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Thundurus (Analysis)

Discussion in 'Uploaded Analyses' started by Jukain, Feb 15, 2012.

  1. Jukain

    Jukain fuck macle
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    [pimg]672[/pimg]

    [Overview]

    <p>Thundurus is enjoying free reign as one of the Pokemon brought down from Ubers to participate in the DW OU metagame. Top-notch mixed offenses and a fantastic base 111 Speed, along with a movepool that contains everything it needs, will keep Thundurus a top contender for a long time. While a weakness to Stealth Rock does no favors for Thundurus, it is mitigated by the fact that Thundurus is immune to Ground-type attacks, Spikes, and Toxic Spikes. Prankster was a gift bestowed upon Thundurus, giving it priority Taunt and Thunder Wave. Low bulk and weakness to Stealth Rock are the major problems Thundurus has, but with proper team support, Thundurus can shine.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Nasty Plot
    move 1: Nasty Plot
    move 2: Thunderbolt
    move 3: Hidden Power Ice
    move 4: Focus Blast / Substitute
    item: Life Orb / Leftovers
    ability: Prankster
    nature: Timid
    evs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    ivs: 30 Atk / 30 Def

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>This set is Thundurus's bread and butter, the reason it was banned from OU. The idea is to stack hazards, take out the opponent's Choice Scarf user, beat the opponent's special wall, set up Nasty Plot, and sweep. High Special Attack and Speed stats make Thundurus an ideal candidate for the job. Switching in on a support Pokemon or something Thundurus forces out, such as Breloom or Jellicent, is ideal, allowing Thundurus to grab a Nasty Plot on the switch. After a Nasty Plot, Thundurus hits a sky-high 698 Special Attack stat, which, alongside its excellent coverage, lets it plow through the entire metagame.</p>

    <p>Thunderbolt is of course the primary option if you are not running rain support, and still hits insanely hard. Hidden Power Ice complements Thunderbolt with coverage on the common Grass- and Ground-types in the tier, such as Serperior and Gliscor, and Focus Blast grants Thundurus super effective coverage on Ferrothorn and Tyranitar. Substitute is an option with Leftovers for a deadly Substitute + Nasty Plot set. It prevents status, specifically Thunder Wave and Toxic, and Substitute can be used in lieu of Protect, scouting out the opponent's next move. Taunt can also be used in a similar vein to Taunt + Dragon Dance Haxorus. It helps Thundurus set up on Jirachi and Ferrothorn, who otherwise pose a major pain thanks to Thunder Wave. Body Slam is still an issue with Jirachi, however, so it is best to determine if it has Body Slam or Thunder Wave before attempting to use Taunt. Taunt also prevents Breloom from setting up on Thundurus, which can be very helpful if Breloom lacks Stone Edge.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Thunder is the best choice if you can provide rain support, as it will just about OHKO everything that does not resist it, bar Tyranitar, Blissey, and Chansey. Grass Knot is an option to hit Gastrodon and Quagsire, who are not troubled by Thundurus's other moves. Life Orb offers a power boost while Leftovers grants extra survivability. Leftovers is the recommended item for Thundurus on a sand team. Lum Berry can also be used to prevent paralysis, Toxic, and Spore, giving Thundurus more opportunities to set up.</p>

    <p>The one thing that most hinders Thundurus from sweeping is Stealth Rock. When factoring in Life Orb recoil and possible sandstorm damage, Stealth Rock ruins Thundurus's day and drastically shortens its sweep. Because of this, a Rapid Spin user is very helpful to Thundurus. The best choice is Starmie, who provides excellent complementary offense with Thundurus as well. Chandelure is great for trapping common Choice Scarf users, particularly Terrakion locked into Close Combat, and generally troublesome Pokemon that like to ruin Thundurus's day, such as Quagsire, Tyranitar, and Lucario.</p>

    <p>As Thundurus resists common priority attacks, they are not an issue, but Choice Scarf users definitely are. When equipped with a Choice Scarf, Terrakion, Chandelure, Tyranitar, and Genesect can all take advantage of Thundurus's relative frailty and pick it off. Dual screens are amazing in helping Thundurus set up; Deoxys-S and Espeon come to mind as the best ones. Paralysis support is another option to deal with Choice Scarf users, and is generously provided by Ferrothorn, who also happens to be able to set up hazards to help Thundurus's sweep. Politoed support is great for providing the rain that allows Thundurus to run Thunder.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Mixed
    move 1: Thunderbolt
    move 2: Hammer Arm
    move 3: Hidden Power Ice
    move 4: Volt Switch / U-turn / Taunt
    item: Life Orb / Expert Belt
    ability: Prankster
    nature: Naive
    evs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    ivs: 30 Atk / 30 Def

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Thundurus also has a good 115 Attack, with which it can take down its common checks, namely Blissey and Tyranitar. With mixed attacking stats, Thundurus can function as an excellent wallbreaker, weakening opposing teams for its teammates to sweep. Thundurus can be a great powerhouse with this set, and its effectiveness can sometimes eclipse even the powerful Nasty Plot set.</p>

    <p>Thunderbolt is Thundurus's main STAB move for its power and reliability. Hammer Arm allows Thundurus to OHKO non-Chople Berry Tyranitar and 2HKO Blissey, as well as severely dent Terrakion. Hidden Power Ice is the best coverage move available to Thundurus, complementing its other moves very well by hitting the Dragon-types that resist its other moves. The last slot is a bit of a toss-up. Volt Switch is a great option particularly for VoltTurn offense teams, and also allows Thundurus to maintain offensive pressure if faced with a counter. U-turn functions similarly, with the advantage of hitting Ground-types such as Garchomp and Excadrill, who are common switch-ins to Thundurus. Taunt can be used to screw over walls attempting to paralyze or set up hazards on Thundurus, and also stops Dragon Dance boosters in their tracks. It also cripples Deoxys-S, but backfires if Deoxys-S uses Magic Coat.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Thunder Wave is always an option for quick paralysis, which could potentially save your team from a rampaging Blaziken. Grass Knot can be used to lure and remove Gastrodon and Quagsire. The item choice depends on Thundurus's role on the team: Life Orb should be used for maximum power, with the added bonus of OHKOing Tyranitar; Expert Belt is also a great item since Thundurus has excellent super effective coverage. In general, Life Orb lets it be the best possible wallbreaker, while Expert Belt grants better longevity. Leftovers can always be used for recovery, as can Substitute to block attacks and status.</p>

    <p>This set lacks the sweeping potential of Nasty Plot, so its teammates need to pick up the slack. Entry hazards, particularly Stealth Rock and Spikes, are also needed to make this set work, as they enable Thundurus to nab crucial kills, such as on Jellicent and Vaporeon; this makes Excadrill and Garchomp good partners. Chansey defeats this set, being able to Softboiled off the damage from Hammer Arm and stall out Thundurus with Toxic and Seismic Toss. Gastrodon and Quagsire still do a great job with beating Thundurus. Breloom deals with all three of them, KOing them or forcing them out with its dual STABs and fearing nothing except for a Scald burn or Ice Beam from Gastrodon. Politoed can provide rain support so that Thundurus can run Thunder.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Prankster
    move 1: Thunder Wave
    move 2: Thunderbolt / Thunder
    move 3: Hidden Power Ice
    move 4: Taunt / Volt Switch / Hammer Arm
    item: Life Orb
    ability: Prankster
    nature: Timid / Naive
    evs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    ivs: 30 Atk / 30 Def

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>With its Prankster ability, Thundurus's non-attacking moves gain priority. This makes Thundurus a quick check to a Dragon Dance sweeper or something continually stalling with Substitutes or status moves. The ability to go first, outspeeding even most other Prankster users, gives Thundurus the advantage over bulkier alternatives. In general, this set's main purpose is to be a last-ditch stop to threatening sweepers, and maybe get some attacks off if it finds the time.</p>

    <p>Thunder Wave is the crux of the set, and the reason why Prankster Thundurus is so good. It can be a game-saving clutch against a DragonDancer or Choice Scarf user that your team cannot overcome because of its high Speed; it can also cause paralysis hax, giving Thundurus more opportunities to attack. Thunderbolt is a reliable STAB move. Hidden Power Ice is Thundurus's best possible coverage move, while as on all Thundurus sets, the last slot is a toss-up. Taunt is the primary option to shut down status spreaders such as Jirachi and Jellicent, and prevent boosting Pokemon from setting up further. Volt Switch or U-turn can make Thundurus an effective scout, while Hammer Arm can be used for coverage on Tyranitar and Blissey—of course, be sure to use a Naive nature and 4 Attack EVs if using Hammer Arm or U-turn.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>If you have rain support, run Thunder. This set will often die in one hit as a sacrifice to get off that one Thunder Wave or Taunt, but its special attacking capabilities should not be forgotten, and abused to their full potential. In fact, it should still be played offensively in general, but cautiously if Team Preview reveals a threat it may need to deal with.</p>

    <p>This set is countered by Blissey and Chansey, as well as Gastrodon and Quagsire, who are immune to Thunder Wave and take basically nothing from its attacks. A Focus Sash can be used to allow a full health Thundurus to live an otherwise fatal attack, but is not recommended because it requires that entry hazards be kept off the field at all times. Substitute + Calm Mind Jirachi is an amazing partner to this set, as it enjoys setting up on and sweeping paralyzed opponents. Adamant Choice Band Terrakion is perhaps the Pokemon that benefits most from the support this Thundurus provides, abusing the paralyzed opposition to alleviate its Speed issues, and OHKOing most opponents. Substitute + Calm Mind Chandelure also benefits from paralyzed opponents due to its low Speed stat. Politoed are great for rain support. Choice Scarf Politoed in particular is useful because it can come in and revenge kill Excadrill, who is immune to the main point of this set—paralysis—and can KO Thundurus with Rock Slide. Choice Scarf Garchomp poses a similar problem, so Bronzong and Skarmory are great teammates.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>Swift Swim teams should consider using Thundurus as a Rain Dance setter; Thundurus can even take advantage of the rain itself with Thunder. Torment is an option to mess with and annoy the opponent, especially in combination with Substitute, as Pokemon such as Excadrill and Jirachi have only one attack capable of breaking Thundurus's Substitutes. Once again, though, it is often a waste of a moveslot in comparison to Thundurus's other options. Hidden Power Fire hits Steel-types more reliably than Focus Blast, but it requires forgoing the coverage Hidden Power Ice provides, and is weakened by rain. Dark Pulse is an option to hit Latios, but is generally a waste.</p>

    <p>Agility can remedy Thundurus's problems with Choice Scarf users, but Thundurus's attacks will lack the punch that Nasty Plot provide. A double boosting set on the other hand requires too many turns to set up, and also suffers from the loss of coverage moves. Bulk Up can be used for a physical set, with Brick Break and Wild Charge as attacks. However, Thundurus has a higher Special Attack stat, and is outclassed by most physical attackers; furthermore, Wild Charge has hindering recoil. Choice Specs can turn Thundurus into a hard-hitting special attacker, and Choice Band makes it a strong physical attacker. Choice Scarf might seem tempting, but it is outclassed in this role by other Pokemon such as Rotom-W and Terrakion, which have better movepools for the role, along with better coverage.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>Gastrodon, Blissey, and Chansey are Thundurus's main counters, as they can sponge all of Thundurus's common attacks, can recover off the damage, and deal with Thundurus either directly or with status moves. Quagsire ignores the Nasty Plot set's boosts and so can deal with it. As with most other Choice Scarf users, Rotom-W can switch in on the Nasty Plot and KO it with a rain-boosted Hydro Pump. Excadrill causes huge problems to Thundurus, switching in for free on Thunderbolt and outspeeding in sand to OHKO with Rock Slide; Choice Scarf Garchomp and Landorus can similarly switch in and KO with Stone Edge. Choice Scarf Tyranitar can surprise Thundurus by bluffing a standard set, only to outspeed and Stone Edge for the KO. Raikou can also function as a decent check, as it is immune to Thundurus's Electric-type moves and outspeeds, forcing Thundurus to rely on a 70% accurate Focus Blast.</p>
  2. NoCheese

    NoCheese It's not just a house...it's a maison!
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    I'm rather new to the style checking game, but here are a few corrections, mostly in capitalization.

  3. sirndpt

    sirndpt
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    Sorry if I'm out of line here, but imo a little bit more elaboration on these two sentences in the first set's SET COMMENTS section would be great: Substitute is an option with Leftovers if you want to run a deadly Sub + NP set. Taunt can also be used in a similar vein to Taunt + DD Haxorus.
    Who specifically do either of these moves help you set up more easily against? Is Ditto that much of a problem? Imo the reference to Taunt + DD Haxorus doesn't really help (and at the very least shouldn't really be the entire explanation) because it isn't that common / straightforward of a Pokemon to use, haha).

    Similarly, in AC: Chandelure and Wobbufett are great for trapping common Choice Scarf users and generally troublesome Pokemon that like to ruin Thundurus's day - such as?

    How much does this Thundurus need rain support? Because, well, minor issue, but I think Thunder should be moved to AC with a mention of "if in rain, use this, obvs."

    Second set is missing [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS] tag, and in the third paragraph: A Hasty nature may be used over Naive if you prefer your special defense stat to be higher - any particular reason why one would want to??

    Finally, second set needs more suggested teammates—such as counters to Chansey, Gastrodon, and Quagsire—and third set is lacking teammates altogether.

    Also, while I'm at it,
    feedback on NoCheese's GP check (open)
    NoCheese, the changes you've made are good overall, but I don't think these are ready for GP yet. I'm not too sure about when they will be, but just sit tight and wait for official GPers to start doing stuff, and you should be fine. You've also missed some conventions, such as:

    Scarf Terrakion -> Choice Scarf terrakion, Choice Scarfer / scarfer -> Choice Scarf user
    don't refer to Thundurus / the Pokemon as "you"
    sandstorm not Sandstorm, unless referring to the actual TM
    mixed set doesn't need an ability, because both are viable

    You're off to a good start, though :)
  4. Jukain

    Jukain fuck macle
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    You're certainly not out of line with anything you just said. I will do what you just said, I was really just looking for feedback. TBH this is only my second written analysis, my first being Regigigas RU, which is in the process of the writing portion, and my second in skeleton form possibly to be abandoned Pikachu. I'll make whatever the changes you suggested were, thanks for the feedback.
  5. Jukain

    Jukain fuck macle
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    This good?

    Here
    Here
    and here are where I implemented Thunderbolt alone.

    Here is my additional comments for the second set. Hasty nature is removed, and the bolded text is additional teammates.

    Bolded is the troublesome Pokemon I added in. As a note to NoCheese, GPing if the analysis is still subject to change is a really bad idea, and your check is now pretty much obsolete.
  6. Tobes

    Tobes Woo-hoo, woo-hoo, woo-hoo-hoo!
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    Remove Choice Scarf from Mix Thund it is horrible. Also slash Volt Switch in 4th slot.
  7. Jukain

    Jukain fuck macle
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    Sure.
  8. Tobes

    Tobes Woo-hoo, woo-hoo, woo-hoo-hoo!
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    Ok some last nitpicks:





    Overview
    • There are a lot of prose errors but I'll leave that for GP checks
    • Thundurus is technically not wallable by Gastrodon. Thundurus does have the option of running Grass Knot.
    NP Thundurus
    • Ferrothorn (aside from Scarf Genesect) is the only common Steel-type that Thundurus cares about and that loses to Focus Blast. Remove the mention of having Steel-types eliminated before going for a sweep and replace that with Choice Scarf users.
    • Add Blissey for Pokemon Thundurus doesn't beat with +2 Thunder
    • Again, don't generalize Steel-types as Pokemon Thundurus has trouble with. Ferrothorn is really the only example.
    • Taunt doesn't help you avoid paralysis from Jirachi (Body Slam)
    • AC: Recommend Politoed support.
    • AC: Add Grass Knot and Lum Berry as options
    • AC: Scizor and Breloom don't trouble Thundurus
    Mix Thundurus
    • Make the slashes on the 4th Slot Volt Switch / U-turn / Taunt
    • Highlight that the reason to use U-turn is that Ground-types are not immune to it, not "because it hits physically"
    • Mention that Taunt backfires if Deo-S uses Magic Coat
    • AC: Remove mentions of Volt Switch since it is now a main slash.
    • AC: Recommend Politoed support
    • AC: Add Grass Knot
    • AC: Remove mention of Terrakion, it really doesn't make any sense.
    Prankster Thundurus
    • Slash Thunder after Thunderbolt
    • AC: Recommend Politoed support. Especially Scarftoed for revenge killing Excadrill, who defeats the purpose of this set.
    • AC: Mention that Excadrill in sand and Scarchomp are immune to T-Wave and Thundurus is not a reliable answer to them; teammates such as Bronzong and Skarmory are necessary.
    • AC: All Bliss/Chans have Natural Cure, no need to discuss that.
    • AC: Ninetales mention makes no sense and is completely random. Remove it.
    Other Options
    • Make the order Rain Dance -> Torment -> Hidden Power Fire -> Dark Pulse -> Agility -> Bulk Up -> Choice. Mention the shortcomings of each option. (Example: HP Fire loses out on coverage, weakened by rain, etc.)
    Checks and Counters
    • Stress that Excadrill in sand and Scarf Garchomp / Landorus are the best revenge killers.
    • Mention that Scarftar surprises it
    I feel like Theorymon >_>

    Once these changes are made (all of them):
    APPROVED
  9. Jukain

    Jukain fuck macle
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    Made the changes, details in bold next to them.
    Done.
  10. sirndpt

    sirndpt
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    copypastable (open)
    [Overview]

    <p>Thundurus is enjoying free rein in Dream World as one of the Pokemon brought down from Ubers to participate in the DW OU tier. Top-notch mixed offenses and a trolling base 111 Speed, along with a movepool that contains everything it needs will keep Thundurus a top contender for months to come. While a weakness to Stealth Rock does no favors to Thundurus, it is somewhat mitigated by the fact that Thundurus is immune to Ground attacks, Spikes, and Toxic Spikes <!!>. Prankster was a gift bestowed upon Thundurus, giving it priority Taunt and Thunder Wave. The electric genie does, however, have its downfalls. Low bulk and weakness to Stealth Rock are the major problems Thundurus has; it is also nearly completely walled by Gastrodon, with only Grass Knot as an option. With proper team support, Thundurus can shine and do what it does best: sweep.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Nasty Plot
    move 1: Nasty Plot
    move 2: Thunderbolt
    move 3: Hidden Power Ice
    move 4: Focus Blast / Substitute
    item: Life Orb / Leftovers
    ability: Prankster
    nature: Timid
    evs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>This set is Thundurus's bread and butter, the reason it was banned from OU. The idea is to stack hazards, take out the opponent's Choice Scarf user, beat the opponent's special wall, set up Nasty Plot, and sweep. High Special Attack and Speed stats make Thundurus an ideal candidate for the job. Switch in on a support Pokemon or something Thundurus forces out, such as <examples>, then grab a Nasty Plot on the switch. After a Nasty Plot, Thundurus hits a sky-high 698 Special Attack, which, alongside its excellent coverage, lets it plow through the entire metagame.</p>

    <p>Thunderbolt is of course the primary option if you are not running rain support, and still hits insanely hard. Hidden Power Ice complements Thunderbolt with coverage on the common Grass- and Ground-types in the tier, such as <examples>, and Focus Blast grants Thundurus super effective coverage on Ferrothorn. Substitute is an option with Leftovers for a deadly Substitute + Nasty Plot set. It prevents status, specifically Thunder Wave, and priority Substitutes mean that Thundurus can Substitute stall as long as it needs to, with Leftovers of course. Taunt can also be used in a similar vein to Taunt + Dragon Dance Haxorus. It helps Thundurus set up on Jirachi and Ferrothorn, who otherwise pose major pains thanks to Thunder Wave. Body Slam is still an issue with Jirachi, however, so it is best to determine if it has Body Slam or Thunder Wave before attempting to use Taunt. Taunt also prevents Breloom from setting up on Thundurus, which can be very helpful if <or "in fact allows Thundurus to wall Breloom if it lacks"?> Breloom lacks Stone Edge.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Thunder is the best choice if you can provide rain support, as it will just about OHKO everything that does not resist it, bar Tyranitar, Blissey, and Chansey. If you want to maintain a VoltTurn chain, Volt Switch is an option over Focus Blast to do just that. Grass Knot is an option to hit Gastrodon and Quagsire, who are not troubled by Thundurus's other moves. Life Orb offers a power boost <if there are specific kos not using LO misses, it'd be great to mention them> while Leftovers grants extra survivability, and is the recommended item for Thundurus on a sand team. Lum Berry can also be used to prevent paralysis, Toxic, and Spore, giving Thundurus more time to set up.</p>

    <p>The one thing that most hinders Thundurus from sweeping is Stealth Rock. When factoring in Life Orb recoil and possible sandstorm damage, Stealth Rock ruins Thundurus's day and drastically shortens its sweep. Because of this, a Rapid Spin user is very helpful to Thundurus. The best choice is Starmie, who provides excellent complementary offense with Thundurus as well. Chandelure is great for trapping common Choice Scarf users, particularly <examples>, and generally troublesome Pokemon that like to ruin Thundurus's day, such as Quagsire, Tyranitar, and Lucario.</p>

    <p>As it resists common priority attacks, that is not an issue for Thundurus, but Choice Scarf users definitely are. When equipped with a Choice Scarf, Terrakion, Chandelure, Tyranitar, and Genesect can all take advantage of Thundurus's relative frailty and pick it off. Dual screens are amazing in helping Thundurus set up; Jirachi and Espeon come to mind as the best ones. Paralysis support is another option to deal with Choice Scarf users, and is generously provided by Ferrothorn, who also happens to set up hazards to help Thundurus's sweep. Politoed support is great to provide the rain that allows Thundurus to run Thunder.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Mixed
    move 1: Thunderbolt
    move 2: Hammer Arm
    move 3: Hidden Power Ice
    move 4: Volt Switch / U-turn / Taunt
    item: Life Orb / Expert Belt
    nature: Naive
    evs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Thundurus also has a good 115 Attack, with which it can take down its common checks, namely Blissey and Tyranitar. With mixed attacking stats, Thundurus can function as an excellent wallbreaker, weakening opposing teams for its teammates to sweep. Thundurus can be a great powerhouse with this set, and its effectiveness can sometimes eclipse even the powerful Nasty Plot set.</p>

    <p>Thunderbolt is Thundurus's main STAB move for its power and reliability. Hammer Arm allows Thundurus to hit <be more specific? ohko / 2hko?> Tyranitar and Blissey, as well as severely dent Choice Band Terrakion. Hidden Power Ice is the best coverage move available to Thundurus, complementing its other moves very well by hitting the Dragon-types that resist its other moves. The last slot is a bit of a toss-up. Volt Switch is a great option particularly for VoltTurn offense teams, and also allows Thundurus to maintain offensive pressure if faced with a counter. U-turn functions similarly, with the advantage of hitting Ground-types such as <examples>, common switch-ins to Thundurus. Taunt can be used to screw over walls attempting to paralyze or set up hazards on Thundurus, and also stops Dragon Dance boosters in their tracks. It also cripples Deoxys-S, but backfires if Deoxys-S uses Magic Coat <is this right?>.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Thunder Wave is always an option for quick paralysis, which could potentially save your team from a rampaging <example>. Grass Knot can be used to lure and remove Gastrodon and Quagsire. The item choice depends on Thundurus's role on the team: Life Orb should be used for maximum power; Expert Belt is also a great item as Thundurus has excellent super effective coverage. In general, Life Orb lets it be the best possible wallbreaker, while Expert Belt has the surprise factor. Leftovers can always be used for recovery, as can Substitute to block attacks and status. <are there any KOs LO or EB is necessary for?></p>

    <p>This set lacks the sweeping potential of Nasty Plot, so its teammates need to pick up the slack. Therefore, <examples> make good partners with opposing <examples> removed. Entry hazards, <particularly Stealth Rock / Spikes>, are also needed to make this set work, as they enable Thundurus to nab / secure crucial kills, such as on <examples>; this makes <examples> good partners. Chansey defeats this set, being able to Softboiled off the damage from Hammer Arm and stall out Thundurus with Toxic and Seismic Toss. Gastrodon and Quagsire still do a great job with beating Thundurus. Breloom deals with all three of them, KOing them or forcing them out with its dual STABs and fearing nothing except for a Scald burn or Ice Beam from Gastrodon. Politoed provides rain support so Thundurus can run Thunder.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Prankster
    move 1: Thunder Wave
    move 2: Thunderbolt / Thunder
    move 3: Hidden Power Ice
    move 4: Taunt / Volt Switch / Hammer Arm
    item: Life Orb
    ability: Prankster
    nature: Timid / Naive
    evs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>With its Prankster ability, Thundurus's non-attacking moves go first. This makes Thundurus a quick check to a Dragon Dance sweeper or something continually stalling with Substitutes or status moves. The ability to go first, outspeeding even most other Prankster users, gives Thundurus the advantage over bulkier alternatives. In general, this set's main purpose is to be a last-ditch stop to threatening sweepers, while getting some attacks off if it finds the time.</p>

    <p>Thunder Wave is the crux of the set. the reason why Prankster Thundurus is so good. It can be a game-saving clutch against a Dragon Dance or Choice Scarf user that your team cannot overcome because of its high Speed; it can also cause hax to give Thundurus more opportunities to attack. Thunderbolt is a reliable STAB move, to be used when not using Thunder Wave. Hidden Power Ice is Thundurus's best possible coverage move, while as on all Thundurus sets, the last slot is a toss-up. Taunt is the primary option to shut down status spreaders such as <examples> in their tracks, and prevent boosting Pokemon from further setting up. Volt Switch or U-turn can make Thundurus an effective scout, while Hammer Arm can be used for coverage on Tyranitar and Blissey—of course, be sure to use a Naive nature and 4 Attack EVs if using Hammer Arm or U-turn.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>If you have rain support, run Thunder. Nasty Plot can also be used in the last slot, as a lure into thinking this is the standard Nasty Plot sweeper set, then pulling out the Thunder Wave. This also gives the set makeshift sweeping potential, something it currently definitely does not have. This set will often die in one hit as a sacrifice to get off that one Thunder Wave or Taunt, but its special attacking capabilities should not be forgotten, and abused to their full potential. In fact, it should still be played offensively in general, just cautiously in case it is needed later for a game-deciding Thunder Wave or Taunt.</p>

    <p>This set is countered by Blissey and Chansey, as well as Gastrodon and Quagsire, who are immune to Thunder Wave and take basically nothing from its attacks. A Focus Sash can be used to allow a full health Thundurus to live an otherwise fatal attack, but is not recommended <why>. Substitute + Calm Mind Jirachi is an amazing partner to this set, as it enjoys setting up on and sweeping paralyzed opponents. Adamant Choice Band Terrakion is perhaps the Pokemon that benefits most from the support this Thundurus provides, abusing the paralyzed opposition to deal with its Speed issues, and OHKOing most of the team. Substitute + Calm Mind Chandelure also benefits from paralyzed opponents due to its low Speed stat. Politoed is great for rain support, but does hinder the effectiveness of Chandelure. Nonetheless, Choice Scarf Politoed in particular is useful because it can come in and revenge kill Excadrill, who is immune to the main point of this set—paralysis—and can KO Thundurus with Rock Slide. Choice Scarf Garchomp poses a similar problem, so Bronzong and Skarmory are great teammates.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>Swift Swim teams should consider using Thundurus as a Rain Dance setter; Thundurus can even take advantage of the rain itself with Thunder. Torment is an option to mess with and annoy the opponent, especially in combination with Substitute, as Pokemon such as <examples> have only one attack capable of breaking Thundurus's Substitutes. Once again, though, it is often a waste of a moveslot. Hidden Power Fire hits Steel-types more reliably than Focus Blast, but it requires forgoing the coverage Hidden Power Ice provides, and is weakened by rain. Dark Pulse is an option to hit hit Chandelure and Psychic-types, but is generally a waste, as Thunderbolt severely dents them anyway, and a neutral Thunder is in fact stronger <added this info - verify it thanks!>.</p>

    <p>Agility can remedy Thundurus's problems with Choice Scarf users, but Thundurus's attacks will lack the punch that Nasty Plot provide. A double boosting set on the other hand requires too many turns to set up, as well as the loss of a coverage move. Bulk Up can be used for a physical set, with Brick Break and Wild Charge as attacks. However, Thundurus has a higher Special Attack stat, and is outclassed by most physical attackers; furthermore, Wild Charge has hindering recoil. Choice Specs can turn Thundurus into a hard-hitting special attacker, and Choice Band makes it a strong physical attacker. Choice Scarf might seem tempting, but it is generally outclassed in this by Tornadus <why?>, and is not that good in general <why?>.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>Gastrodon, Blissey, and Chansey are Thundurus's main counters, as they sponge all of Thundurus's common attacks, can recover off the damage, and deal with Thundurus either directly or with status moves. Quagsire ignores the Nasty Plot set's boosts and so can deal with it. As with most other Choice Scarf users, Rotom-W can switch in on the Nasty Plot set and KO it with a rain-boosted Hydro Pump or Hidden Power Ice. Excadrill causes huge problems to Thundurus, switching in for free on Thunderbolt and OHKOing with Rock Slide; Choice Scarf Garchomp and Landorus can similarly switch in and KO with Stone Edge. Choice Scarf Tyranitar can surprise Thundurus by bluffing a standard set, only to outspeed and Stone Edge for the KO.</p>
  11. Jukain

    Jukain fuck macle
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    This is all nice and all, but you missed something, which I highlighted in purple above. Just say what to do and I'll implement it.

    EDIT: Screw it, I'll let the second person deal with it.
  12. sirndpt

    sirndpt
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    my bad, fixed in my original post!
  13. Jukain

    Jukain fuck macle
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    Your check is implemented, just one more!
  14. Destiny Warrior

    Destiny Warrior also known as Darkwing_Duck
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    Minor thing I thought I'd bring up; the mix set has no ability in the OP.
  15. Omicron

    Omicron
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    Most likely because both abilities are equally viable. When both abilities are equally viable, there is no need for the ability to be listed.
  16. Tobes

    Tobes Woo-hoo, woo-hoo, woo-hoo-hoo!
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  17. shrang

    shrang Defend the Headquarters of Revolution
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    Volt Absorb Raikou should be mentioned as a counter to Thundurus, IMO. Raikou outspeeds Thundurus, can Calm Mind up to reduce damage and destroy it with Thunder(bolt) or HP Ice. It is immune to Thundurus' Electric attacks, so 70% Focus Blast is the best that Thundurus can do.
  18. Omicron

    Omicron
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    kk uploading, and will add what shrang mentioned if the OP has not done so.
  19. Jukain

    Jukain fuck macle
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    I already did.

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