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Tornadus is mad at his Therian brother (peaked 1694)

Discussion in 'BW OU Teams' started by victinivcreate1, Feb 3, 2013.

  1. victinivcreate1

    victinivcreate1

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2012
    Messages:
    139
    Hello. This is my first RMT, and I am very sorry for a lack of sprites, I am doing this on an Ipad as my computer is broken.

    Here it is. I have used it several times, and it is effective. I do think i need some help, and that is why I came here. Here it is.


    Wall breaker team!

    Dragonite-Ferrothorn-Tornadus-Infernape-Jolteon-Starmie

    My team's weaknesses, resists, and immunities

    Infernape
    Weak to Ground, Psychic, Flying, Water
    Resists Bug, Steel, Ice, Grass, Dark, Fire

    Dragonite
    Weak to Ice, Rock, Dragon
    Resists Grass, Fire, Water
    Immune to Ground

    Ferrothorn
    Weak to Fire, Fighting
    resists Grass, Electric, Water, Ghost, Dark, Steel,
    Immune to Poison

    Starmie
    Weak to Bug, Electric, Grass, Dark, Ghost
    Resists Water, Psychic, Fire, Steel

    Tornadus
    Weak to Rock, Ice, Electric
    Resists Grass, bug, fighting
    Immune to Ground

    Jolteon
    Weak to Ground
    Resists Steel and Flying
    Immune to Electric

    The Lead
    Tornadus @ Life Orb
    Ability: Prankster
    EVs: 4 Atk/252 SpA/252 Spd
    Nature: Naive
    Actual Stats-299-267-176-349-176-353
    -Taunt-trolls Stealth Rock/Spikes users (AKA Deoxys-D, Ferrothorn)
    -Heat Wave-for Ferrothorn, OHKOs even Sp.Def variants, 2HKOs Skarmory, Jirachi.
    -Hurricane-powerful STAB attack, hits all the fighting types running rampant in OU (Terrakion and Techniloom especially)
    -Superpower-Hits Heatran, who resist all other attacks, good coverage with Hurricane.
    Description: Tornadus' role is to lead. His blistering speed helps me outspeed the Base 110's that give me some issues. Although weak to common moves (Ice Shard, Stone Edge), his coverage is phenomenal (and Flying is an awesome STAB overall in OU) and Prankster allows me to Taunt set up sweepers (Trick Room Reuniclus) and mess up entry hazard leads. Overall, Tornadus is furious at his Therian form being better than him, and has come back to smash everything in its path.

    The Nice Dragon that can be Mean
    Dragonite @ Expert Belt
    Ability: Multiscale
    EVs: 252 HP/252 SpA/4 Spd
    Nature: Mild
    Actual Stats-386-304-203-328-236-197
    -Extremespeed-typical revenge move, powerful even without investment
    -Thunder-100% accuracy in rain, downright superb coverage with Hurricane
    -Hurricane-100% accurate in Rain. (If only Zapdos had Hurricane)
    -Dragon Pulse-Powerful STAB move, much like Hurricane but with better coverage
    Description: Dragonite is my rain wrecker. Boasting two 120 base power attacks, one being a STAB move, Dnite is certaintly powerful. Extremespeed has power, even without investment! Multiscale essentially doubles Dragonite's defenses which also helps stop Outrages when Ferrothorn is dead. Dnite is also my #1 check to Keldeo, as it can always beat it (Hurricane) provided Multiscale is up, and Dnite resists both Keldeo's STABs.

    The Wallbreaker
    Infernape @ Life Orb
    Ability: Iron FIst
    EVs: 252 Atk/4 SpA/252 Speed
    Nature: Naive
    Actual Stats: 293/307/178/245/160/346
    -Close Combat-The standard STAB move, and Ape's most powerful attack.
    -Fire Blast-I needed a STAB special with more PP than Overheat but with maintaining great power.
    -Thunder Punch-Hits Gyarados, Vaporeon, and others weak to electric.
    -Mach Punch-boosted from 60 to 72 base power. Priority move and secondary STAB attack.
    Description: Infernape. I understand why people say he sucks. But with Drizzle's main abusers (Tornadus-T, Genesect, and Thundurus Incarnate) in ubers, Infernape has an easier time dealing with rain. Mach Punch is exclusively for Terrakion, specifically scarfed ones. Thunder Punch is for screwing over all those water types (good chance to OHKO standard Politoed (specially defensive), as well as getting a good hit on Keldeo, the dominant rain sweeper in this current metagame. Plus I have multiple ways for dealing with rain (cough cough Ferrothorn and Dragonite). It also is 1/3 of my Fire/Grass/Water core.

    The Mixed Wall
    Ferrothorn @ Leftovers
    Ability: Iron Barbs
    EVs: 252 HP/4 Atk/252 SpDef
    Nature: Impish
    Actual Stats: 352/225/327/129/331/76
    -Leech Seed-For stalling out certain pokemon, like Bulky waters and Dnite. Used in tandem with Thunder Wave so I can recover more HP without getting hit.
    -Thunder Wave-Paralyzes faster threats. Once exclusively for Tornadus T, now for Terrwackion switch ins.
    -Power Whip-With STAB, it has 180 base power. Even 2x resists take a 90 base power attack. The bane of most Starmie.
    -Stealth Rock-Removes switch-in's HP and making it easier for Infernape and Dragonite to sweep.
    Description: Ferrothorn is my wall, and is pretty standard. However, this EV spread creates a very effective mixed wall. In fact, my Ferro takes a mere 21-26% damage from a Modest Rain boosted Choice Specs Hydro Pump from Keldeo. Only Dragonite boasts similar bulk (takes 27-32% damage from Rain Boosted, Choice Specs Hydro Pump, provided Multiscale hasn't been broken). Ferrothorn also tears through Starmie, Gastrodon, Swampert, and also 3HKOs Standard Gengar with Power Whip, despite little investment. Thunder Wave cripples fast threats like Latios, Volcarona, Alakazam and Terrakion (only on the switch). Ferrothorn is fantastic overall, and makes up another third of my Fire/Grass/Water core.

    The Revenger/Late Game Sweeper
    Jolteon @ Choice Scarf
    Ability: Volt Absorb
    EVs: 4 HP/252 SpA/252 Spd
    Nature: Timid
    Actual Stats: 272/149/156/319/289/394
    -Thunderbolt-obligatory STAB move of choice. Powerful, good coverage overall.
    -Shadow Ball-hits Latios, Gengar, and psychics.
    -Hidden Power Ice-makes pseudo BoltBeam coverage.
    -Volt Switch-OHKOs standard Starmie after Stealth Rock damage.
    Description: You may think a Scarf on Jolteon is overkill, but at 561 base speed (factoring in the 394 standard speed +197 extra that Choice Scarf offers), Jolteon is the fastest thing in the Metagame unboosted. Only rival scarfed Crobat, Aerodactyl, and emeny Jolteon boast such speed. With this speed, it can beat Scarfchomp with a lightning fast HP Ice, kill Tornadus-T with a Thunderbolt, and switchout with the fastest Volt Switch in the game. Shadow Ball smashes Gengar, Starmie, Latios and Alakazam (who is uncommon nowadays). Overall, the Jolteon pulls his weight amazingly well, and now is sweeping teams.


    The Special Sweeper that works as the Rapid Spinner (mainly because I have no other choice)
    Starmie @ Life Orb
    Ability: Natural Cure
    EVs: 4 HP/252 SpA/252 Spd
    Nature: Timid
    Actual Stats: 261/167/206/299/206/361
    -Thunderbolt-BoltBeam coverage
    -Surf-Obligatory STAB move. Powerful. Good coverage overall.
    -Rapid Spin-spins away entry hazards
    -Ice Beam-BoltBeam coverage
    Description: Starmie is my standard special sweeper and is also my all-mighty spinner. Starmie is very powerful, despite having low offenses compared to my other sweepers. Starmie's niche is his Rapid Spinning ability, crucial for Dragonite maintaining Multiscale, and Tornadus if he survives his early game battle. Boltbeam coverage and Surf are his offensive options. With these 3 offensive options, he can tear through a large portion of the tier (hitting Heatran, Latios, Latias, Landorus, Thundurus-T, Volcarona, etc) for super effective damage. The only things that wall Starmie are Ferroseed and Ferrothorn. Starmie is the last part of my Fire/Grass/Water core.

    Threats that my team can deal with
    (Threat on the left, my solution on the right)

    Tornadus T (Uber)-Jolteon
    Terrackion-Infernape, Tornadus Incarnate, Dnite (in the rain)
    Starmie-Ferrothorn
    Gastrodon-Ferrothorn
    Politoed-Jolteon, Dragonite, Tornadus Incarnate
    Ninetales-Infernape (2HKOs with Close Combat, Ninetales cant OHKO even with Sun boosted, STAB Choice Specs Overheat)
    Volcarona-Starmie (only if hit on the switch, 2HKOs with Surf) Tornadus, Dnite
    Landorus-Starmie, Jolteon (can't switch in on EQ or Earth Power
    Garchomp-Jolteon, Starmie
    Ferrothorn-Tornadus Incarnate, Infernape
    Keldeo-Tornadus Incarnate, Dragonite, Infernape, Jolteon, Starmie, Ferrothorn (only on Keldeo switch ins).
    Venusaur-Jolteon (most Venusaur run Modest for power, and 561>518 in sun).
    Scizor-Tornadus Incarnate, Infernape
    Dnite-Starmie, Jolteon, Dnite
    Breloom-Tornadus I, Infernape, Dnite, Jolteon, Starmie
    Latios-Jolteon, Dnite, Starmie, Ferrothorn
    Gengar-Jolteon exclusive, but sometimes Ferrothorn and Dnite
    Alakazam-Jolteon (2HKOs with Shadow Ball), Dnite (2HKOs with Dragon Pulse)
    Mamoswine-Infernape (must look for EQ), Tornadus Incarnate, Ferrothorn (usually wins)
    Rotom Wash-Ferrothorn exclusive, otherwise Dnite
    Gliscor-Jolteon, Starmie
    Landorus T-Jolteon, Starmie
    Landorus Incarnate-Starmie, Jolteon (on switch ins, HP Ice KOs all).
    Jirachi-Infernape (2HKOs with Fire Blast), Tornadus Incarnate (depends, often loses)
    Thundurus-T-Jolteon, Ferrothorn (must watch for Focus Blast)
    Heatran-Infernape, Tornadus Incarnate, Starmie

    All the pokemon listed are fairly common. I feel that my team handles these threats.

    So what do you think?
    Rate please.
  2. DrunkDemon

    DrunkDemon

    Joined:
    Feb 26, 2012
    Messages:
    206
    Hi,

    This is an interesting team, but I'm sort of confused about your use of Infernape here. Every other Pokemon would be perfect for a rain team (100% accuracy Hurricanes and Thunders for DNite and Torn, Starmie's Water STAB boosted, ect.), but you've put Infernape, a Fire-type, here and it just seems out of place. Infernape is also a pretty niche Pokemon in general, and I don't think this team takes advantage of its strengths enough to justify it here. That being said, I would suggest using Choice Specs Politoed over Infernape. The permanent rain Politoed summons is great for this for the aforementioned reasons, while Choice Specs gives Politoed a lot of extra power, which an offensive team like this really appreciates.

    Now onto Jolteon. I understand why using a Choice Scarf on it seems appealing, since it outspeeds basically the entirety of OU, but I don't think it's such a great idea. The reason it that, although its very fast, it often lacks the power possessed by other revenge killers to get the job done. Because of that, I'd suggest changing Choice Scarf on Jolteon to an Expert Belt. This makes Jolteon more of a wall-breaker, but doesn't lock it into an undesirable move like Choice Specs, or cause recoil from Volt Switching like Life Orb. With this change you lose your revenge-killer, which leads to my next change. Using a Hurricane set on Dragonite seems redundant when you already have the faster and stronger Tornadus to fill this role. To remove this redundancy and give you a new revenge-killer, I would swap Dragonite for Choice Scarf Keldeo. Keldeo possesses a blazing 108 speed to take advantage of Choice Scarf, loves rain to boost its Water STAB, and also fills the missing spot of a Fighting-type on your team now that Infernape is gone. For these reasons, I think it would be a good fit.

    Now for a few smaller changes. Since rain weakens Fire moves, you should probably get rid of Heat Wave of Tornadus in favor of U-turn. U-turn eases prediction when trying to work around Tornadus' checks and counters, and can potentially gain you momentum throughout the match if you keep Stealth Rock off the field. Since Rain makes Thunder 100% accurate, you might want to consider using Thunder on both Jolteon and Starmie. This is more personal preference than anything, since it will make you more vulnerable to opposing weather, but it's something to consider. Finally, if you replace Dragonite with Keldeo, just about all of your team members will be very fast, and therefore won't allow you to take advantage of the paralysis Ferrothorn spreads. Because of this, Gyro Ball over Thunder Wave is an option. Gyro Ball will allow Ferrothorn to fare better against the Dragon-types you would want it to wall, since Power Whip is resisted by Dragon.

    Hope this helps you improve the team! I'll post all of the sets of the Pokemon I changed out below.

    Show Hide
    Politoed @ Choice Specs
    Trait: Drizzle
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SAtk
    Modest Nature
    - Hydro Pump
    - Focus Blast
    - Ice Beam
    - Hidden Power [Grass]

    Keldeo-Resolute @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature
    - Hydro Pump
    - Surf
    - Hidden Power [Ice]
    - Secret Sword
  3. Shurtugal

    Shurtugal The Enterpriser.
    is a Pre-Contributor

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2011
    Messages:
    1,302
    Hello! Got the request :)

    I'm seeing Dragon Dance Dragonite as such a threat to this team, at +1 it can manhandle most of your team! Scarf Keldeo is another bothersome threat, as it can come in and rain hosted HPumps 2HKO everything but Ferrothorn, which doesn't like taking SS at all. Growth LO Venusaur also sweeps after a single boost, as we certainly must fix that! Lastly, CB Stoutland could give you problems, Fire Fang a near OHKO on Ferrothorn!

    I would switch your Expert Belt Dragonite in place for DD Dragonite. DD Dragonite is a great checks to all things in sun, including the infamous Venusaur. It also can set up on choice-locked Keldeo's and late-game sweep rain teams.

    Dragonite set (open)

    Dragonite @ Lum Berry
    Trait: Multiscale
    Nature: Adamant
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SDef / 252 Spe
    - Dragon Dance
    - Outrage
    - Extreme Speed
    - Fire Punch / Earthquake


    As for that Infernape, I feel a substitute of SubSalac Terrakion would fit best. Terrakion can check Stoutland (and sand in general) much better, as well as being able to sweep Sun if you can remove Venusaur late game. Terrakion also late-game sweeps better in general than Ape, and ape doesn't accomplish too much that Terrakion isn't.

    Terrakion set (open)

    Terrakion @ Salac Berry
    Trait: Justified
    Nature: Jolly
    EVs: 4 Hp / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
    - Swords Dance
    - Substitute
    - Close Combat
    - Stone Edge


    I would change Ferrothorn a bit more. This team is more of an offensive team so I want to change Ferrothorn to a Pokemon that can set up your hazards, as well as being a decent offensive pivot. So I'm going to recommend trying out this orthodox set that I think would work great with your lead TornI.

    Ferrothorn (open)

    Ferrothorn @ Normal Gem
    Trait: Iron Barbs
    Nature: Brave
    EVs: 252 Hp / 252 Atk / 4 SDef
    - Stealth Rock
    - Spikes
    - Explosion
    - Power Whip / Gyro Ball / Leech Seed


    Also, I'd replace TBolt on Starmie for Psyshock. Psyshock makes it a better Keldeo / Terrakion check, as well as still hitting Tentactruel. You have Jolteon, so why the Tbolt?

    As for Jolteon, I think you'd be better off with Scarf ThundyT, which as stronger power and better coverage that Scarf Jolteon. Starmie is great support so I wouldn't worry too much about SR.

    ThundyT (open)

    Thundurus-T @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Volt Absorb
    Nature: Timid
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 252 Spe / 4 SDef
    - Volt Switch
    - Focus Blast
    - Hidden Power [Ice]
    - Thunderbolt / Thunder / Grass Knot


    Now, finally, your lead. I can tell by the title that you'll want to keep it so lets make some necessary changes! I would use Mental Herb over LO to better counter DeoD, while using Rain Dance over Heat Wave to check sun teams. Prankster makes it a great RD pivot after Tales dies.


    That's all from me mate! GL

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