and Darkrai. I also want something else to help with the stall matchup because Blissey stalls look rather mean at the moment. We can help with hazard control, Ho-Oh, and the Dark resist by choosing Mega Diancie. Typewise it has great synergy with our main offensive core and is a formidable offensive threat itself, and it likes having Kyurem-W to wear down bulky Steels and Waters that are often its main checks.
LO Kyurem-W / OTR Bronzong / Primal Groudon (SR) / Mega Diancie
We can handle CM Arceus and Darkrai with CB Ho-Oh, which also doubles as a great stallbreaker in conjunction with the rest of the team. We're going to need strong anti-hazard support already with Kyurem-W on the team, so it's not big deal to include Ho-Oh.
LO Kyurem-W / OTR Bronzong / Primal Groudon (SR) / Mega Diancie / CB Ho-Oh
Our last slot absolutely has to be a Defogger, and it needs to be able to help against Primal Groudon, Ho-Oh, and EKiller. Looks like it's gonna be some kind of Arceus. This is actually a little annoying to work out though, as no Arceus variant covers all three of them as well as I would like. Wisp Dragon Arceus does come pretty close though. It's not the best EKiller check by any means and without Toxic it has some trouble dealing with Groudon, but I have Bronzong to act as backup against Fire-less PDon and Ghost-less EKiller, as well as Mega Diancie and my own Primal Groudon to help check Ho-Oh, so it can at least do what I need it to do.
LO Kyurem-W / OTR Bronzong / Primal Groudon (SR) / Mega Diancie / CB Ho-Oh / Wisp Arceus-Dragon (shoutouts Hack)
And that's what I ended up with. It feels alright, and Kyurem-W baits things that stuff like Rayquaza/Palkia don't so it seems like it has good offensive synergy here. That said, the shakiness versus EKiller is still annoying. Having Wisp non-Ghost Arceus as the only check isn't the best thing in the world, but the Arceus slot really needs the Fire resist for PDon/Ho-Oh so it pretty much has to be this. Stone Edge Giratina-O might work over Dragceus but it can still be overwhelmed easily and not having an Arceus forme in ORAS is meh.
Using the Mega on Gengar or Sableye could also lead you into an interesting new direction, but Diancie has good synergy offensively with Kyu and I'm a fan of Diancie in general so...
Overall, building with Kyurem-W is very tricky as it has very little defensive synergy, not resisting much and requiring extensive anti-hazard support to make the most out of it. It also doesn't accomplish much against hyper offense due to said bad defensive typing and lack of boosting options. I tried though!
(also hyw that team is too weak to geoxern)
It is the best wallbreaker in the tier, yes, but requires more support than your average wallbreaker.
The good news is that its best partner, Primal Groudon, happens to be the best mon in the tier. Its second best partner, Mega Gengar, is also very viable, though it has a rather high opportunity cost being a mega.
Nothing is safe from a Kyu-W + P.Don + M. Gengar core in ubers, so after estabilishing this fact we need to cover their weaknesses from a defensive standpoint.
You definitely want a defogger and a ground immunity, so Lati@s or Giratina-O should be considered for that purpose. However both of them share a dragon weakness with Kyurem (the fairy weakness is already covered by Groudon and Gengar) so you might want to consider a fairy type to cover that. Xerneas is always an excellent option as it can be either offensive or supportive and its 2 uncommon weaknesses are already covered by P. Don.
As for the sixth member an Arceus forme is probably your safest bet, though I can't say which one is the best in this scenario. If your Primal Groudon isn't running a sweeper (and it's running SR) set then the classic Extremekiller should work, otherwise you could use a support forme.
tl;dr if you plan to use Kyurem-W this is the best possible team:
Kyurem-W
Primal Groudon
Mega Gengar
Giratina-O/Lati@s
Xerneas
Arceus forme
The good news is that its best partner, Primal Groudon, happens to be the best mon in the tier. Its second best partner, Mega Gengar, is also very viable, though it has a rather high opportunity cost being a mega.
Nothing is safe from a Kyu-W + P.Don + M. Gengar core in ubers, so after estabilishing this fact we need to cover their weaknesses from a defensive standpoint.
You definitely want a defogger and a ground immunity, so Lati@s or Giratina-O should be considered for that purpose. However both of them share a dragon weakness with Kyurem (the fairy weakness is already covered by Groudon and Gengar) so you might want to consider a fairy type to cover that. Xerneas is always an excellent option as it can be either offensive or supportive and its 2 uncommon weaknesses are already covered by P. Don.
As for the sixth member an Arceus forme is probably your safest bet, though I can't say which one is the best in this scenario. If your Primal Groudon isn't running a sweeper (and it's running SR) set then the classic Extremekiller should work, otherwise you could use a support forme.
tl;dr if you plan to use Kyurem-W this is the best possible team:
Kyurem-W
Primal Groudon
Mega Gengar
Giratina-O/Lati@s
Xerneas
Arceus forme
Thugly Duckling
I play TCG now
Honestly your memes are epic lol
so kyuw is good vs stuff thats good vs pdon (lugia, support arc ground), they share a common check in arc water so id run twave sd donner + lo kyuw to wear it down for both. sd pdon is also good vs the stuff that walls kyuw like chansey, and kyuw gives a water resist for pdon and weakens shit like bronzong for it. with those mons settled on to the rest of team, i can either use excadrill or deos for rocks since this team is more offensively inclined, im going to use exca since to get rocks up vs sayb and pressure arc water more by getting it toxicd / weak, this means i need a good countermeasure for darkrai and mence since thats the problem with exca lead. for that ill settle with a icywind / focus blast / tect / sball mgar set it does good vs those threats and serves as a good mence lure (credit steelphoenix). ok with kyuw, exca , pdon , mgar im really weak to jolly don or rp pdon to remedy that a little i can something like ray or latios as a shaky offensive check, ill settle with cm latios since it can clean after kyuw hits most of the steels that get in its way with cleaning. Last slot could use something with cleaning potential after stuff is weakened so ill settle with ekiller to finish the job and make sure i dont get swept by stuff like aroma geoxern etc. i realize this team is pretty shit, but so is kyuw. also this is the only 5 minute build i could come up with that doesnt mirror something someone else has posted, https://paste.ee/p/Jek1J