-
Welcome to Smogon! Take a moment to read the Introduction to Smogon for a run-down on everything Smogon, and make sure you take some time to read the global rules.
Pokemon Black & White, aka Gen 5. Coming to Japan in Fall 2010.
- Thread starter Firestorm
- Start date
- Status
True that people would consider it broken. I, however, consider it to be awesome. I could see the move "Fusion" be banned on Shoddy/etc., but it'd be cool regardless. The only thing slightly wrong with it would be that it's not to the Pokemon norm. Also, creating sprites/abilities for even a few pokemon that know the move would be really difficult.
Otherwise, that's a totally epic idea and think that'd be great.
If every Pokemon can fuse with another Pokemon...that would be a lot of Pokemon. So much complication...imagine Mantine-Skarmory.
The "Soul of Pokemon" is going on your journey to become a Pokemon master. It's choosing a team of friends to travel and grow with as you travel across unknown lands and face powerful opponents, and eventually rise up to become a Pokemon master, and when you're smarter, you can go back to that and begin competitive battles; a game that's not just a game, it's an adventure that appeals to people of all ages.
That is the soul of Pokemon.
[/gamefreak]
Agreed. The more I think of it, the less likely it'd be...GF would essentially be designing hundreds of other sprites with typings and abilities to boot. I just think it'd be cool :P
On the third evolution topic: why not make that final evolution extremely specific or hard to do? Call it the "ultimate" forme of the pokemon, maybe. That way, only a select handful of pokemon get it (GF could pick and choose) and it could allow GF to make evolutions on previous generations without it clashing too much (assuming GF sticks to the items/level up near Rock/Mt. Coronet/knowing this move crap)
GF could make it so it doesn't overpower certain pokemon. And hey, if it's too powerful, we put it in ubers, no problem. I'd assume no evolution for Salamence/Gyarados/etc...more along the lines of starters and crappy three-stage pokemon (maybe Butterfree/Beedrill and related pokemon).
I'm spitballing here. I don't really think evolutionary lines will be added, but just trying to further the conversation (it's a better idea than most of the stuff on this thread, anyway)
If this were to be considered broken, then batton passing might as well be broken too. Their both, at least, 2 turn set ups, and batton passing sword dance to a pokemon like metagross would be superiour then base 165 attack. (max 165 atk is 471 points, max x2 attack metagross is 808) Dragon dancing a salamence 2 times is also more powerful and faster then that fusion too.
And seriously, why would gamefreak make all pokemon be able to fuse with eachother? Thats completely retarded, and why I mention that they would most likely make it a rare move that allows fusing, so only a small pool of pokemon can fuse.
Two problems with that:
1. You forgot that the fusions are considerably bulkier, and will be extremely difficult to break, perhaps taking 3 or 4 hits and not fearing things like Ice Shard.
2. Then it would be just a gimmick a select few Gen 5 Pokemon would have. I don't think any old Pokemon like Empoleon or Gallade will have the ability to combine its genetics with another Pokemon. If this ridiculous idea ever did happen, you shouldn't expect more than 3 or 4 Pokemon to utilize it.
Either way, it's just a stupid feature we don't need that makes a bad impact on the game by hurting the aforementioned "soul" of Pokemon. Fusing is corny and is best left to other series it works in.
I concur. Guys, I honestly don't think that fusing will happen. Ever.
I figure if Transform is available, Fusion wouldn't be unreasonable. I agree with Galactic Boss Cyrus that it wouldn't be super powerful pokemon being combined, so it'd be more of a gimmick. I see your point though, -FUCK-.
I have to agree. If you want fusion, see Digimon. The main problem I have is that in Pokemon, Pokemon are like Animals in the real world (or are supposed to be). You don't see a Bird and a Dog fusing together. It really doesn't make sense for Pokemon to do that. Maybe if it was something exclusive to Porygon/Ditto/Mew, where they could naturally pull this stuff anyway. Your idea of "fusion" is 2 Pokemon completely rearranging their genetic material. And if such a move did exist, it would be for, as I said, Pokemon who naturally mess up their genetic composition anyway. Keep in mind, Pokemon at least tries to make sense. Just because random artwork you got from Google images looks "cool" doesn't mean it makes any sense.
And even if it was strictly to poor Pokemon like Spinda and Ledian, they could still fuse with whatever they want. And Arceus' power doesn't need to fuse with Spinda's monster move pool. Thousands of sprites and animations would have to be created just to support the attack "fusion" on one Pokemon, let alone, say ten at least.
It would also be, as mentioned, incredibly cheesy.
Fusion = Yu-Gi-Oh/Digimon =/= Pokemon which means it's bad.
Anyway, I like the idea of more rivals and if more people are trying to get badges, it could be used instead of "the gym leader is off doing something silly right now, please come back later"/team rocket won' let you in. The gym leader could then say they're swamped with challengers which would still make you do something specific before you fight them.
Anyway, I like the idea of more rivals and if more people are trying to get badges, it could be used instead of "the gym leader is off doing something silly right now, please come back later"/team rocket won' let you in. The gym leader could then say they're swamped with challengers which would still make you do something specific before you fight them.
That would make some sprites look creepy beyond belief. If you take things apart and connect them in different places, it just won't look right.
Lets compare:
Tyranitar: --- Galladeon:
HP: 100------ HP: 110
Atk: 134----- Atk: 160
Def: 110----- Def: 120
SpA: 95----- SpA: 90
SpD: 159*--- SpD: 145
Spe: 61------ Spe: 120
*Sandstream Boost
Bulk-wise they are comparable, and I don't see anyone complaining that Tyranitar takes 3-4 hits to die from normal moves.
After one dragon dance (1 turn set up), Jolly Tyranitar's attack and Speed are brought to the equivelent of base 210-ish (attack) and 118 (Speed). Statwise, DD Tyranitar is superior to Gallade, which takes 2 turns to set up, so again, it really isn't broken when you put it in perspective. And you could always phaze fusions away on the 2nd setup turn before they have the chance to attack, you don't have to fight it head on.
I don't see what the problem is with that. As I said before, Gamefreak could use this as a way to make weak/outclassed pokemon like Beedrill/Pinsir/Pidgeot, usable.
EDIT: It could be a move tutor to let old pokemon learn it.
Everything would end up looking like this, trust me.
That's because Tyranitar is slow and has a 4x weakness you can exploit. Certain fusions like Lucario + Lati@s (provided it keeps Levitate and somehow keeps all its types) don't have any weaknesses to exploit and can destroy everything with Draco Meteor and Close Combat.
Also, loling because this forum thinks Lati@s is an email address.
Tyranitar doesn't have 6 moves. If Water and Normal covers everything but 2 Pokemon, than can you imagine what 6 moves will cover? And it has the option of Bulck Up, CM, and Agility to increase all of it's stats, be bulky enough to set up, and still have 3 move slots for coverage and a monster attack on its own.
It is clear that you put effort into your idea, but it is without a doubt the worst fucking idea for pokemon ever posted. I think you're really underestimating your creation here.
This thing is obscenely broken, even by Ubers standards.
EDIT:
Water/Fighting is weak to: Electric(2x), Grass(2x), Flying(2x), Psychic(2x). T_Tar can struck for SE damage from Bullet Punch, Mach Punch and Aqua Jet. Your beast resists Bullet Punch and takes neutral damage from every other Priority move.[/QUOTE]
This monster actually has 30 base points more than Arceus, with an incredible typing and downright broken movepool. Those base stats don't even reflect a single base stat that Gallade OR Empoleon have.
No. Gyarados can't do a fucking thing to this beast. Base 165 atk honestly doesn't not give a shit about intimidate in OU. And after Gyarados switches in, then what? He has base 81 speed compared to your monster's base 120. And did you forget that you gave it Thunderpunch? Base 110 HP combined with Base 120 defense honestly does not give a fuck about Gyarados using Bounce. And what can Mence do? Not a whole lot. And don't forget, Gallade gets Swords Dance as well, so I'd be running a set of Waterfall/EQ/CC/TPunch/Icepunch/Swords Dance.
This thing is obscenely broken, even by Ubers standards.
EDIT:
You're right, T_Tar does have a higher effective BST than 600, but he has a shit ass defense typing. He's weak to: Water(2x), Grass(2x), Fight(4x), Ground(2x), Bug(2x), Steel(2x). He is not as fast as Alakazam and does not have Swords dance.
Water/Fighting is weak to: Electric(2x), Grass(2x), Flying(2x), Psychic(2x). T_Tar can struck for SE damage from Bullet Punch, Mach Punch and Aqua Jet. Your beast resists Bullet Punch and takes neutral damage from every other Priority move.[/QUOTE]
Gallade also learns Taunt.
New things as in new concepts, new ideas, etc.
Stealth Rock was just an improved version of Spikes to me. And really now, it's centralized the metagame so much that no team was acceptable without it. Doesn't that kinda lack variety?
Really now? Are you suggesting that gen three wasn't playable? RSE was loads of fun. Besides, the only problem associated with the gen three game mechanics was that certain pokemon couldn't get STAB moves, but that certainly didn't stop pokemon like Gengar and Gyarados from being dominant.
Anyways, I don't want to hijack the thread, so I digress.
-I think fusions look good visually, but I would hate for them to be in the game. Way too much complication. There literally be tens of thousands, maybe even hundreds of thousands of combinations, and that's not even counting whatever Gen.5 will come out with. Too much work, and every other part of pokemon being enhanced in any way would be neglected. Say goodbye to new moves, pokemon, graphics, a good plot line, or anything else you've ever hoped for in the next generation except for these fusions. I would rather just keep them to talented artists and awe in their appeal.
-About Zoroark being exclusive, I think it reminds me too much of Lucario to be one. No other exclusives, and it would pool many more people into buying a single version instead of the one which didn't have all the hype.
-Those starters don't look half bad actually, for being fake. I wouldn't mind them if they had good evolutions. I think they look very cute, personally.
-Also, I don't like the idea of a fourth evolution for any good 3 stage pokemon that already exists. It's not necessary, and is by no means revolutionary. Think of how broken an evolution to Salamence would be, or one for Kingdra. Maybe you could give it to Golem or someone else who would appreciate it. If they do decide to make a 4 stage evolution from scratch, it would probably end up just powerful enough at its final stage, but would be fairly weak at its first stage compared to most first stage pokemon. That's just what I think.
-About Zoroark being exclusive, I think it reminds me too much of Lucario to be one. No other exclusives, and it would pool many more people into buying a single version instead of the one which didn't have all the hype.
-Those starters don't look half bad actually, for being fake. I wouldn't mind them if they had good evolutions. I think they look very cute, personally.
-Also, I don't like the idea of a fourth evolution for any good 3 stage pokemon that already exists. It's not necessary, and is by no means revolutionary. Think of how broken an evolution to Salamence would be, or one for Kingdra. Maybe you could give it to Golem or someone else who would appreciate it. If they do decide to make a 4 stage evolution from scratch, it would probably end up just powerful enough at its final stage, but would be fairly weak at its first stage compared to most first stage pokemon. That's just what I think.
SR turns hundreds upon thousands off 2/3HKOs into OHKO and keeps pesky, weakened Pokemon from coming back in. It also helps that there are Pokemon who actually get SR besides the normal Skarm and Forre. And there are a lot of Pokemon immune to Spikes, and even more immune to T-Spikes (as well as T-Spikes relative easy method of switching in Roserade/Tenta). It also doesn't take 3 turns to set up. Without 3 turns, T-Spikes is more of a burden because you can simply recover from normal poison, and it stops you from Para/Burning enemies, and normal spikes will easily be recovered regardless. (There are also no Pokemon immune to it)
Although I do have to agree, it does have way to big an impact on the tier system. i.e. Charizard is banned to NU because it loses 50% of HP just by switching in.
You guys are forgetting that theres a TWO TURN set up to make a fusion.
In fact, I'll show you how even a Skarmory completely stops this fusion without even taking a scratch:
-FUCK- switched in Empoleon
Tyranitar used Crunch
Its not very effective!
Opponet switched in Skarmory
Empoleon used Fusion
Empoleon is glowing!
-FUCK- switched in Gallade
Gallade is fusing with Empoleon!
Galladeon was formed!
Skarmory used whirlwind...
And there you go, Skarmory didn't even have to take a hit to do that, and the fusion is stopped and I'll have to reset that up all over again. You guys are really overestimating this. In double battles, Regigigas can be set up in one turn, but he is still not used much at all in there, and is far from broken.
- Status