Metagame NP: RU Stage 4 - The Abyss (Diggersby banned, see post #65)

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EviGaro

is a Member of Senior Staffis a Community Contributoris a Tiering Contributoris a Battle Simulator Staff Alumnus
RU Leader
Welcome to the new stage of the SWSH RU metagame! With the new drops below, we felt appropriate to kickstart things officially as we embark on what is truly a completely new experience for this tier. First though, a few things about how we will proceed:

- RUBL is now completely unbanned. This is probably an obvious starting point considering the sheer amount of drops, but an important one to make. We will probably, as we did the last time we voted on RUBL drops, revisit those when we start tiering again but this is a far more dramatic shift than Armor ever was.
- We will not start tiering until a full Council vote on December 7th. We are still waiting on another shift, which might change things both in terms of rises and drops, so we judged best to hold off on this and keep the tier in the Alpha state for that time. While we will restrain the voting to the Council for matters of expediency and having a "playable" tier as quickly as possible, we of course are keen to see what you think of this new RU over the course of the next three weeks, be it in this thread, in the PS! room, or in our Discord server.
- Now the drops, thanks Moutemoute for cropping those lol:


So yes, complete chaos really, although I bet if you played earlier RU gens you look at Tangrowth and are screaming FINALLY YOU'RE BACK... no? just me?

Anyways, have fun! Don't forget the standard forum rules apply, and discuss away.
 

ViZar

your toast is burned
is a Social Media Contributor Alumnus
I think that weather teams and HO will dominate. Rain & Hail were used before, but now we have Venusaur and Darmanitan for Sun and with the RUBLs and mons like Terrakion, Haxorus and Grimmsnarl, HO teams will look scarier
 
While most people are looking at the drops, there is a couple of mons from RUBL and previous UU rises that I am really exited about:


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Indeedee (M) @ Choice Specs
Ability: Psychic Surge
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Trick
- Expanding Force
- Dazzling Gleam
- Shadow Ball/mystical fire/hyper voice

While RU got some new dark types in Zarude, Sharpedo, Malamar, Grimsnarl, Obstagoon and umbreon, Expanding force is still an obsene move to spam. Male is a direct upgrade over female in terms of offensive power, being just 10 points weaker than modest female indeedee while being a lot faster. Sure, it will probably not live many hits compared to female, but if the oponent is dead there is nobody to hit it back (?).
You are probably just gonna spam expanding force most of the game or dazzling gleam if you predict a dark type switch in, so the last move is highly customizable depending on what your team needs.

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Linoone @ Iapapa Berry
Ability: Gluttony
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Belly Drum
- Extreme Speed
- Seed Bomb
- Throat Chop/stomping tantrum

Fast boi is back and ready to sweep late game.... well, maybe not yet considering the amount of ghost types the tier suddenly received. While the tier is not really kind to it, screens HO always aprecciates a way to clean weakened teams late game, and I see it being pretty good once things start to settle down. I can see it being a good pair with its galarian evolution to get rid of oposing ghost types.
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Slowbro-Galar @ Quick Claw
Ability: Quick Draw
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Belly Drum
- Drain Punch
- Zen Headbutt
- Shell Side Arm

In terms of deffensive pivots, I believe its galarian brother is better, having better special attack and more overall bulk. So, its option to shine is through the cheese. having close to a coin toss of a chance to move first is absolutely unfair, and combined with screens to ease set up, it is hilarious to pull off a sweep with it.
One notable thing about this mon is that it pairs really well with psychic terrain, as the ability does not change its place into the priority bracket (thus, not being blocked by it) while blocking opposing priority and powering its zen headbutt to nasty levels.
Nasty plot is also viable and probably more reliable in longer games, but I find this set more enjoyable to mess around on ladder and have a controled enviroment for my gambling addiction XD

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Flygon @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP / 4 SpA / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Roost
- Scorching Sands
- U-turn
- Defog

My favorite mon of all time is finally on a tier where it can shine.... maybe not offensively, considering the competition around it, but as a defensive pivot. This mon is one of the only mons that doesn't care about any form of hazards (taking negligible damage from rocks), so leftovers is the prefered item over HDB. The adition of scorching sands gives it a way to threaten switch ins, while having reliable recovery in roost.
The EV spread is not really optimized yet, so feel free to change it to suit your needs (some invested in speed may be required)

Overall, the tier will be utter chaos for the next couple of days and I can't wait to jump into teaambuilding once I have the time for it XD
 
How are Haxorus, Conkeldurr, Terrakion and Thundurus RU?

Why is Gengar here?

How long before we implement a lower treshold for a mon's tiering placement so this shit doesn't happen?

Will Toxic Spikes ever be viable in this tier?

All I know for sure is that Sword and Shield still suck.


Ghost spam would be braindead and dumb from a cursory glance if not for the stupid amount of good mons with a Normal subtyping. But given we just got a stupid amount of Fighters as well...

Zoro with a Gengar disguise sounds really, really fun to play with (Zoro + Ghost disguise in general, tbh).

Looking forward to a record amount of quickbans because Jesus Christ.
 
How are Haxorus, Conkeldurr, Terrakion and Thundurus RU?

Why is Gengar here?

How long before we implement a lower treshold for a mon's tiering placement so this shit doesn't happen?

Will Toxic Spikes ever be viable in this tier?

All I know for sure is that Sword and Shield still suck.


Ghost spam would be braindead and dumb from a cursory glance if not for the stupid amount of good mons with a Normal subtyping. But given we just got a stupid amount of Fighters as well...

Zoro with a Gengar disguise sounds really, really fun to play with (Zoro + Ghost disguise in general, tbh).

Looking forward to a record amount of quickbans because Jesus Christ.
Mons like conk scolipede lycan d terrak thundurus togekiss suicune tangrowth fell bcuz ppl in uu obssesed with new toys lmao
 

HailFall

my cancer is sun and my leo is moon

Ninetales-Alola @ Light Clay
Ability: Snow Warning
EVs: 248 HP / 8 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Freeze-Dry
- Aurora Veil
- Hail
- Encore / Hypnosis

Grimmsnarl (M) @ Light Clay
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 120 SpD / 136 Spe
Careful Nature
- Light Screen
- Reflect
- Taunt
- Spirit Break / Thunder Wave

Screens has quickly proven to be one of the most powerful strategies in the tier with glass cannons like Gengar, Lycandoge, and Scolipede around. Both are effective setters and enable the brokens to shine to their full extent.


Cleaner (Scolipede) @ Life Orb
Ability: Speed Boost
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature / Jolly Nature
- Megahorn
- Poison Jab / Rock Slide
- Earthquake
- Swords Dance

Suicide lead (Scolipede) @ Focus Sash
Ability: Speed Boost
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Spikes
- Toxic Spikes
- Endeavor
- Poison Jab

Scolipede is a very scary threat, especially in a meta dominated by HO like this. Switchins are limited to things like Doublade, Geezing, and Rhyperior and they can basically all be worn down fairly easily due to lack of recovery. Suicide lead sets are also effective, but come with the fairly large opportunity cost of not being able to use Scolipede as a cleaner. It definitely seems broken, but I think it will be a little less obvious once the meta calms down (assuming its not hit in the first ban wave) and people start running more defensive stuff like Steelix and Rhyp. Still, I think the obscene pressure it puts on offense while also putting in work against slower teams just makes it too much for the tier.


Venusaur @ Life Orb
Ability: Chlorophyll
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Giga Drain
- Weather Ball
- Sludge Bomb / Earth Power
- Growth

Sun is back and better than ever with the addition of Venusaur. Its terrifying power and coverage on top of a fantastic speed tier makes it nearly unwallable under sun, and its natural bulk and typing allows it to set up with Growth. This will probably be one of the first things to go come December 7th.


Durant @ Life Orb
Ability: Hustle
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- First Impression
- Iron Head
- Superpower
- Stomping Tantrum

Durant is very nice. Its respectable attack on top of hustle gives it the strongest first impression in the game, putting a hefty dent in pretty much anything that isnt a 4x resist. Its a valuable tool for keeping weather and a number of sweepers like Haxorus and Venusaur in check, and works pretty well on any offense team as a blanket check to a number of faster mons. Just don't miss.

Talonflame @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Gale Wings
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Brave Bird
- Flare Blitz
- Swords Dance
- Roost

Talonflame is one of my favorite mons in the new meta. With a phenomenal speed tier, solid typing, and access to boots, it's a solid revenge killer that can handle threats like Venusaur and Scolipede thanks to Gale Wings. Bulky sets might find their place later on in the meta, checking threats like Durant and crippling switch-ins like Gigalith and Rhyperior with Will-O-Wisp.
 
So I'm gonna post a few thoughts on a couple of the pokemon that have recently dropped.

  • Diggersby is in my opinion the most broken of the drops for a multitude of reasons. The main one is when it's out, the risk reward is heavily favoring the diggersby user. The opponents counterplay to it is largely hoping what they have is faster than it and can take quick attack while ohkoing it, having Tangrowth paired with a ghost to try and get it to guess incorrectly and that's dicey as knock off exists. It even gets spikes to so it can just throw those out and chip down its checks for later on.
  • Gengar falls in a similar boat in that it lacks sufficient answers to be dealt with. The best one is umbreon which is passive and focus blast nukes it or scarf sets just trick, revenge killing it with a faster mon or scarfer, or by priority. Registeel would be a great answer to it but taunt shuts it down, it's extremely passive, and trick also ruins it.
  • The next one I view as most problematic is lycanroc dusk. It basically takes lycanrocs best traits and amps them up due to tough claws. Getting close combat makes it a like a better terrakion with priority and is a huge pain for a lot of teams to deal with. It takes terrakions main issue and removes it.
  • Scolipede is just sharpedo with stronger moves and better bulk. There's some ways to play around it I guess, but it steamrolls very hard once it gets it going though. The best counter to it is probably regular weezing, which is niche since g weezing is better and brings more to the table.
  • Ninetales-A and Grimmsnarl enable screens and hyper offense. Also fuck aurora veil. Ninetales being super fast means your almost guarantees it gets it up, hypnosis cripples stuff that would otherwise be unfavorable, and gives a free turn to a sweeper. Also it makes hail and arctozolt even more annoying.
  • Two mons that I thought would be insanely dumb but aren't that I want to get into are obstagoon and terrakion. I was expecting these two to be insanely dumb, but in practice they kinda fall short. Don't get me wrong, they're not bad, but I wasnt satisfied with using them as much as I'd like. Obstagoon tries to combine the best traits of diggersby and heracross, but ends up worse than either individually. It has a harder time standing out with its main pros being: stab on facade and knock off and parting shot. The expanding force immunity is also nice as it gives teams something to force indeedee m to guess. I ran taunt parting shot facade knock off on it and while it did it's job as a breaker, I think lacking SD is really bad for this since it can't fathom to pump out the damage these 2 can while it lacks enough qualities that make it stand out from them, or conkeldurr, which is bulkier, hits even harder, and comes with a super strong priority. Now with terrakion I find it worse than duskcanroc due to the lack of accelrock. Tough claws also plays in favor for lyc, but it's mainly the lack of priority that makes it so much harder to revenge kill. Plus I feel like the tier has legitimate counterplay to it that's not insanely niche. I feel that Slowbro-g/Slowking-g, nidoqueen, golurk, tangrowth, doublade, celebi, and cresselia are all capable of providing countermeasures to it and all of them can easily do things besides stopping terrakion. Meanwhile it's not that difficult to revenge kill with scarfers or priority. My opinion will probably change later on about them, but as of now, neither doesn't feel broken to me to the point I can't play against them.
  • Talonflame is probably one of the best drops that the tier has gotten. Even without gale wings, it's speed tier is ideal for revenge killing a lot of new threats, a physical attacker immune to burns, and it can also check Durant without a rock move/thunder fang.
 

Slowking-Galar @ Assault Vest
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 252 HP / 108 SpA / 148 SpD
Calm Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Eerie Spell
- Sludge Bomb
- Scald
- Future Sight

I'm 2nd (edit: 1st) on the ladder right now largely on the strength of this set. It's such a good blanket check to a huge swath of the tier. EVs tank a +2 Life Orb Shadow Ball from Gengar and knock it out with Eerie Spell. It also easily tanks a Life Orb Earth Power from Nidoqueen and chunks it back. Scald hits junk like Steelix on the switch-in, but you could slot in Flamethrower for Zong or Ice Beam or whatever. You don't use Eerie Spell primarily because it docks PP, you use it because it goes through subs. The PP effect is just a nice bonus.

I'm also definitely using Avalugg because uhhh Arctovish and Zolt and Diggersby and Zygarde-10% and Haxorus are stupid
 
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I decided to just throw a quick team together (literally 2 mins) and had a few battles, here are the results.
Bare in mind, I haven't played RU in Gen 8 yet:

Easy battle, Darmanitan destroys lives

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8ru-1225104967-si7tsri0el9nbzk6ua8v9zzt1o7yjscpw

Good Battle, Gengar destroys all

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8ru-1225111264-sjryjwf2wk01uvccgcww4tqlkivygjwpw

Darmanitan sweeps... again

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8ru-1225115793-olczakcil27xrdy8vkf7aww18x0e2fzpw

6-0 mono water

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8ru-1225118847-7e4jxp734xamkxjbhd8fiv7vufx6rq1pw

Good battle, Cloyster was worrying, but choice scarves win in the end

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8ru-1225120721-db9uqmmgncy3i6yv1ho5cnm4y7ii29jpw

As it has been said before, there is true chaos occurring now and I expect quickbans soon xD
 
I decided to just throw a quick team together (literally 2 mins) and had a few battles, here are the results.
Bare in mind, I haven't played RU in Gen 8 yet:

Easy battle, Darmanitan destroys lives

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8ru-1225104967-si7tsri0el9nbzk6ua8v9zzt1o7yjscpw

Good Battle, Gengar destroys all

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8ru-1225111264-sjryjwf2wk01uvccgcww4tqlkivygjwpw

Darmanitan sweeps... again

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8ru-1225115793-olczakcil27xrdy8vkf7aww18x0e2fzpw

6-0 mono water

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8ru-1225118847-7e4jxp734xamkxjbhd8fiv7vufx6rq1pw

Good battle, Cloyster was worrying, but choice scarves win in the end

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8ru-1225120721-db9uqmmgncy3i6yv1ho5cnm4y7ii29jpw

As it has been said before, there is true chaos occurring now and I expect quickbans soon xD
hate to break it to you but despite the insane amount of busted mons running around, the council said they wont ban anything until December 7th when the metagame stabilizes more.
(also to make this post longer ill edit it with my metagame thoughts when I'm less busy)
 
Imagine telling someone 14 years ago that Gengar would be in the same tier as Regigigas and Articuno.

But anyways, I really love the Abomasnow and Raikou pairing. Abomasnow provides Hail for Ice type Weather Balls that Raikou and abuse, and it also absorbs the ground type attacks Raikou is weak to while being a huge threat to all ground and Goodra types. Meanwhile Raikou is fast, hits hard, and that weather ball can be used against opposing weathers such as using it against an oncoming Venusaur in the sun, and its electric provide a constant threat to rain teams. Raikou also appreciates the extra chip damage when breaking past the metagame.
 

A floor Mat

The Official Floor Mat of Rarley Used
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Tsareena @ Life orb / Heavy - Duty Boots
Ability: Queenly Majesty
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Rapid Spin
- Power Whip / Trop kick
- Knock Off / U - Turn
- Synthesis / High Jump Kick

With the crazy shifts, I have seen people use all the new drops on ladder except for the Fruit Pokemon. Tsareena is a Interesting mon, like last gen it is a grass type spinner that has a high base 120 attack stat that allows it to hit hard as well. It also boasts great utility moves in knock off and U-turn which helps helps it weaken switch ins by removing items or pivoting out. Unfortunately, this gen it has competition as a grass type spinner in Eldegoss, who has room in its move pool for sleep powder or aromatherapy and has excess to everyone's favorite ability Regenerator. Hopefully once the metagame cools down a little, the Fruit Pokemon can see more action in the tier it was raised in (look at the drops and you quickly see that 80% of the mons there beat this thing XD).
 
Hello! I wanted to talk about really interesting that I have noticed in the tier, and that's the dinamics of weather. Due to the way tiering is being handled this gen and some interesting mon additions, all weathers are viable in some way (either offensively or defensively). Let's see them in detail:

Weather cores: these choices are used in conjunction with mons that don't neccesarily benefit from the weather, either because they lack abusers to create an entire team or because it stacks too many weaknesses in the team.

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Sand is, admittedly, the least common of the weathers due to the lack of good abusers outside of Lycanrock midday and Stoutland. Both are decently solid as late game cleaners once priority and Gardevoir (a common menace for all weather) is taken care of.
However, Gigalith acts as an excellent weather check due to its ability to change it into sand. This, combined with the fact is is a pretty decent pokemon on its own defensively (though the influx of fighting types did not help it al ALL) makes sand a decent choice to include on your team.

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Hail is the most pleasant surprise to me, as I thought it was destined to be the black sheep of weathers for all eternity. But alas, they just needed better abusers to be effective XD Now, full hail teams stack up way too many weaknesses to be viable, but hail cores are an excellent adition to offense, giving aurora veil support and other perks depending on the setter (hypnosis and fairy coverage with ninetales-A, taunt and explosion with vanilluxe, priority and grass coverage with abomasnow). The best hail abuser is, without question, arctozolt, having an excellent STAB combination and coverage for almost every check in the tier. Other decent abusers are Sandslash-A and arctovish, but they don't bring as much pressure compared to arctozolt. Overall, seeing hail being good outside of gen 4 stall teams makes me so happy and I highly recomend using it.

Weather teams: These teams revolve around abusing the weather condition as much as they can for as many turns as possible. They usually consist of 1 main setter, a backup setter/support, 2 to 3 abusers and a non weather mon to fill weaknesses.

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(I hate that these images are not standing at the same level)

Sun has been around for a while in the tier, giving mons like zard and vileplume the chance to offensive menaces. It also gave the occasional Leafeon the chance to shine in the tier. However, two new clorophyll abusers have entered the fray, carving an inmediate spot in sun teams. The most notable one is venusaur, being an incredibly dangerous threat if given the chance to set up. Between weather ball, sludge bomb and giga drain, there is little that can stomach a hit from this monster. On the other side, we ha Shiftry. Once banned due to its inmense power under sun, the boi is back in a really unfavourable meta for it, filled with fighting priority and faster threats. Even with this in mind, Shiftry is still a force to be reckoned with. Its STAB combination + heat wave covers almost the entire tier, with equally menacing physical and special sets. Don't underestimate this mon, as it will probably get better with time. Other notable sun mons are zard (either specs or scarf), Xatu (hazard removal and magic bounce are invaluable tools),heliolisk (a water inmunity and excellent pivot with heavy duty boots) and whimsmicot (prankster sunny day and encore are pretty useful).

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Remember how in Avatar they talk about how the fire nation attacked? Well, here it was the water nation, beause holly molly rain is insane a as playstyle. Now, it is not nearly as busted as I expected it to be, but that doesn't mean it can be underestimated. The thing about rain is that its abusers are incredibly strong and can break for each other against most playstyles. Now, Politoed is not the best pokemon around, but having encore + toxic can save you from some tricky situations while bringing the rain for the squad. Kingdra is one of the best abusers, having an excellent STAB combo, hurricane and momentum in flip turn. Physical is also a choice, but it lacks the inmediate power of special. Kabutops bring physical power to the fray, while also having useful priority in aqua jet or surpise coverage in leech life. Omastar also acts as a special breaker, either with shell smash or with white herb meteor beam. Be careful with its speed tier though. Seismitoad brings rocks + and electric inmunity to the team, while also being decently strong with swift swim or having another inmunity with water absorb. Tornadus, imo, is what gives rain the edge over the weathers above, as it acts as an excellent secondary rain setter with prankster AND rain abuser with hurricane. Other honorable mentions are raikou (momentum, boosted scalds and accurate thunders), Xurkitree (monstrous special attack, momentum and accurate thunders), Raichu alola (gives you a check to opposing electric terrain teams) and mantine (unorthodox swift swimmer that can dent grass types with STAB hurricanes)


To wrap this up, I think all of these playstyles have ways to be played around, either offensively or defensively, and the only mons I consider over the top are venusaur and tornadus. Once those are dealt with in the future, I think RU can handle the weather pretty well. If not, consider abusing it while you can! It is pretty fun XD
 

phantom

Banned deucer.
this meta has about 5 days left so I’ll share some thoughts before we start tiering in the upcoming shift. overall, I find the tier to be pretty enjoyable. I’ve been able to make various hyper offenses and bulky offenses work and even found some success with stall. balance is...not that great but just about everything else can work to an extent. I really enjoy a lot of the new options ru has and it finally feels like a new gen as opposed to a watered down sm like the tier has felt throughout ss.

- gengar is obviously ridiculous but I don’t think anyone expected otherwise. zero counters, near flawless movepool, great stats, and surprisingly palatable defensive typing. standard life orb sets are terrifying to switch into and anything that could pivot into that just gets overpowered by nasty plot. sub sets are also pretty annoying to deal with. hopefully this moves up to uu soon, if not, it will be one of the first things to go for sure.

- surprisingly...not that bad. I think once people got past the initial knee jerk reaction of “omg terrakion is ru” they’ll realize it isn’t even unmanageable down here. between several viable defensive checks like doublade tangrowth and suicune, it hasn’t been that overbearing to check, and there’s several offensive mons that can naturally outspeed and ko it like starmie, thundurus, zygarde, scoli, gengar, durant etc. that’s not to mention other counter play from scarfers, mimikyu, and mach punch conkeldurr. not sure if it’ll stay that way and it’s obviously top tier regardless but I find it funny that it’s not even close to being the most egregious thing that dropped down here.

- I know it might be weird in a tier with gengar, terrak, and chlorophyll venu legal to find this one of the dumbest mons, but it really is. I think the combination of future sight + regen + teleport is absolutely ridiculous and enables a lot of brainless play. it’s just way too cheap. specifically, a lot of offensive combinations like slowking + conk, slowking + zarude, and even slowking + zygarde are pretty hard to respond to. I don’t like how this exacerbates a lot of already borderline problem mons in the meta and even makes mons that are supposed to be manageable difficult to check. the way it exploits a lot of the tier’s defensive mons so effortlessly is pretty obnoxious too. definitely one of the most cancerous mons in the meta imo.

- weather overall hasn’t been that bad for the most part. venu is obviously great but it has a hard time setting up atm and the threat of ditto counter sweeps really inhibit it. sun without venu is pretty bad too. venu is really the one thing that holds that archetype together and even then it doesn’t have free reign. rain is surprisingly one of the worst weathers and was even manageable in the last meta. there’s a lot of defensive checks such as suicune and tangrowth that punish rain teams severely, and offensive mons like raikou and xurk give these teams huge problems too. the biggest obstacle when it comes to rain’s success is politoed. it’s just...bad. all it does is sit there and click weak scalds. it has no way to help with the hazard game, pivot or even pose as an offensive threat on its own. as long as politoed is the drizzle setter, I don’t see drizzle ever being a problem. veil teams are pretty annoying on the other hand. while veil wasn’t as crazy as it was in the first few days, i think ninetales is too consistent as a veil setter and i view its support capabilities as a detriment to the tier. I think grimmsnarl is in a similar boat as well.

- it isn’t ru without regi, is it? gaining heavy slam was great for it. regi finally has a decent steel stab, and it’s pretty essential in this meta when it comes to dealing with mons like gengar, mimikyu, togekiss, polteageist etc. it still needs seismic toss of course, so not having protect is a bummer since regi depends on it to accrue leftovers recovery, but im glad it’s now able to take a less passive approach towards checking opposing threats. definitely one of the best steels atm and i can only see it getting progressively better as the tier continues to develop.

- ditto is extremely clutch in alpha tiers, as usual. I think the presence of ditto has been very good for the meta in holding down setup spam teams and weather. it also responds to every offensive threat in the tier pretty well and can even be used to pivot around regen cores. this is easily the best ditto has ever been in ru.

- there’s a lot of great defensive picks in this meta in spite of all the crazy brokens. tangrowth is fantastic and really annoying to handle between knock off and the threat of sludge bomb poisons (great option to check zarude btw). suicune is easily one of the best mons in the tier and is borderline broken, but i think it’s more so because it takes advantage of the state of the tier rather than it being unmanageable if that makes sense. I think once a lot of the brokens leave it’ll have the potential to settle in nicely. crobat is one of the best fight checks in the tier and is just fantastic overall. decent offensive presence great speed etc. a clear defensive staple. glowking really can only use av but it’s actually so very annoying to deal with. it counters venu, checks electrics like raikou, thundurus, toxtricity, and has very few non-punishable switch-ins because of sludge bomb poison spam. cresselia is somewhat niche but i’ve found it to be really effective since it’s one of the few pokémon capable of responding to a lot of portsight cores. i’ve been using skill swap / toxic / moonlight / ib and it’s been great. skill swap is mainly to stop cm reun but it also does a couple of the other neat things like stripping regen from slowking and pressure from suicune.

- nidoqueen is back and as good as ever. it’s easily one of the best sr setters in the tier and is a fantastic breaker. the good bulk also lets it 1v1 several offensive mons like zarude, doublade, and talons. definitely a mainstay in ru. starmie has been one of my favorite mons to use. analytic life orb sets are great and have very few switch-ins. while rapid spin is decent if you really need it, i’ve been experimenting with flash cannon in the last slot to bait unsuspecting ninetales and it’s hilarious how often it works. analytic flash cannon is still pretty useful in other ways by breaking mons like kyurem and sylveon, so it has some use outside of the surprise factor. zarude is easily one of the best mons in the tier. great stats and movepool and defensive typing let it do almost everything. i think the tier is slowly adapting to it as defensive checks like weezing galar, tangrowth and togekiss rise in usage, but it does have the potential to adapt to most of those. it should be interesting to see if it’ll fit into the tier or end up being too much over time. scolipede i’ve found to be unambiguously broken. stab megahorn with sd and speed boost is insane. it’s not just great at cleaning offense but it’s also difficult to respond to defensively. it also has the coverage moves to break past any potential counter. mimikyu on the other hand has been a bit underwhelming. i think it’s an interesting pick but it has so many issues. it’s pretty weak first of all, even doublade can beat it 1v1 which is kinda pathetic. it has issues with other mons like crobat, suicune, registeel, tangrowth etc, and offense can just break disguise with uturn or volt spam to deal with it. still a good mon i think but more than manageable surprisingly.

this became a bit longer than i thought it would be lol but the tier just has so many interesting options (a lot of which i haven’t even mentioned yet) and it’s just so new from any past gen ru or even past gen alpha metas. hopefully the tier shifts will be merciful, but i expect this to be a great gen once the dust settles.
 
I'm running a Sand Balance/Semi Stall core composed of Gigalith/Palossand/Sigilyph/Gastrodon and it has been working wonders on the ladder. Rain matchup is surprisingly decent and I actually find the Sun match up trickier to handle.
 
ok just wanted to talk about a few things here, since the meta will be different in a few days



it might just have to do with how i'm playing but this is by far the most obnoxious thing in the meta for me to face...granted i haven't really played against veil so take that as you will. i really like crocune as opposed to vincune because it obviously has a lot more staying power, making it a better defensive presence throughout the game, but yeah vincune is a major dickhead. ive considered running some things like toxic noivern / crobat just to deal with it. id like to see it go personally but it's probably rising up anyway cause apparently it's great in ou too.


probably the best overall defensive mon in the tier atm behind registeel, not hard to see why. it has every tool it needs to be a pain in the ass for any team and is one of the best answers to zarude. giga / knock / sbomb is the bread and butter, things like powder, toxic, leech, and synth are probably good as well.


arguably not as splashable as noivern and crobat but i really love using this thing. been using bb / defog / roost / overheat instead of sd or 3 atks but those sets are probably good as well. main draw of overheat is that you dick tangrowth if you get a tiny bit of chip on it, and more importantly, dont get punished through bb + rocky helmet damage. it's also a nice anti-cheese mon in a way with gale wings, as full health bb allows u to emergency check a lot of things. you get also prio defog in some occasions which is nice.


perhaps overshadowed following the influx of god knows many nukes, but this thing is really strong. terrakion check obviously and its stabs are incredibly hard to switch into. u can dynamic punch zarude on the switch to just own that too.


kinda awkward to work with in how it forces you to build, but this thing is, as always, super strong late game and is obnoxious to switch into. a full special set is fun cause u own tangrowth. need some voltturn support and perhaps spikes but it's always a neat cleaner. can totally see this being broken down the line lol


speaking of voltturn, this thing is a total beast. specs is a great breaker and with grounds not being super common aside from nidoqueen and the occasional lix, it's real easy to just break things down. tspike immune which in theory probably doesn't matter that much, but tspikes seem fantastic in this meta so there's that. unfortunately it doesn't have a lot going for it in the defensive utility department but well sometimes that's a lot to ask for something like this, and that's a tradeoff worth taking. shift gear sets are probably ok as well but meh you need a lot of conditioning for it to work out, so i prefer just chipping shit down with it.


not really a whole lot to say about it LOL it's pretty obvious what it does, and to me is one of, if not the best breakers in the tier. coupled with pivot, or really just fs slowking, this thing is nigh unstoppable. beyond that you have mach which is always a beautiful tool to have, and you can eat a lot of hits at full, so you're always getting mileage from it. doesn't have the speed and slightly better typing of terrakion (who i also think is stupid because the lo set requires an immense amount of just dancing around to get around it) but it's always gonna pummel something.


one of the best answers to zarude, and a great overall utility mon with heal bell. of course you can use thunder wave to make life harder for everything lol. scarf trick sets seem viable as well to punish registeel / zong / diancie but you kinda always want to be able to switch into rocks.


thought this thing would be great but it kind of sucks. despite theoretically being great against ho and standard teams, missing just causes such a momentum loss due to its nonexistent bulk and awkwardness of fitting it on a team. honestly you could maybe justify a swarm scarf set a la bw ru cause it seems like it'd be more worthwhile as an anti offense regard as opposed to just rolling the dice and forcing yourself to play catch up.


that's about it atm. aside from cune and terrak there's not a whole lot i'd want gone now, i think weather is by nature kind of stupid but i haven't seen it enough to make a justifiable conclusion. rain probably sucks lowkey lol. specs chandy in sun seems really really fun on the other hand...thanks for reading as always

e: oh i forgot about gengar lol yeah that's dumb too for obv reasons. kyurem is really really good too and i think that's worth taking a deep look at to see if it should go or not
 
ok just wanted to talk about a few things here, since the meta will be different in a few days



it might just have to do with how i'm playing but this is by far the most obnoxious thing in the meta for me to face...granted i haven't really played against veil so take that as you will. i really like crocune as opposed to vincune because it obviously has a lot more staying power, making it a better defensive presence throughout the game, but yeah vincune is a major dickhead. ive considered running some things like toxic noivern / crobat just to deal with it. id like to see it go personally but it's probably rising up anyway cause apparently it's great in ou too.
Is Suicune really broken? I think you have some loopholes in your teambuilding. Between Toxicroak who is the number one counter and Clear Smog Gastrodon/Haze Mantine, Suicune have no hopes of breaking either of them. Hell even SpD Vileplume with Growth is a decent check to it so you can boost alongside it.
 
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Is Suicune really broken? I think you have some loopholes in your teambuilding. Between Toxicroak who is the number one counter and Clear Smog Gastrodon/Haze Mantine, Suicune have no hopes of breaking either of them. Hell even SpD Vileplume with Growth is a decent check to it so you can boost alongside it.
While I wouldn't really say I can agree with the statement that suicune is broken(jk I hate this mon way too much using stall), I feel like Croak isn’t really good when considering the bloated metagame right now. Sure croak is great as a counter to suicune, but having to give up your fighting type slot when you can have monsters like terrakion,Conkeldurr and Heracross is a huge opportunity cost. Gastro and mantine are way better as counter and the same goes for growth vileplume.

In other news, Gengar got the boot so now we don’t have to keep using stuff like umbreon to check it which is very nice, might make a post with some metagame thoughts Or may not.
 

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Considering it's the final day of the tier as it stands currently, wanted to give some thoughts on some Pokemon I've played with, had a lot of experience with, etc.


We may have gotten a lot of new toys, but Xurkitree is still quite good. Sure, Nidoqueen is kind of annoying for it as it being the Ground takes away Gleam as a good mid-ground move in a lot of cases, but LO / Specs just slaps it with Grass Knot. Scarf I feel is pretty lackluster in this meta as I feel Xurk should be focusing on what makes it different than other Electrics; pure, raw power. Of course, when there's no Ground type, it's pretty freakin strong to just click Specs / LO Volt Switch continously as most of the tier's non-Ground pivots aren't shrugging it of.


This has been getting a lot of talk and this is actually another reason I really like Specs / LO Xurkitree in this meta as it still 2HKOes +2 Suicune and doesn't drop to 1 Scald. That aside, Suicune is stupid good right now because of the meta around it. Agreeing with Bouff about CroCune feeling more optimal than VinCune atm as the staying power RestTalk gives Suicune is incredible against the myriad of physical attackers in the tier that attempt to brute force their way through other bulky Waters. It essentially gives Suicune utilty even in games where the opponent has stuff like Zarude + Xurkitree, Heliolisk, or some lesser good Cune counter. I feel it's not getting love from the majority of players right now because Alpha tiers gravitate toward heavy hitters, but Suicune is still really good and rewards smart, patient players very nicely.


phantom mentioned Teleport Slowking enabling a crazy amount of powerful breakers to easily pick and choose their matchups, and while I'm in full agreement with that, Kyurem is arguably the most dangerous one of these. Great Speed tier, good bulk, an Electric resistance, and basically unresisted coverage. Part of why Registeel is a top defensive Pokemon is that it's one of the very few Pokemon that stops Kyurem from mindlessly clicking Freeze-Dry or Draco any time it comes in. SubRoost sets can punish more balanced teams, but Specs benefits immensely from Slowking, U-turn / Volt Switch, and Spikes support which are all relatively easy to get on a team.


This is such a splashable defensive Pokemon right now. It checks so much of the physical metagame and even if it can't check a physical attacker directly, it can pivot in pretty reliably as there's so little that can OHKO it on the physical side. Should you want it to sponge a few special hits in a similar fashion, you can throw AV on to let it sponge Electric attacks. Even so, Helmet with a support move (Leech in particular as it passively pressures switch-ins that don't necessarily care about Sludge Bomb poisons) is such an amazing pivot right now that can turn defense into (passive) offense.


Scarf Zarude is such a fantastic offensive glue mon. A Speed tier above +1 Haxorus is nice, but add in its STAB options, natural bulk, Psychic immunity, and U-turn, and it's such a fun way to generate momentum or steal momentum away (70% of the time) from Slowking users. Throat Chop is also very fun on it as it can make incoming Sylveon a non-factor when it comes to switching into it. Lacking Knock Off is a bit unfortunate, but it's still great. Can also run BU, Band, and a 4 Atks HDB Pivot set, but I really feel Scarf is an easy offensive fit for many teams due to the utility it provides on offense and defense.


I feel this is really underrated right now. While Nidoqueen might define the role of Offensive SR user, Necrozma is an alternative option that can outpace Nidoqueen and OHKO it. Of course, it can also go Autotomize + Meteor Beam, DD, and maybe even bulkier support sets, but I really feel it shouldn't bother with bulkier sets currently as it's a naturally bulky offensive mon that outpaces Nidoqueen, Toxtricity, and a few others I"m probably missing.


The best Pokemon in the tier. I know that's a bold statement to say and perhaps a statement not everyone will understand with stuff like Zarude, Xurkitree, Raikou, and Polteageist around. However, best doesn't always mean it beats the most things or is threatened by the least amount of things. The way I feel "best" should be viewed as is A. how splashable it is B. Does it contribute game in and game out, regardless of team comp matchup? C. Is it the reason you win a lot of games? D. What is the opportunity cost to using a Pokemon in comparison to its competition? Slowking is incredibly splashable as it requires next to no support to function at a base level, it will perform well against virtually all team comps due to tis ability to pivot into many attackers and slow pivot out to help your attackers pick and choose their matchups, and Slowking will typically be one of the last Pokemon you sac in games because of the positioning it can provide you to regain advantage. And opportunity cost? yeah, there is none. While the likes of Suicune, Starmie, Sharpedo, and Galar Bro/King are good Pokemon in their own right and you wouldn't be frowned upon for using them in the slightest, none of them can provide as many things as Slowking can in a single teamslot. So yeah, Slowking is the best right now in my eyes.

There's tons of other great Pokemon in the tier right now. Galar Weezing, Togekiss, Diancie, Registeel (this mon is never not good in RU lol. Over a half decade of dominance) Nidoqueen, and Lycanroc-Dusk (please use Drill Run on this) are just some of the fantastic Pokemon I'm chosing not to talk about so you're not here an hour and a half reading all my thoughts lol.
 

A floor Mat

The Official Floor Mat of Rarley Used
Just a final thought on this months metagame : )


At the beginning of the month, I am sure we were all shocked by the insane drops and I personally was not looking forward to playing a RU metagame with Conkeldurr, Kyurem, Gengar and a few other beasts. As the month progressed, counter play to these mons were found and a majority of these crazy mons didn't seem to bad for me. There were things I still think were a bit unfair like veil offense and Gengar ( Ha got banned at the very end thanks UU). But all in all, this was a very fun month for RU, bringing back beloved classics like queen and steel and adding some life to the tier! Hopefully next month will be just as good as this one ; )
 
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Aquarius Ghost ❤

Banned deucer.
Hey, RUer's. It's Aqua, back with another post, just before the tier shifts. So today, I'm going to be posting a few teams that got me to peak RU,(Aquarius Ghost) while also averaging one of the highest Glicko X-Act Estimate also known as GXE which is basically determined by your w/l ratio. I ended up getting 89.6 (Aqua Gxe Shop). Anyway, besides the showboating and stuff, let me introduce you to the teams that I used to get me to these achievements.

:sableye::Slowking-Galar::Tangrowth::quagsire::crobat::bronzong:

Usually, I build a stall with a cleric or a wish-passer such as Togedemaru, Sylveon, and Umbreon, but not this time. I found out that Wish-Passers in Alpha meta would be so hard to pull off because of how much offensive pressure there is. I ended up making a bunch of stalls without Wish-Pass such as this one. Now the reasoning behind this is that a wish passer is really not needed when I have 2 Regen mons that can basically cover each other's weaknesses. The same thing applies with cleric support since I have four mons that can't be pressured by toxic or any status I don't find the need to spend a whole slot and open more weaknesses to the stall to just have a wish passer / cleric when it's not needed. Now at first glance, this team seems like it would have a lot of weaknesses such as Nidoqueen, Gengar, Haxorus, but that's false, usually, this team can cover the whole tier with Slowking-Galar being able to wall Nido + Gengar. During Alpha meta, a lot of people are running brainless HO such as Veil, Weather, Screens, etc, which is why I created this team. Ratchet Batman+ Quagmire is composed up of a Quagsire+Crobat+Galar King core. This core is can basically check most offensive teams with a bit of support from Sableye, Tangrowth, and Bronzong. (you get the idea) The main reason why my Tangrowth set has Worry seed over anything else is mainly because of crocuno+ Haxorus. Now basically Worry Seed changes the Pokemon's ability until they switch out. Now when u hit a Haxorus with worry seed its ability is no longer mold-breaker it would be Insomnia, which that means Quagsire is now able to wall it. The same thing happens to crocrune (rest, sleep talk, cm, scald) once u hit them with worry seed it would be changed to Insomnia, and Insomnia's effect means the pokemon can not fall asleep or in other words it cant use rest and that is basically why I have Worry Seed on Tangrowth. During this team's process, I had Registeel>Bronzong, but I soon found out that the team was very weak to Kyruem when I was running a few test battles with Mac3, I soon made the change and started having a lot of success with Bronzong over Registeel. Crobats Ev's are very simple, I Ev'd it to live a Gut boosted Facade from Conk, while additionally living a stone edge from Terrakion, this spread also allows you to live a +2 shadow ball from Poltergeist. Sableye is usually my Conk answer, while annoying tf out of Haxorus, Bewear, Cloyster, Doublade, Terrakion, etc. (You get the point) Finally, we have Quagsire, I truly love this pokemon. Its main use on this team is to haze any setup users while being my unaware user. (pretty basic on what it does)

The second team I have to show is called Scrubby Jaguar + Goofy Water snake!
:Zarude::Registeel::ditto::xatu::Sableye::milotic:
This team is a Semi-Stall its mainly revolved around Zarude+Xatu. Again this team doesn't have a wish passer nor a cleric. The main reason because of this is cuz I have Xatu which can deflect any Hazards+ Status. Before my Registeel's set was Heavy slam, Toxic, tect, Rocks, but then after laddering on the ladder, I noticed that opposing Zarudes was going to be a huge problem so I ended up making Regi's set Iron Defense+ Body Press. It ended up working well at countering Zarude and I also got a few sweeps with it too. I don't need to explain Sableye since it basically does the same thing as it does in the team above ^. Milotic is usually my Spdef wall/haze user, and yes, Darm can be a huge issue if u don't make it Physdef, but now with Gengar gone, I guess u are able to change it to Physdef. Finally, we have ditto, ditto is usually my revenge killer, kinda sucks if ur against a scarf Xurk tho, since it's a 50/50.

Finally, I'm just gonna post some other teams I used during this Alpha meta. Aqua OUT! (Sorry if my writing is bad, I'm an ass writer.)
Togekiss Stall
Ruen fat balance
Ru celebi stall
Durant HO
Luke HO

Edit: forgot to post replays, also the reaction goal for this post is 9!!!!!
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8ru-1233741711
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8ru-1234318175-9nd8n42gvcbp6mnhwgoqdh9avsst6fupw
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen8ru-1230663742-8iaravgkzq2h93ooyco2vfkzgzvx0hipw
 
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Aquarius Ghost ❤

Banned deucer.
Seeing this shift I was extremely disappointed. For example, losing Gking+Tangrowth was a huge blow since they made team building super easy and were by far Ru's best Special and physical walls. While the availability of replacements to both these mons are great, such as Tangela could replace Tangrowth, however, the issue of this is that Tangela has to rely on Eviolite which is very poor since Tangrowth doesn't and could easily pressure opponents with rocky helm. As for Gking, many users would use Av Gbro as a replacement which really isn't bright since Av Gbro is an unviable AV user it mainly needs the physical bulk, instead of the special bulk, also Special attackers still greatly pressure it with its mediocre Special bulk, the only viable replacements is Av Reuniclues, but even that needs cleric support so it can reliably check most of Ru's special attacking threats. Anyway, let's talk about the drops. Ice horse seems like a great addition to Ru, its great bulk+ high attack stat allows it to get multiple chances to set up and become a dangerous threat on tr. Now, with Ru's numerous amounts of TR setters such as Slowking, P2, Uxie, and possibly even Bronzong all pair well with Ice horse. TR would really be able to shine because of this amazing new addition. Next, we have Reidrago, now this mon I have mixed feelings about it since it can threaten unprepared teams, however, it is also too frail. It would be like a 5:6 if you come across a Fairy while ur using Regidrago. Kinda like a High-risk high reward. P wack right? Anyway guys those are my thoughts on these shifts. Aqua OUT!

(reaction goal for the post is 12, ty for everyone who helped me break my last reaction goal) <3
 
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