Weather induced by abilities is indeed permanent in Gens 3-5.
The matchup makes me think you were playing in round 3, before smart AI kicks in full-force. As such, the trainer's move selection is a bit random at this point in time.Anyone here knows how AI behaves in regards to using explosion in doubles? I've been playing Factory doubles on open level and I had a team of Infernape3/Muk3/Salamence3 vs Exploud2/Weezing3/Floatzel3. I double targeted Exploud with Focus Blast Gunk Shot just in case Infernape missed and ignored Weezing. So yeah got the KO on Exploud, then Weezing proceeds to kill everything with Explosion, leaving Floatzel with an easy job vs Salamence.
So why does Weezing go for Explosion there? Bad matchup, just chooses it because it gets the double KO, does the AI know what I have in the back and forces the easy 1v1 scenario, or is it just a random low chance? In singles it felt like they only ever picked Explosion when on low health.
EDIT: I guess it could have been Exploud 3 since both have Facade but Exploud 3 also has Earthquake, so it should have used that since both my Pokemon are weak to it and Weezing is immune and not go straight to Explosion?
Yeah, it was on round 3. But I thought doubles had smart AI from the get-go? I mean they definitely do some random things, but in general they target intelligently with super effective moves. Does the AI get better from round 5 on?The matchup makes me think you were playing in round 3, before smart AI kicks in full-force. As such, the trainer's move selection is a bit random at this point in time.
This happened to me, too, and also in the Arcade. Some Picnicker in an early set.As a bonus, here's a trainer that for some reason used a SHINY against me!!!
I didn't know that was possible in Gen 4! Funnily enough I also have my own Red Gyarados which I'm going to use next...
While some hall Pokémon have unwinnable matchups, this doesn't really affect a mon's viability at getting Gold, since you can just choose to fight the types at low levels and win by virtue of outlevelling your opponent. The most likely reason there's no leaderboard streaks with Lati@s is that everyone who wants to get gold with a Dragon used Garchomp instead - while it is slightly slower and weaker, it also has a MUCH more useful secondary typing and doesn't have to rely on the 90% accurate Draco Meteor if it wants massive damage.Hi all, longtime lurker on this thread and casual Battle Hall enthusiast. I'm currently considering trying to get to 170 with a mon which hasn't been done yet, so I was looking over the Hall records and noticed a couple missing that surprised me. How come no one's recorded gold with either of the Lati twins or Lucario yet? Do either of them have unwinnable matchups I'm not thinking of?
Good to know, thanks. I saw a couple of average fella 's runs and found the Wormadam one both impressive and hilarious. I didn't realize the Discord server was where these were being discussed. I'll check it out. Since my all-time favorite, Nidoking, has been done already, I'm considering my favorite starter, Blaziken, who, despite being inferior Infernape in many ways, I think has the movepool to make an interesting run.While some hall Pokémon have unwinnable matchups, this doesn't really affect a mon's viability at getting Gold, since you can just choose to fight the types at low levels and win by virtue of outlevelling your opponent. The most likely reason there's no leaderboard streaks with Lati@s is that everyone who wants to get gold with a Dragon used Garchomp instead - while it is slightly slower and weaker, it also has a MUCH more useful secondary typing and doesn't have to rely on the 90% accurate Draco Meteor if it wants massive damage.
As for Lucario, it's probably just been overlooked because Infernape pretty much does its job better.
There's nothing wrong with any of those three mons, and you could absolutely get 170 with any of them if you wanted.
average fella is doing a challenge on the discord server where he tries to take every single hall-eligible species in the game as far as he can, in order of ascending BST. Compared to some of the stuff he thinks can get 170 (Marill), or has actually got 170 with (Wormadam), Lati@s and Lucario are leagues better.
Oh cool, I didn't see your "road to 10000" post until now, which I see has a couple more streaks. Yeah that Weavile set is cruel and I've lost to it multiple times with several different mons. I'll ask any more questions I have in the Discord. Thanks!Just_Peaches it just so happens that I have gotten a 170+ win streak with Lucario. I used 2 sets: one was a female Naive set with Close Combat/Psychic/HP Rock/ExtremeSpeed (stats: 281/291/175/307/157/292), the other was a male Hasty set with Close Combat/Crunch/HP Ice/Counter (stats: 280/311/157/279/176/302), both level 100 with Focus Sash. These sets were my attempt to cover everything as best as possible during the post-170 phase, so I probably wouldn't call them a super-optimal set-up in pre-170. But Lucario can certainly reach 170, and it's actually a pretty fun Pokemon to toy with due to its excellent move pool. It has great STAB options (Close Combat, Aura Sphere), lots of coverage, 3 priority moves, and interesting gimmicks like Counter, so you can get quite creative if you're willing to breed lots of different sets.
It has issues in post-170 because it runs into a bad case of 4-move-slot syndrome - it can cover almost anything it wants but it can't really do everything it needs to across just two sets (I'd say Ground is an especially tricky type for it to deal with since the pool of threats in Ground is quite versatile and it's difficult for a frail Ground-weak Pokemon like Lucario to cover all of then reliably without hindering itself elsewhere). But I think if stuff like Medicham and Gallade can be brute forced to 200 then I see no reason why Lucario can't be with a bit of effort and luck.
To add to what HeadsILoseTailsYouWin has said re: Lati@s, I think convenience also played a part in why it hasn't really been tried much. They are one-off legendary Pokemon so that inherently limits access to different sets for many people, and while some people might have been willing to go the hard yards for it if it seems amazing on paper, it doesn't seem like it would be an improvement over more readily available options like Garchomp if you're trying to go the distance, so why bother? But yes, they are inherently powerful enough that I would expect them to be able to get 170. In terms of threats, these 3 come to mind:
H454 | Weavile | Adamant | Focus Sash | Night Slash | Ice Punch | Ice Shard | Quick Attack | Atk/Spd
H389 | Scyther | Jolly | Focus Sash | X-Scissor | Aerial Ace | Swords Dance | Quick Attack | Atk/Spd*
H411 | Scizor | Brave | Focus Sash | Swords Dance | X-Scissor | Counter | Bullet Punch | HP/Atk*
*Scyther can't OHKO out-right with unboosted X-Scissor so it might use Swords Dance instead, and Scizor can sometimes go for Counter, so there's a chance that they won't attack and allow a win
Lati@s (and many other Psychics for that matter) get check-mated hard by these guys because of their Focus Sashes and priority moves. One way I thought of that might be able to beat them with some consistency would be Trick + Choice Specs to steal the Sash and lock them out of their priority. Lati@s would have to be able to OHKO them after if they choose to attack instead of boost/Counter though, and in the post-170 phase your only option to cover them all would probably be Draco Meteor with HP Fire for Scizor. With that in mind, I guess one post-170 set for Latios in particular would be Specs Timid with Draco Meteor/HP Fire/Trick/filler (needs to be Timid to out-speed maxed rank 10 Weavile), and then the other set is probably a Focus Sash 4 attacks set or something, but would probably have to go over the full pool of Hall mons to see if this would be viable (EDIT: Specs Draco Meteor would lose to Tyranitar in Dark, so you'd have issues already with this set-up). Unfortunately this strategy would be less helpful for Latias since Timid Draco Meteor can't OHKO Weavile so you'd have no choice but to run HP Fighting, in which case you're less safe against Scizor (but again, maybe it'll Counter instead), and Scyther is also only OHKOed by Latias' Draco Meteor with a high roll.
Sorry now I'm rambling lol, but yeah feel free to join the Discord if you want to chat all things Hall!
if (Flamethrower is GUARANTEED to kill) Flamethrower; else if (you did NOT Protect last turn) Protect; else if (you have an active Substitute) if (you need to stall more AND don't have enough HP to Sub) Rest; else Flamethrower; else if (you have enough HP to Sub) Substitute; else Rest;
That post was about 18 months ago, but now I finally did it! I'll post my full report within the next day or so; it may end up around 8000 words, and the video will show every battle....my Pokemon goal for this year is to finally get the Gold Print in the Platinum Battle Factory. I gave up on that back in 2009, and I still think it might be the hardest in-game challenge in any main-series Pokemon game.
I actually went against that common wisdom that I learned from researching old Smogon posts about Factory strats; I only committed to 14 trades as a bare minimum, and only went for 21 trades if it wouldn't ruin a good current team and/or give me a bad matchup, especially when approaching Thorton at 21. It seemed to work well, as I won 5 out of 6 Thorton silver battles across all my attempts.There's one helpful exploit that you guys thought me and I'm very thankful for that: I kept swapping and swapping on the first 4 rounds which gives you the option to get some mons from later sets.