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Thousand Sunny - A UU sun team (peaked 1938 ACRE)

Discussion in 'BW Other Teams' started by Purple Grind, Jul 11, 2013.

  1. Purple Grind

    Purple Grind

    Feb 1, 2012
    Thousand Sunny is a sun team I made quite quickly while trying to make a usable sun team. I've found this team surprisingly good considering how rare manual sun is. I sorta made it as a joke but used properly it is quite good. I don't think I've ever seen a team that I have no chance of winning against, not to say that there aren't annoyances.

    At a glance:
    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]

    After I decided to make a manual sun team the first pokemon I chose was Arcanine because he's one of the few fire types with the bulk to set up sunny day.

    Next I thought I'd add another sunny day inducer, so that I could set up the sun more reliably. After a bit of looking around I decided on Cresselia.
    [​IMG] [​IMG]

    Now I needed some sun abusers, and pokemon that could coordinate well with each other. I decided on the pair of Victini and Liligant.
    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG]

    Now I had to patch up some weaknesses. Chandelure looked particularly annoying, and I didn't really have any special attack absorbers so Snorlax was an obvious choice.
    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]

    Last I needed a pokemon to help take hits here and there as well as give some defense vs opposing fire types so I went with Milotic.
    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]

    Here are the sets I ran:

    Arcanine @ Leftovers
    Trait: Intimidate
    EVs: 192 HP / 248 SAtk / 4 SDef / 64 Spd
    Modest Nature
    - Morning Sun
    - Sunny Day
    - Fire Blast
    - SolarBeam
    Sunny day Arcanine ripped straight off of smogon. This Arcanine needs the sun to function properly and can set it up himself if it isn’t up already. Despite having a slightly lower special attack, Arcanine’s fire blast still hits incredibly hard under the sun. Between intimidate, natural bulk, sunny day taking away his water weakness, leftovers and a boosted morning sun, this variant of Arcanine has great survivability. Solar beam compliments fire blast well, hitting unsuspecting Rhyperior or bulky waters that think they can come in and rain on his parade. This Arcanine is an invaluable member of the team, and forms one part of my offensive core.

    Snorlax @ Leftovers
    Trait: Thick Fat
    EVs: 80 HP / 176 SDef / 252 Atk
    Adamant Nature
    - Return
    - Fire Punch
    - Earthquake
    - Pursuit
    This Snorlax set is the standard and seen everywhere for a reason; Snorlax is great. This snorlax acts as a special tank and answer to some particularly annoying threats, namely Chandelure. That thing is so annoying, its flash fire stops me from freely spamming fire type moves and it gets a free switchin to my Arcanine which it completely walls. Fortunately, all I have to do when I see a Chandelure is bring in my Snorlax. Not only does he resist both stabs but he has pursuit to really put a hurt on that thing. I’m perfectly ok with letting my snorlax get tricked or burned while killing a Chandelure as the mere presence of a flash fire user alters the way I play quite drastically. I gave Snorlax fire punch over crunch to help with bronzong and stuff and help take advantage of sun, but crunch would still be usable.

    Lilligant (F) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Chlorophyll
    EVs: 252 Spd / 252 SAtk / 4 SDef
    Modest Nature
    - Giga Drain
    - Quiver Dance
    - Sleep Powder
    - Hidden Power [Rock]
    Lilligant is an offensive powerhouse. I have ended many games with a Lilligant sweep. With chlorophyll she can act as a failsafe revenge killer in the sun, outspeeding every common scarf user in the tier. Even without the sun she can still wreak havoc on teams that underestimate her. Sleep powder is a great move on a setup sweeper, although the accuracy is infuriating at times. I went with hp rock instead of the sun boosted hp fire because I felt like I already had enough fire type coverage on my team and being able to kill opposing fire types is incredibly handy. Hp rock just works better with this team. Lilligant is the second part of my offensive core, and does her job incredibly well.

    Victini @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Victory Star
    EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4 SDef
    Jolly Nature
    - V-create
    - Bolt Strike
    - U-turn
    - Zen Headbutt
    Victini is already a threat, but under the sun he takes the word threat to a whole new meaning. To give you an idea, he will always 2hko max def eviolite Gligar under the sun. Practically nothing is safe from his sun boosted v-creates, and with a scarf attached not many pokes are going to be outspeeding him either. Victini also gives me a hard hitting physical attacker to help compliment my other two special attackers; Lilligant and Arcanine. Don’t underestimate Victini’s 100/100/100 defenses either. I’ve found that to use him to his fullest potential you need to be a little adventurous with your switches, especially if they don’t have any hazards up. Victini is an essential part of my team’s offense, and usually plays a key role in the battle.

    Cresselia (F) @ Heat Rock
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 4 SDef / 252 HP / 252 Def
    Bold Nature
    - Sunny Day
    - Moonlight
    - Psychic
    - Hidden Power [Fighting]
    Cresselia is one of the bulkiest pokes in the game, and that makes her great for this role. A heat rock helps my team make the most of her sunny days, so it’s required. Under the sun moonlight gets a boost which helps compensate for her lack of recovery item. She’s also my answer to threats like Mienshao who would otherwise walk through my team quite easily. She can also act as a status absorber without too much worry. I don’t even really mind much if she eats a toxic as she rarely stays in for more than a couple of turns anyway. When using her in battle it’s important to not get carried away with sunny day. Yes this is a sun team, but it doesn’t require constant sun to be effective. Rather keep an eye out for the opportune moment to cast sunny day and turn the tides of battle. Switching her in whenever the sun goes out just to put it up again is simply a waste of turns, and her hp. I like to keep Cresselia at a high hp throughout the battle incase I absolutely need to set up sunny day. There have been a decent number of battles that I’ve won where a threatening sweeper is about to sweep me but the amazing bulk of Cresselia has allowed me to set up a sunny day before dying, allowing my Lilligant to outspeed and ko the threat.

    Milotic @ Leftovers
    Trait: Marvel Scale
    EVs: 252 Def / 252 HP / 4 SAtk
    Bold Nature
    - Scald
    - Recover
    - Dragon Pulse
    - Toxic
    If I had to choose the weakest link on the team, it would definitely be Milotic. That’s not to say she’s bad, I just hardly ever see her do something useful. She’s needed to help me deal with certain physical attackers that the rest of my team doesn’t want to handle. This includes but is not limited to fire types like opposing Darmanitan/Victini’s. She is also my primary answer to another annoyance: rain dance Kingdra. She has decent special and physical defense, and with the 4 spa ev’s she will 2hko Kingdra with dragon pulse. I have strongly considered replacing her with Blastoise. My team is quite weak to hazards, especially stealth rocks so Blastoise is appealing in that aspect. However, I honestly think that Milotic’s access to recovery and ability to hurt Kingdra outway Blastoise’s rapid spin. Let me know if you disagree though, as I would be willing to try it (or any other poke that fills a similar role). Like I said a pokemon like Milotic is required but she rarely sees use in battles.

    As a whole, I think the team is decent. One advantage to using a sun team that it does well against opposing weather teams. Hail teams are especially easy matches, and I can go toe to toe rain teams. One shortcoming is that I don’t carry any hazards or rapid spin on this team and I have 2 pokes weak to stealth rock. This is annoying, but not as game breaking as some people think. I can usually overcome this problem; it just puts a limit on how much I can play around. Feel free to try the team out, and let me know of any suggestions you have that could improve it.
  2. GenXXZ


    Apr 11, 2013
    Haha just kidding, congrats on such a high ladder score, especially with a gimmicky team like this. Well done. Here's a couple things:

    I'm not going to say that Lilligant is a bad sun sweeper, that definitely isn't true. The thing about her is that it can take too many turns to get up to adequate sweeping potential with Quiver Dance. I believe there is one option that might be better from all the way down in NU... Victreebel. Dispite its NU status, Victreebel is usable in every tier because of the sun. It has chlorophyll, growth, and great mixed offenses. I seriouuussllyyy recommend you give Victreebel a shot.

    Mixed Sun Sweeper Victreebel

    Victreebel @ Life Orb
    Trait: Chlorophyll
    EVs: 172 Atk, 140 Sp. Atk, 196 Spd.
    Rash Nature
    -Leaf Blade/Power Whip
    -Weather Ball/HP Fire
    -Sludge Bomb/Sleep Power

    (Power Whip and Weather Ball are illegal together on a Victreebel. Yup. That's how good it is.)

    If you wanna grab the upper hand on Kingdra so badly, then how about a Scarf Flygon? That's pretty much a hard counter. It would outspeed Kingdra, even in rain. Cresselia and Snorlax are honestly all of the defensive presence you need, so I would consider giving Milotic the split and putting in Scarf Flygon. Flygon has Fire Punch as well, so it can take advantage of the sun!

    I find that Cresselia is one of those Pokemon that just shouldn't have two attacking moves. Here's why:

    0 SpA Cresselia Hidden Power Fighting vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Umbreon: 48-58 (12.18 - 14.72%) -- 9HKO at best

    As for what should be put in HP Fighting's place, I would put in either a status move, like Twave or Toxic, or Lunar Dance. Lunar Dance is pretty situational, but it can gives you the ability to set up the sun and run; it's basically a glorified memento. I'd definitely give it a go.

    That's all from me! Good luck climbing the ladder further.
  3. Halcyon.

    Halcyon. @Choice Specs
    is a Community Contributoris a Contributor to Smogon

    Dec 29, 2012
    Hey Purple Grind, cool team. It's rare to see sun used in UU, so kudos to you. It can be an extremely powerful team style if played correctly.

    The major problem I see with the team is that you have no spinner. In a tier where Spikes stacking is a regular occurrence, you definitely want to make sure your Arcanine isn't taking 50% on the switch from a full set of hazards, as well as Victini since it's Choice Scarfed and will be switching in and out often. You also mention that Milotic is your weakest link on the team. Well there is a simple solution to that issue. I would change Milotic to Blastoise. Blastoise provides much more utility to your team, since it can spin away the hazards that you hate to see piling up on your side of the field. If Kingdra is still giving you trouble, you can give Blastoise Dragon Tail to take a huge chunk out of its health and force it to have to switch back in, meaning it could be worn down even more by being hit with oncoming attacks. Not only that, but if your opponent does use rain Dance, then Blastoise will actually heal itself with rain Dish! The only downside to using Blastoise is that it doesn't have any reliable recovery outside of that. However, Blastoise is essentially an all around better bulky Water type for this team.

    Hope I was able to help! Good luck with the team!
  4. Purple Grind

    Purple Grind

    Feb 1, 2012
    Mmm k thanks for the rates so far guys! Halcyon I'll give blastoise a shot, I was already toying with the idea so thanks for the input. I'll give it dragon tail with relaxed nature to break kingdra subs.

    @genxxz I'm a bit worried about replacing lilligant with a sweeper that is completely dependent on the sun like victreebel. Lilligant can sweep with the speed boosts from quiver dance outside the sun and can even outspeed some stuff unboosted. Victreebel on the other hand is quite slow and frail. It seems to me like lilligant is the more versatile and reliable choice. That said, I might try it out with lunar dance on cresselia, that might give me a way to get victreebel in easier with more sun turns. Hp fighting on cresselia isn't useless, although you're right it's pitifully weak unless 4x super effective or 2x super effective against a poke with weak special defense. I'll try switching around that slot to see if something fits better. Thanks!
  5. PTJon7


    Dec 29, 2012
    Cool team dude

    I wonder if Mew would possibly be a good replacement for Cresselia, while you would lose a lot of bulk Mew would give you access to U-Turn and a much wider support move pool while also having a higher base speed.

    I'd say this team could really use Stealth Rocks, Rhyperior in place of Milotic could possibly work.
  6. GenXXZ


    Apr 11, 2013
    Mew could run Sunny Day and Stealth Rocks. U-Turn too. Although no recovery then I guess.

    Purple, I would still recommend giving Victreebel a shot. You're right about Lilligant being able to sweep outside of sun but... You've got eight turns of sun; that's more than enough to switch Victreebel in, set it up and hit things hard. With Lilligant, I just don't understand what getting up sun does for you, besides giving you revenge kill opportunities. Still, whatever you prefer.
  7. Explorer


    Mar 22, 2012
    Honestly, I agree that Victreebel > Lilligant since Victreebel is already plenty fast under sun and doesn't need speed boost, and it can viably hit with both physical and special attacks, letting it double as a wall breaker. However, Sludge Bomb has poor coverage and Sleep Powder is unreliable on such a frail Pokemon, so I suggest Hidden Power Ghost as a third option to get past Chandelure and Victini, which resist Leaf Blade/Power Whip and Fire Weather Ball/HP Fire, and Chandelure resists Sludge Bomb.

    Also, Mew gets Softboiled, but then Fighting-types will give the team more trouble.

    Other Changes:
    1. I would suggest is giving Arcanine a Heat Rock, because Morning Sun gives it enough recovery anyway.
    2. Milotic has incredible bulk and could possibly take advantage of Wrap or Recover over Scald/Dragon Pulse, letting it trap Pokemon such as Kingdra and wear them down, or stall out teams much better. Then you have THREE Pokemon with solid recovery.

    Overall this is a very nice-looking team that has great potential!
  8. CoolStoryBrobat

    CoolStoryBrobat The hero Smogon needs, but not the one it deserves
    is a Battle Server Moderator

    Aug 31, 2012
    Why not Hidden Power Rock? On top of still killing the guys you mentioned he would also have a better coverage move on most Flying-type switch-ins since you suggested removing Sludge Bomb, which dampens Victreebel's neutral coverage. Also HP Ghost would leave it walled by something weird, like Togekiss, who can take a Weather Ball even in sun, lol
  9. Purple Grind

    Purple Grind

    Feb 1, 2012
    I'll give victreebel a shot, but I don't think good players are going to let me set up often enough to make it worth the switch. But who knows, maybe I'm completely wrong about this. And yes hp rock would be superior to hp ghost in every way, it also hits fire types that aren't chandelure/victini.

    @explorer: I'm was already running recover on milotic lol. And wrap would never replace scald/dragon pulse, EVER.

    Mew over cresselia is a neat thought, I might test it. But as explorer said I would be weaker to fighting.

    Thanks for your input so far guys.

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