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VGC First Timer

Discussion in 'BW Other Teams' started by Clinton, Feb 22, 2012.

  1. Clinton

    Clinton

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2011
    Messages:
    99
    I am on my 3ds typing so there will be no pics or color text but I will make it as neat as possible.


    Team at a glance: Zapdos, Garchomp, Abomasnow, Latios, Hitmontop, Cresselia.

    Zapdos: Timid @ sitrus berry :Pressure
    252 HP 144 Sp.atk 108 Speed
    Moves:
    Heat Wave
    Tailwind
    HP Ice
    Thunderbolt

    Zapdos is my tailwind setter and steel/rain cruncher because of his outstanding movepool of common weaknesses in VGC. He can't survive a a critical hit modest 252sp.atk Ice beam from Ludicolo unfortunately but it covers most threats well. Sitrus berry is to add another turn and possibly save him from getting 2hko'd. Tailwind is my option against faster pokemon, in TR I will attack the TR setter hoping for a kill.

    Garchomp @ Yache Berry: Jolly :Sandviel
    6 HP 252atk 252 speed
    moves
    Earthquake
    Dragon Claw
    Roar
    Protect

    Garchomp becomes a semi-support mon in Trick Room using roar to give my partner an attack and to stop their setup of Trick Room, its not that common but it can easily ruin a Trick Room team, Roar is preffered over Dragon Tail because of accuracy. Everyone remembers only needing that move like Draco meteor to hit and win a game but misses with 90% accuracy. Thats why I can sacrifice some damage for 100% success. Other than that he is standard.

    Hitmontop @ LO: Adamant: Technician
    252HP 252Atk 6sp.def

    Standard Technotop: Fake out, Sucker punch, Mach Punch and Feint

    Use him to kill scarf abomasnow and feint anything using protect I want dead, always feint when T-tar is at 1-2% and you have 1-2% also when sandstorm is up :D

    Cresselia @ Leftovers:Calm: Levitate
    252hp 100def 158sp.def
    moves:
    Icy Wind
    Psychic
    Helping Hand
    Light Screen

    Cress is good against a standard rain team, setting up light screen and using helping hand to boost my main attackers, breaking Yache berries and wittling my opponents down.

    Abomasnow @ Focus Sash: Modest: Snow Warning
    252hp 252spatk 6speed
    moves
    Blizzard
    Ice Shard
    Grass knot
    Protect

    This is standard I believe, the HP Ev's just help out if sash gets broken by sandstorm or a non-koing hit. 6 speed evs allow me to outspeed a flawless mirror without the 6evs in speed meaning my blizzard can do 40-50% to them. And I can play the weather game fairly well and with hail up it hits everything hard, TTar with grass knot, Hippo with Grass knot(or blizzard though in the spread grass knot is the stronger) and rain(grass knot doesnt do half to a standard politoad but 2hko's gastrodon holding a Rindo Berry)

    Latios @ Choice Specs :Timid:
    6hp 252 spatk 252speed
    Levitate
    moves
    Draco Meteor
    HP Fire
    Psychic
    Trick

    Latios hits everything hard with Draco meteor even at -2 though with HP Fire other Timid Latios' with 31 speed IV's will kill me and being locked in a not very effective move can really change the game. Trick is to get rid of specs on a physical pokemon and a Trick Room setting Gallade(Oh yes they can, ever play PO?) Plus it could lock a metagross in Zen Headbutt or Earthquake so I can kill it with HP fire :P


    I tried narrowing my teams weaknesses down but Ice is a problem, technotop can stop an abomasnow but Zapdos needs max bulk so an EV yeild allowing him to survive super effective crits would be great to have! Also have been playing with Gem latios and Modest Scarf Latios, Scarf Abomasnow but they can be unreliable at times. Any tips and reviews are greatly appreciated! Hopefully this isnt a bad post cuz my 3ds is kinda crap on the internet browser
  2. Kiyo

    Kiyo

    Joined:
    Feb 22, 2012
    Messages:
    307
    Roar on Garchomp isnt the best anti TR strategy considering itll get Faked Out by the ever present scrafty, etc. A taunt user would be more beneficial. And Giga drain should be preffered over grass knot on Abomasnow
  3. Saboros

    Saboros

    Joined:
    Apr 18, 2011
    Messages:
    391
    Umm I don't really understand how roar comes into play really and specs latios is pretty strong but you'll find yourself making situations harder for yourself when you find yourself locked into a move you don't want to be locked into.
  4. CedOmega

    CedOmega

    Joined:
    Nov 15, 2011
    Messages:
    217

    Not to be rude, but I do believe that that is what Trick on Latios is for; locking the foe into a move that they themselves do not neccessarily want to be locked into.
  5. voodoo pimp

    voodoo pimp Apply directly to the forehead
    is a Forum Moderator Alumnus

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    Trick is useless if you're already locked into a different move, which is the point Saboros was trying to make. And yeah, I don't think Roar will prevent TR from going up by any serious TR team, since it's beaten by both Fake Out and Rage Powder/Follow Me.
  6. The Knights of Wario Land

    The Knights of Wario Land

    Joined:
    Jan 30, 2012
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    819
    I agree with everyone else saying that Roar should not be run, for the reasons stated above.

    Also, Feint on Hitmontop should not be run, it's way too weak even with Technician and requires a lot of prediction. Replace it with Detect.
  7. Solace

    Solace swing from the chandelier
    is a Site Staff Alumnusis a Super Moderator Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus

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    okay, so i'm gonna give this a shot!

    Zapdos is pretty fine and standard, so nothing of interest there really. What exactly does 144 spatk / 108 spe ko or outpace though?

    Like others have said before, Roar is a bit unreliable for beating Trick Room. You also have Cresselia, which can run Trick Room to reverse the field condition. On Garchomp, I'd recommend either Rock Slide or Substitute, instead of Roar. With Rock Slide, you get added super effective coverage, however the miss chance may not suit you. Substitute gives you the ability for an extra turn of protection without having to use Protect, and can mess with your opponent a bit, since Garchomp can be deadly under a sub.

    If Feint works for you on Hitmontop, I'd keep it, since really why not? It's a cool move and has great uses, but if it becomes problematic I'd probably change it for something else, like Protect or Detect.

    On Cresselia, I'd consider Trick Room over Icy Wind. If you feel TR teams are a massive threat, you can use Cresselia to reverse that, which can come in handy a lot. It's just another option, although Icy Wind is very powerful on its own. Light Screen can also be taken off for Trick Room, although personally I feel that since you have a slight ice weakness, it's probably better to keep that on. Also, just wondering what those EV's do exactly.

    Now talking about that ice weakness, here's a Pokemon I might recommend changing. Abomasnow is cool (no pun intended), but it really doesn't do much at all for your team aside from changing weather. Every Pokemon on your team is hurt by hail, and none of them benefit from the condition at all. If anything, an opposing 100% accurate Blizzard can really mess around with your team. If you really want a weather setter, you can try Ninetales, who's sun doesnt really bother anyone on your team but can mess around with other weather. It also gets STAB fire moves, which will alleviate some of the ice problems. However, if you don't feel a weather setter is necessary (and for your kind of team, i don't really think one is), you can try out Heatran or Infernape. Heatran has nice typing and can be quite dangerous when left unchecked. Infernape has the ability to run a mixed set, hitting both specially and physically, which can be incredibly useful.

    For Latios, while Choice Specs seems like a cool idea, it can often come up short. If you are really sold on Specs, I'd use Dragon Pulse instead of Draco Meteor, just for some longevity. However, I'd really recommend going for White Herb over Choice Specs, and changing Trick to Protect. While it's a little more risky with so many Intimidate Hitmontops going around, it's certainly nice to be able to launch off two full Draco Meteors.

    It's a nice team overall, and here is a summary of the changes I recommend:

    Garchomp @ Yache Berry
    Jolly Nature
    6 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
    ~ Dragon Claw
    ~ Earthquake
    ~ Rock Slide / Substitute
    ~ Protect

    Cresselia @ Leftovers
    Calm Nature
    252 HP / 100 Def / 158 SpD (although I'm not 100% sure on the EVs)
    ~ Psychic
    ~ Trick Room
    ~ Helping Hand
    ~ Light Screen

    options to replace Abomasnow (open)

    Ninetales @ Focus Sash / Charti Berry
    Modest Nature
    4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    ~ Heat Wave
    ~ Hidden Power Ice
    ~ Energy Ball / Will-O-Wisp
    ~ Protect

    Heatran @ Air Balloon
    Modest Nature
    4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    ~ Heat Wave
    ~ Earth Power
    ~ Dragon Pulse / Hidden Power Ice
    ~ Substitute / Protect

    Infernape @ Focus Sash / Life Orb
    Naive Nature
    116 Atk / 140 SpA / 252 Spe
    ~ Fake Out
    ~ Close Combat
    ~ Heat Wave / Overheat
    ~ Hidden Power Ice / Protect / Encore


    Latios @ White Herb
    Timid Nature
    4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    ~ Draco Meteor
    ~ Psyshock
    ~ Hidden Power Fire
    ~ Protect

    ----------------------------
    Hope this helps!
  8. Clinton

    Clinton

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2011
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    Thank you all! I'm definitely gonna do some testing on all those replacements etc.

    As for the EV's I do not have a program that lets me simulate damage so I can pin-point a good yeild to use. Is there one out there similiar to the damage calculator?
  9. voodoo pimp

    voodoo pimp Apply directly to the forehead
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    I like to use this one. It's quicker to set up than other calculators I've seen, and works on my crappy laptop that can't run any of the others.
  10. Clinton

    Clinton

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2011
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    So the results are in, I replaced Abomasnow with Drought Ninetales.

    Ninetales @ Fire Gem
    Timid: 6HP/252 Sp.atk/252 Speed
    moves:
    Heat Wave
    Solarbeam
    Hidden Power Ice
    Protect

    Now this bugger helps me with Abomasnow mainly because of Speed, if I get Sun up Aboma is scarfed, I expect a switch in, if Hail gets up I expect a switch in or protect(Why I use Feint on hitmontop, it works), it weakens rain teams if I play the weather properly. Because it is Timid Amoonguss can survive a Fire Gem boosted heat wave in the sun because of spread damage(if no spread it dies)

    Any tips on teching out Ninetales?

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