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unrelenting ubers offensive onslaught

Discussion in 'BW Other Teams' started by albinorhino, Aug 9, 2012.

  1. albinorhino


    Aug 9, 2012
    Hi all, I'm posting an ubers team that has had quite a bit of success for my standards(peaked at 1420 which was somewhere on the frontpage at one point) but needs a little tweaking, so I was hoping the smogon community could help me out. Ubers is a really offensive metagame and while there are a few skilled battlers who can stall quite well, but in general its just a really fast metagame where most battles are over in just a few turns so thats what my team is, really offensive. I guess that's all for an intro, lets look at the team.

    AT A GLANCE: [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]

    Groudon @Rawst Berry
    EVs: 252atk 252def 4hp
    Adamant nature

    Swords Dance
    Rock Polish
    Shadow Claw

    Thoughts: Double dance groudon is a very underutilized set and sweeps many unprepared teams completely. I use shadow claw as opposed to stone edge/rock slide because of the common switch ins to groudon. Lugia and Giratina and Giratina-O are all damaged supereffectively from shadow claw. Lugia is hit harder by stone edge, but it misses alot and the only things that i don't hit as hard with shadow claw are Ho-oh and Rayquaza. Shadow claw also hits arceus ghost which is very common. I'm not really sure about the EVs, Ive played around with lots of sets and am open to suggestions. I dont want to go full offensive 252 atk/spe because I want to have some bulk to get at least one earthquake on arceus if he gets a swords dance up before being 2hkod by extremespeed. Groudon puts up the sun, but my team isnt really a sun team, I just like him more than kyogre and so I started this team around him and his double dance set. I chose rawst berry because a burnt double dance groudon is worthless and toxic hurts him, but doesnt ruin him so thats why I use rawst over the traditional lum.

    Mewtwo @Life Orb
    EVs: 252 spatk 252spe 4hp
    Timid nature

    Ice Beam
    Aura Sphere

    This guy is a beast. I have played with stalltwo before and really like that set and the CM + 3attacks is good, but this is his best set in my opinion. He hits everything. Other than opposing mewtwo, and arceus ghost, I think every poke seen commonly in ubers is hit supereffectively by one of his attacks. And to top it all off, the fat nurse has no chance thanks to Psystrike. It is crucial to go timid, otherwise shaymin-s and darkrai can outspeed you and you dont want that, however tempting modest is with 447 spatk. Of all the pokes on my team, this guy is probably the most important as he always kills or severely damages multiple pokes on the opposing team. Not much else to say about this guy, just a beast.

    Arceus @Lum Berry
    EVs: 252 atk 252 hp 4 def
    Adamant nature

    Swords Dance
    Shadow Claw

    Ok, so basically, I think that every ubers team should have some form of arceus on it, he's simply too good not to. I chose the normal form because STAB priority is ridiculous, and he can hold an item, which all the other forms can't(well, a plate, but not a beneficial item). I decided on lum berry because being burned kills this guy, toxic and being paralyzed aren't ideal either. I used to run overheat instead of earthquake, but there arent that many skarmory out there any more and there is often rain, and I couldn't really hit Dialga very hard so I decided to go full physical. Ferrothorn is 2hkod by earthquake after a boost anyway and Dialga and Terrakion hate EQ much worse than overheat. Many of you are wondering about the EVs. I know its not really traditional and most people think using half defensive half offensive EVs is stupid, but with max hp, he often times wins duels against opposing "extremekillers" with life orb, and more importantly, he lives a close combat from scarf terrakion bar a critical hit and can OHKO with earthquake. I use shadow claw for the same reasons as groudon. Arceus ghost is a very common switch in along with the forms of Giratina. It works perfectly with the lum berry because I bring in Arceus, sd as they switch to Giratina, shadow claw as they WOW and then I'm healed and Shadow claw for the 2HKO, works like a charm. And after the ghost is out of the way, many teams cant handle arceus extremespeed after a swords dance.

    Palkia @Choice Scarf
    EVs: 252 spatk 252 spe 4spdef
    Timid nature

    Spacial Rend
    Fire Blast
    Focus Punch

    I run groudon, so naturally I need a Kyogre counter and Palkia is the best one, PERIOD. He takes a surf in the rain at about 12% from the scarf set, and dominates the irritating whale with 100% accuracy thunder. I run timid because Palkia's base 100 speed is a gift and should be used to its maximum potential as Palkia outspeeds scarf Rayquaza and scarf Dialga. Many people would advocate for Draco Meteor on a choice set, but I've kept with spacial rend because on many an occasion I've been down 4-1 and simply swept because they dont have anything to outspeed and spacial rend doesnt drop Palkia's spatk. Fire blast is for Ferrothorn and arceus steel. I run Focus Punch on the last slot because sometimes you can predict a ferrothorn switch in in the rain, or a heatran or blissey switch in. However, Thunder and Spacial rend get about 95% of the usage of all this guy's moves so focus punch is kind of a filler, Ive used aura sphere in the past but blissey....This guy is absolutely necessary to the team because of his speed and countering the number one used poke in the uber tier.

    Garchomp @leftovers
    EVs: 252 atk 240 spe 16 def
    Jolly nature
    Sand Veil

    Swords Dance

    This is the spot I've been struggling with. I've had Ho-oh who I like, Rayquaza who I like, and Garchomp who I like, however, I don't LOVE any of the aforementioned like I love my mewtwo set or palkia or arceus. Ho-oh is just to screwed by SR even with regenerator, Rayquaza is slow and frail despite his amazing power, and Garchomp is good, but I just don't feel like I've found the perfect fit for the team yet. I first used the scarf set, but two scarfers isn't usually good and I found that I was only using outrage or earthquake so I decided to go for the subswords set. It's great for whenever my opponent switches in a forretress. I get a free sub and usually a free turn of set up while they put up spikes and then I can 2HKO with earthquake(damn sturdy) and then usually hit something else pretty hard as garchomp has a troll 102 speed. I gave him leftovers to regain hp after he has subbed and 240 speed EVs to outrun timid base 100s like palkia. There aren't that many garchomps out there so I don't really care about losing the speed tie. Hes also great against the few and far between sand teams out there as he can hit excadrill with eq and dominate tyranitar, he also hurts arceus steel and sets up freely against ferrothorn. Only problem is gyro ball from either ferrothorn or forretress usually breaks his sub so unless he gets an OHKO, his sub is usually broken and an easy victim for a scarfed dragon or mewtwo which are very common

    Dialga @leftovers
    EVs: 252 hp 252spdef 4 spe
    Calm nature

    Thunder Wave
    Stealth Rock
    Draco Meteor

    Dialga is alot more specially bulky than most people give him credit. He takes only about 48% from a full hp Kyogre specs water spout and can twave and then draco meteor to cripple the terrible whale. This guy is generally the annoyer of the team and works very well. Although he is listed last on here, he is usually my lead especially against kyogre as most people dont see him as a special wall. He sets up crucial stealth rock and being that he can live almost any hit, he usually gets a twave in which is great in ubers, a tier full of fast offensive pokes. If scarf Kyogre or mewtwo, darkrai, shaymin-s or rayquaza or Ho-oh get paralyzed, they are almost worth less as their speed is now rendered useless and their frailties exploited. Draco meteor is there to hit as hard as he can once before switching out to something that can dominate the paralyzed pokemon. Roar is fantastic as it goes through subs. I prefer it over dragon tail as I can roar away sub seeders and lugia which dragon tail fails to do, also, its seems that dragon tail has about 50% accuracy despite the claimed 90, so I like roar. Dialga can take a sd boosted extremespeed or brick break well enough to twave or roar out extremekiller and only dies to earthquake which not all arceus carry. He is kind of the glue to my team as he can take hits like palkia, but I like to preserve Palkia primarily for taking out kyogre or slower rayquaza locked into outrage or non scarfed garchomp.

    Well, those are the members of my team, so I guess I'll cover the threats and problems that hurt the team.

    -Toxic Spikes really hurt all of my team other than dialga who is immune and sometimes Arceus as he can eat his Lum berry, but if the opponent is a skilled staller, toxic spikes are probably the biggest thorn in my side

    -Extremekiller is a pain as I dont have a ghost and Dialga is killed by EQ. Usually I can kill it with a combination of mewtwo's aura sphere, my own arceus and/or dialga, but usually a pokemon will die and I can often be swept if it comes in at the right time

    -Lugia is such a pain with multiscale. Seriously, the subroost set with toxic or twave or both or whirlwind is just hard to stop, SR helps along with roar and Twave from Dialga. If its raining, Palkia's Thunder hurts it severely along with mewtwo's Ice Beam, but in general, this thing is very hard to take down Despite shadow claw on both groudon and arceus.

    -Scarf ditto. Seriously, this is stupid, I get set up and can sweep many teams, but then a ditto comes in and its GG. I hate this thing and have been seeing more and more of it. Its just a dumb mechanic by gamefreak in my opinion but I have to find someway of dealing with it.

    -Deoxys-A usually kills one of my pokemon and thats about it, but I guess thats what its used for. Focus sash prevents it from being OHKOd by palkia and as a lead its hard to kill it without hurting my team a good bit

    Those are the biggest threats to my team. I guess in general, a very well constructed stall team along with a good battler is what has been my bane, but overall I think I have a well constructed team that deals with many threats, Im not bothered by Kyogre, Zekrom, Reshiram, Darkrai, Shaymin-s, Sand teams, Rain sweepers(kabutops, ludicolo, kingdra), Dialga, Palkia, Giratina, Ferrothorn, Terrakion, and I can usually beat smash pass smeargle without much trouble.

    I am open to any and all suggestions on different pokemon, sets, EVs, and overall strategy, please let me know if there is anything more you would like to know about the team or if I can improve this RMT in anyway. Thanks!!!
  2. Jirachee

    Jirachee scootin
    is a Tournament Directoris an official Team Rateris a Super Moderatoris a Tutor Alumnusis a Community Contributor Alumnus
    RMT Leader

    Sep 24, 2010

    This isn't a bad team but, like you said, ExtremeKiller Arceus can be a real pain, especially those who carry Earthquake (which is most of them anyway). It will be somewhat difficult for it to set up but after it does it will completely wipe out your team in a way that isn't even funny, since your only Normal resist, Dialga, is slower than Arceus and gets smashed by +2 Earthquake. ExtremeKiller is a formidable sweeper as you know, since you use it, and getting a better check to such a popular and dangerous sweeper might be vital to your team's success. Another thing that might be very threatning to your team are Dragon types. since you carry no Dragon type resistance, they will be able to spam their powerful Dragon STAB such as Draco Meteor and Outrage which will always take down something on your team, given how powerful they are (just think of threats like Palkia and Soul Dew Latios.) I think that your team would greatly benefit from changing your Arceus to its Steel forme. Arceus-Steel is an alright check to ExtremeKiller Arceus since it resists ExtremeSpeed, is faster and can cripple it with Will-O-Wisp (Lum Berry is not that common.) Arceus-Steel also gives you a reliable switch in to Dragon STAB moves which is very important when it comes to deal with Dragon if you don't want to be forced to sack something and revenge kill them with Palkia every time. I don't think you lose much in that change since you have plenty of powerful sweepers already and Arceus-Steel will add a nice, reliable defensive pivot to your team, who can sweep on some occasions with Calm Mind.

    Groudon's EV spread isn't very good and you should definetly change it. Investing some speed is great because it allows Groudon to outspeed stuff even when unboosted and some other stuff when boosted, like Choice Scarf Kyogre. 140 Speed allows you to outspeed opposing Rock Polish Groudon, which is excellent. You can still use max Attack to hit like a truck, which is cool, and dump the rest in HP, giving you additional bulk on both side of the spectrum, and given Groudon's already high Defense, HP investment actually makes it bulkier on the physical side, while also helping it take some Special Attacks, so that's a lot more useful than just maxing out its Defense.

    Here's the set you should use:
    Arceus-Steel (open)

    Arceus-Steel @ Iron Plate
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe
    ~Calm Mind

    Good luck!

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