I would suggest you bring it up in the RBY and GSC viability lists as well, then.I disagree with Cloyster's usability in any generation, but concensus rules.
I would suggest you bring it up in the RBY and GSC viability lists as well, then.I disagree with Cloyster's usability in any generation, but concensus rules.
restalk wisp haze (which owns hera) is very good and i find its a lot harder for physical offense to overwhelm than skarm (and then theres always mag). dont discount the offensive set, it can potentially do a lot of damage... i remember funkasaurus had a team with it and it was surprisingly hard to switch into. i dont think it belongs in gimmick tier since its a good mon on its own and gimmick tier is home to a lot of garbage
I can't see how Weezing really achieves a lot, on paper its great but I think a physical wall trying to burn things isn't as great as it sounds, especially when one of the things it would primarily check (Heracross) loves being statused, either from WoW or Sludge Bomb. FT/FB help in this regard but tbh I think I'd rather just carry a Mence or Gar or something, especially considering Weezing has pretty mediocre offensive utility outside boom. Yeah its a good lax answer, but so is Skarm, who just so happens to overlap on a lot of what Weez does, while doing more.
i dunno, ttar is pretty strong but rhydons stab eq and access to sd makes it harder to wall for most teams that ordinarily wouldnt struggle with tar which i think is a great niche. its because of this that its better at busting open waters and that lets you sweep with a dder (like ttar himself!) so i think rhydon is fine here. also being harder to kill for dugtrio is pretty sweet.
Its basically worse than TTar in every way other than having a super strong EQ (and I guess it can live a BB), but even then TTar can generally break through stuff with repeated RSes. Megahorn isn't really much of a benefit because HP Bug generally creams its intended target anyway. I guess its slightly better at checking Mence/Aero? But not really.
havent used wak much but this seems accurate, although its one of the best receivers on those agili bp zapdos teams
Read Rhydon, then remember it doesn't have a Flying or Normal resist, or a STAB RS. Can't switch in on anything. No option of lefties. Urk. Use Bandgon, it hits just as hard but without being a sucky mon.
yea i dont like machamp very much, agreed
Basically Heracross does Machamp better. And so does Medicham. And so does Hariyama. Pretty much no matter what role you put it in one of its compadres will do it better. I think pretty much the only role it can contend with any of them as is as a bulky bander (Hariyama's speed really sucks for that), but I think thats pretty far down the niche barrel when you have a mon that can do only one thing possibly better than another 2 BL mons who receive negligable usage anyway, despite being otherwise better than Champ.
i can see what youre saying and dont have a real counter argument aside from my feeling that putting ken in gimmick tier just seems wrong (bias aside)... it might be that stab fire is great offense and surprising mence with hp ice (bulkier sets are harder to wear down with -1 rock slides especially the wish variants) is always great. theres also that hp flying steelix that shuts hera down if it doesnt come into a focus punch that blaziken has no trouble with as well as raping unboosted slow jirachi. i agree that hera is usually better but ken as a gimmick just doesnt seem accurate.
In a metagame with no attacks Skarm and SD Focus Punch Hera existing, I see very little reason for Blaziken. Its not actually got any worse, but its just made redundant, I feel. The situations I envision where its better off than Heracross are when its running shit like HP Ice vs a Mence but all you really gain from that is an OHKO off of your prediction instead of the likely 2HKO you would've got if you predicted with Hera and gone for RS. And the opportunity cost for running mixed offenses over what you would run on Hera is pretty big IMO.
claydol gets harassed by crunch/pursuit tar and struggles vs hp bug forre. also donphan is physically bulky as fuck and therefore much harder to wear down, especially since it can run protect (needs pursuit support obviously but its worth it). not quite gimmick tier imo...
I've never found a realistic use for this. Claydol has Spikes immunity (thats kinda huge for a spinner), checks what its supposed to check (TTar, Mence, Flygon) better, and has access to other support moves like Boom and Screens. Also has solid special bulk to actually take a Hidden Power/Ice Punch if need be. And a STAB Psychic for Gar. Donphan has like, a good EQ going for it. A good EQ does not a viable mon make. You could argue for HP Ghost in its 4th slot but I still don't think that really sells it over Dol on any team.
Alright, fair play to Weez. Though Restalk Wisp Haze just sounds crazy to me.restalk wisp haze (which owns hera) is very good and i find its a lot harder for physical offense to overwhelm than skarm (and then theres always mag). dont discount the offensive set, it can potentially do a lot of damage... i remember funkasaurus had a team with it and it was surprisingly hard to switch into. i dont think it belongs in gimmick tier since its a good mon on its own and gimmick tier is home to a lot of garbage
SD just has a generally terrible time setting up and base 40 speed does it no favours, and even in terms of a band set rhydons extra power just feels eh when TTar can often get off 2 hits on the things rhydon would be hitting once before they can actually respond, and also be able to take a SE special attack without instantly crumbling and proceed to maim a check anyway. With Rhydon you're giving up a lot of versatility and also a lot of defensive synergy, for what are (I think) pretty inconsequential benefits.i dunno, ttar is pretty strong but rhydons stab eq and access to sd makes it harder to wall for most teams that ordinarily wouldnt struggle with tar which i think is a great niche. its because of this that its better at busting open waters and that lets you sweep with a dder (like ttar himself!) so i think rhydon is fine here. also being harder to kill for dugtrio is pretty sweet.
Honestly I did feel awkward myself suggesting it, but I really don't think its worth C. Those examples aren't ever going to sway you when you're building a team, lets be honest- I don't think anyone sits there and goes "What if they use a HP flying Steelix!? Gotta tweak my team for that top tier threat!" and if you're sending the chicken in on a rachi you're at he point in the game where you're clutching at straws. You're never putting Blaziken into a team because its the best choice- you're putting it in because you want to use Blaziken. Thats what constitutes a gimmick, as far as I know.i can see what youre saying and dont have a real counter argument aside from my feeling that putting ken in gimmick tier just seems wrong (bias aside)... it might be that stab fire is great offense and surprising mence with hp ice (bulkier sets are harder to wear down with -1 rock slides especially the wish variants) is always great. theres also that hp flying steelix that shuts hera down if it doesnt come into a focus punch that blaziken has no trouble with as well as raping unboosted slow jirachi. i agree that hera is usually better but ken as a gimmick just doesnt seem accurate.
Pursuittar also harrasses Phan with HP Grass/Crunch/Ice Beam anyway since its special bulk is sub par, it may be harder to wear down through sheer attacks but the matchups where Donphan matters (i.e when theres spikes down) he's taking more damage than Dol anyway thanks to the spikes he's trying to spin away. HP Bug Forre is one upside I guess but then again some people run HP Fire Dol, so it works both ways. I've never seen anyone use the elephant seriously though.claydol gets harassed by crunch/pursuit tar and struggles vs hp bug forre. also donphan is physically bulky as fuck and therefore much harder to wear down, especially since it can run protect (needs pursuit support obviously but its worth it). not quite gimmick tier imo...
Yeah I definitely see what you mean, although I feel like this is mainly just because people are so used to playing against it. Better players can tell what sort of set its running based on the team that surrounds it to an extent, but if it wasn't as common, I don't think this would be the case. Heracross on the other hand is not quite as common because as you said it takes quite a bit of skill to use effectively. But its lack of usage not to mention that it hits so hard that even its counters can't really switch in on it consistently, makes it so many standard teams are vulnerable to it right off the bat. However, if it did get more usage I feel a lot more people would take it into greater consideration when team building instead of saying "oh dugtrio/skarm/gengar can take it on, im fine" With gengar on the other hand it's usually one of the first threats that comes to mind when building a team.Gengar's super strong but he's not number 2 because to a certain extent he's a pubstomping mon, and he's very very good against bad teams. When the big boys play with Gengar he's more matchup dependent - like, a Wispgar will do great vs Physimag, but not so well vs CM. A lot of people like Gar because he's easy to play and build with, and also is the only ghost really.
Like Dugtrio or Garen, the lower level play, the better he is. Something like, say, Heracross, is the opposite. A poorly played beetle does jack shit, but a well executed Hera can destroy the best players.
Y'know it feels weird to say it but that's an idea I can maybe get behind. I think Lax is better at being a reliable check to things because while it suffers just like Cune with the Spikes + Sand weak and is even more vulnerable to being punished on a switch because of its speed, Rest isn't isn't as dead a slot on it as it is with Cune, since it can take things like Zap/Mag Tbolt better than Cune can take a HP Flying or Rock Slide(also the side effects of special attacks are nowhere near as bad as RS, so he doesn't have to suffer from BS an awful lot besides Rachi spdef drops). He's also got more routes he can take with his sets as well, so whereas Cune's versatility is pretty much in the many ways it can sweep you with CM, Lax poses threats in more ways than just sweeping you straight with Curse. Which means he fits on more teams.IMO Snorlax is better than Suicune, but you guys won't move Lax up so that's okay.