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Treecko (Analysis)

Discussion in 'Uploaded Analyses' started by bugmaniacbob, Dec 6, 2009.

  1. bugmaniacbob

    bugmaniacbob Floats like a Butterfree, stings like a Metapod
    is a Smogon Media Contributoris an Artist Alumnusis a CAP Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2008
    Messages:
    2,295
    Status: Complete; awaiting grammar checks, critiques, etc.

    I just read this:

    I honestly can't do an analysis quickly to save my life. I may not be able to finish this in the next week or so given some important events irl, but oh well:

    Initial Additions:

    • Wrote Anti-Lead, Agility SubPetaya and Swords Dance set descriptions
    • Wrote EV section - others pending
    Stamps:
    [​IMG] (Heysup)[​IMG] (macle)

    [​IMG] (Oglemi)[​IMG] (Komodo)

    [​IMG]
    http://www.smogon.com/dp/pokemon/treecko
    -------------------------------------------------

    [Overview]

    <p>Treecko is one of those Pokemon that can do everything, but do it in only an average way - it is pretty difficult to predict what it is going to do next, but once you have it figured out, Treecko tends to die quickly. It is pretty quick, but it isn't enough to make it outstanding, it isn't overtly frail, but it isn't defensively competent either. Its movepool is where it excels, but it can only ever carry four moves at a time. It can beat almost any Pokemon in Little Cup given the right moveset - but it never seems to carry the right one at the right time.</p>

    <p>All in all, Treecko is a decent Pokemon with some promise, but don't expect him to outperform the more commonly used Pokemon anytime soon. You may well describe him as a small packet of Haribo - he is versatile in flavor, but lacking in substance.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Anti-lead
    move 1: Leaf Storm
    move 2: Hidden Power Fire
    move 3: GrassWhistle
    move 4: Quick Attack / Focus Punch
    item: Focus Sash
    nature: Hasty
    evs: 36 HP / 240 SpA / 200 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>There are several ways that Treecko can be used in the lead spot, and this variant is perhaps the most useful, and almost certainly the most conventional of all of them. Leaf Storm is its basic STAB move, and due to Treecko's above average Speed and Special Attack, it is a good move for hit-and-run attacks against most Pokemon in Little Cup, especially if you can get Treecko into Overgrow range. It also happens to score super effective damage against a good number of common leads and even those that resist it cannot usually afford to switch in safely. Hidden Power Fire gives good coverage alongside Leaf Storm and also 2HKOs lead Bronzor, as well as OHKOing Snover. GrassWhistle is an interesting move that, while having a quite unreliable 55% accuracy, can be used to incapacitate a member of the opponent's team that Treecko cannot pass through, or to prevent a slower Pokemon such as Bronzor from setting up. GrassWhistle is also of particular note against Machop leads, against whom GrassWhistle is guaranteed to hit thanks to Machop's ability, No Guard.</p>

    <p>In the last slot, Quick Attack is a useful tool to finish off any slower Focus Sash leads, and is also useful later on in the game if revenge killing is required. Focus Punch, on the other hand, can be used alongside GrassWhistle to buy free turns in which to charge up a punch, and can be rewarding if Treecko happens to catch a Munchlax attempting to soak up a predicted Leaf Storm. Focus Sash will save Treecko if it happens to fall on the wrong end of an attack that would normally OHKO, which is helpful as it will simultaneously activate Overgrow, adding to the raw power of Leaf Storm. The given EV spread generates maximum Special Attack and Speed while also giving an extra point in HP. Because Hidden Power Fire necessitates an IV of 30 in both Speed and Special Attack, an extra 4 EVs are required in both stats to max them out – if you do not run Hidden Power Fire for whatever reason, you can add 72 EVs to Attack instead to gain an extra point there – something you cannot do if you run Hidden Power Fire. A Hasty nature is used so as not to spoil the power of either offensive stat, though Treecko's defensive prowess is not spectacular regardless.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>The basic idea behind this set is to attempt to put your opponent to sleep with GrassWhistle, disabling one of your opponent's Pokemon and leaving you free to cause havoc with Treecko's attacking moves. If Treecko faces a Pokemon it can hopefully beat one-on-one, such as Kabuto, Onix, or Phanpy, the threat of a Grass-type attack will usually force the opponent to switch out. With luck, your opponent's Treecko counter will be forced to take the sleep, or else a very powerful Leaf Storm, while Treecko has the assurance of surviving the next attack thanks to Focus Sash. As for other move options, Endeavor can be useful alongside Quick Attack to strike down faster offensive leads that resist Grass or Fire, but due to the prevalence of Oran Berry and Treecko's excellent coverage on most leads, it is usually not worth the effort. Counter is another option that can work well against threats such as Meowth, but it is a free invitation for Ghost-types to come in for free and is illegal with GrassWhistle.</p>

    <p>Treecko is neither slow nor catastrophically frail, but it still leans some way towards both, making it less effective against certain foes. Meowth is top on the list of foes Treecko cannot beat, as it can take out Treecko without suffering a single hit with a combination of Fake Out + U-turn. Meowth hates having to deal with Rock-types such as Aron, who can set up Rock Polish if Meowth doesn’t carry Hypnosis, as they resist its STAB and can exploit Meowth's hasty retreat to their own advantage. Houndour is another lead that Treecko has trouble with, as it resists both Leaf Storm and Hidden Power Fire. It also takes little damage from Quick Attack, and there is little real hope of ever hitting it with a Focus Punch, although you can catch it out if it tries to Sucker Punch as Treecko uses GrassWhistle. A Water-type that can take a Sucker Punch, such as Krabby, is a good answer if Houndour lacks Hidden Power Grass. Krabby can also deal with Bronzor leads if they prove troublesome.</p>

    [Team Options]

    <p>Offensive Treecko greatly appreciates Stealth Rock support, as it strikes four of the five types that cause it the greatest woe (Fire-, Flying-, Ice-, and Bug-types) for super effective damage, shaving off large amounts of health as they come in and putting them closer into KO range for Treecko's attacks. Dual screen support can also come in handy from a Pokemon like Bronzor, especially considering Treecko's middling defensive stats, giving it time to set up or attack without hassle.</p>

    <p>Houndour resists both Fire- and Ice-type attacks, and if Treecko can bait a Fire-type attack, Houndour can use it to activate its Flash Fire ability, powering up its STAB to more seriously threaten the opponent. Houndour is also very useful for its ability to get rid of Bronzor, as well as being able to use STAB Sucker Punch and Pursuit to get rid of Gastly or Duskull. Stunky is another useful partner if Ghost-types are bothering you. If Treecko can bait out and weaken its counters, you should try to have Pokemon waiting in the wings who can take advantage of this hole - Gastly appreciates the end of Munchlax, Bronzor, or Stunky, and getting rid of any of them can be the key to a win at any time. Scarf Cranidos is also a useful partner for Treecko, able to dispose of almost all the Pokemon that Treecko hates, hitting Fire-, Flying-, Poison-, and Steel-types, and OHKOing many more with the combination of Head Smash, Earthquake, and Mold Breaker. Phanpy is similarly helpful, able to deal with Fire-, Poison-, and Steel-types with its STAB Earthquake and revenge kill Dragon-, Flying-, and Grass-types with Ice Shard, though it shares an Ice weakness with Treecko. Lastly, Magnet Rise Magnemite is a failsafe way to remove Bronzor, and Diglett is likewise the same for Poison-, Fire-, and Steel-type foes, which are available to push Treecko's effectiveness even further.</p>

    <p>Kabuto makes a great defensive and offensive complement to Treecko, as it resists four of Treecko's five weaknesses - Flying, Ice, Fire, and Poison - while Treecko itself can come in on Ground-, Electric-, or Grass-type attacks aimed at Kabuto. Furthermore, Kabuto can revenge kill a number of Pokemon that give Treecko trouble, such as Gastly, Taillow, and Houndour, with STAB Aqua Jet. Aron resists Flying-, Ice-, Poison-, and Bug-type attacks, and is able to easily set up a Rock Polish on them, while wiping out Treecko's foes with STAB Head Smash, and giving Treecko opportunities to switch in on predicted Ground- and Water-type attacks. Aron also helps out against leads such as Meowth whom Treecko cannot beat. Chinchou is also a good choice, being able to take Fire-, Ice-, and Flying-type attacks aimed at Treecko, threatening all of them with its STAB moves or Ice Beam, and all the while threatening the opponent with the potential to set up Agility on the switch. All of these attract Croagunk, something that neither they nor Treecko can really deal with, so Gligar is recommended to beat Croagunk if Treecko lacks Hidden Power Fire or Croagunk lacks Hidden Power Ice.</p>

    [Optional Changes]

    <p>Treecko's Choice Specs Leaf Storm is very powerful, though it's a shame that so many Pokemon resist it, as otherwise it could be quite the force. Treecko has a pretty good physical movepool, with access to Swords Dance, Seed Bomb, Quick Attack, Brick Break, Rock Slide, Aerial Ace, ThunderPunch, and Crunch, but Treecko's low Attack stat means that that sort of role is better delegated to other Pokemon. Treecko is perhaps the premier user of Endeavor + Counter sets in Little Cup, whereby it takes a physical hit, survives with Focus Sash, and KOes the opponent with Counter, or else uses Endeavor + Quick Attack if they are faster and likely to use a special move. Endeavor and Counter are, however, illegal with GrassWhistle and Leaf Storm. Also, with the influx of priority users in Little Cup, this strategy is not as effective as it may seem on paper. Lastly, Agility is a nice move which boosts Treecko's Speed, and can be used alongside Swords Dance, or Substitute and a Petaya Berry, which also takes advantage of Overgrow.</p>

    <p>Leech Seed can be used to stall out a slower opponent such as Bronzor or Munchlax, while shuffling them and hopefully racking up entry hazard damage as well. Hidden Power Ice is an alternative to Hidden Power Fire, hitting Dratini, Gligar, and Taillow rather than Bronzor, Snover, and Paras for super effective damage. Hidden Power Rock hits Taillow, Snover, Houndour, and Paras rather than Bronzor and Croagunk. Giga Drain can replenish lost health, albeit not by much. Protect can be used on the Lead set to block Meowth's Fake Out. If you are feeling confident, Treecko can use Synthesis to offset Life Orb or Substitute damage on a sweeping set. Lastly, Aerial Ace is an option to take down Croagunk and Machop with assurance, and is also useful against other Grass-types as well as Bug-types.</p>

    <p>Treecko has a decent Speed stat, which can be a real asset to overcome his less-than-impenetrable defensive stats, so max Speed is usually the best course of action on any set. Remember that if Treecko runs Hidden Power Fire, it will need 200 EVs to max it out due to having to run a 30 Speed IV – without it it only needs 196 EVs. Next you should aim to max out the primary attacking stat, both of which max out with 236 EVs, or 240 EVs if it runs Hidden Power Fire. When going mixed it is recommended that you max out Treecko's better Special Attack anyway, as Treecko needs all the power it can get. This will leave you with 68 EVs left over, of which 36 EVs are sufficient to get an extra point in HP. If Treecko does not run Hidden Power Fire, you will have 76 EVs left over, which will give Treecko an extra point in any of Attack, Defense, or Special Defense. If Treecko holds Life Orb, it should run a 0 HP IV to minimize the recoil. Lastly, when using a set with Counter, you should aim to minimise Treecko's Defense stat in order to ensure the maximum possible damage done.</p>

    [Counters]

    <p>Treecko is nothing if not versatile, and you should never underestimate its ability to surprise you. Although a total of seven different types resist its STAB, the number of moves it can potentially run can always catch you off-guard. Once you have figured out the moveset, Treecko is a lot easier to handle, if it isn't already dead.</p>

    <p>Fire-types such as Houndour and Magby are usually the best switch-ins, as they have useful resistances to both Grass- and Fire-type attacks, but you must be wary of a surprise Hidden Power Rock. In the same vein, Flying-types such as Taillow and Doduo also resist Grass and can attack back with their STAB attacks, though if they are weakened by enough residual damage, they may well find themselves either in Quick Attack range or dying after their attack. Gastly and Stunky both resist Grass - Stunky can be rid of Treecko either by Sucker Punch or Pursuit, while Gastly is faster and is immune to Quick Attack. Dratini is another Pokemon that resists both Grass and Fire, and can set up a Dragon Dance sweep if Treecko attempts to flee, or else beat Treecko with ExtremeSpeed.</p>

    <p>On the special side of things, Munchlax is probably the best check you can find. With enough Special Defense to take Energy Ball and a resistance to Hidden Power Fire and Ice with Thick Fat, as well as the ability to OHKO with Fire Punch or Return, it easily beats Treecko. Bronzor is weak to Hidden Power Fire, but resists nigh-on everything else Treecko has and has the defensive stats to take several attacks and KO back. Treecko is quite frail and is easily revenge killed, even factoring in Quick Attack - although Croagunk cannot take Hidden Power Fire, it can usually beat Treecko with Fake Out + Vacuum Wave, and can come in on any STAB attack with its Grass resistance. Treecko is not as fast as it would like to be either, and there are a number of Pokemon that can outrun and OHKO it, such as Elekid, Taillow, and Staryu, although these have to watch out for Agility variants of Treecko. Phanpy deserves a special mention as it can sometimes lure out Treecko and destroy it with Ice Shard.</p>

    <p>Remember that none of these checks are complete counters in any way - even granted a resistance they can be stopped on the switch by a surprise set, so always be on your guard.</p>

    ---------------------------------------------

    Post-critique changes:
    • Added Team Options
    • Added Opinion, Counters and OO sections
    • Grammar check 1, thanks to mtr
    • Updated with format changes
    • Removed Misdreavus
    • Agility SubPetaya --> Optional Changes
    • Swords Dance --> Optional Changes
    • Added Endeavor Lead set
    • ...Endeavor Lead --> Optional Changes >.<
    • Grammar check 2, thanks to Aeron Ee1
    • GP Grammar-Prose Check #1, thanks to Oglemi
    • GP Grammar-Prose Check #2, thanks to Komodo
    Rejected Sets:

    Agility SubPetaya (open)

    [SET]
    name: Agility SubPetaya
    move 1: Substitute
    move 2: Agility
    move 3: Energy Ball
    move 4: Hidden Power Fire
    item: Petaya Berry
    nature: Modest
    evs: 240 SpA / 200 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Treecko also has access to Agility, allowing it to boost its decent Speed to levels that are enough to allow it to mount a serious assault on the opponent. After an Agility boost, Treecko hits 32 Speed, enough to allow it to outspeed even Jolly Scarf Diglett, making it hard to revenge kill without priority, despite Treecko’s poor defensive stats. Now that it outruns the majority of the metagame, Treecko can usually set up a Substitute before being attacked, allowing it to reach 5 HP with relative ease, activating its Petaya berry as well as Overgrow, making it a real threat to most of Little Cup, despite the lack of priority.</p>

    <p>The idea with this set is to come in on something that it threatens, such as Squirtle lacking Ice Punch, and set up a Substitute as it switches out. If the switch-in is a threatening priority-user, Treecko can use the Substitute as cover while it attacks, doing about 60% on average to Croagunk with unboosted Hidden Power. If the switch-in does not appear to carry priority, such as Bronzor, you can set up with Agility as it breaks your Substitute, then use Substitute until you reach 5 HP, at which point both Overgrow and the Petaya Berry should activate, granting you very high power at your disposal and enabling you to gain a number of OHKOs and 2HKOs. However, this power comes with the price of forcing you down to low health, making you easy pickings for the priority-heavy Little Cup Metagame. Also, you have only two moveslots in which to use offensive moves, which is very taxing on Treecko when you consider that its only STAB is resisted by seven different types. Energy Ball is your most powerful, reliable STAB option, as Leaf Storm is unusable given its negative side-effect, which renders your boost wasted.</p>

    <p>Hidden Power Fire hits the Steel-, Grass-, and Bug-types that resist your main STAB, as well as Croagunk. Other options for the coverage move include Hidden Power Ice, which hits Dragon-, Grass- and Flying-types super effectively, and Hidden Power Rock, which hits Fire-, Flying-, and Bug-types super effectively. However, because Grass is such a poor attacking type, one move can never quite cover everything – with Hidden Power Fire you are exposed to Fire-types such as Houndour, who can usually take an Energy Ball and finish you off with a STAB Fire attack, or else take you down with Sucker Punch. Dragon-types such as Dratini can be problematic as well, but Dratini with no defensive investment are almost always OHKOed by a +1 Overgrow Energy Ball after Stealth Rock damage, although they can strike before you with Extremespeed given a chance, and Gible is OHKOed regardless. Hidden Power Ice can help if you dislike Dragons, but although Dratini is no longer much of a concern, you have the additional problem of Bronzor to contend with. If you choose Hidden Power Rock, both Bronzor and Croagunk are big problems. The EVs generate maximum Special Attack and Speed, but the leftover 68 EVs will not get you an extra point anywhere except in HP, which you cannot gain an extra point in as you will not activate the Petaya Berry after three Substitutes unless you have an even HP number. If you do not run Hidden Power Fire or any other Hidden Power that necessitates a drop in either Special Attack or Speed, you can run 236 EVs and 196 EVs respectively, allowing you 76 leftover EVs, enough to gain an extra point in either defensive stat. A Modest nature is chosen as, after an Agility boost, very little can beat Treecko, and it needs the extra power far more, since with Timid, it cannot OHKO standard Misdreavus with a Petaya and Overgrow-boosted Energy Ball, whereas it can do so with Modest.</p>

    <p>Stealth Rock support can greatly help Treecko, as it will make a big dent in Treecko’s usual responses, namely Fire-, Flying-, Bug-, and Ice-types. As previously mentioned, this set’s checks largely depend on the coverage move chosen. Hidden Power Fire is usually the best choice, but you cannot beat Fire-types such as Houndour or Dragon-types such as Bagon. If you pick Hidden Power Ice, Bronzor is a massive problem. Scarf Diglett can remove most Fire-types and Bronzor can be removed via a dedicated Magnemite, but Treecko still retains the problems of priority-users, who are extremely common in Little Cup. Treecko typically lures in Pokemon that resist its STAB moves, as Grass resistances are not difficult to come by even in Little Cup, and so Treecko often has the opportunity to cause massive damage to Pokemon who threaten it, paving the way for another to exploit, such as Misdreavus should you happen to run into a Stunky or Munchlax.</p>

    Swords Dance (open)

    [SET]
    name: Swords Dance
    move 1: Swords Dance
    move 2: Seed Bomb
    move 3: Quick Attack
    move 4: Rock Slide / Brick Break / Crunch / Leaf Storm
    item: Life Orb / Oran Berry
    nature: Jolly / Adamant
    evs: 236 Atk / 76 SpD / 196 Spe
    ivs: 0 HP

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Although Treecko loses out on its big brother Sceptile’s Leaf Blade, a complaint which only adds to the problem of its relatively poor Attack stat, Treecko can make a decent Swords Dance Pokemon thanks to its good physical movepool, a desirable trait sadly lacking on the special side, in particular the priority Quick Attack. Although both Gligar and Anorith both outrun and outgun Treecko in terms of raw stats, and are usually classified as the superior choice as Swords Dancers in most situations, Treecko is sufficiently different enough to warrant a look.</p>

    <p>With a Jolly nature, Treecko hits a respectable 28 Attack after a Swords Dance, which coupled with its ability to hit the most naturally defensive of Pokemon, usually Rock-, Water-, and Ground-types for super-effective damage with its STAB moves, such as Hippopotas, Geodude and Squirtle, can make it quite difficult to stop or stall for very much time. Seed Bomb is Treecko’s best physical STAB move, and indeed his only one aside from Bullet Seed, and while not as powerful as could be desired, it will still bite into almost anything that does not resist it after a Swords Dance. Quick Attack is priority move that helps greatly in dealing with Pokemon faster than Treecko, such as Staryu and Taillow, whom you will inevitably come across on your opponent’s team, given the extremely speed-related Little Cup metagame. It also helps with priority abusers such as Croagunk, and can be used to cheat death against Sucker Punch revenge killers such as Houndour and Stunky.</p>

    <p>In the last slot, there are a lot of options for coverage, each with its own specific areas to deal with opponents that Treecko finds difficult, yet lacking even one can often mean Treecko’s doom. Treecko’s Grass type STAB is resisted by Fire-, Flying-, Steel-, Dragon-, Bug-, Poison-, and other Grass-types, Rock Slide is the main option in the last slot, able to take down the slower Fire-, Flying-, and Bug-types that resist Grass. Brick Break is also an option for Steel-types such as Bronzor and Magnemite, who will wall you almost completely otherwise, and also tackles Snover. It does not help much with anything else, however. Crunch is your best option for Ghost-types, specifically Gastly, who is both faster than you and has a resistance to your STAB Grass-type attacks by virtue of its Poison typing. Lastly, Leaf Storm is powerful enough to warrant a mention, despite not receiving a boost from Swords Dance, and can be useful to hit some Pokemon on their weaker special side in a one-time blast. For your item, Life Orb is almost always preferred for the extra power, which Treecko needs more than anything else, although it does shorten Treecko’s lifespan considerably. Oran Berry is the other noteworthy option, healing Treecko should it survive a weaker attack, and also reinforcing slightly Treecko’s rather poor defensive stats. It can also facilitate setting up a single Swords Dance in pressing circumstances.</p>

    <p>One can also try a SubSalac strategy with Salac Berry as your item and Substitute over Quick Attack or your coverage move, where you use Swords Dance then Substitute down to Salac Berry, activating the Speed boost as well as Treecko’s Overgrow ability, giving extra power. However, this strategy has big problems with bulkier or faster priority-users, who can polish you off easily regardless of Quick Attack. The EVs given here generate maximum Attack and Speed, while also allocating a point to Special Defence, although you can switch this to Defence if you prefer. The 0 IV in HP gives you 19 HP, which rounds up Life Orb damage to 1 HP per use, allowing you far more uses of Life Orb than you would otherwise have. If you run Oran or Salac Berry this IV change is not necessary. The choice of nature is dependant on whether you would rather count on Treecko’s good base 70 Speed stat or pump up his below-average Attack stat to a higher degree. Jolly is recommended here to avoid being outrun by neutral Mankey and Cranidos, amongst others. However, Adamant can still work due to Quick Attack compensating for the lower speed.</p>

    <p>As before, Treecko appreciates Stealth Rock support to wear down those that resist its Grass-type STAB into possible KO ranges, as well as to break Focus Sashes. In this situation, however, Treecko’s great bugbear is not priority, but those physically defensive Pokemon who can take one of his attacks and KO back–and even when Treecko is at full health there are plenty of them. Even with Brick Break or Crunch, and a Swords Dance under its belt, Treecko can barely 4HKO Bronzor through Oran Berry, although a Swords Danced Brick Break does OHKO Magnemite and Snover. A Fire-type such as Houndour or Ponyta can be helpful here to get rid of all three of them with their STAB attacks, though they have to be careful of Earthquake from Bronzor. Krabby can set up Swords Dance or Agility on a weakened Bronzor, and Treecko can help lure it out. Without Crunch, Gastly and Misdreavus can outrun and end you quickly, so having a Stunky or Munchlax to get rid of them with Pursuit is a good idea. Lastly, without Rock Slide you are susceptible to Fire-, Bug-, and Flying-types, so bringing along another Rock-type such as Onix or Phanpy can help.</p>

    Endeavor (open)

    [SET]
    name: Endeavor
    move1: Endeavor
    move2: Quick Attack
    move3: Counter / GrassWhistle
    move4: Protect / Crunch
    item: Focus Sash
    nature: Jolly
    evs: 236 Atk / 196 Spe

    <p>An alternative lead set that Treecko can attempt is one that uses the combination of Endeavor, Quick Attack, and Focus Sash, enabling Treecko to almost always take down at least one Pokemon on the opponent's team. Treecko is perhaps the premier user in Little Cup of Endeavor + Counter sets, due in part to its additional access to such moves as Counter and GrassWhistle. The idea of the set is, if being used as a lead, to take an attack, survive with Focus Sash, and use the appropriate move to be rid of your opponent's lead, though this comes at the cost of Treecko's life. If your opponent is unlikely to use priority moves and you suspect that it will use a special move, then use Endeavor to bring your opponent down to 1HP, and subsequently use Quick Attack to KO them. On the other hand, against a physically-inclined opponent who is undoubtedly faster, Counter is better in order to guarantee a quick KO.</p>

    <p>The last slot is also rather important, as it is necessary in order to deal with those who may attempt to interfere with your strategy. On the one hand, Protect is useful to beat powerful Fake Out users such as Meowth and Aipom, so that you retain your Focus Sash and can continue your strategy. If you manage to Counter the U-turn, you can end up doing massive damage to whatever switches in. On the other hand, Ghost-types such as Gastly and Drifloon almost entirely shut down this strategy since they are immune to both U-turn and Counter, so having Crunch on your moveset can be helpful to pose some threat to them, especially if you retain your Focus Sash.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>One extremely problematic lead that has not been mentioned already is Machop, who has a number of problems associated with it. Lead Machop cannot OHKO due to Focus Sash, however it has one weapon that is especially potent against Treecko - No Guard Dynamicpunch. This means that Treecko will be confused after the first attack, and so you only have a 50% chance to Counter the attack - and if Machop has a Focus Sash, you have only a 25% chance to execute your strategy properly. Therefore, GrassWhistle can be a useful investment in order to deal with all lead Machop adequately, as well as having some general utility against leads less likely to attack, such as Bronzor. However, it is illegal with Counter, which seriously diminishes the effectiveness of the strategy as a whole.</p>

    <p>Generally speaking, teammates for this set could either be described as 'flexible' or 'irrelevant'. Treecko is designed for suicide, doesn't create any specific support, and is very sporadic as to the Pokemon it eliminates. However, if you intend to keep Treecko aside should you happen to run into a Pokemon it cannot handle, or else mispredict, there are a couple of Pokemon that could be worth advising. Pursuit support from Stunky or Munchlax can be useful to get rid of Ghost-types if you do not have Crunch, preventing them from ruining your strategy, and Ghost-types such as Gastly can be useful to deal with Machop.</p>
  2. Heysup

    Heysup Monsters are dangerous and kings are dying like flies.
    is a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Forum Moderator Alumnus

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2008
    Messages:
    5,581
    I think you should make a special mention that Grasswhistle handles Machop very nicely since all attacks have 100% accuracy against it.
  3. bugmaniacbob

    bugmaniacbob Floats like a Butterfree, stings like a Metapod
    is a Smogon Media Contributoris an Artist Alumnusis a CAP Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

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    Messages:
    2,295
    That's interesting, I never thought of it that way. Added.

    Also, I've finished it way before I expected (predicting exam grades to suffer accordingly, but oh well). New stuff:

    Team Options (open)
    [Team Options]

    <p>Offensive Treecko greatly appreciates Stealth Rock support, as it strikes four of the five types that cause it the greatest woe - Fire-, Flying-, Ice-, and Bug-types for super effective damage, shaving off large amounts of health as they come in and putting them into KO range for Treecko's resisted STAB or neutral attacks. Dual Screen support can also come in handy from something like Bronzor, especially considering Treecko's middling defensive stats, giving it time to set up a Swords Dance or Agility without hassle.</p>

    <p>Houndour resists both Fire- and Ice- attacks, and if Treecko can bait a Fire attack Houndour can use it to activate its Flash Fire ability, powering up its Fire attacks and threatening the opponent. Houndour is also very useful for its ability to get rid of Bronzor, as well as being able to use STAB Sucker Punch and Pursuit to get rid of Gastly or Misdreavus. Stunky is another useful partner if Ghosts bother you - while Stunky beats Nasty Plot Misdreavus, Houndour beats SubSneak Will-o-Wisp Misdreavus, so choose wisely. If Treecko can bait out and weaken its counters, you should try to have Pokemon waiting in the wings who can take advantage of this hole - Misdreavus appreciates the end of Munchlax, Bronzor or Stunky, and getting rid of any of them can be the key to a win at any time. Scarf Cranidos is also a useful partner for Treecko, able to dispose of almost all the Pokemon that Treecko hates, hitting all of Fire-, Flying-, Poison-, and Steel-types for super effective damage and OHKOing many that it hits neutrally with the combination of Head Smash, Earthquake, and Mold Breaker. Phanpy is similarly helpful, able to deal with Fire-, Poison-, and Steel-types with its STAB Earthquake and revenge-killing Dragon-, Flying-, and Grass-types with its priority Ice Shard, and it too has access to Head Smash, though it shares an Ice weakness with Treecko. Lastly, Magnet Rise Magnemite is a failsafe way to remove Bronzor, and Diglett is likewise the same for Poison-, Fire-, and Steel-type foes, which are available for use if you wish to push Treecko even further.</p>

    <p>Kabuto makes a great compliment to Treecko, as it resists four of Treecko's five weaknesses - Flying, Ice, Fire, and Poison - while Treecko itself can come in on Ground-, Electric- or Grass-type attacks aimed at Kabuto and begin attacking. Furthermore, Kabuto can revenge-kill a number of the Pokemon that give Treecko trouble, such as Mismagius, Taillow and Houndour, with its STAB priority Aqua Jet. However, they both have a number of common foes and similar type coverage with their main STAB. Aron works in a similar way, resisting Flying, Ice, Poison, and Bug attacks, and being able to set up a Rock Polish on a Pokemon lured out by Treecko and locked on a not-very-effective move, while wiping out Treecko's foes with STAB Head Smash, and giving Treecko opportunities to switch in on predicted Ground- and Water-type attacks. Aron also helps out against leads such as Meowth that Treecko cannot beat. Chinchou is also a good choice, being able to take Fire, Ice, and Flying attacks aimed at Treecko, while beating Fire-types with STAB Surf, Flying-types with STAB Thunderbolt, and Grass- and Dragon-types with Ice Beam, while able to set up Agility on the switch after Treecko lures in something it frightens off. All of these attract Croagunk, something that neither they nor Treecko can really deal with, so Gligar is recommended to beat Croagunk if you lack Hidden Power Fire or they lack Hidden Power Ice.</p>


    Other Options (open)
    [Other Options]

    <p>Treecko's Choice Specs Leaf Storm is very powerful, though it's a shame that so many other Pokemon resist Grass-type attacks as it could be quite the force otherwise. On the other end, Choice Band is a possibility, though Treecko's low Attack stat means that that sort of role is better delegated to other Pokemon. Treecko is perhaps the premier user in Little Cup of Endeavour + Counter sets, whereby it can take a physical hit, survive with Focus Sash, and KO the opponent with Counter, or else use Endeavour + Quick Attack if they are faster and likely to use a special move. Endeavour and Counter are, however, illegal with Grasswhistle and Leaf Storm. Also, with the influx of priority users in Little Cup this strategy is not as effective as it may seem on paper - the extreme popularity of Mismagius is another point worth noting if you wish to use that set.</p>

    <p>Thunderpunch is an alternative to Rock Slide on the Swords Dance set for more accuracy in exchange for worse coverage with Grass. Leech Seed can be used to stall out a slower opponent such as Bronzor or Munchlax, while shuffling opponents and hopefully racking up entry hazard damage as well. Hidden Power Ice is an alternative to Hidden Power Fire, hitting Dratini, Gligar, and Taillow rather than Bronzor, Snover, and Paras for super effective damage. Hidden Power Rock hits Taillow, Snover, Houndour, and Paras rather than Bronzor and Croagunk. Giga Drain can replenish health lost, albeit not by much. Protect can be used on the Lead set to block Meowth's Fake Out. If you are feeling confident, you can use Synthesis to offset Life Orb or Substitute damage. Lastly, Aerial Ace is an option to take down Croagunk and Machop with assurance, and is also useful against other Grass-types as well as Bug-types.</p>


    Opinion (open)
    [Opinion]

    <p>Treecko is one of those Pokemon that can do everything, but do it in only an average way - it is pretty difficult to predict what it is going to do next, but once you have it figured out, Treecko tends to die quickly. It is pretty quick, but it isn't enough to make it outstanding, it isn't overtly frail, but it isn't defensively competent either. Its movepool makes it excel, but it can only ever carry four moves at a time. It can beat almost any Pokemon in Little Cup given the right moveset - but it never seems to carry the right one at the right time.</p>

    <p>All in all, Treecko is a decent Pokemon with some promise, but don't expect him to outperform the more commonly used Pokemon anytime soon. You may well describe him as a small packet of Haribo - he is versatile in flavour, but lacking in substance.</p>


    Counters (open)
    [Counters]

    <p>Treecko is nothing if not versatile, and you should never underestimate its ability to surprise you. Although a total of seven different types resist its Grass-type STAB, the number of moves it can potentially run can always catch you out. Once you have figured out the moveset, Treecko is a lot easier to handle, if he isn't already dead. The types that resist Grass are Fire, Flying, Bug, Grass, Poison, Dragon, and Steel, however Treecko will almost always be running Hidden Power Fire on special sets such as Agility SubPetaya, meaning that Pokemon such as Paras, Croagunk and Bronzor become less efficient checks in normal circumstances, however there are a number of Pokemon that resist both Grass- and Fire-type attacks.</p>

    <p>Fire-types such as Houndour and Magby are usually the best switch-ins, as they have useful resistances to both Grass- and Fire-type attacks, but you must be wary of a surprise Hidden Power Rock. The Swords Dancer can also fight back with Quick Attack or Rock Slide. Flying-types such as Taillow and Doduo also resist Grass and can attack back with their STAB attacks, though if they are weakened by Stealth Rock, Brave Bird recoil or Flame Orb damage, they may well find themselves either in Quick Attack range or dying after their attack. Gastly and Stunky both resist Grass - Stunky can be rid of Treecko either by Sucker Punch or Pursuit, while Gastly is faster and is immune to Quick Attack. However, Stunky is 2HKOed by a Swords Danced Life Orb Brick Break even factoring in Oran Berry, and Gastly cannot take Crunch. Dratini is another Pokemon that resists both Grass and Fire, and can set up a Dragon Dance sweep if Treecko attempts to flee, or else beat Treecko with Extremespeed.</p>

    <p>On the special side of things, Munchlax is probably the best check you can find, with enough Special Defense to take Energy Ball and a resistance to Hidden Power Fire and Ice with Thick Fat, and is able to easily beat Treecko with Fire Punch or Return. It has to be careful of Petaya-boosted Overgrow Leaf Storms, however, and is OHKOed by a Swords Dance Life Orb Seed Bomb. In a similar vein, Bronzor is 2HKOed by +1 Hidden Power Fire even through Oran Berry, but can take anything that the Swords Dancer throws at it with ease. Treecko is quite frail and is easily revenge-killed, even factoring in Quick Attack - although Croagunk cannot take a Hidden Power Fire, it can usually beat Treecko with Fake Out + Vacuum Wave, and can come in on any STAB attack with its Grass resistance. Treecko is not as fast as it should like to be either, and there are a number of Pokemon that can outrun and OHKO it, such as Misdreavus, Taillow, and Staryu, although these have to watch out for Agility variants of Treecko. Phanpy deserves a special mention as it can sometimes lure out Treecko and destroy it with Ice Shard.</p>

    <p>Remember that none of these checks are complete counters in any way - even granted a resistance they can be stopped on the switch by a surprise Grasswhistle, Counter-Sash or Endeavour set, so be on your guard.</p>
  4. diinbong

    diinbong *it's in you to give*
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    In Other Options Mismagius should be Misdreavus and Endeavour should be Endeavor.
  5. mtr

    mtr

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    Since I've only played about 40 LC battles, I can't content check, but I can check grammar, which is in pink.

    I'll cover Team Options and stuff later, because I lose editing efficiency as time goes on, kinda like Leaf Storm.
  6. bugmaniacbob

    bugmaniacbob Floats like a Butterfree, stings like a Metapod
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    Changes made, thanks muchly.
  7. bugmaniacbob

    bugmaniacbob Floats like a Butterfree, stings like a Metapod
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    Updated with new format. Still need more grammar checks.
  8. bugmaniacbob

    bugmaniacbob Floats like a Butterfree, stings like a Metapod
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    Bump. Sorry for the triple post.

    Updated again, removed the Agility SubPetaya set as it doesn't work, and shuffled about some more stuff. Critiques are appreciated.
  9. Rising_Dusk

    Rising_Dusk
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    This set needs to be QCed with the shuffling of set content and so forth before anyone can GP it. Please check with the LC QC crew and then I can add it to the queue as you requested.
  10. Heysup

    Heysup Monsters are dangerous and kings are dying like flies.
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    Done and [​IMG]
  11. Kannon

    Kannon

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    All of treecko's sets outside of it's anti-lead set (which needs endeavor slashed somewhere imo) look terribly outclassed. I'd like you to PM me with some logs or something that show treecko is a more valuable partner than swords dance gligar or double dance paras/krabby before I stamp this.
  12. bugmaniacbob

    bugmaniacbob Floats like a Butterfree, stings like a Metapod
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    I'm not going to pretend that Treecko is, realistically speaking, any better than a more standard SD Pokemon like Gligar or Krabby, since if I was to use a physical set-up Pokemon competitively I would almost always choose one of those. However, I'm pretty sure that the general C&C consensus is that, if the set isn't utterly outclassed in every single way, and the Pokemon can't actually use the set well or has better options, then it should be considered viable. If I'm going to be honest, however, Swords Dance isn't exactly Treecko's best option. It "works" but is still pretty lacklustre, from what I got from testing it. I still wouldn't consider it on a team. If it would solve the problem I would be more than happy to remove it.

    As for Endeavor on the lead set, it would seem more sensible to make a separate endeavor lead, since the two sets operate quite differently. Something like:

    [SET]
    name: Endeavor
    move1: Endeavor
    move2: Quick Attack
    move3: Protect / Counter
    move4: Grasswhistle / Crunch
    item: Focus Sash
    nature: Jolly
    evs: 236 Atk / 196 Spe

    I'm not fond of endeavor sets in general, as they are a trifle gimmicky for me, but since Treecko seems to be pretty good at it, I can give it a look in. As for the set, Endeavor is the main move, and Quick Attack is there to finish off opponents. Protect stops Fake Out Meowth and co. from ruining the strategy, and Grasswhistle is there to stop Machop. Counter is useful to eliminate slower physical targets, but is illegal with Grasswhistle. If you want to use Counter, then Crunch is the next best thing I guess, in order to stop Ghosts that try to ruin the strategy, or else just stop you from being complete set-up bait (Crunch OHKOes Gastly and 2HKOes Duskull through Oran).

    Will update with thoughts.

    EDIT: Wow, trop longtemps. Er... well, I've decided to add the set above probationarily, pending QC decisions.
  13. bugmaniacbob

    bugmaniacbob Floats like a Butterfree, stings like a Metapod
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    *Stealth Bump*

    Just trying to reactivate my last LC QC analysis, needs one more stamp to go to Copyediting.

    I added an Endeavor lead set pending Quality Control judgement.
  14. Elevator Music

    Elevator Music
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    Moderator

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    I've never been a fan of Endeavor in LC simply because of Oran Berry making it pretty useless... While the Endeavor lead looks like it works on paper against LO and slower Sash leads, it still won't win against any lead with Oran (which I don't find to be too rare) as outside of Endeavor is basically lacks all offensive capability. In pretty much every case I'd rather use the first lead I think. If you have logs or post scenarios (its a lead matchup so I guess logs aren't mandatory!) showing Treecko working I won't ask for it to be removed.

    idk, just my 2 cents. Treecko obviously doesn't have many viable options so w/e :(
  15. bugmaniacbob

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    Yeah whatever

    This has really been around too long, I don't really have the will to argue any of these sets' cases. Summary of changes:

    - Removed all sets barring Anti-lead (see hide tags at bottom of the OP)
    - Added Endeavor and Counter to AC of Anti-lead
    - Put all removed sets into OC

    The analysis is now a lot shorter, but maybe that's for the best.
  16. macle

    macle ribbit
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    Little Cup Co-Leader

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    Approved.
  17. Aeron Ee1

    Aeron Ee1 Nom nom nom
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    Proofread (open)

    Additions in blue
    Removals in red
    comments in green
    repeated words in bold

    [Overview]

    <p>Treecko is one of those Pokemon that can do everything, but do it in only an average way - it is pretty difficult to predict what it is going to do next, but once you have it figured out, Treecko tends to die quickly. It is pretty quick, but it isn't enough to make it outstanding, it isn't overtly frail, but it isn't defensively competent either. Its movepool is where it excels, but it can only ever carry four moves at a time. It can beat almost any Pokemon in Little Cup given the right moveset - but it never seems to carry the right one at the right time.</p>

    <p>All in all, Treecko is a decent Pokemon with some promise, but don't expect him to outperform the more commonly used Pokemon anytime soon. You may well describe him as a small packet of Haribo - he is versatile in flavor, but lacking in substance.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Anti-lead
    move 1: Leaf Storm
    move 2: Hidden Power Fire
    move 3: GrassWhistle
    move 4: Quick Attack / Focus Punch
    item: Focus Sash
    nature: Hasty
    evs: 36 HP / 240 SpA / 200 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>There are several ways that Treecko can be used in the lead spot, and this variant is perhaps the most useful and almost certainly the most conventional of all of them. Leaf Storm is your basic STAB move, and due to Treecko’s above average Speed and Special Attack, it is a good move for hit-and-run attacks against most Pokemon in Little Cup, especially if you can get Treecko into Overgrow range. It also happens to score super effective damage against a good number of common leads, and even those that resist it cannot usually afford to switch in safely. Hidden Power Fire gives good coverage alongside Leaf Storm and also 2HKOs lead Bronzor, as well as OHKOing Snover. GrassWhistle is an interesting move that, while having a quite unreliable 55% accuracy can be used to incapacitate a member of the opponent’s team that Treecko cannot pass through, or to prevent a slower Pokemon such as Bronzor from setting up. GrassWhistle is also of particular note against Machop leads, against whom you are guaranteed to hit thanks to Machop's ability, No Guard.</p>

    <p>Treecko’s threat to many common leads often forces the opponent to switch Treecko’s best check in blindly, often resulting in Treecko shutting down the opponent’s first answer to it prematurely. In the last slot, Quick Attack is a useful tool to finish off any slower Sash lead, and is also useful later on in the game if revenge killing is required. Focus Punch on the other hand can be used alongside GrassWhistle to buy free turns in which to charge up a punch, and can be rewarding if you happen to catch a Munchlax on the switch attempting to soak up a Leaf Storm, on the switch. Focus Sash will save Treecko you if it you happens to fall on the wrong end of an attack that would normally OHKO you, which is helpful as it also activates Overgrow for you, adding to the raw power of Leaf Storm. The EV spread here generates maximum Special Attack and Speed while also giving an extra point in HP. Because Hidden Power Fire necessitates an IV of 30 in both Speed and Special Attack, an extra 4 EVs are required in both stats to max them out – if you do not run Hidden Power Fire for whatever reason, you can add 72 EVs to Attack instead to gain an extra point there – something you cannot do if you run Hidden Power Fire. A Hasty nature is used so as not to spoil the power of either offensive stat, though it reduces Defense slightly, Treecko’s defensive prowess is frankly not spectacular, even without it the defense-lowering nature.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>The basic idea behind this it is to attempt to put your opponent to sleep with GrassWhistle, disabling one of your opponent’s Pokemon and leaving you free to cause havoc with your attacking moves. If you face a Pokemon you can hopefully beat one-on-one, such as Kabuto, Onix or Phanpy, the threat of a Grass-type attack will usually force the opponent to switch out. With luck, your opponent’s Treecko counter will be forced to take the Sleep, or else a very powerful Leaf Storm, while you have the assurance of surviving the next attack, thanks to Focus Sash. The activation of the Sash also brings you down to Overgrow range, making your Leaf Storms even more powerful. As for other move options, Endeavor can be useful alongside Quick Attack for a way to strike down faster offensive leads that resist Grass or Fire, but due to the prevalence of Oran Berry and Treecko's excellent coverage on most leads, it is usually not worth the effort. Counter is another option that can work well against threats such as Meowth, but it is a free invitation for Ghost-types, and is illegal with GrassWhistle.</p>

    <p>Treecko is neither slow nor catastrophically frail, but it still leans some way towards both, making it less effective against certain foes. Its Speed is not sufficient to compensate for its lack of bulk, and what little bulk it has cannot protect it against faster foes. Meowth is top on the list of foes Treecko cannot beat, as it can take out Treecko without suffering a single hit with a combination of Fake Out + U-turn. Meowth hates having to deal with Rock-types such as Aron, who can set up Rock Polish on Meowth if it doesn’t carry Hypnosis, as they resist its STAB Fake Out and can exploit Meowth’s hasty retreat to their own advantage. Houndour is another lead that Treecko has trouble with, as it resists both Leaf Storm and Hidden Power Fire. It also takes little noteworthy damage from Quick Attack, and there is a slim chance little real hope of ever hitting it with a Focus Punch, although you can catch it out if it tries to Sucker Punch as you use GrassWhistle. Diglett can switch in on a predicted Sucker Punch and get rid of it with Earthquake, or else a (Diglett takes 94.1% - 123.5% from Sucker Punch) A Water-type that can take a Sucker Punch, such as Krabby, is safe can take it on if it Houndour lacks Hidden Power Grass. Krabby can also deal with take on Bronzor leads, if they prove troublesome.</p>

    [Team Options]

    <p>Offensive Treecko greatly appreciates Stealth Rock support, as it strikes four of the five types that cause it the greatest woe :- Fire-, Flying-, Ice-, and Bug-types, for super effective damage, shaving off large amounts of health as they come in and putting them closer into KO range for Treecko's resisted STAB or neutral attacks. Dual Screen support can also come in handy from something like Bronzor, especially considering Treecko's middling defensive stats, giving it time to set up a Swords Dance or Agility without hassle.</p>

    <p>Houndour resists both Fire- and Ice-type attacks, and if Treecko can bait a Fire-type attack, Houndour can use it to activate its Flash Fire ability, powering up its STAB to more seriously Fire attacks and threatening the opponent. Houndour is also very useful for its ability to get rid of Bronzor, as well as being able to use STAB Sucker Punch and Pursuit to get rid of Gastly or Duskull. Stunky is another useful partner if Ghost-types are bothering you. If Treecko can bait out and weaken its counters, you should try to have Pokemon waiting in the wings who can take advantage of this hole - Gastly appreciates the end of Munchlax, Bronzor or Stunky, and getting rid of any of them can be the key to a win at any time. Scarf Cranidos is also a useful partner for Treecko, able to dispose of almost all the Pokemon that Treecko hates, hitting all of Fire-, Flying-, Poison-, and Steel-types, for super effective damage and OHKOing many that it hits neutrally with a moveset the combination of Head Smash, Earthquake, and Mold Breaker. Phanpy is similarly helpful, able to deal with Fire-, Poison-, and Steel-types with its STAB Earthquake and revenge-killing Dragon-, Flying-, and Grass-types with its priority Ice Shard, and it too has access to Head Smash (so?), though it shares an Ice weakness with Treecko. Lastly, Magnet Rise Magnemite is a failsafe way to remove Bronzor, and Diglett is likewise the same for Poison-, Fire-, and Steel-type foes, which are available for use if you wish to push Treecko even further.</p>

    <p>Kabuto makes a great compliment to Treecko, as it resists four of Treecko's five weaknesses - Flying, Ice, Fire, and Poison - while Treecko itself can come in on Ground-, Electric- or Grass-type attacks aimed at Kabuto and begin attacking. Furthermore, Kabuto can revenge-kill a number of the Pokemon that give Treecko trouble, such as Gastly, Taillow and Houndour, with its STAB priority Aqua Jet. However, they both have a number of common foes and similar type coverage with their main STAB (huh?). Aron works in a similar way, (no, it doesn't) resistsing Flying-, Ice-, Poison-, and Bug-type attacks, and being is able to easily set up a Rock Polish on them a Pokemon lured out by Treecko and locked on a not-very-effective move, while wiping out Treecko's foes with STAB Head Smash, and giving Treecko opportunities to switch in on predicted Ground- and Water-type attacks. Aron also helps out against leads such as Meowth that Treecko cannot beat. Chinchou is also a good choice, being able to take Fire, Ice, and Flying attacks aimed at Treecko, while beating all of them with its STABs or Ice Beam, all the while threatening the opponent with potential set-up on the switch Fire-types with STAB Surf, Flying-types with STAB Thunderbolt, and Grass- and Dragon-types with Ice Beam, while able to set up Agility on the switch after Treecko lures in something it frightens off. All of these attract Croagunk, something that neither they nor Treecko can really deal with, so Gligar is recommended to beat Croagunk if you lack Hidden Power Fire or they lack Hidden Power Ice.</p>

    [Optional Changes]

    <p>Treecko's Choice Specs Leaf Storm is very powerful, though it's a shame that so many other Pokemon resist it, Grass-type attacks as it could've been quite the force otherwise. Treecko has a pretty good physical movepool, with access to Swords Dance, Seed Bomb, Quick Attack, Brick Break, Rock Slide, Aerial Ace, ThunderPunch, and Crunch, but Treecko's low Attack stat means that that sort of role is better delegated to other Pokemon. Treecko is perhaps the premier user in Little Cup of Endeavor + Counter sets in Little Cup, whereby it can takes a physical hit, survive with Focus Sash, and KOs the opponent with Counter, or else use Endeavor + Quick Attack if they are faster and likely to use a special move. Endeavor and Counter are, however, illegal with GrassWhistle and Leaf Storm. Also, with the influx of priority users in Little Cup this strategy is not as effective as it may seem on paper. Lastly, Agility is a nice boosting move which boosts Treecko's Speed, and can be used alongside Swords Dance, or else Substitute and a Petaya Berry, which also takes advantage of Overgrow.</p>

    <p>Leech Seed can be used to stall out a slower opponent such as Bronzor or Munchlax, while shuffling them opponents and hopefully racking up entry hazard damage as well. Hidden Power Ice is an alternative to Hidden Power Fire, hitting Dratini, Gligar, and Taillow rather than Bronzor, Snover, and Paras for super effective damage. Hidden Power Rock hits Taillow, Snover, Houndour, and Paras rather than Bronzor and Croagunk. Giga Drain can replenish lost health lost, albeit not by much. Protect can be used on the Lead set to block Meowth's Fake Out. If you are feeling confident, you can use Synthesis to offset Life Orb or Substitute damage on a sweeping set. Lastly, Aerial Ace is an option to take down Croagunk and Machop with assurance, and is also useful against other Grass-types, as well as Bug-types.</p>

    <p>Treecko has a decent Speed stat, which can be a real asset to him to overcome his less-than-impenetrable defensive stats, so max Speed is usually the best course of action on any Treecko set. Remember that if you run Hidden Power Fire, you will need 200 EVs to max it out the Speed stat due to having to run a 30 Speed IV – without it you only need 196 EVs. Next you should aim to max out the primary attacking stat that you will be using primarily, both of which max out with 236 EVs, or 240 EVs if you run Hidden Power Fire. When going mixed it is recommended that you max out Treecko’s better Special Attack anyway, as Treecko needs all the power it can get. This will leave you with 68 EVs left over, of which 36 EVs are sufficient to get you an extra point in HP. If you do not run Hidden Power Fire, you will have 76 EVs left over, which will give you an extra point in any of Attack, Defense, or Special Defense. If you use Life Orb, you should run a 0 HP IV to minimize the Life Orb recoil. Lastly, when using a set with Counter, you should aim to minimise your Defense stat in order to ensure the maximum possible damage done.</p>

    [Counters]

    <p>Treecko is nothing if not versatile, and you should never underestimate its ability to surprise you. Although a total of seven different types resist its Grass-type STAB, the number of moves it can potentially run can always catch you out. Once you have figured out the moveset, Treecko is a lot easier to handle, if he isn't already dead. The types that resist Grass are Fire, Flying, Bug, Grass, Poison, Dragon, and Steel, though be careful of Treecko's coverage attacks. (unnecessary, everyone knows the type chart)</p>

    <p>Fire-types such as Houndour and Magby are usually the best switch-ins, as they have useful resistances to both Grass- and Fire-type attacks, but you must be wary of a surprise Hidden Power Rock. In the same vein, Flying-types such as Taillow and Doduo also resist Grass and can attack back with their STAB attacks, though if they are weakened by enough residual damage Stealth Rock, Brave Bird recoil or Flame Orb damage, they may well find themselves either in Quick Attack range or dying after their attack. Gastly and Stunky both resist Grass - Stunky can be rid of Treecko either by Sucker Punch or Pursuit, while Gastly is faster and is immune to Quick Attack. Dratini is another Pokemon that resists both Grass and Fire, and can set up a Dragon Dance sweep if Treecko attempts to flee, or else beat Treecko with Extremespeed.</p>

    <p>On the special side of things, Munchlax is probably the best check you can find, with enough Special Defense to take Energy Ball and a resistance to Hidden Power Fire and Ice with Thick Fat, and is able to easily beat Treecko with Fire Punch or Return. Bronzor is weak to Hidden Power Fire, but resists nigh-on everything else Treecko has and has the defensive stats to take several attacks and KO back. Treecko is quite frail and is easily revenge killed, even factoring in Quick Attack - although Croagunk cannot take a Hidden Power Fire, it can usually beat Treecko with Fake Out + Vacuum Wave, and can come in on any STAB attack with its Grass resistance. Treecko is not as fast as it should like to be either, and there are a number of Pokemon that can outrun and OHKO it, such as Elekid, Taillow, and Staryu, although these have to watch out for Agility variants of Treecko. Phanpy deserves a special mention as it can sometimes lure out Treecko and destroy it with Ice Shard.</p>

    <p>Remember that none of these checks are complete counters in any way - even granted a resistance, they can be stopped on the switch by a surprise GrassWhistle, Counter-Sash or Endeavor set, so always be on your guard.</p>

    Nice.
  18. Oglemi

    Oglemi We broke it. Yes, we were naughty. Completely naughty.
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    [Overview]

    <p>Treecko is one of those Pokemon that can do everything, but do it in only an average way - it is pretty difficult to predict what it is going to do next, but once you have it figured out, Treecko tends to die quickly. It is pretty quick, but it isn't enough to make it outstanding, it isn't overtly frail, but it isn't defensively competent either. Its movepool is where it excels, but it can only ever carry four moves at a time. It can beat almost any Pokemon in Little Cup given the right moveset - but it never seems to carry the right one at the right time.</p>

    <p>All in all, Treecko is a decent Pokemon with some promise, but don't expect him to outperform the more commonly used Pokemon anytime soon. You may well describe him as a small packet of Haribo - he is versatile in flavor, but lacking in substance.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Anti-lead
    move 1: Leaf Storm
    move 2: Hidden Power Fire
    move 3: GrassWhistle
    move 4: Quick Attack / Focus Punch
    item: Focus Sash
    nature: Hasty
    evs: 36 HP / 240 SpA / 200 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>There are several ways that Treecko can be used in the lead spot, and this variant is perhaps the most useful, (comma) and almost certainly the most conventional of all of them. Leaf Storm is its basic STAB move, and due to Treecko’s's (correct apostrophe) above average Speed and Special Attack, it is a good move for hit-and-run attacks against most Pokemon in Little Cup, especially if you can get Treecko into Overgrow range. It also happens to score super effective damage against a good number of common leads and even those that resist it cannot usually afford to switch in safely. Hidden Power Fire gives good coverage alongside Leaf Storm and also 2HKOs lead Bronzor, as well as OHKOing Snover. GrassWhistle is an interesting move that, while having a quite unreliable 55% accuracy, (comma) can be used to incapacitate a member of the opponent’s's team that Treecko cannot pass through, or to prevent a slower Pokemon such as Bronzor from setting up. GrassWhistle is also of particular note against Machop leads, against whom GrassWhistle is guaranteed to hit thanks to Machop's ability, No Guard.</p>

    <p>Treecko’s threat to many common leads often forces the opponent to switch Treecko’s best check in blindly, resulting in Treecko shutting down the opponent’s first answer to it prematurely. (I'm pretty sure this isn't needed.) In the last slot, Quick Attack is a useful tool to finish off any slower Sash lead, and is also useful later on in the game if revenge killing is required. Focus Punch, (comma) on the other hand, (comma) can be used alongside GrassWhistle to buy free turns in which to charge up a punch, and can be rewarding if Treecko happens to catch a Munchlax attempting to soak up a predicted Leaf Storm. Focus Sash will save Treecko if it happens to fall on the wrong end of an attack that would normally OHKO, which is helpful as it will simultaneously activate also activates Overgrow, adding to the raw power of Leaf Storm. The EV spread here given generates maximum Special Attack and Speed while also giving an extra point in HP. Because Hidden Power Fire necessitates an IV of 30 in both Speed and Special Attack, an extra 4 EVs are required in both stats to max them out – if you do not run Hidden Power Fire for whatever reason, you can add 72 EVs to Attack instead to gain an extra point there – something you cannot do if you run Hidden Power Fire. A Hasty nature is used so as not to spoil the power of either offensive stat, though Treecko’s's defensive prowess is frankly not spectacular regardless.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>The basic idea behind this set is to attempt to put your opponent to sleep with GrassWhistle, disabling one of your opponent’s's Pokemon and leaving you free to cause havoc with Treecko's attacking moves. If Treecko faces a Pokemon it can hopefully beat one-on-one, such as Kabuto, Onix, (comma) or Phanpy, the threat of a Grass-type attack will usually force the opponent to switch out. With luck, your opponent’s's Treecko counter will be forced to take the Sleep, or else a very powerful Leaf Storm, while Treecko has the assurance of surviving the next attack thanks to Focus Sash. The activation of the Sash also brings Treecko down to Overgrow range, making its Leaf Storms even more powerful. (This was already stated above.) As for other move options, Endeavor can be useful alongside Quick Attack for a way to strike down faster offensive leads that resist Grass or Fire, but due to the prevalence of Oran Berry and Treecko's excellent coverage on most leads, it is usually not worth the effort. Counter is another option that can work well against threats such as Meowth, but it is a free invitation for Ghost-types to come in for free and is illegal with GrassWhistle.</p>

    <p>Treecko is neither slow nor catastrophically frail, but it still leans some way towards both, making it less effective against certain foes. Its Speed is not sufficient to compensate for its lack of bulk, and what little bulk it has cannot protect it against faster foes. (Basically just two sentences in a row that say the same thing.) Meowth is top on the list of foes Treecko cannot beat, as it can take out Treecko without suffering a single hit with a combination of Fake Out + U-turn. Meowth hates having to deal with Rock-types such as Aron, who can set up Rock Polish on Meowth if it doesn’t carry Hypnosis, as they resist its STAB and can exploit Meowth’s's hasty retreat to their own advantage. Houndour is another lead that Treecko has trouble with, as it resists both Leaf Storm and Hidden Power Fire. It also takes little damage from Quick Attack, and there is little real hope of ever hitting it with a Focus Punch, although you can catch it out if it tries to Sucker Punch as Treecko uses GrassWhistle. A Water-type that can take a Sucker Punch, such as Krabby, is a good answer if Houndour lacks Hidden Power Grass. Krabby can also deal with Bronzor leads if they prove troublesome.</p>

    [Team Options]

    <p>Offensive Treecko greatly appreciates Stealth Rock support, as it strikes four of the five types that cause it the greatest woe (Fire-, Flying-, Ice-, and Bug-types) for super effective damage, shaving off large amounts of health as they come in and putting them closer into KO range for Treecko's attacks. Dual screen support can also come in handy from something a Pokemon like Bronzor, especially considering Treecko's middling defensive stats, giving it time to set up or attack without hassle.</p>

    <p>Houndour resists both Fire- and Ice-type attacks, and if Treecko can bait a Fire-type attack, Houndour can use it to activate its Flash Fire ability, powering up its STAB to more seriously threaten the opponent. Houndour is also very useful for its ability to get rid of Bronzor, as well as being able to use STAB Sucker Punch and Pursuit to get rid of Gastly or Duskull. Stunky is another useful partner if Ghost-types are bothering you. If Treecko can bait out and weaken its counters, you should try to have Pokemon waiting in the wings who can take advantage of this hole - Gastly appreciates the end of Munchlax, Bronzor, (comma) or Stunky, and getting rid of any of them can be the key to a win at any time. Scarf Cranidos is also a useful partner for Treecko, able to dispose of almost all the Pokemon that Treecko hates, hitting Fire-, Flying-, Poison-, and Steel-types, and OHKOing many more with the combination of Head Smash, Earthquake, and Mold Breaker. Phanpy is similarly helpful, able to deal with Fire-, Poison-, and Steel-types with its STAB Earthquake and revenge kill Dragon-, Flying-, and Grass-types with Ice Shard, though it shares an Ice weakness with Treecko. Lastly, Magnet Rise Magnemite is a failsafe way to remove Bronzor, and Diglett is likewise the same for Poison-, Fire-, and Steel-type foes, which are available to push Treecko's effectiveness even further.</p>

    <p>Kabuto makes a great defensive and offensive complement to Treecko, as it resists four of Treecko's five weaknesses - Flying, Ice, Fire, and Poison - while Treecko itself can come in on Ground-, Electric-, (comma) or Grass-type attacks aimed at Kabuto. Furthermore, Kabuto can revenge kill a number of the Pokemon that give Treecko trouble, such as Gastly, Taillow, (comma) and Houndour, with STAB Aqua Jet. Aron resists Flying-, Ice-, Poison-, and Bug-type attacks, and is able to easily set up a Rock Polish on them, while wiping out Treecko's foes with STAB Head Smash, and giving Treecko opportunities to switch in on predicted Ground- and Water-type attacks. Aron also helps out against leads such as Meowth whom Treecko cannot beat. Chinchou is also a good choice, being able to take Fire-, Ice-, and Flying-type attacks aimed at Treecko, threatening all of them with its STAB moves or Ice Beam, and all the while threatening the opponent with the potential to set up Agility on the switch. All of these attract Croagunk, something that neither they nor Treecko can really deal with, so Gligar is recommended to beat Croagunk if Treecko lacks Hidden Power Fire or Croagunk lacks Hidden Power Ice.</p>

    [Optional Changes]

    <p>Treecko's Choice Specs Leaf Storm is very powerful, though it's a shame that so many Pokemon resist it, as otherwise it could be quite the force. Treecko has a pretty good physical movepool, with access to Swords Dance, Seed Bomb, Quick Attack, Brick Break, Rock Slide, Aerial Ace, ThunderPunch, and Crunch, but Treecko's low Attack stat means that that sort of role is better delegated to other Pokemon. Treecko is perhaps the premier user of Endeavor + Counter sets in Little Cup, whereby it takes a physical hit, survives with Focus Sash, and KOes the opponent with Counter, or else uses Endeavor + Quick Attack if they are faster and likely to use a special move. Endeavor and Counter are, however, illegal with GrassWhistle and Leaf Storm. Also, with the influx of priority users in Little Cup, (comma) this strategy is not as effective as it may seem on paper. Lastly, Agility is a nice move which boosts Treecko's Speed, and can be used alongside Swords Dance, or Substitute and a Petaya Berry, which also takes advantage of Overgrow.</p>

    <p>Leech Seed can be used to stall out a slower opponent such as Bronzor or Munchlax, while shuffling them and hopefully racking up entry hazard damage as well. Hidden Power Ice is an alternative to Hidden Power Fire, hitting Dratini, Gligar, and Taillow rather than Bronzor, Snover, and Paras for super effective damage. Hidden Power Rock hits Taillow, Snover, Houndour, and Paras rather than Bronzor and Croagunk. Giga Drain can replenish lost health, albeit not by much. Protect can be used on the Lead set to block Meowth's Fake Out. If you are feeling confident, Treecko can use Synthesis to offset Life Orb or Substitute damage on a sweeping set. Lastly, Aerial Ace is an option to take down Croagunk and Machop with assurance, and is also useful against other Grass-types as well as Bug-types.</p>

    <p>Treecko has a decent Speed stat, which can be a real asset to him to overcome his less-than-impenetrable defensive stats, so max Speed is usually the best course of action on any set. Remember that if Treecko runs Hidden Power Fire, it will need 200 EVs to max it out due to having to run a 30 Speed IV – without it it only needs 196 EVs. Next you should aim to max out the primary attacking stat, both of which max out with 236 EVs, or 240 EVs if it runs Hidden Power Fire. When going mixed it is recommended that you max out Treecko’s's better Special Attack anyway, as Treecko needs all the power it can get. This will leave you with 68 EVs left over, of which 36 EVs are sufficient to get an extra point in HP. If Treecko does not run Hidden Power Fire, you will have 76 EVs left over, which will give Treecko an extra point in any of Attack, Defense, or Special Defense. If Treecko holds Life Orb, it should run a 0 HP IV to minimize the recoil. Lastly, when using a set with Counter, you should aim to minimisze Treecko's Defense stat in order to ensure the maximum possible damage done.</p>

    [Counters]

    <p>Treecko is nothing if not versatile, and you should never underestimate its ability to surprise you. Although a total of seven different types resist its STAB, the number of moves it can potentially run can always catch you out off guard. Once you have figured out the moveset, Treecko is a lot easier to handle, if he isn't already dead.</p>

    <p>Fire-types such as Houndour and Magby are usually the best switch-ins, as they have useful resistances to both Grass- and Fire-type attacks, but you must be wary of a surprise Hidden Power Rock. In the same vein, Flying-types such as Taillow and Doduo also resist Grass and can attack back with their STAB attacks, though if they are weakened by enough residual damage, they may well find themselves either in Quick Attack range or dying after their attack. Gastly and Stunky both resist Grass - Stunky can be rid of Treecko either by Sucker Punch or Pursuit, while Gastly is faster and is immune to Quick Attack. Dratini is another Pokemon that resists both Grass and Fire, and can set up a Dragon Dance sweep if Treecko attempts to flee, or else beat Treecko with Extremespeed.</p>

    <p>On the special side of things, Munchlax is probably the best check you can find. With enough Special Defense to take Energy Ball and a resistance to Hidden Power Fire and Ice with Thick Fat, as well as the ability to OHKO with Fire Punch or Return, it easily beats Treecko. Bronzor is weak to Hidden Power Fire, but resists nigh-on everything else Treecko has and has the defensive stats to take several attacks and KO back. Treecko is quite frail and is easily revenge killed, even factoring in Quick Attack. (period) - Although Croagunk cannot take a Hidden Power Fire, it can usually beat Treecko with Fake Out + Vacuum Wave, and can come in on any STAB attack with its Grass resistance. Treecko is not as fast as it should would like to be either, and there are a number of Pokemon that can outrun and OHKO it, such as Elekid, Taillow, and Staryu, although these have to watch out for Agility variants of Treecko. Phanpy deserves a special mention as it can sometimes lure out Treecko and destroy it with Ice Shard.</p>

    <p>Remember that none of these checks are complete counters in any way - even granted a resistance they can be stopped on the switch by a surprise set, so always be on your guard.</p>


    I don't care what anyone says, I like your writing style. You pretty much learn about the entire metagame from reading a single analysis by bmb.

    I take my hat off to you sir.

    GP 1/2

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  19. Komodo

    Komodo I have a custom title?
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    ~GP 2/2~

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    Red is remove
    Blue is an edit or addition

    Good stuff, hardly anything to change.

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  20. bugmaniacbob

    bugmaniacbob Floats like a Butterfree, stings like a Metapod
    is a Smogon Media Contributoris an Artist Alumnusis a CAP Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

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    YAY DONE

    Multiple thanks to Oglemi and Komodo. At last, I've finished my Gen IV Little Cup outstanding analyses. Tea and medals all round.

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