Mafia vs Village Weeb Mafia: GAME OVER! Postgame in #504-505

i don't understand what everyone was thinking the last day. did none of you realize the sheet was public? hello?

i mean everyone has access to the knowledge that out of the 2 mayor claims, one is dead and that dead person was mafia. everyone should know that out of the 2 rogue claims, 1 is dead mafia.

did no one pay attention to the fact that aubisio said unclesam was mafia? that's not so bad, but then kirsche told shubaka (at least to my understanding) that sam is bad? what? did no one pay attention to the fact that i heavily suspected unclesam? why???

unclesam using the logic of balancing is pretty lame altho it is a convincing argument but then again the hosts decided to shaft the bad anime for w/e reason but that's irrelevant i guess. the real MVPs for good anime were king and to a lesser extent haruno. even then we had a good shot to win but both town and the other mafia choked. expert killer is a dumb role. the end. good game srry 4 any perceived flame
 
I will write a very comprehensive postgame tomorrow, but for now I just want to thank everyone for joining my first Outside Communication game, and I really hope you enjoyed it.

This is my 1000th post on the site, and while I joined a long time ago, all my activity is here in Circus Maximus. I'm not going to do a big thing with shoutouts, but I do want you to know that my time here has been incredibly fun and the experiences I've shared playing games with all of you mean a lot to me. If we've played in a game as enemies or allies or even just talked, you've made me feel like part of an amazing community. I'll definitely continue to play in and host games in the future!
 
Yeah, no offense town, but I'm just really surprised. Sam caused so many mislynches, managed to stay alive for so long despite seemingly leading town, and was never 100% cleaned and nobody caught on? Well, a few people here and there did, but it obviously wasn't enough. Sam literally had everyone in the palm of his hand from day 1.

Gg I guess. Sucks that things had to go the way they did. Twin and Jalmont already voiced my frustration so there's no point in hammering it. Mafia, particularly UncleSam, played well. They really deserved to win.
 
also just so everyone knows as soon as i was sheeted i kicked yeti off but then i gave nomark the decision to re-add her or not. i think part of nomark's play is partly on me because i didn't work with him as much as i should have. that said the best decision he made was to release the sheet publicly which was a good move that should've paid off in the end but didn't.

a criticism i have of my game is that i need to be more assertive. i should've been assertive regarding yeti being on the sheet but more importantly in trusting nomark. i should've worked with him more instead of purposefully leaving him in the dark due to a sort of silly fear that he was bad. i should've been more assertive and switched the lynch to sunny or nico? who was acting super weird. i should've been proactive and added rssp1 although i feared he was wolf. i should've been better about marking US and DLE as bad right away.

so although i think a lot of ppl made mistakes (and maybe bigger mistakes than me but i don't talk about those mistakes right now i talk about me) i could've done better too. well, except for expert killer. i was screwed as soon as i assumed it wasn't in the game, so right away basically. gg
 
hey ggs to good anime you guys definitely deserved the win and played the best out of all the three factions (idk what dle did so im not including him here)
A lot of town seriously misplayed throughout the game so those of you in mylo dont beat yourselves up too badly for messing up. I think it's a learning experience for a lot of people, I know for sure i'm playing OC differently and being a lot more assertive next time.
Thanks to Blazade and Walrein for a fun game, I had a good time being a vig for the first time!
 
Shoutouts to my best friend Blazade for hosting this game. He'd been trying to get me to play mafia for a while, and I decided to do it for his first host. I liked this game a lot (regardless of the fact that my side won)

As for the gameplay, our faction definitely made its own share of mistakes to be honest.

In any event it was great, and I'll definitely play more mafia on here in the future.
 

Haruno

Skadi :)
is a Tiering Contributor Alumnus
Yeah village played like shit this whole game. If I had a bigger dick I would've stealth'd unclesam but the balance argument was pretty good but yknow fuck balance ?___?. If I lynched US, we as good as won. Jalmont if aubisio's niche wasn't playin as shitty as possible then I'd have put more faith but mehhh oh well. Overall village had no competent leadership which led to a double mole which got us shafted but if we didn't lack proper playing I guess it didn't work. I'll post a better post later, fuck eagle for playing badly which made everyone think he was mafia.

I'm saving all my rage for NOC that I got subbed out of
 
eagle didn't play badly though. like the only bad thing he did was not defend himself well and point out the fact that he was the only alive town rogue claim. there was legit no reason to believe eagle was mafia. nothing about his posts suggested he was mafia lol. most importantly he claimed a reasonable role that usually exists on a village. i'm not sure why you thought his posts indicated he was so mafia

not realizing aubisio was telling the truth wasn't that big of a misstep (well it was more of an aubisio misstep)

leadership was ruined by expert killer, a role that is not fun or fair or balanced or interesting. there was only one mole, yeti, who i immediately kicked once i had access only for nomark to re-add her which i allowed (reasoning being it was his decision who to add to the sheet. although i did express my concerns).

you didn't help at all by refusing to help me out and then proceed to not really do anything/contribute to helping me think about who might be mafia. but good effort i guess at the end. much better than king who for some reason never claimed even when he was getting lynched but more importantly IDLED negating any reason he had for not claiming. ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
 

Haruno

Skadi :)
is a Tiering Contributor Alumnus
If you are flaming leadership with your play I don't know what to say.
>thinks leadership isn't terrible
>got 4 village PR dead in night 1
>also gave a mole sheet + pretty much freed up space for a second mile

Come on now lol.

Jalmomt made sure I had no trust him, got king fucked and yeah due to his US village playstyle which didn't work coming from him.
 
>thinks leadership isn't terrible
>got 4 village PR dead in night 1
>also gave a mole sheet + pretty much freed up space for a second mile

Come on now lol.

Jalmomt made sure I had no trust him, got king fucked and yeah due to his US village playstyle which didn't work coming from him.
Except I never said anything about eagle4 and I did say that Sam was bad (although technically I did retract that but still). I didn't fuck king he fucked himself and everyone by refusing to claim and IDLING his ability which is just a waste of everyone's time. It is literally no one's fault but the people who voted eagle because the information was readily available to anyone with a brain.

Actually trying to accomplish things in this game and figuring it out is much better than sitting around complaining about the work that others are putting in. I gave you an opportunity to help me out and you decided to believe I was mafia instead. That's not town behavior and it isn't much better than everything the village leadership did do. (wait it isn't better)
 
Honestly killing twin n1 was a good play on mafia's part. Other people tried to step up as village leader, but nobody was really...strong enough, I guess. Idk how to word it.

Twin did fine. He had scumreads on Galap and Nico and probably could've gotten them lynched early if he was still in the game. At the very least, he successfully got pancake. Twin's only real mistake was misvigging me.
 
leadership was ruined by expert killer
OK so if I wanted a game where just one or two people could carry a town to victory I would have designed it that way, where there was clear and easy counterplay to the role. You are right in that no one individual person's survival was guaranteed, however there were lots of ways to clean people and expand leadership efficiently. Village leadership wasn't destroyed. Organization wasn't destroyed. I felt that every townie had a hand in making very important decisions for their faction because of the way events unfolded, and that a victory here would have been a true victory for the town, an uninformed majority making careful decisions about who to trust and coordinating in times of peril.

I don't think that having a balance where it's very common for a specific person to live a long time is sacred, and while Expert Killer is a role I'd seriously rework if I put it in future games, I don't think it was a problem in a game as swingy by design as this.
 
Yeah I think the killing of twin N1 was a major turning point (which is kind of weird to say since it was so early). That said, it could have been anyone's game still after that point, but things would have gone down a very different path if that were the case. And I think we (good anime) would have had a much harder time of it.
 

Haruno

Skadi :)
is a Tiering Contributor Alumnus
Yeah I think the killing of twin N1 was a major turning point (which is kind of weird to say since it was so early). That said, it could have been anyone's game still after that point, but things would have gone down a very different path if that were the case. And I think we (good anime) would have had a much harder time of it.
Killing twin wasn't that big compared to yeti taking over + pseudo cleaning US + getting rid of two PR.
 
OK so if I wanted a game where just one or two people could carry a town to victory I would have designed it that way, where there was clear and easy counterplay to the role. You are right in that no one individual person's survival was guaranteed, however there were lots of ways to clean people and expand leadership efficiently. Village leadership wasn't destroyed. Organization wasn't destroyed. I felt that every townie had a hand in making very important decisions for their faction because of the way events unfolded, and that a victory here would have been a true victory for the town, an uninformed majority making careful decisions about who to trust and coordinating in times of peril.

I don't think that having a balance where it's very common for a specific person to live a long time is sacred, and while Expert Killer is a role I'd seriously rework if I put it in future games, I don't think it was a problem in a game as swingy by design as this.
expert killer is bad because there are roles that can accomplish the same thing that don't make me auto-die as soon as i claimed my role name or nomark sheeted yeti. the way in which it interacts with other roles in a non-standard way makes the game unclear and is unfair to villagers. how is shubaka supposed to explain why his role doesn't work? how am i supposed to prepare for a role that i don't expect to be in the game and have no reason to expect it to be in the game? i don't focus on expanding leadership because there is no reason to expect a kill to bypass 3 types of protection.

the role also only works based on an element of surprise. if i know it's in the game then i never claim my role name or no one else ever talks about their role name. the role is now useless and a waste of space for the most part.

theoretically the trade-off to a village leader should always be that more important roles are not protected. obviously things don't work out that way because as you would have it, smarter players tend to be more valuable than good roles come late game due to situations where you have people who don't know what they're doing or don't make correct choices that a different player would make correctly. i liked mithril's bg role because it added an element of doubt to things. that's good.

i think it's totally fine if you want to go the route of nerfing the village leader so they don't live forever but expert killer is not the way to go. don't put any protection roles in the game. don't put in a BG or limit it from protecting the same person one night. but when i can't counterplay it or have no expectation of it being in the game, then it just removes my agency and makes planning useless.

also there weren't lots of surefire ways to clean people and expand leadership efficiently. this is kind of like sam saying in metagame "yeti add more kids to the sheet" but there were no roles to clean anyone with so we were left to guessing. DLE had a mole role, and there was one alliance checker. role name checker doesn't really mean much because flavor is fairly arbitrary although i admit that it's close. it's totally reasonable that people won't get sheeted quickly or at all due to a lack of real ways to clean people and there definitely weren't. maybe i am a bit of an outlier because i am more paranoid than a lot of ppl on this site, but if you look at my sheet day 2, who on there reasonably deserves the sheet? rssp1? could be wolf.. flyhn? role isn't really proven etc. The person I considered adding the most was kirsche and as we all know that would've been a mistake LOL!
 

Ampharos

tag walls, punch fascists
is a Community Contributor Alumnus
ok everyone (read: haruno and twin) needs to chill the fuck out

pointing fingers isn't going to do anything except get people salty, there's no prize for winning the blame game and both of you know that the other person isn't going to stop and say "oh you're right i royally fucked up and am terrible, sorry O Great Mafia Master"

this is leading nowhere and is stifling actual setup-related discussion that would help blazade become a better host in the future - and we need more good hosts, i can't keep trading off with yeti for all eternity

fucking children itt

edit: i'm now surrounded by two good setup critiques, keep it up jalmont/yeti
 

Yeti

dark saturday
is a Community Contributor Alumnus
the village shouldn't be flaming itself lol, don't throw stones in glass houses.

ive mentioned this to blazade before but for the record the village had too many people in combination with the nightly vig. if they aimed ideally every cycle they won 100%, and that was assuming both mafia never crossfired and got eliminated at an equal rate.

the mafias had to never stab each other until the very end of the game and somehow mole deep into the village to force both mislynches and misvigs. you all saw how close we were to losing this game anyway...

twin shouldn't be flaming anyone, he literally vigged his own role-twin. jesus. somewhatoddish you really did nothing wrong, twin just went full retard. sam would have stopped it but >mafia

Mithril i honestly felt really bad mislynching you, i could tell you weren't mafia from your behavior and if i was town i dont let jalmont mislynch you, ever. but... as mafia it behooved me to let jalmont flail between shubaka, sunny iirc and nico and stay on yourself. then we had to pick eagle4 to mislynch next and force the poor guy into a tough position too =\ this game required so many mislynches on our part to get the win...

3 mislynches and 2 misvigs and we only vigged kids anime and still nearly lost LAWDY

sam was technically on the sheet d1 after empoof miscleaned him before it was revealed that the busdriver situation meant empoof had cleaned twin, not sam. then sam got removed and we killed twin off but still had about half the claims.

nomark's great error was sheeting me and i contend jalmont too instead of rssp1 as twin had said to on the sheet if the oddish kill went off. it wasn't rssp1's fault twin had idiot tier aim and i am still uncertain why neither nomark nor jalmont added rssp1 to the sheet. i know why i didnt/never pushed for it lol but ayy

our team would've been wiped out pretty quickly if i didnt get sheeted, we gave galap a pretty shoddy claim and nico got owned by the fact nightly vig rssp1 existed, she should've been killed off a lot sooner, her role made 0 sense when rssp1 proved his n1. i took our best claim but we only succeeded by using what we learned from the other mafia and off the sheet to fulfill my role name checks. they also got caught out by twin's gay af gmaxing... if you do this to newbies you are a huge douchebag who needs to sit tf right down. stalking their smogon profiles to see if they're engaged in convo to determine if a 1 poster is mafia is just a pathetic strategy, you are trying to discourage them from learning about the game from their teammates and it's smh tier that 1 posters NEED to set their profiles to private so twin cant stalk them lol.

sam mislynched/vigged more villagers than me! and so did twin! and jalmont! ayy

shout out to king_ for giving us that free necessary mislynch to allow us to win the game. now yall know why i ragesubbed ullar for refusing to talk to his team. king was even worse and didnt use his action, when he did we stopped it. never claimed. never did anything.

that kids kill on me was so absolutely infuriating. we told them to kill nomark, i guess maybe we should have said he was the village info role that kept FINDING THEIR TEAM to ensure they ACTUALLY killed him because instead they went full retard and killed me, the bg who can't self-protect. ughhhhhhhhhhhhh grrrrrrrrrrr aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa we had the game won a lot sooner if i didnt die, instead sam had to tryhard and lynch nico and possibly lynch galap as well as force all the misfires to knock down village #s.

also i was the good anime PS alt lol IT WAS ME THE WHOLE TIME, we were actually convinced jalmont was on the kids anime as their good bc their alt had similar cadence to him and the mithril mislynch made us suspect he had done it intentionally lol.

this game was incredibly easy for village to win if sam and i had actually been town like i wanted, unfortunately he buffooned our request and requested same team not we individually asked to be town so we got the typical yeti+oldfag+2 randos/idlers. RIP the yeti/lw/flyhn team lmaooo. we wouldn't have mislynched such as mithril and eagle4 or misvigged poor oddish. but as mafia we had to sabotage as much as we could.

jw wtf dle was doing all game, he never told our team he was neutral and the kids never quite told us why their kill failed... fsr we trusted him a lot mroe than we should have. i also choked by putting him on myself even though we were supposed to be hooking him instead of shubaka on myself, it was a huge error on my part to have done that. i think i just spaced that we wanted to kill dle when i had to churn out the village actions for nomark's approval.

the game # distribution heavily favored a village win, it was only through extreme misplays on their part they lost it. but it happens. ah well. i applaud blazade for some interesting twists he put on standard roles like the bg and rogue who were if x, then y as opposed to standard, plus the hooker twins were cool even though they both died n1, in part bc twin was a huge threat and needed to gtfo. he had talked to me about how nico and galap were caught by his gmaxing and i was like oookay it's time for you to leave lol. his roles were inventive though i think our team was meh in terms of our roles namely sam's, he was essentially a mafia goon especially after he misused dictatorship after i told him not to.

anw gg to all sorry to those we had to mislynch/deceive to get our own win 8( gg to my team solid batch of 2 good newbies and my boo <3 and nico's comics lmaooooo top tier new user. hope to see both back in future mafias and galap take a bit more of an active role in his next game!
 

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