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All Gens Underrated Sets

Discussion in 'Ruins of Alph' started by BKC, Dec 21, 2015.

  1. Jirachee

    Jirachee who dares wins
    is a Tournament Directoris a Super Moderatoris a Tutor Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnus
    Head TD

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    2 things: first, Heracross hasn't got enough speed even after a Salac boost to outspeed the common scarfers. You can stop say, a scarf Rachi trying to flinch you down or a scarf Ape trying a late game clean with Custap. Second, pure surprise factor can help you grab an early kill against an oblivious opponent because it activates just before it's used. Lasting more than one turn isn't really useful with sand and the fact your opponent probably has a faster scarfer or a priority user anyway
  2. Smurf.

    Smurf.
    is a Past SPL Champion

    Joined:
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    [​IMG]
    Zapdos @ Choice Band
    Ability: Pressure
    EVs: 240 Atk / 116 SpA / 152 Spe
    Lonely Nature
    - Thunderbolt
    - Drill Peck
    - Hidden Power [Fighting]
    - Baton Pass

    Hate leading zap and seeing opposing lead CB Tar? Not anymore. This guy can put you in an immediate 6-5 position! CB zapper has great surprise value, and it is lethal with spikes support. I like cloyster personally, since you can come in for free on perts and lax. Then later in the game you reveal your cheeky phys attacks and this can prove absolutely backbreaking for the likes of Celebi / Regice / Lax / Bliss. A good partner in crime for him is Modest Gengar, who takes advantage of hazards + zapper's wallbreaking prowess.

    http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen3ou-203145


    [​IMG]
    Heracross (M) @ Leftovers
    Ability: Guts
    EVs: 252 HP / 20 Atk / 164 SpD / 72 Spe
    Adamant Nature
    - Megahorn
    - Focus Punch
    - Rest
    - Sleep Talk

    The BKC destroyer, and arch enemy of fat teams. This hera comes in for free on the lamest mon in ADV, swampert, and from there you can throw out attacks with impunity. With restalk + guts + the enormous bulk on this set, you can also comfortably stay in on Gengars who think they are safe (although pairing with a pursuit user can make life less dependent on sleep rolls which is always nice). While asleep, its a 50% chance to select pseudo-CB-megahorn which is cool. This set is a great teammate if you want to remove Starmie or Celebi for your other offensive dudes, as it comfortably eats psychic attacks. It will also lure out opposing dugtrios for the counter-trap. Salamence can make life annoying for this set but it can be easily lured out and dealt with by other teammates (I recommend: hp ice celebi)

    http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen3ou-192769
    http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen3ou-198814
    http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen3ou-194782
    Last edited: Oct 15, 2016
  3. UD

    UD

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2016
    Messages:
    77
    I like that CB Zapdos a lot. It's really annoying when Celebi/Venusaur (had to) wall even HP Ice variants, but that Drill Peck will smack them super hard. Does the HP Fight OHKO bulky Tar or just CB version? Regardless, very cool set.

    I love the innovation of the RestTalk Hera with Focus Punch. I didn't even know STalk can't select FP, but that's a really cool tech. "Arch enemy of fat teams" gave me a good laugh. Will definitely have to try that set out!
    Kingler12345 likes this.
  4. Bughouse

    Bughouse Like ships in the night, you're passing me by
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a CAP Contributor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

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    lol I've been using

    Heracross (M) @ Leftovers
    Ability: Guts
    EVs: 252 HP / 16 Atk / 168 SpD / 72 Spe
    Adamant Nature
    - Megahorn
    - Focus Punch
    - Rest
    - Sleep Talk

    for ages, and I'm sure I got it from somewhere (presumably Husk, given Conflict's post)

    Soooooo what does the 4 EV shift do :p
  5. Smurf.

    Smurf.
    is a Past SPL Champion

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    I have my own preferred Ev's but I rather keep that spread to myself. Those posted are the ones that m dragon shared.

    The real UD realistically it's a Ohko on lead cb tar unless its max hp, which is a roll. With one layer of spikes down you kill even the bulkiest tar.

    Might post some more neat stuff later for adv lovers.
    Last edited: Oct 15, 2016
    Astamatitos, UD and Luigi like this.
  6. Drangonn.

    Drangonn.

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2015
    Messages:
    689
    enough posts have been made to justify not editing earlier post

    ive got some more things

    sceptile.gif
    Sceptile @ Miracle Seed/Leftovers/Black Belt (customizable)
    Ability: Overgrow
    EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    Rash/Naive Nature
    - Leaf Blade
    - Dragon Claw
    - Hidden Power Fire
    - Focus Punch

    This set is actually not bad. I was theorymonning and getting nowhere, so I just went to the BL list and theres a shitton you can do with those mons. This Sceptile variant actually is really cool when paired with spikes, which wears down the likes of Celebi and Blissey for HP Fire and Focus Punch respectively. Dragon Claw lets you 2hko mence without wasting time on hp ice, which allows hp fire for skarm and forre. you could probably run rock slide if you really want but it wont actually do much because of you easy it is to lure stuff like zapper and get a bit of chip on skarm/meta for HP Fire. Pair with fp/boom gar and/or mixmence for best results.


    This next set also goes quite nicely with it, but can function on its own as a trapper.

    houndoom.gif
    Houndoom @ Leftovers
    Ability: Early Bird
    EVs: 252 SpA / 32 SpD / 224 Spe
    Timid Nature
    - Fire Blast
    - Pursuit
    - Will-O-Wisp
    - Taunt

    I don't know if this is standard but w/e. Taunt+Wisp Houndoom is really nice to chip stuff like Lax and Bliss that want to come in and eat crunches and blasts and heal them off later. Just wisp, get another oppurtunity to come in, and taunt. Also superb with spikes support to wear down Blissey. EVs outrun 176 timid celebi. Another added benefit is hitting Celebi that try to BP out with taunt and bopping them with pursuit to make their life of wearing down your TECH Sceptile set a lot harder. This set is legit. 32 spdef lets you tank 186 tbolts and stuff like that better.

    replay vs dice showcasing both sets:
    http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen3ou-463975634
  7. Smurf.

    Smurf.
    is a Past SPL Champion

    Joined:
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    random noob on showdown tried to give me lip, and also said CB zap was bad.... so i decided to bust out the real innovation:

    BW King
    [​IMG]
    Metapod @ Focus Sash
    Ability: Shed Skin
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD
    Quiet Nature
    - Bug Bite
    - Iron Defense
    - String Shot
    - Electroweb

    http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen5ou-464715312

    enjoy!

    P.S. if someone knows who this dude's real identity is name and shame him.
  8. Enigami

    Enigami

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2014
    Messages:
    174
    [​IMG]
    Rhydon
    - Earthquake
    - Rock Slide
    - Hyper Beam / Body Slam
    - Leer / Tail Whip

    Old school innovation time! This is a neat alternative way to use Rhydon in RBY that I discovered. Leer has two major benefits: softening Reflect users and increasing its ability to take on Exeggutor.

    It is very likely to beat a healthy Raish Chansey (SToss / Reflect / TWave / Softboiled) already behind Reflect, because SToss takes 5 turns to KO Rhydon, and Rhydon only needs 4 to KO first (Leer > Leer > EQ > EQ KOs). After one Defense drop, Rhydon, Tauros and Snorlax all have the means to 2HKO Reflect Alakazam (2x EQ for Rhydon, Body Slam + Hyper Beam for Tauros and Snorlax). It also helps against Reflect Snorlax, which is 4HKO'd and 3HKO'd by EQ after 1 and 2 Defense drops respectively, so it gives Rhydon the chance to break through if played well (when it uses Rest is a good time for dropping Defense). Even if the opponent switches out, they lose Reflect anyway which can be big depending on the situation you're in.

    If the opponent has already put something to sleep, and Exeggutor doesn't have Mega Drain, Rhydon can turn the tables on Exeggutor and beat it because Rock Slide + Hyper Beam has a very high chance to KO a -1 Exeggutor. If a healthy Exeggutor switches into Leer, Exeggutor is dependent on getting lucky with Rhydon missing or getting low rolls, or Psychic getting a critical hit or Special drop or 2 near max rolls. If Exeggutor is paralyzed, Rhydon doesn't even need a free Leer on a switch, and with the chance of FP it pushes the odds well into Rhydon's favor.

    Leer also has the side effect of reapplying the Speed drop of paralysis at the same time their Defense is reduced (thanks funky Cartridge mechanics), which gives a paralyzed Rhydon the ability to gain the speed advantage against a paralyzed opponent while also increasing the power of Rhydon's next attacks.

    Body Slam can be used over Hyper Beam, trading the ability to greatly threaten Exeggutor for the paralysis chance. Rhydon also gets Tail Whip which is identical to Leer so you can use whichever of those two you prefer.

    Damage Calcs (open)

    Rhydon hits Exeggutor with Rock Slide x2 + Hyper Beam:
    Rhydon Rock Slide vs. Exeggutor: 108-127 (27.4 - 32.3%)
    Rhydon Rock Slide vs. Exeggutor: 108-127 (27.4 - 32.3%)
    Rhydon Hyper Beam vs. Exeggutor: 143-169 (36.3 - 43%)
    Rhydon Combined Damage vs. Exeggutor: 359-423 (91.1 - 107.6%) -- approximately 45% chance to KO

    Rhydon drops Exeggutor's Defense and uses Rock Slide + Hyper Beam:
    Rhydon Leer vs. Exeggutor: Defense drops one stage
    Rhydon Rock Slide vs. -1 Exeggutor: 164-193 (41.7 - 49.1%)
    Rhydon Hyper Beam vs. -1 Exeggutor: 217-256 (55.2 - 65.1%)
    Rhydon Combined Damage vs. -1 Exeggutor: 381-449 (96.9 - 114.2%) -- approximately 80% chance to KO

    Rhydon drops Reflect Chansey's Defense twice and uses Earthquake:
    Rhydon Earthquake vs. -2 Chansey through Reflect: 354-417 (50.3 - 59.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

    Rhydon drops Reflect Alakazam's Defense and uses Earthquake:
    Rhydon Earthquake vs. -1 Alakazam through Reflect: 155-183 (49.5 - 58.4%) -- 99.5% chance to 2HKO

    Tauros comes in after Rhydon drops Reflect Alakazam's Defense and uses Body Slam + Hyper Beam:
    Tauros Body Slam vs. -1 Alakazam through Reflect: 110-130 (35.1 - 41.5%)
    Tauros Hyper Beam vs. -1 Alakazam through Reflect: 194-228 (61.9 - 72.8%)
    Tauros Combined Damage vs. -1 Alakazam through Reflect: 304-358 (97.1 - 114.3%) -- approximately 85% chance to KO

    Snorlax comes in after Rhydon drops Reflect Alakazam's Defense and uses Body Slam + Hyper Beam:
    Snorlax Body Slam vs. -1 Alakazam through Reflect: 117-138 (37.3 - 44%)
    Snorlax Hyper Beam vs. -1 Alakazam through Reflect: 206-243 (65.8 - 77.6%)
    Snorlax Combined Damage vs. -1 Alakazam through Reflect: 323-381 (97.1 - 114.3%) -- guaranteed KO

    Rhydon drops Reflect Snorlax's Defense and uses Earthquake:
    Rhydon Earthquake vs. -1 Snorlax through Reflect: 127-150 (24.2 - 28.6%) -- 99.2% chance to 4HKO
    Rhydon Earthquake vs. -2 Snorlax through Reflect: 169-199 (32.3 - 38%) -- 97.1% chance to 3HKO


    If you're looking for some other fun ways to use RBY Rhydon, you can also try Blizzard. Its damage output is lower than Rock Slide and Earthquake against everything but Dragonite, but it makes for a decent attack against Zapdos as long as you haven't frozen anything yet. If Zapdos stays in, it's still taking damage (4HKO, can mix in a Rock Slide to reduce that to 3HKO), but at the same time it also covers all switch-ins pretty well. Ice-types are unlikely to switch in due to the very likely Rock Slide, Exeggutor takes almost as much damage from Blizzard as it does from Rock Slide, Ground-types expecting Rock Slide or Body Slam take a lot of damage and are usually within KO range afterwards, and everything besides the Ice-types have about a 9% chance to be frozen. It also gives Rhydon a chance for a miracle freeze against Slowbro and AmnesiaLax.
    Last edited: Oct 29, 2016
  9. no longer here

    no longer here

    Joined:
    Apr 11, 2012
    Messages:
    342
    I' m sorry but i'm bad in explaining sets :heart:

    ADV OU



    [​IMG]
    Alakazam @ Leftovers
    Ability: Synchronize
    EVs: 144 HP / 252 Def / 112 Spe
    Timid Nature
    - Counter
    - Encore
    - Psychic
    - Recover

    Able to stop setuppers with encore, it takes literally everything (unless cbmetagross explosion), in combo with dugtrio it would be amazing to help ursaring/snorlax/miltank/cmbliss doin' their work. Enough bulky to use Counter, enough fast to use Recover. 334 Speed to outspeed standard Gengar!

    ------------------------

    [​IMG]
    Ninetales (M) @ Salac Berry
    Ability: Flash Fire
    EVs: 192 HP / 96 SpA / 220 Spe
    Timid Nature
    - Fire Blast
    - Grudge
    - Hidden Power [Grass]
    - Substitute

    Don't know what to say, it works, that's all!

    -------------------------

    [​IMG]
    Snorlax (M) @ Leftovers
    Ability: Immunity
    EVs: 80 HP / 88 Atk / 140 Def / 200 SpD
    Adamant Nature
    - Curse
    - Protect
    - Body Slam
    - Shadow Ball

    Protect let you scout the cbmove, the explosion and eventually is a leftovers free every turn.
    mulgokizary, Oxypad, danilo and 3 others like this.
  10. Yoshizilla315

    Yoshizilla315

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    Apr 30, 2016
    Messages:
    401
    Probably one of my favorite underrated sets has to be CM Cosmic Power Clefable. It's bad in a meta with excessive
    crits, but can be funny to use if you use it correctly and get lucky.


    The Set

    Clefable @ Leftovers
    Ability: Magic Guard
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD
    Calm Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Calm Mind
    - Cosmic Power
    - Stored Power
    - Soft-Boiled

    I've also found that SPEXNITE (Choice Specs Dragonite) can be hilariously good if used correctly as well.

    The Set

    Dragonite @ Choice Specs
    Ability: Multiscale
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
    Modest Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Draco Meteor
    - Fire Blast
    - Ice Beam
    - Hurricane

    Speaking of Choice Specs, SPEXCADRILL is a set made by someone a while back (Forgot the name), that I've found can put in work. While it's origins were in ORAS, I believe it can put in work in other past gens as well.

    The Set

    Excadrill @ Choice Specs
    Ability: Mold Breaker
    EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpD
    Modest Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Earth Power
    - Focus Blast
    - Sludge Bomb
    - Hidden Power [Ice]
    Last edited: Dec 24, 2016
  11. NightFox

    NightFox

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2011
    Messages:
    543
    Let's revive this thread with two unusual yet cool dpp sets:

    [​IMG]
    Offensive Lead Raikou

    Raikou @ Lum Berry
    Ability: Pressure
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    Rash Nature
    - Thunderbolt
    - Hidden Power [Ice]
    - Aura Sphere/Shadow Ball
    - Extreme Speed

    This guy has a lot of favorable lead matchups like vs Roserade/Smeargle who can't put him to sleep thanks to Lum Berry and gets 2HKOed back, vs suicide leads like Aerodactyl (Earthquake fails to KO) and sash Azelf thanks to Extremespeed and vs other kind of troublesome leads like Starmie, Machamp, Jirachi, Empoleon, non LO Heatran and those pesky Zapdos while Metagross must choose between set up rocks or kill Raikou. It can even lure Tyranitar dealing heavy damage to any variant with Aura Sphere something that some special sweepers like Choice Scarf Heatran aprecciate.
    This set its so rare that it will often get some surprise kills but is almost helpless against Swampert and Hippodown so grass types like Breloom or Celebi are good teammates.

    [​IMG]
    Choice Scarf Lucario

    Lucario @ Choice Scarf
    Ability: Inner Focus
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
    Jolly Nature
    - Close Combat
    - Ice Punch
    - Thunder Punch
    - Crunch

    I found this set when i was looking for a physical revenge killer steel type other that Jirachi. With a Choice Scarf Luke can revenge kill some mons that Jirachi can't, like Raikou, Offensive Suicune, DD Kingdra, Choice Scarf Heatran and Infernape (Without praying Cyberodin, Carloo or Posho for flinch them to death). Among other mons that ScarfLuke can revenge kill are Rotom scarf, Gengar, Gyarados DD, Dragonite DD, Starmie, weakened Scizor SD and even himself. Unboosted Close Combat still packs great power and can even sweep with rocks and Pursuit support. And believe me, this set its so rare that things like Infernape, Scarf Heatran, non scarf Flygon, Gengar, Gyarados and Dragonite WILL stay in only to get KOed with the respective move.
    Posho, Slurmz, sugarhigh and 14 others like this.
  12. Deluks917

    Deluks917 Ride on Shooting Star

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2012
    Messages:
    436
    Modest Magneton tbolt only kills max special defense Skarm about 19% of the time. So even if you get get magneton in while they spike Skarmoy gets two layers down about 75% of the time (you can ohko skarm or get a crit or get a para+full-para). If your team is spikes weak this can be a serious problem. I see two ways to fix this problem. One option is using thunder which gives you a 70% chance of ohkoing skarm. The other option is to use Magnet Magneton. With Magnet you are 75% to ohko plus crits. I would only advocate runnning these sets if your team is spikes weak and can't spin.

    Sets:

    Magneton @ Leftovers
    Ability: Magnet Pull
    EVs: 136 HP / 252 SpA / 120 Spe
    Modest Nature
    IVs: 2 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 Spe
    - Thunder
    - Hidden Power [Fire]
    - Toxic
    - Protect

    Magneton @ Magnet
    Ability: Magnet Pull
    EVs: 56 HP / 252 SpA / 200 Spe
    Modest Nature
    IVs: 2 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 Spe
    - Thunderbolt
    - Hidden Power [Fire]
    - Toxic
    - Metal Sound / Thunder Wave
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2017
    dice, UD, Crestfall and 7 others like this.
  13. Oxypad

    Oxypad

    Joined:
    Dec 6, 2007
    Messages:
    90
    Gen3OU / ADV - I like Charizard, it's pretty well-rounded and can impart a lot of niches/techs to a team.
    It's really meant to be offensive but has some defensive use too, due to its rather unique typing and not being susceptible to Spikes or Dugtrio trapping. I think it would help a team keep or gain momentum when used right. This could be part of a high win% team for sure, right here!

    Here is a set:

    Charizard @ Leftovers
    Ability: Blaze
    EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    (IVs: 30 Attack, 30 Defense, all the rest 31)

    (Hasty Nature, +Speed - Defense)
    - Fire Blast
    - Toxic
    - Hidden Power [Ice]
    - Focus Punch


    STAB Fire Blast is the main attack, explaining the 252 EVs there...and it's totally underrated...just think about all the pokes that run Fire Blast (Salamence, Tyranitar, Flygon, Snorlax) and Skarm users still stay in cuz pffft non-STAB...and then Protect lefties the next turn... makes me cry. Plus 10% burn chance is always there on the resists like Cune/Swamp/Starmie.

    Toxic...a great status move. Something on your team should have it. It works well here since you can poison switch-ins once you get it in risk free on an EQ, or on Meta, Hera, Skarm, Celebi, or double switch. Tyranitar, Blissey, Dragons, Snorlax (non-immune) and Water-types can all get nabbed by Toxic. Just use it when Charizard forces a switch and you know they are going to go to something that sponges Fire Blast.

    HP Ice goes with the idea of Max +speed to tie Salamence / Flygon ... that would seem to be important for any team that might be weak to these little bastards. If you are tired of them getting momentum, HP Ice will usually solve that before any Rock Slide might come your way.

    Focus Punch - Dents Blissey and Lax, I guess. For example, it works very well to Focus Punch a mid-health Blissey if maybe it came in on Toxic or Fire Blast and thinks that it's safe to Softboiled. It can also be primarily used to hit Tyranitar on the switch, besides Bliss and Lax. Or you can surprise Dragon Dance Tyranitars that might think they can set up once in. If you are fearless and go for Focus Punch, say bye bye to Tar! If they do attack, at least you prevent a massive threat from setting up to +1 attack and +1 speed. It has about a 37.5% chance to OHKO an average full health Tar, just for some perspective. Some chip damage from any prior attack essentally makes it a guaranteed kill on Tar. Real men don't need substitute to use Focus Punch.

    Other tidbits on Charizard:
    --Can serve as switch-in to Heracross / Metagross (once or twice, but this is a pretty invaluable trait and could mean a lot just to have something to take an attack that's not Rock Slide coming from either of those beasts.)
    --Rather unpredictable and pretty fucking dangerous once in against Forry/Skarm/ passive shit like Claydol.
    --Not a sitting duck against Blissey if using the above set, with Toxic and Focus Punch potential to disrupt cleric variety or CM variety.
    --Faster than Moltres (this is really important!!!) but usually put aside for some reason, apparently because it's less of a special attacker. Use Focus Punch, or some gimmicky physical set, to make it a non-inferior Moltres. It kinda does Petaya better too due to Blaze.
    --Speaking of Blaze...Don't forget about it and how you can take non-STAB Gengar T-bolt from near full health and then go spastic. (Did I mention the other benefit of Zard's Fire-typing is that it can come in on Will-o-wisp?)
    Last edited: Feb 4, 2017
  14. Smurf.

    Smurf.
    is a Past SPL Champion

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2009
    Messages:
    1,182
    I don't anticipate playing dpp competitively anymore so I'll share some cool sets / teams.

    Sets:

    [​IMG]
    Suicune @ Leftovers
    Ability: Pressure
    EVs: 104 HP / 248 SpA / 156 Spe
    Modest Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Calm Mind
    - Hydro Pump
    - Ice Beam
    - Protect

    Protect cune is really useful, especially when a lot of people try deal with a post-CM cune by exploding on it. Out of sand you can steal an extra turn of recovery that can prove pivotal vs faster revenge killers. If you have tspike protect puts the clamps down on soft cune checks. You can also stall OTR zong trick room turns which is cool.

    [​IMG]
    Tyranitar @ Life Orb
    Ability: Sand Stream
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
    Jolly Nature
    - Dragon Dance
    - Ice Punch / Fire Punch
    - Stone Edge
    - Earthquake / Crunch

    DDtar has kind of fallen out of favour since the rise of mach punch users, but its still a great mon. This LO set is my favourite variant, especially under screens, as the extra power breaks would be answers like skarmory / quagsire / various shuca berry holders!. Very, very dangerous to fat teams. Crunch and fire punch are decent alternatives, depending on your team and what you want to cripple.

    [​IMG]
    Bronzong @ Lum Berry
    Ability: Heatproof
    EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Def
    Brave Nature
    IVs: 0 Spe
    - Stealth Rock / Zen Headbutt / Hypnosis
    - Payback
    - Earthquake
    - Explosion

    Great zong set that shrugs off Heatran, Infernape, Will-o-wisp rotoms and breloom. If you have another solid ground type switch in this is perfect. Utility boom is great and this dude can also pop up rocks. Other options you can run over SR are Zen headbutt (so you dont have to bomb on breloom) or Hypnosis (to deal with skarm/forre)

    [​IMG]
    Heatran @ Passho Berry
    Ability: Flash Fire
    EVs: 128 HP / 216 SpA / 164 Spe
    Modest Nature
    - Magma Storm
    - Hidden Power [Grass]
    - Will-O-Wisp
    - Explosion

    My personal favourite heatran set. For some reason people think Tar and Flygon are decent switchins to this thing so I like to throw out willo to just destroy them for the rest of the match. 90% of gyara like to DD on you too... so they get unpleasantly surprised as well. Magma storm is great, especially if you want the waters out of the way. Hp grass is preferred to earth power on this set since you can get out of swampert and starmie matchups alive, just make sure your team has a hard switch to opposing tran.

    SPL Teams:

    pixie screen assault (open)

    Azelf @ Colbur Berry
    Ability: Levitate
    EVs: 8 HP / 104 Atk / 144 SpD / 252 Spe
    Jolly Nature
    - Stealth Rock
    - Taunt
    - U-turn
    - Explosion

    Suicune @ Leftovers
    Ability: Pressure
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 104 HP / 248 SpA / 156 Spe
    Modest Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Calm Mind
    - Hydro Pump
    - Ice Beam
    - Protect

    Uxie @ Light Clay
    Ability: Levitate
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 252 HP / 36 Def / 4 SpD / 216 Spe
    Timid Nature
    - Light Screen
    - Reflect
    - Memento
    - Psychic

    Tyranitar @ Life Orb
    Ability: Sand Stream
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
    Jolly Nature
    - Dragon Dance
    - Ice Punch
    - Stone Edge
    - Earthquake

    Gyarados @ Wacan Berry
    Ability: Intimidate
    EVs: 60 HP / 252 Atk / 196 Spe
    Adamant Nature
    - Dragon Dance
    - Waterfall
    - Stone Edge
    - Bounce

    Metagross @ Life Orb
    Ability: Clear Body
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 60 HP / 252 Atk / 196 Spe
    Adamant Nature
    - Agility
    - Meteor Mash
    - Earthquake
    - Explosion


    very berry (open)

    Azelf @ Choice Band
    Ability: Levitate
    EVs: 24 HP / 232 Atk / 252 Spe
    Jolly Nature
    - Explosion
    - Trick
    - U-turn
    - Ice Punch

    Bronzong @ Lum Berry
    Ability: Heatproof
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Def
    Brave Nature
    IVs: 0 Spe
    - Stealth Rock
    - Payback
    - Earthquake
    - Explosion

    Heatran @ Passho Berry
    Ability: Flash Fire
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 128 HP / 216 SpA / 164 Spe
    Modest Nature
    - Magma Storm
    - Hidden Power [Grass]
    - Will-O-Wisp
    - Explosion

    Gengar @ Life Orb
    Ability: Levitate
    EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
    Timid Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Shadow Ball
    - Focus Blast
    - Substitute
    - Thunderbolt

    Gyarados @ Wacan Berry
    Ability: Intimidate
    EVs: 60 HP / 252 Atk / 196 Spe
    Adamant Nature
    - Dragon Dance
    - Waterfall
    - Bounce
    - Stone Edge

    Tyranitar @ Shuca Berry
    Ability: Sand Stream
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
    Jolly Nature
    - Dragon Dance
    - Stone Edge
    - Earthquake
    - Ice Punch


    custapapa smurf (open)

    Metagross @ Custap Berry
    Ability: Clear Body
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 104 HP / 116 Atk / 112 Def / 176 Spe
    Adamant Nature
    - Stealth Rock
    - Meteor Mash
    - Earthquake
    - Explosion

    Heatran @ Passho Berry
    Ability: Flash Fire
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 128 HP / 216 SpA / 164 Spe
    Modest Nature
    - Magma Storm
    - Hidden Power [Grass]
    - Will-O-Wisp
    - Explosion

    Flygon @ Choice Scarf
    Ability: Levitate
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
    Adamant Nature
    - Outrage
    - Stone Edge
    - Earthquake
    - U-turn

    Breloom @ Toxic Orb
    Ability: Poison Heal
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 204 HP / 244 Atk / 60 Spe
    Adamant Nature
    - Spore
    - Seed Bomb
    - Substitute
    - Focus Punch

    Gengar @ Life Orb
    Ability: Levitate
    EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    Timid Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Substitute
    - Pain Split
    - Shadow Ball
    - Focus Blast

    Machamp @ Custap Berry
    Ability: No Guard
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 124 HP / 252 Atk / 132 Spe
    Adamant Nature
    - Substitute
    - Dynamic Punch
    - Payback
    - Stone Edge


    notorious (open)

    NOTORIOUS (Empoleon) @ Focus Sash
    Ability: Torrent
    EVs: 252 SpA / 28 SpD / 228 Spe
    Mild Nature
    - Stealth Rock
    - Hydro Pump
    - Aqua Jet
    - Ice Beam

    Jirachi @ Shuca Berry
    Ability: Serene Grace
    EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    Naive Nature
    - Psychic
    - Iron Head
    - Hidden Power [Ice]
    - Thunder

    Tyranitar @ Passho Berry
    Ability: Sand Stream
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
    Jolly Nature
    - Dragon Dance
    - Crunch
    - Stone Edge
    - Fire Punch

    Kingdra @ Life Orb
    Ability: Swift Swim
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
    Modest Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Dragon Pulse
    - Hydro Pump
    - Signal Beam
    - Rain Dance

    Gengar @ Black Sludge
    Ability: Levitate
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    Timid Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Substitute
    - Will-O-Wisp
    - Shadow Ball
    - Focus Blast

    Metagross @ Shuca Berry
    Ability: Clear Body
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 60 HP / 252 Atk / 196 Spe
    Adamant Nature
    - Agility
    - Meteor Mash
    - Earthquake
    - Explosion
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2017
  15. Mr.E

    Mr.E im the best
    is a Pre-Contributoris a Past SPL Champion

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2004
    Messages:
    5,046
    [​IMG]

    Now, you might say to yourself, "Gosh, Mr.E! Lovely Kiss + Dream Eater is a noob combo! Nobody leaves their sleeping mon out to take it." But you see, Billy, in Gen 2, a whole lot of stuff likes to run Sleep Talk. Everything is reasonably bulky because everything has max defensive stats (and offensive!) in Gen 2, so Rest + Sleep Talk is a good combination on many things either to solidify their ability to wall particular matchups or to bulk up something that otherwise doesn't quite take hits as well as you might want but still fits a niche on your team by typing or offensive capability. Rest on its own is hardly uncommon as well.

    As the more common Exeggutor can attest (or, umm, Tapu Lele...), Psychic is actually a pretty good neutral attacking type because Dark- and Steel-types are uncommon. Other Psychics are also rare, excepting Exeggutor who is conveniently weak to Jynx's other STAB attack. Jynx is a very potent special attacker, of which Gen 2 suffers a major shortage outside the Electric legends, and it even carries an accurate sleep move at relatively high Speed. But it suffers from one thing: lack of recovery. It doesn't have Recover like Alakazam, nor absolve the need for recovery by Exploding like Eggy, and its physical bulk is so nonexistent that even a Sleep Talk set can't fix it (nor does Jynx want to give up Lovely Kiss to run Rest anyway).

    Enter Dream Eater! Jynx does have halfway respectable Special bulk, but without recovery it can normally get grinded out over time by the likes of many STalkers. They'll also frequently switch in to absorb Lovely Kiss, whether it's to eat the initial sleep or while already Resting to control its Sleep Talk cycles and prevent teammates from taking an uncontrolled snooze. Well, Jynx's STAB Ice Beam already scares the bejeezus out of Zapdos, the most common STalker, but Dream Eater is a nice recovery move to have in your pocket if it lands a Thunder and for other common STalkers you don't 2HKO, like Suicune or Raikou. (It's also very slightly stronger than both Psychic or Ice Beam.)

    I mean really, what else does a dual-STAB Jynx run in that fourth moveslot anyway? Substitute is recommended on the Dex but it does little except ease LK prediction... only hit a Jynx Sub will survive is an Umbreon Pursuit, which I suppose lets you go for the freeze on that pretty easily but that's it. Counter is as risky as it can be rewarding, because you only get one shot at making it work, and Reflect is safe but too defensive for a mon with Jynx's speed and firepower. Naked Perish Song has niche utility uses. But I think Jynx is best served applying consistent and heavy offensive pressure on opponents with its high-powered, difficult-to-resist dual STAB combo. Dream Eater allows it to maintain pressure against the ubiquitous Sleep Talkers it'll frequently face up against by effectively combining Psychic + Recover (which it doesn't even learn) into one moveslot (and one turn!) and not get grinded down by its own lack of recovery... or sometimes PP even.
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2017
    craing ;_;, wishes, Cheryl. and 12 others like this.
  16. Sergi

    Sergi

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2014
    Messages:
    179
    always thought the standard was nightmare + spikes. good one though.
  17. Mr.E

    Mr.E im the best
    is a Pre-Contributoris a Past SPL Champion

    Joined:
    Dec 29, 2004
    Messages:
    5,046
    I've run naked Nightmare before on Gengar. Gengar pretty much always has a moveslot available to do weird experimental stuff. You can do worse in a world of Sleep Talkers, particularly since Raikou is Gengar counter numero uno and it frequently doesn't even carry Sleep Talk with its Rest; it also Rest-locks Snorlax which is nice as a special attacker that struggles to actively damage it. Jynx gets STAB on Dream Eater and doesn't have Gengar's type resists to switch in and out easily, though.
  18. Tokyo Tom

    Tokyo Tom Somewhere between psychotic and iconic
    is a Forum Moderator Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2013
    Messages:
    646
    In retrospect, my last post was just a lot of marginal ish that barely worked on v. specific team builds, so now that I feel I have a slightly better grasp over the metagame I'd like to apologize for those and post some sets I was working with during this SPL.

    [​IMG] @ Life Orb
    Ability: Sheer Force
    EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
    Modest Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Fire Blast
    - Sludge Wave / Ice Beam
    - Substitute
    - Earth Power

    SubKing is a set I saw used in ORAS that I thought could be incorporated into BW2. With its huge offensive presence, Nidoking can grab subs against a lot of defensive Pokemon in the tier and simply fire off attacks; for example, Sludge Wave will 2HKO bulky Slowking after SR. It requires some prediction, but once the sub is up you're typically getting a KO. While Nidoking may not be bulky, it can fulfill some defensive roles for a team, such as providing an offensive check to Breloom and Terrakion and absorbing TSpikes. Although Nidoking can 2HKO Ground-types with the proper coverage move, Ice Beam can be used to grab OHKOs and OHKO Latios after SR, if you're ok with dropping coverage against Rotom-W.

    [​IMG] @ Focus Sash
    Ability: Arena Trap
    EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe
    Jolly Nature
    IVs: 21 HP
    - Earthquake
    - Reversal
    - Toxic
    - Substitute

    SubTox Dugtrio is a bit more specialized for teams that don't need it to set up SR. The main thing this set does is beat Chansey, which can be a huge boon for both Sun and Rain teams. Chansey's first thought vs. Dugtrio is usually to Toxic in order to prevent a 1HP Reversal, so you can sub on that, hit Chansey with a Toxic to prevent it from stalling you with SoftBoiled, and then click moves until it is KOed. Sub will also help Dugtrio do various other things, such as Toxic stalling, PP stalling Rotom-W, and giving it as powerful of a Reversal as the situation allows.

    [​IMG] @ Chesto Berry
    Ability: Drizzle
    EVs: 120 HP / 4 Def / 96 SpA / 72 SpD / 216 Spe
    Modest Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Hydro Pump
    - Hypnosis
    - Rest
    - Ice Beam

    Looks kind of dumb, but this spread is mainly there so Toed isn't using max/max, 'cuz I don't think a non-choiced Pokemon with modest defensive potential should be running that. The bulk allows Politoed to take hits from Scarf Chomp/Mienshao after rocks, and also Dracos from LO Latios and Hydreigon. The spread could probably be edited for more bulk depending on build; in this case I wanted to keep a good amount of speed to outpace Adamant Scizor and enough SpAtk for Hydro to still pack a punch.

    [​IMG] @ Leftovers
    Ability: Flash Fire
    EVs: 56 HP / 200 SpA / 252 Spe
    Timid Nature
    IVs: 2 Atk / 30 Def
    - Flamethrower
    - Substitute
    - Toxic
    - Hidden Power [Ice]

    In a meta where Heatran usage has gone down, I decided to tweak the standard SubTran set to abuse the fact that most Heatran give a 100% free switch to Garchomp. Heatran gets subs on a lot of common Pokemon and can proceed to either Toxic bulky waters or fire off attacks. There isn't much else to the set, but HP Ice keeps Latios honest by threatening a 2HKO, and grabs the OHKO on Landorus-T as well. Without Earth Power you lose coverage on Ttar (well, among other things), but the majority of bulky SR Ttar can't touch Heatran anyway (Crunch will never break the sub), and you can hit them with a Toxic. I didn't end up using this set, but the surprise value worked out in testing, and the set synergized well with a lot of different builds.

    [​IMG] @ Leftovers
    Ability: Intimidate
    EVs: 72 HP / 184 Atk / 252 Spe
    Naive Nature
    - Earthquake
    - Hidden Power [Ice]
    - Gravity
    - Substitute

    Like SubTran, SubGrav Lando isn't necessarily a new set, but I feel that it's underrated in the current state of BW, where conventional Physical walls such as Hippowdon are decreasing in usage. Your typical Sand Balance builds don't carry too much for EQs under Gravity, with the most resistance usually coming from Pokemon such as Ferrothorn or Gastrodon. Additionally, Gravity Lando forms a nice core with common scarfer Garchomp, a duo I ended up using in two of my SPL games. Nothing too special about the set; the HP EVs get a Leftovers number and allow Lando to survive HP Ices from opposing Lando from full. Any more investment (or investment in SpAtk) would take too much away from Lando's physical damage output.

    [​IMG] @ Choice Scarf
    Ability: Intimidate
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
    Naive Nature
    IVs: 30 HP / 30 Def
    - Earthquake
    - Hidden Power [Ice]
    - U-turn
    - Punishment

    Alrite, this one is more of a gimmick. I like Punishment because it -
    a) offensively "checks" Reuniclus (a Pokemon that has completely fallen off in usage, but you still have to account for because it's so game-breaking) so you can use non-Chople/Gem/BandTar (like Scarf or Lum), or a +SpDef nature (which turns Latios's moves from 2HKOs to 3HKOs), or even drop Crunch. Now obviously this isn't for every team, but Ttar often times appreciates extra coverage or support moves and always appreciates a SpDef nature.
    b) pops Gengar after SR
    c) hits stuff like Starmie and Lati@s in occasional situations where I don't want to U-Turn + has 100% accuracy
    d) you keep shittalking up state new york when newark is 10x worse
    At the end of the day it doesn't do all that much, but since Edge only really hits Gyarados + Torn, and Punishment allows for less constraining teambuilding at certain times, I thought I'd mention it. (also WHOMST'D THE FR*CK uses Gyarados in twenty seventeen [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG])


    So yeah, while most consider the BW2 OU meta a done deal at this point, I think there is still some room to make cool (and fairly applicable) stuff, so thanks for reading and I look forward to seeing what everyone else has come up with this season c:
    Century Express, Chop, Empo and 18 others like this.
  19. zf

    zf take it easy, amigo
    is a Tiering Contributor

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2013
    Messages:
    933
    some bw stuff

    [​IMG]
    Latios (M) @ Life Orb
    Ability: Levitate
    EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
    Timid Nature
    IVs: 2 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 Spe
    - Draco Meteor
    - Grass Knot
    - Hidden Power [Fire] / Surf
    - Recover

    Grass Knot Latios is strong choice for some offenses that need a way to pressure bulky waters or don't need the coverage Surf / HP [Fire] provide. GK lets Latios break past its best "check", Tyranitar, by 2hkoing it on the switch, which makes it amazing vs most sand teams. It also gives Latios a way to pressure bulky water types, namely Gastrodon and Jellicent, both of which are tough to KO for offenses that lack a strong, super-effective way to hit them.

    [​IMG]
    Kyurem @ Choice Specs
    Ability: Pressure
    EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
    Modest Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Draco Meteor
    - Ice Beam
    - Dragon Pulse
    - Sleep Talk / Earth Power

    Specs Kyurem was an idea Sergi had and I think it's a decent niche pick on certain rain teams. Firstly, it gives rain a direct switch-in to both bulky grasses (eats Amoonguss's Spore) and bulky Waters (2hkos Gastrodon / Jellicent / Slowking), both types of defensive mons rain teams can struggle to break. Secondly, Kyurem forces and punishes switches well with its raw power, meaning it can actually damage relevant mons (Ferro / TTar) after getting a free turn. Earth Power is probably the best coverage to 2hko Rachi and Heatran on the switch if your team already has a sleep absorber or doesn't need one.

    [​IMG]
    Magnezone @ Chople Berry
    Ability: Magnet Pull
    EVs: 160 HP / 232 SpA / 116 Spe
    Modest Nature
    IVs: 2 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 Spe
    - Thunderbolt
    - Flash Cannon
    - Hidden Power [Fire]
    - Sunny Day

    Chople Mag's a neat alternative for weatherless offenses that would usually use Specs Mag. Chople lets Magnezone soft check Alakazam, Keldeo, Mienshao, etc and makes sure 252 Adamant +2 Scizor Superpower doesn't ohko it after rocks. Sunny Day gives Magnezone a way to trap Ferrothorn more consistently than its counterparts and offers some utility in rain matchups by clearing the weather. Spe is just for creep, run however much you want as long as the SpA stat stays above 375 (needs this to ohko Ferro in sun and SpD Skarm after SR).

    other notes: all variants of gravity lando-t are good rn, they pair really well with scarfchomps and excas. sleep talk on anything that resembles a loom / amoonguss check is also really good, notably amoonguss, specs latios/mence, and helm lando-t. offensive jirachi is a great glue for offense and has a lot of options, ranging from sub, shuca, sr, extra coverage, sitrus for latios, etc., and fits on so many teams. scarfchomp era is pushing faster scarfers to the forefront of the meta rn, namely mienshao / keldeo.
    Last edited: Apr 3, 2017
    rozes, KratosMana, Sacri' and 13 others like this.
  20. Jirachee

    Jirachee who dares wins
    is a Tournament Directoris a Super Moderatoris a Tutor Alumnusis a Team Rater Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnus
    Head TD

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2010
    Messages:
    2,384
    [​IMG][​IMG]
    Landorus-Therian (M) @ Fighting Gem
    Ability: Intimidate
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
    Naughty Nature
    - Earthquake
    - Superpower
    - Hidden Power [Ice]
    - Swords Dance

    I gave this to McMeghan and he used it vs Eo in his week 4 game. Basically, this Landorus is made to decimate slow balances that rely on Skarmory to check it. +2 Fighting Gem Superpower one shots just about anything bulky, from Skarmory itself to max defense Gastrodon. The only issue with it is that Landorus and Gliscor wall Ground / Fighting coverage, which is why I use HP Ice as the third attack. It's a pretty fun set!

    [​IMG][​IMG]
    Garchomp @ Water Gem
    Ability: Rough Skin
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
    Jolly Nature
    - Dragon Claw
    - Earthquake
    - Aqua Tail
    - Swords Dance

    This one is designed to be used by a Rain team. +2 Aqua Tail will KO Skarmory in Rain, making Garchomp very hard to counter. It also has other fun applications like one shotting offensive Landorus without needing a boost, or just providing a strong neutral hit without using Outrage.

    [​IMG][​IMG]
    Scizor @ Occa Berry
    Ability: Technician
    EVs: 80 HP / 252 Atk / 176 Spe
    Adamant Nature
    - Bullet Punch
    - Bug Bite
    - Superpower
    - Swords Dance

    Offensive SD Scizor isn't really commonly seen nowadays but it can be pretty threatening to standard sands. My main problem with it was that random Fire moves always killed it. SoulWind had a bulky Occa Scizor on the team he used against me so I decided to try it on a more offensive variant. Turns out it's pretty sweet against teams that check it by using HP Fire Jirachi and the like. Scizor's bulk is really bad though so don't except it to live something like Heatran's Magma Storm

    [​IMG][​IMG]
    Dragonite @ Leftovers
    Ability: Multiscale
    EVs: 80 HP / 252 SpA / 176 Spe
    Timid Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Hurricane
    - Surf
    - Roost
    - Agility

    McMeghan and I created this because we thought it'd do well against Smurf's weatherless offenses. He ended up using something else I think though. Anyway Special Dragonite in Rain is one of the most popular "hipster" picks although I never really liked it. This one is neat because Roost, Multiscale, and the Speed boost interact very nicely with each other. Hurricane and Surf have nearly perfect coverage, only missing out on like, the bulkiest of Jirachis, Rotom, and rarely even seen stuff like Empoleon.

    [​IMG][​IMG]
    Latios @ Colbur Berry
    Ability: Levitate
    EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
    Timid Nature
    IVs: 2 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 Spe
    - Draco Meteor
    - Grass Knot
    - Hidden Power [Fire]
    - Calm Mind

    I was looking for something that could lure Tyranitar for Sub LO Alakazam, and came up with this one. The goal of this set is to force something out then CM up, and then you just hit whoever you're facing with the appropriate move. +1 Grass Knot will 2HKO Tyranitar while Surf will probably fail to do so vs bulkier ones. Colbur Berry is especially nice for it because the only attack that has a chance to KO you is CBTar Crunch, and they're very likely to use Pursuit anyway. Not only that but CBTar takes a million from GK.
    IronBullet, Chop, rozes and 19 others like this.
  21. McMeghan

    McMeghan Dreamcatcher
    is a Tournament Director Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis an Administrator Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnusis a Past SPL Championis the Smogon Tour Season 14 Champion

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2010
    Messages:
    3,057
    With spl out of the way and no plans to play in classic, it's a good time to post some of the stuff i've been using/considering recently.

    BW

    [​IMG]Alakazam @ Focus Sash
    Ability: Magic Guard
    EVs: 88 Def / 192 SpA / 228 Spe
    Timid Nature

    No particular set, the ev spread is the thing I wanna showcase anyway. With it, alakazam survives dual chop from scarf chomp, which is all the rage these days (understandably so). I couldn't tie with other zams/dugs with HP Fire IVs anyway, so I thought I'd try to get something else out of them. The current evs are thought with HP Fire in mind by the way, make sure you adjust them if you don't use it (you just need to keep the same hp & defense stats).

    [​IMG] Dragonite @ Leftovers
    Ability: Multiscale
    EVs: 80 HP / 252 SpA / 176 Spe
    Timid Nature
    - Hurricane
    - Surf
    - Agility
    - Roost

    To use in rain. Dragonite brings very solid resistances to Rain teams, and this set gives it longevity. Agility late-game can do wonders, especially with Roost and Multiscale (set-up on an hp ice then spam roost). Flying/Water is a pretty good coverage (similary to Gyarados), but keep in mind surf is pretty weak without rain to back it up. You're never really ohkoing much, but you have a lot of 2KOs on offensive pkmns, and you can muscle through some bulkier stuff with confusion should it come down to it. Avoid status ofc.

    The ev spread allows you to outspeed Breloom without a boost and scarf latios at +2 (which is rare in itself, so you outspeed every common scarfers like mienshao/keld/landot/chomp).

    edit: FUCKIN ninja'd by slick -_-

    [​IMG] Latios @ Ground Gem
    Ability: Levitate
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
    Jolly Nature
    - Dragon Dance
    - Earthquake
    - Zen Headbutt
    - Outrage

    Credits go to peachy because I found this one in a replay from a previous spl. I dont think many people will rly like the idea of dd tios bc spec latios is just too good to pass up. Beside the surprise factor, what I rly like with it is that after a single boost, you outspeed the whole meta, scarfers included, which can rly fuck with some teams.

    The item and zenbutt slot are up to preferences. I liked ground gem because it beats down the jirachi/ttar (calcs below) that usually prey on latios, while zen ohkos amoong and avoid the outrage lock vs other threats such as terrak/keldeo. I recommand mag as a partner (for obvious reasons) and a lando-t lure (i used shuca ice beam ttar in my spl game).

    Calcs (open)
    +1 252 Atk Ground Gem Latios Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Tyranitar: 350-414 (86.6 - 102.4%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
    +1 252 Atk Ground Gem Latios Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Jirachi: 382-450 (94.5 - 111.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock

    [​IMG] Mamoswine @ Life Orb
    Ability: Thick Fat
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
    Jolly Nature
    - Substitute
    - Ice Shard
    - Earthquake
    - Icicle Crash

    My favorite "innovation" of this spl by far. Mamo is amazing in BW in general and super anti-meta. My biggest grip in the past with mamo is that a lot of pkmns can pivot around it to put it in a situation where it has to leaves the field (classic example: switch lando on eq then keld on ice move), making it very prediction-reliant.

    Thats where sub kicks in. Mamo naturally scares away a ton of top tiers in BW (amoong, landot, chomp, ttar, bulky jirachi, to name a few). Once you're behind a sub, you put even more pressure on your opponent, and you can rly go to town. Not to mention sub will block intidimate and you can fish for odds vs paralysed opps or smth like rotomw that has to hit pump to break it.

    Superpower is not mandatory at all when you think about it. Most targets take a fuckton from eq/crash and smth like Rotom will take ~30 from crash lol. You can run adamant if you want, and icicle spear has some perks (beating loom through sash or killing a dnite/landot behind a sub), but crash is rly the better move overall.

    [​IMG] Rotom-Wash @ Leftovers
    Ability: Levitate
    EVs: 228 HP / 56 SpA / 224 Spe
    Modest Nature
    IVs: 2 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 Spe
    - Volt Switch
    - Hydro Pump
    - Hidden Power [Fire]
    - Toxic

    Forgot to post this one. Good pivot early (despite everyone hating on it :sob:). Faster than offensive zor/loom and can surprise them with hp fire, which is also handy vs ferro (2ko in sand, or comes close). Toxic is a cool last move to fuck with gastrodon.

    GSC

    I mostly used standard in that tier. It's hard to rly come up with something "new", not to mention its not a gen I was rly familar with anyway.

    [​IMG]
    Snorlax @ Leftovers
    - Lovely Kiss
    - Belly Drum
    - Return
    - Protect

    This is the only thing I theorymoned (and theorymoned only, bc i didn't even use it in a test game). Protect is smth i rly like in general on bd lax, free leftovers and avoid boom, which is a common way to deal with a boosted lax, especially in offense. In the past, I mostly used EQ or Rest in the last slot, but I thought LK would be cool because you can put to sleep a Skarmory or give yourself an easier time setting up. You also put to sleep ttar/rhydon/steelix but technically, EQ would be better for these three. To use with pursuit support ofc, and para support is appreciated too. Might be wack anyway lol.

    And that's it. Some honorables mentions:
    • I couldnt find ciele's post about it, but all credits go to him: Ice Gem NP Thundurus-T in BW. Hide the item and will OHKO Amoonguss/Latias at +2.
    • Offensive Tentacruel, s-o Reymedy. Surprise factor and cool resists. You can run Shuca btw, it fucks with chomp/scarf landot and you have rain dish recovery. Starmie is a better pokemon overall tho.
    • Natural Gift Ice Breloom. You get the technician boost with aspear/yache berry. +2 will kill Amoonguss (amazing lure, which opens the way for a ton of pkmns vs common sand builds, think keldeo). Unboosted will put latis in mach range, +1 will kill defensive landot and -1 will kill offensive landot with rocks (mach punch range too). Did i mention all those things are achieved with a Jolly nature?
    • Sub in general is amazing in BW. There are a ton pkmns easy to abuse, like Amoonguss (and they always stay in and spam spore too!) and then you can put on a clinic vs all those balanced builds that ppl love to spam. Sub rachi, sub chomp (mix has been a favorite of mine), sub croak, etc.
    That's it for the time being. I hope some peeps will post some of their lab results, bc i love reading about creative sets :heart:
    Last edited: Apr 12, 2017
  22. Posho

    Posho It's like I'm hanging on to nothing
    is the Smogon Tour Season 23 Champion

    Joined:
    Sep 14, 2014
    Messages:
    795
    ORAS:

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    Tuerca (Ferrothorn) @ Leftovers
    Ability: Iron Barbs
    EVs: 248 HP / 112 Def / 148 SpD
    Sassy Nature
    IVs: 0 Spe
    - Stealth Rock
    - Spikes

    - Gyro Ball/Power Whip
    - Leech Seed

    Double hazard ferrothorn is just amazing, with mega sableye gone, leaving diancie, espeon and xatu (lol) as the only viable magic bouncers this set works incredibly well, being capable to pressure up your opponent constantly with hazards and also saving yourself a slot in case you want to build a team with spikes :D

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    Batichica (Gliscor) @ Toxic Orb
    Ability: Poison Heal
    EVs: 244 HP / 192 SpD / 72 Spe
    Careful Nature
    - Roost
    - Toxic
    - Earthquake
    - Taunt

    This one as well, has become really good with mega sableye gone. It's a standard stallbreaker glisc and as its name says, it deals really well against stall teams

    Replay vs nedor in SPL where I use these sets: http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-ou-241848

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    Skarmory @ Custap Berry
    Ability: Sturdy
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
    Jolly Nature
    - Stealth Rock
    - Spikes
    - Brave Bird
    - Taunt

    God dammit looks like all of the sets are based on m sab's departure but those who know me may know that I LOVE custap skarm <3<3

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    Eonita (Latias-Mega) @ Latiasite
    Ability: Levitate
    EVs: 248 HP / 8 SpA / 252 Spe
    Timid Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Calm Mind
    - Psyshock
    - Dragon Pulse
    - Roost

    This set is so good and underrated at the same time, I used it a lot during OLT qualifying phase and also brought it vs xtrashine in smogon tour semifinals but could not showcase it cause I got pwned that turn kek. Few people prepare for it, I use it alongside spikes this way it's easier to wear down steels and ttar to prep a sweep :O

    This is the only replay I got to showcase it kek: http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/pokespain-ou-2902


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    Mohoso (Gastrodon-East) @ Leftovers
    Ability: Storm Drain
    Shiny: Yes
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
    Bold Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Scald
    - Toxic
    - Recover
    - Protect

    It may look weird but on the team I was using I couldn't find any better move to use and it's very helpful when it comes to avoid some rolls against bandtar or simply scouting lol

    here it's really helpful against that medicham and gastro: http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-467519638


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    Eonito (Latios) @ Life Orb
    Ability: Levitate
    EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
    Timid Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Draco Meteor
    - Surf
    - Roost
    - Thunderbolt

    I love this set cause it can deal p well w teams that have slowbrotran or even azumarill

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    Azumarill @ Lum Berry
    Ability: Huge Power
    EVs: 160 HP / 252 Atk / 96 Spe
    Adamant Nature
    - Power-Up Punch
    - Play Rough
    - Waterfall
    - Aqua Jet

    This set is insanely good cause it allows azu to lure some shit like tran or rotom into wisping while receiving a good chunk back


    BW:

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    3 pajas al día (Hydreigon) @ Choice Specs
    Ability: Levitate
    EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
    Modest Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Draco Meteor
    - Focus Blast
    - Fire Blast
    - Dark Pulse

    Standard specs hydra, I kinda like it more than the LO one cause it doesn't suffer from 4mss while you can spam dracos mindlessly against the entire meta (fucc dragons)

    this is one of the few replays I have to showcase it: http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen5ou-219323

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    Moltres @ Choice Specs
    Ability: Pressure
    EVs: 252 SpA /4 SpD/ 252 Spe
    Modest Nature
    - Hurricane
    - Fire Blast
    - Sleep Talk
    - U-turn

    Beastful mon, I absolutely love how it does against some bulky teams and also offense while also keeping the pressure up with u-turn and serving as a good sleep fodder thanks to sleep talk

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    Big Heights (Dragonite) @ Life Orb
    Ability: Multiscale
    EVs: 56 Atk / 200 SpA / 252 Spe
    Mild Nature
    - Hurricane
    - Extreme Speed
    - Thunder
    - Superpower/Earthquake

    Mixed nite is one of my favourite mons in rain, thanks to how well it does against bulky-ish teams and the good coverage it has allows it to open up holes on the opposing team for another mon to clean, like scarf keld

    here it barely does anything but confusing rachi and throwing a thunder but kek: http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen5ou-212164

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    Gyarados @ Normal Gem
    Ability: Intimidate
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
    Adamant(kuk) Nature
    - Double-Edge
    - Waterfall
    - Dragon Dance
    - Earthquake

    Set basically made to lure rotom(which is spodef mostly)
    +1 252+ Atk Normal Gem Gyarados Double-Edge vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Rotom-Wash: 296-349 (97.6 - 115.1%) -- 87.5% chance to OHKO

    Lastly some memes that are somewhat viable xD:

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    Articuno @ Choice Specs
    Ability: Pressure
    EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
    Timid Nature
    - Blizzard
    - U-turn
    - Hurricane
    - Hidden Power [Ground]

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    Scyther @ Eviolite
    Ability: Technician
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
    Jolly Nature
    - Swords Dance
    - Brick Break
    - Aerial Ace/Bug Bite
    - Quick Attack

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    Lanturn @ Life Orb
    Ability: Volt Absorb
    EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
    Modest Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Agility
    - Hydro Pump
    - Ice Beam
    - Thunder
  23. TDK

    TDK
    is a Tournament Directoris a member of the Site Staffis a Super Moderatoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a defending World Cup of Pokemon champion
    OU Leader

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2013
    Messages:
    862
    not gonna bother posting things that are literally standard or stupid memes that even marshall law or hellpowna would never use in a tournament but

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    Gliscor (M) @ Toxic Orb
    Ability: Poison Heal
    EVs: 244 HP / 36 Def / 228 SpD
    Sassy Nature
    - Swords Dance
    - Earthquake
    - Roost
    - Baton Pass

    I was talking to Gingy prior to my SPL game vs Trosko about stuff I wanted to use and he brought up bringing out an old set the two of us liked a lot; SD BP Gliscor. I remember in the very early stages of ORAS, like, release week, Tesung and I used it quite a bit and made some teams with it. I really haven't seen anyone outside of us use it aside from McMeghan after I gave him some underrated/creative sets in ORAS. Fast forward quite a while later I'm building with it in ORAS. The set is designed to abuse the fact so few Pokemon can actually OHKO Gliscor, and those that can don't usually switch directly in (Weavile / Keldeo). Passing boosts to things like Scarf Garchomp, Mega Metagross, and other offensive behemoths that can't boost up / can't afford to is very nice for certain teams. This set is most definitely best when paired with Magnezone, due to the fact it gets completely neutralized vs one, and easily allows you to get Magnezone in thanks to Baton Pass, although usually you'd rather keep the fact it has BP hidden until late game. The EV spread is designed to under speed standard Rotom-W and maximize bulk, allowing your recipient to avoid any attack or status from Rotom-W, as well as avoiding anything from a bulky Landorus, among other things.

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    Charizard-Mega-X (M) @ Charizardite X
    Ability: Tough Claws
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
    Jolly Nature
    - Tailwind
    - Swords Dance
    - Fire Punch
    - Outrage

    After lots of testing I feel like standard DD Charizard has hit a wall in terms of effectiveness; it's always a threat but it's not reaching the same potential it did when I originally made my DD 3 Atks Charizard HO team early 2016. EQ was criminally underrated on DD Zard; lots of people were trying to get away with Heatran + Scarf Landorus as counterplay, and that really isn't sufficient without some serious outplaying. Nowadays, things like Slowbro and bulky Landorus are even more common than they were at the time, as well as other means of counterplay like Thunder Wave Rotom, Scarf Latios, amongst other things. As such I looked into trying the old set Hugo used in WCoP 2014; TW SD. This set aims to play more of a role as a wallbreaker (via SD) or a late game cleaner (via Tailwind) rather than a sweeper. It was pretty effective in most of my test games, finding chances to break for other 'Mons such as RP Landorus by denting/killing bulky Lando, Slowbro, etc, and nice for endgaming vs some offensively oriented teams. I was originally going to use this vs Nintendi in playoffs but after we were eliminated I just decided to use the variant with DD 3 Atks still.

    Our team was pretty boring as far as BW and DPP goes but I blame bkc for that, w/e lol. Don't have anything special to share from those tiers because I don't think anything that's not unorthodox is worth posting in here.
  24. Empo

    Empo
    is a Tutoris a Tiering Contributor Alumnus

    Joined:
    Sep 24, 2015
    Messages:
    1,234
    i'll post some oras sets

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    SNOWBLIND (Kyurem-Black) @ Leftovers
    Ability: Teravolt
    EVs: 56 HP / 200 Atk / 16 SpA / 236 Spe
    Lonely Nature
    - Fusion Bolt
    - Iron Head
    - Ice Beam
    - Substitute

    first thing i wanna say, this is not a set created by me, so credit goes to bad ass because he firstly introduced to me this one. however, i really like this since it can hit a large amount of things and sub is pretty rare on kyub to be honest. iron head is so damn cool with all those clefable around and kyub can 2hko it. ev spread is made to tank one chansey's seismic toss under sub

    OLT vs Paycard

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    AERIALS (Gardevoir-Mega) @ Gardevoirite
    Ability: Pixilate
    EVs: 16 HP / 8 Def / 232 SpA / 252 Spe
    Timid Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 Spe
    - Hyper Voice
    - Focus Blast
    - Hidden Power [Fire]
    - Substitute

    i thought about this set a long time ago, and it actually works pretty well. steels are usually threatening against garde so i thought sub + hp fire might worked, and it actually does because you can just sub on mons that might switch against this monster (like idk mola or tios) and you just hp fire the scizor or focus blast the heatran. be careful about poison mons because this mon doesnt have any psychic move.

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    CHOP SUEY! (Mew) @ Colbur Berry
    Ability: Synchronize
    EVs: 248 HP / 152 SpD / 108 Spe
    Calm Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Aura Sphere
    - Defog / Taunt
    - Will-O-Wisp
    - Soft-Boiled

    this set is actually incredibly good. i remember i had a team where this was my bisharp and weavile counter, lol. 108 speed evs let it reach 263 speed so you just outspeed sharp, which rarely sucker punches mew. however, +2 bisharp cant kill it with sucker and aura sphere ohkoes. you can slash defog to taunt, its your choice.

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    ATWA (Gyarados) @ Liechi Berry
    Ability: Intimidate
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
    Jolly Nature
    - Waterfall
    - Bounce
    - Natural Gift
    - Dragon Dance

    natural gift grass, this is mainly to get rid of other fat water types such as rotom wash, starmie, gastrodon and stuff like that. moveset and evs are standard.

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    FOREST (Latios) @ Choice Specs
    Ability: Levitate
    EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
    Timid Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 Spe
    - Surf
    - Psyshock / Psychic
    - Draco Meteor
    - Hidden Power [Fire]

    this is not really gimmick but despite this, i think specs latios is one of the strongest oras mons, especially with 4 attacks. hp fire fucks ferrothorn, surf is for tyranitar, heatran and steel / rock stuff that latios is weak to, and draco meteor and psychic (or psyshock) both hit very hard with a choice specs and are lati's main stabs.
  25. LuckOverSkill

    LuckOverSkill

    Joined:
    Nov 28, 2010
    Messages:
    659
    I actually didnt' go for many weird sets / mons this year but I still got something to post!

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    Abomasnow @ Expert Belt
    Ability: Snow Warning
    EVs: 40 Atk / 252 SpA / 216 Spe
    Mild Nature
    - Giga Drain
    - Blizzard
    - Ice Shard
    - Earthquake

    This set was on the team I was supposed to bring vs McMeghan, too bad he got subbed out. Anyway, we've all seen Belt Abomasnow, except most of the times its purely Physical with Hidden Power Fire, but I'm not that big of a fan of that set now. I like being able to switch Abomasnow in throughout the match, something a set with Wood Hammer doesn't really let you do. Blizzard hits really hard, and other weather setters don't really want to come in on you, because they are all weak to Grass / EQ, while mons like Ferrothorn still don't deal with Aboma all that well with Hail up. Definitely worth a try if you want to try Abomasnow. Its Ice Shard is rather weak though with this set (it barely 2HKOs Chomp / Lando-T), so be careful with it.

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    Terrakion @ Life Orb
    Ability: Justified
    EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
    Adamant Nature
    - Swords Dance
    - Close Combat
    - Stone Edge
    - Protect

    Credits for this set goes to Bad Ass, it was on his team I used in SPL. Protect Terrakion sparkled a debate on Smogon (I don't remember exactly when, but it had to be around 2011 I think?), and it has never seen much use, but it's actually really good. As pointed out by other users in this thread, ScarfChomp is really popular nowadays, so is Landorus-T, and both these mons generally need to lock into an easily resisted move, or even try to U-Turn on a switch, in the case of Landorus-T. Terrakion solves this problem by running Protect, allowing it to scout, and mindgame these threats, as well as about any other choice locked mon in the tier (Politoed, Latios, Mienshao). The one I used was Adamant, since it relied very heavily on its scouting with Protect, but you could run Jolly if you so wished. I've seen BKC run this recently, but he had Leftovers instead of Life Orb (and possibly a different move over Swords Dance, he didn't reveal it :c).

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    Kyurem-Black @ Choice Specs
    Ability: Teravolt
    EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
    Modest Nature
    IVs: 0 Atk
    - Ice Beam
    - Earth Power
    - Draco Meteor
    - Sleep Talk / Focus Blast

    This set right here is super scary with some support (mostly momentum wise). While regular Kyurem has slightly higher Special Attack, this set has a couple differences that make it worthwile running. Firstly, its trait: Pressure isn't all that useful on Specs Kyurem, because you are attacking once and then switching out usually, so the PP draining is hardly abusable, while Teravolt makes sure mons like Lati@s, Rotom-W, and Bronzong, can't really predict an Earth Power and come in for free. Secondly, a fully specially attacking Kyurem-B is hardly expected, so you can generally put a very strong dent on certain mons that don't expect such a strong Ice Beam, like Ferrothorn. Kyurem-B being fully special also means you can send it easily on defensive mons such as Rotom-W and Scald users like Tentacruel and Politoed without fearing a burn at all. Sleep Talk is great and abuses Amoongus' high usage best, but Focus Blast gets rid of non-Chople Tyranitar in 1 hit, although its shaky accuracy and locking yourself in a fighting move might not be the best.

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    Mew @ Expert Belt
    Ability: Synchronize
    EVs: 60 Atk / 252 SpA / 196 Spe
    Rash Nature
    - Energy Ball
    - Flamethrower
    - Low Kick
    - Ice Beam

    I love Mew, its one of my favourite mons, so I tried to switch it up a bit by trying this set out. Its actually really hard for most teams to switch into this, although sometimes I wish I had a Psychic move when my opps just hards Keldeo into this after a sacrifice. Anyway, this coverage is amazing and hits basically everything in the tier decently hard, while keeping Mew's decent bulk at a somewhat acceptable state. Heatran is Mew's #1 switch in usually, but even a max HP Heatran takes 59% minimum damage from Low Kick with this spread, making it almost unusable. Chople Berry Tyranitar takes 54% minimum from Low Kick, and always dies from Energy Ball + Low Kick if SR are on the field, which eases the prediction game. Rotom-W takes 60% minimum from Energy Ball, while mons like Skarmory and Hippowdon don't stand a chance against this. Max SAtk and a Rash nature to squeeze as much damage out as possible, while it has enough EVs to outspeed Jolly Mamoswine. It could also be made faster, or the EV spread could probably be optimized better, but this is something the reader should do according to his team. Really cool set with a lot of nice applications, and it's really unexpected too, very hard to not grab a kill with this. It also has a couple nice resistances, mostly to Fighting. The only real problem is max SDef Jirachi, which isn't 2HKOd, so if you're scared of that, run Fire Blast, which does 52% minimum.
    Last edited: Apr 12, 2017

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