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VGC 2014 Combinations Thread

Discussion in 'VGC' started by Tobes, Nov 28, 2013.

  1. Tobes

    Tobes 「Cheezum」「Cripes」
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    A discussion thread for synergistic combos between two teammates, and additional teammates who help supplement the pair.

    [​IMG][​IMG]

    [​IMG]
    Gengar @ Gengarite
    Levitate
    Timid 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    - Shadow Ball
    - Focus Blast
    - Substitute
    - Protect

    [​IMG]
    Greninja @ Focus Sash
    Torrent / Protean
    Timid 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    - Hydro Pump
    - Dark Pulse
    - Taunt / Ice Beam
    - Mat Block

    An opening combo designed around getting an active Mega-Gengar behind a Substitute on the very first turn. Gengar Mega-Evolves on the first turn to trap the opponents with Shadow Tag while setting up a Substitute. Greninja uses its signature move, Mat Block, to ensure nearly any non-priority attack is useless on this turn. In a fair number of scenarios, this combo will put the opponent pretty badly on the backfoot, with their first turn more or less wasted and them facing down a Mega-Gengar with a Sub up. Taunt on Greninja can be used to block Trick Room, or you can run Ice Beam to hit Dragons, which would give reason to run Protean.

    This combination is obviously soft to priority moves, so two excellent partners are Talonflame and Amoonguss. Talonflame can block priority with a blistering-fast Quick Guard, and naturally wrecks Scizor and Aegislash with Flare Blitz. Amoonguss is especially brutal. It can draw in targeted attacks with Rage Powder to give Gengar the chance for its initial Sub, and then start putting things to sleep with Spore while they're trapped with Shadow Tag, while Mega-Gengar picks off stuff it has an advantage against. Nasty stuff. Either are fine complementary leads if you think Greninja won't cut it against the opponent's opening.
    Monache and Pocket like this.
  2. TheMantyke

    TheMantyke Larvitard
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    Here's something I've really been enjoying using in battlespot doubles.

    [​IMG]
    Blastoise @ Blastoisite
    Quiet
    Rain Dish
    252 HP / 252 SpAtk / 6 SpDef
    31/x/31/31/31/0
    -Water Spout
    -Aura Sphere
    -Dragon Pulse
    -Fake Out

    [​IMG]
    Aromatisse @ Sitrus Berry
    Sassy
    Aroma Veil
    252 HP / 252 Def / 6 SpDef
    31/x/31/31/31/0
    -Trick Room
    -Heal Pulse
    -Moon Blast
    -Energy Ball

    I've been using these two to close out games and they're pretty good late game. The general strategy is to lead with two Pokemon that can bust big wholes or KO the opponent's water resistant Pokemon (ROTOM), then set up Trick Room with Aromatisse and start Water Spouting things, all the while keeping Blastoise healthy and hitting at maximum power with Heal Pulse. The movesets should be pretty straight forward. Water Spout is the centerpiece with the pulse moves acting as pseudo stabs / coverage. Fake Out helps Aromatisse set up in difficult situations. Trick Room sets up, Heal Pulse keeps Blastoise healthy, and Moonblast is the token attack. Energy Ball probably looks really weird. It's mostly filler since Aromatisse didn't look to have much else to work with and Energy Ball helps soften up any remaining water resists (ROTOOOOM). The EVs on both of these guys are super lazy / not fine tuned to get specific jobs done in the slightest, so feel free to play with them. Blastoise gets max SpAtk and max HP to maximize bulk while with Aromatisse I just went with good overall bulk by giving it maximum defensive bulk with a +spdef nature (read: super lazy).

    As I mentioned earlier, the whole combo is engineered to work late game, so having partners that can kill off bulky Waters, primarily Rotom-W, is really crucial. Your own Rotom-W is cool for dealing with other Water-types while just throwing physical attacks at Rotom-W seems to work okay at taking it down.

    Edit: Also, on the subject of Mega Gengar, here's an interesting combo that almost gave me some trouble initially:

    [​IMG]
    Liepard @ Focus Sash
    Impish? Careful?
    Prankster
    ???
    -Fake Out
    -Encore
    -???
    -???

    [​IMG]
    Gengar @ Gengarite
    Timid?
    Levitate
    ???
    -Substitute
    -Disable
    -Shadow Ball
    -Sludgebomb

    For what it's worth, this combo got the jump on me. Liepard uses Fake Out turn one to give Gengar a chance to go mega / set up a substitute. Whatever Pokemon did get to attack gets encored into that move on the next turn, then disabled immediately after, unable to switch and unable to make any move but struggle. Truth be told, once liepard went down, I was able to set up using the core above in the back and sweep the team because my opponent didn't have much to run off of this idea after liepard, but it's a pretty cute combo and at least warrents a mention for catching me off guard. I'd imagine this could get really scary when Perish Song and / or multiple prankster encore users are thrown in the mix too !_!
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2013
    Allosteric and Pocket like this.
  3. Sprocket

    Sprocket P(n) = 1 - (1 - P(1))^n

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    Let's get the obvious out of the way:

    Garchomp @ Rocky Helmet / Life Orb
    Jolly
    252 Attack / 4 Def / 252 Speed
    Rough Skin / Sand Veil
    -Dragon Claw
    -Earthquake
    -Rock Slide
    -Protect / Substitute

    Rotom-W @ Life Orb / Sitrus Berry
    Modest
    252 HP / 252 Sp.Atk / 4 Def
    Levitate
    -Hydro Pump
    -Discharge / Thunderbolt / Volt Switch
    -Will-O-Wisp / Thunder Wave
    -Protect / Light Screen / Reflect

    Classic DisQuake; Garchomp's Earthquake doesn't affect Rotom, while Rotom's Discharge doesn't affect Garchomp. Rocky Helmet + Rough Skin Garchomp trades offensive power for defensive annoyance (and Garchomp itself is surprisingly bulky even without investment), while Life Orb gives it raw power. Rotom-W can run Discharge to complete the DisQuake combo, or opt for a Thunderbolt for more offensive power on single targe;. Life Orb and Sitrus Berry is a tradeoff between power and longevity. Will-O-Wisp cripples would-be physical attackers while Thunder Wave is there for speed control. This combo has issues with fast ice types, especially Mamoswine, and to a lesser degree Abomasnow. Bulky grass types like Venusaur also give it a hard time.
  4. TheMantyke

    TheMantyke Larvitard
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    Wait, how is Mamoswine much of a problem when you have Rotom resistant to Ice, immune to Ground, and hitting it with Hydro Pump, lol.

    To be honest, I have used Rotom-W and Garchomp together since they're just innately fantastic / top tier Pokemon on their lonesome and I think Disquake as the main selling point to be a bit off. The main selling point, imo, should be that they're just naturally good, bulky Pokemon that hit reasonably hard and require some very specific Pokemon to easily get through. Thunderbolt / Hydro Pump / Will-o-wisp / Protect has been great for me so far and I've run into a lot more situations where I value having Will-o-Wisp / enjoy not hitting my partner with Thunderbolt than wishing I had Discharge for the spread damage.

    As for partners for Rotom-W and Garchomp, Talonflame's pretty sweet. Talonflame's Brave Birds lend the core some helpful priority coverage and a few missing resistances. Really, any of the two of the three are great together and all three are good enough to be splashed onto most teams.
    Eeyore likes this.
  5. Sprocket

    Sprocket P(n) = 1 - (1 - P(1))^n

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    Maybe Mamoswine isn't a counter per se, but it was the only Pokemon with Ice Shard I could think of that can really smack Garchomp. I'll admit I didn't follow through with my thoughts all the way.

    You are absolutely correct that Garchomp/Rotom-W/Talonflame is an amazing trio. They cover each others weaknesses very well, and they have exactly the move pools they need to punch holes in the opposing team. Hell I love leading with Garchomp and Rotom-W just because they are so awesome together.
  6. clarinetist87

    clarinetist87

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    Here's a decently strong opener I've seen around and used:

    Charizard @ Charizardite Y
    Trait: Blaze/Solar Power
    EVs: 4 HP, 252 SAtk, 252 Spd
    Timid Nature
    - Heat Wave
    - Air Slash/Dragon Pulse
    - Focus Blast/Solar Beam
    - Protect

    I prefer the Fire/Flying/Fighting set myself because it gives perfect neutral coverage by itself.

    Venusaur @ Life Orb/Black Sludge
    Trait: Chlorophyll
    EVs: 4 HP, 252 SAtk, 252 Spd
    Modest Nature
    - Solar Beam/Giga Drain
    - Sludge Bomb
    - Sleep Powder/HP Ice
    - Protect
  7. Sprocket

    Sprocket P(n) = 1 - (1 - P(1))^n

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    Here's a fun combo I was thinking of working with, to borrow a page from my VGC2012 team:

    [​IMG]
    Scrafty @ Eject Button
    Ability: Intimidate
    EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 SpD
    IVs: 0 Spe
    Nature: Brave
    -Fake Out
    -Drain Punch
    -Crunch
    -Detect

    [​IMG]
    Aromatisse @ Red Card
    Ability: Aroma Veil
    EVs: 188 HP / 172 Def / 84 SDef / 60 SAtk (or other spread)
    Relaxed Nature
    IVs: 0 Spe
    - Dazzling Gleam / Moonblast
    - Heal Pulse
    - Trick Room
    - Protect

    Scrafty's purpose is to perform a Fake Out against the opposing Pokemon to give Aromatisse a chance to get Trick Room off, while Aromatisse performs the role of Trick Room setter and supporter. Scrafty and Aromatisse themselves are unremarkable, as they've been discussed quite a bit; that said Scrafty is a super bulky version of Hitmontop, who trades higher offenses, a 4x weakness to Fairy, and speed for far superior bulk, immunity to Psychic attacks, and STAB Crunch, as well as Drain Punch to keep it healthy. Aromatisse is your typical support Pokemon, with absurdly low speed (ideal for Trick Room) and decent defensive stats and an absurdly large support move pool. Its ability Aroma Veil also makes it and its partners immune to Taunt and Torment, short of a Mega Gyarados and its Mold Breaker ability.

    The trick to this set are the items Eject Button and Red Card. After Scrafty gets a Fake Out off, it will likely be targeted (or targeted by opposing Fake Out users), and Eject Button will allow you to bring in your trick room sweeper/counter for free; it will also give Scrafty the chance to come back later and torment the opposing team with Intimidate and another Fake Out. Short of a Fairy attack (which Scrafty is 4x weak to), there are few attacks in VGC2014 that can OHKO a standard Scrafty (fewer after an Intimidate too). Meanwhile, Red Card on Aromatisse will force the opponent to switch to a random Pokemon when Aromatisse is attacked (and being a support Pokemon it will be targeted), which will also disrupt your opponents.
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  8. TheMantyke

    TheMantyke Larvitard
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    That seems alright Sprocket, although I feel like it's a bit iffy at points. Scrafty and Aromatisse both have great bulk, but it feels like you're really lacking in offensive prowess, though I guess the switch with the Eject Button remedy that's somewhat. I'm not quite sure a Red Card is the best item for Aromatisse since with Intimidate you kind of want your opponent's -1 Pokemon to stay active. Also, can I ask what Aromatisse's EVs are doing?
  9. Sprocket

    Sprocket P(n) = 1 - (1 - P(1))^n

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    TBH I don't remember. A better set would probably be full 252 HP / 252 SpA 4 SpD or some such. You're probably right about the Red Card though; its still a work in progress for me.
  10. tlyee61

    tlyee61

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    with Intimidate, I would use 252 HP / 172 Def / 84 SDef with a Relaxed Nature

    it lives a MegaCharizard-Y's Heat Wave and a -1 MegaMawile's Iron Head
  11. TheMantyke

    TheMantyke Larvitard
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    Interestingly enough, if my calcs are correct, my really lazy spread seems to be doing both of these, the only difference between the two spreads being mine lacks one point of defense and gains a point of special defense. Sprocket, I might just stick with a default EV spread until you find a big hit you really want to take. You could also play around with X-act's EV applet.
  12. Mr Plow

    Mr Plow

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    I have been running this pair for a while with the Charizard with the Solar Beam and I must say they kick serious butt. The only problem is that Venusaur doesn't get a speed boost until the turn after Charizard mega evolves, so that can cause some trouble. And the main counter to this is Talonflame with his priority brave bird. But other than that they are a good pair.
  13. DDRMaster

    DDRMaster

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    Garchomp @ Yache Berry
    EVs: 4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spe
    Nature: Jolly
    Ability: Rough Skin
    ~ Earthquake
    ~ Dragon Claw
    ~ Rock Slide
    ~ Protect

    Charizard @ Charizardite Y
    EVs: 252 SpAtk/4 SpDef/252 Spe
    Nature: Timid
    Ability: Blaze (Drought)
    ~ Heat Wave
    ~ Air Slash
    ~ Solarbeam
    ~ Protect

    I originally wanted to use Heat Wave Togekiss with Garchomp, but that's not allowed in VGC 2014. Heat Wave Zapdos isn't either, so I ended up with this. The idea is to spam Earthquake, Rock Slide, and Heat Wave for massive amounts of spread damage and the other moves are mostly for coverage. Fire/Ground deals neutral damage to all non-Fliers and Levitators, and Rock Slide hits most Flying types SE, anyway. Focus Blast could be used over Solarbeam on Charizard, but I like not having to rely on a 70% accurate move. You can use other items on Garchomp, but I've found Yache Berry to be very helpful as you can survive many Ice attacks aimed at it.

    Tyranitar can remove your Sun, meaning it effectively walls Charizard and Garchomp won't be able to kill it with Earthquake. Fighting-types like Scrafty and Conkeldurr can take it out. Talonflame can hit both Pokemon with Brave Bird, so Rotom-W can make a good partner to take it down. It can also kill off Water-types that could be difficult for these two to take out, especially if Sun isn't up. Choice Scarf Smeargle can potentially put them both to Sleep with Dark Void, so Talonflame or a Magic Bounce Pokemon can be used to check it. Talonflame can also set up Tailwind to help these two sweep.
  14. Dragonknight!

    Dragonknight!

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    I've been running this:
    Slurpuff @ Sitrus Berry
    EVs: 252 HP / 156 Def / 100 Speed
    Nature: Adamant
    Ability: Unburden
    -Belly Drum
    -Play Rough
    -Return
    -Protect/Thief

    Meowstic (M) @ Leftovers
    Ability: Prankster
    EVs: 252 Def / 252 HP / 4 Spd
    Bold Nature
    - Thunder Wave
    - Reflect/Psychic
    - Safeguard
    - Quick Guard

    This lets me set up slurpuff almost every time. Slurpuff survives most hits with this spread, and outspeeds almost everything after using belly drum and consuming Sitrus berry. The Meowstic protects the Slurpuff, from almost anything with prankster, and supports Slurpuff in it's sweep. Very few things resist Play Rough, and if they do Return usually does the job. Thief is there if Meowstic doesn't have Psychic and I need help killing Megagengar, as this set Some damage calculations with Slurpuff:

    +6 0+ Atk Slurpuff Play Rough vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mega Gengar: 111-132 (82.2 - 97.7%)
    +6 0+ Atk Slurpuff Play Rough vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Mega Tyranitar: 264-312 (127.5 - 150.7%)
    +6 0+ Atk Slurpuff Play Rough vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Mega Kangaskhan: 186-220 (87.7 - 103.7%)
    252 SpA Mega Gengar Shadow Ball vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Slurpuff: 106-126 (56 - 66.6%)
    252+ Atk Talonflame Brave Bird vs. 252 HP / 160 Def Slurpuff: 79-94 (41.7 - 49.7%)
    252+ Atk Mega Scizor Bullet Punch vs. 252 HP / 160 Def Slurpuff: 84-98 (44.4 - 51.8%)
    252+ Atk Garchomp Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 160 Def Slurpuff: 90-106 (47.6 - 56%)
    252+ Atk Mega Tyranitar Stone Edge vs. 252 HP / 160 Def Slurpuff: 106-126 (56 - 66.6%)
    252+ Atk Mega Kangaskhan Return vs. 252 HP / 160 Def Slurpuff: 90-106 (47.6 - 56%)
    252+ Atk Aegislash-Blade Shadow Sneak vs. 252 HP / 160 Def Slurpuff: 42-49 (22.2 - 25.9%)










  15. Camzeee

    Camzeee

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    Talonflame @ Focus Sash
    Ability: Gale Wings
    Adamant
    EVs: 4hp, 252atk, 252spe
    Protect
    Taunt
    Quick Guard
    Brave Bird

    Gengar @ Gengarite
    Ability: Levitate > Shadow Tag
    Timid
    EVs: 4hp, 252spa, 252spe
    Protect
    Substitute
    Perish Song
    Shadow Ball

    Talonflame has one of the fastest taunts and quick guards in the game. Taunt the opposing taunt user and watch it fail. Deals with a huge variety of first turn shenanigans and threatens a Brave Bird on pesky Mental Herb Amoonguss.

    Gengar starts the perish song combo: perish song > protect > substitute > protect/attack > switch out. Down goes the opposing two pokemon with your gengar sitting pretty on 75% health.

    If they run Garchomp turn 1 you could be in trouble, but simply have an ice type in your party like Choice Mamoswine or Cloyster and few people will venture out with it first turn.
  16. Camzeee

    Camzeee

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    Trick Rotom destroys this. I've seen it tried on me in showdown and I just trick them a choice specs and Slurpuff is down to 50% health and is forced to switch out.
  17. Tobes

    Tobes 「Cheezum」「Cripes」
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    Perish Song is illegal until Pokebank hits. Once it is legal though I would be more interested in having Mega-Gengar's partner use Perish Song while it does whatever. Mega-Gengar is still pretty frail, and taking the burden of using Perish Song off it lets it be more productive. For example, Politoed using Perish Song as Mega-Gengar's partner serves a role on a rain team outside of Drizzle and would probably increase the quality of a rain team, and give it more outs to troublesome match-ups.
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  18. chimpact

    chimpact fire nation
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    I'm not sure how effective perish trapping is in doubles. You only have 4 pokemon and Gengar and its partner will be taking some sort of damage before they're forced to switch out on the last turn of perish song and you can really take advantage of that turn.
  19. Mr Plow

    Mr Plow

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    This is honestly a great combination, however some may want to switch the yache berry for a rocky helmet to really hurt physical attackers. Just an option. My only worry is that people may get used to this by the time VGCs rolls around and will be able to counter it easily.
  20. The_Grey_King

    The_Grey_King

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    Trick destroys any set-up sweeper...There really isn't a need to mention it. That said, Meowstic can also run Fake-Out, which is another way to help force through a Belly Drum/Unburden.
  21. Sprocket

    Sprocket P(n) = 1 - (1 - P(1))^n

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    I can just picture a Meowstic Tricking a Lagging Tail on a Slowbro or Slowking on the same turn it uses Trick Room.
  22. DDRMaster

    DDRMaster

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    Lagging Tail makes you always go last, so your Slowbro/king will still move last even in TR.
  23. Sprocket

    Sprocket P(n) = 1 - (1 - P(1))^n

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    That's the idea. Give it to an opposing TR sweeper to completely foil their TR outright.
  24. Zarnick151

    Zarnick151

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    The best combo at any point of the game would have to be

    Noivern @ life orb
    Evs: spa:252 spe:252 hp:4
    Nature: Timid
    Ability: Telepathy
    -boomburst
    -draco meteor
    -dragon pulse
    -air slash

    Exploud Choice Specs
    Ev: hp:252 spa:252 def:4
    Nature: modest
    Ability: soundproof
    -Boom burst
    -surf
    -flamethrower
    -thunder bolt

    Dual boombursts with explouds hitting much harder. You can also use choice scarf to up his speed but, there powers alone just wrecks. And is definatly my favorite combo to do this gen
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  25. RedSpyda

    RedSpyda

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    Here is the leads that ive been using with great success


    Rotom @ Chesto Berry
    252 HP/252 SPD/4 Def
    Bold
    Will-o-wisp
    Volt Switch
    Overheat
    Rest

    Smeargle @ Focus Sash
    Moody
    252 HP/ 252 Speed/ 4 Def
    Timid
    Dark Void
    King's Shield
    Magic Coat
    Baton Pass


    smeargle uses kings shield on fake out users, Dark void to Put both pokes to sleep. Magic bounce is for opposing smeargle/spores/wisps/thunderwave/sticky web that want to status and priority taunt users as it has a higher priority off the bat. Because moody isnt banned in VGC and kings shield acts as a protect i gain a moody boost as well. Baton the boosts away

    Rotom is there to burn physical attackers that target smeargle. volt switch is to scout possible movesets while overheat and rest are self explanitory

    I know I know that smeargle is taunt bait if i mispredict. I tried oblivion wing instead of baton pass but smeargle is too weak and the recovery was not worth it

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