Unless a pokemon was locked into a dragon attack, people aren't stupid enough to leave it undamaged (or maybe they are). And ubers throws out very high damage, even if resisted.
-
Welcome to Smogon! Take a moment to read the Introduction to Smogon for a run-down on everything Smogon, and make sure you take some time to read the global rules.
-
Congrats to the winners of the 2023 Smog Awards!
Xerneas
- Thread starter superstar
- Start date
- Status
You know what I mean
We already know Sticky Web won't be on Scizor or Forretress, what do you really expect?
You're still better off using Focus Blast and Psyshock, considering Hidden Power's SE power is 120, which is pathetic. In Ubers, the main things you'll want Xerneas to be prepared against are Steels and Ho-Oh, and Hidden Power Ground does chicken shit scratch to the main steels (Ferro, Forry, Genesect, Skarm, Dialga takes more from Moonblast) and nothing to Ho-Oh. Sure Focus Blast's accuracy sucks but you'll still be able to handle Heatran while Psyshock does much more to Ho-On and the few Poisons.
Xerneas @ Leftovers
252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe
Timid
-Substitute
-Calm Mind
-Moonblast
-Thunderbolt / Psyshock
This is what I think Xerneas's flagship set will be. Xerneas can create massive Substitutes with that HP stat and after a few Calm Minds should be able to take special attacks without breaking Substitute. From there it can basically play like Calm Mind Arceus: stack up boosts until you kill everything, even things that resist your STAB. The difference being Xerneas can run Leftovers and doesn't take up your Arceus slot. The EVs can probably be adjusted to Speed creep on some Pokemon.
252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe
Timid
-Substitute
-Calm Mind
-Moonblast
-Thunderbolt / Psyshock
This is what I think Xerneas's flagship set will be. Xerneas can create massive Substitutes with that HP stat and after a few Calm Minds should be able to take special attacks without breaking Substitute. From there it can basically play like Calm Mind Arceus: stack up boosts until you kill everything, even things that resist your STAB. The difference being Xerneas can run Leftovers and doesn't take up your Arceus slot. The EVs can probably be adjusted to Speed creep on some Pokemon.
I highly doubt it. What makes this better than a Calm Mind Arceus? Not to mention, it's phased so easily by roar and will still have it's subs broken by tons of physical attacks...notably gyro ball ferro
It then becomes gene weak, psyshock + moonblast are both resisted by steel while moonblast/tbolt are pretty underwhelming since moonblast is far from spammable with only a single cm boost.
Why make something like calm mind Arceus while we have calm mind Arceus and you're ignoring the geomancy in the room? Plus Arceus gets recover while Xerneas doesn't (I think), and recover > just leftovers.
I admit the set has merit, and a bulky set will probably be viable, but calling it "flagship" while ignoring geomancy+power herb is jarring.
Edit: double greninja'd.
Power herb + geomancy is inherently different from a bulky cm sweeper (which arceus does far better)
I hate quoting myself...
I was comparing it to CM Arceus, not Geomancer. I know Geomancy and CM are different :/
Here's the thing about Power Herb Geomancy: it works ONCE. Once you use up Power Herb, its gone. If you have to switch Xerneas out or it gets phased out, next time you use Geomancy you have to charge it up, which is an obvious and extreme disadvantage. This limits Xerneas to lategame, when it is least likely to be phased out or its counters/checks are weakened and it can take full advantage of the SINGLE +2/+2/+2 BOOST it can now safely set up. CM Xerneas does not face this limitation can be used to set up at any point in the game. They are played entirely differently, so one is not better than the other. Comparing them would be like comparing LO DD Moxie Gyarados with Bulky DD Leftovers Gyarados; they do entirely different things. The reason why I said it would be the "Flagship" set is that it is just "safer", and past experience shows that skilled players will stick to safer and more reliable sets.
Here's the thing about Power Herb Geomancy: it works ONCE. Once you use up Power Herb, its gone. If you have to switch Xerneas out or it gets phased out, next time you use Geomancy you have to charge it up, which is an obvious and extreme disadvantage. This limits Xerneas to lategame, when it is least likely to be phased out or its counters/checks are weakened and it can take full advantage of the SINGLE +2/+2/+2 BOOST it can now safely set up. CM Xerneas does not face this limitation can be used to set up at any point in the game. They are played entirely differently, so one is not better than the other. Comparing them would be like comparing LO DD Moxie Gyarados with Bulky DD Leftovers Gyarados; they do entirely different things. The reason why I said it would be the "Flagship" set is that it is just "safer", and past experience shows that skilled players will stick to safer and more reliable sets.
I'm having a similar dilemma, except mine's 200 HP and 30-31 in everything else except 24-25 in Sp. Atk. Haven't saved it yet, trying to decide if I should or try again.
The reason why people were quoting you is because Fairy Arceus exists now and does this better. Xerneas will be mainly staying to Geomancy; I don't see how it's 'unreliable' at all, you just don't set up when they can obviously roar you out.
Cm is even more unreliable than geomancy is due to not giving a speed boost and thus being outsped by scarfers + gene + gene (this is important so might as well mention it twice) as well as every other mon that checks geomancy xerneas. Geomancy is used as a late game sweeper... It's not designed to do things like geomancy turn 1 then sweep, that only works on the absolute bottom of the ladder.
just saying how he couldnt get outsped by the set that was quoted as a counter on paper
Unfortunately, Psyshock doesn't even manage a 2HKO on 0/148 Xerneas, and from there Xerneas can either choose to OHKO back due to Ditto's terrible base HP, or proceed to get another Geomancy up if there isn't another priority user on the opposing team.
I actually want to know if the ES Genesect can threaten this thing, considering it has Shift Gear, Iron Head and Gunk Shot. (I know you can't get it yet, but with the Poke transporter coming in a few months, I thought it prudent to at least look at the hypothetical.)
It will almost certainly get a +Atk Download boost, and it hits 84.47 - 99.74% with Iron Head with 252 Atk. But +2 Focus Blast OHKOs uninvested Genesect in return, and Moonblast has 62.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock.
Assuming Lugia runs its usual Great Wall spread and Xerneas runs a Timid nature with no boosting items (seeing as it uses Power Herb):
+2 252 SpA [Xerneas] Thunderbolt vs. 252 HP / 80 SpD Lugia: 298-352 (71.63 - 84.61%) -- guaranteed 2HKO -- 75% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
Yes, indeed it will. Beating Lugia is debatable when we consider the mixed attacker set, however.
It's running modest. There is next to no reason to run timid. So it'll most certainly ohko Lugia after sr.
Modest is the common option so can you run the calc with this ?
Edit : Greninja'd ! xD
Fine.
+2 252+ SpA [Xerneas] Thunderbolt vs. 252 HP / 80 SpD Lugia: 328-388 (78.84 - 93.26%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock.
Keep in mind that Moonblast might be the better option depending on how much of a boost it gives to Fairy-type moves.
+2 252+ SpA [Xerneas] Thunderbolt vs. 252 HP / 80 SpD Lugia: 328-388 (78.84 - 93.26%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock.
Keep in mind that Moonblast might be the better option depending on how much of a boost it gives to Fairy-type moves.
- Status