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VGC Ask a Simple Question, Get a Simple Answer - Mark II

Discussion in 'Past Format Discussion' started by Solace, Aug 11, 2012.

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  1. SoulRed12

    SoulRed12

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    Actually...not a bad point. When I rebreed my Kanga for Jolly I might actually go for Inner Focus.
  2. Darkmalice

    Darkmalice Level 2
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    Kang has tight competition for a slot, and it's very difficult to justify a slot for Facade, which will be useless in many matches - not everyone uses burn. It is horrible in 3v3, as once Facade is revealed, your opponent will simply not burn it and take advantage of the fact that you've given up a move for it - either no threat of Fake Out, no threat of major damage with Return/Double Edge gone, no priority without Sucker Punch, and no counter-measure to passive play with PuP. Hammer Arm and Protect are the only non-standard move that I would consider over any of those 4, maybe Substitute too because that's good on most Pokemon and coincidentally also helps against burn.

    If I were to use Facade, I would definitely not replace Return - without Return, you lack the ability to smash things quickly without setup which is Kang's best attribute. Probably PuP, but I still rather not. PuP also helps against burn, as a +2 boost equals out the burn boost for all your attacks - whilst burnt +0 Facade will hit harder, your other moves will still deal half damage.
  3. SoulRed12

    SoulRed12

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    What's a good way to deal with the MGar+Liepard disable/encore leads? It almost feels unbeatable, they both protect first turn, forcing you to choose moves, then Liepard encores and Gengar disables, then next turn they do the same thing to your other mon, and they always target the thing that can KO MGar first. Then Liepard can even switch into something that can set up.

    Is prankster taunt or trick room the only way to deal with it? I guess Quick Guard could also work but I've also seen variants with Accelgor instead of Liepard for a very fast Encore rather than a priority encore.
  4. EtherDrive

    EtherDrive

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    quick guard murders Liepard, but it depends on what you lead with. KhanArtist can Double fake out and then you could run something like follow me on smeargle to give Khan some breathing room against Liepard and take it out, then bring in something to clean up gengar. That's how I deal with it
  5. rcade216

    rcade216

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    Aroma Veil Aromatisse would protect both teammates from Encore, Disable, Taunt, Torment, Attract, and Heal Block.

    Only Aromatisse has this, but I guess one on your team could deter your opponent from using the encore + disable tactic.


    Could anyone tell me which would be better for a Trick Room Clefairy/Clefable, a Sassy Nature or Relaxed Nature?

    I know naturally Clefairy/Clefable are higher in SP.DEF, so Relaxed would make DEF a little more balanced with SP.DEF.
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2014
  6. Empoleon_master

    Empoleon_master

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    Hi, I'm a noob to decent competitive play and I'm just asking if the list for OU/non legendary ubers on the forum makes a good list of pokemon to start breeding for perfect ivs and natures etc for competitive play or is there another, better list? And if there is I know it will be stupidly long so please just message it to me.

    I would like the list so I can go and start breeding perfect ivs out of the pokemon so I can have a decent chance at VGC tournaments after the new season starts after getting trained by the nice people here on how to be decent at the video game.

    Also, links to places where I can read about haved move sets for the Pokemon would be really helpful as the smogondex is only B/W.
    Last edited: Jun 15, 2014
  7. rcade216

    rcade216

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    Looking at the Online Battle results on the Pokemon Global Link can show you like the top 16 most used Pokémon for the battle style you are looking for.

    I try not to follow those top 16, but I find that it is harder to compete when you have a team filled with borderline Pokémon.

    So I have recently added a Tyranitar to my team and this June challenge I will be adding a Salamence.

    The PGL will even show what moves people use on the selected Pokémon.
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  8. Empoleon_master

    Empoleon_master

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    I was sort of looking for a list of about 30+ or so pokemon I could breed the perfect ivs and natures of so if say I needed 6 *blank* natured, perfect ived pokemon that are on that list for example I would have them on hand (Yes I know it will take a bajillion years but hey, It's the long gap from worlds-the next tournaments) and I would just Ev train them right, give them the proper moves and give them the right item and there, it's done and it's ready to kill, kill, kill.

    And I figured the ou/non legendary ubers would be a good starting list as there would be decent for battling competitively. I was just asking if anyone knew of a better list for VGC battles and tournaments etc.
  9. rcade216

    rcade216

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    Looking at the list of the top 16 and then looking at some tournament winners, they are basically Identical. Most teams that finish well have atleast 4 of the top 16 on their team.

    I can't remember the trainers, but this year at these 3 tournaments the winning teams looked like this.


    Virginia
    Mawile-M
    Garchomp
    Ferrothorn
    Salamence
    Rotom-W
    Tyranitar

    Missouri
    Kangaskhan-M
    Talonflame
    Abomasnow
    Chandelure
    Zapdos
    Mienfoo

    California
    Charizard-Y
    Venusaur
    Scrafty
    Garchomp
    Rotom-W
    Gyarados


    You could also check out the Nugget Bridge and their speed tier and compare the speed. A lot of the info in the speed tier can help you design a team to deal with common threats.
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  10. Chipndip

    Chipndip

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    You have to do something that gets rid of Gengar turn 1. Go full tilt on Gengar from the jump is your main bet. Liepard's sashed, and Gengar's the one keeping you there.
  11. Empoleon_master

    Empoleon_master

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    Could you please explain scrafty and mienfoo?
    I thought that they were considered some of the worst pokemon to use. Scrafty's typing being great but lacking just about oh everything else.
    And I don't even know how to say the words "WTF" loud enough on an internet forum to go WTF at mienfoo.

    Anyway thank you a lot for the help, and is this the proper topic to ask a complicated mental process question about competitive battling?

    Also, thank you for the link! :)
  12. Pyritie

    Pyritie

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    Scrafty has intimidate and fake out which are both great in doubles. He's also got good bulk to be able to switch in multiple times (for more intimidates) as long as you keep him away from fairies.

    Assuming he meant mienshao instead of mienfoo, it has inner focus to ignore fake outs or reckless for stronger HJKs (or even regenerator if you want to go that route), and also gets fake out, wide guard, and quick guard, all three of which are great support moves.
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  13. Empoleon_master

    Empoleon_master

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    I was told that I could ask lengthy complicated questions here and sorry for the massive post, I sort of can't hide it under a spoiler via my ipod. :/

    The big reason for why the vgc is so damn hard for me because I can't figure out the answer to this question, ever.

    Say I am battling Dave in a singles battle. My active pokemon will easily deal heavy damage to his active pokemon and this is obvious to both of us.

    Should I predict that he is going to switch into a pokemon that will not only have the move that I am using on his current pokemon deal little damage and then easily ko my current pokemon and I should use a move that would be super effective against what I think he will switch into?

    Or should I predeict that he's predicting that I'm predicting that so he doesn't switch and instead just attacks my active pokemon and my move deals little damage to his active which I thought would be another pokemon?

    Or should I predict that he's predicting that I'm predicting that and he would switch into the pokemon that I thought he was going to switch into in the first place?

    So my question is this, how many degrees of the above is actually useful before it becomes stupid?

    Also, side note if I know my opponent is smart/good at the vgc as a game and beating the crap out of me and my friends in battles after league etc. Would it be a good idea to actually do the stupidest thing that is so impossibly stupid that the opponent would never see it coming? (This has actually turned out to do me well in minecraft pvp, yes, I know "minecraft pvp lol" I just figure that the same logic can be applied for when my opponent is say hiding behind a wall and I can't shoot them, so I do the stupidest thing ever, run up beside them and start attacking with my sword.)
  14. Mymble

    Mymble

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    In general make the play with the highest reward to you, which puts you at the lowest risk. If you don't need to predict the switch in order to win the battle, then don't. In this case predicting the switch has not enough reward to be worth the risk of your opponent staying in. If however, you not predicting the switch will cost you the battle or make it far harder to win, you need to asses the risks of him staying against the risks those of him switching out, and then make the most beneficial play to you. Making stupid plays can confuse your opponent, but then they are just that, stupid plays. Just because your opponent won't see it coming doesn't mean they no longer have the advantage, if your opponent knows they have the advantage they are unlikely to make risky plays as they aren't necessary. In these situations predicting your opponents safest playing and reacting to it, is what you need to be doing. Your opponent will be working with the same logic as you, what is the most beneficial play to me, in order to win this game, you should generally work off your opponent's best play. Predicting predictions based off of other predictions is extremely high risk and almost never worth it. Remember you don't know what four out of the six they have brought or what moves they carry, until your opponent actually reveals what they have, all you can make is assumptions, and assume wrong and you can disadvantage yourself. Generally at the start of the battle making safe plays is the best thing to do as you can, scout out what the opponent has. As the game progresses you can predict more accurately, as you know what the opponent has and how they play.
    Last edited: Jun 16, 2014
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  15. rcade216

    rcade216

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    It is also helpful to write down the Pokémon you see before the battle from your opponent. If you have the setup to use say a Super Effective Ghost attack, does he have a Pokémon on his team that could switch in with an immunity to Ghost or take little damage from Ghost?

    Most people don't like to switch unless they are going to take little damage doing so. Switching out when they know a Super Effective hit is coming into something that would still take a chunk of damage.

    Or you could scout with Protect. Your opponent might switch during your Protect, but that could also save you from attacking with a move that could boost your opponent, like say an Electric attack to Volt Absorb, Lightning Rod, or Motor Drive or Fire to Flash Fire, or Water to Storm Drain.


    I have been doing double battles since X/Y came out, so my single battle tactics might be dated.
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  16. Pyritie

    Pyritie

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    This might help: http://nuggetbridge.com/articles/building-a-foundation-in-pokemon-part-one/
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  17. Empoleon_master

    Empoleon_master

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    Thank you guys
    upload_2014-6-16_17-0-9.png
  18. Empoleon_master

    Empoleon_master

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    I have to ask, is it even worth using pp ups/maxs on all pokemon that you plan on using in tournaments etc.

    I just want to know if it's even worth leveling up 6 ambipombs to level 100(they require 200k less exp to get to level 100 than any other pokemon with pickup) just so I can try to get enough pp ups to max out the pp of all of the moves of my pokemon I plan on using in a tournament.
  19. Mymble

    Mymble

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    Save your PP ups until before tournaments so you know your team, then prioritize moves with low PP like Fire Blast. If you have a surplus you may as well use them.
    Last edited: Jun 17, 2014
  20. rcade216

    rcade216

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    That is situation. I have had moments where I wished I had used some PP UP or PP MAX. Other times most Pokémon don't survive long enough to use all the PP.

    Any move with 5 PP o 10 PP I would say it would not hurt to use a PP UP/PP MAX.

    I have all my level 100 Pickup Pokémon from previous Gens, so I am good there.

    You can get PP UP by spending PokéMiles.
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  21. Empoleon_master

    Empoleon_master

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    Oh, right and this brings me to another question, that I am unsure if I should ask here or in OI.
    Long story short I have two POP ids because there was an issue with the first one, but the first one has my b/w and b/w2 games registered onto it. And I have not used it forever and have since been using my second one for the TGC. (I have not been to any VGC things like ever so don't worry the CP can't be split. I know I can merge the two accounts it just takes months from what I've heard.
    Can I put my pokemon from b/w2 onto pokebank with my pokemon X while having pokemon X registered to my second pop id?

    I hope this makes sense and sorry for any confusion it causes.
  22. rcade216

    rcade216

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    I don't think the account you used for B/W/B2/W2 matters when you are transferring them to a new X/Y account.

    They matter if you sync them on the PGL to gain medals for your Dream World achievements, but pretty sure the account only matters for your current Bank info.
  23. Empoleon_master

    Empoleon_master

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    Thank you so much, now I don't have trade an arm and a leg for pokemon I can transfer from b/w2 in like 5 minutes. :)
  24. Pyritie

    Pyritie

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    I always use them on moves with 5 PP and any recovery moves. I haven't really ran into a situation where I wished I had more than that.

    If you've got a lot of random wonder traded pokemon in your boxes, you can get a free PP Up/Max almost every day from the loto-ID. And they're 500(?) pokemiles each on the PGL -- wonder trading over and over is a good way to rack up pokemiles relatively quickly.
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  25. SoulRed12

    SoulRed12

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    For a life orb mixed Salamence, does it generally prefer Draco or Dragon Pulse?
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