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Virizion

Discussion in 'BW OU' started by Garganator, Sep 19, 2010.

  1. Garganator

    Garganator

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    [​IMG]

    #640 - Birijion
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    Typing
    -----------

    [​IMG][​IMG]
    Weaknesses/Resistances
    Immunity: [​IMG]
    x0.50: [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    x1.00: [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    x2.00: [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    x4.00: [​IMG]

    Grass and Fighting unfortunately is mediocre combination in offense - mainly resisted by Flying types, which also hits Birijion for x4 effective damage. Also offenses of Birijion is nothing to be really impressed to make up for it - both 90 base special attack and defense makes it not so threatening in offensive way. However, it has few notable options. For first good number of resistances, like -Electric, -Water, -Grass, -Dark, -Ground and -Rock, with famous QuakeEdge resistance give it solid potential for defensive Pokemon (however lack of recovery hurts). Solid speed allowing it to outspeed some important targets in Sazando, Adamant DDTar, Roserade and other attacker with good offensive potential. But if you need more offensive approach, it has good enough movepool to use Swords Dance and Calm Mind with decent effect, but don't expect it to decimate teams. It's more supposed to tank one or two hits, while finding one more turn to boost mediocre offenses to good levels. Play to it's biggest advantages and avoid strong -Fire and -Flying attacks and it should work.

    --------
    Stats
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    Base Stat Total: 580
    Base Stats: | 91 | 90 | 72 | 90 | 129 | 108 |

    Birijion's main blessing is his above average base Speed of 108 along with its great 129 special defense, while stiil keeping solid 91/72 physical bulk. In other words Birijion works as a decent check to few types of pokemon, mostly Water, Grass, Dark and Electric ones, which Birijion may easily tank with his good special bulk (or physical one, when invested). On physical side it may check Tyranitar, Gyarados, Leafeon, Aggron and other dangerous hard-hitters and sweepers. However his main niche is special walling/tank hits and he does it quite well. Immunity to Leech Seed, Dark type attacks

    -------------
    Abilities
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    Justice Heart: Absorbs Dark-type attacks when hit and raises Pokemon's Attack stage by 1.

    While Birijion would prefer to absorb a different type attack, seeing as it would resist Dark-types anyways, it will gladly welcome the Attack boost. This ability can help Birijion to boost his mediocre physical attack (for example on Choice Tyranitar) and boost it farther with Swords Dance, making it solid physical attacker. While Birijion is bulky, especially on special side, it helps even further in checking some offensive threats like Sazando, Tyranitar, Zoroark and other Dark-type offensive threats. However it has few problems - For first bad weaknesses to -Fire, -Ice and this easily to exploit x4 -Flying weakness means trouble, even with this decent speed. Also Birijion would love to have better movepool, which lacks few options popular on other Grass-types like Sleep Powder, Leech Seed, Leaf Storm, Power Whip and other usable options. In overall when you compare his weaknesses to resistances, then Birijion generally is solid addition to any team, if you need bulky and fast sponge to some strong attacks, which Birijion quite easily resists.

    Learnable TMs:

    TM04 - Calm Mind, TM05 - Roar, TM06 - Toxic, TM10 - Hidden Power, TM11 - Sunny Day, TM12 - Taunt, TM15 - Hyper Beam, TM16 - Light Screen, TM17 - Protect, TM20 - Safeguard, TM21 - Frustration, TM22 - Solar Beam, TM27 - Return, TM32 - Double Team, TM33 - Reflect, TM40 - Aerial Ace, TM42 - Facade, TM44 - Rest, TM48 - Troll, TM52 - Focus Blast, TM53 - Energy Ball, TM54 - False Swipe, TM67 - Get Even, TM68 - Giga Impact, TM70 - Flash, TM71 - Stone Edge, TM75 - Swords Dance, TM77 - Psych Up, TM81 - X-Scissor, TM83 - Cheer Up, TM86 - Grass Knot, TM87 - Swagger, TM90 - Substitute, TM94 - Rock Smash, HM01 - Cut, HM04 - Strength

    Level-up Moves:

    Lv1: Quick Attack, Lv1: Leer, Lv7: Double Kick, Lv13: Magical Leaf, Lv19: Take Down, Lv25: Helping Hand, Lv31: [M514], Lv37: Giga Drain, Lv42: [M533], Lv49: Swords Dance, Lv55: [M501], Lv61: [M526], Lv67: Leaf Blade, Lv73: Close Combat

    -----------------
    Sets Ideas
    -----------------


    'Speedy Physical Tank'
    Birijion @ Leftovers
    252 HP / 208 Spe / 44 Def
    Jolly / Naive Nature
    ~ Reflect
    ~ Close Combat
    ~ Leaf Blade / Grass Knot
    ~ Hidden Power Ice / Stone Edge / Taunt

    For first, those EVs are enough to outspeed Max Speed Jolly Garchomp, probably the most dangerous physical sweeper to outspeed. Reflect is perfect for additional bulk, which you may need to wall some slower physical attackers. However you're not totally hopeless against threats, which outspeeds you. Some calculations.

    +2 Adamant Doryuuzu Swords Dance X-Scissor vs 252 HP/44 Def Neutral Birijion 62.95% -> 74.09%

    In other words you easily survive hit and retaliate with STAB Close Combat, while easily resisting Rock Slide/Earthquake from his offensive sets. For me it makes Birijion a really solid Doryuuzu counter. Ok, time for something else.

    +2 Adamant Life Orb Lucario ExtremeSpeed vs 252 HP/44 Def Neutral Birijion
    70.73% -> 83.42%.

    In other words you easily survive ExtremeSpeed and OHKO Lucario back. Life Orb Close Combat from the same Lucario deals 60.88% -> 71.76% so if you make mistake here, you still survive.

    +1 No Boosting Item Jolly Tyranitar Fire Punch vs 252 HP/44 Def Neutral Birijion
    80.31% -> 94.82%

    I admit it, there's a really slim chance for OHKO, however it's impossible without Life Orb. And I don't think that Tyranitar will choose Life Orb over Babiri Berry or Lum Berry just to let itself being easily revenge-killed by Scizor or just crippled by status. Against choice sets you're pretty much safe.

    +2 Life Orb Adamant Kabutops Waterfall IN RAIN vs 252 HP/44 Def Neutral Birijion
    81.87% -> 96.37%

    This is best what Kabutops may do against Birijion under rain. It hurts, but you always survive without SR up. I don't need to say that you OHKO said Kabutops back with grass attack.

    Choice Band Adamant Rhyperior Megahorn vs 252 HP/44 Def Neutral Birijion
    72.80% - 85.75%

    In other words you may easily switch in, take Megahorn and OHKO back with grass attack.

    Anyway, those are some examples on calcs. Anyway, this Birijion stops also physically based Water attackers (Gyarados, Crawdaunt, Kingler), Bulky Ground attackers (Hippowdon, Donphan, Doryuuzu) and some Physical Grass-type attackers.

    'Swords Dancer'
    Birijion @ Life Orb / Leftovers
    4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
    Jolly Nature
    ~ Swords Dance
    ~ Leaf Blade
    ~ Close Combat
    ~ Stone Edge / Quick Attack / Taunt

    Not many things to explain here. Birijion is fast enough to abuse it and thanks to Justice Heart you may receive +1 boost to physical attack, which compliments this set. Taunt is perfect choice when you need a wall-breaker, especially with Birijion's good bulk to abuse it.

    'Offensive Calm Mind'
    Birijion @ Life Orb / Leftovers
    4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
    Timid Nature
    ~ Calm Mind
    ~ Grass Knot
    ~ Focus Blast
    ~ Hidden Power Ice / Taunt

    Not as good as Swords Dancer, however unique enough and unlike Terakion or Kobaruon, Birijion has resistances mostly popular on special side like electric or water ones, finding this free turns to use Calm Mind much easier then other two Fighting legendaries. Choice between HP Ice and Taunt is hard. Without Taunt, phazers and statusers easily takes on this set. Without HP Ice, your biggest enemy are dragons and giving them free turns is bad idea.

    [I'll add Cheer up sets and Special Tank sets when I'll test some calculations. For now, I leave it like this ;)]
  2. Upstart

    Upstart Copy Cat

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    Jolly 252atk 252 spe
    Sword Dance
    Leaf Blade
    Close Combat
    Stone Edge / quick attack

    Timid/ Hasty
    252 SpA 252 Spe
    Calm Mind
    Close Combat / Focus Blast
    Calm Mind
    Grass Knot
    Not sure

    All choice sets are possible
  3. Ontop

    Ontop

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    Hasty (Random EV spread with Atk,Sp.Atk and Spe)

    Cheer up
    Close combat
    Stone edge
    Grass knot

    Something along those lines is problably what i'm gonna run for OU if i consider testing this poke.
  4. doomvendingmachine

    doomvendingmachine
    is a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus

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    Idk, to me, Birijion seems like a defesive pokemon with an offensive movepool. I'm not sure if both really mesh that well.
  5. Ontop

    Ontop

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    Yes true.

    But if you can pull off a Cheer up he becomes a bulky sweeper.
  6. ginganinja

    ginganinja Dating Haunter
    is a Forum Moderatoris a CAP Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a Community Contributor Alumnusis a Battle Server Moderator Alumnus
    Moderator

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    It can pull of duel screens quite well but it does not seem very special. It cannot exactualy shrug off Physical hits and a few other pokemon can wall special attacks better than it
  7. Ice-eyes

    Ice-eyes Simper Fi

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    Taunt is a really cool option; you can break stall and stuff. Typing is really cool as well.

    Birijion @ Leftovers
    Justice Heart
    252 HP / 4 Attack / 252 Spe (or something to that effect)
    Jolly (+Spe, -SpA)
    Taunt
    Swords Dance
    Leaf Blade
    [M533] / Close Combat

    It checks LOADS of stuff as well - it's like Breloom, except really bulky. I'm sure a defensive set would make a good mixed wall, too; maybe with Calm Mind?
  8. Kannon

    Kannon

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    you list it has 91/90 physical defenses but your base spread right before that lists his defense as base 72.
  9. Garganator

    Garganator

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    True, mistake on my part. Fixed it ;).

    Anyway, I tested some calculations on Physical Tank and it isn't bad. I also added your propositions guys ;).
  10. Azure Demon

    Azure Demon Guest

    Birijion @ salac berry/lechi berry
    Justice Heart, Jolly (+Speed, -sp.atk)
    212attack/46spdef/252speed

    Sword dance
    leaf blade
    stone edge
    close combat/sub
  11. Myrrh

    Myrrh

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    If this guy got bulk up, then that would be awesome, anyway its mediocre at best, as its good spD is eschewed by its lack of recovery outside of rest.
  12. Lee

    Lee @ Thick Club
    is a Team Rater Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnus

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    I do agree with you that this guy has potential as a speedy supporter/tank, and that that is probably a better route than shoehorning him into a sweeper like everybody else in this thread seems to be set on doing.

    However, your calculations are wrong. 252 HP / 44 Def produces 386 HP and 191 Def. Which means...

    That one's right.

    So's this one, but it's kinda irrelevant because Lucario will always hold Life Orb, in which case it does: 70.73% - 83.42%.

    You forgot to factor in the Life Orb. It actually does 104% - 122%

    You forgot the Life Orb again. 88.60% - 104.40%

    81.87% - 96.37%

    72.80% - 85.75%
  13. Raistmagic

    Raistmagic

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    I love the typing of this guy. Grass has become a little more versatile in this generation.

    I can see grass types getting a lot of use due to how common waters will be.
  14. Garganator

    Garganator

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    Hmmm I guess I took out by accident on cherubi calculator Life Orb, missing some damage in calculations. I fixed this. However when I look at this, maybe it's worth to invest a bit more in physical defense, as you can't OHKO Garchomp anyway, especially with Yache Berry on.
  15. Manaphy

    Manaphy

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    This Guy looks like he has a of of potential. He has a great defensive Typing, and not bad Defenses. Speed is great too. The Speedy Physical Tank Set Seems like the best for him. I would put some more EVs in Defense, as you shouldn't stay in on Garchomp anyway.


    EDIT: After looking at this guy's resists, he might make good use in Ubers. He Resists all common Ubers Attacking Types except for Ice and Dragon, and his Speed lets him Outspeed most things in Ubers.

    The 'Offensive CM Set' Looks like it could function quite well in Ubers.
  16. Jonathan

    Jonathan

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    I agree that the "Speedy Physical Tank" set has the most potential in OU. There are very few Pokemon whose stats and move-pool support such a role, which means if such a role is needed in the metagame there's a good chance Birijion will end up in OU.

    And now my real reason for posting (hey at least I'm being honest):

    [​IMG][​IMG] (because apparently 40 Nest Balls and 15 Heal Balls aren't enough to catch a sleeping Pokemon at 1 HP...)
    Nature: Jolly
    IVs: 30 / 22 / 24 / 23 / 19 / 30
    HP Electric 67 (in case anyone's curious)

    A pity about the Speed IV, but I think it's great otherwise. This was the fourth one I caught, and really I didn't see my luck getting any better without RNG abuse, so I decided to keep it. Thoughts?

    EDIT: By the way, at level 50 this guy speed ties with Base-108s which have 31 Speed IVs. I don't know if WiFi Battles still auto-level to Lv. 100 or whether it's to Lv. 50 now, but I thought I'd point this out. This has good implications for VGC use though.
  17. Click

    Click

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    Here is something that came to mind when looking at it's stats/movepool
    'Dual Screener'
    Birijion @ Light Clay / Leftovers
    252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
    Bold Nature
    ~ Taunt
    ~ Grass Knot/Leaf Blade
    ~ Reflect
    ~ Light Screen

    Typically you would think it would be much more of a sweeper, but it has great potential for a screener as well. Any thoughts?
  18. Nastyjungle

    Nastyjungle fat and sassy
    is an Artist Alumnusis a Forum Moderator Alumnus

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    The ability to hit the new defensive core of Burunguru+Nattorei for SE damage is a huge selling point to Birijion. Close Combat+Leaf Blade is a godsend to him. Combine that with great Special walling abilities and respectable bulk otherwise, I can see this being a very prominent Pokemon. Being able to throw up screens only helps his case further.

    However, as an all out attacker, despite its lower speed, I feel it's outclassed by Breloom. It does however, have access to a lot of things that Loom doesn't, and I feel it definitely won't have problems finding its niche. A great Pokemon overall.
  19. min min

    min min

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    Taunt SD seems the best option for Birijion, shutting down NatBun, even better than Sazandora and other wallbreakers. Pity about the lack of coverage, Stone Edge/Holy Sword seems the best bet coverage-wise as a +4 Stone Edge (which isn't too hard to get against Burungeru) does the job as well as a Leaf Blade. I don't like Close Combat that much as it lowers your impressive defences, and making you Doryuuzu food in Sandstorm (iirc X-Scissor does a ton with -1 Def).
  20. evadw

    evadw

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    birijion is actually really good

    i have an adamant birijion, and it is really really good. here's my set
    Birijion @Leftovers
    Adamant | 252Atk/252Spe/4HP
    ~Leaf Blade
    ~Stone Edge/ substitute/taunt
    ~Swords Dance
    ~Holy Sword
    just a basic sweeper set, but if you can get in a swords dance, it becomes unstoppable due to its nice speed stat.
    suggest or constructively criticize this set if there's anything wrong with it, because this is my first post on this forum, and i'm not the best strategist ever.
  21. min min

    min min

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    You mean this?

    Birijion @Leftovers
    Adamant | 252Atk/252Spe/4HP
    ~Leaf Blade
    ~Stone Edge
    ~Swords Dance
    ~Substitute/Holy Sword (???What do you want here???)

    Well, you have to run a fighting move no matter what, just for the sheer power of a boosted Holy Sword. When you do get Holy Sword, replace one of the first 2 moves with it. Substitute can also be Taunt, if you want, they both allow you to amass huge amounts of Swords Dances. However Taunt does not protect you from random Boiling Water burns or Arceus forbid, Ice Beam freezes. But it does leave your impresive bulk intact. Suit yourself.
  22. evadw

    evadw

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    sorry if it was a bit unorthodox. thanks for the help, I'll change it. i'll just replace stone edge with sub or taunt. stone edge is a bit unreliable, but it does give it a lot of type coverage, such as pure poison.
  23. Cristhianmlr

    Cristhianmlr

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    Sorry, I'm don't have a moveset now, I'm explain this: Justice Heart don't give to the user an inmmunity to Dark moves, the user still take damage from the Dark moves, but still increasing it Attack STAB.

    Doesn't matter, Virijion resist those attacks.

    See you.
  24. Scoopapa

    Scoopapa
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    I was initially very confused as to why there was so much emphasis on a Swords Dance set, until I went and tried it out on PO. Now I'm actually convinced that Sword Dance is THE set for Birijion. Grass/Fighting/Rock is actually amazing type coverage, and the high speed combined with good bulk mean that it can set up easily and attack several times before going down. On top of that it can counter and check a multitude of threats, making it very useful to have on your team. The physical bulk isn't quite as bad as I thought it'd be, probably thanks to the awesome typing (It's a Doryuuzu counter, for instance). The special bulk is another big selling point, as it can easily survive super effective hits from Starmie, Scarf Sazandora, and Espeon (beware of Psycho Shock), to name a few.

    I ran the most conservative version, I guess, since it has Leftovers as opposed to Life Orb and Holy Sword instead of Close Combat. I didn't want to squander that cool typing and awesome special bulk. I'm sure other versions could work too, however.

    Birijion @ Leftovers
    4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe, Jolly

    Swords Dance
    Leaf Blade
    Holy Sword
    Stone Edge

    In my experience it was easier to sweep with this than with Terakion, although that's highly subjective.
  25. The3DOstrich

    The3DOstrich

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    Fighting gave this guy really good physical stab, and its stats are great (barring it's mediocre Def), and with entry hazard support and acess to roar, it could make a good phazer.

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