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"V" for Vendetta

Discussion in 'BW OU Teams' started by CedOmega, Nov 28, 2012.

  1. CedOmega


    Nov 15, 2011
    Hello everyone! I hope you enjoy the RMT that I've brought to you today. Its main focus is around the Japanese Christmas Victini, so keep that in mind as you read further. I've only made a tiny change in its standard moveset w/ FusionBolt. I substituted it for BoltStrike, as it provides both more power and a chance of paralysis; pretty nice if I do say so myself. Victini is, in my honest opinion, highly underestimated as a Legendary Pokemon. The fiery rodent has always interested me since its days in OU and on to its now present UU position. It does, however have its faults, such as a weakness to common attacks, like Ground, Dark, Ghost and Water attacks. Rain does not cripple its set, aside from lessening the power provided by V-Create, which can easily be played around in battle. Because of the name, I figured I'd throw some quotes from the movie in that I think suit the Pokemon for fun. “Since mankind's dawn, a handful of oppressors have accepted the responsibility over our lives that we should have accepted for ourselves. By doing so, they took our power. By doing nothing, we gave it away. We've seen where their way leads, through camps and wars, towards the slaughterhouse.” - Alan Moore, V for Vendetta. Without further due, here's the team. Enjoy! ^-^

    Victini@ChoiceScarf; VictoryStar
    Jolly: 252 Attack/ 252 Speed/ 4 Hp
    V-Create, BoltStrike, U-turn & Trick

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    As obviously stated, I started w/ Victini. Why? I love it! The recent Japanese event gave it a few new weapons to add to its arsonal of attacks with V Create, BoltStrike, Glaciate & BlueFlare. Victini is overall a scout for the team. Although its event moves are great, I chose to run a physical scout set, ofcourse. Able to hit very hard w/ V-Create, it is commonly the team's lead. BoltStrike's purpose was fully esplained in the above summary, so there's no reason to cover it, again. Not mentioned, however, is its ability to check some rain teams not prepared for it. I gave Victini Trick as filler, to cripple most walls from doing their job effectively against my team. Scarf was ultimately the best choice when couled w/ Trick. With it, after a V-Create's recoil stat drop, Victini still reaches enough speed to speed tie non-Scarfed Jirachi for a possible KO. Given support, Victini potentially tears through any unsuspecting team.
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    “Everybody is special. Everybody. Everybody is a hero, a lover, a fool, a villain. Everybody. Everybody has their story to tell.” - Alan Moore, V for Vendetta

    Keldeo@Leftovers; Justified
    Timid: 252 SP.Attack/ 252 Speed/ 4 Defense
    Surf, SecretSword, HiddenPower(Ice) & CalmMind

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    Keldeo was the first spot choice when I was looking in to a partner for Victini. Having great synergy and decent typing, Keldeo is the ideal counter to most of Victini's checks and counters. I chose to run HP(Ice) Keldeo to hit Dragons that maybe switch in. All except Salamence...that's when I switch to Bronzong for walling. Surf is its main STAB for power and accuracy. Keldeo also helps defend against Rain teams that counter Victini, resisting Water attacks like opposing Surf & IceBeam(s). I'm also avoiding the SubCM set, as the loss in Hp eventually kept adding up. SecretSword 2HKO's checks Chansey and Blissey, while also hitting other Sp.Defensive Pokemon for hard damage.
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    “Happiness is the most insidious prison of all.” - Alan Moore, V for Vendetta

    Tyranitar@ChoiceBand; SandStream
    Careful: 252 Hp/36 Attack/220 Sp.Defense
    StoneEdge, Crunch, Pursuit & SuperPower

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    The godsend for handling threats like Latios and Latias. Suggested by LucaroarkZ, it serves as a great special wall to take hits from Latios like a Specs DracoMeteor & inneffective Psyshock prediction; which then end with it being revenged by a STAB Pursuit or Crunch. StoneEdge has great neutral damage, while also tearing away at dragons like Salamence, Gyarados & Dragonite. Tyranitar is mainly here for those reasons and to combat weather that could prove to be very troublesome. SuperPower takes care of Ferrothorn, Heatran and Forretress switch ins expecting to set up on T-tar.
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    “You wear a mask for so long, you forget who you were beneath it.” - Alan Moore, V for Vendetta

    Tentacruel@BlackSludge; RainDish
    Bold: 252 Hp/ 236 Defense/ 20 Speed
    Scald, RapidSpin, Toxic & Protect

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    Tentacruel was suggested by Genj4lf over Rotom-W and, after some testing, has done very well on the team. ToxicStalling with this set is easy to play, as even a +4 QD Volcarona can't take it down while stalling. Tentacruel is the team's spinner, and has great synergy w/ Tentacruel and Bronzong. Tentacruel also provides another check to Rain teams, as it can take advantage of RainDish better in battle once it has been set. Tentacruel is also the ideal switch-in to Politoed threats, then poisoning the foe's Pokemon w/ Toxic. Protect was added to ensure its longevity in battle stays in tact when facing a wide threat to the team.
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    “Your pretty empire took so long to build, now, with a snap of history's fingers, down it goes.” - Alan Moore, V for Vendetta

    Bronzong@Leftovers; Levitate
    Sassy: 252 Hp/252 Sp.Defense/4 Defense
    GyroBall, HP(Ice), EarthQuake & StealthRock

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    Bronzong replaced Forretress on the team as the wall. Bronzong's job is to set up SR and then tear down the opposing team w/ GyroBall, HP(Ice) & EarthQuake. HP(Ice) is for Dragons and Gliscor, none of which enjoy taking the attack. EarthQuake handles opposing Steel type Pokemon for a great deal of damage. GyroBall not only grants Bronzong w/ STAB, but also does massive damage to fast foes with 0 IVs in Speed. With a meta centered mostly around speed and power, it becomes an important asset. Bronzong was also a suggestion by Genj4lf, and has been very useful since then.
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    “There's no flesh or blood within this cloak to kill. There's only an idea. Ideas are bulletproof.” - Alan Moore, V for Vendetta

    Garchomp@ChoiceScarf; RoughSkin
    Jolly: 252 Attack/ 252 Speed/ 4 Hp
    Outrage, EarthQuake, StoneEdge & FireFang

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    Garchomp...what to say?! Welcome back to OU, brother. Garchomp is yet another suggestion from LucaroarkZ and has been tested previously on the team prior to being added. Garchomp is an amazing sweeper, as it always had been back in its previous OU days. With an Outrage that outpaces all 101 Speed Scarfed Pokemon, Garchomp is the teams secondary sweeper for when things get nasty on the field. Garchomp can revenge Pokemon like Landorus, Gengar, nonScarfed Garchomp, +1 DD Haxorus, Salamence and Dragonite(After SR or Sand have been set). With STAB EQ, Garchomp can secure a OHKO on all special defensive Jirachi, including those that run Scarf, Magnezone, Infernape, Metagross, Jolteon & Ninetales. FireFang is for those pesky Steel types like Scizor, Ferrothorn & Forretress. StoneEdge serves the same purpose on Garchomp as T-tar's, although it is mainly used as filler.
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    “The ending is nearer than you think, and it is already written. All that we have left to choose is the correct moment to begin.” - Alan Moore, V for Vendetta

    There you have it! I hope you enjoyed reading my RMT. I should give credit where it's due to Ace86 for having given me the Victini. To all those who make a suggestion, I have a couple restrictions, to provide a reason why I should or shouldn't replace a certain member, as most people like to suggest random Pokemon that'd only bring down the team's stability. At any pace, thanks for reading and, again, I hope you enjoyed my RMT. :)

    Threat List:
    Show Hide


    Standard OU Offensive Threats

    • Mixed Attacker – [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Choice Scarf – [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Focus Sash – [​IMG] can scout, [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Offensive Calm Mind - [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Lead -[​IMG][​IMG]
    • Dual Screens - [​IMG]
    • Nasty Plot - [​IMG]
    • Choice Band – [​IMG] [​IMG]
    • Choice Band – [​IMG]
    • Physical Attacker – [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Choice Band / Choice Scarf – This exists? [​IMG]
    • Bulk Up – [​IMG] [​IMG]
    • Sub Punch – [​IMG]
    • Tinkerbell – [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Nasty Plot Sweeper - [​IMG]
    • Choice Specs / Choice Scarf - [​IMG]
    • Shell Smash – [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Bulk Up – [​IMG]
    • Flame Orb + 3 Attacks - [​IMG]
    • Choice Scarf / Band – [​IMG]
    • Life Orb – [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Fast Spiker – [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Dragon Dance – (SR)[​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    • Choice Band – (SR)[​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    • Mixed – [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Parashuffler – (SR)[​IMG] [​IMG]
    • Rain Abuse – [​IMG]
    • Focus Sash – (SR) [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Choice Band – [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    • Agility – [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    • Choice Specs –[​IMG][​IMG]
    • Baton Pass – [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    • Dual Screens – [​IMG] [​IMG](barr HP(Fighting))

    • Swords Dance -[​IMG][​IMG]
    • Choice Band – [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    • Choice Scarf – [​IMG] [​IMG]
    • Substitute + Disable / Pain Split – [​IMG][​IMG] [​IMG](No Sub)[​IMG]
    • SmashPass –[​IMG][​IMG] [​IMG] (before SS)
    • Shell Smash Sweeper - [​IMG](before SS)[​IMG]
    • Choice Scarf / Specs – [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    • Offensive / Bulky Dragon Dance – [​IMG]
    • Choice Band – [​IMG] [​IMG]
    • Choice Scarf – [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Choice Scarf / Choice Band – [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
    • Dragon Dance – [​IMG](At +1 DD)
    • Swords Dance – [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Choice Scarf / Specs – [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    • Air Balloon – [​IMG][​IMG](when AirBalloon has been popped)[​IMG]
    • Mixed Attacker - [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Choice Specs / Scarf - [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Substitute – [​IMG] [​IMG]
    • Expert Belt –[​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Choice Band / Choice Scarf – [​IMG]
    • Mixed Attacker – [​IMG]
    • Nasty Plot / Swords Dance booster – [​IMG] [​IMG]
    • Substitute + Calm Mind / Substitute + 3 Attacks – [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Wish + Calm Mind – [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Expert Belt – This exists? [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    • Choice Scarf – [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    • Choice Scarf / Specs – [​IMG]
    • Calm Mind – [​IMG] [​IMG]
    • Choice Specs – [​IMG]
    • Rain Dance – [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Dragon Dance – [​IMG](At +1 DD)[​IMG]
    • Choice – [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    • Substitute + 3 Attacks – [​IMG] [​IMG]
    • Substitute + Roost – [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    • Substitute – [​IMG] [​IMG]
    • Substitute + Dragon Tail – [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG](When Sub is down)
    • Choice Band – [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Mixed – [​IMG]
    • Choice Scarf -[​IMG][​IMG]
    • Rock Polish / Swords Dance – [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Special Attacker- [​IMG] [​IMG]
    • Choice Scarf - [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Substitute + 3 Attacks – [​IMG][​IMG](When Sub is down)[​IMG]
    • Stealth Rock - [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    • Swords Dance / Rock Polish – [​IMG]
    • Substitute + 3 Attacks – [​IMG]
    • Gravity - [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Choice Scarf - [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Life Orb – [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
    • Choice Specs / Scarf – [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    • Calm Mind – [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    • Life Orb / Expert Belt – [​IMG] [​IMG]
    • Choice Scarf / Specs - [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    • Calm Mind – [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Swords Dance – [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    • Substitute – [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    • Choice Scarf / Specs – [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    • Physical Attacker – [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    • Focus Sash + Endeavor – [​IMG](after SR)
    • Relic Song Mixed Attacker – [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    • Calm Mind + 3 Attacks / Substitute - [​IMG]
    • Stealth Rock – [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Choice Scarf / Band – [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Agility –[​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Stealth Rock –[​IMG] [​IMG]
    • Baton Pass – [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
    • Nasty Plot -[​IMG] [​IMG]
    • All-Out Attacker – [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
    • Choice Scarf / Band - [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Special Attacker – [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Choice Specs / Scarf – [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
    • 3 Attacks – [​IMG] [​IMG]
    • Offensive Trick Room- [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Calm Mind – [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Support – [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Choice Scarf / Specs – [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Support – [​IMG] [​IMG]
    • Choice Scarf / Specs - [​IMG]
    • Dragon Dance – [​IMG](before set up)[​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Mixed - [​IMG] [​IMG]
    • Choice Scarf / Band – [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    • Choice Band – [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Swords Dance – [​IMG]
    • Bulky Swords Dance – [​IMG]
    • Dragon Dance – [​IMG]
    • Bulk Up – [​IMG]
    • Speed Boost – [​IMG] [​IMG](Set Sand)[​IMG]
    • Hazard Lead – [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Baton Pass – [​IMG][​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Life Orb -[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Choice Specs –[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
    • Choice Band - [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Non Choice - [​IMG]
    • Substitute + Swords Dance / Salac Berry – [​IMG](Speed tie race)[​IMG]
    • Choice Band / Choice Scarf- [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Double Dance - [​IMG](Before RP)[​IMG][​IMG](Before SD)
    • Nasty Plot – [​IMG] [​IMG]
    • Agility - *Weak point*[​IMG](Before set up)[​IMG]
    • Choice Scarf - [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Tailwind –[​IMG] (Before set up)[​IMG]
    • Standard –[​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
    • Choice Specs – [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    • Swords Dance – [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Bulk Up - [​IMG]
    • SubPunch - [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Choice Band – [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Choice Scarf – [​IMG][​IMG]
    • MixTar – [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    • Growth – [​IMG] [​IMG](Sand set)[​IMG]
    • Choice Band / Scarf - [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Special Attacker – [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Calm Mind – [​IMG] [​IMG]
    • Swords Dance - [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Offensive Quiver Dance – (SR)[​IMG][​IMG] [​IMG](At +1 QD)[​IMG]
    • Bulky Quiver Dance / Roost – (SR)[​IMG][​IMG]
    • Chesto Rest – (SR) [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    • Substitute – (SR)[​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    Standard OU Defensive Threats

    • Standard – [​IMG]
    • Support – [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    • Tank – [​IMG]
    • Physically Defensive – [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Specially Defensive – [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Support –[​IMG] [​IMG]
    • Utility –[​IMG] (before SS)[​IMG](After +1 SS)
    • Support – [​IMG][​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Calm Mind – [​IMG]
    • Specially Defensive – [​IMG][​IMG] [​IMG]
    • Calm Mind – [​IMG][​IMG] [​IMG](barr HP(Fighting))[​IMG]
    • Standard – [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Physically Defensive – [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG] [​IMG]
    • Specially Defensive – [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    • Tank – [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Substitute + Protect – [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    • Britscor Stallbreaker – [​IMG]
    • Swords Dance –[​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    • Bulky Support – [​IMG]
    • Resttalk – [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Specially Defensive – [​IMG][​IMG] [​IMG]
    • Physical Tank – [​IMG]
    • Specially Defensive – [​IMG]
    • Utility Counter – [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Specially Defensive – [​IMG][​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Support – [​IMG][​IMG] [​IMG]
    • Reflect / Refresh + Calm Mind – [​IMG][​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Stallbreaker –[​IMG] [​IMG]
    • Specially Defensive – [​IMG][​IMG] [​IMG]
    • Defensive –[​IMG]
    • Defensive – [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Physically Defensive – [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Support – [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Choice Scarf – [​IMG] [​IMG]
    • Support – [​IMG]
    • Prankster – [​IMG]
    • Physically Defensive – [​IMG]
    • Specially Defensive – [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Tank – [​IMG]
    • Rapid Spin – [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Defensive – [​IMG][​IMG](@ x2 CM)​

    • Substitute + Toxic – [​IMG][​IMG](When Sub is down)[​IMG]
    • Protect – [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Specially Defensive – [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    • Rest Hydration – [​IMG][​IMG](Sand set)[​IMG]
    • Wish Support – [​IMG]
    • SubSeed – [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Max Speed – [​IMG][​IMG]
    • Bulky – [​IMG][​IMG]

    Standard – [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]

    (Enjoy the Team!)

    Show Hide

    Trait: VictoryStar
    EVs: 252 Attack/252 Speed/4 Hp
    Jolly nature

    Trait: Justified
    252 Sp.Attack/252 Speed/4 Defense
    Timid nature
    -Secret Sword

    Trait: Sand Stream
    252 Hp/36 Attack/220 Sp.Defense
    Careful nature

    Trait: Rain Dish
    252 Hp/ 236 Defense/20 Speed
    Bold nature

    Trait: Levitate
    252 Hp/252 Sp.Defense/4 Defense
    Sassy nature
    -Gyro Ball
    -Stealth Rock

    Trait: Rough Skin
    252 Attack/252 Speed/4 Sp.Defense
    Jolly nature
    -Fire Fang
    -Stone Edge
  2. undisputed

    is a Tutor Alumnusis a Tiering Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnusis a Past WCoP Champion

    Aug 16, 2009

    Got your PM, and since I'm home from school now, I figured I'd stop by and give you a rate. You've got a solid defensive team going right here. Your Pokemon have solid defensive synergy. As long as you dodge some Tricks from a Choice Scarf/Specs Lati@s, Keldeo has a very real shot at sweeping. Victini doesn't really fit on your team, and I think you could use some move-set changes. On the whole, the team looks like a solid start though.

    First, Victini isn't the right choice for a team Scarf user. It doesn't have the coverage to revenge other Pokemon efficiently. It's also weak to Stealth Rock which is pretty problematic. You need a Pokemon that can consistently switch in and threaten to eliminate opposing threats that could potentially get out of hand. I think the best candidate for you would be Scarf Genesect. The Scarf set is basically the ultimate revenge killer in the current metagame. For example, let's say Dragonite came in on Forretress and threatened the Fire Punch KO. If it Dragon Danced instead, you'd probably be in a tough position. With Genesect, you no longer have to worry about set-up Pokemon.

    Next, I think Gliscor's moveset needs a little work. Gliscor is your main physical wall on a defensive team. That means it will be tasked with countering Pokemon like Terrakion or Landorus-t. The set you currently have is inefficient at those jobs. I'd suggest dropping Substitute for Protect and Baton Pass for Ice Fang. I don't think you'll miss the sub-passing that much anyway. Keldeo is typically hard countered, which means you'll be forced to switch anyway. Jellicent could simply out stall Hidden Power Ice even at +6 Sp Atk, and Starmie will switch in and wall you too. Honestly, I'm a bit skeptical how many times you can even pass a Sub successfully, so I think you'll get much more utility out of Ice Fang and Protect.

    Finally, on Chansey, you should for sure use Softboiled / Toxic / Seismic Toss / Filler. The filler can be whatever you want. If you want Wish support, that's a great slot to use. If you want Aromatherapy, that's solid too. It's kind of annoying to stop Gliscor's Toxic though, so I'd be an advocate for Wish in the filler slot. Softboiled in really important because it gives you instant recovery. Chansey is easily worn down through entry hazards, and since Wish takes two turns, a Physical Pokemon like Terrakion could easily keep forcing you out. Toxic and Seismic Toss make up for Chansey's inability to use Special Moves. Since you're playing defensive Chansey and not support, you'll want to build up extra Toxic Damage wherever possible. Thunder Wave would be best utilitize on a slow, bulky offense team with Chansey as a support.

    Good luck!
  3. Asek


    Apr 28, 2012

    Cool team. As undisputed said, jellicent is walling your keldeo, and for that matter is annoying the vast majority of your team. None of your pokemon except for chansey can switch very well into it, and even then taunt stops chansey cold. An easy fix for this problem is to use Hidden Power [GHOST] > Hidden Power [ICE]. You still retain the SFE hit on Lati@s, while gaining the ability to muscle through jellicent. The only targets you really miss out on are Dragonite and Salamence, both of which don't like taking Hydro Pump at all unless its in sun. Considering they are both being beaten by the next change I plan on making, I think they are a non issue

    Now, I thought that SubPass Gliscor wasn't really necessary here. Keldeo doesn't really need to be behind a sub to sweep, as it will be more often than not gone very quickly, only really allowing for minimal set up, and your still getting beaten out on by the same mons in many cases. Considering that you have a slight weather problem, I think you should try out Physically Defensive Hippowdon > Gliscor. Hippowdon is a great Physically Defensive wall with the abilty to pretty much wall the same pokemon as gliscor. Hippowdon has the advantages of supplying you with Stealth Rock as well as a way to make your life against weather easier. Another perk hippowdon has is his abilty to PHaze, and with your teams hazards it can quickly abuse this to rack up entry hazard damage and do some pretty heavy damage to the opponent. You may lose out on a Sub Passer and a Toxic mon, but if you follow undisputed's chansey set then those losses shouldn't be very major at all. Hippow helps your match up with Gene + Duggy sun as well as be a good way to help beat the rare but annoying baton pass teams. Hippow can still wall terrakion and the 2 dragons mentioned previously fairly well, and can Phaze them out accordingly forcing them to take more hazard damage.

    GL with the team
    Hippowdon (open)
    Hippowdon @ Leftovers
    Nature: Impish (+Def -SpA)
    Trait: Sand Stream
    EV's: 252HP/ 4Atk/ 252Def
    Whirlwind/ Earthquake/ Stealth Rock/ Slack Off
  4. CedOmega


    Nov 15, 2011
    Thanks again, Undisputed! You hit the nail right on the head with T-wave. I actually find nearly no time to paralyze the foe at all, so Chansey is definitely going to run the set you listed: SeismicToss, Toxic, Softboiled & Wish.

    With Gliscor, it sets up a Sub at most 5-12 times a battle, I should have mentioned that in the summary. It helps scout the other team when expecting a switch in to a counter. It then gets a free HP gain if already poisoned. For the most part, Gliscor helps Victini evade countering while using V-Create behind the Sub. Landorus-T aren't very much a threat due to Keldeo(assuming non-scarfed variants are at question) & Gliscor being able to scout it(assuming Scarfed and using either U-turn or EQ). The given EVs(revised) in Sp.Defense allow it to survive with at most 70+ Hp from an unboosted HP(Ice) from Naive/Hasty Landorus-T, which give it just enough Hp to set up a single Toxic.

    I'm kinda indecisive about what to do w/ Genesect. I'm thinkinh of keeping Victini since it is the base of the team. I'm thinking more so Genesect>Forrtress. Maybe the RP variant for sweeping. May do well behind a Sub. I used to run Genesect over Chansey before replacing it due to the support gain in Wish from Chansey.

    Again, they're all things I'll test out on the team. Thanks!

    Thanks for the suggestions, Asek! For HP(Ghost) on Keldeo, I pretty much covered that weakness w/ Rotom-W. It really doesn't mind being burn from Scald, nor poisoned from Toxic using variants at times due to PainSplit. It can't really do much to Chansey either, as well as vice versa. The most Jellicent can do to Chansey is poison or burn her, then try to Taunt her, in which time Rotom-W can come in on a predicted Taunt and VoltSwitch back out again.

    I'll use Hippowdon on this team on the side after testing out Gliscor a bit more. Your suggestion are great, though. Thanks! :)
  5. Superpowerdude

    Superpowerdude !
    is a Team Rater Alumnusis a Smogon Media Contributor Alumnus

    Mar 15, 2012
    Hey man i got your request!

    First of all i agree with Aseks suggestion of Hippowdown>Gliscor because your team can have some trouble with weather teams due to your team being weatherless. Sun teams in particular look quite menacing because you have nothing to interupt their chloroohply sweepers abusing double speed. Your team also lacks Stealth Rock which is pretty much suicide in a metagame where Volcrona, Dragonite and Tornadus-T reign supreme. Stealth Rock is supplied by Hippowdon and lets your team halve Volcarona health and break Dragonites Multiscale. Hippowdon does fix a lot of holes in your team so i definatly agree with that suggestion.

    However if you are going to use Hippowdon then you will probally want to use Blissey>Chansey although Chansey does have better bulk, with no Leftovers recovery Chansey is more easily worn down by sand storm the Hippowdon provides and will force Chansey to keep going for Wish to keep itself healthy giving your opponent more free turns. Although its not really a big deal its just fun to know but Blisseys Wishes heal more then Chanseys so thats pretty good.

    On your Rotom-W i suggest an ev spread of 252 Hp / 28 SpA / 228 Sp Def>252 Hp / 248 Sp Def / 8 SpA to garuntee the ohko on standard SubToxic Gliscor with Hydro Pump. The loss of bulk is barely even noticable while being able to ohko Gliscor is always nice. Also I don't really like your Forretress's ev spread sure it provides nice mixed bulk but still Forretres will still get beaten by most powerful special attacks except maybe say a Draco Meteor. Besides you have Blissey/Chansey to take special hits any way. An ev spread of 252 Hp / 176 Def / 80 Sp Def>252 Hp / 144 Def / 112 Sp Def is more benficial for Forretress to give it better bulk while still having some special defence investment.

    Good luck with the team i hope i helped!

    Show Hide
    Show Hide

    Blissey @ Leftovers | Natural Cure
    Calm | 252 Hp / 4 Def / 252 Sp Def
    Siesmic Toss | Wish | Heal Bell | Thunderwave

    Show Hide
    Show Hide


    .252 Hp / 28 SpA / 228 Sp Def--->252 Hp / 8 SpA / 248 Sp Def

    .252 Hp / 176 Def / 80 Sp Def--->252 Hp / 144 Def / 112 Sp Def

  6. CedOmega


    Nov 15, 2011
    Kinda sad how Genesect is apparently banned now. Victini is sorta the star of the team, so it isn't really replacable in my eyes either way. Sorry.

    I'm thinking of going w/ Hippowdon for good, since weather is a prevelant threat. I'm going to change their sets, change Chansey to Blissey and see how it works out. Thanks again, Superpowerdude! :)
  7. CedOmega


    Nov 15, 2011
    With the changes made, a new threat is that Blissey can't really take moves that Chansey could. Also a threat is LeafStorm Celebi w/ T-wave once Blisseyhas been taken down. Any suggestions are appreicated and would help at this point.
  8. Adamant Zoroark

    Adamant Zoroark

    Aug 11, 2011
    I saw this team in its original form in action against my own team that I worked on with Bestow5000. Of course, what immediately stood out in that battle was that the team seems rather Sharpedo weak, but Sharpedo's UU so that's not too big of a concern. However, to me this team seems horribly weak to Salamence and Latios. For Salamence, I just can't see how you can reliably beat it. Hippowdon switches in on Scarf/DD sets easily, but can only phaze in return (so you will lose to last-poke DDMence pretty much guaranteed, even last-poke DDNite tbh) and loses to MixMence. Keldeo's losing to any boosted Scarf or DD Salamence, and Victini cannot revenge kill it. Forretress, your only Steel-type, cannot switch in on Latios's Draco Meteor worth a damn, and Blissey gets eaten alive by Psyshock. Best you can do is Victini's U-turn, but I'm pretty sure it doesn't OHKO.

    The easiest way to fix the Latios weakness is to run a Specially Defensive Tyranitar > Hippowdon. Tyranitar can easily trap Latios and tank Draco Meteors like they're nothing, which essentially removes the Latios weakness altogether. It also helps against Latias, who is similarly threatening, although not as much as Latios. I personally think the standard set with Fire Blast will do you just fine; You already have SpD Rotom-W for Tornadus-T, so Chople Berry won't be needed.

    Salamence is a little trickier to handle without changing the team too much. Normally I'd suggest Porygon2 when a Salamence weakness is this severe, but thanks to Sandstorm that's not an option. Now, I really don't get what Blissey is doing for you. You already have Specially Defensive Rotom-W, and a lot of Special attackers in this metagame have some way to bypass Blissey altogether. I would say at this point that a revenge killer that can beat Pokemon such as Salamence and Dragonite (which Victini cannot do) would help you much, much more. So, I'd like to suggest Choice Scarf Garchomp > Blissey, which does just that.

    All I can think of for now. If this opens up any new holes, let me know. Good luck!


    Show Hide
    Tyranitar @ Leftovers
    Trait: Sand Stream
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
    Sassy Nature
    -Stealth Rock
    -Fire Blast

    Garchomp @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Rough Skin
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
    Jolly Nature
    -Dragon Claw
    -Fire Fang
  9. CedOmega


    Nov 15, 2011
    Thanks for the suggestions, LucaroarkZ!

    Yes. Latios & Mence variants are a threat and, ironic enough as it is, I've been testing ScarfedChomp for the fill in on Hippowdon. Now that I think about it, I'm more of an offensive trainer anyways, so I'll test out having it in over Blissey.

    T-tar has always been my favored SandSetter because of its bulk. Sp.Defensive T-tar seems like it'd be good over Hippowdon on the team. Thanks to a suggestion by Superpowerdude, my Forretress has been able to wall most physical attacks anyway, so having one more special bulky Pokemon on the team helps alot.

    Thanks again for the suggestions, LucaroarkZ. I'll be back in a few days with feedback. I'll make the changes later, however.
  10. ganj4lF

    ganj4lF Nobody is safe from the power of science!
    is a Team Rater Alumnus

    Jun 11, 2011
    Hi, got your request. While the previous raters helped quite a bit, after the changes your team seems weak to Fighting attacks a lot. CB Terrakion can 2HKO everything after SR with just Close Combat (yeah Victini takes 44% minimum from it) and SubSalac is a nightmare if it manages to get the boosts, since it will outspeed and OHKO both Garchomp and Victini, it just needs to get Forretress down to 70% and it sweeps you clean. Your team also currently lacks Stealth Rock, although you probably forgot that while switching around pokes.

    IMHO, that Forretress is the weakest link in some way. It spins and provides Spikes support, but it doesn't have recovery and cannot really wall physical powerhouses like SD Lucario / CB Terrakion / SD Garchomp. Also, while I can see the reason for that, you have two special walls, and Rotom-W has little use if not providing a complete safe switch-in to Tornadus-T. However, changing your team is going to be hard since you still want to retain some hazard control; you don't want your Victini to be worn down by continuous switching around. I'm going to suggest a change which is a little too big for my tastes, but I don't see many other ways to work around your team to achieve what I have in mind:

    Rotom-W --> Specially Defensive Bronzong
    Forretress --> Physically Defensive Celebi
    Garchomp --> Tentacruel

    So, before listing the sets, let me explain my reasoning. Bronzong is added instead of Rotom-W since it covers the role of safe switching into Tornadus just as well, and can provide Stealth Rock. Also, it can handle many Dragons just fine even being Specially Defensive; Salamence relies on Fire Blast to hit Steels (and some sets may even not run it), while Dragonite relies on Fire Punch, that however cannot OHKO at +1, and it won't be happy to take an HP Ice. This somewhat frees the Garchomp slot, which is very useful to avoid putting all the pressure of physical walling and spinning on a single poke. Now, Celebi is added since it can take Fighting attacks easily, while handling all set-up sets of Terrakion without problems, and can take also CB if you predict correctly and avoid X-Scissor. It also retain the ability to take Water attacks somewhat, and provides another resistance to Ground, so it partially substitutes the role previously of Rotom. Thirdly, Tentacruel is added to aid the team with Rapid Spin, while being a complete annoyance for Rain teams and for everything in general. Its weaknesses (Psychic, Electric and Ground) are already perfectly covered by Zong and Celebi, and it provides useful resistances to Fighting (although it cannot reliably take CB Terrakion or the likes), Water, and Bug (VERY useful, with already 3 Psychic types and a Dark one). The set is kinda customizable, I was going to suggest SubToxic since it trolls Rain teams like no other poke, but with Sandstorm damage it's not very effective. A standard Toxic Spikes set is fine, maybe with Toxic instead of Toxic Spikes, seeing how easily those hazards are played around these days (Poison types, levitators, Spinners are everywhere).

    Sets (open)
    Bronzong @ Leftovers | Levitate
    Sassy | 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD | 2 Spe IVs
    - Stealth Rock
    - Gyro Ball
    - HP Ice
    - Earthquake

    Celebi @ Leftovers | Natural Cure
    Bold | 252 HP / 220 Def / 36 Spe
    - Giga Drain
    - Recover
    - HP Fire / HP Ice / U-Turn
    - Thunder Wave / Perish Song

    Tentacruel @ Black Sludge | Rain Dish / Liquid Ooze
    Bold / Timid | 252 HP / 236 Def / 20 Spe
    - Scald
    - Rapid Spin
    - Ice Beam / Protect
    - Toxic / Toxic Spikes

    Hope I helped. Good luck.

    EDIT: Looking back at what I've done, I feel little reason to have Lefties on TTar when you can use CB and retain much of the special bulk with a spread of 252 HP / 36 Atk / 220 SpD. This handles Lati@s as well, but gives your team a little more punch, that could be a problem with only Keldeo as set-up sweeper / hard hitter.
  11. CedOmega


    Nov 15, 2011
    Thanks for the rate, Ganj4lF!

    I really like the set you made for Tyranitar. Although, I do have one question. If I replace Leftovers for CB, should I change FireBlast to FirePunch?

    Bronzong is an interesting suggestion over. It does provide more coverage for the team, so I'm gonna use it in place of Rotom-W to see how it does. Also, Spikes on Forretress is a typo; it was meant to have SR.

    Tentacruel is cool, too. Has some great synergy w/ Bronzong and Victini, too. I've not used one in a real battle since Gen IV, so I guess it's time to test it out again. :P

    Kinda edgey about GigaDrain on Celebi without having any Sp.Attack EVs. Would LeafStorm and U-turn be a good combo for it? I'm thinking more of running LeafStorm/U-turn/Recover/T-wave instead of GigaDrain. Just wondering if it'd be an okay change to the set, maybe.

    At any pace, thanks for the suggestions! I'll test them out.
  12. ganj4lF

    ganj4lF Nobody is safe from the power of science!
    is a Team Rater Alumnus

    Jun 11, 2011
    Nah, just use Superpower instead. You still get the SE hit on Ferrothorn, gain coverage on Heatran, and while not hitting Forretress that hard, Forry is a free switch for Cruel anyway, so that shouldn't be too big of a problem.

    As for Leaf Storm, I don't really like it on a defensive set, but it can work somewhat with U-Turn, since you don't carry any other attack. Just test it and see how it fares.
  13. CedOmega


    Nov 15, 2011
    The team has been edited and is now open to new suggestions.

    Current Feedback:

    Show Hide

    -Original team
    -Tested and didn't work out
    -Changes made
    -Suggested changes
    -Currently on Team

    Genesect: -Banned-
    Gliscor: Replaced w/ Hippowdon
    Chansey: Replaced w/ Blissey
    Hippowdon: Replaced w/ Tyranitar
    Blissey: Replaced w/ Garchomp
    Rotom-W: Replaced w/ Bronzong
    Forretress: Replaced w/ Tentacruel
    Celebi: -Tested-
  14. tehy

    tehy Banned deucer.

    Aug 16, 2010
    I'm aware you answered this already, but you lack HP ghost on keldeo, and you also really lack a way to deal with jellicent, as most of your pokemon are either burned or scalded into uselessness/oblivion. The closest thing to an answer is a tyranitar trap, but a smart player can rather easily just spam WoW on a burned keldeo that's unable to hurt it in SS. It's not fast enough to outspeed jellicents, and it doesn't even have enough attack investment to really mess jellicent up. You could toxic it with tentacruel, but it can just burn him and leave. Victini can bolt strike, but it has to switch in safely as well. In any case, you can just force dragons to outrage, then kill them off with bronzong.
  15. CedOmega


    Nov 15, 2011
    When it comes to Jellicent, I usually just poison it or its switch in using Tentacruel's Toxic. Tentacruel, when facing Jellicent, really doesn't mind the burn; so to speak. Jellicent aren't as common as they once were, and the ones that do appear in battle often are running Scald/Toxic/Recover/Taunt. Not much of a threat since they are also taken care of by T-tar, as you pointed out, due to T-tar outpacing it by just 2 Speed points with no Speed investment on either Pokemon.

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