Resource VGC Creative & Niche Pokemon Thread

Jio

welcome back mahmz :]
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#1
OP stolen from Energy who stole & adapted from ginganinja
Approved by blarajan


Pokemon World Championships have come and gone but VGC 16 is still an ongoing metagame and this thread aims to present a platform for any unique sets or niche Pokemon that has popped up over the season. Hopefully the Pokemon and their movesets that are displayed in this thread will allow players to branch out and try out obscure selections for their teams. Not only will this thread cover VGC '16 but also the impending VGC '17 format.

What is a new and creative, good moveset?
  • It successfully pulls off a role and is not strictly outclassed by others.
  • It takes advantage of metagame trends.
  • It has had some success. Post replays / logs to strengthen your case.
What is an underrated, good moveset?
  • It is an existing set that for whatever reason isn't common.
  • Its use is meant to prey on specific facets of the metagame.
  • It might be able to surprise and demolish Pokemon that normally counter the usual sets, but does not become a gimmick in order to do so.
If you post a shitty gimmick, your post will be deleted and infracted, NO EXCEPTIONS. (i'm not that mean--blara)

What are some things that constitute a shitty gimmick?
  • Using a Pokemon that has no business being used in VGC 16, for the sake of using it in VGC.
  • Movesets that are inferior and ineffective compared to existing movesets, or use an obscure move for the sake of hitting an even morea obscure check or counter.
  • Movesets that are utterly impractical or are horribly outclassed by another Pokemon.
A shitty gimmick is not limited to the above, though. To quote Potter Stewart, "I know it when I see it."

Basically, don't be this guy:
Kyogre @ Choice Band
Ability: Drizzle
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def
Adamant Nature
- Waterfall
- Earthquake
- Rock Slide
- Sleep Talk

While Primal Kyogre is viable and all CB Kyogre is cool because it can catch the opponent off guard. The EVs ensures that Kyogre hits as hard as possible while still being able to take opposing hits pretty well. Sleep Talk is so you counter Smeargle.


Rules:
  • NO SHITTY GIMMICKS. The title says it all. They don't add any positives to the discussion and only derail the thread. These posts may be subject to being deleted. Repeated offenses may result in further action. Just because this thread isn't heavily modded doesn't mean its okay to break this rule. (I'M MODDING IT--blara)
  • Make sure the set is actually underrated. There's no need to post a set that everyone and their mom uses. These posts are subject to the same consequences as shitty gimmicks.
  • This is for VGC 16. (The thread will include VGC 17 when the ruleset for that is announced.
  • Multiple replays are now required for new and creative sets.
DON'T JUST LIST SETS, DISCUSS PREVIOUS ONES. MAKE CONVERSATION WITH YOUR FELLOW SET POSTERS -- blara
 
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#3
I SAID I WOULD DO IT SO HERE I COME!

003-mega.png


Venusaur @ Venusaurite
Ability: Chlorophyll
Level: 50
EVs: 180 HP / 100 Def / 60 SpA / 132 SpD / 36 Spe
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Sleep Powder
- Grass Knot
- Sludge Bomb
- Protect

Chrolophyll + Sleep Powder has been a combo that people have looked forward for a lot of time. Naturally, many Grass-type Pokemon get this combo, but every one of those Grass-types have an unique feature that let it shine over the rest. Mega Venusaur is one of those for a simple reason: It's extremely bulky.

Venusaur, on Primal Groudon archetypes, works extremely similar to what it did back on sun teams in 2015. It's a useful Chrolophyll + Sleep Powder abuser, stopping Pokemon like Xerneas, Salamence and Smeargle on their tracks, while also acting as a possible Mega Evolution if the match-up requires. Mega Venusaur excels at both the Xerneas + Groudon match-up and at the Dual Primals match-up, being capable of even benefitting from the opponent's Harsh Sun to spam Sleep Powder while also being able to 2HKO Groudon / Kyogre with Grass Knot in the mega form. However, like Grass-types usually do, it struggles badly against Rayquaza, Salamence, Talonflame and every single Steel-type in the metagame, so partners capable of taking care of it are required and appreciated.

This EV spread was a re-work of Guru Fernandez's VGC'15 Mega Venusaur spread, with enough speed to outspeed Scarf Smeargle and the rest distributed in bulk. I can't say the spread is 100% optimized for this metagame yet, but it definitely works.
 

ethan06

⋖(☼┆☼)⋗
is a Community Contributor Alumnus
#4
my time has come


Magnezone @ Life Orb
Ability: Analytic
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 12 Def / 244 SpA
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Flash Cannon
- Thunderbolt
- Magic Coat
- Protect

I came top 16 at my local regionals with this set on Mega Gengar RayOgre, which isn't an incredible feat but serves as at least a proof of concept. This Pokémon hits extremely hard, but is extremely slow: if it makes it through a turn, chances are something is going down. Here's a small list of calcs to illustrate my point:

244+ SpA Life Orb Analytic Magnezone Thunderbolt vs. 4 HP / 0- SpD Mega Salamence: 173-204 (101.1 - 119.2%)
244+ SpA Life Orb Analytic Magnezone Thunderbolt vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Mega Kangaskhan: 142-169 (78.4 - 93.3%)
252 Atk Parental Bond Mega Kangaskhan Low Kick (100 BP) vs. 252 HP / 12 Def Magnezone: 148-176 (83.6 - 99.4%)
244+ SpA Life Orb Analytic Magnezone Flash Cannon vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Raichu: 77-90 (56.6 - 66.1%)

244+ SpA Life Orb Analytic Magnezone Flash Cannon vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Mega Manectric: 75-90 (51.7 - 62%)
244+ SpA Life Orb Analytic Magnezone Flash Cannon vs. +2 4 HP / 0 SpD Xerneas: 133-156 (65.8 - 77.2%)
244+ SpA Life Orb Analytic Magnezone Flash Cannon vs. 236 HP / 12 SpD Togekiss: 221-265 (116.3 - 139.4%)
244+ SpA Life Orb Analytic Magnezone Thunderbolt vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Ho-Oh: 198-234 (92.9 - 109.8%)
244+ SpA Life Orb Magnezone Thunderbolt vs. 244 HP / 188+ SpD Bronzong: 75-90 (43.3 - 52%)
244+ SpA Life Orb Analytic Magnezone Thunderbolt vs. 244 HP / 188+ SpD Bronzong: 99-117 (57.2 - 67.6%) (under tr)
244+ SpA Life Orb Analytic Magnezone Thunderbolt vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Mega Gengar: 148-175 (109.6 - 129.6%)
244+ SpA Life Orb Analytic Magnezone Flash Cannon vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Landorus-T: 153-181 (92.7 - 109.6%)
244+ SpA Life Orb Analytic Magnezone Flash Cannon vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Primal Groudon: 69-82 (33.3 - 39.6%)
244+ SpA Life Orb Analytic Magnezone Flash Cannon vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Mega Rayquaza: 126-149 (69.6 - 82.3%)


Obviously, Talonflame, Crobat, Yveltal and all the other prevalent Flying-types are immediate write-offs if they're not supported by Delta Stream or Lightning Rod. This Magnezone pairs well with Primal Kyogre, which beats Groudon and shields Magnezone from Mence, Talon and Ho-oh's Fire coverage to virtually guarantee a free hit. It was a huge asset against Big 6 during my season, as it served as a fantastic counter lead to dogdeer and khanartist thanks to the unexpectedness of Magic Coat, and any lead involving Talon or Mence when next to Kyogre. It more or less countered the meta outside of Groudon, Dialga, Ferrothorn and maybe Bronzong and destroyed RayOgre teams where Lightning Rod wasn't present. It requires some support but pays dividends if Groudon is well covered and you have counterplay for opposing Steels in Pokémon like Hitmontop or Infernape. This spread is the one I used, but 220 HP / 36 Def / 252 SpA affords you that one extra point of offensive power while still guaranteeing that you take one Kangaskhan Low Kick.

Because I'm paranoid about the shitty gimmick rule, even though I'm certain this thing has a unique niche in terms of hole-punching, here's a small bank of replays featuring me practicing with Magnezone on the ladder:

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/vgc2016-379176656 (magnezone cleans)
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/vgc2016-362497588 (the big 6 matchup)

because the flawless showdown replay system has eaten most of the older replays, here's one from the cart, once again showcasing Mag versus big 6:

RPHG-WWWW-WW4R-9WMH
 
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blarajan

Rest in Bling
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VGC Co-Leader
#5
Sableye @ Focus Sash
Ability: Prankster
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Icy Wind
- Fake Out / Will-O-Wisp
- Quash
- Feint / Will-O-Wisp

The intended partner is something like Eruption Groudon / Water Spout Kyogre. The point is that max Speed +Spe nature Sableye hits 112, which lets it outrun Kangaskhan and Yveltal after an Icy Wind. Accordingly, you can Quash them before Sucker Punch goes off, cause Sucker Punch to fail, and use Eruption or Water Spout without taking the hit and losing damage. Since you need max Speed to do that, I gave it a Focus Sash as Sableye isn't even that bulky with bulk anyways. Max Special Attack offers slight chip to guarantee the kill against Kangaskhan with Eruption after Icy Wind. The chip is weirdly important even if miniscule, and a Focus Sash is the preferred item anyways so I chose Naive. Besides Icy Wind and Quash, the other moves are preference. I like Feint / Fake Out but Sableye has a ton of support options so you can choose.

Zapdos @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Static
Level: 50
EVs: 20 HP / 232 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 Def / 30 SpA
- Thunderbolt
- Hidden Power [Water]
- Substitute
- Tailwind

Basically, at this point in the metagame I wanted to use 4 move Thundurus (Thunderbolt/Taunt/Hidden Power Water/Thunderbolt). Unfortunately, that's Fake Out bait and as such weak to Kangaskhan / Smeargle, and I wasn't comfortable with that. I immediately looked at Zapdos, which is both bulkier than Thundurus but also has Static, which makes Kangaskhan less willing to Fake Out it. I created the equivalent set with Zapdos, Thunderbolt/HP Water/Tailwind (speed control like Thunder Wave) and then added SUBSTITUTE (Smeargle response like Taunt) and it was clutch at Worlds. It makes you a great response to Smeargle/Salamence leads and was really great at blocking TR. It also gave you discretion in terms of Static, as sometimes you don't want your opponent to get paralyzed (like when you're trying to burn them). The Special Attack evs OHKO standard bulky Groudon in rain with HP Water.

Groudon-Primal @ Red Orb
Ability: Desolate Land
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Mild Nature
- Precipice Blades
- Eruption
- Overheat
- Protect

sooooooo strong. I wanted my Groudon to outrun Smeargle, I wanted Eruption because it's so strong, I still wanted Precipice Blades because it's the best move Groudon has, and I wanted Overheat because it OHKOes everything. Hence, Mild Groudon. Overheat from Groudon + Sludge Bomb from Gengar or Thunderbolt from Zapdos killed glass Cresselia, which was cool. This Groudon did everything I wanted at Worlds.

Smeargle @ Chesto Berry
Ability: Moody
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 68 Def / 188 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 26 Spe
- Dark Void
- Wide Guard
- Crafty Shield
- King's Shield

Really cool Smeargle set that deals with Kangaskhan / Smeargle leads effectively. King's Shield Chesto Berry lets you King's Shield on Kangaskhan Fake Out, drop its attack, and then eat the Dark Void. That neuters Kangaskhan, and then Crafty Shield in following turns protect your partner from future Dark Voids. The EVs live -2 Kangaskhan Double-Edge and 252 SpA Xerneas Moonblast.
 
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#6

Clefairy (M) @ Eviolite
Ability: Friend Guard
Level: 50
EVs: 172 HP / 252 Def / 84 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Encore (/ Icy Wind / After You)
- Helping Hand
- Follow Me
- Protect

I've had the little guy on my team for pretty much all of the 2016 season.
Things I did with it:
- 2 times Regional Top 4
- National Top 16
- 4-3 40th place Worlds Day 2

If you want to see it in action, you can watch my Top 16 match at the German National Championship as well as some videos on my own channel such as my International Challenge June highlight videos.

Clefairy is best used on teams that feature set up moves, in my case that would be Swords Dance on Rayquaza, as well as being a good partner in general for both Primals, as Clefairy is capable of shielding them from harm in several ways.
First you have Follow Me, which in Groudon's case means that you'll be able to redirect Earth Power from opposing Groudon, and your Kyogre will be safe some Thunders and strong physical attacks such as Kangaskhan's Double-Edge.
But what sets Clefairy apart from other redirection users is Friend Guard, which is an excellent ability to have on a team in this format, with strong spread moves such as Precipice Blades, Eruption, Water Spout, Origin Pulse and +2 Dazzling Gleam being extremely common.
Protect is a staple and very important for Clefairy as you want it to stay on the field as long as possible because of Friend Guard.
I chose Encore as my last move to have some interesting counter-play options against teams that rely heavily on Trick Room or choose to use their Trick Room option against you. You can also pull of neat little tricks, such as locking Xerneas into Geomancy or Kangaskhan into Fake Out.

There's also several other move options for the Encore slot, depending on what your team needs. Icy Wind and After You are the big ones, the first giving you additional speed control on your team and a way for Clefairy to break Sashes or finish off extremely weakened opponents, while After You can be a solid option if your team has access to Trick Room. Magic Coat is also an option, but I don't think very highly of the move, so I don't really recommend it.
 

Level 51

Oniichan of all imoutos
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Moderator
#7
Clefairy is really really cute and adorable and I used it on my team to win Singapore Nationals, which may or may not mean anything. It picked up one (1) KO along the way. Here's the spread I used:

Clefairy @ Eviolite
Ability: Friend Guard
Level: 50
EVs: 244 HP / 100 Def / 164 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Follow Me
- After You
- Helping Hand
- Protect

Clefairy is like :ok_hand: :ok_hand: :ok_hand: :ok_hand: :ok_hand: :fire: :fire: :fire: next to bulky Xerneas, which I used, since you can pile on even more pseudo-bulk with Friend Guard to manipulate your damage rolls vs Primals / other Xerneas / etc heavily into your favour without having to sacrifice power on a Bold Nature. This particular spread survives a Moonblast from +2 252 Timid Xerneas, which I think I actually played against 0 of since my Groudon kept outrunning everything, so that's a shame ahhh

I chose this set because I figured TR would be pretty common at Nationals so I wouldn't have much use for Icy Wind, and I also thought After You would be pretty flames against lame Double (Dual?) Primals TR and stuff, but in the end the one Bronzong I faced just kept firing blind Hypnosis at my Pokemon so I was kind of forced to use Follow Me a lot of the time. Moral: if you're playing against lucky players just use Heal Pulse or Icy Wind or Encore or something instead. I also thought Helping Hand would be pretty good, and it was in practice, especially when you get that $ick ca$h HH Double Edge off against a Kyogre or something and it just disappears. Again though at the event this never really happened since I actually played some people who were good at Pokemon (unfortunate). Could be better though now that half the people you will run into at your live PCs will be running Wolfe's / Markus' team, so you can OHKO the Raichu or something? Long story short though, in the right circumstances Clefairy is really really good for all the reasons mentioned earlier. I think it probably also fits onto Dual (Double?) Primals pretty well (though I haven't tried that specifically) since it lets you manipulate your damage calcs against opposing Two (Duplo?) Primals teams. If you have a PC without a team planned for it you should totes bring Clefairy, plus it earns you free style points!
 

Kaori

Shall I take you to a place in town where wishes come true?
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Moderator
#8

Reshiram @ Life Orb
Ability: Turboblaze
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Blue Flare
- Draco Meteor
- Safeguard
- Protect

Basically the niche here is being an uber for Big B teams that aren't reliant on the Xerneas and instead want to tech for the mirror. Reshiram KO's Bronzong through Heatproof, Safeguard on Smeargle, chunks Groudon for a ton with Draco, and sun boosted Blue Flare KO's slow bulky Xerneas. I tested this pretty heavily prior to Worlds, it's pretty restricted to one team composition but it fills the niche well there. Pair with Timid Chesto Berry HP Ice Thundurus as your 6th for best Big B results.

Calcs

252 SpA Life Orb Turboblaze Reshiram Draco Meteor vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Primal Groudon: 175-208 (99.4 - 118.1%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO
252 SpA Life Orb Turboblaze Reshiram Draco Meteor vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Assault Vest Mega Rayquaza: 218-257 (120.4 - 141.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Life Orb Turboblaze Reshiram Blue Flare vs. 244 HP / 188+ SpD Bronzong: 218-260 (126 - 150.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Life Orb Turboblaze Reshiram Blue Flare vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Yveltal: 164-192 (81.5 - 95.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Life Orb Turboblaze Reshiram Blue Flare vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Dialga in Sun: 242-286 (116.9 - 138.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Life Orb Turboblaze Reshiram Blue Flare vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Xerneas in Sun: 243-289 (104.2 - 124%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Life Orb Turboblaze Reshiram Blue Flare vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Yveltal in Sun: 243-289 (120.8 - 143.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Life Orb Turboblaze Reshiram Blue Flare vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Thundurus: 192-227 (123.8 - 146.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Replays
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/vgc2016-412384214
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/vgc2016-412427841
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/vgc2016-413566993

hi my name is samvgc and i posted a replay with a lumineon in it to prove a point :D

hi my name is blarajan and i leave mean edits on peoples posts :D
 
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#10

Reshiram @ Life Orb
Ability: Turboblaze
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Blue Flare
- Draco Meteor
- Safeguard
- Protect

Basically the niche here is being an uber for Big B teams that aren't reliant on the Xerneas and instead want to tech for the mirror. Reshiram KO's Bronzong through Heatproof, Safeguard on Smeargle, chunks Groudon for a ton with Draco, and sun boosted Blue Flare KO's slow bulky Xerneas. I tested this pretty heavily prior to Worlds, it's pretty restricted to one team composition but it fills the niche well there. Pair with Timid Chesto Berry HP Ice Thundurus as your 6th for best Big B results.

Calcs

252 SpA Life Orb Turboblaze Reshiram Draco Meteor vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Primal Groudon: 175-208 (99.4 - 118.1%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO
252 SpA Life Orb Turboblaze Reshiram Draco Meteor vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Assault Vest Mega Rayquaza: 218-257 (120.4 - 141.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Life Orb Turboblaze Reshiram Blue Flare vs. 244 HP / 188+ SpD Bronzong: 218-260 (126 - 150.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Life Orb Turboblaze Reshiram Blue Flare vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Yveltal: 164-192 (81.5 - 95.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Life Orb Turboblaze Reshiram Blue Flare vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Dialga in Sun: 242-286 (116.9 - 138.1%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Life Orb Turboblaze Reshiram Blue Flare vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Xerneas in Sun: 243-289 (104.2 - 124%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Life Orb Turboblaze Reshiram Blue Flare vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Yveltal in Sun: 243-289 (120.8 - 143.7%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Life Orb Turboblaze Reshiram Blue Flare vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Thundurus: 192-227 (123.8 - 146.4%) -- guaranteed OHKO

Replays
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/vgc2016-412384214
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/vgc2016-412427841
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/vgc2016-413566993

hi my name is samvgc and i posted a replay with a lumineon in it to prove a point :D

hi my name is blarajan and i leave mean edits on peoples posts :D
God damn that damage is just unreasonable
 

Jio

welcome back mahmz :]
is a Tutoris a Forum Moderatoris a Contributor to Smogon
VGC Co-Leader
#12

Persian-Alola @ Assault Vest
Ability: Fur Coat
EVs: 156 HP / 12 Def / 4 SpA / 84 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Fake Out
- Foul Play
- Feint
- Snarl

Think I'll revive this thread with the first 17' submission. Assault Vest Alola-Persian is one of the first things I really wanted to try when the format started because I thought its move pool, typing, ability, and stats all complimented each other really well for what role it was meant to play. The idea is to turn tight situations into your favor with the help of Fake Out and Feint as well as getting some proper damage control in Snarl. Foul Play rounds out the set by giving you good consistent damage against the majority of the format (it 2hkos Garchomp most of the time). The HP and SpDef allows you to survive a spread Life Orb Dazzling Gleam from Tapu Koko while the Def and SpAtk are filler.

Alola Persian was a solid Pokemon that I brought to the NJ PC and I would fully recommend it to anyone that needs a fast Fake Out user with stellar team support.
 
#13
Milotic @ Red Card
Ability: Competitive
EVs: 252 HP / 36 SpA 220 SpD
Calm Nature
- Scald
- Ice Beam
- Recover
- Protect

Milotic's competitive is a fantastic ability in the current meta. Just the possibility of a Milotic is enough to neuter Arcanine, and Milotic can heavily punish Gyarados / Garchomp leads. Red Card is included, in particular, for Garchomp, as his Earthquakes will get him benched. Red Card also screws with Tapu Koko pretty heavily, and if Milotic is run alongside Arcanine it can surprise an enemy's physical attacker quite a bit to be dragged into an intimidate.

252 HP and 220 Sp Def allows Milotic to tank two hits from Tapu Koko's Thunderbolt before recovering. As a result of this, Milotic actually wins a hypothetical 1v1 with Tapu Koko, as Scald is also a guaranteed 3HKO (and at 44-48% damage it's 2HKO if he's been chipped) and you can pop Recover in the midst.

Scald is the obvious choice for water STAB, as burns are a pretty nice aside. It's 2HKO on Tapu Koko after hail damage, and OHKOs Arcanine and Torkoal, who might just eat that Scald on a switch from Red Card. Ice Beam 2HKOs Garchomp, and ice coverage is always a solid choice. Recover and Protect are fairly self-explanatory, as Milotic's special tank will keep it on the field for a long time.

Pairs particularly well with a solid physically bulky attacker like Metagross, Celesteela or Arcanine. A Milotic / Ninetales-A lead can be great for completely shutting down Intimidate strategies, as well as for fighting off weather.
 
#14

Persian-Alola @ Assault Vest
Ability: Fur Coat
EVs: 156 HP / 12 Def / 4 SpA / 84 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Fake Out
- Foul Play
- Feint
- Snarl

Think I'll revive this thread with the first 17' submission. Assault Vest Alola-Persian is one of the first things I really wanted to try when the format started because I thought its move pool, typing, ability, and stats all complimented each other really well for what role it was meant to play. The idea is to turn tight situations into your favor with the help of Fake Out and Feint as well as getting some proper damage control in Snarl. Foul Play rounds out the set by giving you good consistent damage against the majority of the format (it 2hkos Garchomp most of the time). The HP and SpDef allows you to survive a spread Life Orb Dazzling Gleam from Tapu Koko while the Def and SpAtk are filler.

Alola Persian was a solid Pokemon that I brought to the NJ PC and I would fully recommend it to anyone that needs a fast Fake Out user with stellar team support.
I really like this set. However, I changed it a little bit and got rid of the Assault Vest because Taunt is a really valuable move (at least, for my team since Celesteela is a pain in the behind with Leech Seed and Substitute). I'm going to test it a bit, replacing Foul Play with Taunt but I wanted to note that Persian survives that Dazzling Gleam you mentioned WITHOUT the Assault Vest, though it becomes much closer to a KO.

Here's the calc without the Vest:

252 SpA Life Orb Tapu Koko Dazzling Gleam vs. 156 HP / 84 SpD Persian-Alola: 133-159 (83.1 - 99.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

And here it is with it:

252 SpA Life Orb Tapu Koko Dazzling Gleam vs. 156 HP / 84 SpD Assault Vest Persian-Alola: 88-109 (55 - 68.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Since you gain the ability to use status moves, Protect will need to be put somewhere on the set unless you're feeling gutsy. I'd probably get rid of Feint. Beyond that, I kept the EVs the same. Persian hits a really good Speed tier, capable of outspending Alolan Ninetales before it can use Aurora Veil and Gengar before it can do some of its crazy shenanigans (as well as Snarl it to reduce the damage of its incoming Special moves).

For the item, I decided to replace it with a Focus Sash since I just got wrecked by a Scarf Tapu Lele.
 
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#15
I thought I'd post about something I've been having a lot of fun testing recently. By no means am I saying this isn't being used or that it is original, but I do think in general Aerodactyl isn't seeing as much usage as I believe it deserves.


Aerodactyl @ Focus Sash
Ability: Pressure
Level: 50
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Rock Slide
- Wide Guard/Taunt/Roar
- Tailwind
- Sky Drop

Being one of the only truly viable tailwind setters in the format besides Pelipper and at a bit of a stretch Whimsicott, as well as the few viable rock types besides Gigalith and at a stretch Nihilego, I feel Aerodactyl has some massive draws as a utility lead. The first and most straightforward of which is a fast Rock Slide. In previous formats Rock Slide was often said to be the best move in the game due to its great flinch chance when factoring in both targets. While it is less common this year, it is still just as useful as ever for breaking sashes, fishing for flinches and picking off heavily weakened Pokemon. Wide Guard allows Aerodactyl to protect its partner from the plethora of spread moves in this format, such as Discharge, Dazzling Gleam, EQ, Blizzard and Eruption/Heat Wave, while also protecting itself ensuring that you at least survive from your Focus sash if your opponent expects the spread damage to finish you off. Taunt is predominantly used to prevent Trick Room being set up by P2, as well as preventing their recovery/toxic stall. It is also useful in preventing sub+seed Celesteela from stalling you out. On the other hand, Roar can be used to guarantee that you prevent Trick Room from Mental Herb Oranguru, as well as being useful versus set up mons such as Z-stockpile Gastrodon/Araquanid or Sub+Calm Mind Tapu Fini. Tailwind is here obviously for speed control, though granted it isn't used all that much. Often times I have found that the threat of Tailwind was better than actually using the move. Still, with so little speed control in the format tailwind can be huge in setting up a win condition. And finally Sky Drop, my favourite part of the moveset. The fact that Sky Drop can just cock block a Pokemon for a turn is huge, but the fact that they can't Protect or switch the next turn is huge. I love pairing it with some kind of nuke option, such as Z moves or terrain/choice item boosted STAB moves. Considering how fast Aerodactyl is, I often have my say on what I want gone for the turn, allowing my partner to focus on its target and then have a pretty much guaranteed KO the next turn.

The spread is straight forward enough, though max speed really does take advantage of the fact that seemingly very few Tapu Koko are max speed nowadays, making it pretty much faster than the entire unboosted metagame. Something that hasn't come in to play yet and I'm not sure about the mechanics of but what I imagine should work in theory is that its ability Pressure coupled with its fast speed should allow you to check whether or not an opposing Tapu Lele is scarfed depending on if their terrain goes off before your Pressure, but I'm not sure if terrains go off before other abilities so I'd like confirmation on that.

I've personally been testing this set with a bulky specs Tapu Lele, in my opinion the epitome of a nuke and one that really appreciates the speed control. It is slow enough to deny opposing Tapu Koko leads the terrain advantage and just puts a dent into anything unresisted. It can just delete opposing Tapus, or at the very least 2HKO Bulu outside of psychic terrain, as well as things like Arcanine, Gastrodon, Milotic (especially after a Sky Drop) and clean 2HKO any P2 in psychic terrain. But enough about that, really it can work with all sorts of things that love getting off guaranteed damage, value speed control and appreciate Wide Guard support, which tbh seems pretty damn broad to me.
 
#16
Sorry for the double post (though my last post was a decent while ago and this thread is pretty dead). I just wanted to share a pretty cool tech for Muk's fairly underwhelming 3rd moveslot, something that I believe deserves a bit more usage on certain teams.


Muk-Alola @ Figy Berry
Ability: Gluttony
Level: 50
EVs: 188 HP / 244 Atk / 44 Def / 20 SpD / 12 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Poison Jab
- Knock Off
- Flamethrower
- Protect

Flamethrower Muk. Literally only there to hit Kartana, but with everybody and their dad running Kartana as their Fini/Gastro check nowadays I feel like it is worth the moveslot on certain teams. While AV is certainly a popular option, Focus sash and generally no bulk variants are still the most popular variants of Kartana, making up roughly 60% of all Kartana spreads on the most recent Showdown usage statistics. This tech capitalises on the fact that Kartana feels relatively safe when faced against Muk (it's not a great matchup but it's not awful). No bulk AV variants get clean OHKO'd by uninvested Flamethrower (and therefore any other no bulk variants do also, with sash variants being brought down to their sash).

0- SpA Muk-Alola Flamethrower vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Assault Vest Kartana: 136-164 (101.4 - 122.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO

The spread is simply the exact same as PokeAlex's spread, but this tech can be slot on to any Muk set. Running a Brave nature adds about 11% more damage to bulky AV sets, not really affecting the calcs all that much. Brave should only be run if a lower speed is required for the team for some other reason.

I feel placed on a team which appreciates another way of dealing with Kartana, where alternatives like Shadow Sneak and Curse aren't required this set could really thrive. Partners like Tapu Lele certainly appreciate Kartana's absence, while Shadow Sneak is made unusable in Psychic terrain. Hail and sand setters can be useful to break Kartana's sash before clicking Flamethrower, while also generally having a fairly poor matchup with Kartana themselves.

I would like to stress that Flamethrower is ONLY to be used on Kartana. It does nothing to anything else in the format and is only strong against Kartana due its pitiful special defence and 4x weakness, and even then bulky AV variants aren't OHKO'd by it. If your team is very comfortable against Kartana and can make use of the alternatives, Flamethrower is almost certainly not the best option.
 
#17
Not sure if ya'll are gonna like this, but I will post it anyway! I think it's a interesting way to use a interesting Pokémon

Pheromosa @ Focus Sash
Ability: Beast Boost
Level: 50
EVs: 252 Sp. Atk, 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Focus Blast
- Bug Buzz
- Ice Beam
- Protect

Now, this is really weird, I admit that, but it works excellently, OHKOing almost all variants of Garchomp (Only VERY specially bulky survives) while 2HKOing Porygon2 and many others with Focus Blast, and often being able to 2HKO with ice beam after the Focus Blast, and having really neat Bug Type STAB, Modest allows it to still out speed the entire unboosted meta game bar 252+ Phero. I will warn though, it needs a fairly specialized team in order to shine, but with the right teammates it does wonders! It's great on Hyper Offense teams, but I am sure it can be used elsewhere too.
I don't think this is a shitty gimmick because it functions in many different situations and is fairly easy to use.

Edit: Stupid autocorrect...

jio edit: Just make to make special note of Fightinium Z on this Pheromosa set. It gives you a buffed Focus Blast that never misses and has a good shot to OHKO even the most specially bulky Porygon2 possible.

252+ SpA Pheromosa All-Out Pummeling (190 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Eviolite Porygon2: 186-218 (96.8 - 113.5%) -- 81.3% chance to OHKO \o/
 
Last edited by a moderator:

Jio

welcome back mahmz :]
is a Tutoris a Forum Moderatoris a Contributor to Smogon
VGC Co-Leader
#18
Adding all of these sets because I think each of these are solid enough to do work in the current metagame!

Going to try to update this as much as possible so bare with me. With Regionals passing usually comes an influx of innovative sets that happen to perform well and mixed Porygon2 is a great example of that! You can read more about it from Jibaku's report but after trying it out myself I can attest to how effective it is and would definitely advise everyone else to try it too!


Porygon2 @ Eviolite
Ability: Download
EVs: 244 HP / 124 Def / 140 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Ice Beam
- Return
- Trick Room
- Recover

keep them coming friends [:
 
#19


reptile (Kommo-o) @ Fightinium Z
Ability: Overcoat
Level: 50
EVs: 148 HP / 252 SpA / 108 Spe
Modest Nature
- Clanging Scales
- Flamethrower
- Focus Blast
- Protect

Ive been using this on throughout the season so far, and i have to say, its not bad at all. Its has similar idea as on Kommo-o used by that Chinese guy (i think he is Chinese, not Japanese) who topped Battle Spot with it, but eventually i have made changes to mine, such as Overcoat over Bulletproof and less bulk and more Spe EVs.

The mon is quite matchup specific. I avoid bringing against teams with multiple Tapus, for example. However, it tears holes against certain teams.

Stuff that Kommo-o can do:

* destroys Lilligant + Torkoal entirely. Lilligant cant do anything to Kommo-o as it cant put it to sleep, while Torkoal gets oneshotted by All-Out Pummeling. Both of those get 2HKOed by Clanging Scales so there is that, too
* deals tons of damage to P2; can OHKO some variants
* OHKOs non-AV Gigalith
* OHKOs Snorlax
* murders Kartana entirely. Kartana cant 2HKO Kommo-o by any of its attacks while Kommo-o can either just click Flamethrower if its AV or just smack it through Protect with All-Out Pummeling if its something else and still OHKO or atleast bring it to sash
* with EVs outspeeds most defensive Arcanines, deals tons of damage with All-Out Pummeling, while physical, more offensive variants that lack Snarl cant do anything to this at all and those might get just oneshotted by All-Out Pummeling
* has spammable fully accurate STAB spread move which hits many things neutrally
* if opponent havent seen that hail team with Kommo-o that topped Battle Spot, it probably doesnt even know what Kommo-o does, and at best cases might even think its physical and waste time by burning it with WoW or something
* has quite few resists + good bulk so it can switch in as long as there is no blizzard users or fairies in field

It can also run Soundproof with slower spread so it will completely laugh at Arcanine (inb4 Dragonium-Z Outrage Arcanine) or Bulletproof to wall Gengar's and Nihilego's STABS. This mon has potential, it just needs good teambuilding and is not very easy to use.
 
#20
Lilligant @ normalium z
Ability: Chlorophyll
Modest nature
Evs: 108 hp 4 def 4 spd 252 spa 140 spe

Protect
Nature power
Sleep powder
Leaf storm

You lead torkoal lilligant, then switch to a tapu of your choice. You blast a normally resistant to fire and grass target with shattered psyche, gigavolt panic, or even twinkle tackle depending on how many tapus are on your team. other two attacks are standard fair for lilligant, always useful.


Pros:
Lilligant ohkoing a kommo-o with shattered psyche with a tapu lele switch or even a twinkle tackle from a fini switch is the most hilarious thing.
ohkoing a mandibuzz with gigavolt panic is just as hilarious.
You get to use lilligant.

Cons: Forced to have torkoal and other tapus in your team, limiting options greatly.
Incredibly gimmicky, but anything works in sun and moon.

On a bit more serious note, the nature power build can be used by almost anyone that can learn it, like tapu koko or even whimsicott. Going normalium z with nature power gives enough fire power to take many surprise kos, or at least until the build becomes more commonplace. Btw thanks to Blarajan and Jibaku for inspiring the build with their love for nature power in the first place. I didn't even know what z-nature power did before I talked with them.
 

Halcyon.

@Choice Specs
is a Community Contributoris a Contributor Alumnus
#21
Was gonna save this until after the VGC tour was done in case I wanted to use it but whatever.



Slowbro @ Kee Berry
Ability: Oblivious
Level: 50
EVs: 252 HP / 108 Def / 148 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Scald
- Psyshock
- Calm Mind
- Slack Off

After seeing the success of Curse Snorlax, a mon that relies solely on its great bulk and reliably recovery to sweep through teams whether offensively or defensively by walling the opponent out, I wanted to try Slowbro. This set functions as a sort of special counterpart to Snorlax. It does the same effective thing: set up a few boosts, then simply eat hits from the opponent until you can sweep. Kee Berry is something I wanted to test out simply because I found Slowbro's bulk to be just shy of good enough. The EVs let mean you take less than 50% from offensive Arcanine's Wild Charge, get your Def boost, and can comfortably recover off the damage. The rest is just thrown into SDef. I've tested this set out on a few teams and it definitely works, though it runs into some problems that Snorlax does not. For one thing, Snorlax has one weakness: Fighting, and the number of Fighting options is very limited. Slowbro is weak to Electric, Bug, Dark, Ghost and Grass, all relatively common attacking types, meaning that even once you set up, it can be hard to keep healthy enough to set up. So it isn't as easy to use as Snorlax is, BUT its definitely a viable mon. It can also help take on TR teams in the same way that Snorlax does. Worth a shot if you are looking for something new to build a team around.
 
#22
Wait I accidentally confused oblivious with unaware for a second, and first thought slowbro was going to be a counter to set-up lax rather than be a niche special version of it. This makes me wonder though if someone would want to try unaware clefable to try to wall and stall out curselax or drumlax in tr.
 
#23
well, the VGC discord thought it was cool, so I may as well put it here.

Rampardos @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Mold Breaker
EVs: 252 Att, 252 Speed, 4 HP
Nature: Jolly
-Head Smash
-Hammer Arm
-Rock Slide
-Iron Head

I present the Mimikyu killer. With Choice Scarf and Mold Breaker, Rampardos will bust through disguise and OHKO Mimikyu with Head Smash all of the time and with Iron Head some of the time mattering on Mimikyu's EV investment.

252 Atk Mold Breaker Rampardos Head Smash vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Mimikyu: 184-217 (113.5 - 133.9%) -- guaranteed OHKO

252 Atk Mold Breaker Rampardos Iron Head vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Mimikyu: 132-156 (101.5 - 120%) -- guaranteed OHKO


In addition to Mimikyu, Choice Scarf Rampardos will outspeed and KO Arcanine.


-1 252 Atk Mold Breaker Rampardos Head Smash vs. 244 HP / 188 Def Arcanine: 198-234 (101 - 119.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
 

Jio

welcome back mahmz :]
is a Tutoris a Forum Moderatoris a Contributor to Smogon
VGC Co-Leader
#24
:scopelens:


Kartana @ Scope Lens
Ability: Beast Boost
Level: 50
EVs: 52 HP / 124 Atk / 4 Def / 76 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Leaf Blade
- Sacred Sword
- Substitute
- Detect

So this is a set that has caught on rather recently and deserves mention here. Scope Lens Kartana was piloted on Enosh's 3rd/4th place ONOG team and Nail's Top 8 Melbourne Internationals team. The premise here is that Kartana is able to bypass Intimidates with both Substitute and a 50% chance to crit your opponent. Critical Hit Leaf Blades do an absurd amount of damage to even Pokemon that normally resist and it only snowballs further if you can get attack boosts. This set is also very good at shutting down Snorlax as crit Leaf Blade and Sacred Sword bypass Snorlax's Curse boosts and deal tremendous damage while Snorlax struggles to do anything back. Definitely a fun set and worth trying [:
 
#25

Garchomp @ Groundium Z
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 52 HP / 148 Atk / 4 Def / 92 SpD / 212 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Earthquake
- Rock Slide
- Protect

Swords Dance basically lets Garchomp ignore Intimidate and even a Burn by boosting any time the opponent makes a defensive play. Earthquake and Rock Slide provide the best coverage from 2 moves and Protect keeps Garchomp from going down to things like Ninetales while its partner takes them out or sets up speed control. Groundium Z is even more important on this set than others as it allows Garchomp to get around Wide Guard. With the SD boost and the given EVs, Garchomp has a 93.8% chance to OHKO standard Porygon2.

Investing in some bulk lets Garchomp set up much more easily. 52 HP / 4 Def lets you survive an opposing Jolly Garchomp's Tectonic Rage. 92 SpD puts it one point higher than Def, making sure Download gives Porygon2 an Attack boost. Without the SpAtk boost, 0 SpAtk Porygon2 will be unable to OHKO this Garchomp with Ice Beam. 52 HP / 92 SpD also lets Garchomp take an HP Ice from Timid LO Tapu Koko and Timid Sash Nihilego. 212 Spe allows you to outrun Jolly Mimikyu and Togedemaru, so you don't have to worry about taking a Play Rough or being Encored into Swords Dance or Protect, respectively. You can also move all but 4 of the Atk EVs into SpDef for a total of 236. This lets Garchomp survive Modest Tapu Lele's Moonblast, LO Timid Nihilego's HP Ice 93.7% of the time, Timid Choice Specs Tapu Koko's HP Ice, and 4 SpAtk Pheromosa's Ice Beam. I think the only significant offensive calcs you lose out on are the 93.8% chance to OHKO standard Porygon2 with a +2 Tectonic Rage and a guarenteed OHKO on 252 HP / 0 Def Snorlax after a Curse with the same move.

Here's probably the best replay I have showing it off:
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7vgc2017-547412522
I was able to set up a free Swords Dance since I knew my Garchomp would be able to take an Ice Beam from Porygon2. The missed Leech Seed certainly helped me, but Porygon2 likely had about the same chance to go down to Tectonic Rage.

---------

And now to talk about physical Porygon2.

If you do the math, Tri Attack is actually a terrible option. Assuming no investment in either attack, Return actually hits harder (100 x 102 = 10,200; 125 x 80 = 10,000). This is without even considering that Pokemon in VGC tend to invest more in SpDef than Def and most Pokemon can guarantee to make Download give you an attack boost. Even if you immediately get Intimidated, you'll likely be at +0 in both attacks.

So yeah, there's really no point in running Tri Attack at all unless you're investing in SpAtk.