5th Gen OU Analysis Index - 89 BW2 Revamps On Site!

[Gamester]

Why don't people read, Oglemi even made a simple post stating the answer.

I read that and yet in the original post it's showing that b&w2 analysis's have already been reserved. It shows Bluemon's Amoonguss reservation for example. Perhaps you should pay more attention to detail, despite how my wording made it seem I was asking if I could not stating I would.

Also @Furai I'm aware it would be alot but I already have some rough drafts and it wouldn't take more than a hour or two to get the threads up whenever we're allowed to start doing so. From that point I'm certain I'd be able to check back on feedback and comments often enough that I'd get them done in near the same amount of time 3 individuals would have done so. I've already tested them all individually since PS updated and now on PO. Of course there's always room for more testing but I'm confident I could handle it if I'm allowed to do so.

 

[AccidentalGreed]

GUYS. NO ANALYSES until the eighth. We've established that to avoid "new toy" mentality, and wait for the metagame to solidify a bit. With all these new threats being announced at random (I'm sure I'll wake up next morning seeing people reporting new hallows), I'm pretty sure testing at this point would be some sort of hard effort. QC has also gone over each forme individually, so calm your horses. Just wait. Period.

http://www.smogon.com/forums/announcement.php?f=148&a=266

 

[bugmaniacbob]

As a note, I've been trying to re-jig the index to make it better overall and also to allow it to cope more easily with the influx of new updates once they are allowed - the result, at least for the time being, is in the OP. I'll see if it looks any better with sprites or something tomorrow.

If anyone has any ideas, I'm all ears. As a note, the list of Pokemon in the OP is just a list of those Pokemon that currently have an OU analysis and are on-site. Naturally the QC team will perhaps want to, ah, re-evaluate / retroactively reject / other pertinent action some of the more dubious threads, which will doubtless slim it down a little.

 

[Husky]

Interesting, that Farfetch'd is in the list of BW2 Updates, but Honchkrow's missing out there ;3 That's proof that Sticks are for Pros xD

 

[JellyOs]

If reservations are now open, I'd like to take Landorus-T and Keldeo

 

[shrang]

I'd appreciate if everyone just held off reservations for little bit longer, we'll get QC and stuff together and discuss how we're going to do this. Hopefully everything should be fine in a few hours.

EDIT: Alright, since I haven't got confirmation about things that I wanted to do before you all started reserving, you can feel free to reserve analyses, provided you don't do too many at a time. I don't want to see anyone reserving more than 2 at a time, any more would slow the system down. I'll hopefully get the "OU to-do list" up soon, and when that goes up, I would hope people follow it if possible.

 

[ginganinja]

O.k Reservations for BW 2 are now open. Feel Free to reserve stuff and all that jazz. Having said that QC would like the following to be noted.

-We would prefer that you reserve no more that 2 analysis at a time. We are aware that some of you can write up stuff really fast and thats cool, however in the interest of getting this shit done, we would rather not have people take more than they can handle, as it slows the system down. So please, don't reserve an ass load of pokemon as chances are its just going to slow things down.

- We would prefer that people don't bandwagon new sets. If your post actually has solid information on a set or logs or or calcs or solid opinion or whatever, thats perfectly fine, but "this set so awesum I use it to sweep people all da time it should get a set"" is just a waste of a post and annoying to read.

Note that these guidelines might be removed / changed if the higher C&C moderation staff feel that they are too restrictive or something but ideally they what QC would like to aim for during this time.

Go Nuts

EDIT

Fuk SHRANG

 

[Chillarmy]

Reserving Landorus-T

 

[jc104]

I've formulated a (not exhaustive) list of pokemon with OU analyses that are likely to need relatively minor set changes as a result of new tutor moves/dw stuff

Hide

Durant (Superpower) , Choice Jellicent (trick), Terrakion (SR), Victini (Trick), Stoutland (Superpower), Conkeldurr (elemental punches), Galvantula (Giga Drain), Chandelure (Trick), Haxorus (Low Kick, Superpower, Aqua Tail), Golurk (elemental punches, SR), Hydreigon (Roost, Superpower), Cobalion (SR), Venusaur (Chloro + Giga Drain), Toxicroak (Ice Punch + Drain Punch), Dragonite (Superpower + Multi Scale), Ninetales (Drought + Pain Split), Mamoswine (Thick Fat + everything), Salamence (Moxie + Outrage + DD), Infernape (Iron Fist + Elemental Punches, SR), Gliscor (Poison Heal + Roost/SR), Gallade (Justified + elemental punches, Drain Punch and other things), Tornadus (Superpower, Heat Wave??), Volcarona (roost), Landorus (Gravity), Lucario (Justified + Ice Punch), Slowbro (Trick + Regen,)

The majority of these probably do not require a full update, so here is the question: should they pass through the C&C process again as a result of BW2, or should someone merely edit the on-site analyses on the SCMS? I'm willing to help either way.


I'd also like to reserve Ditto. Should be fun!

edit: I take it the inital tierings on showdown are now official, right? If they aren't, we really shouldn't be doing this...

edit2: Thanks ginganinja. I really hope shrang posts that list, since as far as I can tell it would do nothing but help.

 

[ginganinja]

I think that in general, a lot of this stuff is going to be case by case basis. Hydreigon for example, is going to have a decent amount of its sets reworked (Kyurem is also in the same boat) or have new threats to be added (like Tech Loom for Terrakion) so in some of those cases its more than just slashing on a move here, and a move there. Mamoswine is prolly one of the pokemon on your list that could have its abilities just swapped, however it needs an analysis re-write since its pretty darn good against the formes of Thundurus / Landorus / Tornadus.

Tbh, I personally would rather just re-test everything, its a new metagame, and although it means more work for everything, ideally I would prefer that most of the OU tier to at least get an updated analysis (ideally priority given to stuff like Breloom that actually got something new) just because its a new metagame, new threats, a shift to rain being slightly more popular than it was previously etc etc.

Shrang has a list which QC contributed too and discussed together, which had most of the changes and things we want to look at, as well as the general priority of the pokemon in question, which he might post at some stage, but as it stands, I personally would prefer that most things on your list receive a full update.

Yes Showdowns tiers are "official" for the purposes of the new formes etc etc

 

[shrang]

Okay, here's the list of things QC and I came up with. Try to do the higher priority Pokemon first:

Hide

Updates index:

TOP PRIORITY - QC WILL ADDRESS THESE POKEMON IN DETAIL
All new forms/DW ability/released Pokemon need analyses ASAP!
- Ditto
- Keldeo
- Landorus-T
- Meloetta - July 14th
- Sandslash
- Thundurus-T
- Tornadus-T


HIGH PRIORITY - SEE BELOW FOR DETAILS
- Amoonguss
- Breloom
- Celebi
- Conkeldurr
- Deoxys-D
- Dragonite
- Espeon
- Gastrodon
- Gliscor
- Haxorus
- Heatran
- Hydreigon
- Jellicent
- Jirachi
- Jolteon
- Kyurem
- Landorus
- Latias - I'm taking care of this
- Latios
- Metagross - Berserker Lord is taking care of this
- Mew
- Ninetales
- Politoed
- Roserade
- Salamence
- Starmie
- Tentacruel
- Terrakion
- Toxicroak
- Tornadus
- Tyranitar
- Vaporeon
- Venusaur
- Volcarona
- Zapdos

FULL UPDATES NEEDED BUT NOT HIGH PRIORITY - SEE BELOW FOR DETAILS
- Bisharp
- Elektross
- Empoleon - Harsha's taking care of it
- Feraligatr
- Golurk
- Kingdra
- Shiftry
- Slowking
- Stoutland
- Victini
- Weavile
- Xatu

POKEMON THAT COULD POTENTIALLY NEED OU ANALYSES BUT DOESN'T REALLY MATTER IF THEY ARE WRITTEN OR NOT:
- Lapras
- Mantine? lol
- Moltres

OTHERS
- Abomasnow - Retest CB, maybe merge with physical attacker
- Aerodactyl - Look into EQ on Hone Claws set
- Accelgor - Retest Life Orb
- Archeops - Merge Acrobatics and physical sweeper
- Azelf - Slash U-turn onto Nasty Plot and turn it into "Special Attacker"
- Blissey - EVs
- Bouffoulant - Retest for viability
- Carracosta - Retest Curse and CB
- Chandelure - Retest CM
- Charizard - Retest for viability
- Cresselia - Make Ice Beam main slash for 3rd move on standard, mention Sunny Day in there, retest SubCM
- Dugtrio - Rename "Reversal" to "Trapper", remove Fighting Gem, Dugtrio is not getting to 1HP without Focus Sash.
- Durant - Retest for viability
- Dusclops - Retest RestTalk
- Dusknoir - Retest for viability
- Ferrothorn - Retest Choice Band
- Galvantula - Merge LO and Specs and call it "Special Attacker"
- Gyarados - Retest RestTalk
- Heracross - Retest "Non-Choice" and "Bulk Up", test SD
- Hippowdon - Retest LO Tank
- Jynx - Get an EV spread that abuses Dry Skin more (AKA Take a leaf out of the Ubers analysis)
- Krookodile - Retest Bulk Up
- Lucario - Retest Choice sets, give Justified a bigger mention or a slash on physical sets
- Ludicolo - Move SubSeed to first set, retest SD
- Magneton - Rewrite SubCharge with Salac Berry
- Magnezone - REMOVE CHOICE SCARF. WHY ARE WE USING THIS WHEN MAGNETON EXISTS?!
- Mamoswine - Slash Stealth Rock on Physical Attacker set, then rename "Stealth Rock" as "Suicide lead" or "Endeavor"
- Mienshao - Retest Choice
- Milotic - Retest RestTalk
- Nidoking - Retest Mixed Hone Claws
- Ninjask - Retest for viability
- Nidoqueen - Stealth Rock + Sheer Force
- Parasect - Retest for ParaSUCK's viability
- Reuniclus - Retest TrickOrb
- Rotom-C - Merge "Special Scout" with "Choice Specs" and call it "Special Attacker"
- Sableye - Retest Calm Mind
- Sawsbuck - Retest Baton Pass
- Sharpedo - Check EV spreads
- Slowbro - Retest Choice Specs
- Spiritomb - Retest for viability
- Swampert - Make CB the first set, it's pretty what it's good at in OU
- Venomoth - Retest Sweeper set
- Virizion - Retest Work Up and Dual Screens - Yes, I know we had a big debate about this in the recent thread, but we're going to measure sets (which are borderline) against the new metagame
- Wobbuffet - Bulky > Speedy

DO NOT NEED CHANGE / MINOR CHANGES FOR THE NEW METAGAME - OBVIOUSLY IF ONE OF THESE POKEMON GET AN EPIC NEW MOVE OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT, THEIR PRIORITY WILL CHANGE
- Alakazam
- Arcanine
- Azumarill
- Bronzong - Expand on Counters section
- Chansey - Expand on Counters section
- Cloyster
- Cobalion
- Cofagrigus - Expand on Counters section, look into RestTalk
- Cradily
- Crawdaunt
- Crobat
- Crustle
- Darmanitan
- Donphan
- Drapion
- Electivire
- Excavalier - Small change: Is that 4 Spe really necessary?
- Farfetch'd
- Flygon
- Forretress - May need mention of Custap Berry if it is released
- Froslass - Needs Focus Sash slash
- Gallade - Leaf Blade needs a mention on SD
- Gengar
- Hitmontop
- Huntail
- Infernape (May change priority due to Pokemon released)
- Kabutops
- Lilligant
- Machamp
- Magikarp
- Mandibuzz
- Medicham
- Omastar
- Porygon2
- Quagsire
- Raikou (May change priority if Volt Absorb is released)
- Rotom
- Rotom-H
- Rotom-W (May change priority due to Pokemon released)
- Sceptile
- Scizor (May change priority due to Pokemon released)
- Scrafty
- Shaymin
- Sigilyph
- Skarmory (May change priority due to Pokemon released)
- Smeargle
- Staraptor
- Suicune (May change priority if Water Absorb is released)
- Tangrowth
- Throh - Maybe mention Sleep Talk
- Togekiss - Hyper Voice mention, maybe?
- Uxie
- Victreebel
- Volbeat
- Whimsicott
- Yanmega
- Zoroark


HIGH PRIORITY POKEMON:

Amoonguss:
- Regenerator and Keldeo
- General update

Breloom:
- Technician
- General update

Deoxys-D:
- Retest viability of "Suicide Lead"
- Redo EVs on Toxic Agility set
- General update

Celebi:
- Update to reflect ability to check Keldeo
- GET RID OF THE NAME "NAVI". WE ARE NOT JAMES CAMERON'S OR NINTENDO'S BITCHES Just get rid of the personalised name. It's not a truly established set name.
- General update

Dragonite:
- A lot of those sets look quite redundant
- Possible merges: Rain mixed and classic mixed, or tank and classic mixed, or tank and rain tank, or tank and Parashuffler, SubDD and bulky DD
- I don't care what happens, but please cut down on the number of Dragonite sets! They all look too similar to warrant individual analyses!
- Retest Parashuffler
- Update to reflect ability to check some Keldeos

Espeon:
- Retest straight CM set
- Look into an EspyJump set
- Update reflect ability to check Keldeo
- General update

Gastrodon:
- General update for all the BW2 Pokemon

Gliscor:
- Move AcroBat up to set 2, rename "Swords Dance" as "Defensive Swords Dance"
- General update with all the new BW2 crap that it got

Haxorus:
- General update with new move tutor moves

Heatran:
- Replace Protect in the third slash in SpD for Earth Power or just some move that is more useful than Protect. I swear to God if I see Protect as a main slash in any set that does not specifically need it (like Vaporeon), I will reject on the spot.
- General update. I'm sorry, but the analysis looks quite messy.

Hydreigon:
- Merge Offensive with Specs and call it "Special Attacker"
- General update with new move tutor moves

Jellicent:
- Update to reflect ability to check Keldeo
- General update

Jirachi:
- General update

Jolteon:
- Update to reflect ability to check Tornadus-T (and pretty much the entire metagame, lol)
- General update

Kyurem:
- General update with all the new BW2 stuff

Landorus:
- Put Smack Down into OO, or provide us VERY VERY good reason why it should stay
- Retest Expert Belt
- General update - Like Heatran, the analysis looks a tad messy.

Latias:
- I'm going to do this one, but just saying what I'm going to do:
- Standard CM set is going to be more offensive - Have a more offensive spread with Psyshock and Surf in the last slot. Latias is bulky enough without that much investment, and the lack of power (unable to OHKO Dragonite with Dragon Pulse after SR) sucks balls.
- Conversely, the defensive Calm Mind set will have the more defensive options on it, like Sub, Roar, Reflect, and all those kind of moves
- Merge LO Tank and Specs
- Update to reflect that Latias is probably the best Keldeo counter ever - ie You're going to be seeing Psyshock everywhere

Latios:
- Update to reflect its ability to check Keldeo and Thundurus-T
- General update

Metagross:
- General update

Mew:
- General update

Ninetales:
- PAIN SPLIT
- General update

Politoed:
- General update

Roserade:
- Update to reflect ability to check Keldeo
- General update

Salamence:
- Can we please make +Spe natures the primary slash on all sets? Salamence's biggest asset this gen is probably his Speed.
- Have a look into 252 HP / 80 Def / 176 Spe Timid on the FatMence.
- General update with BW2 stuff

Starmie:
- Make Psyshock VERY prominent to reflect your ability to check Keldeo
- General update

Tentacruel:
- General update

Terrakion:
- General update + BW2 move tutor moves (like Stealth Rock)

Tornadus:
- General update with new move tutor moves

Toxicroak:
- Update to reflect ability to check Keldeo
- General update with BW2 move tutor moves (most specifically SD + Drain Punch + Ice Punch)

Tyranitar:
- Knock that mixed attacker set down a few pegs please. It is just... mediocre, to say the least
- Make CB standard. It deserves to be.
- Have a look into a mixed DD set: DD / Crunch / Fire Blast / Ice Beam: This set seriously beats like every physical wall in existence.
- General update

Vaporeon:
- General update

Venusaur:
- General update with BW2 stuff (mostly Giga Drain)

Volcarona:
- The set orders seem all over the shot (will have to be reorganised) and the analysis seems quite messy. Clean up is needed.
- Fire Blast > Fiery Dance on offensive sets
- General update with BW2 shenanigans


Not high priority updates:

Bisharp:
- Night Slash needs to be in the SD set (SD / Night Slash / Sucker Punch / Brick Break)
- Retest Thunder Wave. It seems really dubious

Golurk:
- BW2 move tutor moves
- General update

Elektross:
- Retest viability of everything, then do a general update

Empoleon:
- Agility SubPetaya!
- General update

Kingdra:
- General update

Stoutland:
- General update for BW2 move tutor moves (Superpower)

Shiftry:
- Retest Growth, Specs and all out attacker
- General update

Slowking:
- Update to reflect ability to check Keldeo
- General update

Victini:
- Mention Flare Blitz/Fire Punch on some of the physical sets for late game cleaning potential
- Consider Trick on Choice sets
- General update

Weavile:
- Update to reflect ability to check Therian forms
- General update

Xatu:
- General update with BW2 move tutor moves

Zapdos:
- Update to reflect ability to check Tornadus-T

 

[alexwolf]

Reserving Tornadus-T and Haxorus.

 

[bugmaniacbob]

Just posting to say that everything should currently be up to date

Also that I seem to always miss things whenever I update...

EDIT: Just like the above...

 

[shrang]

Oh nice. Thanks for that bugmaniacbob, I'm going to reserve Latias.

 

[complete legitimacy]

Reserving Keldeo and Gliscor.

 

[Husky]

Reserving Breloom and Golurk

 

[jc104]

Skeleton up for ditto. (and QC approved 3/3 already!)

I'd also like to reserve Landorus (the normal one)

 

[JellyOs]

Taking Thundurus-T and Volcarona

 

[-Rockstar-]

Reserving Hydreigon and Landorus-T

 

[Jirachee]

Reserving Starmie and Latios.

 

[Thatsjustpeachy]

Reserving Jolteon

 

[capefeather]

Dammit, Breloom and Hydreigon are taken?

Well then, I guess I'll take Dragonite and m.f. Tyranitar. Part of me actually was reluctant of reliving the Dragonite analysis experience, but it was an interesting ride and it would be fun to do it again. That and no Breloom or Hydreigon :(

 

[Swamp-Rocket]

Reserving Salamence.

On a side note, I think that Lapras actually had an OU analysis at one point, but it was deleted. Is that one usable at all?

 

[Princess Bubblegum]

You know, ive played with Amoonguss quite a bit, I can at least get it through QC.

Reserving Amoonguss.

 

[Tobes]

Reserving Politoed.

P.S. Dugtrio can get to 1 HP by using Substitute 4 times from full health, and Fight Gem helps to guarantee OHKOes on some of its targets.