A weatherless OU Hyper Offensive team with... what?!?

Adamant Zoroark

Adamant Zoroark

catchy catchphrase
is a Contributor Alumnus
Hey Smogon! I'm LucaroarkZ and this is my first RMT here. I had been working on a viable hyper offensive team with no weather for a few months. It has proven to be incredibly difficult with Excadrill as well as the Chlorophyll sweepers running around everywhere in the current metagame. After a lot of testing, I finally made one that's been working out very well for me. Enjoy!
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Deoxys-S @ Focus Sash
Trait: Pressure
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Stealth Rock
- Spikes
- Magic Coat
- Psycho Boost


Deoxys-S is broken, no doubt about it. With this guy I almost always get up Stealth Rocks and at least one layer of Spikes. It makes the job of all my teammates a lot easier, making the difference between OHKOing something and not OHKOing it. Making sure I can KO the enemy is a necessity, since if the enemy survives, odds are it's lights out for my Pokemon. I'm using Magic Coat instead of Taunt since that has proven to do a good job at dealing with common entry hazard leads like Tyranitar.


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Scizor (M) @ Choice Band
Trait: Technician
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Spd
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Bullet Punch
- Superpower
- Pursuit
- U-turn

Edit 9/22/11: Currently testing out SubCM Jirachi in this guy's place to get a reliable answer to rain stall.

Generic CB Scizor set. I love this set so much! Obvious Bullet Punch is obvious, dealing massive damage to almost anything that doesn't resist it. This guy can come in after Latios has used Draco Meteor, and trap it with Pursuit. I can also use it to trap Espeon if I see that the opponent has an Espeon on their team, which makes Deoxys-S's job a little easier. U-turn is for scouting and Superpower is for extra coverage.


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Zoroark (M) @ Life Orb
Trait: Illusion
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Flamethrower
- Nasty Plot
- Dark Pulse
- Focus Blast


No sir, I am not a Hitmontop. I just took out your Jellicent with Dark Pulse because of it. What are you gonna do now? Anyways, I'm not too big on this Zoroark set, but it works well for this team, so whatever. Zoroark has been a staple of my strategy for a while since I've used it on literally every team I've ever made, so I just can't use other Dark-type attackers like Weavile or Tyranitar effectively. Because of Deoxys-S, entry hazards are very rarely on my side of the field, meaning I can almost always safely come out disguised as Hitmontop and either get a free Nasty Plot and start sweeping, or take out a potential threat to Hitmontop such as Jellicent. Zoroark has always delivered great results for me and I would never even consider removing it from my strategy. Even with team preview, Illusion is a great strategy. I can mix-and-match the team roster before the match, so it's hard to truly know when Zoroark comes out.


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Typhlosion (M) @ Choice Specs
Trait: Blaze
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Timid Nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Overheat
- Fire Blast
- Focus Blast
- Hidden Power [Grass]


This is the member of my team that influenced the title. Typhlosion is a very underrated threat in my opinion, and I thought it needed a time to shine. You're probably wondering why I'm using this instead of Chandelure, who could also serve as a great Spinblocker on my team. The reasons are quite simple, really: Typhlosion is not weak to Pursuit like Chandelure is, meaning I can effectively employ a hit-and-run strategy that comes with using moves such as Overheat or Draco Meteor. Overheat is the main move of this set, which scores a OHKO on Ferrothorn, even during rain. Fire Blast is there so I can have a move I can use without lowering Typhlosion's Special Attack. Focus Blast is on this moveset because I need a move to take care of Tyranitar, who is otherwise a huge threat to this set. I need Hidden Power Grass to deal with Gastrodon, Swampert, Politoed, etc. who also otherwise threaten this set, since the only other Grass-type move Typhlosion can learn is SolarBeam, which on a weatherless team is just lol.



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Salamence (M) @ Life Orb
Trait: Intimidate
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SAtk / 252 Spd
Naive Nature (+Spd, -SDef)
- Draco Meteor
- Fire Blast
- Brick Break
- Roost


Mixed Salamence is probably my favorite dragon to use. I decided not to use the usual EV spread and use the spread I'm using because I needed more power when using Draco Meteor and the only physical attack I'm using on this set is Brick Break, which usually takes care of those annoying Steel-types (and Tyranitar) perfectly well. Fire Blast is there to deal with Skarmory, and Roost is so I can recover damage Salamence takes from Life Orb and also for playing mind games with Gliscors carrying Ice Fang.


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Hitmontop (M) @ Life Orb
Trait: Technician
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def
Adamant Nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Fake Out
- Mach Punch
- Close Combat
- Sucker Punch

Edit 9/22/11: Currently testing out Air Balloon Terrakion in this guy's place for a still reliable answer to Excadrill who can function as a better physical sweeper.

Technician Hitmontop is, hands down, one of the best priority abusers in the game. I don't understand why people use Conkeldurr when this guy is available. Fake Out is free damage on anything that isn't a Ghost-type, then I can usually take out the threat with either Mach Punch or Sucker Punch. Close Combat is on this set to deal with Chansey and Blissey very well, especially after hazards damage and Fake Out. Mach Punch also scores a KO on Excadrill with Stealth Rock and just one layer of Spikes set up.

I hope you enjoyed this team! Any comments/critiques are welcome!
 
Whats with all these people who have no clue what the difference hyper offense and heavy offense trying to make "hyper offense" all the sudden?

Your team isn't hyper offense at all, but heavy offense. Heavy offense is based on using offensive pokemon withgood offensive and defensive synergy. Hyper offense on the other hand, completely ignores synergy. In fact, if anything, the team shouldn't have synergy. Hyper Offense is based on Deoxys-S to set up either hazards or dual screens depending on the sweepers, then 5 sweepers. Sweepers should be either all physically oriented or specially oriented (although mixed sweeping is okay). This is to ensure as few of the opponent's walls are relevant as possible. Essentially, members of a hyper offense team have similar checks and counters. It relies on saccing 2/3 members to overwhelm said checks and counters so that another sweeper can get through.

As well, Hyper offense teams should pretty much never switch, because if your opponent sets up on your switch, you're done for. CHOICED POKEMON ARE AN ABSOLUTE NONO. Yeah, you can get a revenge kill, bet that leaves the choiced pokemon as set up bait, and since HO teams have horrendous defensive capability, this is usually game over. Hyper offense sweepers need to stay in an put in as many dents as possible until they go down, so another sweeper can come in on the now weakened check and attempt to break through. The magic of hyper offense is that pressure is always on your opponent. As soon as you make a switch, change from a physical threat to special threat, or use a choiced pokemon to net a KO, that offensive pressure instantly disappears. Becuase your opponent can just switch out Gliscor and bring out Jirachi and continue walling you.

So, would you like this to be a hyper offense team or heavy offense?
 
@New World Order: Chill out bro. This is "Rate my Team", not "tell me what my team is"
Anyway, if that's what you say hyper vs. Heavy offense is then I would prefer heavy offense.
 
haha thats exactly what New World Order posted on my rain offense team. also, while typhlosion is neat, heatran outclasses it by far
 
That Noob said:
haha thats exactly what New World Order posted on my rain offense team. also, while typhlosion is neat, heatran outclasses it by far
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I dunno why, but I've always seemed to prefer Typhlosion. I particularly enjoy using my opponent's entry hazards to trigger its Blaze ability, and then Fire Blast is pretty much GG bro unless you still have something that resists it, or your special wall like Blissey. I'm also not amused by Heatran's lack of Focus Blast.

I'll try out Heatran, but as of now I'm not 100% sure about it.
 
typhlosion is your fav pokemon? =p meh if you want to use your favorites please do. Also, heatran lacks Focus Miss but has Dragon Pulse and 106/106 defences
 
I recommend replacing Salamence with Latias or Latios. You're running him for his Special offensive presence, which Latios and Latias do far better. Specs Latios is a solid set if you want to hit hard right off the bat, or you can use CM Latias for a better defensive pivot and sweeper. I've been running Max HP/Max Speed Timid with Dragon Pulse/CM/Wish/Sub, and it works great. Recover can be used for more reliable recovery. With that great Special bulk, CM Latias with Recover can act as a decent Rain check too.

Hitmontop is awesome, but how do you stop Excadrill? When I ran it, I don't think Fake Out+ Mach Punch KOs. Excadrill can plough through your team with little difficulty. I strongly recommend at least replacing Typhlosion with Heatran. With a Balloon, it can take a Rock Slide and OHKO with Flamethrower or Fire Blast (I hate having to count on avoiding a Rock Slide flinch and then an 85% move though). Going back to what I said earlier, if you use Specs Latios to replace Mence it also replaces Typhlosion's role to an extent. An even better Excadrill counter is Gliscor. I've been loving the SD+Taunt set in the analysis. It take around 20% from Balloon Excadrill's unboosted Rock Slide, easily popping the balloon with Ice Fang or Facade and then KOing with EQ.

That's all I have for now. I feel like I could come up with more, so maybe I'll check in again tomorrow.
 
This is the 7th team I've seen in the past month or so that said they were hyper offense, but really weren't. I got annoyed after the third one, so I decided to post this to make sure people know what they're talking about when they slap "hyper offense" into their title.

As for a rate, I don't believe Hitmontop has the power to take out Excadrill. I suggest using an Air Balloon Terrakion, who is a better sweeper than Hitmontop as well.

Terrakion @ Air Balloon
Justified
Jolly
252 Atk/ 252 Spe/ 4 Hp
Swords Dance
Rock Polish
Close Combat
Stone Edge

Your only steel type is CB Scizor, and with all the SR damage its going to take, its not a very reliable way to deal with dragons. Your team also seems to have a problem against rain teams, especially rain stall. I suggest using a classic SubCM Jirachi. (don`t use rain abuser since Thunder+Water Pulse suck outside of rain) Tanks dragon hits like a boss, shuts down many dangerous rain threats such as Tornadus, and returns fire with a sweep of its own. Oh, and it rips rain stall a new one as well.

Jirachi @ Leftovers
Serene Grace
Timid
252 Hp/ 252 Spe/ 4 SpA
Substitute
Calm Mind
Thunderbolt
Psychic
 
Jirachi's also a great answer to rain, although I prefer the Specially Defensive Wish passer with Iron Head + Body Slam. It's so annoying to face.
 
With no Rapid spinner on your team, I see 3 problems. The first two being Typhlosion and Salamence having their health eaten away every time they switch in, if you even plan on switching, since this is "Hyper Offense." The second being that your Zoroark strategy goes right out of the window with rocks on the field. I STRONGLY suggest you attempt to fit Rapid Spin somewhere on your Hitmontop set. GLB.
 
NeoSeth said:
I recommend replacing Salamence with Latias or Latios. You're running him for his Special offensive presence, which Latios and Latias do far better. Specs Latios is a solid set if you want to hit hard right off the bat, or you can use CM Latias for a better defensive pivot and sweeper. I've been running Max HP/Max Speed Timid with Dragon Pulse/CM/Wish/Sub, and it works great. Recover can be used for more reliable recovery. With that great Special bulk, CM Latias with Recover can act as a decent Rain check too.

Hitmontop is awesome, but how do you stop Excadrill? When I ran it, I don't think Fake Out+ Mach Punch KOs. Excadrill can plough through your team with little difficulty. I strongly recommend at least replacing Typhlosion with Heatran. With a Balloon, it can take a Rock Slide and OHKO with Flamethrower or Fire Blast (I hate having to count on avoiding a Rock Slide flinch and then an 85% move though). Going back to what I said earlier, if you use Specs Latios to replace Mence it also replaces Typhlosion's role to an extent. An even better Excadrill counter is Gliscor. I've been loving the SD+Taunt set in the analysis. It take around 20% from Balloon Excadrill's unboosted Rock Slide, easily popping the balloon with Ice Fang or Facade and then KOing with EQ.

That's all I have for now. I feel like I could come up with more, so maybe I'll check in again tomorrow.
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I just ran a damage calc on my Hitmontop set vs. Excadrill, here's the result (using the ability as Technician):

252 Atk Life Orb Hitmontop Mach Punch vs 4 HP/0 Def Excadrill: 94.48% - 111.88%

252 Atk Life Orb Hitmontop Fake Out vs 4 HP/0 Def Excadrill: 15.75% - 18.51%

Just checking, were you running Intimidate or Technician on your Hitmontop?

I was using Latios in an early form of this team, and the main problem I have with it is its Pursuit weakness. After a Draco Meteor, if the opponent just happens to have a Tyranitar or Scizor, I'm screwed. For this reason I ended up replacing Latios with Salamence, since Salamence lacks that Pursuit weakness. I can see what you're getting at though, but I just don't really like using Latios. I will consider Heatran, though.

New World Order said:
This is the 7th team I've seen in the past month or so that said they were hyper offense, but really weren't. I got annoyed after the third one, so I decided to post this to make sure people know what they're talking about when they slap "hyper offense" into their title.

As for a rate, I don't believe Hitmontop has the power to take out Excadrill. I suggest using an Air Balloon Terrakion, who is a better sweeper than Hitmontop as well.

Terrakion @ Air Balloon
Justified
Jolly
252 Atk/ 252 Spe/ 4 Hp
Swords Dance
Rock Polish
Close Combat
Stone Edge

Your only steel type is CB Scizor, and with all the SR damage its going to take, its not a very reliable way to deal with dragons. Your team also seems to have a problem against rain teams, especially rain stall. I suggest using a classic SubCM Jirachi. (don`t use rain abuser since Thunder+Water Pulse suck outside of rain) Tanks dragon hits like a boss, shuts down many dangerous rain threats such as Tornadus, and returns fire with a sweep of its own. Oh, and it rips rain stall a new one as well.

Jirachi @ Leftovers
Serene Grace
Timid
252 Hp/ 252 Spe/ 4 SpA
Substitute
Calm Mind
Thunderbolt
Psychic
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I like that Terrakion set, I'll try it out. Though those damage calcs I posted do prove that my Hitmontop can take on Excadrill. I'm not quite sure about the Jirachi set, though, but I've never used Jirachi so I don't know.

Howard said:
With no Rapid spinner on your team, I see 3 problems. The first two being Typhlosion and Salamence having their health eaten away every time they switch in, if you even plan on switching, since this is "Hyper Offense." The second being that your Zoroark strategy goes right out of the window with rocks on the field. I STRONGLY suggest you attempt to fit Rapid Spin somewhere on your Hitmontop set. GLB.
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I suppose Fake Out isn't completely necessary, so Rapid Spin could replace Fake Out, but then the problem is that Life Orb will blow Zoroark's cover majority of the time, so if I go for Rapid Spin, I'll probably end up replacing LO with Expert Belt. Any thoughts?

Thanks for the rate, everyone!
 
Expert Belt on Zoroark can help you feign a choice item, provided it lives the following attack/isn't destroyed by some form of priority. Could work out well for you. GLB.
 
LucaroarkZ said:
I just ran a damage calc on my Hitmontop set vs. Excadrill, here's the result (using the ability as Technician):

252 Atk Life Orb Hitmontop Mach Punch vs 4 HP/0 Def Excadrill: 94.48% - 111.88%

252 Atk Life Orb Hitmontop Fake Out vs 4 HP/0 Def Excadrill: 15.75% - 18.51%

Just checking, were you running Intimidate or Technician on your Hitmontop?

I was using Latios in an early form of this team, and the main problem I have with it is its Pursuit weakness. After a Draco Meteor, if the opponent just happens to have a Tyranitar or Scizor, I'm screwed. For this reason I ended up replacing Latios with Salamence, since Salamence lacks that Pursuit weakness. I can see what you're getting at though, but I just don't really like using Latios. I will consider Heatran, though.
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I must've put in the wrong defense stat for Excadrill or something when I ran that calc. It was way back in March when I ran Hail haha.

Substitute Latias would be the Dragon I recommend. You Sub on the firt turn you bring it in, and Sub blocks Pursuit. Although it won't be able to beat Pursuit users since they break your Subs, you can switch out free and bring in something that resists Pursuit. If you're worried about the Pursuit weakness, then I suggest Hydreigon. It resists Pursuit and is neutral to Stealth Rock while also possessing a much stronger Draco Meteor and Fire Blast. It also has Surf, Focus Blast and U-Turn, which is great for gaining the momentum in a match. Scarfgon also gives you a decent revenge killer for things.

How do you deal with Rain teams? I don't see anything that can really switch into a SpecsToed Hydro Pump or the like.
 
Where the heck did you get the idea I don't know how to read. On top of that I was making a joke about Zoroark acting as Hitmontop, geez people take the internet a bit seriously.
 
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