Winter is Coming!-a 5th gen hail team

Who should be my spinblocker?

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happymanhappy

I've used many hail teams and it is about using abilities like snow cloak and abuse the hail thing well thats how I used to play ;D. For the most part I really think its pretty solid maybe find a spot for vanniluxe its acually not to shabby it's just pretty under rated i used at vgc and got VERY far
 
Superpowerdude

Superpowerdude

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Vanniluxe has always been one of my favourite pokemon. But i feel he is outclassed by other ice body pokes i.e Regice and stallrien. but due to weather constantly changing pokemon with ice body and snowcloak cant always live to there full potential. Although snow cloak froslass is quite a good poke. anyway i feel like putting in another ice type would wreck my synergy and make me weaker to sandstorm. also i am glad you use hail teams :D
 

CrackinSkulls

Aww man i wrotw some suggestions and it all got deleted anyway to put it in short i saw your thread bumped and had a few ideas that you may want to try. Shift Stealth Rock to an Air Balloons Heatran over Earth Power because you will get plenty of opportunity to set them up with him and you can wall any Heatran not carrying Dragon Pulse. Now that you have shifted rocks you could try running a Rest Talk Suicune or a similar set over swampert because you get a superior bulk and survivability as well as a higher powered Blizzard i think. Another small suggestion is to use WishMence over Latias as you will get a phazer and a wish-passer which will greatly increase your survivability plus it has great synergy with Heatran and it can heal off the residual damage. anyway these are just some changes to consider to an already awesome team except for sabeleye, i hate sabeleye! anyway see ya and good luck. PS did you check out my edited Checkmate RMT?
 
Superpowerdude

Superpowerdude

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thanks for the post Crackinskulls i am testing baloon Heatran and putting stealthrocks on him sounds like a good idea. then Swamperts place is going changing by the minute now! as i am testing out new things like Sub cm chandelure/Conkledurr/Suicune. also suicune does sound pretty cool as i am yet to use him in a 5th gen team! also with me testing suicunes calm mind set i might also try that Salamence of yours! but it would really hurt me to let Latias go lol. so sorry people but i plan to edit my team over the next couple of weeks (if these cahnges you guys are suggesting works) because i am getting in new pokemon all the time and testing them! Sableye does wonders for my team in fixing up holes burning etc. But Spiritomb would always be a Badass!!!!! lol. so thankyou for your help guys!
 

CrackinSkulls

Hey good luck laddering and testing, your team is really great i tried it out a bit while working on a hail team for a friend. After playing it i decided to have a semi-stall Bisharp team and that is why checkmate is the way it is just want you to know that it is a really great team. and is it just me or is happymanhappy's vanniluxe suggestion really strange and just plain bad? anyway talk to you later bye
 
Superpowerdude

Superpowerdude

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thanks Uomo Solo for the comment and the Luvdisc ;) its much appriecated. As for the teams progress. i am trying the laggin tail Sableye, Air baloon stealth rocks Heatran and Cm Suicune. i have tried Conkledurr before and it is awesome but it is seen on quite a few hail teams so i might go with Bulk Up scrafty as it can still set up and KO T-Tar brings a rock resistance to the team and is still a status absorber with shed skin. Also he is one of my favourite pokemon and can still phaze with Dragon tail!

Edit oh and i have to still test out liquid ooze tentacruel.
 
Superpowerdude

Superpowerdude

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Yeh you love scrafty just like me lol. He is not used often in hail cause of his fighting weakness but he has a pretty useful rock resistence and can help my team against e-belt/life orb latios. even though he brings my team to 3 fighting weaknesses i still have 2 resists and 1 immunity. i am still going to test him a bit but he seems awesome!
 
Superpowerdude

Superpowerdude

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Bump i have added in Liquid Ooze Tentacruel, Lagging tail Trick Sableye, Air Baloon Stealth rocks Heatran and if that wasnt enough reasons i have Subpunch Breloom completely replacing Swampert
 

Lazyboy

I actually really like the change to Breloom, it gives you another decent switch into a bulky waters Scald, whilst it wasn't a problem, random burns on either Abomasnow or Tentacruel could be really detrimental to the team. The only change I would suggest is changing the spread to 12 HP/ 244 Atk/ 252 Spe. The only reason for this change is to maximise the amount of recovery you receive from poison heal, which is important as with entry hazards, hail and substitute all stripping Breloom of health, he needs all the healing he can get.
 

Lazyboy

No problem man, as I said I really like the team and want to see it improve. One thing I forgot to mention is that now you're running Breloom over Swampert (my version was using Conkledurr), there is little reason to run Lagging Tail on Sableye. This is because Breloom invests so heavily in speed that the only reason to use it would be to cripple fast special attackers, but with no attacking move he can't really do much else to the likes of alakazam and Latios. So I'd suggest switching back to Leftovers and Night Shade on Sableye and possibly switching to a full specially defensive spread of 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Sp.def as this would allow him to do better against the aforementioned threats. I haven't tested this change out myself so far, so I can't comment on it's effectiveness, but with multiple ways to deal with physical attackers such as Dragonite and Conkledurr, the loss of physical defense shouldn't be too much of a problem.
 
Superpowerdude

Superpowerdude

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i will give that a try later because i havnt used that Sableye set in a while but on the contary i find having lagging tail Sableye works great with Breloom. Often people forget that lagging tail gives you a speed drop and i played a game 10 minutes ago where i tricked a lagging tail to a Infernape at +2 it KOed my Sableye and stayed in On Breloom allowing me to spore him and set up and win! Laggin tail helps Breloom set up on faster threats and for that reason i might also try Adamant Breloom later.
 

CrackinSkulls

Hi there Superpowerdude, i am liking the new addition of Breloom on your team coz now you wont get Bisharp swept XD but are you sure you don't want a Bulkier Breloom spread like 236 HP / 212 SpD / 60 Spe because it can be unexptectadly bulky and its speed is already so bad but its up to you because there really is nothing more annoying than a speedy spore. I think a Gliscor would really fit in nicely rounding off a good defensive core with Tentacruel and checking things like Terrakion, Tyranitar etc but the only place i can see it doing well is in Latias' position which i know is your favourite pokemon but anyway its something to think about. Also now that you lack cleric support you want all the status absorbers you can get which brings to mid Conkeldurr>Breloom although you lose your Fire/Water/Grass core it is far less cheap :P. but anyway Gliscor is another status absorber.

The Gliscor Set
Gliscor (M) @ Toxic Orb
Trait: Poison Heal
EVs: 252 HP / 184 Def / 72 Spd
Impish Nature (+Def, -SAtk)
- Toxic
- Earthquake
- Taunt
- Protect
 
Superpowerdude

Superpowerdude

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Hmmm i will try the bulkier breloom set it sounds like a good idea espically when Sableye tricks lagging tail i dont necassarily need Breloom to be reall fast. i have tried conkledurr before and his role is quite similar to breloom i just prefer breloom cause i like him more. and that gliscor sounds interasting i might give it a try. thanks a bunch for all of the help! and yes your Bisharp is boss.
 

Lazyboy

I'd be cautious in replacing latias with gliscor. Whilst gliscor does have some good synergy with the team, he makes you slightly weaker to threats such as infernape as well as compounding your weakness to latios. Rather if you're looking to beat threats such as terrakion then I would suggest using max speed on latias, as this allows you to get up a reflect before terrakion can attack you. It also helps you revenge latios better, as most run hp fire forcing them to use an imperfect speed iv, so you can outspeed 100% of the time. You may lose a certain amount of bulk, but CB Scizor will still fail to ohko you under reflect, so he's still not that much of a threat.

I do agree with the bulkier spread on breloom, as not only does it allow him to switch in on resisted attacks easier, it also allows you to make the most out of lagging tail, as heatran is a common switch to sableye, so dropping below threats such as this isn't too much of a worry.

Breloom and Conk do serve very similar purposes, although arguably breloom does what this team needs better, as whilst a status'd conk does get a power boost, it does still limit his sweeping potential, whereas brelooms immunity to status is far more welcome
 
Superpowerdude

Superpowerdude

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Yeh that Breloom Bulky set really sounds like something that could fit on this team and i am testing it out! and Terrakions arent actaully to much of a threat to this team. As Latias can set up on one easily unless they are locked into X-Scissor which even then Latias can set up on, She is just unwelcomed to due to crits. and Sableye can Cripple Terrakion with WoW and proceed to recover whilst stalling out Terrakion with Hail and burn damage. And infernape can be set up bait for Latias as U-turn doesnt do to much behind reflect. thanks for the help guys!
 

Lazyboy

Seeing as Latias is your main answer to both Terrakion and Infernape, surely that's even more of an argument for running max speed? Considering you have multiple switches for pokes such as Scizor and Tyranitar, yet not too many pokes like taking on Terrakion.
 

Lazyboy

I've just been running a support set of Dragon Pulse / Reflect / Wish / Protect. Whilst is means Latias loses it's ability to sweep (which is rare due to the abundance of steels) it becomes a much better defensive pivot for the team, as well as providing useful wish support for Heatran and Tentacruel, who both lack reliable recovery.

The only other change I've been experimenting with is running Foul Play on Sableye and it's been working pretty well. The ability to do massive damage to Latios as well as Ohko Alakazam is a big help, although with Sableye spreading burns around, it has little utility outside of that (apart from 1 match when I Ohko'd a Darmanitan switch in who tried to avoid a w-o-w)

The only thing I will mention is since switching from Conklefurr to Breloom is that Shell Smash Cloyster has been a bit of a pain Conkledurr could either tank a non-Life Orb Icicle Spear and retaliate with Drain punch or just revenge weakened versions with mach punch, but Breloom can do neither of those. How are you guys dealing with it?
 
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