Metagame 1v1 Metagame Discussion

So first post in 1v1 and I don't know where to report this. Anyways Aggron needs to be banned. It has access to sturdy and metal burst and most people see aggron as a free kill due to its crippling quad weaknesses to ground and fighting. So they often attack aggron and activate sturdy as aggron fires back with a choice band brave nature metal burst automatically winning the game. This is just as broken as the level 1 aron with berry juice, toxic, endeavor, and sturdy which is an automatic win. Therefore aggron should be banned due to its prominent sturdy metal burst combo. Sure it can be checked with status conditions like burn, but it's still overpowered overwhelming 1v1.
this is probably the place to report it yeah but you could've asked whatever counters it in the 1v1 room or if it's worthy of a ban or not for a quicker response, assuming experienced enough players are online

tapu fini
steela
regidrago
zeraora
dragapult
metagross
most fighting types and sturdy users
volcanion
spectrier
tapu bulu
tapu koko
heatran
registeel
rillaboom
zap g
arcanine
kommo o
rhyperior
azumarill
corviknight
steelix
aegislash
every water/ground type
porygon2
krookodile
salazzle
blastoise
blaziken
jellicent
nidoking
rotom wash
silvally water
toxapex
weavile

these are all excluding the mons you can get cheesed by like pressure stall users

aron just gets countered by wisp, multi hit moves, trick users, etc
 
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Recently 1v1 released new sample teams, That I honestly think are quite good. They do a really good job of avoiding auto lose match ups that tend to plague most teams in this tier. However, no team can cover everything, and these teams are no exception. In this post I'll be going over a Pokemon per team that 3-0's at preview.

vs.
Adamant Choice Band Garchomp has the ability to 3-0 this team by way of brute strength. Zeraora and Landorus cannot OHKO Garchomp with any of their moves and are one shot by Earthquake and Outrage respectively. Against Tapu Fini, Garchomp spams Earthquake and overwhelms Fini. Between the massive damage of the initial EQ since Chomp will attack before Fini gets a chance to Iron Defense + the limited healing from Draining Kiss because it's a contact move that procs Rough Skin leads to Garchomp prevailing in this match up.

vs. and
So Choice Specs Latios has a 100% win rate against this team, if you hit your Dracos, by way of clicking Psychic into Rotom-H, Ice Beam into Landorus-T, and Draco Meteor into Rillaboom. That said Latios is a little low on the VR so it felt a little cheap using for this post. That's where Regidrago comes in, however, it only has an 81% of OHKOing Lando-T which is necessary almost all the time to win this one. Regidrago clicks Draco Meteor vs Rotom-H and Rillaboom, and Dragon Energy against Landorus.

vs.
This set is definitely a bit creative, but it gets the job done. Against Dragapult you click Dragon Pulse twice, one Surf should put you in Custap range, but if they elect to Shadow Ball simply Endure between Dragon Pulses if necessary. Against Tapu Bulu simply Overheat as you're faster and it one shots. against Aggron you Will-O-Wisp turn one so that you break Sturdy while also lowering Aggron's attack so you eat a Head Smash, and then KO the following turn with Overheat. The EVs for this set are by no means a finished product, but you are faster than Bulu and Aggron, while also always eating Surf (and Hydro Pump) from Dragapult. (Oh also looking back a bit you 2hko Dragapult with Flash Cannon, so need for Dragon Pulse, making your set better overall).

vs.
this team was honestly very difficult to break, but SD Life Orb Garchomp manages the task a large majority of the time. Celesteela's strongest move against Garchomp is Flash Cannon which does 86% to garchomp with a pair of max roles, which means Garchomp has time to set up a pair of Sword Dances and KO with Fire Fang. Tapu Koko has no attack that can touch Garchomp and is one shot by Earthquake. The hardest match up for Garchomp to overcome is definitely Crustle, but even then it's not a likely loss. Turn one you Fire Fang, and turn 2 you will either SD or EQ depending on what your opponent did. If they clicked Shell Smash, Counter, or Rock Wrecker you will click Earthquake and safely win. However, if they click Rock Blast turn one things get a little interesting. Fire Fang and Earthquake kills Crustle almost every time, it takes a pair of minimum roles to not KO, so if you fire Fang into Earthquake and don't kill you could die to Counter. At the same time if they Rock Blast and then Shell Smash turn 2 on your SD they can kill you with Rock Wrecker thanks to the previous LO and Rock Blast damage. As mentioned it's a very low chance for this line to take place (you're more likely to miss a Fire Fang or Draco), and on top of that it doesn't feel like a line of play that's natural from Crustle unless they read this post, but it's something that could occur so be wary I guess.

That should wrap this up. The sets used to 3-0 these teams aren't super common, but they were fun to come up with. If you're ever laddering and someone is spamming a given sample feel free to grab one of these sets and try to take some points. Also worth noting that most of the Cteam sets don't have complete move sets, and that's because they aren't needed for the given match up. Feel free to fill those slots in with staples or something team specific.
 
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Recently 1v1 released new sample teams, That I honestly think are quite good. They do a really good job of avoiding auto lose match ups that tend to plague most teams in this tier. However, no team can cover everything, and these teams are no exception. In this post I'll be going over a Pokemon per team that 3-0's at preview.

vs.
Adamant Choice Band Garchomp has the ability to 3-0 this team by way of brute strength. Zeraora and Landorus cannot OHKO Garchomp with any of their moves and are one shot by Earthquake and Outrage respectively. Against Tapu Fini, Garchomp spams Earthquake and overwhelms Fini. Between the massive damage of the initial EQ since Chomp will attack before Fini gets a chance to Iron Defense + the limited healing from Draining Kiss because it's a contact move that procs Rough Skin leads to Garchomp prevailing in this match up.

vs. and
So Choice Specs Latios has a 100% win rate against this team, if you hit your Dracos, by way of clicking Psychic into Rotom-H, Ice Beam into Landorus-T, and Draco Meteor into Rillaboom. That said Latios is a little low on the VR so it felt a little cheap using for this post. That's where Regidrago comes in, however, it only has an 81% of OHKOing Lando-T which is necessary almost all the time to win this one. Regidrago clicks Draco Meteor vs Rotom-H and Rillaboom, and Dragon Energy against Landorus.

vs.
This set is definitely a bit creative, but it gets the job done. Against Dragapult you click Dragon Pulse twice, one Surf should put you in Custap range, but if they elect to Shadow Ball simply Endure between Dragon Pulses if necessary. Against Tapu Bulu simply Overheat as you're faster and it one shots. against Aggron you Will-O-Wisp turn one so that you break Sturdy while also lowering Aggron's attack so you eat a Head Smash, and then KO the following turn with Overheat. The EVs for this set are by no means a finished product, but you are faster than Bulu and Aggron, while also always eating Surf (and Hydro Pump) from Dragapult.

vs.
this team was honestly very difficult to break, but SD Life Orb Garchomp manages the task a large majority of the time. Celesteela's strongest move against Garchomp is Flash Cannon which does 86% to garchomp with a pair of max roles, which means Garchomp has time to set up a pair of Sword Dances and KO with Fire Fang. Tapu Koko has no attack that can touch Garchomp and is one shot by Earthquake. The hardest match up for Garchomp to overcome is definitely Crustle, but even then it's not a likely loss. Turn one you Fire Fang, and turn 2 you will either SD or EQ depending on what your opponent did. If they clicked Shell Smash, Counter, or Rock Wrecker you will click Earthquake and safely win. However, if they click Rock Blast turn one things get a little interesting. Fire Fang and Earthquake kills Crustle almost every time, it takes a pair of minimum roles to not KO, so if you fire Fang into Earthquake and don't kill you could die to Counter. At the same time if they Rock Blast and then Shell Smash turn 2 on your SD they can kill you with Rock Wrecker thanks to the previous LO and Rock Blast damage. As mentioned it's a very low chance for this line to take place (you're more likely to miss a Fire Fang or Draco), and on top of that it doesn't feel like a line of play that's natural from Crustle unless they read this post, but it's something that could occur so be wary I guess.

That should wrap this up. The sets used to 3-0 these teams aren't super common, but they were fun to come up with. If you're ever laddering and someone is spamming a given sample feel free to grab one of these sets and try to take some points. Also worth noting that most of the Cteam sets don't have complete move sets, and that's because they aren't needed for the given match up. Feel free to fill those slots in with staples or something team specific.
ngl its 3am, so its a bit of tl:dr but its gross sweep ; so its factually correct
 
gm goats of 1v1.today I talk about the togekiss (future hopefuly)ban.there is no VIABLE mon that beats all togekiss sets even if u include random mons like sivally elec the count is close to 0 and by beats I mean mons that have 100% winrate v togekiss (all sets) now back I go to research I will edit the guaranteed counters
metagross-kee,babiri 252def bold,zeraoara(scarf)waccan,zeraora(life orb)-HAX,azumarill(band jet)kee magnezone (custap)waccan fire blast air slash t1 protect for custap endure
SUCCESSFULY Finished paragraph 1 will edit in 2 later next A togekiss check that 100% beats it all these mons aren't that bad even if not good but toge haxes
but lemme try all these mons are slow with few exeptions
metagross (scarf)[you trick praying its babiri/kee only to get destroyed by specs/scarf fire blast]zeraora(life orb)[1 you get cocky and pfists t1 and waccan counter or HAX]heatran (random)scarf HAX OR AURA sphere 2hko custap loses to protect if max hp tran air slash flinch into aura sphere 2hko if its scarf tran scarf hax
custup steela with risk of losing babiri fire blast protect
america heck ye charti 252 bold toge rips this team apart
guys if u see inbetween leftout information sry I might've took a break anyways lemme search for 100% counters
regieleki special cause physical wild charge loses to waccan wait so does special set is 252 hp 252+spatk waccan gota test.u might say max hp max spatk but scarf wins bec HAX and max speed max hp eleki is bad and has 0.001% (guess)and the 1 person saw this post (guess)
MAYBE av registeel can PARAGAPH 2 OVER PROGRESS?
AV REGISTEEL HAS A CHANCE but even if every air slash flinches it should win
hype's over boys it loses to babiri counter
let me guess b4 calc maranga toge 15 flinches lemme guess 1 air slash=2damge +flinch 2x15=30 so its at 70 fire blast does 25 flash canon does 40 without marranga and 25 with marranga wow toge ez win it wins without hax bec roost
marranga toge .......WINS but wierd set roost+morning sun to make them struggle THIS WIN COUNTS
toge is busted all I can do is sit and watch wait PRIORITY
e speed arcanine beats scarf but loses to kee azu jet same as arcanine no notable users from now
scarf zapdos
I THink ThIs IS THE ONLY VIABLE TOGe counter and hey [insert guarantee toge counter and item here]isn't that bad request to ban toge and if you don't ban toge why did u ban jirachi
 
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You should probably take opportunity cost into consideration before making a bold post like that. Togekiss cannot counter these unreasonable things without sacrificing a lot of evs, a moveslot or two and an item slot that is usually better off being maranga or another standard item. Something like zeraora can beat landorus therian with the right set. You also assume people aren't going to do simple things such as knock off as zeraora vs toge. You can't just give togekiss the benefit of the doubt vs things such as zera because of flinch hax when there is a 10% chance for it to happen on top of toge being able to miss. Your fundamental reasoning is terrible and if you want something banned, you should try to form a post with arguments for and against, rather than just making a show of your lacking 1v1 knowledge.
 
While Togekiss is a top 5 mon I don’t think it’s banworthy. I think the list of mons that beat it is much longer than you make it out to be. Just because Togekiss has <5% odds of beating some of its counters by flinching them I don’t think it’s inherently uncompetitive, those MUs are crit odds in a trenchcoat. You can look at the MUs where toge only needs one flinch but honestly I see those as a builder fault if your toge check is reliant on a weighted coinflip. If you’re having difficulty with Togekiss I advise consulting this list:

Hard Counters
:Tapu koko: :heatran: :zapdos::registeel: :regieleki: :choice scarf::darmanitan galar: :tyranitar: (also some notable niche mons like :rotom heat: :raikou: :nihilego:)

Beat All but One Set
:zeraora: :metagross: :magnezone: :aggron: :steelix: :rhyperior: :chansey:

Beat non-scarf, coinflip scarf
:tapu lele: :landorus: :naganadel: :kyurem:

Coinflip Any Set
:crustle: :avalugg:

Set Dependent
:Cresselia: :Entei: :spectrier: :tapu bulu: :dracovish:

Reliant on Guessing
:corviknight: :whimsicott:

Togekiss does end up needing some setguessing if you're not running a hard counter but that's kinda SS's whole shtick. The majority of viable mons in SS are incredibly diverse in what they can run. You also have to note that extreme cteam sets like Endeavor Wacan and Charti are sets that simply will never be consistent in tournament play and on the ladder when you do run into them you can just switch your team.

Also, quick aside on the state of SS 1v1, I think it's okay. It is a bit annoying how much is viable in the gen without anything centralizing but neither problem is really fixable. You can't just mass-ban everything remotely good because then we're playing B-tier royale. Don't free anything, everything on the banlist deserves to be there, I think necro being resuspected mid-pl was completely unfair to it but w/e what's done is done I would not suspect it this late into the gen. I think this tier isn't played a ton because it can be agonizing to build consistent teams, you're forced into top tier spam or constant setguessing if you want a truly consistent team in this tier. This LT was def my last time playing the gen and I honestly don't see much of a future for this tier as an old gen. I would 100% cut SS2 in the first SV tt to keep MG, I'm sure I'm not alone as a CG player jumping ship to SV assuming it's half-decent. This version of the gen is the best we've had yet for sure, I do find making quirky sets and playing quite fun even if teambuilding itself is pretty cbt.
 
While Togekiss is a top 5 mon I don’t think it’s banworthy. I think the list of mons that beat it is much longer than you make it out to be. Just because Togekiss has <5% odds of beating some of its counters by flinching them I don’t think it’s inherently uncompetitive, those MUs are crit odds in a trenchcoat. You can look at the MUs where toge only needs one flinch but honestly I see those as a builder fault if your toge check is reliant on a weighted coinflip. If you’re having difficulty with Togekiss I advise consulting this list:

Hard Counters
:Tapu koko: :heatran: :zapdos::registeel: :regieleki: :choice scarf::darmanitan galar: :tyranitar: (also some notable niche mons like :rotom heat: :raikou: :nihilego:)

Beat All but One Set
:zeraora: :metagross: :magnezone: :aggron: :steelix: :rhyperior: :chansey:

Beat non-scarf, coinflip scarf
:tapu lele: :landorus: :naganadel: :kyurem:

Coinflip Any Set
:crustle: :avalugg:

Set Dependent
:Cresselia: :Entei: :spectrier: :tapu bulu: :dracovish:

Reliant on Guessing
:corviknight: :whimsicott:

Togekiss does end up needing some setguessing if you're not running a hard counter but that's kinda SS's whole shtick. The majority of viable mons in SS are incredibly diverse in what they can run. You also have to note that extreme cteam sets like Endeavor Wacan and Charti are sets that simply will never be consistent in tournament play and on the ladder when you do run into them you can just switch your team.

Also, quick aside on the state of SS 1v1, I think it's okay. It is a bit annoying how much is viable in the gen without anything centralizing but neither problem is really fixable. You can't just mass-ban everything remotely good because then we're playing B-tier royale. Don't free anything, everything on the banlist deserves to be there, I think necro being resuspected mid-pl was completely unfair to it but w/e what's done is done I would not suspect it this late into the gen. I think this tier isn't played a ton because it can be agonizing to build consistent teams, you're forced into top tier spam or constant setguessing if you want a truly consistent team in this tier. This LT was def my last time playing the gen and I honestly don't see much of a future for this tier as an old gen. I would 100% cut SS2 in the first SV tt to keep MG, I'm sure I'm not alone as a CG player jumping ship to SV assuming it's half-decent. This version of the gen is the best we've had yet for sure, I do find making quirky sets and playing quite fun even if teambuilding itself is pretty cbt.
Togekiss can theoretically make every mu at least a 5050. With kee, maranga, and scarf covering a massive number of mus, and resist berries covering everything else, there aren't any mons left that hard counter togekiss. Most of the mons on that list are generally good enough at countering togekiss, but they can still be techd with certain unsets. Even excluding these wacky resist berry techs, there are only a handful of mons that hard counter. idk how heatran is on that list btw it loses to standard maranga.

What you and others have said about SS 1v1 and set variety sums it up pretty well. Since there are so many strong mons in this meta, and they all have at least 5 different sets that get different mus, it becomes very difficult to build teams that don't rely on set guessing, or just get 3-0d by some underused set on an A rank mon. However, I think this is just how a developed 1v1 metagame works, and it is generally counteracted by set guessing. Of course this assumes that your oppo is competent, and doesn't get hard countered by A rank mons. Nonetheless, many mons have been banned in large part due to preview pressure. Togekiss should be no exception. Unlike the other mons in the tier, Togekiss can literally beat anything. Once world cup starts I think you will see how op togekiss is. If not, next pl. Mark my words, Togekiss will be banned from SS 1v1.
 
Togekiss can theoretically make every mu at least a 5050. With kee, maranga, and scarf covering a massive number of mus, and resist berries covering everything else, there aren't any mons left that hard counter togekiss. Most of the mons on that list are generally good enough at countering togekiss, but they can still be techd with certain unsets. Even excluding these wacky resist berry techs, there are only a handful of mons that hard counter. idk how heatran is on that list btw it loses to standard maranga.
It bears repeating.
You also have to note that extreme cteam sets like Endeavor Wacan and Charti are sets that simply will never be consistent in tournament play and on the ladder when you do run into them you can just switch your team.
Also, tran beats toge by clicking steel beam. You should be running specs in this meta as it beats drago, steel beam is ran for arom consistency regardless of toge. Taunt sets can also run beam but those sets are outclassed rn anw.

The resist berry being able to beat anything argument doesn’t hold water to me either.

First off, resist berries are generally unreliable. Babiri and Wacan can lose to Zera/Gross if they either play around the lure (Knock as Zera and Trick as Gross) or aren’t invested enough to do >50% which is a common issue. Resist berries are also unable to consistently cover multiple lure targets which makes their opportunity cost even more astronomical.

Secondly, lures are not an exclusive trait to Togekiss. You can look at WP Fini sometimes beating Zera or Volcanion or Specs letting it beat Venu. Bulu can cheese fires with SubSeed. Helmet PZ can beat sturdies and it can shred fightings with Chople. Toge does this with arguably much less proficiency outside of its Kee set but that’s besides the point. Toge is just a SS mon in a long list of threats in the tier that can run a plethora of sets.

I think on paper Togekiss has the potential to be broken but in practice it’s just not. It’s held back by the unreliability of its lures and massive opportunity cost in a tier where it’s already hard to cover a ton.
 
It bears repeating.

Also, tran beats toge by clicking steel beam. You should be running specs in this meta as it beats drago, steel beam is ran for arom consistency regardless of toge. Taunt sets can also run beam but those sets are outclassed rn anw.

The resist berry being able to beat anything argument doesn’t hold water to me either.

First off, resist berries are generally unreliable. Babiri and Wacan can lose to Zera/Gross if they either play around the lure (Knock as Zera and Trick as Gross) or aren’t invested enough to do >50% which is a common issue. Resist berries are also unable to consistently cover multiple lure targets which makes their opportunity cost even more astronomical.

Secondly, lures are not an exclusive trait to Togekiss. You can look at WP Fini sometimes beating Zera or Volcanion or Specs letting it beat Venu. Bulu can cheese fires with SubSeed. Helmet PZ can beat sturdies and it can shred fightings with Chople. Toge does this with arguably much less proficiency outside of its Kee set but that’s besides the point. Toge is just a SS mon in a long list of threats in the tier that can run a plethora of sets.

I think on paper Togekiss has the potential to be broken but in practice it’s just not. It’s held back by the unreliability of its lures and massive opportunity cost in a tier where it’s already hard to cover a ton.
Specs heatran loses to band drago, and drops mus like venusaur and scarf metagross that are otherwise winning with scarf or air balloon.

Scarf steel beam tran loses to aura sphere. Specs tran loses to light screen maranga (not a standard set i'll admit). You can just facetank zera, with max def, its a 25% roll for band pfists to ko, making it a 5050 between counter and charm. Band metagross loses to babiri while other sets lose to kee. Zapdos can lose so some wacan light screen mfire bs (actually a decent counter to togekiss :O). Registeel is set dependent with counter beating av and encore/trick beating stall. The list goes on and on, and you'll notice that many of them don't include resist berries.

However, you do bring up a valid point about the opportunity cost of these sets. Most of them drop an unreasonably large amount of mus to lure only a few mons. And yes most of the other high ranking mons can also lure stuff that they really shouldn't be able to. PZ is next on the banlist tbh. Opportunity cost hasn't stopped us from banning stuff in the past. If we continue with the current precedent of banning mons that exert large amounts of preview pressure, then we should ban togekiss as well. It lacks real hard counters unlike the other mons in S/A rank. When nearly all the "hard counters" are electric types, then the mon is op.
 
for the sake of argument didn't we ban jirachi for having good stats, a good move pool that can cover most of it's weakness, and lot of sets that can 50/50 "hard counters"? Obviously togekiss isn't as good as jirachi, but it can literally run all the sets jirachi ran except the physical ones. It has the stall amnesia/charm, you can run stored power even if it's a shout, scarf, specs, resist berry sets, t wave encore etc while also having serene grace too.

Darm G (non adamant) is interesting because you have only 25% to kill a 252 252+ Toge counter set which can run a different resist berry, Tyranitar doesn't even come close to killing so I would put that in set dependent instead of hard counter.

Bo brought up a good a point that heatran could get cheesed down too which leaves 4 meta hard counters with 3 being electrics.

Lele can just lose to a t-wave set, same with kyurem if the kyurem isn't scarfed you can just roost and heal yourself back up so I would put them in set dependent instead of just scarf.


im not going explain myself but if there's a set that Toge has to win I just put a W and L for a hard loss in the current viability rankings
S- Rank
:Zeraora: W

A+ Rank
:celesteela: W
:metagross: W
:porygon-z: W
:regidrago: W
:tapu fini: W

A Rank
:Aromatisse: W
:Darmanitan-Galar: W
:Dragapult: W
:Primarina: W
:Sylveon: W
:tapu koko: L
:urshifu: W
:urshifu: W
:volcanion: W

A- Rank
:cresselia: W
:entei: W
:ferrothorn: W
:garchomp: W
:Haxorus: W
:landorus-therian: W
:spectrier: W
:tapu bulu: W
:tapu lele: W
:volcarona: W
:zapdos-galar: W

B+ Rank
:Arcanine: W
:azumarill: W
:Crustle: W
:Dracovish: W
:goodra: W
:heatran: W
:Kyurem: W
:landorus: W
:magnezone: W
:moltres-galar: W
:naganadel: W
:registeel: L
:rillaboom: W
:tyranitar: W
:venusaur: W
:zapdos: L

B Rank
:aggron: W
:Avalugg: W
:chansey: W
:Corviknight: W
:Dracozolt: W
:glastrier: W
:kartana: W
:Kommo-o: W
:nihilego: L
:pheromosa: W
:regieleki: L
:Rhyperior: W
:steelix: W
:Whimsicott: W
:zarude: W

B- Rank
:Clefable: W
:Corsola-Galar: W
:Gardevoir: W
:Hydreigon: W
:ninetales: W
:Rotom-Heat: L
:Sawk: W
:suicune: W
:swampert: W

C+ Rank
:Aegislash: W
:diancie: W
:gastrodon: W
:ninetales-alola: W
:Porygon2: W
:Pyukumuku: W
:raikou: L
:roserade: W
:Rotom-Wash: L
:type-null: W

C Rank
:archeops: L
:Blissey: W
:buzzwole: W
:Carracosta: W
:Darmanitan: W
:incineroar: IW
:jellicent: W
:nidoking: W
:regice: W
:salazzle: W
:slowking-galar: W
:thundurus-therian: L

You'll need some luck to beat some of the mons (mostly poisons) with that juicy scarf set and you're going to have to read your opponents set while also sacrificing your coverage so togekiss isn't a autowin but it is damn prevalent. I think the difference between zeraora and Toge is that there's a lot more thinking with zera on how to play certain mus while Toge can click an unexpected counter or click airslash and win the game somehow. At the very least you move Toge to S.
 
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toge haxxer is me if dont know it already but yes teams I used? basicaly 5 cores?team 1 lorb zap,custap thug,toge scarfed, team2 custap prim,custap thugg,scarf toge,team3 urshifu dark chople counter,scarf toge custap lugg,team4 custap zone,custap lugg, choice scarf toge[worst of the teams],team5 custap venu,custap thugg,custapscarf toge .ya see im realy liking custap bery BAN TOGE
 
I'm bored. I'll write out a post on my thoughts about the meta, including the mon everyone's been talking about:

:togekiss:
On paper, this shit is demonic. Set versatility, powerful movepool, great typing, insane ability; you've heard it all before. I want to put a new spin on it though-Togekiss isn't necessarily more restricting than the rest of the meta. As of now, swsh has reached a bit of a stagnant state. Considerably higher average set-versatility than I've ever seen in other 1v1 generations means that building in ss becomes a game of counters, not of sets. Offensive threats like Dragapult, Zeraora, and Porygon-Z can run whatever they please to nuke their checks, but Defensive Pokemon like Tapu Koko, Tapu Bulu, and Aromatisse all basically need to stick to the same sets they usually run to beat their checks. When you use Koko as a Zera answer, or Bulu as a Shifu/Steelix answer, or Aroma as a blanket stall check, you have extremely little room for variation. Dropping Gleam on Koko for CM loses to taunt Zera, no Disable Bulu drops Lix, and Aroma without helmet can't get enough struggle chip to KO stuff. So while half the meta is stuck checking the tier's biggest offensive threats, those same threats are often able to run any combination of items, moves, or EVs to try and break all but the most solid sets of their counters. And Togekiss, unfortunately, doesn't have the same luxury.

Togekiss is a defensive Pokemon in SS 1v1. I understand that Scarf is run, and even Specs too with some measure of viability, but the Pokemon's value comes primarily through defensive utility. Now, why is that? The reason behind this is because Togekiss doesn't beat its counters with offensive sets. In my opinion, the most viable Togekiss counters/checks are Zeraora, Celesteela, Metagross, Darm, Koko, Ferro, Crustle, and Zone. With the exception of non-custap Ferro, none of these pokemon can lose to scarfed Togekiss more than they otherwise would. Togekiss can definitely cheese many of these mons, but all of those sets are due to defensive utility with moves like Counter, Thunder Wave, Encore, etc. Offensive sets don't really help Togekiss beat offensive Pokemon it wouldn't already beat, they mainly just provide a way to secure matchups on defensive pokemon like Chansey, Registeel, or Corviknight.

So what does this all mean? Well, securing matchups on defensive Pokemon is less valuable than beating the Pokemon that counter you offensively. This is because it's easy to beat something like Chansey with your team, most people do it without even thinking about it. Togekiss' need to check so many Pokemon means that teching for its counters is a high opportunity cost, which only works with offensive Pokemon. This is a different way of thinking about opportunity cost, because most people see it from an offensive standpoint. For example, when Dragapult runs CB instead of Specs, you pick up matchups on stuff like Goodra, Chansey, and AV Gross. You lose to mons like Bulu, Heatran, and PhysDef Steela. It's easy to quantify; you essentially gain a matchup to lose another, and the small numerical difference between the number of mons you beat with one set vs another is just the opportunity cost. Contrast this with Togekiss. Togekiss acts as a blanket check to a host of attackers, but teching on Counter + Resist berry loses you some 50% or more of your matchups. This is not opportunity cost. This is butchering a mon with huge defensive utility for a single matchup.

To wrap things up, Togekiss is so good because it does so much. That's the metric of a good defensive Pokemon; how many Pokemon it counters. This means that "opportunity cost" should not be a term lightly thrown around when advocating for a Togekiss ban, because unlike any offensive mon, the "opportunity cost" turns it from an S-ranked mon to essentially a shitmon. Look at the sets comp, are you seriously gonna run Togekiss without Roost or Air Slash? More often than not this could only work as a bait, as demonstrated by some WC teams I made below that consist of one mon to beat Togekiss, and then 2 more that can easily take it down if it techs for the counter. Anyway, apologies for rambling. Enjoy the post and the teams, and I'd love to hear any/all opinions on this.

Of varying quality, but all demonstrate a 1-2 Maranga Toge mu that turns into a 2-1 or even Toge mu when Toge attempts to tech for the team's counter
https://pokepast.es/f44cc9c9897a5c5c
https://pokepast.es/c156c56436379720
https://pokepast.es/5c967a176ed11686
https://pokepast.es/89c3125401ec5e58
https://pokepast.es/c2554155db82cf3a
https://pokepast.es/ef8e9b692558d793
https://pokepast.es/30fc3a196ffafe5e
 
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k Long time since I talked about toge but yes vr list that toge beats and waylaid you have a good point there defensive toge is the most used or beats more of its counters
S- Rank {W for toge wins L for toge lose}

:Zeraora: Zeraora dependent

A+ Rank
:celesteela: Celesteela W {some sets of toge lose so 50/50/set dependent}
:metagross: Metagross W[defensive toge wins]
:porygon-z: Porygon-Z W
:regidrago: RegidragoW
:tapu fini: Tapu Fini W

A Rank
:Aromatisse: Aromatisse W
:cresselia: Cresselia W
:Darmanitan-Galar: Darmanitan-Galar L
:Dragapult: Dragapult W
:landorus-therian: Landorus-T W
:Primarina: Primarina W
:Sylveon: Sylveon W
:tapu koko: Tapu Koko 50/50 [hax or scarf predicting eerie and tricking,if tapu tbolts maranga mystical fire is 50/50]
:urshifu: Urshifu-R W
:urshifu: Urshifu-S W
:volcanion: Volcanion W

A- Rank
:Crustle: Crustle W
:entei: Entei W
:ferrothorn: FerrothornW
:garchomp: Garchomp W
:spectrier: SpectrierW
:tapu bulu: Tapu BuluW
:tapu lele: Tapu LeleW
:volcarona: VolcaronaW

B+ Rank
:Arcanine: ArcanineW
:azumarill: AzumarillW
:Dracovish: DracovisW
:Haxorus: HaxorusW
:heatran: Heatran 50/50 {toge haxes or maranga stalls flash cannon pp/steel beem bruh babiri aura sphere}
:Kyurem: Kyurem W [hax or maranga ]
:landorus: LandorusW
:magnezone: Magnezone L [toge can win with unusual sets but I cant take them in count]
:moltres-galar: Moltres-GW
:naganadel: NaganadelW
:registeel: RegisteelW
:Rhyperior: Rhyperior L
:rillaboom: RillaboomW
:tyranitar: TyranitarW
:venusaur: VenusaurW
:zapdos: Zapdos50/50
:zapdos-galar: Zapdos-GW
:zarude: ZarudeW
 
k Long time since I talked about toge but yes vr list that toge beats and waylaid you have a good point there defensive toge is the most used or beats more of its counters
S- Rank {W for toge wins L for toge lose}

:Zeraora: Zeraora dependent

A+ Rank
:celesteela: Celesteela W {some sets of toge lose so 50/50/set dependent}
:metagross: Metagross W[defensive toge wins]
:porygon-z: Porygon-Z W
:regidrago: RegidragoW
:tapu fini: Tapu Fini W

A Rank
:Aromatisse: Aromatisse W
:cresselia: Cresselia W
:Darmanitan-Galar: Darmanitan-Galar L
:Dragapult: Dragapult W
:landorus-therian: Landorus-T W
:Primarina: Primarina W
:Sylveon: Sylveon W
:tapu koko: Tapu Koko 50/50 [hax or scarf predicting eerie and tricking,if tapu tbolts maranga mystical fire is 50/50]
:urshifu: Urshifu-R W
:urshifu: Urshifu-S W
:volcanion: Volcanion W

A- Rank
:Crustle: Crustle W
:entei: Entei W
:ferrothorn: FerrothornW
:garchomp: Garchomp W
:spectrier: SpectrierW
:tapu bulu: Tapu BuluW
:tapu lele: Tapu LeleW
:volcarona: VolcaronaW

B+ Rank
:Arcanine: ArcanineW
:azumarill: AzumarillW
:Dracovish: DracovisW
:Haxorus: HaxorusW
:heatran: Heatran 50/50 {toge haxes or maranga stalls flash cannon pp/steel beem bruh babiri aura sphere}
:Kyurem: Kyurem W [hax or maranga ]
:landorus: LandorusW
:magnezone: Magnezone L [toge can win with unusual sets but I cant take them in count]
:moltres-galar: Moltres-GW
:naganadel: NaganadelW
:registeel: RegisteelW
:Rhyperior: Rhyperior L
:rillaboom: RillaboomW
:tyranitar: TyranitarW
:venusaur: VenusaurW
:zapdos: Zapdos50/50
:zapdos-galar: Zapdos-GW
:zarude: ZarudeW
Seems nobody else is making a post so I'll make a quick reply about the matchups that seem dubious to me(someone who hasn't played ss in a while) while I eat lunch.

Zeraora and Koko seem pretty cut and dry, any capable zeraora player should beat a togekiss barring very specific matchups like band zeraora vs wacan counter togekiss. Any smart Koko player would thunderbolt t1 vs togekiss to scout for scarf trick before clicking eerie impulse t2 if they have it.

Metagross can click trick scarf on defensive togekiss, celesteela I believe beats defensive togekiss when leech seed can't be encored any more, and if someone setguesses togekiss as scarf correctly they can heavy slam t1 and win. I also believe(I haven't run the calcs or anything) that togekiss has no way to beat specs celesteela.

A lot of a+ a and a- has a W where it's really a more complex matchup, aromatisse primarina sylveon and porygon-z to name a few definitely don't outright lose to togekiss.

I think too much faith is put into togekiss' ability to "hax" win a matchup, if you kill something with 2 scarf air slashes and need a flinch to win you have a 54.15% chance to win(factoring in air slash miss chance) which is nothing more than a coinflip with a bit of wind. Waylaid's post also explains a lot better how togekiss can't run different sets to check different threats (rhymes) without sacrificing many more important matchups. Togekiss is definitely good but nowhere near as good as this post and some people may make it seem. Adam out.
 
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So I learned a lil bit about the 1v1 meta, and decided to make the team I'll share with you today.
:corsola-galar: :eviolite:
Corsola-Galar @ Eviolite
Ability: Cursed Body
EVs: 252 HP / 152 Def / 104 SpD
Calm Nature
- Amnesia
- Strength Sap
- Night Shade
- Rest

Just your standard annoying Galarian Corsola. With Cursed Body, 2 immunities and immense bulk via eviolite, Galarian Corsola has a role of taking on choices locked pokemon like no one else. Amnesia + Strength Sap in conjunction with Rest makes it incredibly bulky and hard to take down. However, it does have minimal damage output - having to rely on status, Night Shade or the rare Curse to deal meaningful damage. But imo, being able to completely neutralize almost all choice locked pokemon is amazing.

:zeraora: :assault vest:
Zeraora @ Assault Vest
Ability: Volt Absorb
EVs: 16 HP / 184 Atk / 56 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Plasma Fists
- Knock Off
- Outrage
- Close Combat

The one major thing about Galarian Corsola is that it hates losing its Eviolite, or being crippled by Taunt. Enter Assault Vest Zeraora. It doesn't really care about losing its item or Taunt since it only has damaging moves, and with the right ev spread can be fast, bulky and powerful all at the same time. Max speed Jolly Zeraora holding Assault Vest might seem weird - especially with most of the leftover ev's going into its Attack stat. However, this Zeraora is MEANT to be fast and offensive. Assault Vest allows it to stand up to even specs attacks from the likes of Blacephalon's Mind Blown or Dragapult's Specs Draco Meteor. The moves are matchup specific and can be customized to the users liking. Plasma Fist is powerful spammable STAB, Knock Off cripples item reliant threats such as opposing Eviolite Galarian Corsola, Outrage for Dragapult and other Dragon-types and Close Combat as strong, reliable coverage. While not as particularly common as Choice Band variants, Assault Vest Zeraora is a reliable mon in a 1v1 format.

:darmanitan-galar: :choice scarf:
Darmanitan-Galar @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Gorilla Tactics
EVs: 160 Atk / 112 Def / 236 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Icicle Crash
- Superpower
- Flare Blitz
- Earthquake

My team was losing a lot to common Ground-type pokemon in Swords Dance Garchomp and Nidoking. Dubbed Anti-Garchomp Scarf Darmanitan-Galar, this Galarian Darmanitan aims to delete any and all Garchomp as well as other Ground-types. It actually is able to tank hits and retaliate with a ton of power due to its built-in Choice Band. Its a standard set of Superpower, Icicle Crash, Flare Blitz and Earthquake. If you played 1v1 before, there's a high chance you know this set as far as moves are concerned.

But uh yeah. That's my 1v1 team. I will update it to better suit the meta and will take any feedback you may have. Let me know your guys' success with the team if you used it, and with that being said, goodbye.
https://pokepast.es/e334cb0aa3a912c9 < (team in detail)
 
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So I learned a lil bit about the 1v1 meta, and decided to make the team I'll share with you today.
:corsola-galar: :eviolite:
Corsola-Galar @ Eviolite
Ability: Cursed Body
EVs: 252 HP / 152 Def / 104 SpD
Calm Nature
- Amnesia
- Strength Sap
- Night Shade
- Rest

Just your standard annoying Galarian Corsola. With Cursed Body, 2 immunities and immense bulk via eviolite, Galarian Corsola has a role of taking on choices locked pokemon like no one else. Amnesia + Strength Sap in conjunction with Rest makes it incredibly bulky and hard to take down. However, it does have minimal damage output - having to rely on status, Night Shade or the rare Curse to deal meaningful damage. But imo, being able to completely neutralize almost all choice locked pokemon is amazing.

:zeraora: :assault vest:
Zeraora @ Assault Vest
Ability: Volt Absorb
EVs: 16 HP / 184 Atk / 56 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Plasma Fists
- Knock Off
- Outrage
- Close Combat

The one major thing about Galarian Corsola is that it hates losing its Eviolite, or being crippled by Taunt. Enter Assault Vest Zeraora. It doesn't really care about losing its item or Taunt since it only has damaging moves, and with the right ev spread can be fast, bulky and powerful all at the same time. Max speed Jolly Zeraora holding Assault Vest might seem weird - especially with most of the leftover ev's going into its Attack stat. However, this Zeraora is MEANT to be fast and offensive. Assault Vest allows it to stand up to even specs attacks from the likes of Blacephalon's Mind Blown or Dragapult's Specs Draco Meteor. The moves are matchup specific and can be customized to the users liking. Plasma Fist is powerful spammable STAB, Knock Off cripples item reliant threats such as opposing Eviolite Galarian Corsola, Outrage for Dragapult and other Dragon-types and Close Combat as strong, reliable coverage. While not as particularly common as Choice Band variants, Assault Vest Zeraora is a reliable mon in a 1v1 format.

:darmanitan-galar: :choice scarf:
Darmanitan-Galar @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Gorilla Tactics
EVs: 160 Atk / 112 Def / 236 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Icicle Crash
- Superpower
- Flare Blitz
- Earthquake

My team was losing a lot to common Ground-type pokemon in Swords Dance Garchomp and Nidoking. Dubbed Anti-Garchomp Scarf Darmanitan-Galar, this Galarian Darmanitan aims to delete any and all Garchomp as well as other Ground-types. It actually is able to tank hits and retaliate with a ton of power due to its built-in Choice Band. Its a standard set of Superpower, Icicle Crash, Flare Blitz and Earthquake. If you played 1v1 before, there's a high chance you know this set as far as moves are concerned.

But uh yeah. That's my 1v1 team. I will update it to better suit the meta and will take any feedback you may have. Let me know your guys' success with the team if you used it, and with that being said, goodbye.
https://pokepast.es/e334cb0aa3a912c9 < (team in detail)
good morning fellow 1v1er

while this is a very good team for ladder, there are a few issues i would like to bring up

also if you ever need any advice with other teams then feel free to join the 1v1 cord, it is a very friendly and helpful environment (hopefully) and you are more likely to get a way quicker response
https://discord.gg/M4n9ByCz

:metagross:
you lose to this mon's bulky scarf set pretty easily
184 Atk Zeraora Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 248 HP / 96+ Def Metagross: 122-144 (33.6 - 39.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
28 Atk Metagross Earthquake vs. 16 HP / 0 Def Zeraora: 242-286 (75.3 - 89%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
160+ Atk Gorilla Tactics Darmanitan-Galar Flare Blitz vs. 248 HP / 96+ Def Metagross: 286-338 (78.7 - 93.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
and gcorsola gets tricked on

:regidrago:
custap drago should beat all these mons reliably, even if say av zera beats that set you still struggle vs it cause of other sets

:aromatisse:
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/battle-gen81v1-1624753611-j1gl7ef3rm6yc2bfli4bbxv0m205u9fpw
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/battle-gen81v1-1624755391-t0wzcjkirk8lqkiuwq5o1dpcxey97vfpw
gdarm mu should be obvious, you lose to defensive rocky helm

:urshifu:
chople shifu wins p easily

:crustle:
184 Atk Zeraora Plasma Fists vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Crustle: 115-136 (40.9 - 48.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO rock blast/counter into wrecker

:rhyperior:
any SD set just wins
160+ Atk Gorilla Tactics Darmanitan-Galar Icicle Crash vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Rhyperior: 362-428 (83.4 - 98.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

the mons that i mentioned above shouldnt be much of a problem since they are not v common on ladder except like maybe crustle and shifu
if youre just starting out on this tier then this is a very good team to begin with, you have alot of potential and good luck on the journey of this tier

s/o stravench for helping with a few m/u's

[14:05] stravench: i wonder what the evs on zera are for
[14:05] HEY!man?2(69)4: kek
[14:06] stravench: i understand speed
[14:06] stravench: is that for pult or something
[14:06] HEY!man?2(69)4: Mind Blown or Dragapult's Specs Draco Meteor
[14:06] HEY!man?2(69)4: ye
[14:06] stravench: IM A GENIUS
[14:06] HEY!man?2(69)4: goddamn
 
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good morning fellow 1v1er

while this is a very good team for ladder, there are a few issues i would like to bring up

also if you ever need any advice with other teams then feel free to join the 1v1 cord, it is a very friendly and helpful environment (hopefully) and you are more likely to get a way quicker response
https://discord.gg/M4n9ByCz

:metagross:
you lose to this mon's bulky scarf set pretty easily
184 Atk Zeraora Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 248 HP / 96+ Def Metagross: 122-144 (33.6 - 39.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
28 Atk Metagross Earthquake vs. 16 HP / 0 Def Zeraora: 242-286 (75.3 - 89%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
160+ Atk Gorilla Tactics Darmanitan-Galar Flare Blitz vs. 248 HP / 96+ Def Metagross: 286-338 (78.7 - 93.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
and gcorsola gets tricked on

:regidrago:
custap drago should beat all these mons reliably, even if say av zera beats that set you still struggle vs it cause of other sets

:aromatisse:
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/battle-gen81v1-1624753611-j1gl7ef3rm6yc2bfli4bbxv0m205u9fpw
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/battle-gen81v1-1624755391-t0wzcjkirk8lqkiuwq5o1dpcxey97vfpw
gdarm mu should be obvious, you lose to defensive rocky helm

:urshifu:
chople shifu wins p easily

:crustle:
184 Atk Zeraora Plasma Fists vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Crustle: 115-136 (40.9 - 48.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO rock blast/counter into wrecker

:rhyperior:
any SD set just wins
160+ Atk Gorilla Tactics Darmanitan-Galar Icicle Crash vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Rhyperior: 362-428 (83.4 - 98.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

the mons that i mentioned above shouldnt be much of a problem since they are not v common on ladder except like maybe crustle and shifu
if youre just starting out on this tier then this is a very good team to begin with, you have alot of potential and good luck on the journey of this tier

s/o stravench for helping with a few m/u's

[14:05] stravench: i wonder what the evs on zera are for
[14:05] HEY!man?2(69)4: kek
[14:06] stravench: i understand speed
[14:06] stravench: is that for pult or something
[14:06] HEY!man?2(69)4: Mind Blown or Dragapult's Specs Draco Meteor
[14:06] HEY!man?2(69)4: ye
[14:06] stravench: IM A GENIUS
[14:06] HEY!man?2(69)4: goddamn
I appreciate the advise, but there are afew things I will say in advance. a) I can't have discord (sadge. I pray for better future). b) there's a few more mons I struggles with - not great.
:avalugg:
My team absolutely HATES avalugg. I recently discovered Fake Out + Aura Sphere - while extremely niche - allows Zeraora to break past Avalugg and Aggron (another mon on this list). Though it might need Life Orb support to secure a KO.
:aggron:
I already mentioned it, but Aggron is another dangerous thing to my team. Without Fake Out + Close Combat/Aura Sphere, Zeraora doesn't REGULARLY break past it. Galarian Corsola does good against Choice Band, but bad vs Taunt variants. And Galarian Darmanitan just straight up loses the 1v1. While more Sturdy users in Crustle and Sawk exist, they aren't big fans of Galarian Corsola and its bulky Strength Sap antics (though I still lose to most Crustle variants).
:garchomp:
The entire reason I have my last pick in Galarian Darmanitan is that it handles Garchomp. Swords Dance in particular is the worst case scenario for my team since Corsola gets setup on and Zeraora gets OHKOed. Not really much else to say - its too powerful.
:urshifu:
Chople Urshifu is an absolute nightmare. Wicked Blow is a nuke against Corsola - which relies on its bulk and stall antics along side Cursed Body to answer things. Galarian Darmanitan doesn't OHKO with gorilla tactics Superpower and in return folds to Close Combat. Pretty sure Zeraora and its non-existent bulk also comes into play here.

With that being said, I'm keeping Corsola and Zeraora along with there items and subbing out Darmanitan. I will post my team once I found something that reliably answers Ground-types, and the aforementioned ones above.
 
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I appreciate the advise, but there are afew things I will say in advance. a) I can't have discord (sadge. I pray for better future). b) there's a few more mons I struggles with - not great.
:avalugg:
My team absolutely HATES avalugg. I recently discovered Fake Out + Aura Sphere - while extremely niche - allows Zeraora to break past Avalugg and Aggron (another mon on this list). Though it might need Life Orb support to secure a KO.
:aggron:
I already mentioned it, but Aggron is another dangerous thing to my team. Without Fake Out + Close Combat/Aura Sphere, Zeraora doesn't REGULARLY break past it. Galarian Corsola does good against Choice Band, but bad vs Taunt variants. And Galarian Darmanitan just straight up loses the 1v1. While more Sturdy users in Crustle and Sawk exist, they aren't big fans of Galarian Corsola and its bulky Strength Sap antics (though I still lose to most Crustle variants).
:garchomp:
The entire reason I have my last pick in Galarian Darmanitan is that it handles Garchomp. Swords Dance in particular is the worst case scenario for my team since Corsola gets setup on and Zeraora gets OHKOed. Not really much else to say - its too powerful.
:urshifu:
Chople Urshifu is an absolute nightmare. Wicked Blow is a nuke against Corsola - which relies on its bulk and stall antics along side Cursed Body to answer things. Galarian Darmanitan doesn't OHKO with gorilla tactics Superpower and in return folds to Close Combat. Pretty sure Zeraora and its non-existent bulk also comes into play here.

With that being said, I'm keeping Corsola and Zeraora along with there items and subbing out Darmanitan. I will post my team once I found something that reliably answers Ground-types, and the aforementioned ones above.
try celesteela, there are plenty of leech seed sets that can break sturdy from avalugg and aggron while out-healing chomp damage and you can 2HKO urshifu with air slash
 
Hello again. So I was being a total dickwad and decided to cheese the 1v1 low ladder on my other account. And I discovered something quite interesting
:sm/sawk:
Sawk @ Berry Juice
Ability: Sturdy
Level: 1
IVs: 0 Spe
- Knock Off
- Pain Split
- Toxic
- Protect

Low ladder cheese. Aron, Magnemite, Togedemaru and the like also have this going for them. Pretty simple set of Pain Split, Toxic, Protect and Knock Off. Knock Off removes items and is an all around great tool (also helps vs other cheese), Protect as a way to get around a potential Fake Out or just a general scouting tool, Toxic and Pain Split have synergy as Pain Split in conjunction with Sturdy Juice is even more longevity and Toxic wears down the opposition. Nothing else to say here. Try it and see for yourself a glimpse of the ways of gimmicky victories
 
Dropping a top 10 favorites list as the gen is coming to an end. As always, I encourage others to do the same and remember these are my favourites, not what I think is best.

1. :crustle:
Crustle was an under-the-radar threat until it started to see consistent usage mid pl. I'd like to think I was trailblazing the usage as I used a sometimes detrimental amount of it. My favourite set is band, which may sound meh on paper, but is amazing in practice, beating fairies, zera, cress etc in one mon is amazing. Shell smash beats some annoying things, but every time I run shell smash I wish I was band.

2. :zeraora:
Zeraora is the poster child of ss 1v1 right now, it is extremely versatile and has the exact mus an electric type should, unlike some others. I have been enjoying band, av, as well as other niche sets. This mon has just the right amount of attack and bulk to be a menace.

3. :zarude:
Zarude is incredibly underrated, being able to tech most things without a lot of opportunity cost. My favourite set is band however I also love scarf and wp. I just think zarude being a dark type that beats every fairy bar a couple is an extremely useful trait.

4. :slowbro:
Slowbro is a more recent favourite for me. The set I run is wacan which beats zeraora which allows it to be built around easily. What sets slowbro apart from other stall mons is its immunity to taunt, as well as great opposing stall mu. Dog on top.

5. :darmanitan-galar:
Darmg is a trooper. Has stayed great thoughout the whole gen. I like scarf most but use band occasionally and defensive scarf is great to fill holes a team has. It is very fun to build around, trying to create hard 50/50s for opponents and overall just beats a nice amount.

6 :spectrier:
Spectrier is a certified shoota and beats so much. Wisp hex is extremely useful to have for a team, beating both special and physical attackers. Disable is good but seems like more of a lure set. Specs is fucking stupid in the best way possible. Very good mon and farms mid rank mons.

7. :azumarill:
How can you not like this guy? It has gained traction as a fairy type to the point of being one of the best currently. My favourite set is stall closely followed by av and band. Stall is good, being a fairy type that beats most physical attackers, and destroys common counterplay in grass types. Av is absurdly bulky and has nice vr mus. Cool mon.

8. :metagross:
Metagross is one of the easiest steel types to use right now. My favourite sets are av and wp, followed by trick scarf and balloon. Steel mon with steel mus that can tech its counters. What's not to love?

9: :urshifu-rapid-strike:
I prefer urshifu rs to ss for a few reasons. One is beating darm without having to go out of its way, another is surging strikes is devestating vs sub mons. There is a lot of room to tech with both formes, with some of my favourites being wp, liechi subversal, id press, scarf and just classic lo/band.

10: :tapu-fini:
Tapu fini is if nice matchups were a mon. It has great vr matchups, great sets and is easily spammable. My favourite set is specs trick as trick in terrain catches many mons off guard, locking them into a status move. Id is also great, and scarf even though falling off slightly is still solid. Overall a fun mon to build around and play with.

HMS:
:zapdos:-Offensive zapdos is really something with its insane coverage. Maranga is also very nice.
:rillaboom:-Seems to be getting better as people are letting their guard for it down. LO is crazy and subseed is cool af.
:landorus-therian:-Great mon, beats zera, and has a lot of unexplored room for techs. My fav set i've made is custap superpower.
:magnezone:-Easy to build with, beats like all fairies. Good mon.

Mons I don't like much
:cresselia:-ugly and annoying in builder
:porygon-z:-I suck at building around this, probs my fault.
:aromatisse:-Cool af mon however is not great currently, mostly due to the fact that there are a handful of fairies with more, more consistent mus.


gl in classic all, and champs if you make it.
 
Sure

1. :landorus-therian:
I use this mon too much. It's honestly really, really good at whatever the fuck you want it to do. It really isn't close to my personal favorites but by builder and in-game usage it's probably in the top 3 and I think it will always make a team better by having it.

You can run Lum. You can run Band. You can run special with a physical coverage move like Knock Off. You can run Assault Vest. You can run Band with Sludge Wave because why the fuck not. Being a part of innovating Landorus has been quite fun, and I hope to see it in SV so it can be explored even more. I seriously recommend giving this mon a try if you haven't yet, the matchups it can get are ridiculous due to its movepool, bulk, and ungodly Attack stat.

2. :chansey:
Broken incarnate. Just use it for more than 10 battles and you'll understand. Charm/Counter/Soft/Stoss solves the metagame minus a handful of sets and mons you can't really beat. Always feels good to click because you know you're going to have very good odds to win vs a lot of teams.
As a bonus, you can 3-0 the obnoxious fraun sample with good gameplay.

3. :naganadel:
My opinion on Naganadel has always been constantly shifting, but I think now I can safely say I've decided that it's a good mon. What's most piqued my interest about it is how reliable Life Orb is. Versus other dragons, the most amount of setguessing you have to do is whether they are scarf or not, and you shouldn't really lose to fairies. My personal preferred set is Draco/Sludge Wave/Flamethrower/Protect for the most consistency.
I think Naga is in an okay spot right now, it doesn't appreciate both of the top mons being an okay answer to it but it's not at the mercy of the cores built around those mons, and not every team is going to have band Zera and scarf Toge anyway.

4. :regidrago:
Fell off but obviously still good lol. Don't use LO DD. This guy still beats 60% of steel types and Avalugg for no discernible reason with minimal commitment. AV is solid for cheesing stuff and reliability vs, ironically, other AV users. Haban beats every single dragon type bar Haxorus which not a single person uses anyway. Custap is that good cheese and I love it because the opponent always has to respect the possibility even if it's not evident on preview. Band is the rarest usable set I think but it's still absolutely insane it forces something as ridiculously bulky as Celesteela to EV for it instead of the other way around.
I dunno. Regidrago rewards genuinely skillful play between setguessing and choosing the right move vs stuff like CounterCoat Swampert.

5. :togekiss:
The ORIGINAL lottery machine. Casinos were so inspired by watching Togekiss gameplay that they decided to create slot machines to mimic its Air Slash RNG fishing.
Anyway, Togekiss isn't solely carried by flinch odds, otherwise it would be pretty bad tbh. Obviously there's more to it, and it's the fact that it can run every viable item under the sun and EV for whatever the hell it wants. True Togekiss counters really are few and far between, and I've gone on about this in my VR nomination post. With such a silly ability, solid typing, very good bulk and crazy flexibility, I think Togekiss still has more to it than has been currently developed, and while I'm not particularly excited to fight new Togekiss sets, I am excited for this thing to eventually become suspect worthy.
Oh, and I love using this mon because it can either fill holes or be part of a core. Flinching several times in a row is pretty fun too. Not too deep.

6 :urshifu:
Well-defined matchups is such a rarity in this tier, and I think Urshifu having an obvious matchup spread works in its favor; it loses to fairies, and beats most else. My favorite set to use is probably bulky Chople, since it tanks a lot of attacks and then hits back with Wicked Blow, or just bulks up in your face and refuses to die.
Wicked Blow is just such a fun move.

7. :primarina:
It really is as simple as having broken typing + Hydro Cannon to complement broken typing. Beats a lot in theory with Encore and Calm Mind and Moonblast. I think Sitrus is the best set because it catches everyone off guard and turns 2hkos into 3hkos, which matters a lot since you can CM > Blast > Cannon.

8. :magnezone:
I know this mon is bad, and cheesable as fuck, and really really lackluster, but Specs can actually beat things, and it's kinda reliable vs a fair amount of threats. Yeah that's really it though it's just on this list because of Choice Specs.

9: :spectrier:
Everything is 3-0d by Spectrier. This is below Zone because of Wisp accuracy, but otherwise this mon feels incredibly good to use because it defeats everything upon Wisp landing.
Weird to build with though.

10: :tyranitar:
Does not die barring Fighting coverage, super bulky, super strong, Sand giving it an effective AV (such that AV gives it an effective TWO AVs) is a little ridiculous LOL. A dark type that genuinely beats fairies most of the time is hilarious and I do not use this mon that much at all, but it's fun to use because of both its comedy value and reliability when not clicking a rock move.

no honorable mentions
 
My personal top 10 favorites

1. :volcanion:
I used to love spamming this mon when I first started SS, it's still one of my favorites. Being able to beat most fairies and steels in 1 mon is so nice and it has decent versatility between defensive wisp sets, scarf, and even custap.

2. :landorus-therian:
Very big comfort mon for me, av can cover so much and the band set is also very good. It has surprising versatility with both its moves and sets. I like surprising bulus with sludge wave and custap superpower for darm is sick. I feel like this mon was slept on for a long time and it's really nice to see it being used more.

3. :primarina:
I've always liked this more than fini, I dunno why. Encore is such a broken move and is even better when you add in Calm Mind. I've been liking both sitrus and specs more, but custap is always good. Prim always beats what I want it to and just feels like a very honest mon to me.

4. :moltres-galar:
I don't see this mon a lot, especially since the Necrozma ban, which is a shame. Custap is able to beat a lot of the meta provided you hit your hurricanes, but weakness policy can surprise a lot of would be answers. I've recently been using a sitrus berry set with Taunt that beats celesteela pretty reliably, as well as some stall I'm sure. It feels like a very hit or miss mon but I find it very fun so I'm including it here.

5. :tapu-bulu:
Pretty big comfort mon for me, beating the water fairies, zera, drago, and the shifus in one mon is pretty cracked and makes building easier. Taunt + Disable is so good for stall and stuff like choice Haxorus and the sub seed set seems really good too. I've always prefered this to rillaboom because of its fairy typing and disable, but both are solid.

6. :regidrago:
Very fun to use mon that's very straightforward. It can beat nearly every non fairy/steel and can beat some steels with the right set. I feel like it's fell off over time but it can still be very pressuring. Mostly adding this here for pre necrozma ban as I havent used it very much since unfortunately.

7. :spectrier:
I used to love this mon, it's very unique. It's unfortunate it relies on will o wisp, but its still a very good mon either way. Taunt and Disable are extremely nice. It has odds versus an impressive amount of the meta and feels very rewarding to use, granted you hit your willo wisps lol. I agree with zo that it's very weird to build with.

8. :zeraora:
broken speed tier and so many good sets. I personally like AV a lot, but life orb and wp seem really dope. The idea of losing to custap prim turns me off of using band but definently good as well. If you're not using a ground or grass this mon can be very awkward to beat reliably and I've had my fair share of issues building against it. It's very simple to use and it beats what you want it to beat most of the time, just a very healthy mon in the meta imo.

9. :tapu-koko:
I used to be hesitant about this mon cause it was crit bait, but there's a lot of cool offensive sets it can use now. I really like physical charge but cm also seems like a cool idea. This thing has such a good speed tier and its typing is a blessing in this tier. I feel like it doesn't always beat what you expect it to, but it's very fun to use either way and one of my favorites.

10. :steelix:
I didnt know this existed till like 6 months ago ngl but it covers many of my hitlists and I find myself using it as a third/second a lot. ID Press is always good and defeats most of the physical mons, but I've been liking choice band a lot. It has more move options then you would think. Ice Fang is really nice for Lando-I and for most garchomp and flash cannon is good for avalugg. I used to think Aggron was just better but being reliable against zera, magnezone, and koko is so nice for Steelix. I just wish it was more powerful at times.
 
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