Rejected Removing the Official Smogon Doubles Tournament

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Preface: This has nothing to do with the quality of the DOU tier itself.

Official tournaments carry with them a certain weight and prestige. For tours that are not worthy of this designation, we award other prizes, such as the ribbons or just the fun of playing itself. I think we can all agree not everything deserves to be official and offer an individual trophy. I think it was fine to attempt the OSDT but evidently it’s not something that should stick around.

Most notably is the fact that the kickoff edition of this tournament had under 256 signups. For reference, a single OLT cycle can have 500. Something like Classic had 660 unique signups, and OST routinely gets 1024. Really, the 256 bracket just doesn’t cut it. Tournaments used to operate under the assumption that only current gen (singles) OU deserves its own tournament and the numbers support this notion.

I feel like this tournament was only created to throw the doubles community a bone after they got removed from SPL. By now it’s clear that this was a decision to benefit doubles, not one to benefit official tournaments. At the end of the day, the prestige and image of the official circuit is the highest priority of the tours community.

Again, I have nothing negative to say about the doubles tier or community. I just think this tournament isn’t good enough to be part of the official circuit.
 
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Z Strats

Banned deucer.
Yeah as a dou main this seems like a pretty obvious move lol. As much as I'd love having another chance at an easy trophy doubles does not deserve its own official tour especially after the low turnout and hype from the first osdt and I was shocked it got one to begin with.
 
I feel like this tournament was only created to throw the doubles community a bone after they got removed from SPL. By now it’s clear that this was a decision to benefit doubles, not one to benefit official tournaments.
Just want to point out that this was quite literally the stated goal of the tournament (emphasis mine):
All that said, I am going with Tony's idea. The details will be worked out and the tournament schedule reworked to accommodate the new tournament. A simple OST idea makes sense to me, but I'm amenable to any other formats that the community might be interested in. The reason we are granting this exception to Doubles in particular is as follows:

1. The desire to sustain the circuit representation Doubles currently receives
2. The large infrastructure and community established by Doubles on this site and a desire to support them
3. The degree of community support expressed in this thread and elsewhere
4. The existing history of the VGC trophy and the role Doubles plays as its spiritual successor
 
Seriously, every time I read the word "prestige" when having a tournament as the matter, I want to ask some moderator to delete my account. Fuck it, let the guys alone playing their shit and just dont play or follow these stuff yourself if you dont find them fun, it applies to all the tournaments and/or existent tiers around (which is, by the way, a mentality that needs to start to be applied asap in the tours scene as whole). I play all the team tours, some CG OU tournaments and healthy Slam seasons simply because I enjoy playing them and find it entertaining winning in these tournaments. However, I despise RBY and GSC, dont wanna touch these gens and would never go for a classic playoffs at this point in life, and still dont think the tour should be nuked: i just dont spend my energy or time on it, same applies to DOU and unnoficials. Im not saying things shouldnt change or that nobody should care about the circuit, but using prestige as an argument is a joke to me when it comes to smogon tournaments, specially considering that OSDT has got money involved.
 
I’ve had a change of heart but would still like to use this platform to discuss the tour scene.

I apologize if my initial post came off as an unwarranted attack on the prized doubles community. You guys are an integral part of smogon history and its tournament scene. On a larger note, we really need to stop any attempts that limit inclusivity. I mean it’s 2021 too, isn’t it kinda backwards to be excluding people based on the tier they play?

And like come on, its a skill-less computer game for kids at the end of the day. Are we really gonna do things like “keep SPL prestigious” instead of making more people happy? Nothing matters at the end of the day. Just enjoy yourself and each other’s company. We are all human - singles, doubles, level 100, level 5.

To stay on topic to some degree - keep this tour alive. Even if it only gets 128 signups. Even if the finals winpost gets 50 likes instead of 80. Those 128 people matter just as much as anyone else.
 
Okay I’m starting to get worried this recent post is being taken seriously. I was just trying a parody of the Kumbaya Mainers. Neither DOU nor LC is worth its own individual obviously. But sure if some people want the orange stain maybe it’s their problem not mine. At least it’s not in SPL.

Boat + other TDs

- Please delete the LC thread in its entirety

- I can accept the infraction for trolling that’s fine

- Do what you see fit here in the end, regardless it should probably be kept open to foster genuine discussion

Breeze
 

Yoda2798

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Real mask off moment here, not even trying to hide the actual reason behind this.

Yes, OSDT didn't reach the level of signups of OU tours because... it's not OU, that should come as no surprise to anyone. Smogon is a heavily OU-centric site, obviously the first rendition of a DOU trophy tour isn't going to break any records. Speaking of which, this is the all-important image you want to preserve, that Smogon is just a site for OU/singles, not the universal go-to place for all things competitive it strives to be. Growing the site means driving other tiers with things like trophies, halting any attempt with "lol it's not OU though" just reinforces the status quo. Including doubles in the scope of official tournaments seems like a pretty clear benefit to me.

"Prestige" at this point is just a dogwhistle for gatekeeping "lower" (in more than one sense) tiers from trophy representation. DOU already got the boot from SPL when it became OUPL, and now apparently it can't do its own thing instead either. It's okay for there to be non-OU trophies, you don't have to play in them or care about them, that's a normal thing as Eternal Spirit has mentioned. There isn't even the pretense of it being due to limited places in this case, just blatant gunning for it because it isn't OU.

It really sums up these types of threads that the person arguing for the sake of Smogon's "image" is an elitist who thinks inclusivity is a joke.
 

Finchinator

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OU Leader
We will be keeping the Official Smogon Doubles Tournament in the official tournament circuit for 2022, maintaining the status quo established here.

We are discussing prospective shifts in the individual official tournament circuit for 2023 and beyond, but this is a topic of the utmost importance that will require a great deal of discussion. For the time being, we will go with the 2022 group of tournaments as planned and leave everything up in the air for future years. This will allow us to make the most informed and practical decision for our tournament community that has a constantly evolving demographic and set of needs.
 
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