On Fidelity

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Okay, so this is twice now in the span of a week I've been compelled to post something here; it's one of those situations that I'd just like some honest feedback on, and where the anonimity of the internet allows me to be more honest with you guys than I would be with my RL friends.

So, I'll try to keep this brief: I'm dating someone right now; we've been seeing eacother for just over a year and a half, and everything is going great. We are very much in love, I think about her all the time, we thoroughly enjoy one another's company, and all that good stuff. We've known eachother and been good friends for a very long time, and I could probably spend the rest of my life scouring the earth for someone else with whom I would share this level of understanding, love, companionship and respect, and turn up empty-handed. I have every intention of spending the rest of my life with this woman.

The problem: I love her. I also love women. Sometimes, these two affections find themselves in direct conflict. I am growing increasingly... restless in the relationship. I don't know how to fully explain it, but I'm hoping that more than a few of you will understand what I mean. I see pretty girls everywhere, and I love talking to them. Sometimes, my interactions with these ladies lead to small infatuations. Usually these infatuations are unreciprocated by me, and do not present a problem. However, every now and then, I find myself "crushing" on these girls. That's when the problem starts.

Right now, there is a very specific girl, who happens to be a coworker. I find her to be incredibly charming, fairly good looking, and utterly compelling. Last Friday, our team went out drinking, and I spent a good deal of time hanging out with her. Through events I won't get into with any great specificity, the nature of our mutual attraction was brought to light.

She doesn't know I have a girlfriend, she wants to jump my bone (pardon my language), and I kind of want to hook up with her, too.

Now, I know what I should do. That's a pretty easy question to answer. My probelm is just that, even if in this specific case, I choose not to indulge my fickle heart, how do I avoid this situation in the future? Regardless of any physical action I take, I still feel as though I've committed some kind of emotional infidelity. But I've gone through situations like this before, and sticking to the moral high ground doesn't feel as great as I'd thought it would. In The Picture of Dorian Gray, Lord Henry advises Dorian that "the only way to get rid of a temptation is to yield to it. Resist it, and your soul grows sick with longing." This is pretty much exactly how I feel.

I feel like refusing to yield to the whims of my heart is fucking with my head. It is in light of this that I start wondering what would really be more damaging to my relationship with my girlfriend: to maintain my fidelity at the cost of my own sanity, or to give into temptation in the hopes that doing so will appease some devil inside of me?

That's not nearly as brief as I wanted to keep it, but I hope some of you will make it to the end anyway ;).
 
Wilde is wrong. Once you've cheated once, you've fucking cheated. Trust me, I know. It's not forgotten even when it's forgiven. Annd.. once you've cheated once, you've already done it, you've already broken that particular taboo, so there's less and less stopping you each time.
Everyone but everyone has little crushes from time to time. People find other people attractive, it's just how things are. You need to get out of the habits of talking to chicks like that - cheap thrills are not worth your relationship. Are they? You know the answer to that. I don't.
 
I'll keep it brief, but I'll try to make it as distinct as possible.

Once you've cheated, it is never the same. Even if the girl forgives you, she will never forget, and it will remain in the back of her mind for as long as the relationship lasts. Finding other women attractive is a natural thing, and there is nothing wrong with it. But you absolutely MUST refrain from physically acting on it. I've been on both ends of cheating, and I can tell you that it affects you permanently. In my opinion (this might be a bit extreme), once cheating happens the entire relationship is doomed to fail. Whether it happens right then or years later, it will fail. I know there are a few exceptions in cases where a couple overcame cheating, but it is extremely difficult and rare to do. Avoid this painful situation altogether and keep it in your fucking pants.

EDIT - P.S. take it from someone who knows from experience - one night stands are NOT anything special. They are often sloppy and awkward, making the experience mediocre at best. So why blow a working relationship with someone you love for a mediocre, one-time experience? Sounds like a no brainer to me.
 
I should probably make mention of our relationship's coloured history:
My girlfriend and I have both had slip-ups in the past. Usually these were nothing more than simply getting drunk and kissing people at parties, but a couple specific times stand out: one time, we went to a party with each of us being allowed to kiss another person. That didn't turn out particularly well, but also not particulalry horribly. Also, I've kissed a mutual friend of ours who has basically been in love with me for 4 years, and she has kissed my best friend (also an extremely close mutual friend) at a party.

We have survived these things in the past, and I don't think either one of us really holds it against the other - we've even discussed, at fairly great length, the pros and cons of an open relationship. We have, however, decided that at least in the short term, these small infidelities are not a good idea, and we should not be doing anything with other people.

To be honest, I think the main thing that is compelling me here is a belief that I could let myself get away with it. I work in sales, and pretty much lie to people all day long, and I've learned to live with this. It doesn't rest on my conscience anymore, and isn't this basically the same thing? I mean, really, if I don't tell my girlfriend, and I'm not horribly wounded by my indescretions... well, I guess that pretty much still makes me a horrible person.

Fuck, why can't life ever be easy?
 
You probably don't "love" your current girlfriend.

If you've ever felt "love", you would know that having "small infatuations" with other girls isn't really something that happens.

By the way: do you have regular sex with your girlfriend? You could be feeling something else.
 
Ah, yeah. That's something that's tough to get around; frankly, I see it as a mostly semantic issue anyway, but I am confident in my diagnosis of my own condition. There is no force on heaven or earth that could prevent me from being attracted to women that I meet. This is the first time I've ever had a force that could make me think twice about acting on those attractions, and that's something, at least.

I think love is different with everyone. Maybe there are some anorexic people, and when they find themselves in a loving relationship, the symptoms of anorexia disappear. However, there may also be anorexic people in loving relationships who remain anorexic. Maybe loving relatinoships are enough to prevent you from forming "small attractions", but not me?

I'm just saying it's a possibility; regardless, I don't think it's important to get hung up on our definitions of love.

And yes, our sex life is actually pretty good. We fuck a few times a week, whenever we find time, and we have very... compatible sexual tastes. I am certain that our sex-life is the last thing either of us would complain about in our relationship.

That being said, I'm still... curious, about what it would be like with different girls that I meet. I've slept with a couple other women before, but I've hardly done all the exploration that I'd hoped to accomplish in my life.

Really, what I'm trying to do is reconcile the image I've always had of my young adulthood - that of the charming, young bachelor, travelling the world and slamming hos - with the situation that I find myself in right now - in a serious, committed relationship. I've caught myself thinking, on a couple of occasions, how I kind of wish that I'd met this girl five or six years from now when I was ready to settle down. Right now, I honestly feel like I'm fighting the forces of youth.
 
You're completely right when you say you're fighting youth. I have the same sort of feelings, I love my girlfriend(even though I don't think we'll be right for marriage), but I get those little infatuations too. But that's what they are, little, they'll go away. If you think being curious and exploring is more important than the seemingly perfect love you already have, you should end the relationship before you cheat. If you don't tell her about it, it'll eat away at your entire being. If you do tell her she'll be hurt, you'll be hurt, it's just a bad situation. Its really pain that is not worth the cheap thrill, and it almost always is a cheap thrill.You met the perfect girl too early in life. That's what the problem is. It sucks. Question is, are you willing to risk that? If you let her go and didn't find a girl a few years down the line, you'd probably regret it. But then again I do believe there's more than just one person for everyone. Relationships are just kinda rough like that.
 
Without stating the obvious too much, you don't seem to have the greatest respect for women. If you stopped seeing them as things to fuck and actually started looking at them as people, you might find you have less of a problem wanting to run around 'slamming hos'.
 
I think I have a different view on this than many others...

I feel like refusing to yield to the whims of my heart is fucking with my head. It is in light of this that I start wondering what would really be more damaging to my relationship with my girlfriend: to maintain my fidelity at the cost of my own sanity, or to give into temptation in the hopes that doing so will appease some devil inside of me?
You're kidding yourself if you think that appeasing temptation will get rid of it. Think of it this way: in college, you used to cut class, right? Well, once you started doing so, was it easy to stop? Once you start something you like, you will probably become seduced by it. It doesn't matter if its alcohol, sex, or even shoddybattle.

There's nothing wrong with hooking up with a girl. The question is, though, can you successfully discipline your mind and make it a one-night stand rather than something else? If you make it something beyond a one-night stand (this is inadvisable) can you successfully hide it from your current girlfriend? Can you stop it from taking over your mind?

It's only a crime if you get caught doing it, so if you can successfully hide it from your girlfriend, by all means go ahead, because that's not the main issue. The question is: can you resist being seduced by adulterous urges in the future?
 
It doesn't matter if its alcohol, sex, or even


shoddybattle.

GASP!
How can you dare name the most fearsome temptation of them all?!

---
err, about the OP: why don't you talk about it with your girlfriend? I'm sure she will be pleased to help you do "all the exploration that you'd hoped to accomplish in your life"...
 
I'm not quite sure that would go so well. Some desires are best left unstated. Consider a courtroom encounter: if a judge requests that the jury disregard a piece of horrifying testimony, how likely is it that the jury will actually completely disregard the offending information? Isn't it going to be the case that the jury subconsciously takes the information into account?

The case is the same with the girlfriend. You don't bring up other women.

OP said:
I mean, really, if I don't tell my girlfriend, and I'm not horribly wounded by my indescretions... well, I guess that pretty much still makes me a horrible person.

The OP seems to have his dilemma solved for himself: cheat, but don't tell. You're only a horrible person if you think you are. If you don't tell your SO or your friends, she can live with you. The question is: can you live with yourself? It is a man's nature to be sexually polygamous (or at least, more so than a woman: how many women take "mistresses"?) although he might be socially monogamous. There's no shame in it, so don't let it bother you.
 
It's only a crime if you get caught doing it, so if you can successfully hide it from your girlfriend, by all means go ahead, because that's not the main issue. The question is: can you resist being seduced by adulterous urges in the future?

i don't understand how anyone can possibly think like this unless they don't have any fucking concept of reality

please tell me you're playing devil's advocate
 
The OP seems to have his dilemma solved for himself: cheat, but don't tell. You're only a horrible person if you think you are. If you don't tell your SO or your friends, she can live with you. The question is: can you live with yourself? It is a man's nature to be sexually polygamous (or at least, more so than a woman: how many women take "mistresses"?) although he might be socially monogamous. There's no shame in it, so don't let it bother you.

If there is no shame in it, then why do women make a big deal of it?

Also, it might be a good idea to check with your girlfriend how crucial fidelity is to her. If she ranks it highly, then you'd better stay on her good side as if you cheat on her just once, you will eventually be found out and that could cost you the relationship.
 
Glen, this attitude usually stems from a lack of confidence in dating/relationships as a whole. Some people in this world just don't see a relationship as a worthwhile endeavor. There's a woman that works for me that really probed my brain on my views of relationships and marriage, because she very sincerely believes they are a waste of time. It's just a different viewpoint, not so hard to believe people think that way. You and I believe in love, integrity, and companionship. Some people don't :)
 
If there is no shame in it, then why do women make a big deal of it?

Also, it might be a good idea to check with your girlfriend how crucial fidelity is to her. If she ranks it highly, then you'd better stay on her good side as if you cheat on her just once, you will eventually be found out and that could cost you the relationship.

Indeed. Men also make a big deal of it, and women are no less likely to cheat than men, I think.

I don't believe 'what they don't know won't hurt them', unless they are making unreasonable demands of you (for example, my old best friend had an ex that wouldn't let her see her friends at all; I would say that this is fair and reasonable that she would lie to him about speaking to us at college). However, if these demands are a reasonable thing to request in a relationship - for fidelity, for example - then you have to be honest else your relationship isn't worth a great deal; no matter how much you might say 'I love you', and all that, she's just another girl you're sleeping with, and lying to, if you go out and take other partners without her knowledge and consent.

And please, if you're going to cheat, do it safely. Condoms. Please.
 
It's normal to fantasize about other woman, sure. If you act on it though, you're a horrible human being than will die alone and deserves to die alone =D
 
i don't understand how anyone can possibly think like this unless they don't have any fucking concept of reality

please tell me you're playing devil's advocate

I am playing devi's advocate to some point, yes, but not completely. If the OP wants to get his thrills with some other chick, who is to say that he's wrong? I mean, moral blithering is getting us nowhere. All we can do is warn him about the path he's taking, and that yielding to temptation once won't end the temptation, as I said first.
 
Since this other person is tempting you, I think it's your right to discuss with your current partner -
what both of you are happy and unhappy about,
and what both of you can do to maintain each others interests.

And if they're unhappy with doing that, I think it would be fine to move on. But since she is your date right now,
I think the best thing to do is go about it in a VERY friendly way so she won't blow up about you feeling unsecure with her.
Remember that she can always be a good friend, and set boundaries to keep it that way;
she will be an obvious detriment to your new relationship if you do not.
 
In response to the OP, if everything is good in the relationship that you have as you yourself have established then it would be extremely irrational to reciprocate on basic animal instincts towards another female. And based on what you described obviously the girl you happen to be with is not the be all and end all if you still are compelled to such infatuations and such towards other women. The best thing to do is to stick with what you have and that you know works rather than complicating things by letting your penis think for you more than your logical brain. I know it is hard to fight the urge to bang someone when you are presented with the chance, but this girl as you have detailed is clearly worth staying with and not dicking around on the side and totally destroying the happiness you have there. Once you do there will be regret there for the rest of your life.
 
who is to say that he's wrong?

Society has deemed polygamy to be wrong. That is not to say that it is objectively wrong, but the majority of people around him will view him as scum. If the OP wants to cheat then fine, but he must be willing to deal with the consequences.

Alternatively he could move to some other country where polygamy is socially acceptable. That way he gets the best of both worlds.
 
wanting to fuck another girl has nothing to do with the whims of your heart, stop kidding yourself

Truth right there. Personally, I believe it shows a lack of discipline to give in to these base urges, especially when logical analysis would dictate that you control yourself.

While I like that you quoted Dorian Gray, it is a work of fiction. Lord Henry is an idealized person with a wife that doesn't give a damn, living the life of a noble that doesn't have to work at all. Assuming you finished the book, you can see where following Lord Henry's advice led Dorian. Is that how you'd want your life to be?
 
I should probably make mention of our relationship's coloured history:
My girlfriend and I have both had slip-ups in the past. Usually these were nothing more than simply getting drunk and kissing people at parties, but a couple specific times stand out: one time, we went to a party with each of us being allowed to kiss another person. That didn't turn out particularly well, but also not particulalry horribly. Also, I've kissed a mutual friend of ours who has basically been in love with me for 4 years, and she has kissed my best friend (also an extremely close mutual friend) at a party.

We have survived these things in the past, and I don't think either one of us really holds it against the other - we've even discussed, at fairly great length, the pros and cons of an open relationship. We have, however, decided that at least in the short term, these small infidelities are not a good idea, and we should not be doing anything with other people.
This sounds like you are kidding yourself. "Because our relationship is strong and we have overcome adversity in the past, I can abuse it as much as I like, and it will survive". Perhaps your girlfriend is a pushover, I dunno, but I dont think you want to abuse her forgiveness..

To be honest, I think the main thing that is compelling me here is a belief that I could let myself get away with it. I work in sales, and pretty much lie to people all day long, and I've learned to live with this. It doesn't rest on my conscience anymore, and isn't this basically the same thing? I mean, really, if I don't tell my girlfriend, and I'm not horribly wounded by my indescretions... well, I guess that pretty much still makes me a horrible person.
I think this is exactly your problem here. Obviously if your girlfriend never finds out then it wont harm your relationship unless you allow it to, which is an ideal situation for you. But what you have to consider here is how confident are you that she wont find out. And it's not 100%.. No matter how good a liar you might be.

Then you'd need to consider what the cost of her finding out will be, which, I expect, is going to be one hell of a lot. Then look at the value of cheating (which to be fair might be quite a bit), and decide which outcome is best.

That's as impassionate an assessment of the situation as I think you're gonna get.

Have a nice day.
 
don't cheat unless you plan on ruining your relationship.

if you do, and she forgives you, she will never think of you the same again. if you do, and she doesn't find out, then you will never think of your relationship the same way again, either causing a sense shame or a willingness to see if you can get away with it again.

look, when i'm in a relationship, i'm still a flirt towards other women. i often times actually prefer the conversational foreplay over the concept of trying to cheat. if i am happy in the relationship, then the knowledge i could get some random girl i was just talking to is more than enough to me. if i think i will go past that point, i outright tell the girl i'm dating and either we find a way through it, or we break up amicably (not everytime, of course).

Without stating the obvious too much, you don't seem to have the greatest respect for women. If you stopped seeing them as things to fuck and actually started looking at them as people, you might find you have less of a problem wanting to run around 'slamming hos'.
don't you love how a few simple words of common sense put things into perspective?

look, if the fact that you get attracted to others is the problem, then good luck being in any relationship. there will be times in any relationship that you are both attracted to someone and wonder what it would be like to sleep with and/or be dating that person. you get over it if you love the person you are with.

if the problem is that the sex has become monotonous, then spice it up a bit. try throwing in some new fetishes or toys. maybe you could start watching porn together (in my experience, most girl don't mind). and yes, i know you said you are sexually "compatible" but let me say this, i love pasta, but if i ate pasta the same way a few times a week for the past year and a half i would get bored with it and possibly try out a new sauce to put on the pasta.

oh, and if adding fetishes don't work, don't do the stupid thing that many guys do of asking their girls if they can bring in someone else or have a "night-off" from the relationship. some girls like this (in which case you can become a swinging couple), but most will get angry in such a way that you would almost castrate yourself in order to show your sorrow and fear for having mentioned such a thing (not seriously, just the feeling of willingness to do bodily harm to yourself in order to relieve her anger, sorrow and disappointment in you for effectively asking permission to cheat).

edit:also, have you considered the various problems that could arise from getting the girl at work? if it happens more than once, where she doesn't know you have a girlfriend, then she will think herself as either your sex-buddy or your girlfriend. now, if that happens, then the whole store will start talking, whether they actually know anything or not, because you WILL start acting slightly differently around each other after you've had sex. this then means that you can never bring your friends from work around your girlfriend for fear that one of them may slip up. and you should know that every now and then, if you constantly say you are hanging out with someone but your girl never sees them, then she will get suspicious.

now answer, is all the random run-around worth it? especially factoring the chance that your girlfriend might find out and leave you?
 
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