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Tyranitar【BW2 Revamp】【QC: 3/3】【GP: 2/2】

Discussion in 'Uploaded Analyses' started by Trinitrotoluene, Jul 22, 2012.

  1. Trinitrotoluene

    Trinitrotoluene my cheerier serperior is superior to your inferior rhyperior
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    [BOX]Things to do:
    • Test shrang's Mixed DDTar []
    • Fix EVs for certain sets []
    • Reorder sets []
    • Reorder sets AGAIN []
    • Get QC approvals once testing and reordering is done []
    • Write a poem for the Tyrant (not Colonel M, but I will write him one if he wants one) []
    • Get GP checks for this bad boy []
    [/BOX]
    [BOX]--------------------------------
    Status: DONE.
    QC Approvals: [PK Gaming] || [ginganinja] || [shrang]
    GP Checks: [bugmaniacbob] || [Engineer Pikachu]
    --------------------------------[/BOX]

    [​IMG][​IMG]
    [​IMG][​IMG]
    [​IMG][​IMG]
    I wandered through the weird and lurid landscape of another planet...
    [Overview]

    <p>With Pokemon Black and White 2 came the Therian formes and Keldeo, all of whom have bolstered the power of rain teams and worn down Tyranitar's prominence like waves against a cliff. Some older threats, such as Breloom and Mamoswine, have had new life breathed into them with their Dream World abilities. A few new Pokemon have also been added to Tyranitar's list of headaches due to their new access to Superpower, courtesy of the move tutors, who have decided not to give Tyranitar much to improve its admittedly already impressive movepool. The same Fighting-types that troubled Tyranitar before still remain in OU, ready to pounce on it at any moment. The general pace of the metagame has increased, making Tyranitar's life in OU more difficult to maintain than ever before.</p>

    <p>However, Tyranitar maintains a powerful and respectable niche as one of two automatic sandstorm inducers, which is important due to the the ubiquity of weather in OU. While Hippowdon may give Tyranitar a substantial amount of competition for a team slot, the tyrant has many advantages up its sleeve: increased special bulk under sandstorm, a better movepool, and the ability to smite many of its would-be counters on the switch with its raw power and impressive movepool. Tyranitar's ability to support potent sweepers, such as Landorus, Stoutland, Garchomp, and Sandslash, while fending off powerful specially-based threats, such as Latios, Latias, Gengar, and Starmie, further expand its niche in OU. Overall, while many new threats have conspired to dethrone the tyrant, they have yet to succeed, for Tyranitar has retained an iron grasp on its throne as one of the many kings of OU.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Choice Band
    move 1: Stone Edge
    move 2: Crunch
    move 3: Pursuit
    move 4: Superpower
    item: Choice Band
    nature: Adamant
    ability: Sand Stream
    evs: 180 HP / 252 Atk / 76 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>When equipped with a Choice Band, it is easy to see why Tyranitar is one of the most-feared Pokemon in OU. Boasting an absolutely massive 604 Attack, not many Pokemon will have business switching in on it. Opposing weather inducers not named Hippowdon will fear switching into its powerful attacks, making this set ideal for those that want to win the weather war decisively. Stall teams will be hard-pressed to keep up with its onslaught due to the sheer power it possesses, and offensive teams won't like having to sacrifice one of their team members so another one can receive a free switch-in.</p>

    <p>Despite its accuracy, Stone Edge is Tyranitar's main STAB move solely for its power and is capable of OHKOing or 2HKOing those that lack a resistance to it and even some that do. Crunch is a more accurate move that lets Tyranitar make short work of Jellicent, Reuniclus, and Celebi. Pursuit gives Tyranitar the ability to trap and kill the frail Psychic- and Ghost-types that would rather not stay in on any of Tyranitar's attacks. Superpower is the best move to use in the last slot, due to its ability to brutalize Steel-types and other Pokemon that resist its STAB moves. Superpower also gives Tyranitar the ability to land a crippling blow on Keldeo and Breloom, two of its biggest enemies, on the switch.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>The given EV spread maximizes Tyranitar's power while giving it the ability to outpace uninvested base 70s. The remaining EVs are placed into HP to give Tyranitar more bulk. Aqua Tail can be used over Superpower to smack Pokemon like Hippowdon, Gliscor, and Donphan around, but that is usually better left to teammates. Ice Punch can be used to get a surprise blow on powerful Dragons, but most are already hit hard enough by Stone Edge and the main Dragon-types Tyranitar should be facing, Latios and Latias, are scared witless by Crunch and Pursuit. Fire Punch is a great move for those that want to nab a surprise KO on Scizor, one of Tyranitar's most common counters. Earthquake provides mostly redundant coverage, but it still can see some use if your team is vulnerable to Jirachi, Tentacruel, or Metagross. More often than not, however, Superpower is the better option.</p>

    <p>This set has few guaranteed counters due to its sheer power, but unfortunately it does have plenty of checks. The foremost among these is Physically Defensive Hippowdon, who can switch in fearing little other than a boosted Aqua Tail, which is fairly rare on Tyranitar, and stall it out with Slack Off or go for the kill with Earthquake. Landorus-T and Gliscor function almost as well as Hippowdon, but both must watch out for Stone Edge as well as Aqua Tail. While Breloom, Terrakion, and Keldeo won't enjoy taking a Superpower, they can switch in on Tyranitar's STAB moves and force it out with the threat of powerful Fighting-type moves. Teammates such as Latios, Latias, and Reuniclus make great checks and counters to those Fighting-types. This also works in reverse; Keldeo and other Fighting-types appreciate Tyranitar's ability to annihilate Latios and Latias, and in turn, Tyranitar appreciates their ability to lure in Psychic-types, most of which are easy prey for it. While Garchomp will not enjoy eating a STAB Crunch, it can easily switch into Tyranitar's other moves and threaten it with its STAB Earthquake. Other offensive monsters such as Landorus, Terrakion, Garchomp, and Stoutland enjoy the sandstorm and wall-breaking power that Tyranitar brings along. As Tyranitar has trouble with physical walls that resist its STAB moves, Pokemon such as Heatran form great partnerships with it. If special bulk is prioritized over power, then an EV spread of 252 HP / 36 Atk / 220 SpD can be used at the expense of quite a bit of power.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Support
    move 1: Stealth Rock
    move 2: Pursuit
    move 3: Crunch
    move 4: Fire Blast / Superpower / Stone Edge
    item: Leftovers
    nature: Sassy / Careful
    ability: Sand Stream
    evs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>With appropriate investment and the Special Defense boost in a sandstorm, Tyranitar gains the ability to combat several notable specially-based threats, such as Latios, Ninetales, and Jolteon. Tyranitar can also reliably set up Stealth Rock because of its ability to threaten the Pokemon that possess Magic Bounce with its powerful Dark-type STAB attacks. Stealth Rock is the only hazard Tyranitar sets up, but it is enough to easily cripple several important OU Pokemon, such as Ninetales, Volcarona, and Thundurus-T. Crunch is Tyranitar's most reliable STAB move, due to its ability to OHKO targets such as Latios, Gengar, and Starmie, and 2HKO several other Pokemon. Pursuit is Tyranitar's other STAB move, and is great for trapping frail Pokemon that switch out in fear of a powerful attack. Fire Blast is the preferred move in the last slot because it allows Tyranitar to defeat Forretress and Ferrothorn, while retaining the ability to hurt Breloom, Genesect, and Scizor.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>Sassy is the preferred nature, since it lowers Tyranitar's already dismal Speed while maximizing its Special Defense. If more power is desired, a more offensive spread and an Adamant nature can be used, but this comes at the cost of a noticeable decrease in special bulk. Superpower can be used to get a more solid hit on several Pokemon, such as Terrakion (who must be hit on the switch), opposing Tyranitar, and Mamoswine. Stone Edge is an option if you want to use Tyranitar's other STAB type. Keep in mind, though, that the lack of Fire Blast or Superpower gives the Fighting-types in OU a free switch, allowing them to set up and wreak havoc. If your team already has Stealth Rock on another Pokemon, then an extra coverage move can be used in that slot.</p>

    <p>While Leftovers may be the preferred item, a Chople or Lum Berry can be used instead. A Chople Berry, while seemingly useless, is actually useful for taking Focus Blasts and Superpowers from the Therian formes, Reuniclus, and Hydreigon. Lum Berry sees some use in granting Tyranitar a temporary immunity to status, granting it the ability to best defensive Ninetales and Politoed, and other Pokemon that rely on status. At the cost of a small amount of recovery each turn, Shed Shell can also be used to avoid being trapped by Dugtrio or Wobbuffet, helping Tyranitar win the weather war for the rest of its team.</p>

    <p>Thanks to its massive defenses, Hippowdon doesn't fear anything from this set, aside from the rare Ice Beam. In return, Hippowdon can stall Tyranitar out with Slack Off or force a switch with Earthquake. Fighting-types have always been Tyranitar's bane, and this generation has only added to the myriad of Pokemon that counter Tyranitar reliably. In particular, Tyranitar fears facing Terrakion, Keldeo, Conkeldurr, and Lucario, all of whom carry powerful STAB moves that hit Tyranitar on its weaker Defense stat and possess either a higher Speed stat or enough bulk to stomach at least two of Tyranitar's attacks. While it may be weak to Fire Blast, Breloom is a great Tyranitar counter due to its access to Spore and powerful STAB moves. Many of these Fighting-type Pokemon can be properly handled by Latios, Latias, and Reuniclus, all of which present their own unique advantages and disadvantages. If you want to take a more defensive approach, Amoonguss can be used to check Breloom, Virizion, and Keldeo, and Poison Heal Gliscor can be used to keep tabs on Terrakion, Lucario, and Conkeldurr, provided the latter two do not run Ice Punch. Scizor, with its powerful Bullet Punch and U-turn, is also a massive problem for Tyranitar; Magnezone and Heatran are thus great partners due to their ability to reliably take Scizor down. Garchomp, Terrakion, Landorus, and Stoutland are great offensive partners, as all of them benefit greatly from sandstorm.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Choice Scarf
    move 1: Pursuit
    move 2: Crunch
    move 3: Stone Edge
    move 4: Superpower
    item: Choice Scarf
    nature: Jolly
    ability: Sand Stream
    evs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>This is similar to the quintessential Choice Scarf set that can be seen on many offensively inclined Pokemon, but Tyranitar's Choice Scarf set is special because it can outpace and trap many common, threatening Pokemon, ranging from offensive Psychic-type behemoths such as the Latios to frail weather sweepers such as Sawsbuck and Starmie. However, it fails to outpace Tornadus-T and Alakazam, both of which are capable of OHKOing with Superpower and Focus Blast, respectively, which is this set's largest shortcoming. Pursuit is listed first because this set's primary purpose is to trap and kill off weakened Pokemon. Crunch lets Tyranitar get a harder hit on Jellicent and Reuniclus, Pokemon that can usually tank a Pursuit when they don't switch. Stone Edge is Tyranitar's most powerful STAB move, and gives it the power to revenge kill Flying-type Pokemon and unboosted Volcarona. Superpower is useful for catching opposing Lucario and Terrakion off-guard, providing they don't have a Choice Scarf as well.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>If revenge killing opposing Gliscor and Landorus is something your team desperately needs, then Ice Beam and a Hasty nature can be used. Fire Punch can be used to throw Scizor and non-Choice Scarf Genesect off their hinges, but it doesn't exactly get the best neutral coverage and leaves Tyranitar open to Heatran. Fire Blast can be used with a Hasty nature to hit the aforementioned Pokemon with a stronger attack on the special side, but it has little utility outside of that. Earthquake can be used to get a stronger hit on Jirachi and Metagross, but is a lackluster option otherwise.</p>

    <p>Since this Tyranitar is weaker than its Choice Band counterpart, it is more prone to being walled and forced out by physically bulky Pokemon, such as Hippowdon and Skarmory. As such, powerful partners, such as Choice Band Terrakion or Choice Specs Latios, should be used alongside it. Entry hazards are always appreciated due to the reduced power of this set; in particular, they allow Tyranitar to gain exceptional mileage when utilized on stall teams, who already utilize plenty of hazards and typically employ walls that can defeat the Fighting-types that plague Tyranitar. Alternatively, if a more offensive team style is desired, then Deoxys-D, Terrakion, or Scolipede can be used to guarantee the presence of hazards. Since this Tyranitar is adept at eliminating powerful but frail Ghost-types, Stoutland and Landorus make exceptional partners for it.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>Tyranitar's movepool is especially impressive, offering multiple options for boosting, from Hone Claws to Dragon Dance to Curse, a multitude of attacks, and a few support options. While Dragon Dance used to have a set of its own, the ubiquity of Technician Breloom as well as Tornadus-T, who outspeeds even after a Dragon Dance boost, has made it somewhat irrelevant. A mixed Dragon Dance set can be used to break stall, but it too faces the same problems a purely physical Dragon Dance set faces. TyraniBoah, a relic from the days of RSE OU, still holds some merit for stall-breaking thanks to its power and unpredictability behind a Substitute, but it is ultimately a lesser option due to the sheer force of offense reducing the usage of stall teams. Curse is still out there, but it faces the same problems the Dragon Dance sets face and is more vulnerable to Trick, due to Curse's speed-reducing effects. If you desire recovery outside of Leftovers on Tyranitar, then a Rest + Sleep Talk set can be used, but it is thwarted by faster Taunt users. Roar can be used to phaze out certain targets, but Tyranitar is an inferior phazer when compared to other choices, such as Hippowdon and Skarmory. Among the support moves offered by Tyranitar, Thunder Wave stands out as a fantastic option, since many Pokemon used to check it are fast Pokemon that do not appreciate paralysis, and can be used to support itself and some of its slower teammates.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>Naturally, Fighting-types, which possess resistances to Tyranitar's STAB moves and STAB on moves that affect Tyranitar's largest weakness, are its best counters. Among them, Terrakion and Breloom are best suited to dealing with it, thanks to the former's access to Justified and the latter's powerful Technician-boosted Mach Punch. However, Terrakion must beware of a stray Superpower, and Breloom a Fire Blast or Ice Beam. Keldeo stands as a respectable counter, threatening Tyranitar with a powerful Secret Sword. Conkeldurr can use its own immense bulk and use Tyranitar as set-up fodder or force a KO on it with its powerful moves. While it must watch out for the same moves as Terrakion, Lucario is endowed with a 4x resistance to Tyranitar's STABs and access to Close Combat.</p>

    <p>However, Fighting-types are not the only way to halt a Tyranitar's rampage. While it may not have a resistance to its Dark STAB, Hippowdon's massive physical bulk and access to reliable recovery in the form of Slack Off allows it to stall Tyranitar out ad infinitum. Gliscor, thanks to its massive Defense, Poison Heal, and powerful Earthquake, works well as a Tyranitar counter. While Landorus-T may not have Poison Heal, it does get Intimidate, which allows it to sponge even the strongest of hits from Tyranitar, and a massive base 145 Attack stat, making its Earthquake absurdly powerful. Steel-types also possess a resistance to its STAB moves and the ability to smack one of its weaknesses. Among them, Jirachi and Scizor stand out, with the latter only fearing an unexpected Fire Blast. Skarmory, Ferrothorn, and Forretress work as well, but they all must watch out for Fire Blast, and in the case of Ferrothorn, Superpower.</p>

    <p>It's much easier to check Tyranitar than it is to counter it, thanks to its rather low Speed and horrendous defensive typing. Thanks to its access to Arena Trap, STAB Earthquake, and Reversal, Dugtrio can serve as one of the best Tyranitar checks in existence, unless Tyranitar chooses to run a Shed Shell. While it won't enjoy a powerful Crunch or Superpower, Garchomp can come in and threaten to KO with Earthquake or use it as set-up fodder. Users of Will-O-Wisp, such as Mew and Sableye, can easily render its gigantic Attack stat to naught. Ninetales, despite being weak to Stone Edge, can also send Tyranitar's Attack stat crashing down, with the extra bonus of shifting the weather with Drought. Other opposing weather inducers, Politoed and Abomasnow, are massive pains for Tyranitar to deal with, since they carry super-effective STAB attacks and rob Tyranitar of its Special Defense boost. Thanks to the Superpower tutor, Stoutland and Hydreigon are also good checks; the former can use sandstorm against Tyranitar, while the latter resists Tyranitar's Dark-type STAB and Fire Blast. Mamoswine, while not a newcomer to this list, is now an even better check thanks to Thick Fat, giving it a greater ability to switch in on Tyranitar.</p>
  2. shrang

    shrang I AM CHAMPION CHRISTMAS!!
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    I put this in Nachos' thread, although you may not have seen it. Basically, while pure DD has dropped severely in efficiency, I do want you to go and test this. I know I have, and I can attest to its usefulness:

    [SET]
    name: Mixed Dragon Dance
    move 1: Dragon Dance
    move 2: Crunch
    move 3: Fire Blast
    move 4: Ice Beam
    item: Life Orb
    nature: Hasty
    ability: Sand Stream
    evs: 236 Atk / 20 SpA / 252 Spe

    While this set isn't the best to try and sweep with (too many things stop it), there pretty isn't a physical wall that can stop this thing unless it's called Unaware Quagsire. You don't even need to DD up most of the time to lure in a lot of physical walls with thing, although if the opportunity arises, you can actually sweep. Here are some damage calcs:

    +1 Crunch vs 252/252+ Slowbro: 88.32% - 104.06%
    Ice Beam vs 252/12 Hippowdon: 53.33% - 62.86% (Guaranteed 2HKO)

    I don't think I need to show anything else, really. Gliscor? Ice Beam. Tangrowth? Fire Blast. Skarmory? Same thing. Forretress? Fire Blast. While it's pretty easy to revenge kill with Scizor, it's actually quite easy to bait it out early match pretty easily too. I've OHKOed heaps of Scizors on turn 1 because they think I'm just boring old standard TTar which they can U-turn on, only to be outsped and OHKOed with Fire Blast. The 20 SpA EVs let you OHKO Skarmory with Fire Blast, the rest just go into Attack and Speed. Seriously, give it a shot.

    Also, in terms of the set order, I prefer Choice Band to be first, since I think it's easily Tyranitar's most dangerous set. Nothing likes taking Choice Banded Stone Edge, while Pursuit and Crunch deal with so many Pokemon. Instead of doing about 50% to stuff like fleeing Jolteon and stuff, you are now pretty much leaving them for dead. Also, a small thing, but I believe 100 Speed EVs is Speed creeping. You reach 183 Speed, which I would presume that you're using to outpace Skarmory at 182 Speed, which outspeeds max Speed Wobbuffet. Either drop it down to 96, or just get it so you outspeed no investment base 70s (which is 76 Speed EVs), since you're Choiced and don't care about Encore anyway (although I guess it does let you prevent yourself getting Tickled and weakened first turn).
  3. alexwolf

    alexwolf Fear the D
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    @Shrang

    You don't need any SpA evs to ohko max HP Gliscor with LO Ice Beam.
  4. shrang

    shrang I AM CHAMPION CHRISTMAS!!
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    Yeah, it was Fire Blast on Skarmory, my bad.
  5. Colonel M

    Colonel M I don't suck it's my team that sucks!
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    Scarf should really be over Choice Band in the analysis. It's way too good to pass up on in the current metagame.
  6. Trinitrotoluene

    Trinitrotoluene my cheerier serperior is superior to your inferior rhyperior
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    I'll give that set a run soon. Regarding the EV spread for BandTar, I ripped them from the site because they work well in the current metagame. Also, I can do a re-ordering of the sets.

    ScarfTar is good, but it can't outpace Tornadus-T, which I think is one of its biggest shortcomings. I'll give Scarf another run, but I personally think that BandTar is a better set for the current metagame.
  7. Colonel M

    Colonel M I don't suck it's my team that sucks!
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    While it falls short of outspeeding Tornadus-T, which I admit is a disadvantage, it summons the sandstorm so using Sandslash as a partner is viable. Being able to safely check Latin@s, Gengar, Starmie, and Nasty Plot Thundurus-T is huge.
  8. Electrolyte

    Electrolyte On a short LoA
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    I don't like Aqua Tail on the Banded set. It doesn't really add any coverage and you don't need to hit spinners anyway. Superpower is generally a better move, as it hits (most) steel types harder.
    Also, reorder the sets so it's SR/Scarf/Mixed DD/Banded. The scarf set is better than Banded IMO because of its revenging capability, whereas the banded is more of a late game sweeper that relies heavily on team support.
    In OO combine the options of RestTalk and Dragon Tail. It's a great sp def wall and really hard to get past. It also doesn't give a shit about most spinners. I also don't see how Unnerve has any competitive use for Ttar so you might want to take that out.
  9. Adamant Zoroark

    Adamant Zoroark

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    I just want to say that Aqua Tail hits Gliscor, Donphan, still hits Terrakion hard on the switch, and also hits Mamoswine. I do agree that Superpower is better, but Aqua Tail does have its uses, namely Gliscor (I believe Aqua Tail does more to it than Stone Edge)

    As for the set order, I would say Choice Scarf is the best set. Being outsped by things like Tornadus-T and Alakazam does suck, but I would say it's a better way of checking Latios, Gengar, Starmie, and Nasty Plot Thundurus-T, as Colonel M has already mentioned. However, Choice Band does have its uses, like how shrang mentioned that it's better for checking things like fleeing Jolteon. 100 Speed EVs might be considered Speed creep, so I'd drop the EVs down to 76 to outspeed uninvested base 70s as shrang suggested, and it's a Choice Band set, so CBtar shouldn't care about Wobbuffet encoring it as it will already be locked into one move.

    In OO, I don't think Specs and Unnerve should be mentioned at all. Specs Tyranitar is quite frankly stupid and outdone by just about any other Specs user, and Unnerve I just don't think is viable. Sand Stream and the Special Defense boost from sandstorm are two of Tyranitar's biggest selling points, and Unnerve isn't really useful most of the time. Just my two cents.
  10. Pocket

    Pocket Apo, the astronaut's best friend >:3
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    This is misleading, since Chople Berry allows Tyranitar to survive A LOT of Fighting moves. Focus Blast are easily sponged, even from LO Focus Blast from Thundurus and +1 STAB Focus Blast from Virizion. It can even survive uninvested UnSTAB Superpower from the likes of Hydreigon with plenty of health to spare.

    Lum Berry is worth mentioning imo, helps against defensive Politoed and Ninetales, who are trying to wear down TTar and win the weather war.

    As shrang mentioned, the Speed EVs on CBTar is speed creep. I would go with the Speed suggestion provided by shrang. The former Speed EV can be mentioned in AC, since it is essential for Tyranitar to outrun all sorts of Skarmory.

    Also mention a specially defensive spread for CB Tar in AC.
  11. Trinitrotoluene

    Trinitrotoluene my cheerier serperior is superior to your inferior rhyperior
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    You bring up some good points.

    Aqua Tail allows Tyranitar to land a good hit on Hippowdon, Landorus-T, and Gliscor, but I'll admit that it doesn't add anything important. Maybe an AC mention will suff The Band set is more of an early-game wallbreaker, and the Scarf set is more of a revenge-killing machine. I gave Unnerve a OO mention just because Tyranitar has access to it, but I'll remove it soon.

    You bring up some good points. I'll make some changes to the OP soon.

    Sure. Can do.
  12. Chillarmy

    Chillarmy

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    js, CB Aqua Tail does 50.95 - 60% to Hippowdon, which is a guaranteed 2HKO after SR (without SR, there's a 85.94% chance of AT 2HKOing). Considering that really bulky Ground-types, Landorus-T, Terrakion, etc are a pain to deal with, I see no reason to de-slash Aqua Tail from CB.
  13. alexwolf

    alexwolf Fear the D
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    Why is Band the last set, when it is one of its best sets? And definitely slash Aqua Tail with Superpower.
  14. Trinitrotoluene

    Trinitrotoluene my cheerier serperior is superior to your inferior rhyperior
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    You also have good points. I'll wait for QC to voice their decision on that.

    Arbitrary ordering. I was going to change the set order anyways. Read above regarding Aqua Tail.

    Also, I did some more testing, and this is the set order which I think is best:
    • Choice Band
    • Choice Scarf
    • Stealth Rocker
    • Mixed Dragon Dance

    What do you all have to say about it?
  15. Omicron

    Omicron
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    Why isn't there a regular Dragon Dance set? I've used one in the new BW2 meta, and while it is far from Tyranitar's best set, it still functions decently well as a late-game sweeper once faster Choice Scarfers and priority users such as Breloom and Scizor are removed. Even then, running a Chople / Babiri Berry could work heavily in your favor to catch them off guard.
  16. reyscarface

    reyscarface
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    first of all, dont you dare mention sandslash in the overview.

    for band dont slash aquatail, superpower should always be your move to have, but if your team is exceptionally weak to hippowdon or something then yeah you could use it, but only mention it in the analysis.

    the stealth rocker tyranitar could probably do with being over scarf, its more common, has more utility. tyranitar can get stealth rock up while also killing stuff. fire blast should probably be slashed as it can 2HKO skarmory and beat ferrothorn without the need to rely on superpower. in fact, i think the best coverage moves in that tyranitar are pursuit - fireblast - and THEN one of crunch / superpower / ice beam / whatever you want.

    get rid of that dd set, its utterly terrible. I used it in bw1 and it was awful, and i honestly cannot see how it would be better in bw2 with keldeo and breloom being everywhere. its speed is awful, life orb sucks your health too much for a weak boost in power, your special moves are weak (ice beam wont even 2HKO a special defense hippowdon), your fire blast is piss weak to sweep as well, and you wont be winning any weather wars with that tyranitar.
  17. shrang

    shrang I AM CHAMPION CHRISTMAS!!
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    On the other hand, I've used that Tyranitar in DW OU and BW2, and it definitely holds its own, IMO. I know that it's easily stopped, but it puts huge pressure on slower teams that depend on physical walls to stop it. Ice Beam still 2HKOs Physically Defensive Hippowdon, which is the standard set, so I can't see how that's bad. Fire Blast may appear weak but it still KOs everything you'd want to use it for, like Skarmory, while Ice Beam KOs everything you'd want it to KO as well.
  18. PK Gaming

    PK Gaming Pursuing My True Self
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    So I discussed Tyranitar with Eo on IRC, and we can came to these conclusions:

    The overall set order should be Choice Band / Stealth Rock / Choice Scarfer. The Choice Scarf set can't revenge kill arguably the most important offensive threat in OU, and the introduction of Keldeo is a serious hindrance for it. Overall, it's still usable but it took a massive hit in viability with the introduction of these new threats. The Choice Band and Stealth Rock sets are almost interchangeable, but the Choice Band set won at the end because of its effectiveness in the weather war (can Pursuit Ninetales / Politoed) and it's sheer power in general. (It destroys common checks like Keldeo and Breloom with Superpower)

    Choice Band:

    • Give a greater emphasis on how useful Superpower is. The ability to destroy Keldeo & Breloom switch ins is awesome.
    • Mention that CB Tyranitar is arguably Keldeo's greatest partner (it eliminates most of its checks / counters)
    Remove this since it's speed creep. (76 speed evs already outspeeds min speed Skarmory)

    Dragon Dance:

    I don't really think this is a good set at all. Keldeo just eats it for breakfast, and Breloom / Tornadus-T will always revenge kill it. It's just not very threatning at +1. Sure it can wall break, but it can't sweep offensive Pokemon (It isn't capable of killing Terrakion for example). This is the main downfall of the set. A set up sweeper should be able to take down walls and offensive threats, but Tyranitar can't do the latter which makes it bad in my eyes.
  19. Eo Ut Mortus

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    Scarf:
    - Mention how Tornadus-T as a (*the*) notable threat that ScarfTar fails to outrun.
    - Add to Superpower's description: it hits Terrakion in general, not just CB, in addition to Ferrothorn and Tyranitar

    Stealth Rocker:
    - Fire Blast warrants a slash in the fourth slot, before Stone Edge. The Pokemon it hits are very relevant threats, both to Tyranitar and in general. Stone Edge does hit stuff like the Therian-Formes, but most of what it hits is already damaged by Crunch anyway. It should be relegated to the third slash or to AC.
    - I think the spread should be 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD Careful (Sassy if using Fire Blast / Ice Beam). This set is meant to be switching into special attacks; is there anything that warrants all the Attack EVs and the Adamant nature?
    - Mention Chople Berry as an alternative item. Tyranitar is still generally OHKOed by a +2 FB from Thund-T, but anything less (+2 FB from Lum Thund-T, Superpower/FB from Tornadus-T) fails to OHKO.

    Dragon Dance:
    - Regardless of whether it's purely physical or mixed, it's been relatively ineffective in BW1, and just about every single BW2 change rips it apart (Breloom, Keldeo, hell, even Ditto). Agreeing with PKGaming/rey.
  20. Basti

    Basti

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    Alright, here's a set I've been running for a long time and it's definitely proven its effectiveness.

    Show Hide
    [SET]
    name: Bulkyish Mixed...?
    move 1: Fire Blast
    move 2: Crunch
    move 3: Pursuit
    move 4: Superpower / Roar
    item: Leftovers / Chople Berry
    nature: Adamant
    ability: Sand Stream
    evs: 252 HP / 60 Atk / 120 SpD / 76 Spd


    • Enough bulk to tank hits.
    • Enough speed to outspeed most Scizor (up to 40 Spd).
    • Fire Blast OHKOs 252/0 Scizor 100% of the time.
    • Roar/Crunch combination hard counters Baton Pass teams.
    • Adamant 60 Atk give Ttar 350 Atk to help Crunch/Pursuit hit harder as well as let it hit Terrakion/Heatran harder.
  21. Trinitrotoluene

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    Too many common threats make DDTar nonviable.

    I did some more testing, and yes, Sandslash is terrible as a sweeper. However, I believe it still warrants a mention due to its access to Sand Rush and Rapid Spin, making it a mini-Excadrill of sorts. Other than that, I agree with you on almost every point made.

    I finished my test run of Mixed DDTar, and while I liked its ability to torment stall, I didn't appreciate its inability to deal with offensive threats, even at +1.

    Alright. Can do.

    I mentioned the Chople Berry in the AC of the SR set already. I can get the rest posted up. So, do I OO the Mixed Dragon Dance set?

    I don't really like that set, due to its similarities to the SR set already on the OP, but if others also can attest to its success, then I'll add it.
  22. Basti

    Basti

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    I wouldn't give it its own set, but rather update the spread on the SR set and put Roar and Fire Blast as slashes. Like I said -nature 0 Satk Fire Blast still OHKO's 252/0 Scizor as well as physically defensive Forretress.
  23. PK Gaming

    PK Gaming Pursuing My True Self
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    Yes. For Chople Berry, don't forget to state that it's primarily used for Tornadus-T & Thundurus-T (on top of being used for things like Reuniclus, Hydreigon, etc).

    BTW, the SR set should look like this:

    name: Stealth Rocker
    move 1: Stealth Rock
    move 2: Pursuit
    move 3: Crunch
    move 4: Fire Blast / Superpower / Stone Edge
    (with Ice Beam in AC.)

    That was set that Eo envisioned.
  24. Trinitrotoluene

    Trinitrotoluene my cheerier serperior is superior to your inferior rhyperior
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    Thank you! I'll edit it accordingly.
  25. PK Gaming

    PK Gaming Pursuing My True Self
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    Awesome

    QC APPROVED (1/3)

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