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Whiscash (GP 2/2)

Discussion in 'Uploaded Analyses' started by erisia, Dec 20, 2011.

  1. erisia

    erisia (macho) brace yourselves
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    Behold the original derpfish!

    [​IMG]

    [Overview]

    <p>Whiscash has to be the coolest fish in the tier; Stunfisk doesn't even stand a chance. Of course, coolness doesn't correlate with battle-prowess, so for the most part Whiscash is rarely seen in the metagame over its counterpart Quagsire. However, the recent tier changes provide Whiscash with its chance to shine; with Slowking and Lanturn being gone, the number of bulky Water-types is ever shrinking. Furthermore, Whiscash now has access to Hydration, letting defensive sets run Rain Dance + Rest for semi-reliable recovery and finally giving Whiscash some use as a defensive Pokemon. Meanwhile, Whiscash is still an effective user of Dragon Dance, which alongside its good bulk and excellent neutral coverage, allows Whiscash to be an effective late-game cleaner or revenge killer. Whiscash is a severely underrated Pokemon in this metagame, both offensively and defensively, and has the potential to excel in both roles given the right support.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Dragon Dance
    move 1: Dragon Dance
    move 2: Earthquake
    move 3: Waterfall
    move 4: Stone Edge / Rest
    item: Life Orb
    ability: Anticipation / Hydration
    nature: Jolly / Adamant
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Unlike most Water-types, Whiscash has access to Dragon Dance, letting it become a deadly physical sweeper after a boost by combining the offensive capabilities of Lapras with the excellent defensive typing and physical STAB of Quagsire. With full offensive investment, Whiscash reaches an Attack stat of 378 and a Speed stat of 360 after a boost; although these stats are not amazing, they still allow Whiscash to outspeed and decimate offensive Pokemon effectively enough, as almost nothing in the tier outspeeds it after a boost. Due to Whiscash's good bulk and excellent typing, if the opponent lacks a Grass-type response, it can probably accrue more than one boost, letting it fare much better against defensive walls. Furthermore, if your team can provide it with rain support, Whiscash can be extremely difficult to kill due to Hydration + Rest letting it fully restore itself instantly. While Whiscash does not function as well as a straight-up sweeper due to its mediocre offenses and lack of super-effective coverage, it is at its best as a late-game sweeper, cleaning up beaten up threats and being generally unkillable once the opponent's Grass-types are gone.</p>

    <p>Earthquake is the primary STAB move since it hits Fire and Rock types harder than Waterfall, whilst Stone Edge provides the infamous EdgeQuake combo that hits almost every Pokemon in the game neutrally. Waterfall is still used as a secondary STAB move as it hits Pokemon with Levitate harder than Stone Edge in most cases, and the flinch chance can be useful in tense situations. Under rain, Waterfall is more powerful than Earthquake and becomes the primary STAB move, but Earthquake remains for its use against bulky Water-types. Stone Edge is the most expendable move in this case, and can be replaced by Rest to provide Whiscash with the instant recovery that makes it so hard to take down through residual damage.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>The primary item choice is a Life Orb because Whiscash severely lacks power without it, thanks to its mediocre Attack stat and lack of super effective coverage. Furthermore, the recoil is less of a concern with rain support due to the recovery that Hydration + Rest provides. Although its uses are limited, Anticipation is the primary ability because the uses of Oblivious and Hydration (without team support) are none. It lets you see if the opponent's Pokemon are running surprise Grass-type moves, such as Grass Knot and Hidden Power Grass; this scouting could potentially save Whiscash's life. On the other hand, if you have rain support on your team, Hydration obviously gets the nod for removing sleep, poison, burn, and the rare paralysis, as well as enabling Rest to provide instant recovery. In this case, Waterfall becomes the dominant STAB move. An Adamant nature can be used to provide Whiscash with more of the power it needs to sweep effectively, but this forces it to Speed tie with neutral natured fully invested base 100s, which may not be worth it depending on your team. In terms of offensive options, Bounce can be used over Waterfall or Earthquake for its super effective coverage on Grass-types, but lacks enough power to be too effective. Return is also an option, and can be used to maximize neutral coverage at the expense of super-effective coverage. Ice Beam can be useful for OHKOing offensive Torterra and 2HKOing Tangela, but it forces Whiscash to use a Naive nature and sees no use otherwise.</p>

    <p>Whiscash really appreciates support from its team to work effectively as an offensive Pokemon. While it doesn't require Rapid Spin support as much as with other Pokemon due to its resistance to Stealth Rock, it very much appreciates entry hazard support from its teammates, which help to finish off the Pokemon that Whiscash can't quite kill. Glalie is useful in this respect, as not only does it provide Spikes support for the team, but it can also deal with the Grass-type Pokemon that are the bane of Whiscash's existence. If your team is using another Spiker, make sure to pack a specific counter to these Grass-types so that you can eliminate them easily before Whiscash attempts to sweep. Magmortar is excellent in this regard, as it shrugs off Sleep Powders and Grass-type attacks with ease while hitting opposing Grass-type Pokemon for ridiculous damage with Fire Blast. Skuntank is also useful; it can threaten Grass-type Pokemon with STAB Poison Jab or hit them on the way out with a powerful Pursuit. If you're attempting to use Hydration + Rest on Whiscash, then running rain support Pokemon on your team is mandatory to take advantage of this. Mesprit is a good option, for it can set up Rain Dance very reliably and is able to use a slow U-turn to get Whiscash into the match unscathed.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Tank
    move 1: Hydro Pump
    move 2: Earth Power
    move 3: Rain Dance / Ice Beam
    move 4: Rest
    item: Life Orb
    ability: Hydration
    nature: Modest
    EVs: 212 Def / 252 SpA / 44 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Whiscash's access to Hydration finally allows it to compete with Quagsire as a physically bulky Water-type. Whilst the latter has access to Unaware and the reliable Recover, Whiscash can also heal itself of status, such as Toxic, by using Rain Dance, and fully restore itself with Rest, giving it more longevity when rain is up. Furthermore, while Quagsire's offense is lacking at best, Whiscash can make the most of its better Special Attack and the boost that Rain Dance provides to hit opponents hard with Hydro Pump and Earth Power. For reference, Hydro Pump manages to 2HKO Regice under the rain, and thus everything else it hits neutrally in the tier. Since most targets of Water- and Ground-type moves in this tier are physically defensive, Whiscash can make use of its special STABs more effectively than it can its physical options. While this set faces competition from Lapras, access to STAB Earth Power and far better physically defensive typing give Whiscash unique qualities that make it worth considering. However, bear in mind that because this set must use a turn to set up Rain Dance before it can tank effectively, Grass-types should be eliminated before you attempt to set up rain, as they can switch in with little risk. If your team already provides Whiscash with rain support, then Ice Beam can be used over Rain Dance to hit those Grass types hard on the switch-in; Ice Beam also has the added bonus of being able to OHKO Altaria.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>The EVs provide Whiscash enough power to abuse STAB Hydro Pump in the rain, while letting it outspeed defensive Flareon. The rest of the EVs are pumped into Defense to help Whiscash take physical attacks better, which is more efficient than investing in HP due to Whiscash's already-high HP stat and its ability to tank the special attacks it needs to regardless of investment. A fully defensive EV spread can also be run with Leftovers and Scald. With full physical bulk, Whiscash takes unboosted physical hits much better than Quagsire, can hit most physically inclined pokemon harder, and has much better recovery if it can set up a Rain Dance. The burn chance is also useful for annoying switch-ins that attempt to wall Whiscash. EVs can also be put into Special Defense, and are more effective than before as Slowking and Lanturn are no longer NU. For instance, with 212 EVs in Special Defense, Life Orb Magmortar cannot 2HKO Whiscash with Focus Blast even if both attacks hit. Damp Rock can also be a good item choice, letting Whiscash provide better team support rather than attacking power. It works particularly well as a substitute for Leftovers on the fully-defensive spread.</p>

    <p>As this set has access to reliable recovery, the ability to heal status, and the ability to provide rain support for the team, it's very self-sustainable and doesn't require much team support at all to be an effective tank. Obviously having a teammate to deal with Grass types is useful, but since Whiscash will be functioning in rain a lot of the time, Fire-types are not as useful in this respect. Bug-types, such as Pinsir, and Poison-types, such as Weezing, are more reliable in this case, as their STAB attacks remain unhindered by the weather. Although many Pokemon might try to set up on a defensive Whiscash, STAB Hydro Pump in the rain deals with most of them effectively, killing them before they have a chance to respond. However, Pokemon with the Water Absorb ability, such as Cacturne and Lapras, aren't affected by this, and should thus be covered by the rest of your team to prevent them from setting up with impunity.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>A RestTalk set can be used but it's pretty much directly outclassed by Rain Dance + Rest, as you have little reason to use any ability other than Hydration. An all-out special attacking set can be run with Hydro Pump / Earth Power / Ice Beam / Stone Edge and maximum Special Attack investment. Whilst Stone Edge appears useless, even without investment it OHKOes Cryogonal , who otherwise completely walls you. However, this set isn't terribly effective against offensive teams as their sweepers will outspeed and wear Whiscash down fairly, and Life Orb recoil stacks up tool. Hidden Power can't really hit anything in the tier harder than Whiscash's other options, so it's not worth considering. Substitute can be useful for blocking status and Grass-type attacks, but it drains Whiscash's HP quickly in tandem with Life Orb, and Rain Dance + Hydration is generally a better defense against status. Toxic can also be used to annoy other bulky Water-types and Cryogonal.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>By virtue of its typing, almost any Grass-type can counter Whiscash so long as it can survive a +1 Stone Edge. Torterra completely walls any set that lacks Ice Beam due to its defensive typing, and can promptly OHKO Whiscash with Seed Bomb or any other Grass-type move it carries. Tangela and Exeggutor can also come in on Whiscash easily and set up as it switches. Cacturne switches in comfortably on Water-type attacks, as well as unboosted Earthquakes and Stone Edges, and can proceed to set up Spikes or a Substitute as it forces Whiscash out. Bulky Water-types, such as Alomomola, also deal with well Whiscash since they take little from Whiscash's neutral attacks, and can threaten a burn or KO with repeated neutral Scalds, possibly boosted by Whiscash's rain support. In terms of other offensive checks, Whiscash can be surprisingly difficult to stop if it has rain support, and thus, it's often best to stall out the rain before attempting to go for a direct KO.</p>
  2. tennisace

    tennisace brock you like a hurricane
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    Imo Rest should be listed on the main set for the tank, slashed over Ice Beam. That's its biggest draw over Quagsire, full instant recovery + boosted attack power.

    I'm debating whether or not Waterfall and Stone Edge should switch places on the DD set but I think the order is ok for now, if other QC members could weigh in that'd be swell.
  3. Endorfins

    Endorfins Your Worst Nightmare
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    Yeah, Quagsire normally gets owned by status so Rest is a good option on whiscash
    I think Stone Edge is the way to go, being able to hit Grass, Bug and Flying switch ins harder than any of the other moves as well as still being able to maul armaldo. Waterfall doesnt have great coverage with EQ as Eq hit rocks and fire types already
  4. Omicron

    Omicron
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    I don't really see the point of a special set when the only niche Whishcash has is DD + HydraRest
  5. Endorfins

    Endorfins Your Worst Nightmare
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    I think what Tennisace meant was to have Hydra Rest on the Special attacking set. Rain boosted STAB Hydro pumps hurt while Whiscash can heal up fully with Rest
  6. breh

    breh
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    am I the only one who thinks that rain dance on whiscash may be a bad option? every good setter of RD is in the tier (electrode, for example) and whiscash runs out of moveslots too quickly with it.

    without it, though, whiscash can run waterfall/return/dd/rest, which gets perfect coverage bar shedinja. setting up in a field condition is eh but it's not awful.
  7. erisia

    erisia (macho) brace yourselves
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    Okay, I've mentioned DD Hydra-Rest in the first set's AC, should i make the primary option? I also revamped the second set, which has proven pretty damn effective. It can switch in on a lot of things and get some quick attacks or a Rain Dance off fairly easily. LO Hydro Pump in the Rain is also powerful enough to 2HKO specially defensive giants like Regice and fully-invested Lickilicky, so I think it's definitely worth some mention. It can only get better once Slowking leaves the tier, after all. :)
  8. DestinyUnknown

    DestinyUnknown in other words...
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    bounce really deserves a slash on dd set?
  9. erisia

    erisia (macho) brace yourselves
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    After doing the calcs at +1, I've found it's redundant against Roselia (+1 Earthquake already OHKOs) but does get the OHKO on Exeggutor with SR or Spikes and doesn't even 3HKO Tangela. Torterra won't be 2HKO'd thanks to Leftovers, and Snover is OHKO'd. Overall, I think you might be right. Bounce doesn't do enough damage to its key targets and wastes time. I think I'll slash Rest over Stone Edge instead for Hydra-Rest users and mention Bounce in the AC.
  10. tennisace

    tennisace brock you like a hurricane
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    [​IMG]

    Switch Waterfall and Stone Edge/Rest on the DD set and you're good.
  11. Ice-eyes

    Ice-eyes Simper Fi

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    What that man said.

    [​IMG]
  12. Omicron

    Omicron
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    k

    QC APPROVED (3/3)
  13. erisia

    erisia (macho) brace yourselves
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    Whiscash is now ready for the Grammar Patrol!

    Added details concerning teammates and support to the sets, since there wasn't any. (and since Whiscash really needs good teammates)
  14. -Tsunami-

    -Tsunami- ¬°YA HA!
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    Show Hide
    [Overview]

    <p>Whiscash has to be the coolest fish in the tier; Stunfisk doesn't even stand a chance. Of course, coolness doesn't correlate with battle-prowess, so for the most part Whiscash is rarely seen in the metagame over its counterpart Quagsire. However, the recent tier changes provide Whiscash with its chance to shine; with Slowking and Lanturn being gone, the number of bulky Water-types is ever shrinking. Furthermore, Whiscash now has access to Hydration, letting defensive sets run Rain Dance + Rest for semi-reliable recovery and finally giving Whiscash some use as a defensive Pokemon. Meanwhile, Whiscash is still an effective user of Dragon Dance, which alongside its good bulk and excellent neutral coverage allows Whiscash to be an effective late-game cleaner or revenge killer. Whiscash is a severely underrated Pokemon in this metagame, both offensively and defensively, and has the potential to excel in both roles given the right support.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Dragon Dance
    move 1: Dragon Dance
    move 2: Earthquake
    move 3: Waterfall
    move 4: Stone Edge / Rest
    item: Life Orb
    ability: Anticipation / Hydration
    nature: Jolly / Adamant
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Unlike most Water-types, Whiscash has access to Dragon Dance, letting it become a deadly physical sweeper with a boost by combining the offensive capabilities of Lapras with the excellent defensive typing and physical STAB of Quagsire. With full offensive investment, Whiscash reaches an Attack stat of 378 and a Speed stat of 360 after a boost, and although these stats are not amazing, they still allow Whiscash to revenge-kill offensive pokemon effectively enough as almost nothing in the tier outspeeds it. Due to Whiscash's good bulk and excellent typing, if the opponent lacks a Grass-type response you can probably accrue more than one boost, letting it fare much better with defensive walls. Furthermore, if your team provides Rain support, Whiscash can be extremely difficult to kill due to Hydration + Rest letting it fully restore itself instantly. Whilst Whiscash does not function as well as a straight-up sweeper due to its mediocre offenses and lack of super-effective coverage, it functions the most effectively as a late game revenge killer, cleaning up threats with prior damage and being generally unkillable once the opponent's Grass-types are gone.</p>

    <p>Earthquake is the primary STAB since it hits Fire and Rock types harder than Waterfall, whilst Stone Edge provides the infamous EdgeQuake combo that hits almost every pokemon in the game neutrally. Waterfall is still used as a secondary STAB since it hits Pokemon with Levitate harder than Stone Edge in most cases, and the flinch chance can be useful in tense situations. Under Rain support, Waterfall is more powerful than Earthquake and becomes the primary STAB, whilst Earthquake remains for its use against bulky Water-types. Stone Edge is the most expendable move in this case, and is replaced by Rest to provide Whiscash with the instant recovery that makes it so hard to take down with residual damage.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>The primary item choice is a Life Orb since Whiscash severely lacks power without it, due to its mediocre Attack stat and lack of super-effective coverage. Furthermore, the recoil is less of a concern with Rain support due to the recovery that Hydration + Rest provides. Anticipation is the primary ability since, whilst its uses are limited, the uses of Oblivious and Hydration (without team support) are none. It lets you see if the opponent's Pokemon are running surprise Grass moves such as Grass Knot and Hidden Power Grass, which could potentially save Whiscash's life. On the other hand, if you have Rain support from the team, Hydration obviously gets the nod for removing Sleep, Poison, Burns and the rare Paralysis, as well as enabling instant recovery in Rest. In this case, Waterfall becomes the dominant STAB. An Adamant nature can be used to provide Whiscash with more of the power it needs to sweep effectively, but this forces it to speed-tie with neutral natured fully invested Base 100's, which may not be worth it depending on your team. In terms of offensive options, Bounce can be used over Waterfall or Earthquake for its super-effective coverage on Grass types, but lacks enough power to be too effective, whilst Return can be used to maximise neutral coverage at the expense of super-effective coverage. Ice Beam can be useful for OHKOing offensive Torterra and 2HKOing Tangela if you run a Naive nature, but sees no use otherwise.</p>

    <p>Whiscash really appreciates support from its team to work effectively as an offensive Pokemon. Whilst it doesn't require Rapid Spin support as much as with other Pokemon due to its resistance to Stealth Rock, it very much appreciates entry hazards support from its team mates, since it helps to clean up the kills that Whiscash can't quite accomplish. Glalie is useful in this respect, as not only does it provide Spikes support for the team, it can also deal with the Grass-type Pokemon that are the bane of Whiscash's existence. If your team is using another Spiker, make sure to pack a specific counter to these Grass-types so that you can eliminate them easily before Whiscash attempts to sweep. Magmortar is excellent in this regard, shrugging off Sleep Powders and Grass-type attacks with ease, whilst hitting them for ridiculous damage with its Fire Blast. Skuntank is also useful, threatening Grass-type Pokemon with a STAB Poison Jab or hitting them on the way out with a powerful Pursuit. If you're attempting to use Hydration + Rest on Whiscash, then running rain support Pokemon on your team is mandatory to take advantage of this. Mesprit is a good option, setting up Rain Dance very reliably and being able to use a slow U-Turn to get Whiscash into the match unscathed.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Tank
    move 1: Hydro Pump
    move 2: Earth Power
    move 3: Rain Dance / Ice Beam
    move 4: Rest
    item: Life Orb
    ability: Hydration
    nature: Modest
    EVs: 212 Def / 252 SpA / 44 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Whiscash's access to Hydration finally allows it to compete with Quagsire as a physically-bulky Water-type. Whilst the latter has access to Unaware and the reliable Recover, Whiscash can also heal itself of status such as Toxic using Rain Dance, and subsequently fully restore itself with Rest, giving it more longevity once the Rain is up. Furthermore, whilst Quagsire's offense is lacking at best, Whiscash can make the most of its better Special Attack and the boost that Rain Dance provides to hit opponents seriously hard with Hydro Pump and Earth Power. For reference, Hydro Pump manages to 2HKO Regice under the Rain, and thus everything else it hits neutrally in the tier. Since most targets of Water and Ground moves in this tier are physically defensive, this allows Whiscash to abuse its STABs more effectively than with physical options. Whilst this set faces competition from Lapras, access to STAB Earth Power and far better physically defensive typing give Whiscash unique qualities that can make it worth considering. However, bear in mind that as this set must use a turn to set up Rain Dance before it can tank effectively, Grass types should be eliminated before you attempt to do this since they can switch in with little risk. If your team already provides Whiscash with Rain support, then Ice Beam can be used over Rain Dance to hit those Grass types hard on the switch-in, as well as OHKOing Altaria.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>The EVs provide Whiscash enough power to abuse STAB Hydro Pump in the rain, whilst also outspeeding defensive Flareon. The rest are pumped into Defense to help Whiscash take physical attacks better, which is more efficient than investing in HP due to Whiscash's already-high HP stat and Whiscash's ability to tank the special attacks it needs to regardless of investment. A fully defensive EV spread can also be run with Leftovers and Scald. With full physical bulk, Whiscash takes unboosted physical hits much better than Quagsire, can hit most physically inclined pokemon harder, and has much better recovery if it can set up a Rain Dance. Passive Burns are also useful for annoying switch-ins that attempt to wall Whiscash. Specially Defensive EVs are also an option since Slowking and Lanturn have left the tier, and can be used if they suit your team better. For instance, with 212 EVs in Special Defense, LO Magmortar cannot 2HKO Whiscash with Focus Blast even if both attacks hit. Damp Rock can also be a good item choice, letting Whiscash provide better team-support rather than attacking power. It works particularly well as a substitute for Leftovers on the fully-defensive spread.</p>

    <p>Since this set has access to reliable recovery, the ability to heal status, and the ability to provide rain support for the team, it's very self-sustainable and doesn't require much team support at all to be an effective tank. Obviously having a team mate to deal with Grass types is useful, but as Whiscash will be functioning in rain a lot of the time, Fire types are not as useful in this respect. Bug types such as Pinsir and Poison types such as Weezing are more reliable in this case, as their STAB attacks remain unhindered by the weather. Whilst many Pokemon could try and set up on a defensive Whiscash, STAB Hydro Pump in the Rain deals with most of them effectively, killing them before they have a chance to respond. However, Pokemon with the Water Absorb ability such as Cacturne and Lapras aren't bothered by this, and thus you should make sure to cover these threats with the rest of your team, to prevent them from setting up with impunity.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>A RestTalk set can be used but is pretty much directly outclassed by Rain Dance + Rest, since you have little reason to use any ability other than Hydration. An "all-out" special attacker set can be run with Hydro Pump / Earth Power / Ice Beam / Stone Edge and full specially offensive EVs. Whilst Stone Edge appears useless, it OHKOes Cryogonal even without investment, who otherwise completely walls you. However, this isn't terribly effective against offensive teams since sweepers will outspeed you and wear you down fairly quickly alongside Life Orb recoil. Hidden Power can't really hit anything in the tier harder than Whiscash's other options, so it's not worth considering. Substitute can be useful for blocking status and Grass-type attacks but drains Whiscash's HP quickly with Life Orb, and Rain Dance + Hydration is generally a better defense against status. Toxic can also be used to annoy other bulky Water-types and Cryogonal, if you want.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>By virtue of its typing, almost any Grass type can counter Whiscash so long as it can survive a +1 Stone Edge. Torterra completely walls any set that lacks Ice Beam due to its defensive-typing, and can promptly OHKO you with Seed Bomb or any other Grass-type move it carries. Tangela and Exeggutor can also come in on Whiscash easily and set up as it switches. Cacturne can also come in on Water-type attacks and unboosted Earthquakes and Stone Edges, and proceed to set up Spikes or a Substitute as it forces Whiscash out. Bulky Water-types such as Alomomola also deal well with Whiscash since they take little from Whiscash's neutral attacks, and they can threaten a burn or KO with repeated neutral Scalds (possibly boosted by Whiscash's Rain support). In terms of other offensive checks, Whiscash can be surprisingly difficult to stop if it has Rain support, and thus compared to its counterpart Quagsire. However, the recent tier changes provide Whiscash with its chance to shine; with Slowking and Lanturn being gone, the number of bulky Water-types is ever shrinking. Furthermore, Whiscash now has access to Hydration, letting defensive sets run Rain Dance + Rest for semi-reliable recovery and finally giving Whiscash some use as a defensive Pokemon. Meanwhile, Whiscash is still an effective user of Dragon Dance, which alongside its good bulk and excellent neutral coverage, (comma) allows Whiscash to be an effective late-game cleaner or revenge killer. Whiscash is a severely underrated Pokemon in this metagame, both offensively and defensively, and has the potential to excel in both roles given the right support.</p>


    [SET]
    name: Dragon Dance
    move 1: Dragon Dance
    move 2: Earthquake
    move 3: Waterfall
    move 4: Stone Edge / Rest
    item: Life Orb
    ability: Anticipation / Hydration
    nature: Jolly / Adamant
    EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Unlike most Water-types, Whiscash has access to Dragon Dance, letting it become a deadly physical sweeper with a boost by combining the offensive capabilities of Lapras with the excellent defensive typing and physical STAB of Quagsire. With full offensive investment, Whiscash reaches an Attack stat of 378 and a Speed stat of 360 after a boost, and although these stats are not amazing, they still allow Whiscash to outspeed and decimate offensive pokemon effectively enough, (comma) as almost nothing in the tier outspeeds it after a boost. Due to Whiscash's good bulk and excellent typing, if the opponent lacks a Grass-type response, (comma) you can probably accrue more than one boost, letting it fare much better against defensive walls. Furthermore, if your team provides rain support, Whiscash can be extremely difficult to kill due to Hydration + Rest letting it fully restore itself instantly. Whilst Whiscash does not function as well as a straight-up sweeper due to its mediocre offenses and lack of super-effective coverage, it functions the most effectively as a late-(hyphen)game sweeper, cleaning up beaten up threats and being generally unkillable once the opponent's Grass-types are gone.</p>

    <p>Earthquake is the primary STAB move since it hits Fire and Rock types harder than Waterfall, whilst Stone Edge provides the infamous EdgeQuake combo that hits almost every pokemon in the game neutrally. Waterfall is still used as a secondary STAB move since it hits Pokemon with Levitate harder than Stone Edge in most cases, and the flinch chance can be useful in tense situations. Under Rain support, Waterfall is more powerful than Earthquake and becomes the primary STAB move, but Earthquake remains for its use against bulky Water-types. Stone Edge is the most expendable move in this case, and can be replaced by Rest to provide Whiscash with the instant recovery that makes it so hard to take down with residual damage.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>The primary item choice is a Life Orb since Whiscash severely lacks power without it, thanks to its mediocre Attack stat and lack of super effective coverage. Furthermore, the recoil is less of a concern with rain support due to the recovery that Hydration + Rest provides. Anticipation is the primary ability since, whilst its uses are limited, the uses of Oblivious and Hydration (without team support) are none. It lets you see if the opponent's Pokemon are running surprise Grass-(hyphen)moves, (comma) such as Grass Knot and Hidden Power Grass; (semicolon) this scouting could potentially save Whiscash's life. On the other hand, if you have rain support on your team, Hydration obviously gets the nod for removing sleep, poison, burns, (comma) and the rare paralysis, as well as enabling Rest to provide instant recovery. In this case, Waterfall becomes the dominant STAB move. An Adamant nature can be used to provide Whiscash with more of the power it needs to sweep effectively, but this forces it to speed-tie with neutral natured fully invested Base 100s, which may not be worth it depending on your team. In terms of offensive options, Bounce can be used over Waterfall or Earthquake for its super effective coverage on Grass-(hyphen)types, but lacks enough power to be too effective. (period) Return is also an option, (comma) and can be used to maximise neutral coverage at the expense of super-effective coverage. Ice Beam can be useful for OHKOing offensive Torterra and 2HKOing Tangela, but it forces you to use a Naive nature and sees no use otherwise.</p>

    <p>Whiscash really appreciates support from its team to work effectively as an offensive Pokemon. Whilst it doesn't require Rapid Spin support as much as with other Pokemon due to its resistance to Stealth Rock, it very much appreciates entry hazards support from its teammates, since it helps to finish off the Pokemon that Whiscash can't quite kill. Glalie is useful in this respect, as not only does it provide Spikes support for the team, but it can also deal with the Grass-type Pokemon that are the bane of Whiscash's existence. If your team is using another Spiker, make sure to pack a specific counter to these Grass-types so that you can eliminate them easily before Whiscash attempts to sweep. Magmortar is excellent in this regard, shrugging off Sleep Powders and Grass-type attacks with ease whilst hitting opposing Grass-type Pokemon for ridiculous damage with Fire Blast. Skuntank is also useful, threatening Grass-type Pokemon with a STAB Poison Jab or hitting them on the way out with a powerful Pursuit. If you're attempting to use Hydration + Rest on Whiscash, then running rain support Pokemon on your team is mandatory to take advantage of this. Mesprit is a good option, setting up Rain Dance very reliably and being able to use a slow U-Turn to get Whiscash into the match unscathed.</p>

    [SET]
    name: Tank
    move 1: Hydro Pump
    move 2: Earth Power
    move 3: Rain Dance / Ice Beam
    move 4: Rest
    item: Life Orb
    ability: Hydration
    nature: Modest
    EVs: 212 Def / 252 SpA / 44 Spe

    [SET COMMENTS]

    <p>Whiscash's access to Hydration finally allows it to compete with Quagsire as a physically-bulky Water-type. Whilst the latter has access to Unaware and the reliable Recover, Whiscash can also heal itself of status such as Toxic using Rain Dance, and subsequently fully restore itself with Rest, giving it more longevity once the Rain is up. Furthermore, whilst Quagsire's offense is lacking at best, Whiscash can make the most of its better Special Attack and the boost that Rain Dance provides to hit opponents seriously hard with Hydro Pump and Earth Power. For reference, Hydro Pump manages to 2HKO Regice under the Rain, and thus everything else it hits neutrally in the tier. Since most targets of Water-(hyphen) and Ground-(hyphen)type moves in this tier are physically defensive, Whiscash can to its STABs more effectively than it can with physical options. Whilst this set faces competition from Lapras, access to STAB Earth Power and far better physically defensive typing give Whiscash unique qualities that can make it worth considering. However, bear in mind that because this set must use a turn to set up Rain Dance before it can tank effectively, Grass-(hyphen)types should be eliminated before you attempt to set up rain since they can switch in with little risk. If your team already provides Whiscash with rain support, then Ice Beam can be used over Rain Dance to hit those Grass types hard on the switch-in; (semicolon) Ice Beam also has the added bonus of being able to OHKO Altaria.</p>

    [ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

    <p>The EVs provide Whiscash enough power to abuse STAB Hydro Pump in the rain whilst letting it outspeed defensive Flareon. The rest of the EVs are pumped into Defense to help Whiscash take physical attacks better, which is more efficient than investing in HP due to Whiscash's already-high HP stat and its ability to tank the special attacks it needs to regardless of investment. A fully defensive EV spread can also be run with Leftovers and Scald. With full physical bulk, Whiscash takes unboosted physical hits much better than Quagsire, can hit most physically inclined pokemon harder, and has much better recovery if it can set up a Rain Dance. Passive burns are also useful for annoying switch-ins that attempt to wall Whiscash. EVs can also be put into Special Defense, and are more effective than before since Slowking and Lanturn are no longer NU. For instance, with 212 EVs in Special Defense, LO Magmortar cannot 2HKO Whiscash with Focus Blast even if both attacks hit. Damp Rock can also be a good item choice, letting Whiscash provide better team support rather than attacking power. It works particularly well as a substitute for Leftovers on the fully-defensive spread.</p>

    <p>Since this set has access to reliable recovery, the ability to heal status, and the ability to provide rain support for the team, it's very self-sustainable and doesn't require much team support at all to be an effective tank. Obviously having a teammate to deal with Grass types is useful, but since Whiscash will be functioning in rain a lot of the time, Fire-(hyphen)types are not as useful in this respect. Bug-(hyphen)types, (comma) such as Pinsir, (comma) and Poison-(hyphen)types, (comma) such as Weezing, (comma) are more reliable in this case, as their STAB attacks remain unhindered by the weather. Whilst many Pokemon could try and set up on a defensive Whiscash, STAB Hydro Pump in the rain deals with most of them effectively, killing them before they have a chance to respond. However, Pokemon with the Water Absorb ability, (comma) such as Cacturne and Lapras, (comma) aren't bothered by this, and thus, (comma) you should make sure to cover these threats with the rest of your team to prevent them from setting up with impunity.</p>

    [Other Options]

    <p>A RestTalk set can be used but is pretty much directly outclassed by Rain Dance + Rest, as you have little reason to use any ability other than Hydration. An "all-out" special attacking set can be run with Hydro Pump / Earth Power / Ice Beam / Stone Edge and full specially offensive EVs. Whilst Stone Edge appears useless, it OHKOes Cryogonal even without investment, who otherwise completely walls you. However, this isn't terribly effective against offensive teams since sweepers will outspeed you and wear you down fairly quickly alongside Life Orb recoil. Hidden Power can't really hit anything in the tier harder than Whiscash's other options, so it's not worth considering. Substitute can be useful for blocking status and Grass-type attacks, (comma) but it drains Whiscash's HP quickly in tandem with Life Orb, and Rain Dance + Hydration is generally a better defense against status. Toxic can also be used to annoy other bulky Water-types and Cryogonal.</p>

    [Checks and Counters]

    <p>By virtue of its typing, almost any Grass-(hyphen)type can counter Whiscash so long as it can survive a +1 Stone Edge. Torterra completely walls any set that lacks Ice Beam due to its defensive typing, and can promptly OHKO Whiscash with Seed Bomb or any other Grass-type move it carries. Tangela and Exeggutor can also come in on Whiscash easily and set up as it switches. Cacturne can also come in on Water-type attacks and unboosted Earthquakes and Stone Edges, and proceed to set up Spikes or a Substitute as it forces Whiscash out. Bulky Water-types, (comma) such as Alomomola, (comma) also deal with well Whiscash since they take little from Whiscash's neutral attacks, and can threaten a burn or KO with repeated neutral Scalds (possibly boosted by Whiscash's rain support). In terms of other offensive checks, Whiscash can be surprisingly difficult to stop if it has rain support, and thus, (comma) it's often best to stall out the Rain before attempting to go for a direct KO.
    </p>


    lolololol and my app screwed up again x.x
    But meh, w/e. Just copy paste everything in green. Keep the Overview the same and add a comma after 'coverage' in the following sentence: "Meanwhile, Whiscash is still an effective user of Dragon Dance, which alongside its good bulk and excellent neutral coverage allows Whiscash to be an effective late-game cleaner or revenge killer."

    [​IMG]
    GP Approved 1/2
  15. erisia

    erisia (macho) brace yourselves
    is a Contributor to Smogon

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    Wow. That made me WTF before I read the whole thing and realised you only made minor changes. :p Updated.
  16. sirndpt

    sirndpt
    is an Artist Alumnusis a Contributor Alumnus

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    [​IMG]

    2/2
  17. erisia

    erisia (macho) brace yourselves
    is a Contributor to Smogon

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    Implemented, I agreed with all of your subjective changes btw. Unless there's any glaring problems then this is done. :)
  18. tennisace

    tennisace brock you like a hurricane
    is a member of the Site Staffis a Super Moderatoris a Community Contributoris a Pokemon Researcheris a Smogon Media Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Contributor to Smogonis a CAP Contributor Alumnus
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    uploading, good job!

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