Other Viable Megas (V2)

[NeonNinja96]

Approved by Haunter and Alexwolf
OP shamelessly stolen from the OU Viability Rankings Thread

It's so beautiful :)

Welcome to the official Viable Megas topic. You should know the drill by now; In this thread, we as a community will rank every single usable Mega Evolution into "tiers." In this thread, you're encouraged to post your thoughts and opinions on the various Mega Evolutions that are usable in OU and what tier they should fall under.


The general idea of the topic is to rank each Mega Evolution under "rankings" that go in descending order. Since this is a general tier list, everything is lumped together. There won't be any segregation between offense & defense threats.

• EX: Mega Garchomp can be ranked in A tier as an offensive threat, and Mega Venusaur can be can also be ranked in B tier as a defensive threat. These are just examples.

Note that the overall tier list is in no particular order.


Below are the definitions of each rank, and they should be read be anyone that wants to participate in the discussion of a Mega Evolution’s rank in OU:


S Rank: Reserved for Mega Evolutions that are amazing in the OU metagame. These Megas are usually able to perform a variety of roles effectively, or can just do one extremely well. Their use has low risk involved and high reward exerted. Mega Evolutions in this rank have very few flaws that are patched up by numerous positive traits.


A Rank: Reserved for Mega Evolutions that are fantastic in the OU metagame, and can sweep, support, or wall significant portions of the metagame. These Mega Evolutions require less support than most others to be used effectively and have few flaws that can easily be overlooked when compared to their positive traits.


B Rank: Reserved for Mega Evolutions that are great in the OU metagame. These Mega Evolutions have more notable flaws than those above them that affect how they function in the tier. Their positive traits still outshine their negatives, but they require a bit more team support to bring out their full potential.


C Rank: Reserved for Mega Evolutions that have notable niches in the OU metagame, but have just as many notable flaws that prevent them from being effective. Pokemon in the C tier often require significant support to be effective. Mega Evolutions from this rank tend to face a lot of competition with the more commonly used Mega Evolutions.


D Rank: Reserved for Mega Evolutions that are mediocre in the OU metagame, but are viable enough to justify their use on select teams. These Mega Evolutions are either usable but have no real niche, or are only capable of doing their specific task and fail at doing anything more than that. Mega Evolutions from this rank have multiple crippling flaws that prevent them from being successful a majority of the time, and are often severely outclassed because of it.



Mega Evolution Tiers

S Rank: Reserved for Mega Evolutions that are amazing in the OU metagame. These Megas are usually able to perform a variety of roles effectively, or can just do one extremely well. Their use has low risk involved and high reward exerted. Mega Evolutions in this rank have very few flaws that are patched up by numerous positive traits.

Mega Charizard X

Mega Mawile

A Rank: Reserved for Mega Evolutions that are fantastic in the OU metagame, and can sweep, support, or wall significant portions of the metagame. These Mega Evolutions require less support than most others to be used effectively and have few flaws that can easily be overlooked when compared to their positive traits.

Mega Pinsir

Mega Scizor

Mega Charizard Y

Mega Tyranitar

Mega Gyarados

Mega Venusaur

B Rank: Reserved for Mega Evolutions that are great in the OU metagame. These Mega Evolutions have more notable flaws than those above them that affect how they function in the tier. Their positive traits still outshine their negatives, but they require a bit more team support to bring out their full potential.

Mega Gardevoir

Mega Medicham

Mega Heracross

Mega Alakazam

Mega Garchomp

Mega Manectric

C Rank: Reserved for Mega Evolutions that have notable niches in the OU metagame, but have just as many notable flaws that prevent them from being effective. Pokemon in the C tier often require significant support to be effective. Mega Evolutions from this rank tend to face a lot of competition with the more commonly used Mega Evolutions.

Mega Aerodactyl

Mega Ampharos

Mega Aggron

Mega Blastoise

Mega Absol

D Rank: Reserved for Mega Evolutions that are mediocre in the OU metagame, but are viable enough to justify their use on select teams. These Mega Evolutions are either usable but have no real niche, or are only capable of doing their specific task and fail at doing anything more than that. Mega Evolutions from this rank have multiple crippling flaws that prevent them from being successful a majority of the time, and are often severely outclassed because of it.

Mega Banette

Mega Abomasnow

Mega Houndoom

''CONCLUSION REACHED'' Mega Evolutions: Mega Evolutions in this list have reached a conclusive ideal ranking, so unless the metagame changes towards them or there is something about them that hasn't been said, discussion about them is disallowed.

• Nothing yet

BLACKLISTED POKEMON: These Mega Evolutions are not yet released, cause a shitstorm of children when someone brings them up, or are banned from OU. Discussion is disallowed until further notice.

• Mega Metagross
• Mega Sableye
• Mega Latias
• Mega Latios
• Mega Sceptile
• Mega Swampert
• Mega Diancie
• Mega Gengar
• Mega Blaziken
• Mega Kangaskhan
• Mega Lucario
• Mega Mewtwo X
• Mega Mewtwo Y

Rules

• Post intelligently. Posts like "I think mega X should be in this tier" will not be tolerated
• No flaming
• Usage statistics may be used to support an argument or a claim, but don't base your ENTIRE argument around them. For example, you can't just say "Mega Evolution X shouldn't be this tier because they aren't used that often!"
• No talk about editing the OFFICIAL Smogon tier lists.
• NeonNinja96 is amazing. This is an undisputed fact.

If you think this thread is unnecessary, I invite you to look at the old one;

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While all of the new mega's get increased stats/new typing/new ability, they have to forgo a hold item. For which Pokemon is mega evolving worth it?

Mega Venusaur may be worthwhile because of its defensive focus. Thick Fat removes two troubling weaknesses, and the +40 to Def and +20 to SpD don't hurt. It loses on leftovers recovery and Chlorophyll sweeping, but weather got nerfed this gen (yay!) so that set won't be Growing anytime soon (get it?). Also, Attack and Speed are both brought up to 103 and 100 respectively, so maybe this thing has some tanking potential.

Mega Charizard X...possibly. It really hinges on the benefits of Fire/Dragon typing.

Mega Alakazam: Maybe. I can't remember many Specs Alakazams, and Life Orb'd Alakazam has equal SpA. The 150 base Spe is what really makes him worth it.

Mega Gengar might be useful cause of Shadow Tag + Perish Song/Destiny Bond, and a higher SpA than normally obtainable through Life Orb.

Mega Khangaskahn is probably gonna be really good thanks to the parental bond ability.

Mega Gardevoir gets Pixilate, which might be helpful. Its SpA boost is greater than that of which it would've had without mega evolving. Also, 100 base Spe is much better than 80.

I can see Mega Mawile tanking like there's no tommorow cause of its impressive defensive stats and typing, and the highest attack stat in the game thanks to huge power. Its only letdown is its speed.

Mega Medicham was almost as high attack as Mega Mawile, but much higher speed. Definitely gonna be a threat.

Mega Absol may only have +20 to Attack when compared to normal, but it's almost twice as fast. Also, magic bounce makes it immune to crippling status.

Everything else seems to be better off unevolved.

 

[NeonNinja96]

Changelog:

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10/4/14: Preliminary rankings implemented. They are probably shit, but I feel they should be where they are.
10/4/14: Mega Houndoom: D, Mega Absol: C, Mega Venusaur: A, Mega Gyarados: A
11/4/14: Mega Garchomp: B, Mega Manectric: B

 

[NeonNinja96]

Reserved

 

[Kairyu_Gen1]

Cool, can't believe nobody thought of doing this format.

Now, nominating to move Alakazam down to C. At least for now, it's impossible to justify with deoxys-S still around. Plus, while I don't think they're A, Gardevoir and Medicham are significantly more viable than it.

I'm debating Absol, but idk. Let's wait and see how this differentiates itself from the regular viability thread.

 

[Red Cat]

How is this thread different from the general OU Viability Ranking Thread other than we are only focusing on the megas here? The mega evolutions are already included in the general thread, so this thread just seems like a sub-thread of the viability rankings specifically to talk about the megas.

 

[Nova]

I don't agree with Mega Garchomp receiving an A rank. Although he's definitely a strong Pokemon with great mixed attacking stats and bulk that make him an effective wallbreaker, it's rather lackluster when you have to use your mega slot on it when you could use a different mega that can accomplish what he can he can even better such as Mega Mawile and Mega Charizard X/Y. He's arguably even outclassed by the non-Mega Kyurem-B in terms of wallbreaking ability. 92 base Speed, a 10 point decrease from its normal form also hurts it significantly. Although Garchomp's base 102 Speed is not as fast as it once was relative to its competition in DPP, it still remains a fast Speed tier that can outspeed notable threats such as Landorus at 101 Speed, Base 100 Speed Pokemon, etc. 92 base Speed is just not fast enough in this current meta to fit effectively on most offensive teams as he often gets outrun. The criteria for A rank says "can sweep, support, or wall significant portions of the metagame" and I don't think Mega Garchomp fits any of those three roles. It most closely resembles the sweep role, but as I mentioned with 92 base Speed, he's going to have a tough time sweeping anything outside of full Stall teams. He also requires more team support than any of the other A rank Pokemon, as Sandstorm support is a huge boon to him because of Sand Force. Basically, I believe he should be a B rank Mega, his wallbreaking potential and his great bulk are strong positives traits, but he still has some negatives in terms of his Speed and the required support he requires. Also, just taking a look at usage, he's definitely seen less often than the other Megas in the A rank, but I'm not sure how much usage affects viability rankings

 

[NeonNinja96]

How is this thread different from the general OU Viability Ranking Thread other than we are only focusing on the megas here? The mega evolutions are already included in the general thread, so this thread just seems like a sub-thread of the viability rankings specifically to talk about the megas.

It isn't. This thread is for discussion of viable Mega Evolutions, without everything else clouding the discussion.

 

[Kairyu_Gen1]

How is this thread different from the general OU Viability Ranking Thread other than we are only focusing on the megas here? The mega evolutions are already included in the general thread, so this thread just seems like a sub-thread of the viability rankings specifically to talk about the megas.

It also helps narrow the field when choosing a mega. Since a team can only have 1, it makes sense to discuss what to do with that 1. This is just a better format than the free for all of version 1

 

[NeonNinja96]

I would like for users to make write ups for each Mega Evolution. 1 paragraph please, to implement in the thread. Additionally, I will be linking each mega to it's dex analysis.

 

[Lil YoshiXD]

I disagree on Mega Gyarados in A rank, while good its not at the level of others.
ZardX is a frightening sweeper capable of easily plowing through teams. Also it has a defensive set making it usuable on almost any team.
Mega Venusaur is an incredible wall that can stop have the meta, with decent attack and nice utility moves.
MegaMawile is an amazing wallbreaker only being stopped by a few fire types. Also its priority sucker punch can destroy offensive teams.
Mega Gyarados on the other hand, while very good, can basically only run a dd set with very little variation. A bulky grass type like Mega Venu or Amoongus can stop it. Its power isn't at ZardX level.

 

[Kairyu_Gen1]

I disagree on Mega Gyarados in A rank, while good its not at the level of others.
ZardX is a frightening sweeper capable of easily plowing through teams. Also it has a defensive set making it usuable on almost any team.
Mega Venusaur is an incredible wall that can stop have the meta, with decent attack and nice utility moves.
MegaMawile is an amazing wallbreaker only being stopped by a few fire types. Also its priority sucker punch can destroy offensive teams.
Mega Gyarados on the other hand, while very good, can basically only run a dd set with very little variation. A bulky grass type like Mega Venu or Amoongus can stop it. Its power isn't at ZardX level.

It's the defining win condition nowadays, it's core with Gothitelle is a testament to that. Basically, if you don't have and effectively use a poke that can handle it after a DD, you will not have success.

 

[Aragorn the King]

Why aren't you just using the actual rankings for all of the mega Pokemon in the viability thread? Everything is pretty much accurate there, and frankly I disagree with every change you made -_- Sorry if I seem mean/annoyed or w/e... it's just that everything's rank in the actual thread is much better. Gyarados is in no way S, Garchomp and Manectric are in no way A, Aerodactyl and Ampharos are in no way C, and Banette is in no way D. It's just what has been agreed time and time again on the viability thread. I can provide reasoning, but I don't think it's mandatory.

 

[Clone]

I don't agree with Mega Garchomp receiving an A rank. Although he's definitely a strong Pokemon with great mixed attacking stats and bulk that make him an effective wallbreaker, it's rather lackluster when you have to use your mega slot on it when you could use a different mega that can accomplish what he can he can even better such as Mega Mawile and Mega Charizard X/Y. He's arguably even outclassed by the non-Mega Kyurem-B in terms of wallbreaking ability. 92 base Speed, a 10 point decrease from its normal form also hurts it significantly. Although Garchomp's base 102 Speed is not as fast as it once was relative to its competition in DPP, it still remains a fast Speed tier that can outspeed notable threats such as Landorus at 101 Speed, Base 100 Speed Pokemon, etc. 92 base Speed is just not fast enough in this current meta to fit effectively on most offensive teams as he often gets outrun. The criteria for A rank says "can sweep, support, or wall significant portions of the metagame" and I don't think Mega Garchomp fits any of those three roles. It most closely resembles the sweep role, but as I mentioned with 92 base Speed, he's going to have a tough time sweeping anything outside of full Stall teams. He also requires more team support than any of the other A rank Pokemon, as Sandstorm support is a huge boon to him because of Sand Force. Basically, I believe he should be a B rank Mega, his wallbreaking potential and his great bulk are strong positives traits, but he still has some negatives in terms of his Speed and the required support he requires. Also, just taking a look at usage, he's definitely seen less often than the other Megas in the A rank, but I'm not sure how much usage affects viability rankings

The problem with your argument is that Mega Garchomp has no counters outside of SpDef Gliscor and Cresselia (lol). Megachomp literally shits on stall as he 2HKOes everything bar Gliscor. No other Pokemon in OU - not even Kyurem-B, the Pokemon you mentioned, can boast that despite having the same exact offenses. Along with that is a better typing and movepool. Yeah he cant hold an item, but thats not even a big deal. As for your speed argument, running max speed is usually a bad idea. Picking a speed tier to outspeed is all he needs. He works great on offense. Idk why youre saying he doesnt. Hes a great stallbreaker and can still nuke things with Draco Meteor/Earthquake

In regards to Mawile, Megachomp still has enough speed to do what it wants. His job is to break walls, and I feel that he can do it much better than Mega Mawile. His mixed set isnt countered by certain Pokemon like Mawile (ie Subpunch loses to MegaVenu, while SD w/ Fire Fang loses to Heatran). On top of that, he doesnt have to rely on Sucker Punch to hit certain things, and is still able to switch in non mega evolved and take a hit, unlike Mawile who falls to any special attack.

As for the criteria for A rank, the closest that he falls under is support because he supports the team by breaking walls. And even if you dont agree with that, you wont see Aegislash, the best OU poke in the game sweeping. Hes a wallbreaker as well and is the top S Pokemon on the Viability ranking. The closest he gets is walling thanks to Kings Shield, but even thats a stretch. Pokemon dont have to match the criteria to a "T." Its implied.

Yes Megachomp likes Sand. No he does not require a lot of team support. TTar is all he needs to get the ball rolling. Outside of that, hes like every other Pokemon in the game - he has teammates to deal with weaknesses and such. As for the usage thing, most people dont use him because theyre turned off by the lower speed, which isnt even a problem if you use him right, which honestly doesnt sound like you use him at all.

So yeah, keep Megachomp in A.

 

[Aragorn the King]

Mega Chomp is B+ because while it beats stall very well, it's easily revenge killed, costs not being able to use the better Garchomp sets, and therefore loses all of the versatility of Garchomp. It does its job very well, but if it's put up against a team that it can't do its job against, it'll feel like dead weight. It's very slow, needs support, and represents a large amount of opportunity lost. It's a B+ Pokemon in my opinion, obviously better than things in the B- rank, but not as good as A-. It's B+, so it's Borderline, but it fits in much better with megas like Absol than it fits with Charizard-Y!

I could do I write-up for every Pokemon, but it seems silly to do a write-up just to send the Pokemon where everyone knows it is currently and where it belongs. The only one really up for debate (before you implement B+/B- etc, if you will) is Houndoom, imo.

 

[Sergeant Spooky]

Yeah I don't get this either. It's just the viability ranking except all the non-megas are removed, and some stuff is (questionably) moved around.

I think it'd be better to just continue off where the old thread started, except not have an outdated OP.

 

[Karxrida]

The rankings need to be the same as the viability thread, otherwise it looks like you placed stuff based off your own personal bias O_o

 

[TheInsanity]

I don't understand mega charizard y in B. U don't need to set up like megados or megazard x before killing. This means that u aren't stopped by unaware users (same for gyarados ok, but u don't need to set up in any case). Chari y works like this:
"u resist one of my hit? I 2okho u".
"u are neutral? I okho u after stealth rock":

If u aren't chansey/blissey/latwins, this is charizard y in a nutshell.

Every good team should be prepared to take care of chary y. No priority, not a great speed, but with the coverage grass/fire/fight (or loldragon) can hit almost everything neutral, force the switch of a lot of mons and say hi to who switch with a fire blast. There is a reason if after 7 months of this meta the only team that u can in OU in the section rate my team -> archivie u found a team based on chari y.

Is good against every type of playstyle now, with the nerf of bp, every HO (also deobros suspect) has a slower pokemon. Rules against stall teams and bulky offense, good against a volturn. The only things u need for support him is a pursuiter and a rapid spinner/defogger. Every team needs a defogger, but every team likes to have a pursuiter for latwins, so in this case u need only a mon to support him. U want the sand? Ttar can pursuit and bring the sand.
But this is regular, megasaur likes ttar or heatran for partner, mega gyarados likes someone able to kill skarmory/ferrothorn and mega pinsir someone able to kill zapdos and rotom. There are more problematic mons to use.

I am totally not a fan of charizard y, but when you build a team and u don't put a mon at least able to revenge kill him, u probably cannot reach 1500 in the ladder.

 

[MilkyWay]

NeonNinja96 is right about the old mega viability ranking thread being completely shitty, but this is the same thing as the OU viability ranking thread but just with megas. In other words, because megas are ranked in that thread this one is pointless. What we should do is have a new mega viability ranking thread in which people give in depth analysis's of the megas that show how to properly use them and go beyond the smogon dex. This way new users can learn which megas are viable and how to use these megas to their full potential by reading in depth guides and analysis's.

 

[NeonNinja96]

NeonNinja96 is right about the old mega viability ranking thread being completely shitty, but this is the same thing as the OU viability ranking thread but just with megas. In other words, because megas are ranked in that thread this one is pointless. What we should do is have a new mega viability ranking thread in which people give in depth analysis's of the megas that show how to properly use them and go beyond the smogon dex. This way new users can learn which megas are viable and how to use these megas to their full potential by reading in depth guides and analysis's.

I plan to do so at some point, but I need user contribution. Keep in mind that this is an ongoing project.

 

[Jukain]

do this separate from viability rankings. this tiers megas and their role in the tier as compared to each other which is not a waste of time.

megadoom -> d

it's not as bad as banette and aboma tbh but its way worse than the c ranked megas. ive seen maybe three matches ever where megadoom was used successfully. it's frail and has coverage gaps/issues breaking through numerous common things like ttar tran and chansey. its just not on the level of the other c ranked megas which have bulk or some special utility like amph beats thund and talon, absol beats deo-d, dactyl beats birds... houndoom doesn't belong with them.

i agree with megachomp -> b. spdef gliscor is becoming increasingly common also mandibuzz can beat it. the matter also isnt just whether it breaks stall really well because mega medicham and hera do as well yet are b rank. it's not significantly better than those to deserve a rank and doesn't have the same presence in the meta.

mega absol -> c

c rank def "Reserved for Mega Evolutions that have notable niches in the OU metagame, but have just as many notable flaws that prevent them from being effective. Pokemon in the C tier often require significant support to be effective. Mega Evolutions from this rank tend to face a lot of competition with the more commonly used Mega Evolutions."

literally the perfect definition of mega absol. walled/checked a lot by stuff like xzard, keldeo, lando-t bar ice beam, megasaur, zard y, chomp, breloom, conk, fable, azu etc which requires lots of team support/makes it 'notably flawed'. it also is often hard to justify over other megas ie you have to build with it in mind/doesnt typically fit that well.

mega gyara -> a

too flawed vs other s megas. checked by common things like keld, skarm, venu, thundy twave, maw, azu, kyub etc. it's obviously very good but easier to deal with than maw or xzard for sure and more comparable to a rank megas.

agree with manectric -> b

 

[Karxrida]

Mega Venu for A. The meta is super-prepared for it and it recieves competition from Zard X for a spot on Stall. I hear the bulky attack set is being use more but all the things that deal with the defensive sets already take care of it (except Venu dies faster).

 

[NeonNinja96]

do this separate from viability rankings. this tiers megas and their role in the tier as compared to each other which is not a waste of time.

Can you elaborate further on this sentence? I can't really understand what you are trying to convey.

Anyways, updates.

Mega Garchomp: A for now, discussion seems to be relatively even at this point, so I would like to gather more opinion.
Mega Houndoom: D, I've been playing with it, and coupled with user opinion, it's an obvious choice.
Mega Absol: C
Mega Venusaur: A

 

[NeonNinja96]

Also Mega Gyarados: A

 

[KingoftheSlow]

MegaChomp is definitely not deserving of an A. As mentioned, it is very easy to revenge kill, requires quite a bit of team support (i.e. sticky web, fairies, ice resist, etc.), and is just not as good as other Chomp sets.

Personally, I've never had to prepare for a Mega Garchomp whilst team building and have not had any problems. Just seems a bit outclassed, mainly for it's lack of speed.

 

[MilkyWay]

Mega Garchomp for B. It faces competition from Kyurem-B and it takes up the mega slot. Not to mention that it only has one set worth using and it needs sand support on top of that. The speed tier isnt great and it has no way of boosting its speed to make up for this. And you're kidding me if you think it belongs in the same rank as Mega Venusar, Mega Pinsir, and Mega Gyarados.