Gen 3 Try Netbattle Again

[Umby]

And I kinda suck at it.

Tyranitar (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Sand Stream
EVs: 108 HP / 148 Atk / 252 Spd
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Dragon Dance
- Earthquake
- Rock Slide
- Taunt

I should probably be using Jolly if I'm going to use that much speed. Maybe even CB would work.

Dusclops (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 96 Atk / 140 Def / 20 Spd
Careful Nature (+SDef, -SAtk)
- Pain Split
- Shadow Ball
- Taunt
- Will-O-Wisp

Works with Skarmory to block Rapid Spin. Taunt on the switch helps me put pressure on things trying to set up during sandstorm and with Spikes present.

Skarmory (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 84 Def / 172 Spd
Jolly Nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Counter
- Spikes
- Taunt
- Whirlwind

My favorite Skarmory set. Forces physical attackers to switch or get Countered the next turn. Mainly aimed at countering endgame Curselax.

Donphan (M) @ Choice Band
Trait: Sturdy
EVs: 252 HP / 132 Atk / 96 Def / 28 Spd
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Body Slam / Hidden Power [Bug]
- Earthquake
- Rapid Spin
- Rock Slide

A bit random. Needed a spinner, and I just like Donphan. Not sure about which move should be in that first slot. Paralysis is nice, but if I'm not wrecking Celebi off the bat with Crunch/HP Bug on Tyranitar, I might need Donphan to handle that for me. Maybe I can deal without a spinner and use Dugtrio. Claydol's kinda gay without Explosion, so no.

Vaporeon (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Water Absorb
EVs: 188 HP / 252 Def / 68 Spd
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Ice Beam
- Protect
- Surf
- Wish

Definitely needed some Wish.

Blissey (F) @ Leftovers
Trait: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spd
Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Aromatherapy
- Seismic Toss
- Softboiled
- Thunder Wave

Some whore I found in the alley.

 

[Lutra]

Definitely needs a Suicune counter. Why do people forget Suicune all the time? I mean you could try to stall it with Blissey but it's not a very reliable way. And Suicune is likely to outstall/beat Vaporeon.

 

[Purg]

I agree with Lutra. Also, some of your EVs needs fixing. For example, TTar doesn't need max Speed, he needs enough to hit 198 (meaning he will be faster than everything after two DDs, bar Electrode and Ninjask). You might as well swap the EVs on Vappy's HP and Def, to make it take hits better on both ends of the spectrum.

Also, Blissey needs some SAtk EVs and Ice Beam. I usually go 20 HP/max Def/rest in SAtk.

 

[Umby]

Speed was for outrunning stuff with Taunt. Also meant for outrunning things like Dugtrio after one DD, though I was too lazy to recall how much Speed Dugtrio has. Might as well lower it though.

Blissey doesn't always need Ice Beam.

On another note, perhaps I can go WishBliss and turn Vaporeon into Tauntridos? I'd gladly trade Donphan for Magneton in that case.

 

[dekzeh]

I agree with Lutra. Also, some of your EVs needs fixing. For example, TTar doesn't need max Speed, he needs enough to hit 198 (meaning he will be faster than everything after two DDs, bar Electrode and Ninjask). You might as well swap the EVs on Vappy's HP and Def, to make it take hits better on both ends of the spectrum.

Also, Blissey needs some SAtk EVs and Ice Beam. I usually go 20 HP/max Def/rest in SAtk.

Max Speed TTar outspeeds +nature base 100 after one DD, which is enough reason to use it. Vappy REALLY needs max def, I'm not going to even bother explaining why, try some calcs with the swapped EVs you suggested vs CB Mence, CB Gross etc really -___-'

Blissey doesn't exactly NEED SAtk EVs and Ice Beam. That's only when you have a glaring RestalkDos weak.

On the team. CB Tar works better with Spikes then DD, imo. With Spikes down you can just spam Rock Slide and anything (except Claydol and lol bulky Flygon (which doesn't even exist anymore)) will get hurt badly.

I really really really really really REALLY don't like any Dusclops without Rest. Even with all the Wish / Aroma support you can get I suggest you to use a Restalk variation, or at least Rest + 3 moves (Focus Punch clops is kewl).

Donphan is like kinda meh, I never really liked it, but it does fit your team.
However, I wouldn't use CB, you could try keeping the somewhat offensive EVs and instead of Body Slam/HP Bug use Counter or Roar.

You do need wish, but a Zapdos/Suicune counter is a must also.
Heal Bell, Perish Song, Leech Seed, Recover Celebi over Vaporeon and Wish on Blissey?

Mence can be handled by Donphan/Skarmory so Vaporeon isn't that much needed. You only lose coverage against.. fire types that can get past Blissey and TTar, which means, lol Blaziken only.

 

[Lutra]

Response to Umby:

But even Tauntrados doesn't counter an offensive Suicune. And a freeze would completely mess you up. Generally you need a powerful attacker which can shut down Suicune without dying in the process. Like Zapdos. Or at least a Celebi to leech. Or even Heracross would be enough with Gyarados. But it's hard to make a change without messing up the basic strategy. I'm not sure the best option in this case.

 

[Umby]

I can't say that I fear Ice Beaming Suicunes that much. I encounter them (and would expect to encounter them) a lot less than I would their Roaring counterparts.

But I do understand where you're coming from.

So since I'm nowhere near my team builder at the moment, let's say CBTar/Donphan/Skarmory/Dusclops/WishBliss/Rest Talk Zapdos?

 

[dekzeh]

That seems good for me.

 

[Lutra]

Emphasis on what Dekzeh said. Very impressive. This is a rare example of when team rating(helping) actually works. That structure seems to have few weaknesses.

 

[Heysup]

Me and lutra agree on something ^^ very nice team. And thanks for your help with mine. Though, i think you are better then skarmbliss :p.

 

[Umby]

I am. I'm an Umbreon. I rape Skarmbliss.

 

[Clefairy{m}]

Before you count out Vaporeon, consider the following.

Substitute/Baton pass Vap, helps Skarmory set up spikes before Magneton takes it out the game. It also helps you take care of you Rest/Talk suicune weak. Because you'll just Sub/Pass to Skarmory who can whirlwind away without taking damage.


Sub/Pass also helps CBTar wreak more havoc as its counters would have to break through sub 1st before attacking it. Sub/Pass also makes it so you don't have to ev Tar to take Adamant quakes from Dugtrio, instead you can invest more on Speed to make it even more hard to counter for your opponent.

 

[Oxypad]

Thought I would chime in on one of Umby's threads...again.

Not like there's any arguments going on about anything that's been said. I'm sure it will end up being CBTar/Donphan/Skarmory/Dusclops/WishBliss/Rest Talk Zapdos ,
like Umby said.

#1 - I like that Skarmory moveset. Taunt + Counter is nifty. Helps against opposing SubSkarm that try to spike, too, making Donphan stand out as a better Spinner and better Poke in general. (Still can't do anything about its and Skarmory's trait being the almighty, albeit useless, Sturdy though.)

#2 - Dekzeh pointed something out I really like and others should really understand. With SkarmClops virtually guaranteeing Spikes, CBTar can 'spam' Rock Slide as it was so eloquently put. Great thinking. Hurts just about everything. My lord--if only there was a stronger Rock move. 75 base power is kinda measly. Oh well.

#3 - Clefairy{m} (Clefairy Male? Cool avatar. Don't know why I like it.) posted on the usefulness of SubPass Vaporeon. In a perfect world, yes it could do all of those helpful things for the team. But Sandstream will be up, and maybe some Spikes too to impede poor little Vaporeon (say if Donphan can't do his Spinning job because of Ghost / SubSkarm). In reality, it may have time to do 1 of those things well in any given game. Not to knock Vaporeon, but it's not that good.

My bets are that it will crucially need Protect for itself, unless you think Blissey could Wish it back if it gets too low on health. Maybe if there was no Sandstream it could hold up and do all those things Clefairy{m} mentioned a bit better (besides the the stuff involving Tyranitar, since it wouldn't be on the team.)

Main point-- If Vaporeon is on a Sandstream team, it is fundamentally sound to not have its role be passing Substitutes. Use it for its presence as a bulky Water and for Wish Support, and be thankful for that and its ability to delay Suicune from setting up.