1. New to the forums? Check out our Mentorship Program!
    Our mentors will answer your questions and help you become a part of the community!
  2. Welcome to Smogon Forums! Please take a minute to read the rules.

Ugly Trees Are Dancing With Swords (OU Team)

Discussion in 'Past Gen Teams' started by OMGTFBBQQ, Aug 29, 2010.

  1. OMGTFBBQQ

    OMGTFBBQQ

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2010
    Messages:
    62
  2. JSND

    JSND

    Joined:
    Jun 28, 2010
    Messages:
    951
    skarmbliss is ripped by Gyaradps too so try to explode with fore on gyara
    and conserve fore better good thing you have startom but Ttar is one of gyara's partner in crime.
    then there is BOAH you must never forget that BOAH kill all your team with no starmie
  3. Azlanslayer

    Azlanslayer

    Joined:
    Jul 9, 2010
    Messages:
    259
    O.o, your font's are messed up, did you use Microsoft word? you better preview it first..

    Anyways, this team is Taunt Weak, which Gliscor can taunt,Heatran,Gyarados.. Which when Starmie dies, its GG.. To prevent that, use Defensive rotom > your Rotom it helps countering Gyarados when Starmie is down, just to have a back-up.

    I don't see why Blissey is there for, to make a the SkarmBliss Combo? You are better of with Vaporeon, which helps to counter your Infernape weakness, as well as Heatran. Vaporeon passes Wishes too :D. With resist to fire, it helps Starmie so Starmie won't be switching it that much, taking 46% - 50% from heatran's Fire Blast

    Yeah, solid team, just watch out for gyarados..Stallbreakers

    Good Luck!
  4. OMGTFBBQQ

    OMGTFBBQQ

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2010
    Messages:
    62
    yeah.. sorry about that i used Microsoft Word and it messed up... but i fixed it :D

    Thanks for the rate. I reckon with TS on the field and Skarmory with Whirlwind or Blissey with Protect/Wish can do pretty well against it.

    I'll definately use Defensive Rotom since i don't really like my current Rotom. I'm not to sure about changing Blissey to Vaporeon. It does benefit Starmie but Blissey lures out Fighting types which then allows me to bring in Rotom.
  5. Zinocide

    Zinocide

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2010
    Messages:
    33
    This maybe true, but Scarfed Ttar is very common these days, so Rotom will come in a go right back out (most likley taking a pursuit on it's way out) I agree with Azlanslayer. Vaporeon is a much better option over Bliss.

    Also, I just don't really know about Forry in the lead position. Simply because of all the taunt/trick leads that are very abundant in OU. I think Roserade, or Froslass would serve as a better lead in the long run.
  6. OMGTFBBQQ

    OMGTFBBQQ

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2010
    Messages:
    62
    I'll try out Vaporeon over Blissey and see how that goes. As for Taunters i'm trying to find a good move over gyro ball. usually the taunters are the pixie brothers and aerodactyl. Got any suggestions for a good move to cover them?

    I;m not to worried about Trick leads. Switch to blissey aftetr setting 2 layers of TS and then Wish then 3 spikes :)
  7. Zinocide

    Zinocide

    Joined:
    Jun 12, 2010
    Messages:
    33
    Payback is always a decent choice on Forry
  8. OMGTFBBQQ

    OMGTFBBQQ

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2010
    Messages:
    62
  9. DarkShadow

    DarkShadow

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2010
    Messages:
    15
    Firstly, when I saw the title I thought of Sudowoodo ._.


    I'm too lazy to rate, but I have noticed a lot of errors in your replys:


    Firstly, learn to spell. At the moment it is hard to understand what you are saying. Slso, Skarmory beats Gyarados unless Gyarados is the last pokemon, and even then, Brave Bird does shitloads to it. Skarmory takes Tyranitar not Boah, and even then. 65.9% - 78.1% is Flamethrower, and Fire Blast does 99% max to standard Skarmory. This means without being weakened, chances are he can phaze it with Skarmory. also Starmie dies to Tyranitar, Surf is never a KO and Tyranitar always kills it with crunch.

    Aerodactyl Gliscor Azelf Gyarados and OCCASIONALLY Heatran and Skarmory. They are the main taunters. Aerodactyl and Azelf only use taunt as lead, so that isn't a problem. Gliscor Gyarados Heatran and Skarmory... Skarmory is countered by THREE things in your team, Heatran is countered by Bliss if Heatran doesn't know taunt, if he does then Starmie. Gyarados is pwned by Skarmory and maybe Starmie, and Gliscor is beaten by Starmie and Rotom.

    Also, I am not going to say this again, VAPOREON IS NOT A INFERNAPE COUNTER. PHYSICAL MIXAPE 2HKOS IT MEANING IT CANNOT SWITCH IN

    Scarftar is pwned by Skarmory. Nuff sed. I already explained this in the first quote.

    And yes, use Payback on forry.
  10. OMGTFBBQQ

    OMGTFBBQQ

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2010
    Messages:
    62

    THANK YOU!
    Finally someone who understnads. I've faced numerous Gyarados' and many rarely are even able to dent Skarmory with Waterfall, even after a couple of DD's. They DD, i roost, they DD i whirlwind.

    For leads i already knew the only leads giving me trouble are Leadape and Taunters. I don't even know why people are mentioning Gliscor. And yes i'm using Payback on Forry and it's working wonders!

    I honestly don't understand why everyone says Vaporeon is a good Mixape counter. Infernapes tend to carry Grass Knot nowadays and tahts the end of Vappy. At least with Blissey i can Protect when i sense a Clse Combat coming and then switch to Rotom. Plus Blissey has Natural Cure which is a godsend against opponents trying to status me, my only other status absorber being Starmie which is far to frail to come in time after timejust to take status moves.
  11. SmileZ

    SmileZ

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2010
    Messages:
    107
    Grass Knot isn't touching Vappy -

    Specially based MixApes Grass Knot Vs. Standard Wish support Vappy - 34.4% - 40.6%

    Vappy can revenge Infernape if needs be. It's Close Combat you're watching out for really.

    Nice Team, I'll try and help out properly later.

    EDIT: Do you really need Toxic on Bliss? You seem confident about getting those spikes down so it's a case of: would you rather have a chance against Sub Pain Split Gengar by switch Toxic for an elimental move or have "complete" toxic coverage?
  12. OMGTFBBQQ

    OMGTFBBQQ

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2010
    Messages:
    62
    okay point taken :)

    toxic is mainly for flying types immune to TS which would either wise sweep my team. e.g. DD dragonite. it's also a backup incase a shock fire type move pops out of no where and decimates my forry
  13. FalknerLevel7Pidgey

    FalknerLevel7Pidgey

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2010
    Messages:
    25
    Skarmory isn't weak to ice. Machamp will not use Ice Punch (neutral damage) versus Skarmory when it can just hit you with STAB HIGHER BP Dynamic Punch (neutral damage) with a chance of confusing you.

    Oh, and Skarmory can easily shrug off HP Ices from Roserade.

    Just thought I'd throw that out there.
  14. Smith

    Smith is a 90's bitch
    is a Team Rater Alumnus

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2009
    Messages:
    1,341
    Hey I got your message. To everyone that wants to add Vaporeon, okay, this is not a good idea. Some of you recognize that, but for all the wrong reasons. Firstly, Blissey is a stall classic, she just belongs on all heavy stall teams. If you want to stop Infernape, there are other methods beyond just saying "oh weak to ape vaporeon stops it suggest".

    First and foremost, Skarmory + Forry is very, very redundant. They share all the same counters and set up on the same things. Forry is more important to the team strategy, so I'm thinking you should keep him and replace Skarmory. One important thing to remember when using Cradily is that he really, really appreciates sandstorm. I think a Hippowdon would work super in Skarmory's slot, as he can still set up SR and provide more residual damage. He also counter most Tyranitars.

    If you're feeling weak to Machamp, try running a rest talk set with reflect over your current one. He's probably the best Machamp counter available and works great for this team. Please do NOT consider Dusknoir, he is a bad Pokemon in general in my opinion.

    I really dislike your Starmie set, because you run Psychic it is very frail and prone to dying early. Now that you don't need to run Psychic anymore (because you have a better Machamp counter), why not run Leftovers, Recover and Rapid spin over Psychic and Ice Beam? This will keep him more durable and help the team loads more.

    That's all I got, hope this helps.
  15. Faladran

    Faladran
    is a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnus

    Joined:
    Dec 31, 2009
    Messages:
    1,139
    Hello,

    This seems to be a fairly solid stall based team. However, one thing I'd like to point out is that it is very vulnerable to common stallbreakers. The biggest threat to your team is the standard SD Lucario, who doesn't find much trouble setting up, and can 6-0 your team without much trouble.

    I think Smith's suggestions are good and worthy of your consideration. Hippowdon's sandstorm will work great with Cradily, and it's bulky enough to take a +2 Close Combat from Lucario and Earthquake back, which should patch up your weaknesses somewhat. If you do decide to use Hippowdon, trying it out in the lead position is an option as well.

    I'm quite sure Smith was mentioning Rotom here. This is a good suggestion also, since Payback from Machamp will only deal 29.6% - 34.9% after Reflect is used. This will fix your Machamp problems, so Psychic will probably not be needed nearly as much on Starmie. If opposing entry hazards, in particular Toxic Spikes, become a problem, try out Rapid Spin in Starmie's last moveslot. Otherwise, Recover makes a good choice.

    Good luck with your team!
  16. Aqueos

    Aqueos

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2010
    Messages:
    747
    Machamp will probably dynamic punch skarmory because it will do more than ice punch to it.
  17. Psychotic..

    Psychotic..

    Joined:
    Oct 18, 2009
    Messages:
    45
    Hi, At first glance this seems like a fairly solid team and most issues have been dealt with but i have a few tips you may want to try out.

    First of all having Forretress and Skarmory on the same team is awfully redundant. I recommended using Lead Hippo in replace of Skarmory. Hippo gets up sandstorm which helps Cradily thanks to the rock type Sp.Def boost. If you do decide to run Hippo you can use Curse on Cradily so you don't have to run both Stockpile and SD and open up a move-slot for something else.

    This might just be preference but you can try using Thunderwave>Toxic on Blissey.

    Finally true using Grass Knot>Psychic on Starmie. Yes Psychic gets stab but Grass Knot can also help with Pokemon like Swampert who Isn't a large problem but can be a nuisance with Roar.

    Good luck with the team
  18. OMGTFBBQQ

    OMGTFBBQQ

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2010
    Messages:
    62
    thanks for all the rates guys. I'm not going to change Blissey to Vaporeon ever so everyone can stop suggesting that.

    If i run a hippowdon i won't put it in lead position because it really does hurt Starmie to come into SS and SR. If i run Hippowdon would it be wise to put in an ecasive SD Cacturne with Sucker Punch/Sub/Seed Bomb? Hippowdon instead of Skarmory does make me question the numerous weaknesses Hippowdon does have. But i guess TS + Spikes + SR + SS won't give the opponent much time to do anything, let alone switching in numerous times.

    I'll try Resttalk Rotom since this Rotom set still isn't really working for me. If I were to replace it what would you suggest? I mean a bulkier Rotom? I might aswell just get a bulkky Ghost and then invest in Attack.

    I'm still concerned about Starmie's set.
    If I run a LO set it will probably be:
    -Surf
    -Thunderbolt
    -Icebeam
    -Recover

    Lefties set:
    -Surf
    -Tbolt
    -Ice Beam
    -Psychic

    I know you dont recommend me using Psychic but honestly Swampert can only Roar me out. A big Surf should do more than enough damage for whatever is switched in to KO. Feild hazards just aren't really a worry for me bar TS. But i find TS to be rare in the current metagame.
  19. Azlanslayer

    Azlanslayer

    Joined:
    Jul 9, 2010
    Messages:
    259
    I know vaporeon is not a counter -.-, Anyways, you asked me to RATE Again, so here i'm.

    Solid team, Gratz for that. Like i said, you have a massive Heatran weakness, possiblity to 3HKO - 2HKO every member of your team except Blissey, even Starmie takes alot from Fire Blast. I Would recommend you using Suicune, but it doesn't seem to fit in this team.

    Having Skarmory is abit redundant, you can use Swampert > Skarmory to give more Fire resist, the only thing that Swampert lacks is Recovery, he going down fast anyway. Swamperet counters Tyranitar pretty well too.

    Forrestress, i think Spikes + Toxic Spikes Roserade is much more better because of speed, and its STAB Leaf Storm, which makes it faster to set-up Spikes and stuff. Its your choice, with lesser Weakness of course. The only thing it lack is Explosion. Sleep powder is illegal with spikes. Replacing it is not needed, just my suggestions

    Good Luck!
  20. DarkShadow

    DarkShadow

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2010
    Messages:
    15
    I like how nobody notices Infernape.

    60% - 70.7% Physical Mixape Overheat vs Standard Hippowdon lead
    35.7% - 42.1% Physical Mixape Close Combat vs Standard Hippowdon lead
    WITH STEALTH ROCK OR SLIGHTLY WEAKENED, HIPPOWDON CANNOT SWITCH IN TO PHYSIMIXAPE

    ITS OVER 9000 Physical Mixape Overheat vs Forretress WHAT 9000

    LOLFORRETRESS

    ITS OVER 9000 Physical Mixape Close Combat vs Blissey WHAT 9000

    LOLBLISSEY

    67.1% - 79.3% Physical Mixape Overheat to your Rotom-S

    33.6% - 39.8% Physical Mixape Overheat to your Rotom-S

    IT CANNOT SWITCHIN AFTER BEING WEAKENED AND IF STARMIE IS GONE OR NOT REVEALED THEY CAN EASILY PREDICT THE SWITCH-IN

    96.3% - 113.8% Physical Mixape Close Combat to Cradily

    lol

    Starmie is your only counter, and even then.......

    74.3% - 88.1% Physical Mixape U-Turn vs Life Orb Starmie

    The bulkier version is still 2HKOd so a person with even DECENT prediction will pwn you, especially u-turn teams.
  21. OMGTFBBQQ

    OMGTFBBQQ

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2010
    Messages:
    62
    you might want to read everything i wrote before going on a rant.I already noticed infernape as a threat and listed in under "MAJOR THREATS".Honestly i outlined everything you stated...
  22. Azlanslayer

    Azlanslayer

    Joined:
    Jul 9, 2010
    Messages:
    259
    O.o, i realised that, that is why i recommended Vaporeon or Swampert if it lacks Grass Knot, Which Infernape uses U-Turn? As far as i know, only ScarfApes uses it.
  23. McNUTTY

    McNUTTY

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2009
    Messages:
    119
    Personally i think this team will look much better as a pure staller imo as you have most of the components for an effective Stall team, it just needs some rearranging... Take Out Forretress swap in a Hippodwon, as the lead this starts off SS which will help Cradily significantly. Now that you don't have Spikes or Toxic Spikes you need to change somethings up change SR on Skarmory to Spikes. Now the best Infernape Counter which rips most stall teams apart is with out a doubt Tentacruel. He will be your new Toxic Spiker and Infernape Counter, swap him in for Starmie. Now it is a Stall team, most people hate playing stall so i totally think its fine if you take none of my suggestions =) GL with the team.
  24. STEELDRAGON

    STEELDRAGON

    Joined:
    Aug 9, 2007
    Messages:
    453
    Interesting team. It has serious problems though. Magnezone have put a hurt on your team, easily dispatching Fortress, and Skarmory, and walling Cradily. I don't really see what Skarmory is doing except being a phazer and setting up Stealth Rock. I would recommend Swampert or Gliscor to set up Stealth rock. You really need a sandstreamer because it will boost cradily's Sp. defense and add to the residual damage. With cradily's offensive move, it should almost never be Seed bomb. Grass has quite bad coverage. I would recommend Earthquake or Rockslide instead. Concerning Blissey, Wish+Healbell is legal. I would also put rapid spin on Starmie.

    good luck!
  25. Dezza Laa

    Dezza Laa

    Joined:
    Jun 4, 2010
    Messages:
    264
    hi nice team,

    I'm a bit skeptical about your defensive TTar. It may have the same stats defensively as hippowdon and a much better offensive and speed stat but as you said the clear problem is the lack of recovery. That being said, it might get the surprise factor of those not expecting a defensive TTar but other than that i don't see it's use on this otherwise great team.

Users Viewing Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 0)