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Welcome to Smallville (peaked #5)

Discussion in 'BW OU Teams' started by Cherub Agent, Jul 24, 2012.

  1. Cherub Agent

    Cherub Agent ium and me <3
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    [​IMG]


    Hey Smogon. It's been like over a year since I posted an OU team, so I figured why the hell not just post my current one. This team has allowed me to peak at 1994 on the official PS! server and got me voting reqs for Round 9 of the Suspect system, so I'm pretty chuffed with it. Here's the proof:

    [​IMG]

    EDIT1 6/12/12: I've decided to bump my team. I recently got back into playing on the weekends, as during the week I have absolutely no time (I'm a soldier). This team is still an absolute blast to play with, but the metagame has changed quite a bit with the banning of Genesect and the introduction of Cube. I've still not peaked #1 or anything, but I don't aim to since that's impossible when I can only play twice a week. Nevertheless, I have hit the 1900s without too much effort and it still enjoys a very healthy W/L ratio, particularly thanks to my replacing Jolteon with Keldeo.

    EDIT2 10/01/13 Yeah, bumped the RMT with my new ladder score, and major changes that can be seen here. The concept of the team has changed dramatically, as I've taken out both of my setup sweepers in Jirachi and Toxicroak. No more turns setting up are wasted, and this suits my style far better. Every Pokemon on my team has become much more flexible and powerful enough to beat opponents one on one without the need to set up, so while I no longer have assured win conditions, the team plays even more agressively than before, and that ultimately lead to more success.

    Smallville is MY show at the moment (I know it's old now, but I'm only watching it for the first time, and have fallen in love lol.) Since the team is based off very fast and very powerful creatures (Kryptonians) I guess it could fit. And since if I called it something like "My first OU Rain team, please rate", I know nobody would even take a look at the thread.

    I'm really sorry to present you guys with another Rain team. You must really be sick of them by now, but this team is new territory for me. It's very, very fast paced, (generally I'm more of a bulky offensive guy, who loves the Dragon/Steel combo, entry hazards, status conditions and all that crap). This time, I decided to forego status, Dragons (although I do need a Steel, doesn't every team?) and limited myself to only Stealth Rock. This team is all about moving first, and hitting with some very powerful attacks. Rain perfectly suits this kind of playstyle, as it boosts the power of Water-type moves and the accuracy of the devastating Thunder and Hurricane. Keldeo and Tornadus-T are among the fastest Pokemon in OU, and I use both of them. Furthermore, 2 different priority moves really help in guaranteeing that this team won't ever be cleanly swept by Pokemon that boost their Speed. So here you go, rate away, and thanks in advance!

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    Chloe Sullivan
    Politoed @ Choice Specs
    Trait: Drizzle
    EVs: 244 HP / 252 SAtk / 12 Spd
    Modest Nature
    - Hydro Pump -
    - Ice Beam -
    - Focus Blast -
    - Psychic -

    Everyone knows what Politoed does: it brings the eternal downpour. Another common fact is that Politoed sucks. I respectfully disagree. Sure, it has no awesome typing, or any extraordinary stats, but it DOES present some very nice power (well, Hydro Pump at least) and some quite respectable bulk. I've tried basically every single Politoed variant out there apart from Choice Scarf, since I feel that it's easily Toed's worst set. I initially started off with ResTalk, then Lefties + 3 Attacks, then Water Gem, then physically defensive, then Splash Plate. However, and I don't know why it took me so long, I landed on Choice Specs. A big part of my decision was probably because I removed Specs on Tornadus-T, but I am so, so glad that I did. Specs Politoed is simply an absolute behemoth, 2HKOing Pokemon such as Kyurem-B, defensive opposing Politoed and Tank Latias with Hydro Pump, OHKOing bulkier offensive threats such as Stealth Rock Garchomp and Tornadus-T without any entry hazards, and basically fucking up pretty much anything. Even weaknened pink blobs fall to Hydro Pump, so I'm kinda lost for words when I realized that for such a long time I'd been using Splash Plate of all things... Anyway it's really easy to keep Rain up, partly because it's the most common weather, partly because Toed fucks up Ninetales and Tyranitar to kingdom come, and Hail is always easy to beat thanks to my team members. Hydro Pump can sometimes 2HKO even Ferrothorn with a little bit of previous damage, around 15%. So obviously it's the move that I just spam the most. All the other moves are really niche, but have had their uses. Ice Beam is for Dragonites that think that they can set up on me, and for stuff like Celebi, or Gliscor or something when I don't want to risk a Hydro Pump miss. Focus Blast decimates Ferrothorn, but can easily be replaced since I've taken enough measures that it's simply not a threat to my team anymore. Psychic is there exclusively for Toxicroak, but is also a damn cool move to use against incoming Tentacruel. Toxicroak is easily the biggest, nastiest threat for my team, but Politoed is very, very adept at luring him out. I need to rely on my predictions skills, but so far I've nailed multiple Toxicroak with it, so I'm fairly confident in my ability at doing this. Politoed's bulk is also underappreciated, as it can surive a +1 Outrage from Dragonite, even with only HP investment. My experience this round has convinced me that Choice Specs is simply his best set, and I'm definetly not gonna change it.

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    Lois Lane
    Keldeo-R @ Choice Scarf
    Trait: Justified
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 252 Spd / 4 SDef
    Timid Nature
    - Hydro Pump -
    - Surf -
    - Secret Sword -
    - Hidden Power [Ice] -

    My first speed demon, Keldeo is an underrated Pokemon, and is the reason I'm updating this team. I previously had Jolteon in this spot, which formed a cute VoltTurn combo with Tornadus T, but with a different meta I decided a wanted to use a new Pokemon. And boy am I glad I did. See, previously, I had a very offensive Rain team... which completely lacked any Water-type moves apart from on Politoed. I'm not sure how the team managed to be successful with this flaw, but it now simply works even better than before. Keldeo is far faster than Jolteon and is able to revenge kill stuff such as boosted Salamence and Volcarona now, which Jolteon was unable to. The loss of Choice Specs in irrelevant since Keldeo's main moves get boosted by Rain anyway, ergo, Keldeo is my replacement with better Speed, better type synergy and better power. Can't ask for more. I often use it as my late game cleaner. and great check to Scizor and Mamoswine Keldeo is also extremely helpful as a Cloyster counter, which was incredibly annoying for me before. I mean, Jirachi could handle Icicle Spear and Rock Blast, but +2 STAB Water-type moves in the Rain were not fun at all and left my main sweeper crippled. Keldeo on the other hand always outspeeds, OHKOs, and resists every move Cloyster commonly uses.


    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    Oliver Queen
    Tornadus-Therian @ Life Orb
    Trait: Regenerator
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 252 Spd / 4 Def
    Timid Nature
    - Hurricane -
    - Focus Blast -
    - U-turn -
    - Taunt -

    Come on, I'm using an offensive Rain team, of course I had to abuse this monster. I'm pretty sure everyone now knows how this guy works, but I'll dumb it down: simply massacre everything in sight with Hurricane. Few teams pack a Flying-resistance, making the move incredibly spammable. I changed this to a Life Orb set mainly because I gave Politoed Choice Specs and I don't like teams with three Choced mons without a spinner. However, the ability to switch moves came with a very, very nice benefit: I can now completely destroy weatherless Heavy Offense if I lead with this guy, thanks to Taunt. Taunt denies Deoxy-D its hazards, and I can then U-Turn on the switch to either brings in a counter to the Pokemon the opponent brings in if he switches, or Politoed to go for the KO with Hydro Pump is it's some weird attacking Deoxys-D. I went with Focus Blast over Superpower on this set simply because I don't need it. Mamoswine and Breloom already crush the pink blobs, and Jirachi and Tornadus-T can beat them as well, just not so directly. I prefer Focus Blast for the stronger hit on Ferrothorn, Magnezone and Heatran, but towards the end I've been using HP Ground. Don't judge me lol, I know that generally the Fighting-type move is the better option, but considering Hurricane already 2HKOs Ferrothorn, I've liked the OHKO HP Ground provides on the Maggy and Tran. It's also damn cool for nailing Ninetales, as it deals 55.14 - 65.73%, which greatly helps in winning the weather war. I've kept Focus Blast in the moveslot for the RMT since it's th move I've used the most. The main real perk of it is KOing Tyranitar though, which is generally more crucial. The team really does laugh at Tyranitar though, as everything can beat it one one one. You guys tell me what move to use here, and I'll probably just end up using it. U-Turn is obligatroy for wearing down his counters and giving me cool momentum after using Taunt on things that then can't hurt it (also finishing off stuff like Starmie, Latios, Celebi and Alakazam is Rain isn't up for some reason).

    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    Lex Luthor
    Breloom @ Life Orb
    Trait: Life Orb
    EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4 Def
    Jolly Nature
    - Spore -
    - Bullet Seed -
    - Low Sweep -
    - Mach Punch -

    Breloom is the Pokemon that replaced Toxicroak. The latter is undoubtedly a really great Pokemon at the moment (I should know, it's easily the biggest threat to my team), but Breloom just offers me more. The main reason for my change is Spore. With Spore, Breloom can easily remove annoying walls that are outpaced with max Speed, such as Jirachi, Tentacruel, Zapdos, Ferrothorn, etc. I know that the latter can be Low Swept, but they normally switch out of Breloom anyway and at least Spore gurantees that entry hazards won't go up. The synergy behind Low Sweep+Spore is beautiful as well, as I can easily force something like Tyranitar out with Low Sweep, slow down an incoming faster threat such as Zapdos, and the Spore it. The other two moves are just as useful: Bullet Seed is devastating, and with some luck can simply take out Pokemon that resist the attack such as Latios as they switch in on it. It also destroys Pokemon that are bothersome such as Rotom-W, Vaporeon, Jellicent, and other Pokemon neutral to it such as Landorus and Tentacruel. Mach Punch is awesome, awesome priority, and ensures me that stuff like Terrakion will be unable to sweep my team. It's not like it has many setup opportunities, but things can get ugly if it manages to nab a situation like Keldeo being locked into HP Ice, or Mamoswine if he knows he can force me out since he also has a Dragon-type that needs to be revenged. Speaking of Mamoswine, it's really similar to Breloom. Both have awesome priority moves that mean that I basically never get swept by setup Pokemon, multihit moves for breaking Substitutes, and phenomenal power behind them. Both can break down or weaken eachothers counters so that the other can then go on a rampage. Breloom, while frail, also has some pretty nifty resisances that I can abuse.


    [​IMG][​IMG][​IMG]
    Clark Kent
    Jirachi @ Leftovers
    Trait: Serene Grace
    EVs: 252 HP / 4 Spe / 252 SpDef
    Sassy Nature
    - Stealth Rock -
    - U-Turn -
    - Thunder -
    - Iron Head -

    The Man of Steel in person. Previously the SubCM set (this was easily one of the most reliable Pokemon on my team, however, I really needed to put Stealth Rock on Jirachi as Mamoswine wasn't cutting it), HaxRachi now takes its place. While not as lethal as the setup sweeper set, this set's value lies not in its offensive capabilites, as my team hase nough of those. What I needed was a stronge defensive backbone/pivot, that could come in on the metagame's biggest threat and beat them. HaxRachi was the perfect fit. What's unusual about this set is the lack of Wish. I had it for the vast majority of the time, but to be honest rarely found myself actually using it. For the most part, Jirachi was regaining its HP through haxing the oppoenent and benefiting from Leftovers. Wish has on occasion been useful, but more for healing Jirachi than it's teammates. Fac of the matter though, is that Jirachi forces so, so many switches that U-Turn is simply invaluable on it. My Pokemon absolutely adore coming in for free, and that fact has benefited me in the long run far more than the recovery they received from Wish. It lets me completely laugh at incoming Garchomp, as he normally has nothing to lose by coming in on Jirachi. Unfortunately, my Mamoswine has now come in for free and can squeeze off a free powerhit, or Tornadus-T can fire off another free Hurricane. The synergy between U-Turn and my teammates is just invaluable. Oh yeah, and it lets me escape from Magnezone and Dugtrio. That's always cool. Thunder and Iron Head are completely standard, no explanation needed imo. The combo screws over so many Pokemon that I feel bad for using it, but hey, that's Jirachi! Jirachi's typing is a blessing for the team, as is its bulk, which lead to SR going up nigh 100% of the time.


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    Lana Lang
    Mamoswine @ Life Orb
    Trait: Thick Fat
    EVs: 4 Def / 252 Atk / 252 Spd
    Adamant Nature
    - Earthquake -
    - Ice Shard -
    - Superpower -
    - Icicle Spear -

    Aaaand, last but certainly not least, the rising star of the B2W2 metagame, Mamoswine. Mamoswine was initially chosen because I needed Stealth Rock on a Pokemon that could keep up the offensive pressure. That role has since been relegated to Jirachi, who performs it much better. Now Mamoswine has Superpower, which is excellent as it allows me to lure out and cripple Rotom-W so that Tornadus-T can have a field day. The far more powerful hit on Ferrothorn is also much appreciated, as is the abiliy to crush Balloon Heatran and Magnezone. The OHKO on Blisse is also really nice.. The brilliant STAB coverage means that I don't really need another coverage move. Earthquake is extremely powerful, and easily smashes through walls that don't resist the move. Pokemon that resist or are immune to it are easily picked off by either Ice Shard or Icicle Spear. For my entire DW career I used this same Mamoswine with Icicle Crash over Spear, but I decided to just try it out for the hell of it, and it works fine. Breaking Multiscale, Gliscor and Breloom Subs really is a godsend. Before my edit I had a Jolly nature to break 194 Speed Hydreigon Subs, but since then I've not encountered a single one (WHY guys, it's such an awesome Pokemon ;_;). Therefore, I changed the nature to Adamant cause I saw in a thread that that was the groovy thing to do now. The extra power is pretty cool though, as it's a noticeably bigger hit on stuff like Volcarona, Reuniclus and the blobs, not to mention a more powerful Ice Shard for picking off TT and Chlorophyll sweepers.


    So, there's my team. Like any offensive team, I don't hesitate to sac Pokemon if it means that another teammate can pull off a clean sweep. Play aggressively and keep constant pressure on the opponent. This team fares up well against pretty much every teamstyle out there from what I've seen (although I did have some trouble with a certain TR team...). Toxicroak is the biggest threat, since if SR is down, it's Jolly and is at +2, which is really easy for it to pull off, I've probably already lost. This is an offensive team that simply doesn't need Spikes or setup mons, which is quite unique for the playstyle, but it obviously works. If you like the team, I wouldn't mind a Luvdisc :3​
  2. PDC

    PDC D I R T
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    hello, this is a pretty cool team and i like it alot, so good job on that!

    first i can suggest a bulkier spread on cbzor, which takes alot of pressure from pokemon like specs latios, reuniclus, and alakazam. i can suggest running a bulkier spread with iron plate, this gives bullet punch a solid power, while still giving you bulk enough to get through with the many threats in the metagame. i suggest running a spread of 252 HP / 40 Atk / 216 SDef to combat these threats. not much else i want to change to disrupt the synergy here, so good job on the team and good luck!
  3. Cinco Diablo

    Cinco Diablo

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    Hey there. That's a pretty good rain team you got going on there. I'd be happy to make some suggestions for you to try to help make this team much better than it is now. For the Politoed set you currently have, you could use a Choice Scarf over your current Leftovers. You would also want to use a Timid nature on Politoed to outspeed standard Thundurus-T, which is a huge threat to your team. On Jolteon, you might want to run Shadow Ball to help hit Latios, and other Psychic/Ghost typed pokes in the tier. On Tornadus-T, you could run a Mixed Life Orb set. When equipped with Life Orb, Tornadus-T can use it's vast movepool to KO many top threats in the tier. I hope that this advice was useful. Have fun and good luck with your team!

    Tornadus-T (open)
    [​IMG]

    Tornadus @ Life Orb Lv. 100 -- Regenerator
    Nature: Naive - EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
    Hidden Power [Ice]
    Heat Wave
    Superpower
    Hurricane


    ~Dr Ciel
  4. GatoDelFuego

    GatoDelFuego NP: Simon Viklund--Double Cross
    is a Contributor to Smogonis a Smogon Media Contributor
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    I suppose I helped name this team :D

    I feel the same way you do about joleton, but I promise it's garbage. It often doesn't "revenge" those things very well, and when I used one I replaced it with a Choice Scarfed Starmie. I PROMISE you, it works just as well, if not better, with superior coverage to smack down the dragons and grasses. If you don't mind giving up vol-turn, that is. Since you'll be running in to Jirachi a lot, you could put a Dugtrio or Magnezone in there. Once that combination gets popular...well, just use it while you can. I'm not sure what to switch around to make that work, however...but Scizor + Mamoswine seems just slightly redundant.
  5. Cherub Agent

    Cherub Agent ium and me <3
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    Thanks for the rates!

    @PDC - I tried that EV spread and really liked it. Currently however I've had more success with Pocket's suggestion of CM Jirachi in that slot, so I think I'll be using that.

    @Dr Ciel - I've tried Scarf Politoed, but I've never really felt like I had a need for it :/. Jolteon and TT are plenty fast enough, and then I have priority moves with Mamoswine and Toxicroak. My set has more power and bulk than the Scarf set, and being locked into a move on Politoed sucks imo. Regarding Jolteon, Signal Beam 2HKOs Lati@s anyway, just like Shadow Ball, but has the added bonus of also hitting Hydreigon and Celebi. All other things that Shadow Ball hits are hit harder by Thunder anyway (160 vs 180 BP). And regarding Tornadus-T, I don't understand why you're suggesting the LO set? I have Toxicroak, Mamoswine and Jirachi to beat the pink blobs, and Politoed (and all those other three) beat Tyranitar anyway, so I see no need for Superpower. Besides, I'm mainly only going to be using U-Turn and Hurricane anyway, which benefit more from being choiced than losing health to LO.

    @GatoDelFuego - I must have worded that wrong. Obviously I don't use Jolteon as a revenge killer, that's just a side job that he can also perform with his blazing Speed. I use him in conjunction wih TT to keep immense offensive pressure on the opponent, something that Starmie cannot do. Mamoswine can generally take out Jirachi, and it can also fall to Toxicroak, not to mention continuous Thunders and Hydro Pumps. Basically I just hit it hard and keep hitting it, although I admit it can be a pain. I wouldn't know where to fit Dugtrio or Magnezone in anyway. But CM Jirachi is probably taking the place of Scizor anyway.
  6. Asek

    Asek A heart of stone, a smoking gun
    is a Team Rater Alumnus
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    Hey,

    Great team Cherub Agent, I love your format and theme. I did notice some threats can trouble you however. First off
    2 Electric immunity's and Mamoswines Ice Shard means Thundurus-T won't be Volt Switching or Thunder'ing his way though the team any time soon.

    I saw that your Politoed is aiming for a bulky offense approach, but I have never really found Leftovers recovery useful on Politoed unless he's running a completely defensive set. Thats why I think you should try out Water Gem > Leftovers on Toed. Water Gem is a one time Choice Specs Hydro Pump and lets you bluff a choice set / Shed Shell and catching an opponent off guard with a ridiculously powerful Hydro Pump lets you get some suprise KO's, most notably on Ninetales / Ttar thinking you are locked into Ice Beam / Hidden Power. Having said that Leftovers may be your preferred option for winning long drawn out weather wars.

    If you do decide to remove Scizor for CM Jirachi, be aware that it could leave you open to Scarf / Double Dance Terrakion as it can swtich in on Tornadus U-Turn and if Jolteon locks itself into one of its 2 coverage moves it can switch in and set up (I'm assuming you don't run Flash Cannon on Jirachi BTW). Thats why I do suggest you fit Flash Cannon somewhere on that Jirachi set for an OK STAB and also serves well to beat hail and Terrakion.

    Lastly, Although you may miss the power of Adamant, Jolly on Toxicroak lets you outspeed Jolly Mamoswine, otherwise annoying for your team and also lets you outspeed Adamant Lucario. Both of these 2 can be pains for your team so I think it is a switch that you should try out.

    GL with the team, Luvdisc'd
  7. Cherub Agent

    Cherub Agent ium and me <3
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    Wow Asek thanks for the rate

    Don't worry, I discussed with Pocket and we agreed that Flash Cannon would definetly be the STAB move on Jirachi.

    Water Gem sounds like a very, very cool option. I wish I'd though of that. In particular I love the ability to bluff a choice item, not to mention I can finish the weather war in one fell swoop if Ninetales/Ttar come in. Definetly gonna use that.

    You're absolutely right about Jolly on Toxicroak as well: LO should more than make up for the power loss of using a neutral nature anyway, and outspeeding those two threats seems very beneficial.

    Thanks a lot for the rate, that was very useful


    EDIT: changed Scizor to Jirachi, it fits snugly into the team. Oh and Water Gem and Jolly Croak
  8. Cherub Agent

    Cherub Agent ium and me <3
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    Well I can't beleive I made this team in the summer. I've decided to pick it up again after recently getting back into Pokemon, but with Keldeo in the place of Jolteon, and the team is performing even more admirably than before. I think I've edited out all mentions of the little pup, but if you read something in the RMT that doesn't make sense please let me know so I can fix it. There have been some other changes that I've implemented after playtesting, which are:

    Splash Plate > Water Gem on Politoed
    Sleep Talk > Heat Wave on Tornadus T
    Adamant > Jolly on Mamoswine

    Oh yeah and Rotom-W is a complete fucktard to this team, especially the SpD version. It can wall my hard hitters, use my Rain against me and generally be a massive pain in the ass. Toxicroak is really the only one together with Jirachi that can break it, but Toxicroak loathes WoW and Jirachi loathes Rain boosted Hydro Pumps when it doesn't have a CM. Need help with this thing.
  9. Neliel

    Neliel Sacred Sword

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    I see a weakness to Sun team, since Ninetales itself can give trouble to Tornadus-t, Toxicroak, Jirachi, and even keldeo and Politoed to an extent. You know that Ninetales always have will-o-wisp and Sunny day, meaning that politoed can not switch-in safely on it without taking a burn, and if it does sunny day then he can switchback to Venusaur and this can be problematic.

    The other that i noticed is that you are completely destroyed by Rotom-w. Rotom-w can Volt switch on Politoed, Keldeo, Tornadus, Hydro pump on Jirachi and can burn Toxicroak and Mamoswine. You only have mamoswine to take Eletric attacks, but since rotom-w its like one of the best counter of Mamoswine it does not count.

    Again, i have to suggest an Orb Latias instead of Toxicroak. Toxicroak is the most repleaceble member, and Latias checks some things that toxicroak check, mostly Fighting, water and grass types. Latias can switch-in easily on Ninetales without having its stab weakened, which is fine, and its also a nice Rotom-w check. It still check Breloom, Keldeo, and terrakion like Toxicroak did.

    Latias set:
    Show Hide
    Latias (F) @ Life Orb
    Trait: Levitate
    EVs: 252 SAtk / 4 SDef / 252 Spd
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Draco Meteor
    - Surf
    - Psyshock
    - Recover
  10. Cherub Agent

    Cherub Agent ium and me <3
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    Oooh I like the look of that, thanks man. It really, really helps against Rotom-W, not to mention you're absolutely right in that it can check the same things that Toxicroak can. My only qualm is that the baldy Toxicroak was such a perfect Lex Luthor :P

    Jk jk, seriously thanks, that looks like it could solve a lot of my problems
    EDIT: Ok tested two matches with Latias. It helped, but I noticed that I'm now far more vulnerable to Ferrothorn :/
  11. CTC

    CTC The Lord Shepherd shall guideth ye cattle
    is Smogon Frontier's Stadium Baronis a Past WCoP Winner

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    I wouldnt say sun isn't too big of a problem for this team as this seems to be fairly standard rain, and last I checked politoed is still a very reliable switchin to ninetails if predictions serve you well. I do wanted to say that I noticed a huge rotom wash weakness as well when I took a quick first look at this team, seeing as literally nothing switches into it without being crippled for the rest of the match (wow + sub makes jirachi easily disposable at low health especially with little investment in bulk)
    The problem I see with toed is the lack of recovery, and winning weather wars can be hard when nails burns you and stalls you with painsplit and hippo slacks off while tar straight kills you at low health.
    I'm against the latias suggestion because you lose alot of coverage vs things like ferrothorn, and you're just adding to your sand weakness by introducing a pursuitable voltswitches sponge. Toxicroak has good priority, puts on alot of offensive pressure, and deals with sand/rain alike. It is also the best check for the tried and true bandTar + scarf keld combo that will likely sweep you if you change toxicroak. Mamoswine deals with sun well enough, destroying all switchins barring forretress and the odd cresselia. Torn gives you leverage to bring in toed, and toed itself + keld do a number to sun. To address the rotom weakness, I would recommend that you put wish over substitute and run a bulkier spread on jirachi so you can take on rotom and sand better. With wish healing you up you can set up more comfortably vs a number of pokes, and the added healing makes you less susceptible to tornadus T. I saw my buddy Princess Bri use the set the other day and thought it was time to bring back one of the classics :D. It gives your politoed more switchins (wish on hippo and nails, pass to toed etc) and helps rachi beat rotom 1 v 1. It is just generally great for longevity since toed and jirachi are your only 2 'pivot mons' so to speak.

    Jirachi @ Leftovers
    Trait: Serene Grace
    EVs: 252 HP / 160 Def / 96 Spd >>>>> Hits 286 for mamo who might be a problem
    Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
    - Calm Mind
    - Wish
    - Thunder
    - Flash Cannon

    Feel free to use a bulkier spread as an alternative:

    Jirachi @ Leftovers
    Trait: Serene Grace
    EVs: 252 HP / 220 Def / 36 Spd
    Bold Nature (+Def, -Atk)
    - Calm Mind
    - Wish
    - Thunder
    - Flash Cannon
  12. Cherub Agent

    Cherub Agent ium and me <3
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    OK, I'll definetly test Wish Jirachi as well, thanks :)
    However it does little to alleviate my Ferrothorn problem. With Substitute Jirachi can dodge Leech Seed and Thunder Wave... although Wish does mean that the damage taken from Leech See isn't as dramatic...
  13. Neliel

    Neliel Sacred Sword

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    Ferrothorn u say? hum if you think that its a problem you can try Superpower instead of icicle spear on Mamoswine as well as Focus blast over Hidden power grass on Politoed. Orb+taunt Tornadus is also a nice way to avoid stealth rock and stuff, this is the best i can suggest you.
  14. Reymedy

    Reymedy The Black Sun.
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    Well, switch Mamoswine for a Terrakion lead and you got the team people spammed on the ladder for the suspect (with Toxicroak as filler).
    Don't take it as an offense since it means your team is good, but I doubt there is much work that can be done on this team (bar some specific nitpicks about EVs and stuff like that x)).
  15. CTC

    CTC The Lord Shepherd shall guideth ye cattle
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    It's all about what you're weak to most. With toxi, mamo, and torn to deal with ferro and virtually nothing for wash it may be better to prioritize threats.
  16. Cherub Agent

    Cherub Agent ium and me <3
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    ok, it's time for some input from me :)

    Wish Jirachi is really cool, and I'm experimenting a bit with EV spreads, suffice to say I want enough Speed to outrun Jolly Mamoswine and max HP for obviously bigger Wishes, but I'm constantly flipping the remaining EVs into other stats. Wish is a godsend for my team, and makes TT even more long-lasting. Politoed as well, it's been notably useful in helping me win the weather war.

    Latias is a nono, as it leaves me far too open to Ferrothorn. I also don't like how easy it is to Pursuit, and then once it's gone Ferrothorn on Sand teams can go to town on my team. I still have a Rotom Wash problem, but I think my next idea may help alleviate the issue. I'm considering replacing Toxicroak for Breloom.

    Breloom can easily be EVed to outrun defensive Rotom-W if I decide to use Techniloom. If I use Poison Heal, then Breloom doesn't give a damn about outrunning it or not, since it's resistant to its STABs and would be immune to WoW. My team would also really appreciate the Ground resistance, although losing the resistance to Terrakion and Keldeo's STAB moves is a bit bothersome. On the other hand, Breloom can simply Mach Punch Terrakion, and I have Tornadus to revenge kill opposing Keldeo... Point is that Breloom can dispose of both Ferrothorn and especially Rotom-W, and would fit the offensive nature of my team. what do you guys think? also spore is a boss move :)
  17. Neliel

    Neliel Sacred Sword

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    I think that breloom is an another fire weak pokemon that makes you weaker to sunny teams... truely techloom helps against rotom-w and ferrothorn but you have to be carefull due to w-o-w. I dont think toxic orb breloom is that good, the priority mach punch is really helpfull to beat terrakion. Anyway if you choose Techloom instead of Latios you can put Rain dance on Tornadus-t as a filler move, this can help somehow winning the weather war. If you do so its probably better to use the standard life orb variant, with Superpower, Hurricane, U-turn, Rain dance and a naive nature.

    ps. Are u sure that with Focus blast Politoed and Superpower Mamoswine you are Ferrothorn weak? Keldeo has secret sword, Tornadus has both hurricane and focus blast and Jirachi has substitute ( honestly i dont think that wish variants work that much, you cant beat ferrothorn and you risk to being revenge killed by Ground pokemons as well as Cbkion, Specs keldeo and things like that.. its also more weak to status, like the burn of scald or thunder wave)
  18. Cherub Agent

    Cherub Agent ium and me <3
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    Alright, so I've decided to majorly update my team. I used this team for all of Suspect Round 9, and peaked with a ranking of 1992. All except one of my Pokemon has undergone a major change, even if only one was switched out, so I think I'm allowed to bump the thread. Here is a list of all my changes, and they all helped to make this team without a doubt the best one I have ever created.

    Politoed: Choice Specs > Splash Plate | Psychic > Perish Song | Focus Blast > HP Grass
    Keldeo: No changes
    Tornadus-T: Life Orb > Choice Specs | Taunt > Sleep Talk | Superpower > Focus Blast | Naive > Timid
    Toxicroak: Breloom replaces it, with a Jolly nature, max max EV spread and the moves Spore, Low Sweep, Bullet Seed and Mach Punch with a Life Orb
    Jirachi: Changed to HaxRachi, with Sassy Nature, 252 HP, 252 SpD, 4 Spe and the moves Stealth Rock, Thunder, Iron Head, Wish
    Mamoswine: Superpower > Stealth Rock

    Will now update the OP with these changes
    EDIT: OP has been edited. If there's anything you read that simply doesn't make sense, please tell me, as I've edited this thread so many times now that I'm bound to have missed something :P
  19. Shurtugal

    Shurtugal The Enterpriser.

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    Hey, (on IPod cause grounded so not long)

    It's a good thing though that your team is super solid! Since the other raters helped you get this far ; I only have a few nitpicks. Taunt looks super useless (loom and Kedly > Chansey n Blissey). Quite frankly useless vs. rachi and rain teams can smash most Skarm anyway, especially Thunder Jira. I suggest testing Protect on LO Torn to play around more offensive based counters to it like Scarf Keldeo or Scizor .

    4 Hp Ev on offensive pokes is bad cause more SR damage so use 4 in Def / SDef on Breloom and Mamo. Also, SD Breloom is such a bigger threat imo, is there anything low sweep is doing in general...? If not try SD please, as often you can dent stall (LO Torn isn't as good as your prev. Specs in this light so SD fixes this ).

    Also... 4 atk evs on FB Torn? Mistype maybe...?

    Gl friend! :)

    ~! Shurty

    EDIT: oh yah I luvdisc'ed your team. Good stuff is good ;)
  20. Cherub Agent

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    Yeah, thanks for the EV thing shurt, i totally forgot that. I don't use Taunt for Blissey and Chansey, I use it to stop Deoxy-D. I know that Politoed can 2HKO it, or OHKO if Deoxy-D is runningmax Speed and SpA with psycho boost/HP fire, but hydro pump unfortunately does miss at the worst times. I did have great success with Specs on Tornadus-T though, not really sure why I changed to LO, partly because I didn't really want 3 choice users, but with hindsight it may not be so bad. I do like the lack of LO recoil though... And yeah, I'll definetly test Adamant SD loom. It bothers me that Jolly Loom can't OHKO Terrakion with Mach Punch, somethig that really sucks. So basically yeah, I'll test all of your suggestions, thanks :)

    EDIT: Oh i misunderstood, I though you wanted me to use Specs lol, totally missed the Protect part. I saw you post something like that in an ou thread, and i was very intrigued. So I'll definetly test that out too.
  21. Shurtugal

    Shurtugal The Enterpriser.

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    Lol yeah ;) I said SD Loom helps break stall for lack of Specs on TornT, that's what I meant :).

    Good luck during testing, pal!

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